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I have created {{ Steam app}} to provide standardised links to app pages on Steam. I chose "app" (rather than game) to be more generic, as there are a few things beside games on Steam, and "app" is what Steam call it in the URL. It will optionally pull the Steam app ID from Wikidata property Steam ID (P1733), if no id is supplied as a parameter. I think this type of Wikidata usage might still be classified as "alpha", but it seems to work ok today, and it will use a supplied ID in preference to Wikidata if required for any exceptional/problem cases. It's only an external link, so it should not be the end of the world if there's any short term breakage with it due to Wikidata issues or changes. Longer term, pulling that ID from Wikidata seems to be the correct approach. Example usage:
{{
Steam app}}
(id will come from Wikidata, name will be {{
PAGENAMEBASE}}.{{
Steam app|id=|name=}}
{{
Steam app|id=220200|name=Kerbal Space Program}}
→Long term, the first no-params variant should probably be the preferred usage on main articles about a game; only supplying an id or name where the automatic default does not provide an appropriate result, or if it's being used to create a link to something other than the default case.
-- Murph9000 ( talk) 12:39, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
List of Xbox 360 games compatible with Xbox One ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) has been nominated for DYK, so I'd appreciate other editors giving it a nice once-over and tightening it up & watching for vandalism if it does go on the front page. Thanks! – xeno talk 15:02, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
I made a major edit of Persistent world; feedback welcome. Also, I would like to suggest Metaverse as part of the video game project. Since the concept is a collective world of virtual worlds, and virtual worlds are games, I would assume Metaverse will be used for games. For example, there is already an MMO in Second Life. Cheers! -- K.Nevelsteen ( talk) 20:49, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
So Microsoft recently announced Xbox One backwards compatibility. From what I've read, they are emulating the Xbox 360 hardware layer in software. I noticed some IP editors adding Xbox One to the platforms on Mass Effect (video game) and was wondering if this was correct to do. A number of original Xbox titles that are compatible with Xbox 360 (which required emulation profiles) are not list as Xbox 360 titles. But then I see a lot of Nintendo Virtual Console (software emulation) games with Wii U, 3DS, and Wii listed as platforms. What's the best way to approach this? Is/Should there be a guidelines that covers this? -- The1337gamer ( talk) 11:53, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
I have worked very hard for the compilation of Featured Characters section in WWE 2K15 article and also improved the article by adding more details. May I be awarder a barnstar by anyone here? User:AkshayAnand
I had someone recently create and then blank an article at Yandere Simulator. I've got a draft version in my userspace here, but the coverage has been slightly erratic so far so I haven't moved it yet. Do any of you think that it's ready? Some of the sources are brief but could be seen as a slight review of sorts. I haven't incorporated that aspect of the sources yet since I was waffling over that, but I think that this is just at the cusp of either passing or failing criteria. I'd rather get some slight consensus here before moving it to the mainspace before its ready, since I don't want it to go through an AfD, which can sometimes make it more difficult for articles to remain in the mainspace. Tokyogirl79 (。◕‿◕。) 10:17, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
PSA that the latest vg StoryBundle is out:
- Boss Fight Books: Bible Adventures by Gabe Durham
- Designers & Dragons - 1970s, 1980s, 1990s & 2000s by Shannon Appelcline
- The Untold History of Japanese Game Developers by John Szczepaniak
- HG 101 Presents: An Unofficial Guide to Castlevania by Kurt Kalata
- How Video Games Are Made by Russ Pitts
- SCROLL: #12 - Introducing MSX (Plus #1-11 Bonus!) by Ray Barnholt
- Put This In Your Brain: The Best of Unwinnable Weekly by Stu Horvath & the Unwinnable Writers
I actually bought it this time, particularly for the Appelcline and Szczepaniak titles (still regret not getting the previous bundles—can't find those PDFs anywhere...) Anyway, it'll be up for the next three weeks. – czar 14:45, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
Normally, I'd just plop this down as a refidea on the relevant article, but this long interview with Tim Schafer touches on most of the games he's worked on. [4]. -- MASEM ( t) 18:12, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
Is there an existing page on Wikipedia that already overs this topic, and if not, would the topic of second-hand consumerism of games and the microeconomics behind it be a viable topic to cover? How thoroughly discussed is this kind of thing in western (North America/Europe) circles?
Reason being is that I've lately read a few newspaper articles and financial website posts about how videogame retailers work in Japan. Most game retailers there make little or zero profit from selling new games (since essentially ~95% of the retail cost goes to publishers, devs, supply line costs, et cetera), and rely on the second-hand games market in order to remain profitable. I'm kind of intrigued by this topic, but I'm not sure whether it would make sense to make this into an actual article (or even a subsection within an existing broader article).
I've also come across a few primary sources written directly from store owners as well, such as this one, though it probably won't meet WP:V criteria since it's not a third-party independent source. The aforementioned link gives the retailer's perspective and discusses the impact of shitty games ( kusoge) that retailers simply can't get rid of, since nobody wants to buy their stock:
タイトル数が多いVITA。けっこうあるかと思いきや、2本という優秀な結果に。PAOはコアユーザーの方にけっこう使っていただいているので、コア向けゲームが多いVITAソフトがかなり回るんですね。中古が回る=中古の平均仕入価格が下がる、なのでほとんどのゲームで利益が取れるようになってます。ん?その2本って何かって?『うた組み575』と『ヴァルハラナイツ3』です。うた組みはちょっと取り過ぎて中古落としをした結果です。いや、個人的には好きなんですよね。発売日に買ったし…!後者はちょっと買取金額を下げるタイミングが遅かったかなと。シリーズはそこそこ中古で回っていたのですが、本作は目が肥えたVITAユーザーにとってしっかりゲーム内容&評価が把握されていたようで、当初から動きが鈍かったです。ただ全体としては収益をしっかり稼げる機種なので、今しばらくがんばってもらう形になりますね。
Since the PlayStation Vita has a lot of titles, you'd think we'd get a lot of excess stock, but right now there's actually only two used games that we'd be forced to sell at a loss. Reason is, we (PAO) get a lot of 'hardcore' customers, and since the Vita's library appeals to that audience, we move a lot of it. Our only two unprofitable used Vita games are Utagumi 575 and Valhalla Knights 3. I personally liked Utagumi, but we just ended up with too much of it. And we were too late in lowering VK3's price; most gamers found out about the bad reviews very early on, and it just doesn't sell. But as a whole, used vita games sell well and give us a consistent profit.
There's plenty of better sources out there if I search around a bit, but this is the general gist of what the used games market is like in Japan; supply and demand is heavily influenced by the enthusiast demographic in many cases, unless a game specifically targets casual players. -- benlisquare T• C• E 10:13, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
site:eurogamer.net
and site:ign.com
searches generally nets me articles about how various publishers consider the second-hand market "killing the industry". If we do end up writing about videogame economics, it'll probably make sense to have each part separated by region. --
benlisquare
T•
C•
E 11:11, 25 June 2015 (UTC)Many of the MUDs listed in {{ MUDs}} are really sparse of reliable sourcing and are likely candidates for merge (to a parent article or list), if someone wants to take a look:
– czar 19:49, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These likely copyright violations can be searched by your topic of interest, e.g., control-f "WikiProject Video games."-- Lucas559 ( talk) 22:18, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
I don't like doing this sort of thing, especially since lately I haven't been as involved in discussions here as I should be (as in, at all), but... A week ago I requested a move at Talk: Hydlide 3. The request has been relisted, presumably due to the lack of discussion. If anyone here could help remedy that situation by adding their thoughts, that would be much appreciated.-- Martin IIIa ( talk) 12:24, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
Currently I am doing the The Last of Us: Left Behind GAN. While checking the archives to the links, one of them by GameSpot directed me to a clip from an Eddie Murphy comedy special ( link in question). I pointed this out to Rhain1999, the nominator, and they said out that not only is it effecting the other GameSpot archive links, but also a link to Giant Bomb. This also seems apparent to other archive links for The Last of Us and even one for the Mother series. Bare in mind these are all WebCite links cutting to a YouTube clip for the same Eddie Murphy clip. Seeing how both GameSpot and Giant Bomb are both owned by CBS Interactive, that raises some flags, with Rhain saying that this might be happening because some people don't want these links archived. As to why I'm unsure. This is just something that might be a big problem in archiving those two sites using WebCite. GamerPro64 02:50, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
I've spotted an additional problem with GamePro articles on Webcite, the article is present, but the java code renders the text as invisible on the screen. - X201 ( talk) 08:35, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
I've been doing work on the article above, and currently the only major thing bothering me is the image. I tried to upload something, but it is not transparent, and I don't have the stuff on my computer to make the necessary changes. Can someone help me with that? -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 18:25, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi, I recently created the page Dark Souls (series) for the Demon's Souls, Dark Souls 2 and Dark Souls 3 games as well as the related Bloodborne and King's Field (series) games. The page was recently patrolled by DangerousJXD, but it is very bare and I could use help from anyone willing to fill in the article. Osh33m ( talk) 00:28, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
Do we really need so many articles about Second Life? See Template:Second Life where there are a number of poorly sourced or just poorly written articles that seem like they could be consolidated into fewer with less sprawling coverage. Having not played the game or looked at these articles before I'm not sure where to start with this and wondered if anyone with experience could share their opinion. Sam Walton ( talk) 10:32, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
Editors need to made aware of a co-ordinated effort from the subreddit /r/pcmasterrace to add derogatory information to a variety of console articles. A search for "wikipedia" provides some idea of the problem [6] One prominent example:
Some of the names are familiar. In this thread [7] the creation of several new articles is suggested, with the purpose of "showing the peasants how small their collections really are". These articles were eventually created by editor User:Wikinium but later redirected after they were AfDd. The aforementioned editor is now on the Xbox One talk page attempting to add unflattering information there. [8] I have only made a cursory glance at the subreddit. The problem appears to go much deeper and requires further investigation. — TPX 11:15, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
We've been hit. This is absurd along the lines of the old NDT controversy I was in the middle of. Source/Citation Zero Serenity ( talk - contributions) 07:07, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
The issue has been raised on Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents — TPX 20:49, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
mw:Citoid appears to be the future of referencing on WP. Short of it is: enter a URL, it uses a Zotero "translator" to scrape the page's metadata, Citoid compiles the citation for insertion. Logical process. Only problem is that most VG sites do not play well with the scraper since no one has written a translator. Wanted to bring this to the project in case someone interested in coding or sources might want to take it up as a project. We would all save a lot of time by using Citoid/Zotero over our current manual methods. (I wrote a Chrome plug-in for Polygon citations—my source of choice—but I'm a novice at this and wouldn't have time to look at it for many weeks.) @ X201, PresN, and Thibbs – czar 17:33, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
I'm not familiar with history of this series. Is the recent move of Harvest Moon (series) to Story of Seasons (series) appropriate? Same goes for the creation of this split article Harvest Moon (Natsume series). -- The1337gamer ( talk) 23:24, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
Someone might want to take a look at this ( permalink). Does this person have a point, or are they just making stuff up? I have only played some of the first game, so I can't know for sure, but I kinda doubt it's true... and considering PEGI only gave the games a 16 rating and didn't even mention sex it seems unlikely. Still, would be nice if someone more knowledgeable than me looked at it.-- IDV talk 09:34, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
I'm only sporadically active on WP at the moment, and I haven't been following things as closely as I had been doing. But after a quick check of my watchlist, it is evident that User:Tripple-ddd is still trying to brute-force in their way, with the exact same disregarding of consensus - and that's not all of the diffs I can find. Can someone please give them a final warning? Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 17:51, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
I was reading a
Polygon interview with Troy Baker, when this bit jumped out at me (emphasis mine): "[People] start ascribing these roles to us when we're not in it. There's so many things on my IMDb and Wikipedia that I'm like, I never did that.
