This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 90 | ← | Archive 92 | Archive 93 | Archive 94 | Archive 95 | Archive 96 | → | Archive 100 |
I've now knocked up the first couple of years'-worth of ON's productions in the same format as the Wexford list (see above). This is at User:GuillaumeTell/Pebblebox. I'm mildly dissatisfied with the result, so have posed some questions at User_talk:GuillaumeTell/Pebblebox. Comments welcome here or there; below I've reproduced the comments that Voceditenore and Almost-instinct made when I was starting to think about what to do about Opera North:
-- Guillaume Tell 19:02, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Update: after fruitful back-and-forth with almost- instinct on the Pebblebox's Talk page I've arrived at a table in which all columns sort satisfactorily. 3 seasons done, 7 more to do before I tidy it up, add refs and whatnot and unleash it on an expectant world ... and then start on the remaining decades. -- Guillaume Tell 17:18, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
By way of information, this has now been promoted to FA. L'Orfeo in the autumn, unless someone else does it first. Brianboulton ( talk) 18:02, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
Anton Rubinstein - all there is at the moment is an extrmely basic article on The Demon and nothing on his other operatic works (save a stub on Christus which he called an 'sacred opera' but is actually an oratorio). -- Smerus ( talk) 10:30, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
I'm doing some major cleanup work to finally push this image to Featured Picture. It's going to take a while, but Featured Pictures go on Wikipedia's main page, and that means links to Giuseppe Verdi and Falstaff (opera). If we can push a little to bring these up to a high standard, it'd look good for the project when they are linked. Shoemaker's Holiday talk 19:32, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
Following the suggestion by Smerus, I have made Anton Rubinstein one of the CoMs. As his red-linked operas may be obscure/hard to reference, I've added three more composers, born at around the same time (and from three different countries) to attract a wider particpation. See [1]
In the absence of any other proposals, I've used the suggestion by Shoemaker's Holiday to improve Verdi's Falstaff. See [2]
– Voceditenore ( talk) 16:47, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
This article about the resident set-designer for Commonwealth Opera in Northampton, Massachusetts is being discussed for deletion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Julia Noulin-Merat. – Voceditenore ( talk)
This interesting new article just popped up. Its unreferenced but certainly has a lot of potential. 4meter4 ( talk) 06:42, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
I just wrote a lead for the article based on its content. Please feel free to make any changes. I also went through the article and checked all of the links. Several of the wikified composers and operas didn't go the right people/works. Everything should be ok now. 4meter4 ( talk) 19:26, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Do we have a facility for noting operas in course of progress (e.g. this one)? If not, would it be useful to have one? -- Smerus ( talk) 14:15, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
Any more on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Composers/Infoboxes RfC? It closes up in a few days. Cheers -- Jubilee♫ clipman 15:19, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
From Donald Smith (tenor):
This has been fact-tagged. Can anyone verify it, or provide a counter-example? -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 08:30, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
I figured that, with opera in Italy being such a family affair for several centuries, surely the original assertion couldn't be correct. Sure enough, here's a counter-example:
Donizetti's idea for his opera buffa masterpiece Don Pasquale, based on Anelli's libretto to Stefano Pavesi's Ser Marc'Antonio, was encouraged by Lablache, who had sung this opera before in Palermo for the Gala opening of the Teatro San Ferdinando. Don Pasquale opened at the Theatre des Italien in Paris on January 3rd 1843, and immediately became a success. The title role was played to perfection by Luigi Lablache. The other members of the cast (known as the I Puritani Quartet) were: Giulia Grisi - Norina, Antonio Tamburini as Dr. Malatesta and Mario- Ernesto. Frederick Lablache, Luigi's oldest son sang the small role of the Notario. ( http://www.crabbet.com/clablache/artcle_pg2.html)
I can't confirm, but another candidate would be Placido Domingo, who started off in his parents' zarzuela company. If his father sang in the company, surely the two would have appeared together on stage at some point. Drhoehl ( talk) 19:48, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Your input would be appreciated. Viva-Verdi ( talk) 17:58, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
The rules for capitalisation are not the same for French as for Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese. Everytime I see incorrect capitalisation of a French title on English Wikipedia, especially for opera, and see the ridiculous reverts editors make, I react just like Kleinzach (to a similar topic, but not this one) in his post below:
« What exactly are you trying to say? That all titles of operas should be 'anglicized' according to subjective (local?) notions of 'usual' practice in anglophone countries? Is that it? (...) What is the point you are trying to make here? Do you object to foreign language style rules being used on WP? Sorry to point this out - especially if you are not a native speaker - but it's difficult to make out what you are trying to say. How about trying again? --Kleinzach (talk) 14:39, 3 May 2008 (UTC) »
For the enlightenment of editors so disposed, here is the exact text about capitalisation from Lexique des règles typographiques en usage à l'Imprimerie nationale (sixième édition, novembre 2006), ISBN 2-7433-0482-0 issued by the national government of France, approved for use by the Académie française : (NB : the bold emphasis on text is my own.)
