Archive of discussions from December 3, 2006 - December 31, 2006
I archived the talk page, which was 81 KB. I kept FFA. Feel free to re-add any important topics. Alvin6226 talk 02:41, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
I inquired for a SuggestBot list yesterday, and I got it today. I trimmed down this list to only PCP articles:
|
I can already see a couple problems here:
Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 22:49, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
Let's be realistic. Most Pokémon, in-and-of themselves, are not incredibly important within the entire video gaming world and most don't have much priority for being included in Wikipedia 1.0. I'm talking about this. I'm sorry, I just don't see Ekans as a medium-priority article. If anything, it has none. The only Pokémon I could see having the highest priority would of course be Pikachu, who is so popular that it has had its own balloon in the Thanksgiving Day Parade. But most Pokémon, in the grand scheme of all video games, are not of very high priority "within gaming for inclusion in Wikipedia 1.0."
According to this, low-importance articles deal with subject that are "mainly of specialist interest". Inclusion of Pokémon like Ekans don't deal a wealth of knowledgeable information into the world of gaming. I just don't see most individual species being very high on that scale.
And dear God, does our project really cover almost 1,000 articles?? -- Brandon Dilbeck 22:52, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
Why do people waste their time documenting the minutia of some commercial fantasy world? This knowledge may make you better consumers, but won't give you any historic, political, or scientific perspective. Pokemon and other corporate created fiction should only be discussed in the context of their detrimental impact upon human culture and the harm they cause to child development. Serious people need to start treating fandom/fantasyphelia as a mental disorder on par with religious belief. Delirium of disorder 14:03, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for supporting me. I would certainly contest anyone accusing me of vandalism. The past accusations were politically motivated. I'd also like to point out that I don't disagree that Pokemon can have pages on Wikipedia. I don't suggest that these pages be removed. Too many topics cannot be discussed because the pages have been removed and the word has been blocked from having a page about it recreated! This is a major flaw with the current Wikipedia. I just think that much of the effort put into improving CURRENT Pokemon pages is simply a waste of time. Delirium of disorder 04:37, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
We're being WAY too analytical are trying WAY too hard to define and explain every single detail about everything in the Pokemon world as if they were real. Which gets absolutely ridiculous. The fact is, the fictional universe that Pokemon is set in is very much unclear, undefined, or contradictory in many fields. Which is absolutely fine, but we shouldn't try to force all of our real-world reasoning and assumptions onto the fictional Pokemon world.
Is Nidorina a rabbit, or even a mammal? Is Nidorina a reptile? We don't know, and we can hardly imagine the answer, and I'm sure Satoshi did not even have that in mind when he was drawing it. And so, the best way to treat this question is to NOT MENTION IT AT ALL. DON'T speculate if Nidorina is a reptile or mammal or rabbit. DON'T EVEN REMARK that Nidorina is rabbit-like in appearance at all. THAT'S ORIGINAL RESEARCH, AND INSULTS THE INTELLIGENCE OF THE READER. Leave it up to people to determine what Pokemon are.
Is every single animal in the world a Pokemon? Are some pokemon carnivorous? Pokedex entries often mention the dangerous nature of some Pokemon, and talk about their aggresiveness, supersharp teeth, extremely strong bones, etc. However, you never see it mentioned that some Pokemon hunted and killed another Pokemon and ate it. You never see a single Pokemon death. Does this mean that Pokemon never die? Of course not. It's just that the franchise never brings up the issue. SO DON'T TAKE IT UPON YOURSELF TO BRING UP THINGS THAT THE FRANCHISE NEVER DOES, BECAUSE THERE WILL BE NOTHING VERIFYABLE TO SAY!!! Don't theorize on Pokemon breeding or feeding habits unless it's (practically) a direct quote from the show or a Pokedex entry. Don't bring up scientific terms to describe a world that doesn't work scientificially the way ours does. And only use the etymologies that are painfully obvious, cuz some of the ones out there are such long stretches, it's ridiculous
huggles,
Blueaster
03:28, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I'm not a fan of a mega-merge at all. Toastypk 03:43, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
woa.... i wasn't asking for a merge, i was just saying that stuff that doesn't belong on WP ends up clogging alot of the articles... although... merging Pokemon would make for a good and consise solution, if we can figure out how... Blueaster 00:22, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Check this out: someone added one of our previous Pokemon objectives to the Really Stupid Article Ideas list. Now check Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Perappu out. Over half a year ago, an irate user tried deleting Tamanta, Perap, and Buoysel on the basis that it's extreme fancruft. Here is a section of one comment of choice:
With this in mind, I think the best way we can figure out how to merge is think back to how the Pokemon articles would and should have been created back when Wikipedia was young. If this is a general encyclopedia while the various Wikis out there are much more in-depth and specific, what probably would have been made on Wikipedia were all the list of Pokemon pages I had been preaching in recent weeks, and separate articles on the most notable articles - Bulbasaur, Charizard, Pikachu, Mewtwo, et al - would have been linked as main article links in the sections on those Pokemon. Then Bulbapedia would have had one page per Pokemon and town and not Wikipedia. Sigh, it seems that the main thing preventing any merge from happening is that there are lots and lots of users who would rather keep the things the way they are. Erik Jensen ( Appreciate| Donate) 23:32, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I think the gym leader;s article could use a image of all the badges to date, but I'm not sure where to get such a thing. Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 05:37, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
What is the reason for having this template? See Template talk:Pokenum#Necessary?. — Centrx→ talk • 21:40, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Lately, I've been seeing a couple comments that we're carving a niche too much and that Bulbapedia could better use our prose. Are we getting too niche for the general purpose of WP? Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 01:15, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
I was going through the main Pokémon article and found this page: List of Pokémon references or spoofs. As it stands now, it's a terribly put together cultural references list that seems to be simply a list for the sake of a list. We need to try and nuke whatever we can from this, and make it somewhat presentable.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍) 10:33, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Category:Pokémon article cleanup currently has forty-nine pages. We may want to focus on the following:
This is TTV| talk| contribs| email ( 18:06, 10 December 2006 (UTC)), reporting for WP:PCP.