" Wait, what? Does anyone think we might want to do some bit-by-bit deep review of what
Troy Baker is credited for in his article, make sure everything's true and sourced? I know he may have just been using Wikipedia as an example without being aware of specific inaccuracies, but I can't help but to shake the feeling we might've let some incorrect OR in! ☺ ·
Salvidrim! ·
✉ 00:25, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
IEEE interactive timeline of the console generations. I have not checked how exactly it matches up but it looks very close to what we already have (8 gens to date, generally by date, etc.) -- MASEM ( t) 22:28, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
– czar 13:57, 30 June 2015 (UTC)The gap between the computer-focused European and console-focused American gaming histories of the 1980s and early 1990s also highlights another issue I had with the histories I read: console generations. The history of games had somehow become the history of game consoles. It is understandable in some ways. It is a much, much easier story to tell. It’s clean, linear and tidy. But neat and easy a structure as console generations are for a writer, it’s a deeply flawed framework.
— http://www.kinephanos.ca/2015/rewriting-history/
There is currently a content dispute that I am involved in which spans across multiple articles related to PlayStation Vita games.
The PlayStation TV is a variant of the PlayStation Vita which does not feature input buttons, a portable battery or a display screen; rather, it connects to a television via HDMI so that a player can play TV-compatible PlayStation Vita games on a television using a DualShock 3 or DualShock 4 controller. It is a fully-fledged PlayStation Vita system, complete with ARM processor chip, dedicated RAM, motherboard connectors, game cartridge slot, and other hardware components, and all of the core components are completely identical to the components found within the portable Vita; even the graphics scaler in the PlayStation TV is identical to that of the portable Vita, per this interview with Sony Computer Entertainment Software Development Director Muneki Shimada and Hardware Planning Division Manager Kiyoto Shibuya. It features the exact identical system software as the PlayStation Vita (see PlayStation Vita system software), and all games within its library are marketed, by Sony, by publishers and by retailers, as "PlayStation Vita games". Of course, not all PS Vita games are compatible with the PlayStation TV, since some games rely extensively on the Vita's touchscreen, camera or gyromotion controls, features which are not supported by the variant device. Hence, some games are marketed as "PlayStation TV-compatible PlayStation Vita games".
No third-party reliable source ever refers to the PlayStation TV as a videogame platform, and thus referring to the PS TV as a platform would fail WP:V and WP:OR policies. Based on the rationale provided above, I am of the opinion that the PlayStation TV is NOT a videogame platform, just like how the Super Game Boy is not a videogame platform.
Special:Contributions/Kalsolesse has been adding " Playstation TV" as a videogame platform within the VG infobox to a wide multitude of articles about PlayStation Vita games, including but not limited to Persona 4: Dancing All Night, Shin Megami Tensei: Persona 4, Killzone: Mercenary, et cetera. In response to an edit warring warning I placed on their user talkpage, they have responded on my talkpage that they intend to "edit the information back in in over 24 hours... If you see fit to revert it again, then I see no other choice but to seek arbitration".
In the spirit of WP:CONSENSUS, I'd like to seek a third opinion, given that I am party to a content dispute, per standard procedure. -- benlisquare T• C• E 11:55, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
There are no game compatibility issues between the original PlayStation and the PSone, nor between the original PS2 and the PS2 slim. The original PS3 is backwards compatible with PS2 games while the slimmer variants are not, and while the slim PSP versions run games faster due to increased RAM compared to the fat PSP, there are no games which are actually incompatible or unplayable as a result of the negligible hardware difference. Hence, we have a rather unique case on our hands, and I don't think reflecting on other examples would be of much assistance.
In regards to having the information placed conveniently on every game page for readers to view, we can't list the PS TV as a "platform" per WP:V and WP:OR (it's simply not a platform, calling it that would be outright misinformation), which means that we would need a dedicated area for variant device compatibility. However, this issue only affects the Vita platform, and none of the other current platforms, and for a game that is available on PS3, PS4 and a wide variety of others (for example Borderlands 2, which is PS TV compatible), it's simply WP:UNDUE that there are parts dedicated to Vita variant compatibility and irrelevant to the other platforms.
Finally, WP:NOTGUIDE and WP:INDISCRIMINATE are the reasons why we don't have prices within infoboxes for videogames anymore; a long time ago, every single game article contained the launch prices of games for every region, plus system requirements and media formats. I see compatibility notes within these articles as falling within similar territory, a type of "for your information" tidbit that isn't really what an encyclopoedia usually entails. -- benlisquare T• C• E 13:03, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
I have been doing some desultory poking around for sources concerning the development of Prince of Persia: Warrior Within. The most outstanding one is a video making-of featurette created by Ubisoft and originally published on the game's official website. The website is now defunct and the videos lost at their original source and in archived captures of their respective pages. The only one from the site I have found on a fully usable site ( GameTrailers) is an interview with the character Kaileena's voice actress. The main video (titled Making of Prince of Persia: Warrior Within) can be found in various places online (the best version I found was on YouTube), but it's not published through through Ubisoft's official channels, only on user-based accounts which found and published the videos before the original website closed. Is it possible to use these videos as sources and cite them, or at least use them as a reference for my citation without using a link back to them? I do know how to cite videos, it's just using it in a way that would be acceptable in a good-quality article that's the problem. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 14:40, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
As people might know, there is a problem recently with archiving urls on Wayback Machine and WebCite belonging to GameSpot and Giant Bomb (I don't know about any other sites): instead of archiving the url and showing the page, it redirects to a YouTube clip from an Eddie Murphy comedy routine. The problem is still outstanding. Is there any sign of a solution to this, or any update about what is going on that offers a glimmer of hope? -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 21:57, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
There's also an issue with normal GameSpot links. Links made before they changed their site layout are broken, but going to GameSpot and searching for the article - even a review - results in zero hits. I'm now having to use Google site search to find the new location of articles on GameSpot servers. - X201 ( talk) 08:51, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
I caught this [11] over at Portal:Video Games, but it appears that they've consolidated all old content under Gamesradar, meaning all url links are broken to these sites. I have not had a chance to affirm, but this would be a serious problem if true. -- MASEM ( t) 14:33, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
Once again, we bring back this reviewer/reviewee tool to show what is being neglected, what needs urgent attention, and to barter amongst outselves over who does what and how and when. There is the usual backlog at Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests, and contributors are welcome.
Not putting anything here myself, but as usual, here is the place where people can request reviews, either in exchange for something or as a straight-up request for help with something. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 16:49, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
I'll happily trade someone's review for a comprehensive review of List of The Last of Us characters (alternatively, leaving a comment on the peer review of The Last of Us or reviewing the GAN for Development of The Last of Us would be fantastic, too). – Rhain1999 ( talk to me) 11:54, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
Back in April, New Age Retro Hippie edited every article on Virtual Boy games to include this statement in the "Reception" section: "The red-and-black color scheme used in the game were said to cause eye strain, headaches, and nausea." ( Example) When I first noticed this back in May, I decided to leave it be. None of the edits had been reverted, so apparently other Wikiproject Video Game editors approved of them, and New Age Retro Hippie is an experienced editor who I would usually take for granted knows what he's doing.
However, after two months of reflection I still find that the edits to be plainly inappropriate. Isn't it clear that this statement is a comment on the critical reception for the Virtual Boy hardware, not the software, and certainly not the individual software? The cited source doesn't even mention half of the games in question, and those which it does mention it doesn't blame for the red-and-black color scheme which was necessitated by the console it ran on. Also, New Age Retro Hippie made these edits even on articles for games which are not Virtual Boy exclusive, without providing any indication that the statement applies only to the Virtual Boy version of the game. ( Example) While this can of course be quickly and easily fixed, it suggests to me that New Age Retro Hippie did not put as much thought into these edits as he usually does with his editing.
So I am of a mind to remove this statement from all the articles on VB games, but again given that it was added to over a dozen articles without opposition, I thought I should seek consensus here first.-- Martin IIIa ( talk) 12:18, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi WP:VG guys, I'm from WP:Pro Wrestling. We have several stubs of video games on professional wrestling. I want to know how to prove their notability (or lack thereof, then delete them). The wrestling websites I frequent don't mention these games. Is there a standard list of gaming or gaming review websites which if a game fails to appear on those, then it's considered not notable? Most of the games are pretty retro or restricted to Japan.
Thank you very much and have a nice day. starship .paint ~ KO 06:45, 11 July 2015 (UTC)
So I've been thinking about the practice of archiving links here and I was thinking to myself about how it would be possible to archive links to GameTrailers. GT's niche was always it being the go-to place to watch video content on games before YouTube took its spotlight. And since its primarily video content, I wonder if that makes it difficult to archive their links with WebCite or Archive.org. GamerPro64 19:43, 11 July 2015 (UTC)
So with the influx of more and more video game articles becoming Today's Featured Articles, we got two articles making the front page this month: Sinistar: Unleashed on the 6th, and Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within on the 13th. Cheers. GamerPro64 17:34, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
Satoru Iwata just died. Keep an eye on that article. « Ryūkotsusei » 00:10, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
I'm fairly certain that this will be the same as the "No" consensus for Gaikai and On-Live, but thought I'd check anyway. - X201 ( talk) 10:45, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
This is an honest question of curiosity: I know that wikipedia bases itself on external sourcees that can be linked to or verified. However, in the case of games, often the sources include releases from developers that have at least some form of marketing behind, or were written at an earlier stage of development. This can lead to descriptions of gameplay that are described one way in the sources, but function quite differently in the games themselves. Have you ever considered using the media themselves as a source of reference (in addition to the written sources), rather than just the documentation that surrounds it? 80.112.180.116 ( talk) 19:38, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
A heads-up about a change I'm not sure most people know about: for as long as any of us can likely remember, there has been one golden rule about navboxes at the bottom of page- that every link must be to an existing article. No more! As per this RFC, provided the navbox is still mostly blue links, you are now allowed to add a few redlinks to spice things up. Presumably, this includes redirects. Items without an article should actually be redlinked, though, not just in unlinked plain text. -- Pres N 01:32, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi guys... so, I'd like to revisit this archived conversation.
More importantly I would like to revisit the topic of the page for Game Zero Magazine. The page was active for 7 years (2005-2012) and then someone rushed through a deletion request in 2012 that purged the page from the wiki because they felt that the magazine wasn't notable enough to have an entry. The chief problem as has been declared many times is that being online in 1994-1996 much of the web from 1994-1996 is missing to provide context since Archive.org didn't start indexing until late 1996. Short of anecdotal evidence and provable presence in a number of early printed URL indexes where the site was only one a few gaming resources listed (and the generally the only magazine), it may be impossible to provide the period references that validate some of the first that should be attributed to the magazine.
Why I ask this is that prior to the 2012 deletion Wikipedia and Google were slowly becoming the last link sources providing visibility to the archived website to younger web users and now in light of Google demoting results of sites that don't provide a mobile friendly set of pages, the passage of time is doing it's damnedest to push this magazine into true obscurity. (Rebuilding the site to be modern/mobile friendly kinda defeats the idea of an archived site, right?)
On a personal note, as a former editor for the magazine and maintainer of the archive image it really breaks my heart to see something that was so significant slowly wiped from history simply because it isn't easily visible anymore. I know this whole issue is mess of COI, POV and more at this point. So I'm looking to you guys for ideas. I've entertained the idea of talking to some other journalist to see about capturing some of this history but since everyone uses Wikipedia as a first source and they see the magazine not listed ... well, now the problem is feeding itself.