Titres d'oeuvres et de journaux : On mettra une majuscule non seulement à l'article initial mais aussi :
— dans un titre contenant une comparaison ou une symétrie, à chaque terme en opposition ou en parallèle si l'un d'eux exige la majuscule :
— dans les autres, au premier substanif (ainsi qu'aux adjectifs et adverbes qui peuvent le précéder) :
Titres doubles : Si le titre comprend un autre titre ou une variante, les règles précédentes s'appliqueuent aux deux titres séparément (avec la réserve déjà signalée concernant l'article initial du second titre) :
These simple rules are not difficult to follow! The rules for titles in Spanish and Portuguese, which seem to be applied here for all so-called Latin languages, are not correct for French. Separate rules for German language titles already exist! I do not need to repeat what Kleinzach wrote, again. Simply the rules for this WikiProject must be changed because they are wrong. -- If an author or editor is in doubt what the correct capitalisation should be, simply look at the capitalisation used on French Wikipédia, or contact a native French speaker. Bien amicalement, Charvex ( talk) 08:33, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
I don't want to be boring about this (or maybe I do), but why then do we have ' La bohème' (Puccini and Leoncavallo's as well) when Grove has 'La Bohème'? (cf. ' La Juive' which we have, properly as I understand, capitalised).-- Smerus ( talk) 10:47, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
Our list of unreferenced BLPs is down to 19. I've now been going through these and weeding out some:
Note that newly-created unreferenced BLPs are being tagged by many editors with {{ Prod blp}} (If no sources are provided in 10 days, the article is deleted. There's more about it here.) Some of these may well slip under our radar if they haven't already been bannered with {{ WikiProject Opera}}. So it's good to check User:AlexNewArtBot/OperaSearchResult every couple of days, and banner any appropriate new articles. Voceditenore ( talk) 16:20, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
I've nominated this for deletion. The discussion is here. All input appreciated. Voceditenore ( talk) 08:37, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
Proposal: The composers for the month of June are from Ireland, England and America and have all had their operas performed at Wexford Festival Opera. We need articles on:
Comments? Other suggestions? (Note CoM is for the creation of new articles) Voceditenore ( talk) 06:53, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
Proposal: The Operas of the Month for June are three works by Vincenzo Bellini:
Comments? Other suggestions? (Note OoM is for the improvement of existing articles) Voceditenore ( talk) 07:27, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
I would appriciate your opinions at this conversation: Talk:Vocal range#Singers possessing a wide vocal range. 4meter4 ( talk) 19:25, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
I have never written an opera bio article before my current effort at Jonita Lattimore. I usually do athlete or politician bios. For athletes and politicians you can do a fairly comprehensive biography by surveying newspapers. However, opera singers perform internationally and I feel remiss that I can not properly sequence international performances. Is there any sort of source like www.ibdb.com for opera performers that could help me determine when her international performances occurred.-- TonyTheTiger ( T/ C/ BIO/ WP:CHICAGO/ WP:FOUR) 21:47, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
The discussion is at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/OperaUpClose. — Voceditenore ( talk) 15:27, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
After several years, the La Scala archives are back online. These are extensive, often include production photographs, and are useful for referencing articles on singers and adding to performance histories for articles on individual operas. Registration (free) is required to search and accesss them. At the moment the site is only in Italian. If you need help navigating, leave a message here. Also, a reminder that there is guide to other online resources for opera articles at WikiProject Opera/Online research. Best, Voceditenore ( talk) 22:07, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
This article is currently being discussed at WP:Articles for deletion/Nadia Petrella. Voceditenore ( talk) 11:45, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 90 | ← | Archive 92 | Archive 93 | Archive 94 | Archive 95 | Archive 96 | → | Archive 100 |
I've now knocked up the first couple of years'-worth of ON's productions in the same format as the Wexford list (see above). This is at User:GuillaumeTell/Pebblebox. I'm mildly dissatisfied with the result, so have posed some questions at User_talk:GuillaumeTell/Pebblebox. Comments welcome here or there; below I've reproduced the comments that Voceditenore and Almost-instinct made when I was starting to think about what to do about Opera North:
-- Guillaume Tell 19:02, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Update: after fruitful back-and-forth with almost- instinct on the Pebblebox's Talk page I've arrived at a table in which all columns sort satisfactorily. 3 seasons done, 7 more to do before I tidy it up, add refs and whatnot and unleash it on an expectant world ... and then start on the remaining decades. -- Guillaume Tell 17:18, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
