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The list of fully pro leagues says it is, but the source appears to be someone's essay on a publish-your-own-writing website that doesn't even say definitively that either of the top two divisions is fully-professional in the Wikipedia meaning of the phrase. cheers, Struway2 ( talk) 15:52, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
Wow. We're questioning the likelihood of a player in the Dutch second tier being notable. If this hadn't obviously been made in good faith (which of course it has been: no question there) I'd regard this as a breaching experiment. NFOOTBALL's focus on "fully professional" is an absurdity. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 20:14, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
To clarify, what we were questioning was not the likelihood of a player in the Dutch second tier being notable, but the quality of the referencing at WP:FPL. Struway2 ( talk) 08:28, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
The discussion above, promted me to take a look at the sourcing at WP:FPL and I have to say it's a pretty sorry state of affairs. The following is a list of all the leagues currently on the list that are sourced only with dead links. Please note that this is NOT intended as a comment on the notability of footballers playing in those leages:
In addition, Torneo Argentino A is currently listed with no source whatsoever. The source for Ligue 1 and Ligue 2 claimed to be down for temporary maitenance. I will check it again later. You're help in finding more sources is much appreciated. Sir Sputnik ( talk) 20:47, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Apart from the usual vague inclusion criteria ("those that are well known within the non-League (sic)"), what a truly bizarre way to format such a section....... -- ChrisTheDude ( talk) 22:33, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Just checking, is there an article yet on the Al-Ahli/Al-Masry riot yet? Hack ( talk) 06:39, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
What is the difference, precisely, between a local derby and a regular football rivalry, and is the term 'local derby' used in sports other than association football? Various comments at Talk:Local derby suggest that the two terms have distinct meanings but there is no agreement on a single definition. I had always thought of a 'local derby' as a rivalry between local teams that regularly play one another, but that definition would exclude many items listed in the article, such as the France–Italy football rivalry and probably even El Clásico.
The article provides a definition in the lead but it is ambiguous, containing qualifiers such as "in many countries", "generally local", "particularly in association football". It has other issues, too: two unsourced sections about the origin and usage of the phrase; an unsourced 'International' section which raises the question of just how 'local' a local derby is required to be; and, finally, a long and mostly unsourced list of derbies and rivalries. -- Black Falcon ( talk) 23:03, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
User:Barocci have moved the article FC Zenit Saint Petersburg to FC Zenit, even though the result of the previous requested move discussion, started by him, was no consensus for move. User:Ilikeeatingwaffles have started a requested move discussion, to move it back, but I feel that the right thing to do is to move the article back to FC Zenit Saint Petersburg right away (as per the previous discussion), and then if wanted start a requested move discussion to move it to FC Zenit. I tried to move the page back myself, but there was an unknown obsticle there. Could a administrator look into this matter? Thank you, Mentoz86 ( talk) 08:18, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
I believe the move was strictly in line with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (sports) guideline. There were no further comments however since that guideline came to light. Do you guys mind commenting in the discussion with the regard for the guideline? Barocci ( talk) 22:51, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
There is a user constantly changing the flag for Ali El-Khatib to that of Israel, even though he represents Palestine internationally and Tvrtko Kale to Israel even though he has never formally represented Israel after acquiring citizenship. I have asked the user to stop but they continue to revert the edits. - NYC2TLV ( talk) 00:17, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Does anyone know if Walter Puddefoot is related to Len Puddefoot and Syd Puddefoot? Unusual surname, all active in the 20s... Giant Snowman 00:35, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Most clubs seem to have a 'List of X F.C. players' now, which is only a good thing, but I think we need some agreement about layout/format so that they are the same across the board. Here are my concerns:
Disagree - I think info on the position a player has is essential for this sort of list - it adds clarity in some cases towards the stats. EG - Alan Hodgkinson played 600+ times for Sheffield United but never scored a goal - why? Because he was a goalkeeper. Positions are used across pretty much every football article from player articles to seasons to lists to squads etc. Are we moving to remove all of them? Also the disparity between the two stats formats is odd I agree - but only Wikipedia articles seem to differentiate between league and other competitive matches which I have never understood. A player could (in theory) make only three league appearances but play in 100+ cup games for his club, including scoring a hat trick in the Champions League final (unlikely but possible) but on the 'league only' criteria he wouldn't be included in these 'list of notable players from club x articles' Bladeboy1889 ( talk) 17:39, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Some of the above comments seem to imply that such list should only include league appearances. If so, how come so many Featured Lists cover all matches; e.g.
Regarding the ability to source data for certain teams / players - surely just because something may be difficult in some cases that is not a reason for not doing it at all? Bladeboy1889 ( talk) 09:24, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
I was inspired by this discussion to put together a List of Tranmere Rovers F.C. players. I stuck it in for peer review if anyone wants to comment. Ta. U+003F ? 00:27, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
I feel that the Major League Soccer should become a higher priority for this (High Importance). It's growing in popularity and the article for the league is sub-par as is the ones for its clubs. The article is ranked start-class and I feel that that is because it's ranked as importantly as it should be. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cr7ftw3665 ( talk • contribs) 02:51, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
This article appears to be in a bit of a mess. Coly was down as having played five games for Leyton Orient, which is untrue, and I've removed it. I can't find any reference to this guy ever being at Orient at all. Maybe Leyton F.C.? Or maybe neither. Was he ever at Palace? I sense notability problems too, as none of the clubs he has apparently played for competes in a professional league. Bretonbanquet ( talk) 22:46, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
I nominated Malmö FF in Europe for FLC (see here) on 23 December last year and it is still at FLC awaiting further input. I presume that the FL directors want further opinions before promoting or archiving it, it has currently two editors supporting it and none opposing it. I would be truly grateful if anyone wants to express their opinions to reach a consensus. Thanks! -- Reckless182 ( talk) 17:42, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
hi everybody, I have a situation here in AFC Futsal Club Championship page. One user is very persistent to add an unofficial tournament in the main table. in 2006 one trial tournament held link. I say an small explanation about this tournament somewhere in the page is enough, and this trial edition must not added to the main table. based on this link 2010 tournament was the first edition recognized by AFC. can anyone here help me and talk to this user, since he has personal problem with me and does opposite of what I say. I already reverted it 3 times and can't do it again tonight. Thanks in advance. Mohsen1248 ( talk) 22:40, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello, I just want to know that if a player who does not have a wikipedia article yet plays in the Aaha Gold Cup would they then be considered notable being as they played in this tournament. -- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 00:10, 6 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi. A problem that seemed to have been sorted following a previous discussion has reared its ugly head again. It's basically an argument between Real Madrid and Barca fans about who should be described as Spain's "most successful" club. There is a ridiculous argument going on at Talk:Real Madrid C.F. right now. In my opinion, the articles should just list how many of each trophy the clubs have won, and to note whether that is a record (e.g. Real Madrid's 9 European Cup wins). It's plain and NPOV. Sadly, no-one is listening, and I was hoping that experienced WP:FOOTY editors could try and help out. Thanks. Ilikeeatingwaffles ( talk) 11:59, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
What is the guideline for the infobox for a national league if there are members of that league from outside the country of which the league is the national league?