Pages for reference: Game Zero magazine/ Game Zero magazine, talk page
Help? BcRIPster ( talk) 19:48, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
I know Mobygames is not a reliable source, but should we be removing it from external links as well? I'm not sure if there's been a discussion on this before. A brief search didn't turn up anything clear, since there's a lot of noise to sort through. — Torchiest talk edits 16:19, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
So while looking for more sources for an article, I stumbled across the website Blue's News. While the article has already been verified as reliable here, I don't think I've ever seen it be put to use in an article. However, the site says that its been around in 1996, meaning that it has a lot of links to other sites in their work. Even having an archive from July 1996-February 1999. A lot of the links throughout the sites articles are broken but using the Wayback Machine can bring them back. Just something to look through if anyones interested in trying to find more research on an article. GamerPro64 02:49, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
So I've been going around on various Ratchet & Clank-related articles and taking a wrench (ha!) to the plot summaries of each to try and take it down to the most important details that a reader ought to know about the plots of each game, instead of reading like a fan's badly-written blow-by-blow of every cutscene. I wanted to ask a question about the way to do it, and as well, I want to try and sample a few opinions here at WPVG on the subject.
So my first question is, should plot sections simply present the premise of a game's story, OR should it synopsize the plot of the game start-to-finish, albeit only covering the most important components of the plot that a layman needs to know to understand it?
Second question is, which article(s), in you guys' opinions, have the best written Plot sections, whether GA, FA or whatever, that other game articles ought to emulate? I want to use something as a frame of reference, and I know how much mileage may vary between articles, especially depending on story complexity. BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 15:54, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
Video game plot summaries are unusual beasts. The premise of a video game article should principally be about how it's played, not its story. That said, there are games that are quite notable for their storylines, and have received coverage in the gaming press for them. Those are the games that deserve more extensive plot summaries, approaching lengths reserved for films (see WP:FILMPLOT). In my opinion, in the vast majority of cases, video game plot summaries should be just that ... very brief set-ups to the story behind the game. -- McDoob AU93 14:36, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
You seem to be able to cut the plots down. However, if you want to save your time you can just look at the article's history for a point where the plot was in a reasonable state. Being GAs, Arsenal and Commando have had some decent summaries ( here and here). You may have luck with the other games too. Gabriel Yuji ( talk) 14:41, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
I have learned exactly what is causing the archiving issue with GameSpot. It is also responsible for a few other problems the site has been experiencing recently such as videos not working, the site not loading properly, and its speed collapsing. Apparently the site is having extensive trouble with advertisements trying to create clones of their site and using it for their own purposes. As part of their efforts to counter it, GameSpot put in a general block on any site attempting to make a copy of a page: unfortunately, that meant Archive.org and WebCite were also blocked. I have raised the issue on the site's forums, and the staff will apparently adjust to allow Archive.org to archive pages (have no idea about WebCite). I will be doing tests in a week, and if the problem persists, I will make inquiries about its continuation.
On a separate note, since the recent death of Satoru Iwata, I feel we should move to archive the Iwata Asks with all possible speed, as it is possible that they might go down within the next year or two. They can be successfully archived using WebCite from the page's UK and Japanese versions. They have extensive interviews with staff on multiple games, including recent Fire Emblem and Zelda titles, Xenoblade Chronicles and Chronicles X, and more niche titles like The Last Story and Pandora's Tower, among others. I've already archived some interviews. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 13:36, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
Hey everyone, newcomer to the video game realm of Wiki here. Some of you have probably seen me frequenting the late Satoru Iwata's article...I've made a goal for myself to improve it as much as possible and this has extended into his interview series, Iwata Asks. I just finished going through all the translated ones available through Nintendo, but I'm certain there are many more that are Japanese-only. In one of his 3DS interviews, Mr. Iwata stated that he conduced over 200 interviews. Going from that amount, there are at least 32 missing from the list (168 of his are listed + 5 by others). Do any of you here know how to search for these so I can complete the list of his interviews? Many thanks in advance! Cyclonebiskit ( talk) 14:16, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
On a relevant note, if any of you know specific interviews that have pertinent information for Mr. Iwata's article I would greatly appreciate if you could let me know. I plan on reading through all of them at some point since I've noticed they have insightful bits scattered about in the discussions...but knowing where to look first would save me some time. Thanks in advance again~! Cyclonebiskit ( talk) 14:43, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
This is a question on sources, both now and for future reference. I am doing an article rewrite (FE: Path of Radiance) where I need the sales data from NPD Group for October 2005. I've seen plenty of figures quoted in forums where the Top 50 GameCube games were quoted, but I can't find any report/press release by NPD that goes beyond the top ten positions. No actual figures. Is there any source apart from forum pages (which are generally inadmissible in GAs) that can provide these figures? If there are favorable results from this, it can be applied to other games in the future. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 22:53, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
{{
ccat|Roundabout}}
Roundabout is a comedy action video game for PC and current-gen consoles. There are 20 reviews on Metacritic.
[12]
[13]
[14]. It has been on our
requests page since September 2014, I'm asking again here because the developers recently released images under a free use license.
Another reminder is that I still have Steam keys for Insurgency (video game) to give away via email if anyone would like to take that article on. Insurgency is a PC multiplayer shooter with an active community. [15] [16]- hahnch e n 09:36, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone have books by Pix'n Love (histories of Nintendo, Mario, Sonic, Gunpei Yokoi)? No hits in reference. – czar 02:23, 27 July 2015 (UTC)
If a game is released digitally (no retail available) on services including GOG.com, Steam and Origin, who is described as the publisher? All of them, none of them, or self-published?-- Vaypertrail ( talk) 20:13, 28 July 2015 (UTC)
To all interested editors on Wikipedia. There is a rather heated discussion going on on the talk page of Fire Emblem Fates about the inclution of the category "LGBT-related video games". This is the first game in its series to feature the option of a same-sex relationship, but some editors feel that there is not enough content or relevance to merit its inclusion. Can you please come to this RfC and give your stance or opinion. If there are valid, Wikipedia Policy-related reasons for its removal, please cite them fully so there will be no further confusion or argument. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 09:22, 29 July 2015 (UTC)
So, what's gonna happen with List of fictional towns in video games? It could use some help. Oiyarbepsy ( talk) 04:07, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Why does Category:Humble Bundle games exist? If a company that sells games includes a game as a bundle, does that mean its notable enough to have every game put in that category? Is someone going to read about a game and see that category, and think hey, I need to click it to see what other games they sold at discount in a bundle? What about the other companies that sell games, alone or in collections? Do they get a category too? Walmart sells games in bundles now. As do many others. Dream Focus 19:16, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
I was thinking about a few in Category:Video games by theme ("comedy video games", "affective video games"), but here's my dump of running cats that I found questionable as "defining"/lede-worthy characteristics: Category:Video games featuring protagonists of selectable gender, Category:Third-person PlayStation 3 shooters (three-way cross-section), Category:Games for Windows certified games (distribution service). I'm also skeptical of "Fiction with alternative endings" and "comic science fiction" as defining characteristics, though I haven't looked into the specifics. Then there's also FIFA 15-type games having a zillion "Video games set in X country" and the indecipherable Category:Lua-scripted video games (none of the games I spotchecked even mentioned Lua...) Feel free to look into any of these if you agree. – czar 23:20, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
incategory:"CategoryName"
and incategory:"CategoryName2"
in the upper right search box it will intersect the both categories and show you all the articles in both of them. There are also an existing series of list articles dating role-playing video games:
List of role-playing video games. --
The1337gamer (
talk) 15:24, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Category:Humble Bundle games, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Dream Focus 22:14, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
Can somebody link me to the Wikipedia policy on including recommend specs for computer games? I know they are not wanted in articles, but I can't find and link to it for another user who wanted to know why I reverted an edit for Rocket League. Thanks. ~ Dissident93 ( talk) 06:50, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
I want to join the WikiProject where I sign up. Junior Dedinho ( talk) 19:32, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
This month on the main page we'll be seeing Arbiter (Halo) on the 11th for Today's Featured Article. Been a while since we've seen an article on a video game character for TFA. Congrats goes out to David Fuchs for his work. GamerPro64 13:46, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
The above Featured Article discussion has begun and may be of interest to this project. It is focused primarily on the comic character but falls under the purview of video game characters. Darkwarriorblake / SEXY ACTION TALK PAGE! 11:12, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh boy... Check this merge discussion at Talk:Ash Crimson#Merge. First Luke Fon Fabre and now this? Regards. Tintor2 ( talk) 19:06, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
I believe this follows from (1) how the rest of the encyclopedia treats their character articles, and (2) our policies on notability, specifically the general notability guideline. Open for workshopping. – czar 21:16, 31 July 2015 (UTC)Individual fictional characters rarely warrant their own articles. When characters of a series are consistently covered as a group, they are best covered in a list-formatted article on Wikipedia. Individual characters warrant their own articles when they meet the general notability guideline and are the subject of sustained and dedicated (in-depth) coverage such that a full article can be written about them with little reliance on primary or self-published sources. Otherwise, they are best covered in lists of series characters.
Just letting everyone know—even though I know pretty much no one cares—that I went through and adjusted Wikipedia:Good articles/Video games to split games up by half-decades rather than decades. Other than to cut down the impressive walls of text that were the 1990s and 2000s, it also highlights just how few GAs we have on games pre-1985: just 16 from 1980–84, plus 2 from the 70s. On the other side, it's kind of neat that we already have 4 GAs on games released in 2015. -- Pres N 02:48, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
So just a thought to keep an eye out for Gamescom announcements. With the confirmation of a new Halo Wars for example there might be possibility for higher activity on certain pages. And possibly vandalism and edit-warring. GamerPro64 20:57, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
I have nominated Empires: Dawn of the Modern World for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. GamerPro64 22:03, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Issakenta appears to be going through and renaming the lists of games, like List of Dreamcast games, to e.g. Dreamcast game library. There doesn't seem to have been a discussion about this beforehand, and the name is certainly non-standard- opinions? -- Pres N 04:48, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
So it seems its been over a year since Review Threads became a thing. I myself unintentionally starting them. With that aside, here are some things that you can take a look at.
And, of course, new month means an increase in the backlog at Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests. Come take a look if you're interested in making a new article for the site. Contributions are always appreciated. GamerPro64 01:01, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
Happy Anniversary! Just wanted to note that I'll happily trade someone's review for a review of the GAN for Development of The Last of Us (I know it looks long and boring, but you might learn something!). Comments on the peer review of The Last of Us would be greatly appreciated too. – Rhain1999 ( talk to me) 10:35, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
This isn't something I'm able to do with the kind of time and computer access I have, but I've found reason to believe that a lot of the citations on Sega that use the SegaSammy powerpoint PDFs as sources might not actually support the statements they're being attributed to. For example, in this set of edits, I identified a statement about Phantasy Star Online 2 that was attributed to one of these PDFs and did a ctrl+F for "phantasy" to check what page it was on so I could make the citation more than just a bare URL, and it turned up nothing. I'm not sure if these documents were being used before he showed up or not, but User:Tripple-ddd was adamant on using these in a lot of places in Sega, and potentially on other Sega-related articles like their development studios, and I'm suspicious that, WP:PRIMARY issues aside, that these sources aren't being used properly at all.
I can't do more than a cursory ctrl+F on any of these docs to spot-check, and this dinosaur of a computer forces me to download them directly to view them all. I don't have the time to do more than a few just before I go to bed, so I would really appreciate it if someone could help me check these. Even if they're correct, they were just plonked in as URLs; they still need page numbers and titles to clarify just what the hell these sources are when someone hovers over the citation. Thanks, BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 18:27, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm not sure why articles like THIS are being redirected. I think it's extremely sad. -- Kaysser ( talk) 11:47, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
The only waste of time has been process for the sake of process. You should only revert a "bold" move when you actually have evidence to disagree. I did my research. It's incredibly insulting to receive a ream of passive-aggressive hand-wringing instead of some semblance of solidarity or gratitude. I sincerely doubt any one of the disputed articles above will still be standing in a month. – czar 17:42, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
Survival game has been begging to be created for a while, I think there's enough sources but could use a bit of help to flesh it out. -- MASEM ( t) 21:56, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm looking at old games related web pages on Wayback Machine. For example this. How do I search these old articles for keywords/text? SharkD Talk 09:28, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Have we reached consensus on this terminology? Nonlinear gameplay and Open world have merge requests. I'm not happy with some of the content of these articles as well. For instance, the articles treat "open world" and "sandbox" as synonyms. Whereas I think games like SimCity and many of the "Tycoon" games are sandboxes. I created an Venn diagram based on how I feel some actual games fit into these categories:
The definitions I feel are appropriate are that, 1. "open world" refers to exploration of the gameworld, 2. "nonlinear gameplay" refers to the plot/story or other sorts of progression, 3. "sandbox" box refers to being able to manipulate the gameworld or economy. I hadn't thought of "open-ended" gameplay until now. Maybe it is just a property of sandbox games?