By way of information, this has now been promoted to FA. L'Orfeo in the autumn, unless someone else does it first. Brianboulton ( talk) 18:02, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
Anton Rubinstein - all there is at the moment is an extrmely basic article on The Demon and nothing on his other operatic works (save a stub on Christus which he called an 'sacred opera' but is actually an oratorio). -- Smerus ( talk) 10:30, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
I'm doing some major cleanup work to finally push this image to Featured Picture. It's going to take a while, but Featured Pictures go on Wikipedia's main page, and that means links to Giuseppe Verdi and Falstaff (opera). If we can push a little to bring these up to a high standard, it'd look good for the project when they are linked. Shoemaker's Holiday talk 19:32, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
Following the suggestion by Smerus, I have made Anton Rubinstein one of the CoMs. As his red-linked operas may be obscure/hard to reference, I've added three more composers, born at around the same time (and from three different countries) to attract a wider particpation. See [1]
In the absence of any other proposals, I've used the suggestion by Shoemaker's Holiday to improve Verdi's Falstaff. See [2]
– Voceditenore ( talk) 16:47, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
This article about the resident set-designer for Commonwealth Opera in Northampton, Massachusetts is being discussed for deletion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Julia Noulin-Merat. – Voceditenore ( talk)
This interesting new article just popped up. Its unreferenced but certainly has a lot of potential. 4meter4 ( talk) 06:42, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
I just wrote a lead for the article based on its content. Please feel free to make any changes. I also went through the article and checked all of the links. Several of the wikified composers and operas didn't go the right people/works. Everything should be ok now. 4meter4 ( talk) 19:26, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Do we have a facility for noting operas in course of progress (e.g. this one)? If not, would it be useful to have one? -- Smerus ( talk) 14:15, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
Any more on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Composers/Infoboxes RfC? It closes up in a few days. Cheers -- Jubilee♫ clipman 15:19, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
From Donald Smith (tenor):
This has been fact-tagged. Can anyone verify it, or provide a counter-example? -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 08:30, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
I figured that, with opera in Italy being such a family affair for several centuries, surely the original assertion couldn't be correct. Sure enough, here's a counter-example:
Donizetti's idea for his opera buffa masterpiece Don Pasquale, based on Anelli's libretto to Stefano Pavesi's Ser Marc'Antonio, was encouraged by Lablache, who had sung this opera before in Palermo for the Gala opening of the Teatro San Ferdinando. Don Pasquale opened at the Theatre des Italien in Paris on January 3rd 1843, and immediately became a success. The title role was played to perfection by Luigi Lablache. The other members of the cast (known as the I Puritani Quartet) were: Giulia Grisi - Norina, Antonio Tamburini as Dr. Malatesta and Mario- Ernesto. Frederick Lablache, Luigi's oldest son sang the small role of the Notario. ( http://www.crabbet.com/clablache/artcle_pg2.html)
I can't confirm, but another candidate would be Placido Domingo, who started off in his parents' zarzuela company. If his father sang in the company, surely the two would have appeared together on stage at some point. Drhoehl ( talk) 19:48, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Your input would be appreciated. Viva-Verdi ( talk) 17:58, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
The rules for capitalisation are not the same for French as for Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese. Everytime I see incorrect capitalisation of a French title on English Wikipedia, especially for opera, and see the ridiculous reverts editors make, I react just like Kleinzach (to a similar topic, but not this one) in his post below:
« What exactly are you trying to say? That all titles of operas should be 'anglicized' according to subjective (local?) notions of 'usual' practice in anglophone countries? Is that it? (...) What is the point you are trying to make here? Do you object to foreign language style rules being used on WP? Sorry to point this out - especially if you are not a native speaker - but it's difficult to make out what you are trying to say. How about trying again? --Kleinzach (talk) 14:39, 3 May 2008 (UTC) »
For the enlightenment of editors so disposed, here is the exact text about capitalisation from Lexique des règles typographiques en usage à l'Imprimerie nationale (sixième édition, novembre 2006), ISBN 2-7433-0482-0 issued by the national government of France, approved for use by the Académie française : (NB : the bold emphasis on text is my own.)