I’ve spent the last 10 hours or so updating the orphaned, miscategorized List of Pokémon Adventures chapters. All the English chapter names from VIZ volumes 1-7 and Chuang Yi Volumes 8-15 are now present. -- WikidSmaht ( talk) 18:16, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
Amarkov has put up Whismur up for AFD. I know this is already listed on the main project page, but it may need a better focus here.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍) 18:22, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
I brought up the subject of making the TCG its own sub-project a short while ago, but I abandoned it due to having too little support and having too much college work to dedicate any real time to it.
Anyway, I am on christmas vacation now, so I can put some real time into making the TCG-related articles better (and boy do they need it). Please let me know any concerns you have.
Spinach Dip 01:37, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to help, but I'm unsure where I should start, can anyone point me in the right direction?-- Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 02:43, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, there. I've been meaning to join this project for the longest time now, and finally decided to. One major reason I joined was to try and help improve the articles of my favorite Pokemon, noteably Snorunt and Kecleon. To improve these articles, I'll need a few pictures that are hard for me to come about.
If anyone can help, it would be greatly appruciated.
Jeri-kun
02:13, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
How do you know ethmology of each pokémon's name? In Japanese Wikipedia, they are making issues of that now. Do you have any references?-- Ræv 04:31, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
<--- But it is ignoring the rules. -- The Hybrid wishes you a Merry Christmas 07:05, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
I would recommend an adoption agency be placed as a sub-page to this project so that, if members want a Pokémon article assigned to them, they don't have to post on the talk page. Does that sound like a good idea? Joiz A. Shmo 21:54, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
If so, the Mudkip article really needs that section expanded. (In fact, most articles probably do, but...) Any help would be appreaciated.-- Ac1983fan 00:25, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
We've progressed, too! And yes, most of us know about Torchic being a Front Page for a while now ( image to remind us of this) - which showed just now. We should all congratulate ourselves (whether article contributors or background workers) for getting this far! Isn't this our second article to make it to the front page? Cheers. - T e tsuya-san ( talk : contribs) 01:29, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
FYI, although I am not a member of PCP, I have nominated Charizard as a FAC. It definately qualifies as one. Please feel free to leave comments.
Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Charizard Andros 1337 21:15, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
I will shortly be creating a merge proposal to merge the articles Pokémon Red and Blue and Pokémon Green and am alerting the Pokémon Collaborative Project of this. I suggest this merge for the following reasons:
Please discuss this merge on the
Talk:Pokémon Red and Blue
--
Mouse Nightshirt
16:59, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
This discussion kinda just didn't happen. Does anyone have a good reason why it is necessary to include the number of Pokemon in each and every article? - Amarkov blah edits 04:40, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
The number of the pokemon is something ingrained with the pokemon themselves, every region has it's own numbering system, for example. It's jusst how it is. Unlike digimon, where a new mon was introduced every show, almost, pokemon are mostly based on the idea of collecting, for example, in some games, you collect gems or something, repersented like : 100/500. It all has to do with the pokedex, which is where the numbers came from. In pokemon Handbooks, the pokemon are in pokedex order, not alphabetical, or what have you.