What are your thoughts? SharkD Talk 06:02, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Are video games whose localization (but not their actual development) have been financed through crowdfunding supposed to go in Category:Crowdfunded video games? Or in a yet-to-be-created sub-category? Currently no such games seem to be in the category, so I'm a bit hesitant to add any without discussing it with other editors first. If we decide to go with a sub-category, I'm not sure what to name it - do we want to include crowdfunding projects for actual development, that also happen to include multi-language releases (such as Shenmue III), or just dedicated localization projects (such as The Fruit of Grisaia)? The name would have to reflect this in a concise manner.-- IDV talk 14:25, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Something that has bothered me for some time is how, when a visual novel article's title needs disambiguation, editors often seem to choose "(visual novel)" rather than "(video game)". No one would do the same thing to, say, fighting games or platformers, or even the similar genre adventure games, so why should we do it with visual novels? Would anyone be opposed to moving articles like Clannad (visual novel) and Snow (visual novel) to Clannad (video game) and Snow (2003 video game)? On a similar note, the disambiguation used for Christine Love (visual novelist) has bothered me for ages.-- IDV talk 15:28, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Not entirely related to the above discussion, but something that has bothered me a little bit for a while and could help with the discussion if video games should always be disambiguated as "(video game)", there is P.T. (demo). It seems a somewhat silly disambiguation: it is very often referred to as a demo specifically, but does that make it any less of a video game? Also, are there other articles disambiguated as such? ~ Mable ( chat) 07:17, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
For a game on Kickstarter that doesn't end up being funded (looks like Red Ash: The Indelible Legend is going to be the prime example, as it's only around 50% funded with just over a week remaining), do we delete the article since no game will be made, or keep it and re-word it as a "canceled" game? I had thought the previous policy was to hold out until the game officially met it's funding, to avoid situations like these. ~ Dissident93 ( talk) 20:42, 24 July 2015 (UTC)
Another "sort of relevant" thing, in that it's also about Red Ash. Today, an editor added furigana for the Japanese title in the article's lead. I've never seen this done before on Wikipedia, and I'm just barely able to make out the small characters - aside from very distinct and simple ones like ん, it's hard to see anything but clusters of pixels. So... what I'm asking here is, is this an okay addition? We already write out the romanization, so I don't really see it being useful.-- IDV talk 09:46, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
I am definitely against the recent "nuking" of the games in the series, Ratchet & Clank, they are now too summative. A game should not have to be especially noted in "x", for "x" to have a detailed area in Wikipedia. People should be able to go to the "Plot" of a game on Wikipedia that wasn't praised for the story, and find the basic story. It is not like "Reception", where the reception of the story would matter for how much information of the story should be within "Reception". The games' articles were better before they had their stories altered. Freshness For Lettuce ( talk) 19:09, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
I do wonder if like the film project we can push on a word count for plots that can only be sourced to the game itselfWhole-hearted support. I'd even go further to ask why we even need to source to the game when every game's important plot elements are noted in secondary sources. (And in the most extreme cases, we can source to the manual—but as a last resort!) Our sources are already telling us what's important to include. – czar 20:47, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
I disagree with Czar and agree with IDV. And about "I do wonder if like the film project we can push on a word count for plots that can only be sourced to the game itself" that's not a problem. But within the numbers of 500–700 words, they should be able to summary the whole plot. If we only reproduced what sources say, maybe not every film would be able to do so. So it doesn't fit with Czar's idea of adding only of what sources say. Of course a plot is more important for a film than for a video game but wouldn't we be neglecting major facts or details and places the subject in context? Gabriel Yuji ( talk) 22:23, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Whatever the details of such a guideline may be, I'd definitely like to see something more firmly laid out in WP:VG/GL about how plots should be summarized, just so there can be some consistency on how we tackle this. I can see the rationale behind relying only on secondary sources for what to mention in such a plotsum, and I can also see the rationale behind summarizing the plot start-to-finish where the game is considered a primary source-- although personally I think the latter choice, while informative for an interested reader, still doesn't have a good supporting structure in terms of verifiability and a solid framework of reliable sources to hold up what is being written into it. I also think having a word limit could be helpful too, depending on what approach to the guideline we take.
Generally speaking I'd just be game all around if we could nail down some good proposals for how to handle plotsums, and maybe run an RfC either here or on the WP:VG/GL talkpage to poll for what proposal the community thinks is the best practice. BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 11:20, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
The edited plot section of The Witcher 3 is 2000 words. Apparently, it needs to be this long. - X201 ( talk) 16:03, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
R. & C. 1, R. & C. 2, and R. & C. 3, now are extremely unexplained in "Plot". Sure, adding to "Plot" based on reception/coverage can be useful because it provides context, but even if a game recieved "minimal" coverage on the story, it should still have the "Plot" with the main points of the story. The articles of Ratchet & Clank currently don't include the ends of any of the games' stories. They should be restored to how they were. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freshness For Lettuce ( talk • contribs) 19:28, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
This is what I would propose for a Plot update to our guidelines:
Add game plot in the Gameplay section in proportion to its coverage in reliable, secondary sources (i.e., do not create separate Plot sections unless secondary sources note the plot's importance to the game). When an elaborated Plot section is necessary for completeness, prioritize sources in this order: (1) reliable, secondary sources, (2) reliable video game strategy guides and overviews (e.g., Prima, Brady, not user-created guides), (3) the game manual or other primary source documentation, (4) as a last resort, the game itself. Plot sections should be concise, proportional in length to its amount of Reception section coverage, and limited to less than 700 words.
I think this draft minds the above opinions, site policy, and WPVG precedent. Having it in the guidelines should save us from having this discussion repeatedly. Open for workshopping. – czar 20:26, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
Feel free to revise – czar 22:53, 7 August 2015 (UTC)Plot sections, if necessary, should be no more than approximately 700 words to retain focus.
— Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games/Article_guidelines#What_is_appropriate.3F
– czar 03:42, 8 August 2015 (UTC)Plot: if the plot is not too complex, it can be lumped in with the gameplay; otherwise, put it in its own section.
— Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games/Article_guidelines#Organization
unique burden of proofto ask that plot be sourced like everything else in the article (with exceptions for extremes)? Due weight is part of NPOV—the only violation of NPOV here is to have a plot section out of weight with its importance in an article. The problem is that many WPVG editors are determining the appropriate plot weight based on whim rather than source weight. We weigh everything else proportional to source coverage. (The theoretical debate between gameplay and story doesn't belong here, either—especially when invoking our NPOV? If you feel that's even an issue, take it up with the sources.) – czar 20:17, 11 August 2015 (UTC)
my argument, which you simultaneously ignored and misunderstoodI read your "argument" and I disagreed that what you posed as an ideological debate should have any bearing on our dedication to NPOV and verifiability. Are you claiming that the entirety of our (bloated) vetted source list has systemic bias in preference of gameplay over plot and therefore cannot be trusted as a measure of plot's importance? It would have been easier to say so directly, and still I'd disagree that it's the case. As for sourcing plot sections, every guideline says that secondary sources are preferred and that no citations (i.e., sourcing to the work itself) is merely the backup plan. – czar 09:10, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
No need to be inflammatory. – czar 20:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)plot summary ... does not need to be sourced with in-line citations, ... However, editors are encouraged to add sourcing if possible
— Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Writing_about_fiction#Plot_summaries
Hmm, to look on the flipside: imagine a game where absolutely no reliable sources discuss its gameplay other than it being "an RPG", but many of them go deep into the story of the game. Would it make sense for such a game to not have a gameplay-section? I would imagine this to happen commonly enough for visual novels.
Regardless, I agree that in cases where the plot barely gets any coverage, while the gameplay does, we could conclude that to the reviewers, the plot of the game is secondary. This isn't about drawing a line, however: if there is enough to talk about in terms of plot, you can create a section for it; otherwise, you just sum it up in the gameplay section as is done in Mischief Makers. I would definitely prefer the semi-hard word limit to stay in place, however. Surely, many stories are incredibly long and complicated, but we still have to assume that our readers have zero interest in the game they are reading up again. Keeping that in mind, an overly long plot section is something we should try to avoid. Sometimes, a summary of the premise is enough to give a good impression of a story as well. ~ Mable ( chat) 07:29, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Okay, so maybe we can advise along these lines: As video games tend to have the narrative wrapped around the structure of the game (by areas, levels, missions, quests, or similar gameplay segmentation), it can be rather tempting to write the plot section at this level of granularity. However, it is encouraged to look at the larger picture of the game, condensing what might be large sections of it into single paragraphs if little narrative is developed during these parts. For example, it is not necessary to document every step of the hero's quest to obtain 7 parts of a key, when one can simple say that "the hero visits many locations to collect the parts of the key". Not every character, location, or quest needs to be documented if it does not drive the main story or contribute towards the game's development or reception. Plot sections do not have to strongly adhere to the presentation order, either, if it helps to make the plot more concise. More advice on how to write concise plots for any type of fiction can be found at WP:WAF.. -- MASEM ( t) 15:40, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
There is currently a disagreement between editors at the GTA V talk page as to whether the re-release development section should be included into the Development article or kept as is. Any feedback from editors not involved with the subject would be greatly appreciated. CR4ZE ( t • c) 11:50, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
I have a problem. Lately I've been trying to add scores and links to the multi-platform Reception charts, but bots like 81.153.133.15 and 86.42.171.225 keep making Reception charts too tall for articles like Need for Speed: Underground, Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, and Need for Speed: Underground 2; and they also mark mobile versions of games as "not notable" even though they are and remove them. Can somebody please stop these bots from invading game articles and making Reception charts too tall? -- Angeldeb82 ( talk) 21:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
I was wondering if the years and genre in Guitar Hero Live and Rock Band 4 the soundtrack section violates WP:CRYSTAL or any other Wikipedia guidelines? neither games have been released yet but by a simple google search can get the song year and genre since the songs have already been released. TheDeviantPro ( talk) 23:49, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
Not sure how this got on my watchlist, but, it looks like someone has well and truly chucked their teddy out of the pram and created Lost Saga North America because they were upset at accommodating different language versions; history and talk page are worth a read. When would be a good time to point out that all of the character class cruft needs to be removed? - X201 ( talk) 21:17, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm currently copyediting the article Electronic Sports League and wonder where ESL One fits into that context. Is it correct to call it "a CS:GO tournament series", maybe even "the biggest CS:GO tournament series"? Or do the events have significantly more to offer than CS:GO tournaments? I don't know that much about e-sports but started to edit the article because it's in a terrible shape. In that context I found that the ESL is introducing drug screenings on their events, starting with said ESL One Cologne this month. So I'd like to add this information to the article, but since the ESL One is not mentioned so far and doesn't have an article on it's own I wonder what's the best way to reference/describe it, and if the event series is notable enough to deserve an own article (de-wiki has a whole series of articles, one per event, but I think that's a bit overkill). Rh73 ( talk) 17:56, 15 August 2015 (UTC)
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Deletion sorting. Thanks. — JJMC89 ( T· E· C) 03:49, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 110 | ← | Archive 112 | Archive 113 | Archive 114 | Archive 115 | Archive 116 | → | Archive 120 |
I have created {{ Steam app}} to provide standardised links to app pages on Steam. I chose "app" (rather than game) to be more generic, as there are a few things beside games on Steam, and "app" is what Steam call it in the URL. It will optionally pull the Steam app ID from Wikidata property Steam ID (P1733), if no id is supplied as a parameter. I think this type of Wikidata usage might still be classified as "alpha", but it seems to work ok today, and it will use a supplied ID in preference to Wikidata if required for any exceptional/problem cases. It's only an external link, so it should not be the end of the world if there's any short term breakage with it due to Wikidata issues or changes. Longer term, pulling that ID from Wikidata seems to be the correct approach. Example usage:
{{
Steam app}}
(id will come from Wikidata, name will be {{
PAGENAMEBASE}}.{{
Steam app|id=|name=}}
{{
Steam app|id=220200|name=Kerbal Space Program}}
→Long term, the first no-params variant should probably be the preferred usage on main articles about a game; only supplying an id or name where the automatic default does not provide an appropriate result, or if it's being used to create a link to something other than the default case.