Currently we have:
It seems, then, that League of Ireland is out of step. Presumably it should mention Northern Ireland in the infobox? Mooretwin ( talk) 14:29, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
The key question is what the 'country' parameter is supposed to be showing, rather than simply counting its current usage in the infoboxes. Is it supposed to be recording the 'country' in which the league is based, or the country whose FA oversees the league, or the country(ies) whose teams compete in the league? Should the 'country' field be renamed? Should there be a secondary field added for those leagues who have teams from more than one country? Whatever the decision text needs to be added to the template doc. Eldumpo ( talk) 07:58, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
See UEFA Euro 1968 qualifying#Group 3. There it claims, citing no source, that the Austria vs Greece match was "abandoned at 83' because of fans disturbance in the stadium" and "declared void by the UEFA decision". The standings table does not take into account the goals from that game, but regards both Austria and Greece as having lost it, and thus it is claiming that there were a total of 9 victories against a total of 11 defeats in the group. Meanwhile the German and the French Wikipedias do not take into account that match at all, leaving each of Austria and Greece one match short, with the German one also saying that the match was abandoned and subsequently annulled. However, the UEFA reports for the qualifying group and for the specific game say nothing of that kind, and account the game as an ordinary 1–1 draw. What shall we do? -- Theurgist ( talk) 19:22, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
It is excluded now, Koppapa edited the page. Speaking of the topic, would it make sense if we highlighted the group winners of the 1968, 1972 and 1976 qualifying pages with the colour that we normally use for teams proceeding to a play-off round instead of the green that we use for direct qualifiers ( see the legend)? Back then, group winners proceeded to a quarterfinals stage, which was still a part of the qualifying process. -- Theurgist ( talk) 09:52, 6 February 2012 (UTC)
Is the 2012 AFC Women's Asian Cup awarded yet? Qualificaion matches should start in April 2012 (when you add 2 years to the first match played in the last edition). - Koppapa ( talk) 11:34, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
An attempt at WP:RFP would probably be fruitless due to the article never quite reaching the short term threshold usually required there. Instead I'm asking here whether we should consider long term semi protection. I see no net benefit to leaving it unprotected. — WFC— 15:02, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
I don't really know much about bots on wiki but would it be feasible to have one which would automatically update a player's stats on the season page, player infobox, career stats etc. If possible I think it would be good because it would cut out a lot of time spent doing that. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 16:41, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
I notice that this page is back, following a previous deletion. I don't know what's best to do about this, could someone point me in the right direction? U+003F ? 16:48, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Apart from it being a messy article, I came across a section which I thought was disputable, the "top goalscorers" section. Initially, it looked like this... no references and it also only included recent players, so I removed the section saying so. User:MarkMysoe who was responsible for adding the section and is a regular editor on the article, put the section back with few changes. Sources say that Abedi Pele (33) and Tony Yeboah (29) are the top two scorers for Ghana. Asamaoah Gyan just scored his 28th goal the other night against Mali in the Nations Cup, making him third. Apart from them, MarkMysoe lists other players, recent-ish I might add, but only used national-football-teams.com as his source. That would be fine to reference their goal tally, however I've tried telling him that it doesn't state if that player is the 4th, 5th, 10th, etc. in Ghana's leading scorers list. He says NFT is accurate and all that and I've come to the point where I'm getting fed up trying to explain this situation to him. His latest reply just proves how stubborn (and arrogant?) he is. A little help would be nice. The "player drain to other countries" section is a bit dodgy as well. I guess MarkMysoe was the one who added it? Banana Fingers ( talk) 15:38, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
The Player Drain To Other Countries looks very much like WP:OR], and has a bit of a WP:POV feel to it too. I have tried removing this section in the past noting my concern, but another editor disagreed with my assessment. Plenty of other nations (particularly African ones) have eligible players who chose other nations, don't think Ghana is especially notable for this. Ilikeeatingwaffles ( talk) 10:45, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
Just a heads up that the resignation of Capello by immediate effect will likely to bring lots of edits - of course cleanup may be required. – Lemonade51 ( talk) 19:33, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Just wondering if the non-league football season archives on the Tony Kempster website pass WP:RS. It's a very useful site with lots of info that isn't available anywhere else, particularly for the lower leagues. If this reference can't be used is there an alternative? Thanks. Del♉sion23 (talk) 20:30, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
There is one task: User:Pakhtakorienne doesn't tag his created pages, so... -- 84.245.231.134 ( talk) 15:22, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
Hey project. I've noticed that in a number of match articles which feature team lineups etc, we seem content to use the team names three times, one of which is usually in capitals. I don't see the point in this at all, so unless otherwise advised, I would advocate we just don't do it. For instance, see the edit I made here. Both Zenit and Rangers are mentioned above (in the score summary) and below (under the kit description). Do we really need ZENIT and RANGERS below those? Also, why is the score in the final spaced (e.g. 2 – 0) while all other instances of score lines in the article unspaced? Consistency please... Note: I've changed a few, but will change all the others (and there are many!) unless there's a consensus against it... The Rambling Man ( talk) 18:39, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
Your argument makes no sense. Why have every single score in an article unspaced bar one? It's not a template issue either, it's just the fact that some spaces have been added. The template is free text so it is very easy to make it align with the MOS and align with the rest of every single article per WP:DASH. Of course, if you could offer an objective argument why the only scoreline in an article to use spaced en-dashes is good and fine, I'm happy to hear it. There are many dozens (maybe hundreds) of articles like this with just one single spaced scoreline, with unspaced score lines in the infobox in the lead, unspaced score lines in the body of the text, and just one single spaced scoreline in the summary. Why is that a good idea for a professional, consistently formatted encyclopaedia? You don't seem to have any substantive argument other than "I like it that way". Unless I've missed something? The Rambling Man ( talk) 22:02, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
It's inconsistent yeah, but there are other bigger things in WP:Sports in general that don't fit with MOS. Date ranges in season articles according to WP:YEAR should be separated by a slash rather than an endash as they are periods of 12 months, not 2 years. I personally prefer the endash use as it fits with all other date ranges used in, for example, birth–death ranges or career ranges on football player articles. But yeah, MOS seems to be quite flexible at times. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:41, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
So, are we heading towards a consensus to (a) remove the repetitive and over-capitalised team names and (b) at least maintain an internally consistent format to scorelines e.g. either all unspaced en-dashes or spaced en-dashes or whatever? The Rambling Man ( talk) 09:07, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
The table at Africa Cup of Nations#Overall team records ( permanent link), which currently takes into account tournaments up to and including 2010, is obviously wrong because there is a difference of one goal between the total goals scored and the total goals conceded. I dug out all the match results from the articles on the past tournaments and, using MS Ecxel, I calculated the records of each team - and several errors in that table showed up. While there's no guarantee I haven't mistaken anything, there is not a single difference between my results and de:Fußball-Afrikameisterschaft#Ewige Tabelle ( permanent link) - except that it gives 29 losses to Algeria instead of 20, but that looks more like a typo than an error in the calculations. Both tables will require updating tomorrow. Shall I change the figures in Africa Cup of Nations according to my calculations? -- Theurgist ( talk) 14:33, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
Apps | Pld | W | D | L | GD | +/− | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
the-sports.org | 13 | 50 | 16 | 14 | 20 | 62:70 | −8 |
RSSSF | 15 | 56 | 16 | 15 | 25 | 64:80 | −16 |
me and the German WP | 15 | 56 | 16 | 15 | 25 | 65:81 | −16 |
Apps | Pld | W | D | L | GD | +/− | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
the-sports.org | 8 | 28 | 5 | 7 | 16 | 24:45 | −21 |
RSSSF | 6 | 22 | 5 | 6 | 11 | 21:34 | −13 |
me and the German WP | 6 | 22 | 5 | 6 | 11 | 21:34 | −13 |
Does anyone know why the templates in Category:Years in European association football navigational boxes all have a "(UEFA)" suffix? Even if the type of football was considered ambiguous (which I don't think it is for these navboxes) "UEFA" is not a code of football. -- Jameboy ( talk) 10:57, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
I noticed that at the Requests for assessment, there are two articles ( Northwich Victoria F.C. and 2010-11 Juventus F.C. season) which have been waiting more than one year for an assessment. There are five more which have been there more than six months. These are Mansfield Town F.C., History of Mansfield Town F.C., List of American and Canadian soccer champions, 1903 German football championship and FC Nordsjælland. If anyone has time to assess them, it would be much appreciated. Thank you. - Cloudz 679 14:19, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Aren't the Knockout phase, Second group stage, Group stage, and Qualifying rounds rather excessive?-- Echetus Xe 20:51, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Just a heads-up, Rangers have announced an intention to enter administration. Mjroots ( talk) 17:49, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Would someone mind casting an eye over James Jennings? An editor insists on readding unsourced information and unlicened images, claiming that the details have come from the article's subject. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 18:08, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Could a sysop please move Jacopo Sala (footballer) to Jacopo Sala? The latter was salted back in 2010, but the player has since made his professional debut in Germany and the article was created with the disambiguator. Jared Preston ( talk) 18:43, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
I think there are a number of derby articles linked at this template which may not be notable. I've glanced at a few and they don't appear to demonstrate the derby has sufficient coverage, as opposed to just listing matches that have been played. Particular examples include M4 derby, Humber derby (check out the use of colour) and South Lancashire derby. The parent article at the top of template appears to contain many other such 'derbies'. Any other views? Eldumpo ( talk) 07:58, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I would suggest that it contains derbies from the top 2 divisions in each country (possible 3for England) and that new pages be created for all the derbies in each country eg- English football derbies and Scottish football derbies etc. Stevie fae Scotland ( talk) 12:13, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I'm also dubious of "circumstantial" derbies: ties between two clubs that have no obvious reason to be considered a derby other than the fact that they happened to be successful at the same time and have one or two high-profile matches. Specifically I'm thinking Chelsea-Leeds and Arsenal-Manchester United. — WFC— 15:28, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Hey guys the article Liverpool F.C. in European football has been at FAC for a while now and has only had reviews from two users. I would be extremely grateful if anyone could have a look at the article and give a few comments, cheers NapHit ( talk) 19:37, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello, I have just a quick question regarding how to change the way a template works. Here's the issue:
{{fbw|ASA}}
should link to the
American Samoa women's national football team, however when I put it in an article, it comes out like this
American Samoa, instead showing the men's national team. Can anyone tell me how to fix this problem? Thanks in advance, --
Spartan008 (
talk)
00:49, 15 February 2012 (UTC){{fbw|USA}}
works fine
United States.