So why in every pokemon article? because, it is, for lack of better terms, the way it is in the pokemon universe.-- Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 03:18, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:59, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
is in need of repair... and a section on the pokeball trainer cards in the card game. Blueaster 07:05, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
Archive of discussions from December 3, 2006 - December 31, 2006
I archived the talk page, which was 81 KB. I kept FFA. Feel free to re-add any important topics. Alvin6226 talk 02:41, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
I inquired for a SuggestBot list yesterday, and I got it today. I trimmed down this list to only PCP articles:
|
I can already see a couple problems here:
Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 22:49, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
Let's be realistic. Most Pokémon, in-and-of themselves, are not incredibly important within the entire video gaming world and most don't have much priority for being included in Wikipedia 1.0. I'm talking about this. I'm sorry, I just don't see Ekans as a medium-priority article. If anything, it has none. The only Pokémon I could see having the highest priority would of course be Pikachu, who is so popular that it has had its own balloon in the Thanksgiving Day Parade. But most Pokémon, in the grand scheme of all video games, are not of very high priority "within gaming for inclusion in Wikipedia 1.0."
According to this, low-importance articles deal with subject that are "mainly of specialist interest". Inclusion of Pokémon like Ekans don't deal a wealth of knowledgeable information into the world of gaming. I just don't see most individual species being very high on that scale.
And dear God, does our project really cover almost 1,000 articles?? -- Brandon Dilbeck 22:52, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
Why do people waste their time documenting the minutia of some commercial fantasy world? This knowledge may make you better consumers, but won't give you any historic, political, or scientific perspective. Pokemon and other corporate created fiction should only be discussed in the context of their detrimental impact upon human culture and the harm they cause to child development. Serious people need to start treating fandom/fantasyphelia as a mental disorder on par with religious belief. Delirium of disorder 14:03, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for supporting me. I would certainly contest anyone accusing me of vandalism. The past accusations were politically motivated. I'd also like to point out that I don't disagree that Pokemon can have pages on Wikipedia. I don't suggest that these pages be removed. Too many topics cannot be discussed because the pages have been removed and the word has been blocked from having a page about it recreated! This is a major flaw with the current Wikipedia. I just think that much of the effort put into improving CURRENT Pokemon pages is simply a waste of time. Delirium of disorder 04:37, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
We're being WAY too analytical are trying WAY too hard to define and explain every single detail about everything in the Pokemon world as if they were real. Which gets absolutely ridiculous. The fact is, the fictional universe that Pokemon is set in is very much unclear, undefined, or contradictory in many fields. Which is absolutely fine, but we shouldn't try to force all of our real-world reasoning and assumptions onto the fictional Pokemon world.
Is Nidorina a rabbit, or even a mammal? Is Nidorina a reptile? We don't know, and we can hardly imagine the answer, and I'm sure Satoshi did not even have that in mind when he was drawing it. And so, the best way to treat this question is to NOT MENTION IT AT ALL. DON'T speculate if Nidorina is a reptile or mammal or rabbit. DON'T EVEN REMARK that Nidorina is rabbit-like in appearance at all. THAT'S ORIGINAL RESEARCH, AND INSULTS THE INTELLIGENCE OF THE READER. Leave it up to people to determine what Pokemon are.
Is every single animal in the world a Pokemon? Are some pokemon carnivorous? Pokedex entries often mention the dangerous nature of some Pokemon, and talk about their aggresiveness, supersharp teeth, extremely strong bones, etc. However, you never see it mentioned that some Pokemon hunted and killed another Pokemon and ate it. You never see a single Pokemon death. Does this mean that Pokemon never die? Of course not. It's just that the franchise never brings up the issue. SO DON'T TAKE IT UPON YOURSELF TO BRING UP THINGS THAT THE FRANCHISE NEVER DOES, BECAUSE THERE WILL BE NOTHING VERIFYABLE TO SAY!!! Don't theorize on Pokemon breeding or feeding habits unless it's (practically) a direct quote from the show or a Pokedex entry. Don't bring up scientific terms to describe a world that doesn't work scientificially the way ours does. And only use the etymologies that are painfully obvious, cuz some of the ones out there are such long stretches, it's ridiculous
huggles,
Blueaster
03:28, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I'm not a fan of a mega-merge at all. Toastypk 03:43, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
woa.... i wasn't asking for a merge, i was just saying that stuff that doesn't belong on WP ends up clogging alot of the articles... although... merging Pokemon would make for a good and consise solution, if we can figure out how... Blueaster 00:22, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Check this out: someone added one of our previous Pokemon objectives to the Really Stupid Article Ideas list. Now check Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Perappu out. Over half a year ago, an irate user tried deleting Tamanta, Perap, and Buoysel on the basis that it's extreme fancruft. Here is a section of one comment of choice:
With this in mind, I think the best way we can figure out how to merge is think back to how the Pokemon articles would and should have been created back when Wikipedia was young. If this is a general encyclopedia while the various Wikis out there are much more in-depth and specific, what probably would have been made on Wikipedia were all the list of Pokemon pages I had been preaching in recent weeks, and separate articles on the most notable articles - Bulbasaur, Charizard, Pikachu, Mewtwo, et al - would have been linked as main article links in the sections on those Pokemon. Then Bulbapedia would have had one page per Pokemon and town and not Wikipedia. Sigh, it seems that the main thing preventing any merge from happening is that there are lots and lots of users who would rather keep the things the way they are. Erik Jensen ( Appreciate| Donate) 23:32, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I think the gym leader;s article could use a image of all the badges to date, but I'm not sure where to get such a thing. Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 05:37, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
What is the reason for having this template? See Template talk:Pokenum#Necessary?. — Centrx→ talk • 21:40, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Lately, I've been seeing a couple comments that we're carving a niche too much and that Bulbapedia could better use our prose. Are we getting too niche for the general purpose of WP? Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 01:15, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
I was going through the main Pokémon article and found this page: List of Pokémon references or spoofs. As it stands now, it's a terribly put together cultural references list that seems to be simply a list for the sake of a list. We need to try and nuke whatever we can from this, and make it somewhat presentable.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍) 10:33, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Category:Pokémon article cleanup currently has forty-nine pages. We may want to focus on the following:
This is TTV| talk| contribs| email ( 18:06, 10 December 2006 (UTC)), reporting for WP:PCP.