-- Murph9000 ( talk) 12:39, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
List of Xbox 360 games compatible with Xbox One ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) has been nominated for DYK, so I'd appreciate other editors giving it a nice once-over and tightening it up & watching for vandalism if it does go on the front page. Thanks! – xeno talk 15:02, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
I made a major edit of Persistent world; feedback welcome. Also, I would like to suggest Metaverse as part of the video game project. Since the concept is a collective world of virtual worlds, and virtual worlds are games, I would assume Metaverse will be used for games. For example, there is already an MMO in Second Life. Cheers! -- K.Nevelsteen ( talk) 20:49, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
So Microsoft recently announced Xbox One backwards compatibility. From what I've read, they are emulating the Xbox 360 hardware layer in software. I noticed some IP editors adding Xbox One to the platforms on Mass Effect (video game) and was wondering if this was correct to do. A number of original Xbox titles that are compatible with Xbox 360 (which required emulation profiles) are not list as Xbox 360 titles. But then I see a lot of Nintendo Virtual Console (software emulation) games with Wii U, 3DS, and Wii listed as platforms. What's the best way to approach this? Is/Should there be a guidelines that covers this? -- The1337gamer ( talk) 11:53, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
I have worked very hard for the compilation of Featured Characters section in WWE 2K15 article and also improved the article by adding more details. May I be awarder a barnstar by anyone here? User:AkshayAnand
I had someone recently create and then blank an article at Yandere Simulator. I've got a draft version in my userspace here, but the coverage has been slightly erratic so far so I haven't moved it yet. Do any of you think that it's ready? Some of the sources are brief but could be seen as a slight review of sorts. I haven't incorporated that aspect of the sources yet since I was waffling over that, but I think that this is just at the cusp of either passing or failing criteria. I'd rather get some slight consensus here before moving it to the mainspace before its ready, since I don't want it to go through an AfD, which can sometimes make it more difficult for articles to remain in the mainspace. Tokyogirl79 (。◕‿◕。) 10:17, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
PSA that the latest vg StoryBundle is out:
- Boss Fight Books: Bible Adventures by Gabe Durham
- Designers & Dragons - 1970s, 1980s, 1990s & 2000s by Shannon Appelcline
- The Untold History of Japanese Game Developers by John Szczepaniak
- HG 101 Presents: An Unofficial Guide to Castlevania by Kurt Kalata
- How Video Games Are Made by Russ Pitts
- SCROLL: #12 - Introducing MSX (Plus #1-11 Bonus!) by Ray Barnholt
- Put This In Your Brain: The Best of Unwinnable Weekly by Stu Horvath & the Unwinnable Writers
I actually bought it this time, particularly for the Appelcline and Szczepaniak titles (still regret not getting the previous bundles—can't find those PDFs anywhere...) Anyway, it'll be up for the next three weeks. – czar 14:45, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
Normally, I'd just plop this down as a refidea on the relevant article, but this long interview with Tim Schafer touches on most of the games he's worked on. [4]. -- MASEM ( t) 18:12, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
Is there an existing page on Wikipedia that already overs this topic, and if not, would the topic of second-hand consumerism of games and the microeconomics behind it be a viable topic to cover? How thoroughly discussed is this kind of thing in western (North America/Europe) circles?
Reason being is that I've lately read a few newspaper articles and financial website posts about how videogame retailers work in Japan. Most game retailers there make little or zero profit from selling new games (since essentially ~95% of the retail cost goes to publishers, devs, supply line costs, et cetera), and rely on the second-hand games market in order to remain profitable. I'm kind of intrigued by this topic, but I'm not sure whether it would make sense to make this into an actual article (or even a subsection within an existing broader article).
I've also come across a few primary sources written directly from store owners as well, such as this one, though it probably won't meet WP:V criteria since it's not a third-party independent source. The aforementioned link gives the retailer's perspective and discusses the impact of shitty games ( kusoge) that retailers simply can't get rid of, since nobody wants to buy their stock:
タイトル数が多いVITA。けっこうあるかと思いきや、2本という優秀な結果に。PAOはコアユーザーの方にけっこう使っていただいているので、コア向けゲームが多いVITAソフトがかなり回るんですね。中古が回る=中古の平均仕入価格が下がる、なのでほとんどのゲームで利益が取れるようになってます。ん?その2本って何かって?『うた組み575』と『ヴァルハラナイツ3』です。うた組みはちょっと取り過ぎて中古落としをした結果です。いや、個人的には好きなんですよね。発売日に買ったし…!後者はちょっと買取金額を下げるタイミングが遅かったかなと。シリーズはそこそこ中古で回っていたのですが、本作は目が肥えたVITAユーザーにとってしっかりゲーム内容&評価が把握されていたようで、当初から動きが鈍かったです。ただ全体としては収益をしっかり稼げる機種なので、今しばらくがんばってもらう形になりますね。
Since the PlayStation Vita has a lot of titles, you'd think we'd get a lot of excess stock, but right now there's actually only two used games that we'd be forced to sell at a loss. Reason is, we (PAO) get a lot of 'hardcore' customers, and since the Vita's library appeals to that audience, we move a lot of it. Our only two unprofitable used Vita games are Utagumi 575 and Valhalla Knights 3. I personally liked Utagumi, but we just ended up with too much of it. And we were too late in lowering VK3's price; most gamers found out about the bad reviews very early on, and it just doesn't sell. But as a whole, used vita games sell well and give us a consistent profit.
There's plenty of better sources out there if I search around a bit, but this is the general gist of what the used games market is like in Japan; supply and demand is heavily influenced by the enthusiast demographic in many cases, unless a game specifically targets casual players. -- benlisquare T• C• E 10:13, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
site:eurogamer.net
and site:ign.com
searches generally nets me articles about how various publishers consider the second-hand market "killing the industry". If we do end up writing about videogame economics, it'll probably make sense to have each part separated by region. --
benlisquare
T•
C•
E 11:11, 25 June 2015 (UTC)Many of the MUDs listed in {{ MUDs}} are really sparse of reliable sourcing and are likely candidates for merge (to a parent article or list), if someone wants to take a look:
– czar 19:49, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These likely copyright violations can be searched by your topic of interest, e.g., control-f "WikiProject Video games."-- Lucas559 ( talk) 22:18, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
I don't like doing this sort of thing, especially since lately I haven't been as involved in discussions here as I should be (as in, at all), but... A week ago I requested a move at Talk: Hydlide 3. The request has been relisted, presumably due to the lack of discussion. If anyone here could help remedy that situation by adding their thoughts, that would be much appreciated.-- Martin IIIa ( talk) 12:24, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
Currently I am doing the The Last of Us: Left Behind GAN. While checking the archives to the links, one of them by GameSpot directed me to a clip from an Eddie Murphy comedy special ( link in question). I pointed this out to Rhain1999, the nominator, and they said out that not only is it effecting the other GameSpot archive links, but also a link to Giant Bomb. This also seems apparent to other archive links for The Last of Us and even one for the Mother series. Bare in mind these are all WebCite links cutting to a YouTube clip for the same Eddie Murphy clip. Seeing how both GameSpot and Giant Bomb are both owned by CBS Interactive, that raises some flags, with Rhain saying that this might be happening because some people don't want these links archived. As to why I'm unsure. This is just something that might be a big problem in archiving those two sites using WebCite. GamerPro64 02:50, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
I've spotted an additional problem with GamePro articles on Webcite, the article is present, but the java code renders the text as invisible on the screen. - X201 ( talk) 08:35, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
I've been doing work on the article above, and currently the only major thing bothering me is the image. I tried to upload something, but it is not transparent, and I don't have the stuff on my computer to make the necessary changes. Can someone help me with that? -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 18:25, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi, I recently created the page Dark Souls (series) for the Demon's Souls, Dark Souls 2 and Dark Souls 3 games as well as the related Bloodborne and King's Field (series) games. The page was recently patrolled by DangerousJXD, but it is very bare and I could use help from anyone willing to fill in the article. Osh33m ( talk) 00:28, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
Do we really need so many articles about Second Life? See Template:Second Life where there are a number of poorly sourced or just poorly written articles that seem like they could be consolidated into fewer with less sprawling coverage. Having not played the game or looked at these articles before I'm not sure where to start with this and wondered if anyone with experience could share their opinion. Sam Walton ( talk) 10:32, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
Editors need to made aware of a co-ordinated effort from the subreddit /r/pcmasterrace to add derogatory information to a variety of console articles. A search for "wikipedia" provides some idea of the problem [6] One prominent example:
Some of the names are familiar. In this thread [7] the creation of several new articles is suggested, with the purpose of "showing the peasants how small their collections really are". These articles were eventually created by editor User:Wikinium but later redirected after they were AfDd. The aforementioned editor is now on the Xbox One talk page attempting to add unflattering information there. [8] I have only made a cursory glance at the subreddit. The problem appears to go much deeper and requires further investigation. — TPX 11:15, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
We've been hit. This is absurd along the lines of the old NDT controversy I was in the middle of. Source/Citation Zero Serenity ( talk - contributions) 07:07, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
The issue has been raised on Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents — TPX 20:49, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
mw:Citoid appears to be the future of referencing on WP. Short of it is: enter a URL, it uses a Zotero "translator" to scrape the page's metadata, Citoid compiles the citation for insertion. Logical process. Only problem is that most VG sites do not play well with the scraper since no one has written a translator. Wanted to bring this to the project in case someone interested in coding or sources might want to take it up as a project. We would all save a lot of time by using Citoid/Zotero over our current manual methods. (I wrote a Chrome plug-in for Polygon citations—my source of choice—but I'm a novice at this and wouldn't have time to look at it for many weeks.) @ X201, PresN, and Thibbs – czar 17:33, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
I'm not familiar with history of this series. Is the recent move of Harvest Moon (series) to Story of Seasons (series) appropriate? Same goes for the creation of this split article Harvest Moon (Natsume series). -- The1337gamer ( talk) 23:24, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
Someone might want to take a look at this ( permalink). Does this person have a point, or are they just making stuff up? I have only played some of the first game, so I can't know for sure, but I kinda doubt it's true... and considering PEGI only gave the games a 16 rating and didn't even mention sex it seems unlikely. Still, would be nice if someone more knowledgeable than me looked at it.-- IDV talk 09:34, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
I'm only sporadically active on WP at the moment, and I haven't been following things as closely as I had been doing. But after a quick check of my watchlist, it is evident that User:Tripple-ddd is still trying to brute-force in their way, with the exact same disregarding of consensus - and that's not all of the diffs I can find. Can someone please give them a final warning? Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 17:51, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
I was reading a
Polygon interview with Troy Baker, when this bit jumped out at me (emphasis mine): "[People] start ascribing these roles to us when we're not in it. There's so many things on my IMDb and Wikipedia that I'm like, I never did that.