U+003F
?
11:09, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
United States {{{age|}}} {{{mw|men's}}} national soccer team
" value for the {{{link alias-football}}} parametre. Maybe this would be the correct addition for the American Samoa template too. I'm not sure though... --
Theurgist (
talk)
12:41, 15 February 2012 (UTC)I don't know which names are correct, but for American Samoa and Samoa football team articles, the naming convention should really be standardized to either all use "national association" or just "national" in the titles so these templates can work for any instance without creating redirects. So that everyone knows, American Samoa uses "national association" for men's but not women's and Somoa uses "national association" for both. However, both use just "national" for the "under-nn" links in their navboxes (the pages aren't actually created yet). The simplest thing to do is move the American Samoa's women's article to use "national association" and update the redlinks in the navboxes, since that's just one page move. Then both countries' templates can use the |link alias-football=
parameter set up like some of the other countries' country data templates. Just need a consensus on the appropriate naming. —
Bility (
talk)
00:19, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
can someone check this article? someone is continuously trying to remove all the references and change it to another individual with a different birth date. I can't tell if any of these corrections are legit. Frietjes ( talk) 15:44, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
The years in the infobox for Fan Chun Yip don't add up. The infobox says that he played for Hong Kong from 1998 to 2008 and for Hong Kong U-23 from 2005 to 2006. That would mean that he played his first senior international 7 years before his national youth team debut. But since he was born in 1976, it would also mean that he made his U-23 debut at age 29. Which obviously is impossible. Most likely explanation is that the years should be reversed, that he played for Hong Kong U-23 from 1998 to 2008 and for Hong Kong in 2005 and 2006. But that is also impossible. Because it would mean that he played his last U-23 match in 2008, at age 32. Does anyone know the real dates? 83.80.170.157 ( talk) 18:47, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
Is this projects naming standard for international matches "Country A v Country B (Year)"? I ask because I came across an article at WP:GAN with that format and initially thought it was a mistake. It looked like it should be an article on some legal case. If this is the convention I would be surprised if it met WP:Title as it is not recognisable or unambiguous. It at least needs "match" added to it to turn it into a proper descriptive title. AIRcorn (talk) 13:01, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Back to the title. I realise other articles are titled this way, but that doesn't mean they aren't wrong as well and that is why I brought it up here. I don't think it meets WP:title, but this is just an outsider opinion and I won't be changing anymore titles or monitoring new ones. If there is a relatively recent previous discussion deciding on this format then fine, otherwise it may be worth doing so here. AIRcorn (talk) 21:33, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Okay put in a requested move at
Talk:Barbados v Grenada (1994)#Requested move to get some more opinions. On a side note, I don't know what your inclusion criteria is, but some (especially
England v Rest of the World (1963) look a bit suspect notability wise.
AIRcorn
(talk)
00:20, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
I started a post on this topic a little while back, whereby I queried the addition of representative appearances (e.g. at Billy Steel) to the infobox. There were a number of comments made, but the discussion ended without agreement. There are four main approaches that I can see:
It may be there are other solutions. Can you indicate your preference so we can take things forward. Whatever the outcome the template doc will need to be updated accordingly. Thanks. Eldumpo ( talk) 18:56, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I will go for number 3 mainly because, like some other users pointed out, these matches are just friendlies and most of the time are just testimonials or charity games. Also if we add the representative caps it would make notable articles, like Gary Neville, Patrick Vieira, Robert Pirès etc have the wrong information as all three of those players were in the Paul Scholes testimonial which was a match between Manchester United and the New York Cosmos. These three players were on the Cosmos for that match. Does that mean we should add New York Cosmos 1 (0) to the infobox? I would hope not.-- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 11:29, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Option 4 is fine, it's clear enough from the text of each article what the term means. There is an awful lot of recentism in the argument that the inter-league internationals aren't important. Jmorrison230582 ( talk) 13:40, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
I have a weak preference for 3. While I do accept that these games were significant, IMO trying to put them in the infobox is more trouble than it's worth. If we are doing this, I think it should be options 1 or 2. I'm strongly opposed to 4: I don't think we should inaccurately label these matches as internationals in the name of simplicity (especially when it would be simpler not to have them in the infobox at all). — WFC— 23:48, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
Most people have provided reasoning for their choice, and there is a slight preference for removing over keeping them without changes, with a couple of people choosing the 'extra labelling' options. Given that these are to a degree a halfway position between keeping/removing, what do people think about choosing one of these as the way forward, in order to try and achieve overall consensus. If you haven't already provided your order of preference, which of the two labelling options do you prefer (Option 1 or 2), and do you agree that trying to progress with one of these is the best way forward, given the outcome. Eldumpo ( talk) 09:11, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
I was just wondering if a player who appeared in the qualifying rounds of the UEFA Cup (now Europa League) qualifies as notable. I had always assumed that it was a fully pro competition but there's nothing to confirm that on the article or here. Does anyone know? Big Dom 20:17, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
This chap - I've been watching the page because he was once on the Canaries' books... Sam Habergham. (Ref Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sam Habergham, which pre-dates his Tamworth days. -- Dweller ( talk) 23:40, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
I've skrewed up some page moves and need the help of admin to fix it. I came across Filip Filipov (defender), which is obviously the wrong disambigutor. Realising that the article at Filip Filipov was also a footballer, I moved it to Filip Filipov (footballer born 1988). It wasn't until after the move, that I realised the two articles are about the same person. I can someone please sort this out. Sorry about the mess. Sir Sputnik ( talk) 20:18, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
If you're participating or considering in participating in Wikimedians to the Games, you may be interested in attending the events below. They may provide an opportunity to get information to write a Wikinews article or to take pictures for points on Commons. If you're not participating, it would still be great to see people attending these events to take pictures for use on Wikipedia and Wikinews. If you do decide to attend, consider hosting a Wikimedia meetup at the end or the evening of the event, or even just letting HOPAU organisers know you are planning to attend. If you leave a message on my talk page, I can help you promote the meetup. :) If you need help with organising attendance because of transport cost issues or accessibility in terms of wanting press access, again please get in touch. :) -- LauraHale ( talk) 07:16, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
Standings tables with clubs have the default value of the text font size ( example), while standings tables with national teams usually specify a 90% value ( example). Why? -- Theurgist ( talk) 22:39, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
But what shall we do upon such an occasion?