I’ve spent the last 10 hours or so updating the orphaned, miscategorized List of Pokémon Adventures chapters. All the English chapter names from VIZ volumes 1-7 and Chuang Yi Volumes 8-15 are now present. -- WikidSmaht ( talk) 18:16, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
Amarkov has put up Whismur up for AFD. I know this is already listed on the main project page, but it may need a better focus here.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍) 18:22, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
I brought up the subject of making the TCG its own sub-project a short while ago, but I abandoned it due to having too little support and having too much college work to dedicate any real time to it.
Anyway, I am on christmas vacation now, so I can put some real time into making the TCG-related articles better (and boy do they need it). Please let me know any concerns you have.
Spinach Dip 01:37, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to help, but I'm unsure where I should start, can anyone point me in the right direction?-- Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 02:43, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, there. I've been meaning to join this project for the longest time now, and finally decided to. One major reason I joined was to try and help improve the articles of my favorite Pokemon, noteably Snorunt and Kecleon. To improve these articles, I'll need a few pictures that are hard for me to come about.
If anyone can help, it would be greatly appruciated.
Jeri-kun
02:13, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
How do you know ethmology of each pokémon's name? In Japanese Wikipedia, they are making issues of that now. Do you have any references?-- Ræv 04:31, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
<--- But it is ignoring the rules. -- The Hybrid wishes you a Merry Christmas 07:05, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
I would recommend an adoption agency be placed as a sub-page to this project so that, if members want a Pokémon article assigned to them, they don't have to post on the talk page. Does that sound like a good idea? Joiz A. Shmo 21:54, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
If so, the Mudkip article really needs that section expanded. (In fact, most articles probably do, but...) Any help would be appreaciated.-- Ac1983fan 00:25, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
We've progressed, too! And yes, most of us know about Torchic being a Front Page for a while now ( image to remind us of this) - which showed just now. We should all congratulate ourselves (whether article contributors or background workers) for getting this far! Isn't this our second article to make it to the front page? Cheers. - T e tsuya-san ( talk : contribs) 01:29, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
FYI, although I am not a member of PCP, I have nominated Charizard as a FAC. It definately qualifies as one. Please feel free to leave comments.
Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Charizard Andros 1337 21:15, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
I will shortly be creating a merge proposal to merge the articles Pokémon Red and Blue and Pokémon Green and am alerting the Pokémon Collaborative Project of this. I suggest this merge for the following reasons:
Please discuss this merge on the
Talk:Pokémon Red and Blue
--
Mouse Nightshirt
16:59, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
This discussion kinda just didn't happen. Does anyone have a good reason why it is necessary to include the number of Pokemon in each and every article? - Amarkov blah edits 04:40, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
The number of the pokemon is something ingrained with the pokemon themselves, every region has it's own numbering system, for example. It's jusst how it is. Unlike digimon, where a new mon was introduced every show, almost, pokemon are mostly based on the idea of collecting, for example, in some games, you collect gems or something, repersented like : 100/500. It all has to do with the pokedex, which is where the numbers came from. In pokemon Handbooks, the pokemon are in pokedex order, not alphabetical, or what have you.
So why in every pokemon article? because, it is, for lack of better terms, the way it is in the pokemon universe.-- Honeymane Heghlu meH QaQ jajvam 03:18, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:59, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
is in need of repair... and a section on the pokeball trainer cards in the card game. Blueaster 07:05, 30 December 2006 (UTC)