" Wait, what? Does anyone think we might want to do some bit-by-bit deep review of what
Troy Baker is credited for in his article, make sure everything's true and sourced? I know he may have just been using Wikipedia as an example without being aware of specific inaccuracies, but I can't help but to shake the feeling we might've let some incorrect OR in! ☺ ·
Salvidrim! ·
✉ 00:25, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
IEEE interactive timeline of the console generations. I have not checked how exactly it matches up but it looks very close to what we already have (8 gens to date, generally by date, etc.) -- MASEM ( t) 22:28, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
– czar 13:57, 30 June 2015 (UTC)The gap between the computer-focused European and console-focused American gaming histories of the 1980s and early 1990s also highlights another issue I had with the histories I read: console generations. The history of games had somehow become the history of game consoles. It is understandable in some ways. It is a much, much easier story to tell. It’s clean, linear and tidy. But neat and easy a structure as console generations are for a writer, it’s a deeply flawed framework.
— http://www.kinephanos.ca/2015/rewriting-history/
There is currently a content dispute that I am involved in which spans across multiple articles related to PlayStation Vita games.
The PlayStation TV is a variant of the PlayStation Vita which does not feature input buttons, a portable battery or a display screen; rather, it connects to a television via HDMI so that a player can play TV-compatible PlayStation Vita games on a television using a DualShock 3 or DualShock 4 controller. It is a fully-fledged PlayStation Vita system, complete with ARM processor chip, dedicated RAM, motherboard connectors, game cartridge slot, and other hardware components, and all of the core components are completely identical to the components found within the portable Vita; even the graphics scaler in the PlayStation TV is identical to that of the portable Vita, per this interview with Sony Computer Entertainment Software Development Director Muneki Shimada and Hardware Planning Division Manager Kiyoto Shibuya. It features the exact identical system software as the PlayStation Vita (see PlayStation Vita system software), and all games within its library are marketed, by Sony, by publishers and by retailers, as "PlayStation Vita games". Of course, not all PS Vita games are compatible with the PlayStation TV, since some games rely extensively on the Vita's touchscreen, camera or gyromotion controls, features which are not supported by the variant device. Hence, some games are marketed as "PlayStation TV-compatible PlayStation Vita games".
No third-party reliable source ever refers to the PlayStation TV as a videogame platform, and thus referring to the PS TV as a platform would fail WP:V and WP:OR policies. Based on the rationale provided above, I am of the opinion that the PlayStation TV is NOT a videogame platform, just like how the Super Game Boy is not a videogame platform.
Special:Contributions/Kalsolesse has been adding " Playstation TV" as a videogame platform within the VG infobox to a wide multitude of articles about PlayStation Vita games, including but not limited to Persona 4: Dancing All Night, Shin Megami Tensei: Persona 4, Killzone: Mercenary, et cetera. In response to an edit warring warning I placed on their user talkpage, they have responded on my talkpage that they intend to "edit the information back in in over 24 hours... If you see fit to revert it again, then I see no other choice but to seek arbitration".
In the spirit of WP:CONSENSUS, I'd like to seek a third opinion, given that I am party to a content dispute, per standard procedure. -- benlisquare T• C• E 11:55, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
There are no game compatibility issues between the original PlayStation and the PSone, nor between the original PS2 and the PS2 slim. The original PS3 is backwards compatible with PS2 games while the slimmer variants are not, and while the slim PSP versions run games faster due to increased RAM compared to the fat PSP, there are no games which are actually incompatible or unplayable as a result of the negligible hardware difference. Hence, we have a rather unique case on our hands, and I don't think reflecting on other examples would be of much assistance.
In regards to having the information placed conveniently on every game page for readers to view, we can't list the PS TV as a "platform" per WP:V and WP:OR (it's simply not a platform, calling it that would be outright misinformation), which means that we would need a dedicated area for variant device compatibility. However, this issue only affects the Vita platform, and none of the other current platforms, and for a game that is available on PS3, PS4 and a wide variety of others (for example Borderlands 2, which is PS TV compatible), it's simply WP:UNDUE that there are parts dedicated to Vita variant compatibility and irrelevant to the other platforms.
Finally, WP:NOTGUIDE and WP:INDISCRIMINATE are the reasons why we don't have prices within infoboxes for videogames anymore; a long time ago, every single game article contained the launch prices of games for every region, plus system requirements and media formats. I see compatibility notes within these articles as falling within similar territory, a type of "for your information" tidbit that isn't really what an encyclopoedia usually entails. -- benlisquare T• C• E 13:03, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
I have been doing some desultory poking around for sources concerning the development of Prince of Persia: Warrior Within. The most outstanding one is a video making-of featurette created by Ubisoft and originally published on the game's official website. The website is now defunct and the videos lost at their original source and in archived captures of their respective pages. The only one from the site I have found on a fully usable site ( GameTrailers) is an interview with the character Kaileena's voice actress. The main video (titled Making of Prince of Persia: Warrior Within) can be found in various places online (the best version I found was on YouTube), but it's not published through through Ubisoft's official channels, only on user-based accounts which found and published the videos before the original website closed. Is it possible to use these videos as sources and cite them, or at least use them as a reference for my citation without using a link back to them? I do know how to cite videos, it's just using it in a way that would be acceptable in a good-quality article that's the problem. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 14:40, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
As people might know, there is a problem recently with archiving urls on Wayback Machine and WebCite belonging to GameSpot and Giant Bomb (I don't know about any other sites): instead of archiving the url and showing the page, it redirects to a YouTube clip from an Eddie Murphy comedy routine. The problem is still outstanding. Is there any sign of a solution to this, or any update about what is going on that offers a glimmer of hope? -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 21:57, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
There's also an issue with normal GameSpot links. Links made before they changed their site layout are broken, but going to GameSpot and searching for the article - even a review - results in zero hits. I'm now having to use Google site search to find the new location of articles on GameSpot servers. - X201 ( talk) 08:51, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
I caught this [11] over at Portal:Video Games, but it appears that they've consolidated all old content under Gamesradar, meaning all url links are broken to these sites. I have not had a chance to affirm, but this would be a serious problem if true. -- MASEM ( t) 14:33, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
Once again, we bring back this reviewer/reviewee tool to show what is being neglected, what needs urgent attention, and to barter amongst outselves over who does what and how and when. There is the usual backlog at Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests, and contributors are welcome.
Not putting anything here myself, but as usual, here is the place where people can request reviews, either in exchange for something or as a straight-up request for help with something. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 16:49, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
I'll happily trade someone's review for a comprehensive review of List of The Last of Us characters (alternatively, leaving a comment on the peer review of The Last of Us or reviewing the GAN for Development of The Last of Us would be fantastic, too). – Rhain1999 ( talk to me) 11:54, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
Back in April, New Age Retro Hippie edited every article on Virtual Boy games to include this statement in the "Reception" section: "The red-and-black color scheme used in the game were said to cause eye strain, headaches, and nausea." ( Example) When I first noticed this back in May, I decided to leave it be. None of the edits had been reverted, so apparently other Wikiproject Video Game editors approved of them, and New Age Retro Hippie is an experienced editor who I would usually take for granted knows what he's doing.
However, after two months of reflection I still find that the edits to be plainly inappropriate. Isn't it clear that this statement is a comment on the critical reception for the Virtual Boy hardware, not the software, and certainly not the individual software? The cited source doesn't even mention half of the games in question, and those which it does mention it doesn't blame for the red-and-black color scheme which was necessitated by the console it ran on. Also, New Age Retro Hippie made these edits even on articles for games which are not Virtual Boy exclusive, without providing any indication that the statement applies only to the Virtual Boy version of the game. ( Example) While this can of course be quickly and easily fixed, it suggests to me that New Age Retro Hippie did not put as much thought into these edits as he usually does with his editing.
So I am of a mind to remove this statement from all the articles on VB games, but again given that it was added to over a dozen articles without opposition, I thought I should seek consensus here first.-- Martin IIIa ( talk) 12:18, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi WP:VG guys, I'm from WP:Pro Wrestling. We have several stubs of video games on professional wrestling. I want to know how to prove their notability (or lack thereof, then delete them). The wrestling websites I frequent don't mention these games. Is there a standard list of gaming or gaming review websites which if a game fails to appear on those, then it's considered not notable? Most of the games are pretty retro or restricted to Japan.
Thank you very much and have a nice day. starship .paint ~ KO 06:45, 11 July 2015 (UTC)
So I've been thinking about the practice of archiving links here and I was thinking to myself about how it would be possible to archive links to GameTrailers. GT's niche was always it being the go-to place to watch video content on games before YouTube took its spotlight. And since its primarily video content, I wonder if that makes it difficult to archive their links with WebCite or Archive.org. GamerPro64 19:43, 11 July 2015 (UTC)
So with the influx of more and more video game articles becoming Today's Featured Articles, we got two articles making the front page this month: Sinistar: Unleashed on the 6th, and Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within on the 13th. Cheers. GamerPro64 17:34, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
Satoru Iwata just died. Keep an eye on that article. « Ryūkotsusei » 00:10, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
I'm fairly certain that this will be the same as the "No" consensus for Gaikai and On-Live, but thought I'd check anyway. - X201 ( talk) 10:45, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
This is an honest question of curiosity: I know that wikipedia bases itself on external sourcees that can be linked to or verified. However, in the case of games, often the sources include releases from developers that have at least some form of marketing behind, or were written at an earlier stage of development. This can lead to descriptions of gameplay that are described one way in the sources, but function quite differently in the games themselves. Have you ever considered using the media themselves as a source of reference (in addition to the written sources), rather than just the documentation that surrounds it? 80.112.180.116 ( talk) 19:38, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
A heads-up about a change I'm not sure most people know about: for as long as any of us can likely remember, there has been one golden rule about navboxes at the bottom of page- that every link must be to an existing article. No more! As per this RFC, provided the navbox is still mostly blue links, you are now allowed to add a few redlinks to spice things up. Presumably, this includes redirects. Items without an article should actually be redlinked, though, not just in unlinked plain text. -- Pres N 01:32, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi guys... so, I'd like to revisit this archived conversation.
More importantly I would like to revisit the topic of the page for Game Zero Magazine. The page was active for 7 years (2005-2012) and then someone rushed through a deletion request in 2012 that purged the page from the wiki because they felt that the magazine wasn't notable enough to have an entry. The chief problem as has been declared many times is that being online in 1994-1996 much of the web from 1994-1996 is missing to provide context since Archive.org didn't start indexing until late 1996. Short of anecdotal evidence and provable presence in a number of early printed URL indexes where the site was only one a few gaming resources listed (and the generally the only magazine), it may be impossible to provide the period references that validate some of the first that should be attributed to the magazine.
Why I ask this is that prior to the 2012 deletion Wikipedia and Google were slowly becoming the last link sources providing visibility to the archived website to younger web users and now in light of Google demoting results of sites that don't provide a mobile friendly set of pages, the passage of time is doing it's damnedest to push this magazine into true obscurity. (Rebuilding the site to be modern/mobile friendly kinda defeats the idea of an archived site, right?)
On a personal note, as a former editor for the magazine and maintainer of the archive image it really breaks my heart to see something that was so significant slowly wiped from history simply because it isn't easily visible anymore. I know this whole issue is mess of COI, POV and more at this point. So I'm looking to you guys for ideas. I've entertained the idea of talking to some other journalist to see about capturing some of this history but since everyone uses Wikipedia as a first source and they see the magazine not listed ... well, now the problem is feeding itself.