|
|
There needn't be all six of them, one is fairly enough. -- Theurgist ( talk) 03:31, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
With the 90% value these tables look like this:
|
|
That makes a difference, although not much of one. Yet, it made me think that decreasing the font size hadn't been an inherently bad idea despite the inconsistencies it produced. -- Theurgist ( talk) 13:12, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
Prokingsley ( talk · contribs) is showing disturbingly similar editing behaviour (editing predominately Olympiakos F.C.-related articles) and also disturbingly similar aversion to policies and guidelines (he has recreated the recently nominated-for-deletion article Nikos Papadopoulos twice so far). Could someone set an eye on him, because I'm 80% sure this user is a sock? – Kosm 1 fent 20:56, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
Just a quick reminder that this list has been nominated for little over a month and could do with a consensus being reached. As it currently stands, the nomination has two supports as well as comments from two different reviewers which have been addressed. I would appreciate if anyone can give some input, preferably making a final decision. Thanks -- Lemonade51 ( talk) 15:56, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
The page Celtic 9-0 Aberdeen was moved so that it was an en-dash between the two scores rather than an ordinary dash. Is this correct, to me it doesn't look right because the dash it too big but I've never really paid to much attention to WP:ENDASH. Could someone who understands it please tell me if the page is titled correctly. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 16:26, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
How do we distinguish between club article history sections copy-pasted from club websites, and situations where a club has copy-pasted its own website history section from Wikipedia? I'm wondering because the Bracknell Town history section is very similar to the one on the official website and I'm not entirely sure which way round it is. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:03, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
I've removed the copyrighted material and replaced it was a proper history section now, plus stadium and colours sections. Squad was in need of a big update too. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:29, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
A note for these in future: if you can definitively identify an off-wiki piece as being a copyvio from here, please be sure to flag our article with {{ backwardscopyvio}} so that future editors know that it's us being plagiarised and not the other way around. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:35, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Ex-footballer Bobby Bean is reported in my local paper to have died recently. He played professionally for Bexleyheath & Welling F.C. 1952-57, and had one trial match with West Ham Utd in the 1952-53 season. He had the option to sign professionally for Chelsea in 1953 but decided to continue his apprenticeship as a printers' engineer. From 1957 he played for Tunbridge Wells F. C.
As a Kent-related subject, I have a passing interest here. Does this player meet the notability requirements to sustain an article? Mjroots ( talk) 08:53, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Just to note that the Kent League, while not exactly a stepping stone to the Premier League, is still very much not a "Sunday league" (which refers in England to amateur football which isn't even on the non-League pyramid). And it's important not to be too strict regarding "fully professional leagues" when discussing players from before the sixties, or indeed later in many countries. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:33, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Greetings everyone, there's just an issue that I would like to bring to light here. Any footballers who have played solely in the First League of Montenegro can't get articles due to speedy deletion. Apparently, the justification for such speedy deletions is that "the league in which these players play isn't a fully-professional league." Now, this is on the basis of one news article from several years ago (back when sports were just being reformed after the nation's independence in 2006) that an "amateur league had been formed in 2006." Players who have only played a single minute in the first-tier Bosnian or Macedonian leagues can get their articles, so how is it that players who are having remarkable careers in the first-tier league of Montenegro can't get an article too? If professionalism is the sole barrier here, it is still not an excuse for keeping editors from making articles on players in the 1.CFL because players who have only played in USL Premier Development League get articles even though the league's article clearly states that it itself is not a fully-professional league. I think this should be brought up to attention. Thanks in advance guys. Balkanskiredneck ( talk) 03:06, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello everyone, I came across this article after User:The C of E talked about it on the Jock Stein page. I don't think its an appropriate article because firstly, it isn't even about the song (that word being used loosely, the lyrics are just shouting Big Jock Knew) and the word song isn't even in the title. It just seems to be a way for The C of E to try and get his views onto Wikipedia after he wasn't allowed to put them in the Jock Stein article. Also it seems to be lacking inherent notability on its own and the majority of sources don't seem to be mainly about that song. Even still its not really appropriate for a Wikipedia article. What course of action, if any, should be taken. I personally think it should be AfD'd but I could be completely wrong. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 13:22, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
There are lots of unpleasant football songs. Occasionally they get mentioned briefly or alluded to in mainstream media. Very few of them are notable. To me the article reads like a compendium of minor media mentions tied together with synthesis. At most, a redirect (not merge) to Old Firm is warranted. Oldelpaso ( talk) 18:00, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Ideally what we want here is a separate article for the Torbett incident. It makes no sense to have details on the incident (which certainly is notable) spread out on three separate articles about Celtic Boys Club, Stein and the song. Once such an article is created, both the song and Torbett's name should be redirected to it. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:29, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Following all the news about the signs being removed at St James' Park, Leaky caldron ( talk · contribs) changed the infobox on Newcastle United F.C. to list the stadium as Sports Direct Arena. I reverted and noted consensus on using non-sponsored names. They then simply removed the name of the stadium from the infobox. I reverted again, was threatened with being reported, and was reverted (on the faulty premise of BRD). I have asked them to bring the issue here to discuss, but the response was to label WP:FOOTY as a "obscure little workshop page"/"little old group of editors". Can someone else intervene, as currently the infobox is missing a stadium name! Thanks, Number 5 7 11:14, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
The club website calls it "formerly SJP", the media reports it as no longer SJP, the official league website currently calls it something else but WP has to be held hostage to SJP by a few zealots who care more for history than reliably sourced fact. You couldn't make it up. Leaky Caldron 13:16, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
The stadium is officially the Sports Direct Arena, the rights were bought by Sports Direct and all signage with the former name of St James' removed. Stop referring to it by its old name as it has been rebranded. You might want to place the address of the Sports Direct Arena as St James' Park but the stadium name has changed. Peoples personal views should not be allowed to continue giving out misinformation, this is Wikipedia not a fans site. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.214.130.113 ( talk) 15:54, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
Just to confirm here: is everyone happy that this truly lame dispute has been settled? That the page will remain at the poorly-apostrophised St James' Park until such point as there's reason to believe the common name has changed, but that the infobox is headed with the "official" name? Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:20, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
I've said nothing about how the stadium is to be referred in random articles. I specifically asked if the situation with the stadium article itself, and the infobox therein, was acceptable and you objected. For what it's worth, though, use of the common name is almost always more appropriate than use of the "official" name in random articles because the additional recognisability helps with content clarity. In the Newcastle article a simple compromise would be to list both in the infobox. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 08:11, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
TBH, I think it's quite clear there is an impasse here. Do we need a poll on whether the consensus on stadium names (article and infobox) is still valid? Number 5 7 16:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Ideally I'd like to see the original names kept but we have to follow whatever the reliable sources are showing, but not just the position of the club themselves. However, this thread is discussing a slightly strange argument in that the infobox should change and not the article, whereas I think they should be the same. Eldumpo ( talk) 17:45, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I've moved this to Talk:Newcastle United F.C.#Stadium name RFC as I think it's fairly clear this discussion is going nowhere. Number 5 7 19:11, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I created an article about the CAF tournament determining the African qualifiers to the U17 FIFA world cup, but have now redirected as i became aware it already existed: African U-17 Cup of Nations for Women. That name sounds strange, should it be moved to African U-17 Women's Cup of Nations? There also exist two articles for the 2010 tournament 2010 African U-17 Women's Championship, 2010 African U-17 Cup of Nations for Women with the first the better article. So should we move the main article and the the individual tournament, redirecting all the others? - Koppapa ( talk) 16:00, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