Titres d'oeuvres et de journaux : On mettra une majuscule non seulement à l'article initial mais aussi :
— dans un titre contenant une comparaison ou une symétrie, à chaque terme en opposition ou en parallèle si l'un d'eux exige la majuscule :
— dans les autres, au premier substanif (ainsi qu'aux adjectifs et adverbes qui peuvent le précéder) :
Titres doubles : Si le titre comprend un autre titre ou une variante, les règles précédentes s'appliqueuent aux deux titres séparément (avec la réserve déjà signalée concernant l'article initial du second titre) :
These simple rules are not difficult to follow! The rules for titles in Spanish and Portuguese, which seem to be applied here for all so-called Latin languages, are not correct for French. Separate rules for German language titles already exist! I do not need to repeat what Kleinzach wrote, again. Simply the rules for this WikiProject must be changed because they are wrong. -- If an author or editor is in doubt what the correct capitalisation should be, simply look at the capitalisation used on French Wikipédia, or contact a native French speaker. Bien amicalement, Charvex ( talk) 08:33, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
I don't want to be boring about this (or maybe I do), but why then do we have ' La bohème' (Puccini and Leoncavallo's as well) when Grove has 'La Bohème'? (cf. ' La Juive' which we have, properly as I understand, capitalised).-- Smerus ( talk) 10:47, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
Our list of unreferenced BLPs is down to 19. I've now been going through these and weeding out some:
Note that newly-created unreferenced BLPs are being tagged by many editors with {{ Prod blp}} (If no sources are provided in 10 days, the article is deleted. There's more about it here.) Some of these may well slip under our radar if they haven't already been bannered with {{ WikiProject Opera}}. So it's good to check User:AlexNewArtBot/OperaSearchResult every couple of days, and banner any appropriate new articles. Voceditenore ( talk) 16:20, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
I've nominated this for deletion. The discussion is here. All input appreciated. Voceditenore ( talk) 08:37, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
Proposal: The composers for the month of June are from Ireland, England and America and have all had their operas performed at Wexford Festival Opera. We need articles on:
Comments? Other suggestions? (Note CoM is for the creation of new articles) Voceditenore ( talk) 06:53, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
Proposal: The Operas of the Month for June are three works by Vincenzo Bellini:
Comments? Other suggestions? (Note OoM is for the improvement of existing articles) Voceditenore ( talk) 07:27, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
I would appriciate your opinions at this conversation: Talk:Vocal range#Singers possessing a wide vocal range. 4meter4 ( talk) 19:25, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
I have never written an opera bio article before my current effort at Jonita Lattimore. I usually do athlete or politician bios. For athletes and politicians you can do a fairly comprehensive biography by surveying newspapers. However, opera singers perform internationally and I feel remiss that I can not properly sequence international performances. Is there any sort of source like www.ibdb.com for opera performers that could help me determine when her international performances occurred.-- TonyTheTiger ( T/ C/ BIO/ WP:CHICAGO/ WP:FOUR) 21:47, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
The discussion is at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/OperaUpClose. — Voceditenore ( talk) 15:27, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
After several years, the La Scala archives are back online. These are extensive, often include production photographs, and are useful for referencing articles on singers and adding to performance histories for articles on individual operas. Registration (free) is required to search and accesss them. At the moment the site is only in Italian. If you need help navigating, leave a message here. Also, a reminder that there is guide to other online resources for opera articles at WikiProject Opera/Online research. Best, Voceditenore ( talk) 22:07, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
This article is currently being discussed at WP:Articles for deletion/Nadia Petrella. Voceditenore ( talk) 11:45, 9 June 2010 (UTC)