Pages for reference: Game Zero magazine/ Game Zero magazine, talk page
Help? BcRIPster ( talk) 19:48, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
I know Mobygames is not a reliable source, but should we be removing it from external links as well? I'm not sure if there's been a discussion on this before. A brief search didn't turn up anything clear, since there's a lot of noise to sort through. — Torchiest talk edits 16:19, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
So while looking for more sources for an article, I stumbled across the website Blue's News. While the article has already been verified as reliable here, I don't think I've ever seen it be put to use in an article. However, the site says that its been around in 1996, meaning that it has a lot of links to other sites in their work. Even having an archive from July 1996-February 1999. A lot of the links throughout the sites articles are broken but using the Wayback Machine can bring them back. Just something to look through if anyones interested in trying to find more research on an article. GamerPro64 02:49, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
So I've been going around on various Ratchet & Clank-related articles and taking a wrench (ha!) to the plot summaries of each to try and take it down to the most important details that a reader ought to know about the plots of each game, instead of reading like a fan's badly-written blow-by-blow of every cutscene. I wanted to ask a question about the way to do it, and as well, I want to try and sample a few opinions here at WPVG on the subject.
So my first question is, should plot sections simply present the premise of a game's story, OR should it synopsize the plot of the game start-to-finish, albeit only covering the most important components of the plot that a layman needs to know to understand it?
Second question is, which article(s), in you guys' opinions, have the best written Plot sections, whether GA, FA or whatever, that other game articles ought to emulate? I want to use something as a frame of reference, and I know how much mileage may vary between articles, especially depending on story complexity. BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 15:54, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
Video game plot summaries are unusual beasts. The premise of a video game article should principally be about how it's played, not its story. That said, there are games that are quite notable for their storylines, and have received coverage in the gaming press for them. Those are the games that deserve more extensive plot summaries, approaching lengths reserved for films (see WP:FILMPLOT). In my opinion, in the vast majority of cases, video game plot summaries should be just that ... very brief set-ups to the story behind the game. -- McDoob AU93 14:36, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
You seem to be able to cut the plots down. However, if you want to save your time you can just look at the article's history for a point where the plot was in a reasonable state. Being GAs, Arsenal and Commando have had some decent summaries ( here and here). You may have luck with the other games too. Gabriel Yuji ( talk) 14:41, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
I have learned exactly what is causing the archiving issue with GameSpot. It is also responsible for a few other problems the site has been experiencing recently such as videos not working, the site not loading properly, and its speed collapsing. Apparently the site is having extensive trouble with advertisements trying to create clones of their site and using it for their own purposes. As part of their efforts to counter it, GameSpot put in a general block on any site attempting to make a copy of a page: unfortunately, that meant Archive.org and WebCite were also blocked. I have raised the issue on the site's forums, and the staff will apparently adjust to allow Archive.org to archive pages (have no idea about WebCite). I will be doing tests in a week, and if the problem persists, I will make inquiries about its continuation.
On a separate note, since the recent death of Satoru Iwata, I feel we should move to archive the Iwata Asks with all possible speed, as it is possible that they might go down within the next year or two. They can be successfully archived using WebCite from the page's UK and Japanese versions. They have extensive interviews with staff on multiple games, including recent Fire Emblem and Zelda titles, Xenoblade Chronicles and Chronicles X, and more niche titles like The Last Story and Pandora's Tower, among others. I've already archived some interviews. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 13:36, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
Hey everyone, newcomer to the video game realm of Wiki here. Some of you have probably seen me frequenting the late Satoru Iwata's article...I've made a goal for myself to improve it as much as possible and this has extended into his interview series, Iwata Asks. I just finished going through all the translated ones available through Nintendo, but I'm certain there are many more that are Japanese-only. In one of his 3DS interviews, Mr. Iwata stated that he conduced over 200 interviews. Going from that amount, there are at least 32 missing from the list (168 of his are listed + 5 by others). Do any of you here know how to search for these so I can complete the list of his interviews? Many thanks in advance! Cyclonebiskit ( talk) 14:16, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
On a relevant note, if any of you know specific interviews that have pertinent information for Mr. Iwata's article I would greatly appreciate if you could let me know. I plan on reading through all of them at some point since I've noticed they have insightful bits scattered about in the discussions...but knowing where to look first would save me some time. Thanks in advance again~! Cyclonebiskit ( talk) 14:43, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
This is a question on sources, both now and for future reference. I am doing an article rewrite (FE: Path of Radiance) where I need the sales data from NPD Group for October 2005. I've seen plenty of figures quoted in forums where the Top 50 GameCube games were quoted, but I can't find any report/press release by NPD that goes beyond the top ten positions. No actual figures. Is there any source apart from forum pages (which are generally inadmissible in GAs) that can provide these figures? If there are favorable results from this, it can be applied to other games in the future. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 22:53, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
{{
ccat|Roundabout}}
Roundabout is a comedy action video game for PC and current-gen consoles. There are 20 reviews on Metacritic.
[12]
[13]
[14]. It has been on our
requests page since September 2014, I'm asking again here because the developers recently released images under a free use license.
Another reminder is that I still have Steam keys for Insurgency (video game) to give away via email if anyone would like to take that article on. Insurgency is a PC multiplayer shooter with an active community. [15] [16]- hahnch e n 09:36, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone have books by Pix'n Love (histories of Nintendo, Mario, Sonic, Gunpei Yokoi)? No hits in reference. – czar 02:23, 27 July 2015 (UTC)
If a game is released digitally (no retail available) on services including GOG.com, Steam and Origin, who is described as the publisher? All of them, none of them, or self-published?-- Vaypertrail ( talk) 20:13, 28 July 2015 (UTC)
To all interested editors on Wikipedia. There is a rather heated discussion going on on the talk page of Fire Emblem Fates about the inclution of the category "LGBT-related video games". This is the first game in its series to feature the option of a same-sex relationship, but some editors feel that there is not enough content or relevance to merit its inclusion. Can you please come to this RfC and give your stance or opinion. If there are valid, Wikipedia Policy-related reasons for its removal, please cite them fully so there will be no further confusion or argument. -- ProtoDrake ( talk) 09:22, 29 July 2015 (UTC)
So, what's gonna happen with List of fictional towns in video games? It could use some help. Oiyarbepsy ( talk) 04:07, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Why does Category:Humble Bundle games exist? If a company that sells games includes a game as a bundle, does that mean its notable enough to have every game put in that category? Is someone going to read about a game and see that category, and think hey, I need to click it to see what other games they sold at discount in a bundle? What about the other companies that sell games, alone or in collections? Do they get a category too? Walmart sells games in bundles now. As do many others. Dream Focus 19:16, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
I was thinking about a few in Category:Video games by theme ("comedy video games", "affective video games"), but here's my dump of running cats that I found questionable as "defining"/lede-worthy characteristics: Category:Video games featuring protagonists of selectable gender, Category:Third-person PlayStation 3 shooters (three-way cross-section), Category:Games for Windows certified games (distribution service). I'm also skeptical of "Fiction with alternative endings" and "comic science fiction" as defining characteristics, though I haven't looked into the specifics. Then there's also FIFA 15-type games having a zillion "Video games set in X country" and the indecipherable Category:Lua-scripted video games (none of the games I spotchecked even mentioned Lua...) Feel free to look into any of these if you agree. – czar 23:20, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
incategory:"CategoryName"
and incategory:"CategoryName2"
in the upper right search box it will intersect the both categories and show you all the articles in both of them. There are also an existing series of list articles dating role-playing video games:
List of role-playing video games. --
The1337gamer (
talk) 15:24, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Category:Humble Bundle games, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Dream Focus 22:14, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
Can somebody link me to the Wikipedia policy on including recommend specs for computer games? I know they are not wanted in articles, but I can't find and link to it for another user who wanted to know why I reverted an edit for Rocket League. Thanks. ~ Dissident93 ( talk) 06:50, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
I want to join the WikiProject where I sign up. Junior Dedinho ( talk) 19:32, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
This month on the main page we'll be seeing Arbiter (Halo) on the 11th for Today's Featured Article. Been a while since we've seen an article on a video game character for TFA. Congrats goes out to David Fuchs for his work. GamerPro64 13:46, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
The above Featured Article discussion has begun and may be of interest to this project. It is focused primarily on the comic character but falls under the purview of video game characters. Darkwarriorblake / SEXY ACTION TALK PAGE! 11:12, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh boy... Check this merge discussion at Talk:Ash Crimson#Merge. First Luke Fon Fabre and now this? Regards. Tintor2 ( talk) 19:06, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
I believe this follows from (1) how the rest of the encyclopedia treats their character articles, and (2) our policies on notability, specifically the general notability guideline. Open for workshopping. – czar 21:16, 31 July 2015 (UTC)Individual fictional characters rarely warrant their own articles. When characters of a series are consistently covered as a group, they are best covered in a list-formatted article on Wikipedia. Individual characters warrant their own articles when they meet the general notability guideline and are the subject of sustained and dedicated (in-depth) coverage such that a full article can be written about them with little reliance on primary or self-published sources. Otherwise, they are best covered in lists of series characters.
Just letting everyone know—even though I know pretty much no one cares—that I went through and adjusted Wikipedia:Good articles/Video games to split games up by half-decades rather than decades. Other than to cut down the impressive walls of text that were the 1990s and 2000s, it also highlights just how few GAs we have on games pre-1985: just 16 from 1980–84, plus 2 from the 70s. On the other side, it's kind of neat that we already have 4 GAs on games released in 2015. -- Pres N 02:48, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
So just a thought to keep an eye out for Gamescom announcements. With the confirmation of a new Halo Wars for example there might be possibility for higher activity on certain pages. And possibly vandalism and edit-warring. GamerPro64 20:57, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
I have nominated Empires: Dawn of the Modern World for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. GamerPro64 22:03, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Issakenta appears to be going through and renaming the lists of games, like List of Dreamcast games, to e.g. Dreamcast game library. There doesn't seem to have been a discussion about this beforehand, and the name is certainly non-standard- opinions? -- Pres N 04:48, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
So it seems its been over a year since Review Threads became a thing. I myself unintentionally starting them. With that aside, here are some things that you can take a look at.
And, of course, new month means an increase in the backlog at Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests. Come take a look if you're interested in making a new article for the site. Contributions are always appreciated. GamerPro64 01:01, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
Happy Anniversary! Just wanted to note that I'll happily trade someone's review for a review of the GAN for Development of The Last of Us (I know it looks long and boring, but you might learn something!). Comments on the peer review of The Last of Us would be greatly appreciated too. – Rhain1999 ( talk to me) 10:35, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
This isn't something I'm able to do with the kind of time and computer access I have, but I've found reason to believe that a lot of the citations on Sega that use the SegaSammy powerpoint PDFs as sources might not actually support the statements they're being attributed to. For example, in this set of edits, I identified a statement about Phantasy Star Online 2 that was attributed to one of these PDFs and did a ctrl+F for "phantasy" to check what page it was on so I could make the citation more than just a bare URL, and it turned up nothing. I'm not sure if these documents were being used before he showed up or not, but User:Tripple-ddd was adamant on using these in a lot of places in Sega, and potentially on other Sega-related articles like their development studios, and I'm suspicious that, WP:PRIMARY issues aside, that these sources aren't being used properly at all.
I can't do more than a cursory ctrl+F on any of these docs to spot-check, and this dinosaur of a computer forces me to download them directly to view them all. I don't have the time to do more than a few just before I go to bed, so I would really appreciate it if someone could help me check these. Even if they're correct, they were just plonked in as URLs; they still need page numbers and titles to clarify just what the hell these sources are when someone hovers over the citation. Thanks, BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 18:27, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm not sure why articles like THIS are being redirected. I think it's extremely sad. -- Kaysser ( talk) 11:47, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
The only waste of time has been process for the sake of process. You should only revert a "bold" move when you actually have evidence to disagree. I did my research. It's incredibly insulting to receive a ream of passive-aggressive hand-wringing instead of some semblance of solidarity or gratitude. I sincerely doubt any one of the disputed articles above will still be standing in a month. – czar 17:42, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
Survival game has been begging to be created for a while, I think there's enough sources but could use a bit of help to flesh it out. -- MASEM ( t) 21:56, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm looking at old games related web pages on Wayback Machine. For example this. How do I search these old articles for keywords/text? SharkD Talk 09:28, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Have we reached consensus on this terminology? Nonlinear gameplay and Open world have merge requests. I'm not happy with some of the content of these articles as well. For instance, the articles treat "open world" and "sandbox" as synonyms. Whereas I think games like SimCity and many of the "Tycoon" games are sandboxes. I created an Venn diagram based on how I feel some actual games fit into these categories:
The definitions I feel are appropriate are that, 1. "open world" refers to exploration of the gameworld, 2. "nonlinear gameplay" refers to the plot/story or other sorts of progression, 3. "sandbox" box refers to being able to manipulate the gameworld or economy. I hadn't thought of "open-ended" gameplay until now. Maybe it is just a property of sandbox games?