Some of the player articles are turning into commentaries that note every goal a player scores because some editors don't know the difference between an encyclopedia and Match of the Day. The project may wish to keep an eye on this. Britmax ( talk) 20:19, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
This has always happened: we can do little to prevent recentism of this sort, and so long as it gains us content and new editors it should probably be tolerated. As time passes, the articles in question will hopefully be rewritten with better prose. The only time to really worry about it is when the content in question is not written in a neutral style and thus is affecting more than just the readability of the article. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 10:55, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I dare say this question has been asked before but does anyone know if there is a policy regarding how a players name should appear in a teams squad template. i.e should Robin van Persie appear as van Persie or as it apppears on his shirt v. Persie. Any help gratefully received. Quentin X ( talk) 20:14, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
User:MYS77 and another one of his creations, i am 99,999999% sure this chap as not played in higher than Tercera División! Could someone help me out please? -- Vasco Amaral ( talk) 21:36, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
Ahmed Khalil (Emirati footballer) does not appear to require disambiguation as far as I can see. Could an admin please move it back over the redirect? -- Jameboy ( talk) 23:51, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
An unregistered user insists that Healy being photographed with a UDA loyalist and thus being reported in the Sun means that he has "sparked outrage". The Sun seems to be the only newspaper to have reported this. Should it be reported in the article or should it be removed? Approaching the 3 revert rule here.-- Echetus Xe 00:05, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi everyone. I need some admin help. The thing is that I wanted to move Igor Kojić (footballer) to simple Igor Kojić, as there is no need for the disambiguation factor, however I receved a message saying:
You cannot move a page to this location, because the new title has been protected from creation
I never saw that message in my years long wiki history, but I guess someone blocked that article creation? Anyway, not sure if it was intended to be because of this article, so the guys found a way to make using the disambiguating factor (footballer), however the guy passes notability as he played in Serbian top league (1 match :) so it can have an article. Although I have been notecing this article from time to time for one specific reason: the autors seem to have a real difficulty to understand that WP is not their mean to promote the player, so they really insist to add him a horrible propagandistic crap about him being brilliant, etc. I removed that, and left the sourced info, with a good-will unsourced tag for one particular unsourced claim. But the article could be moved to a simple title, for a start. FkpCascais ( talk) 06:29, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi, I recently amended the competition titles in the honours sections of a few Barcelona players recently (e.g. Éric Abidal). For instance, I unpiped [[La Liga|Spanish League]] to just [[La Liga]]. These were later reverted by User:Raulseixas with no explanation given. My amendments are correct though, right? It seems unnecessary and a little condescending to our readers to use generic names for competitions rather than list what they're actually called. Not to mention that it's factually inaccurate as there's no such thing as the Spanish League; it's name is La Liga. And by this logic, what should lower tiers be referred to as? "Spanish League 2"? "Spanish 2nd League"? It just seems silly to me to use these generic, fictional titles rather than the actual titles. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 10:43, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
The article was going through AfD when it was eventually speedy deleted under CSD G5. However, GM1995 ( talk · contribs) has re-created it. Does it qualify for CSD G4, or it has to be nominated for deletion all over again? Cheers. – Kosm 1 fent 13:42, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
When was the European Cup EVER known as the "European Champions' Cup", except perhaps in translation from some European language other than English?! This is the kind of fifth-hand cobbled-together Wikipedia information that gives fifth-hand cobbled-together Wikipedia information a deservedly bad name! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.100.217.69 ( talk) 00:12, 22 February 2012 (UTC)
Not sure about where the cut-off point is for notability of Canadian association football teams, so I'm wondering, is Champlain Cavaliers Men's Soccer team notable? Del♉sion23 (talk) 19:24, 22 February 2012 (UTC)
Umbro have released a new home kit with the three leopards(! ;) [23]) all in red. Does the logo in the infobox on the England national football team now need to be updated? If so, I have created the file:
file:England_national_football_team_crest_(2012).svg
TheBigJagielka ( talk) 00:15, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I know this has been done before, but it remains an issue. Say there is a Brazilian/Spanish/Portuguese player - his article is at 'John Smith', but he is known as 'Johnny'. What should his defaultsort be? I am firmly in the 'surname, firstname' camp... Giant Snowman 09:31, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
User:Jun19, other than the fact he talks to no one and moves pages just like that, is having a totally different approach: Portuguese players are sillily referred to in TV broadcasts with TWO names (i'm Portuguese, so no racism there!), ALWAYS, but Adrien Silva is known as "Silva" (keyword "S"), João Moutinho is known as "Moutinho" (keyword "M"), etc, etc. The M.O. for Brazilian footballers has to be the same, so (example) Fábio Bahia has to be sorted under "B", not "F", as he's not known solely as "Fábio" (some are indeed known by their first name, as Raí or Romário).
Attentively - -- Vasco Amaral ( talk) 09:40, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Please see the explanation of mine at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football/Archive_62#Portuguese_footballers.27_names_.2F_Introductions, most preciselly (I copy/pasted the most important part):
Portuguese players are known by either one of the following ways:
I must say that I think that people with common surnames (Costa, Sousa, Silva, Gomes, Lopes, Pinto, etc.) usually because of disambiguation reasons leave their first name in their commoname, while others like Luis Figo don´t need it, as "Figo" is not a common surname, thus easily recognisable simply as Figo. That is why is common to see in line-ups, exemple: 6 - Paulo Sousa, 7 - Figo, 8 - Rui Cosa, 9 - João Pinto, 10 - Pauleta, 11 - Capucho.
What I really concluded is that Portuguese (including most places using Portuguese as mother tongue, like Brazil) players don´t really have a rule for their names, and they often choose one while still young, which will help them to be recognisable, and usually keep it troughout their careers, weather being real name, nickname, or whatever. FkpCascais ( talk) 04:15, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Someone up for some detective work? Someone added a sourced result to the then unknown third place play-off of the 1983 tournament by finding a web-archive of an english language Singaporan based newspaper archove from 1983. With that start i searched the previous days for more results. I improved the article from this to that but there are some inconsistencies. Day 2 reports that feature a table don't really add up for match-day one when subtracting the day 2 results. Also the 5th matchday results/pairings are unclear to me. There are some clues given in the cited sources like "singapore tied 3rd place after day 4" and so on. I started a table on the articles talkpage. What really would help would be finding a report about matchday 1 (which should have appeared on 11th april) or the last matchday. (although i believe when the paper talks about semi-finals the effectively mean the 5th matchday). If anyone finds a clue please replay on talkpage of article. :) RSSSF is no help for that year btw. - Koppapa ( talk) 11:55, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Just stalking a talk page and saw that Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Competitions was being quoted as the way a football competition article "must be styled". Now I looked at the style guide and, frankly, it's years out of date. Do we want to update it in line with MOS and ACCESS etc or should we just remove the "guide" altogether? The Rambling Man ( talk) 14:00, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I'd never suggest using a GA. We have a couple of hundred or so FAs and FLs, and the most recent ones would be decent frameworks for this kind of thing, don't you think? I see no good reason to do otherwise, but I'm happy to hear suggestions. The Rambling Man ( talk) 20:56, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi, MarkMysoe ( talk · contribs) has added cup icons to football players' honours sections like this. I've removed them with regard to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Archive 18#Euro cup icons. The discussion was in 2008. Has consensus changed in the meantime and do we want to have these icons now in the articles? -- Jaellee ( talk) 18:39, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Discuss. The Rambling Man ( talk) 19:51, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Okeydokey, I find it to be an unlikely notable intersection of vaguely notable events (i.e. non-league, fifth round, FA Cup, 1945). I'll prod it and see how it goes. The Rambling Man ( talk) 21:06, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Malmö FF will be TFA today the 24th of February. I'm the main contributor of the article, however, as a European I won't be able to keep an eye on it for the next eight hours so I would appreciate if people kept their eyes open for vandalism and good faith edits. Thanks! -- Reckless182 (talk) 23:33, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Could anyone confirm that Adrian Schedlinski played one game for OFI Crete in the 2008–09 Superleague Greece as per this link? The German Wikipedia also sources his time at PFC Lokomotiv Plovdiv to transfermarkt. I have a feeling this isn't quite right... Jared Preston ( talk) 01:09, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
OK, Transfermarkt has many mistakes, but has millions of stats... "Anyone can edit it" is just not trouth. Anyone can register, but please try to submit a wrong info and come back to me saying they accepted it, ok?
-Transfermarkt asks you for a source, and then the change is submited to an website admin who checks the source before inserting the facts to the page, a process that usually takes a day or two. The changes are NOT done directly as here on WP, please GiantSnowman stop giving that phalse idea. I am not saying that it is reliable, but lets not exagerate the other way around. FkpCascais ( talk) 23:26, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Come on GS, I explained this already, Transfermarkt is not a WP:RS, but it has as much mistakes as all other similar websites like Playerhistory, NFT, Weltfussball, Footballdatabase, etc. I only dare to say that Soccerway is slightly better, but in comparison, it has only about 1/8th of total ammount of info Transfermarkt has. As one German editor once said, it is quite reliable for German football, and as you move further away from Germany it becomes less and less accurate... FkpCascais ( talk) 23:36, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Domestic football cup articles all have a different style in depicting their tournament matches. As we all know, most football federations have a single elimination policy for their domestic cups. It's simple, the losing club is eliminated. Here, I list a few examples from current season. All are okay in their own terms, but overall they look like a hairy mess. Maybe we could work on a comprehensive WP:MOS for domestic football cup articles.
So, what are your thoughts? — Ekin( talk· @) 09:38, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I was on a forum today and someone asked me if I could put a picture of Amrinder Singh on his page. I said okay and give me the picture. He told me that his picture was on facebook in one of his albums, in that album there is a picture of him in his jersey and that because nothing on Facebook is copyright (supposedly, I am not sure about that) that I can just us that picture on wikipedia freely. I said I would think about it and now I am here. So, are we even allowed to use pictures of footballers from there facebook pages without there consent. I am pretty sure its a no but just to make sure.-- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 18:37, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi guys, I'm sure some of you will have heard of James Forrest (footballer born 1991) the footballer at Celtic. I think his page should be at what is currently the disambiguation page. He is IMO by far the most notable of all the forrests listed on the page and actually the only one who is called James Forrest. I'm not entirely sure on the protocol, does this need an RM or can it just be moved. Cheers. Adam4267 ( talk) 20:02, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
I thought displaying honours in the infobox was only reserved for competitions that actually distribute medals such as the Summer Olympics. User:MarkMysoe has added an honours section in the infobox of André Ayew, but it lists international and domestic competitions. I reverted because I remember this being brought up before and, subsequently rejected, but the user reverted me citing Alessandro Del Piero's infobox, which has honours in his infobox. The honours have also been displayed in the infobox for over a year. — JS Rant Away 03:09, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
I'm just wondering, does anyone here know with which program or editor I can create a lineup image such as File:PAR-NZL 2010-06-24.svg? I can't seem to find any information of how they were created on images such as that one. JaumeBG ( talk) 06:32, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
The issue in general is rather minor, but nevertheless – I recently noticed that Scandinavian league season articles (e.g., 2012 Norwegian Premier League, 2012 Allsvenskan, 2012 Veikkausliiga) began to include collapsible boxes à la Template:2012 in Norwegian football below the standard infobox, partially although a navbox with the same content had already been placed within the stack at the bottom of the pages. Both navbox styles are valid in WP:MOS terms, nevertheless two nearly identical boxes seem to be one too many.
So... is there a preference regarding the location (top of article vs bottom stack) and the style (collapsible box vs standard navbox) of these boxes within the project? -- Soccer-holic I hear voices in my head... 14:19, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
Can we please put the England national football team on protection. The page is consistently vandalized and many IPs refuse to use the talk page. Until the issue of the crest is over I think we should semi-protect the page. -- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 07:35, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
Another Spanish player-related query. I changed the season ranges displayed in a number of Barcelona players' career statistics from 1999–00 to 1999–2000 in order to reflect what the wikilinked articles are titled (e.g. 1999–2000 Segunda División B is used, rather than 1999–00 Segunda División B). However, I have been reverted on all counts by User:Raulseixas, with no explanation given as to why. So I just wanted to raise this here and make sure the amendments I made are correct. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 20:25, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Last summer some user redirected a long existing article into a new page, thus making it loose its edit history. The page is Milan Stojanoski, and the edit history is at Milan Stojanovski which is now a redirect. FkpCascais ( talk) 06:19, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
Since we didn't spent too much attention to User:Zombie433 so that his vandalism in footy biographies grew to unimaginable dimensions I'm forced to report here User:MarkMysoe who is adding to Ghanian footabllers articles fictious youth years, stats and info unsupported by sources, just like User:Zombie433 did. His trademark is to add his own opinions or other info about a player using "ghost" sources that not support the claims. I already reported there his actions in Kevin-Prince Boateng article and User:Basalisk cleaned a lot his POVish. After that he continues to do the same thing like for example in Kevin Mensah. By the way please look how high is the level of his arrogance, he added later another not supported claim, "He usually plays the ball with his right foot but is actually left-footed" based on "Preferred foot: Right/Left" from source, he removed not supported claim in next edit, but look at the summary "so what not supported in the source?" - what a cheek! Go now to his recent edits: Masahudu Alhassan, he added a source which says "...he signed for then Serie B side Rimini. He left after one season to join Genoa", he include this info and by the way added contradictory info that he played 4 years for Rimini as well as fictious years for Prampram Mighty Royals [25]. The same he did in Rashid Sumaila with some POVish and a lot of the same things in Richard Mpong. Please look also into Emmanuel Baffour, this is common example how he adds his own opinion using random sources that not support a claim. As you can see we need to precisely look at his edits, even if he adds references often these are references without cover.-- Oleola ( talk) 16:16, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
The "omniscient one" has struck again............. lol!!!! Banana Fingers ( talk) 16:13, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 60 | ← | Archive 62 | Archive 63 | Archive 64 | Archive 65 | Archive 66 | → | Archive 70 |
The list of fully pro leagues says it is, but the source appears to be someone's essay on a publish-your-own-writing website that doesn't even say definitively that either of the top two divisions is fully-professional in the Wikipedia meaning of the phrase. cheers, Struway2 ( talk) 15:52, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
Wow. We're questioning the likelihood of a player in the Dutch second tier being notable. If this hadn't obviously been made in good faith (which of course it has been: no question there) I'd regard this as a breaching experiment. NFOOTBALL's focus on "fully professional" is an absurdity. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 20:14, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
To clarify, what we were questioning was not the likelihood of a player in the Dutch second tier being notable, but the quality of the referencing at WP:FPL. Struway2 ( talk) 08:28, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
The discussion above, promted me to take a look at the sourcing at WP:FPL and I have to say it's a pretty sorry state of affairs. The following is a list of all the leagues currently on the list that are sourced only with dead links. Please note that this is NOT intended as a comment on the notability of footballers playing in those leages:
In addition, Torneo Argentino A is currently listed with no source whatsoever. The source for Ligue 1 and Ligue 2 claimed to be down for temporary maitenance. I will check it again later. You're help in finding more sources is much appreciated. Sir Sputnik ( talk) 20:47, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Apart from the usual vague inclusion criteria ("those that are well known within the non-League (sic)"), what a truly bizarre way to format such a section....... -- ChrisTheDude ( talk) 22:33, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Just checking, is there an article yet on the Al-Ahli/Al-Masry riot yet? Hack ( talk) 06:39, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
What is the difference, precisely, between a local derby and a regular football rivalry, and is the term 'local derby' used in sports other than association football? Various comments at Talk:Local derby suggest that the two terms have distinct meanings but there is no agreement on a single definition. I had always thought of a 'local derby' as a rivalry between local teams that regularly play one another, but that definition would exclude many items listed in the article, such as the France–Italy football rivalry and probably even El Clásico.