What are your thoughts? SharkD Talk 06:02, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Are video games whose localization (but not their actual development) have been financed through crowdfunding supposed to go in Category:Crowdfunded video games? Or in a yet-to-be-created sub-category? Currently no such games seem to be in the category, so I'm a bit hesitant to add any without discussing it with other editors first. If we decide to go with a sub-category, I'm not sure what to name it - do we want to include crowdfunding projects for actual development, that also happen to include multi-language releases (such as Shenmue III), or just dedicated localization projects (such as The Fruit of Grisaia)? The name would have to reflect this in a concise manner.-- IDV talk 14:25, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Something that has bothered me for some time is how, when a visual novel article's title needs disambiguation, editors often seem to choose "(visual novel)" rather than "(video game)". No one would do the same thing to, say, fighting games or platformers, or even the similar genre adventure games, so why should we do it with visual novels? Would anyone be opposed to moving articles like Clannad (visual novel) and Snow (visual novel) to Clannad (video game) and Snow (2003 video game)? On a similar note, the disambiguation used for Christine Love (visual novelist) has bothered me for ages.-- IDV talk 15:28, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Not entirely related to the above discussion, but something that has bothered me a little bit for a while and could help with the discussion if video games should always be disambiguated as "(video game)", there is P.T. (demo). It seems a somewhat silly disambiguation: it is very often referred to as a demo specifically, but does that make it any less of a video game? Also, are there other articles disambiguated as such? ~ Mable ( chat) 07:17, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
For a game on Kickstarter that doesn't end up being funded (looks like Red Ash: The Indelible Legend is going to be the prime example, as it's only around 50% funded with just over a week remaining), do we delete the article since no game will be made, or keep it and re-word it as a "canceled" game? I had thought the previous policy was to hold out until the game officially met it's funding, to avoid situations like these. ~ Dissident93 ( talk) 20:42, 24 July 2015 (UTC)
Another "sort of relevant" thing, in that it's also about Red Ash. Today, an editor added furigana for the Japanese title in the article's lead. I've never seen this done before on Wikipedia, and I'm just barely able to make out the small characters - aside from very distinct and simple ones like ん, it's hard to see anything but clusters of pixels. So... what I'm asking here is, is this an okay addition? We already write out the romanization, so I don't really see it being useful.-- IDV talk 09:46, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
I am definitely against the recent "nuking" of the games in the series, Ratchet & Clank, they are now too summative. A game should not have to be especially noted in "x", for "x" to have a detailed area in Wikipedia. People should be able to go to the "Plot" of a game on Wikipedia that wasn't praised for the story, and find the basic story. It is not like "Reception", where the reception of the story would matter for how much information of the story should be within "Reception". The games' articles were better before they had their stories altered. Freshness For Lettuce ( talk) 19:09, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
I do wonder if like the film project we can push on a word count for plots that can only be sourced to the game itselfWhole-hearted support. I'd even go further to ask why we even need to source to the game when every game's important plot elements are noted in secondary sources. (And in the most extreme cases, we can source to the manual—but as a last resort!) Our sources are already telling us what's important to include. – czar 20:47, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
I disagree with Czar and agree with IDV. And about "I do wonder if like the film project we can push on a word count for plots that can only be sourced to the game itself" that's not a problem. But within the numbers of 500–700 words, they should be able to summary the whole plot. If we only reproduced what sources say, maybe not every film would be able to do so. So it doesn't fit with Czar's idea of adding only of what sources say. Of course a plot is more important for a film than for a video game but wouldn't we be neglecting major facts or details and places the subject in context? Gabriel Yuji ( talk) 22:23, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Whatever the details of such a guideline may be, I'd definitely like to see something more firmly laid out in WP:VG/GL about how plots should be summarized, just so there can be some consistency on how we tackle this. I can see the rationale behind relying only on secondary sources for what to mention in such a plotsum, and I can also see the rationale behind summarizing the plot start-to-finish where the game is considered a primary source-- although personally I think the latter choice, while informative for an interested reader, still doesn't have a good supporting structure in terms of verifiability and a solid framework of reliable sources to hold up what is being written into it. I also think having a word limit could be helpful too, depending on what approach to the guideline we take.
Generally speaking I'd just be game all around if we could nail down some good proposals for how to handle plotsums, and maybe run an RfC either here or on the WP:VG/GL talkpage to poll for what proposal the community thinks is the best practice. BLUSTER⌉⌊ BLASTER 11:20, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
The edited plot section of The Witcher 3 is 2000 words. Apparently, it needs to be this long. - X201 ( talk) 16:03, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
R. & C. 1, R. & C. 2, and R. & C. 3, now are extremely unexplained in "Plot". Sure, adding to "Plot" based on reception/coverage can be useful because it provides context, but even if a game recieved "minimal" coverage on the story, it should still have the "Plot" with the main points of the story. The articles of Ratchet & Clank currently don't include the ends of any of the games' stories. They should be restored to how they were. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freshness For Lettuce ( talk • contribs) 19:28, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
This is what I would propose for a Plot update to our guidelines:
Add game plot in the Gameplay section in proportion to its coverage in reliable, secondary sources (i.e., do not create separate Plot sections unless secondary sources note the plot's importance to the game). When an elaborated Plot section is necessary for completeness, prioritize sources in this order: (1) reliable, secondary sources, (2) reliable video game strategy guides and overviews (e.g., Prima, Brady, not user-created guides), (3) the game manual or other primary source documentation, (4) as a last resort, the game itself. Plot sections should be concise, proportional in length to its amount of Reception section coverage, and limited to less than 700 words.
I think this draft minds the above opinions, site policy, and WPVG precedent. Having it in the guidelines should save us from having this discussion repeatedly. Open for workshopping. – czar 20:26, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
Feel free to revise – czar 22:53, 7 August 2015 (UTC)Plot sections, if necessary, should be no more than approximately 700 words to retain focus.
— Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games/Article_guidelines#What_is_appropriate.3F
– czar 03:42, 8 August 2015 (UTC)Plot: if the plot is not too complex, it can be lumped in with the gameplay; otherwise, put it in its own section.
— Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games/Article_guidelines#Organization
unique burden of proofto ask that plot be sourced like everything else in the article (with exceptions for extremes)? Due weight is part of NPOV—the only violation of NPOV here is to have a plot section out of weight with its importance in an article. The problem is that many WPVG editors are determining the appropriate plot weight based on whim rather than source weight. We weigh everything else proportional to source coverage. (The theoretical debate between gameplay and story doesn't belong here, either—especially when invoking our NPOV? If you feel that's even an issue, take it up with the sources.) – czar 20:17, 11 August 2015 (UTC)
my argument, which you simultaneously ignored and misunderstoodI read your "argument" and I disagreed that what you posed as an ideological debate should have any bearing on our dedication to NPOV and verifiability. Are you claiming that the entirety of our (bloated) vetted source list has systemic bias in preference of gameplay over plot and therefore cannot be trusted as a measure of plot's importance? It would have been easier to say so directly, and still I'd disagree that it's the case. As for sourcing plot sections, every guideline says that secondary sources are preferred and that no citations (i.e., sourcing to the work itself) is merely the backup plan. – czar 09:10, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
No need to be inflammatory. – czar 20:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)plot summary ... does not need to be sourced with in-line citations, ... However, editors are encouraged to add sourcing if possible
— Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Writing_about_fiction#Plot_summaries
Hmm, to look on the flipside: imagine a game where absolutely no reliable sources discuss its gameplay other than it being "an RPG", but many of them go deep into the story of the game. Would it make sense for such a game to not have a gameplay-section? I would imagine this to happen commonly enough for visual novels.
Regardless, I agree that in cases where the plot barely gets any coverage, while the gameplay does, we could conclude that to the reviewers, the plot of the game is secondary. This isn't about drawing a line, however: if there is enough to talk about in terms of plot, you can create a section for it; otherwise, you just sum it up in the gameplay section as is done in Mischief Makers. I would definitely prefer the semi-hard word limit to stay in place, however. Surely, many stories are incredibly long and complicated, but we still have to assume that our readers have zero interest in the game they are reading up again. Keeping that in mind, an overly long plot section is something we should try to avoid. Sometimes, a summary of the premise is enough to give a good impression of a story as well. ~ Mable ( chat) 07:29, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Okay, so maybe we can advise along these lines: As video games tend to have the narrative wrapped around the structure of the game (by areas, levels, missions, quests, or similar gameplay segmentation), it can be rather tempting to write the plot section at this level of granularity. However, it is encouraged to look at the larger picture of the game, condensing what might be large sections of it into single paragraphs if little narrative is developed during these parts. For example, it is not necessary to document every step of the hero's quest to obtain 7 parts of a key, when one can simple say that "the hero visits many locations to collect the parts of the key". Not every character, location, or quest needs to be documented if it does not drive the main story or contribute towards the game's development or reception. Plot sections do not have to strongly adhere to the presentation order, either, if it helps to make the plot more concise. More advice on how to write concise plots for any type of fiction can be found at WP:WAF.. -- MASEM ( t) 15:40, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
There is currently a disagreement between editors at the GTA V talk page as to whether the re-release development section should be included into the Development article or kept as is. Any feedback from editors not involved with the subject would be greatly appreciated. CR4ZE ( t • c) 11:50, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
I have a problem. Lately I've been trying to add scores and links to the multi-platform Reception charts, but bots like 81.153.133.15 and 86.42.171.225 keep making Reception charts too tall for articles like Need for Speed: Underground, Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, and Need for Speed: Underground 2; and they also mark mobile versions of games as "not notable" even though they are and remove them. Can somebody please stop these bots from invading game articles and making Reception charts too tall? -- Angeldeb82 ( talk) 21:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
I was wondering if the years and genre in Guitar Hero Live and Rock Band 4 the soundtrack section violates WP:CRYSTAL or any other Wikipedia guidelines? neither games have been released yet but by a simple google search can get the song year and genre since the songs have already been released. TheDeviantPro ( talk) 23:49, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
Not sure how this got on my watchlist, but, it looks like someone has well and truly chucked their teddy out of the pram and created Lost Saga North America because they were upset at accommodating different language versions; history and talk page are worth a read. When would be a good time to point out that all of the character class cruft needs to be removed? - X201 ( talk) 21:17, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm currently copyediting the article Electronic Sports League and wonder where ESL One fits into that context. Is it correct to call it "a CS:GO tournament series", maybe even "the biggest CS:GO tournament series"? Or do the events have significantly more to offer than CS:GO tournaments? I don't know that much about e-sports but started to edit the article because it's in a terrible shape. In that context I found that the ESL is introducing drug screenings on their events, starting with said ESL One Cologne this month. So I'd like to add this information to the article, but since the ESL One is not mentioned so far and doesn't have an article on it's own I wonder what's the best way to reference/describe it, and if the event series is notable enough to deserve an own article (de-wiki has a whole series of articles, one per event, but I think that's a bit overkill). Rh73 ( talk) 17:56, 15 August 2015 (UTC)
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Deletion sorting. Thanks. — JJMC89 ( T· E· C) 03:49, 16 August 2015 (UTC)