The article provides a definition in the lead but it is ambiguous, containing qualifiers such as "in many countries", "generally local", "particularly in association football". It has other issues, too: two unsourced sections about the origin and usage of the phrase; an unsourced 'International' section which raises the question of just how 'local' a local derby is required to be; and, finally, a long and mostly unsourced list of derbies and rivalries. -- Black Falcon ( talk) 23:03, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
User:Barocci have moved the article FC Zenit Saint Petersburg to FC Zenit, even though the result of the previous requested move discussion, started by him, was no consensus for move. User:Ilikeeatingwaffles have started a requested move discussion, to move it back, but I feel that the right thing to do is to move the article back to FC Zenit Saint Petersburg right away (as per the previous discussion), and then if wanted start a requested move discussion to move it to FC Zenit. I tried to move the page back myself, but there was an unknown obsticle there. Could a administrator look into this matter? Thank you, Mentoz86 ( talk) 08:18, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
I believe the move was strictly in line with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (sports) guideline. There were no further comments however since that guideline came to light. Do you guys mind commenting in the discussion with the regard for the guideline? Barocci ( talk) 22:51, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
There is a user constantly changing the flag for Ali El-Khatib to that of Israel, even though he represents Palestine internationally and Tvrtko Kale to Israel even though he has never formally represented Israel after acquiring citizenship. I have asked the user to stop but they continue to revert the edits. - NYC2TLV ( talk) 00:17, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Does anyone know if Walter Puddefoot is related to Len Puddefoot and Syd Puddefoot? Unusual surname, all active in the 20s... Giant Snowman 00:35, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Most clubs seem to have a 'List of X F.C. players' now, which is only a good thing, but I think we need some agreement about layout/format so that they are the same across the board. Here are my concerns:
Disagree - I think info on the position a player has is essential for this sort of list - it adds clarity in some cases towards the stats. EG - Alan Hodgkinson played 600+ times for Sheffield United but never scored a goal - why? Because he was a goalkeeper. Positions are used across pretty much every football article from player articles to seasons to lists to squads etc. Are we moving to remove all of them? Also the disparity between the two stats formats is odd I agree - but only Wikipedia articles seem to differentiate between league and other competitive matches which I have never understood. A player could (in theory) make only three league appearances but play in 100+ cup games for his club, including scoring a hat trick in the Champions League final (unlikely but possible) but on the 'league only' criteria he wouldn't be included in these 'list of notable players from club x articles' Bladeboy1889 ( talk) 17:39, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Some of the above comments seem to imply that such list should only include league appearances. If so, how come so many Featured Lists cover all matches; e.g.
Regarding the ability to source data for certain teams / players - surely just because something may be difficult in some cases that is not a reason for not doing it at all? Bladeboy1889 ( talk) 09:24, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
I was inspired by this discussion to put together a List of Tranmere Rovers F.C. players. I stuck it in for peer review if anyone wants to comment. Ta. U+003F ? 00:27, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
I feel that the Major League Soccer should become a higher priority for this (High Importance). It's growing in popularity and the article for the league is sub-par as is the ones for its clubs. The article is ranked start-class and I feel that that is because it's ranked as importantly as it should be. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cr7ftw3665 ( talk • contribs) 02:51, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
This article appears to be in a bit of a mess. Coly was down as having played five games for Leyton Orient, which is untrue, and I've removed it. I can't find any reference to this guy ever being at Orient at all. Maybe Leyton F.C.? Or maybe neither. Was he ever at Palace? I sense notability problems too, as none of the clubs he has apparently played for competes in a professional league. Bretonbanquet ( talk) 22:46, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
I nominated Malmö FF in Europe for FLC (see here) on 23 December last year and it is still at FLC awaiting further input. I presume that the FL directors want further opinions before promoting or archiving it, it has currently two editors supporting it and none opposing it. I would be truly grateful if anyone wants to express their opinions to reach a consensus. Thanks! -- Reckless182 ( talk) 17:42, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
hi everybody, I have a situation here in AFC Futsal Club Championship page. One user is very persistent to add an unofficial tournament in the main table. in 2006 one trial tournament held link. I say an small explanation about this tournament somewhere in the page is enough, and this trial edition must not added to the main table. based on this link 2010 tournament was the first edition recognized by AFC. can anyone here help me and talk to this user, since he has personal problem with me and does opposite of what I say. I already reverted it 3 times and can't do it again tonight. Thanks in advance. Mohsen1248 ( talk) 22:40, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello, I just want to know that if a player who does not have a wikipedia article yet plays in the Aaha Gold Cup would they then be considered notable being as they played in this tournament. -- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 00:10, 6 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi. A problem that seemed to have been sorted following a previous discussion has reared its ugly head again. It's basically an argument between Real Madrid and Barca fans about who should be described as Spain's "most successful" club. There is a ridiculous argument going on at Talk:Real Madrid C.F. right now. In my opinion, the articles should just list how many of each trophy the clubs have won, and to note whether that is a record (e.g. Real Madrid's 9 European Cup wins). It's plain and NPOV. Sadly, no-one is listening, and I was hoping that experienced WP:FOOTY editors could try and help out. Thanks. Ilikeeatingwaffles ( talk) 11:59, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
What is the guideline for the infobox for a national league if there are members of that league from outside the country of which the league is the national league?
Currently we have:
It seems, then, that League of Ireland is out of step. Presumably it should mention Northern Ireland in the infobox? Mooretwin ( talk) 14:29, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
The key question is what the 'country' parameter is supposed to be showing, rather than simply counting its current usage in the infoboxes. Is it supposed to be recording the 'country' in which the league is based, or the country whose FA oversees the league, or the country(ies) whose teams compete in the league? Should the 'country' field be renamed? Should there be a secondary field added for those leagues who have teams from more than one country? Whatever the decision text needs to be added to the template doc. Eldumpo ( talk) 07:58, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
See UEFA Euro 1968 qualifying#Group 3. There it claims, citing no source, that the Austria vs Greece match was "abandoned at 83' because of fans disturbance in the stadium" and "declared void by the UEFA decision". The standings table does not take into account the goals from that game, but regards both Austria and Greece as having lost it, and thus it is claiming that there were a total of 9 victories against a total of 11 defeats in the group. Meanwhile the German and the French Wikipedias do not take into account that match at all, leaving each of Austria and Greece one match short, with the German one also saying that the match was abandoned and subsequently annulled. However, the UEFA reports for the qualifying group and for the specific game say nothing of that kind, and account the game as an ordinary 1–1 draw. What shall we do? -- Theurgist ( talk) 19:22, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
It is excluded now, Koppapa edited the page. Speaking of the topic, would it make sense if we highlighted the group winners of the 1968, 1972 and 1976 qualifying pages with the colour that we normally use for teams proceeding to a play-off round instead of the green that we use for direct qualifiers ( see the legend)? Back then, group winners proceeded to a quarterfinals stage, which was still a part of the qualifying process. -- Theurgist ( talk) 09:52, 6 February 2012 (UTC)
Is the 2012 AFC Women's Asian Cup awarded yet? Qualificaion matches should start in April 2012 (when you add 2 years to the first match played in the last edition). - Koppapa ( talk) 11:34, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
An attempt at WP:RFP would probably be fruitless due to the article never quite reaching the short term threshold usually required there. Instead I'm asking here whether we should consider long term semi protection. I see no net benefit to leaving it unprotected. — WFC— 15:02, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
I don't really know much about bots on wiki but would it be feasible to have one which would automatically update a player's stats on the season page, player infobox, career stats etc. If possible I think it would be good because it would cut out a lot of time spent doing that. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 16:41, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
I notice that this page is back, following a previous deletion. I don't know what's best to do about this, could someone point me in the right direction? U+003F ? 16:48, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Apart from it being a messy article, I came across a section which I thought was disputable, the "top goalscorers" section. Initially, it looked like this... no references and it also only included recent players, so I removed the section saying so. User:MarkMysoe who was responsible for adding the section and is a regular editor on the article, put the section back with few changes. Sources say that Abedi Pele (33) and Tony Yeboah (29) are the top two scorers for Ghana. Asamaoah Gyan just scored his 28th goal the other night against Mali in the Nations Cup, making him third. Apart from them, MarkMysoe lists other players, recent-ish I might add, but only used national-football-teams.com as his source. That would be fine to reference their goal tally, however I've tried telling him that it doesn't state if that player is the 4th, 5th, 10th, etc. in Ghana's leading scorers list. He says NFT is accurate and all that and I've come to the point where I'm getting fed up trying to explain this situation to him. His latest reply just proves how stubborn (and arrogant?) he is. A little help would be nice. The "player drain to other countries" section is a bit dodgy as well. I guess MarkMysoe was the one who added it? Banana Fingers ( talk) 15:38, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
The Player Drain To Other Countries looks very much like WP:OR], and has a bit of a WP:POV feel to it too. I have tried removing this section in the past noting my concern, but another editor disagreed with my assessment. Plenty of other nations (particularly African ones) have eligible players who chose other nations, don't think Ghana is especially notable for this. Ilikeeatingwaffles ( talk) 10:45, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
Just a heads up that the resignation of Capello by immediate effect will likely to bring lots of edits - of course cleanup may be required. – Lemonade51 ( talk) 19:33, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Just wondering if the non-league football season archives on the Tony Kempster website pass WP:RS. It's a very useful site with lots of info that isn't available anywhere else, particularly for the lower leagues. If this reference can't be used is there an alternative? Thanks. Del♉sion23 (talk) 20:30, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
There is one task: User:Pakhtakorienne doesn't tag his created pages, so... -- 84.245.231.134 ( talk) 15:22, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
Hey project. I've noticed that in a number of match articles which feature team lineups etc, we seem content to use the team names three times, one of which is usually in capitals. I don't see the point in this at all, so unless otherwise advised, I would advocate we just don't do it. For instance, see the edit I made here. Both Zenit and Rangers are mentioned above (in the score summary) and below (under the kit description). Do we really need ZENIT and RANGERS below those? Also, why is the score in the final spaced (e.g. 2 – 0) while all other instances of score lines in the article unspaced? Consistency please... Note: I've changed a few, but will change all the others (and there are many!) unless there's a consensus against it... The Rambling Man ( talk) 18:39, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
Your argument makes no sense. Why have every single score in an article unspaced bar one? It's not a template issue either, it's just the fact that some spaces have been added. The template is free text so it is very easy to make it align with the MOS and align with the rest of every single article per WP:DASH. Of course, if you could offer an objective argument why the only scoreline in an article to use spaced en-dashes is good and fine, I'm happy to hear it. There are many dozens (maybe hundreds) of articles like this with just one single spaced scoreline, with unspaced score lines in the infobox in the lead, unspaced score lines in the body of the text, and just one single spaced scoreline in the summary. Why is that a good idea for a professional, consistently formatted encyclopaedia? You don't seem to have any substantive argument other than "I like it that way". Unless I've missed something? The Rambling Man ( talk) 22:02, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
It's inconsistent yeah, but there are other bigger things in WP:Sports in general that don't fit with MOS. Date ranges in season articles according to WP:YEAR should be separated by a slash rather than an endash as they are periods of 12 months, not 2 years. I personally prefer the endash use as it fits with all other date ranges used in, for example, birth–death ranges or career ranges on football player articles. But yeah, MOS seems to be quite flexible at times. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:41, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
So, are we heading towards a consensus to (a) remove the repetitive and over-capitalised team names and (b) at least maintain an internally consistent format to scorelines e.g. either all unspaced en-dashes or spaced en-dashes or whatever? The Rambling Man ( talk) 09:07, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
The table at Africa Cup of Nations#Overall team records ( permanent link), which currently takes into account tournaments up to and including 2010, is obviously wrong because there is a difference of one goal between the total goals scored and the total goals conceded. I dug out all the match results from the articles on the past tournaments and, using MS Ecxel, I calculated the records of each team - and several errors in that table showed up. While there's no guarantee I haven't mistaken anything, there is not a single difference between my results and de:Fußball-Afrikameisterschaft#Ewige Tabelle ( permanent link) - except that it gives 29 losses to Algeria instead of 20, but that looks more like a typo than an error in the calculations. Both tables will require updating tomorrow. Shall I change the figures in Africa Cup of Nations according to my calculations? -- Theurgist ( talk) 14:33, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
Apps | Pld | W | D | L | GD | +/− | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
the-sports.org | 13 | 50 | 16 | 14 | 20 | 62:70 | −8 |
RSSSF | 15 | 56 | 16 | 15 | 25 | 64:80 | −16 |
me and the German WP | 15 | 56 | 16 | 15 | 25 | 65:81 | −16 |
Apps | Pld | W | D | L | GD | +/− | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
the-sports.org | 8 | 28 | 5 | 7 | 16 | 24:45 | −21 |
RSSSF | 6 | 22 | 5 | 6 | 11 | 21:34 | −13 |
me and the German WP | 6 | 22 | 5 | 6 | 11 | 21:34 | −13 |
Does anyone know why the templates in Category:Years in European association football navigational boxes all have a "(UEFA)" suffix? Even if the type of football was considered ambiguous (which I don't think it is for these navboxes) "UEFA" is not a code of football. -- Jameboy ( talk) 10:57, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
I noticed that at the Requests for assessment, there are two articles ( Northwich Victoria F.C. and 2010-11 Juventus F.C. season) which have been waiting more than one year for an assessment. There are five more which have been there more than six months. These are Mansfield Town F.C., History of Mansfield Town F.C., List of American and Canadian soccer champions, 1903 German football championship and FC Nordsjælland. If anyone has time to assess them, it would be much appreciated. Thank you. - Cloudz 679 14:19, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Aren't the Knockout phase, Second group stage, Group stage, and Qualifying rounds rather excessive?-- Echetus Xe 20:51, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Just a heads-up, Rangers have announced an intention to enter administration. Mjroots ( talk) 17:49, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Would someone mind casting an eye over James Jennings? An editor insists on readding unsourced information and unlicened images, claiming that the details have come from the article's subject. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 18:08, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Could a sysop please move Jacopo Sala (footballer) to Jacopo Sala? The latter was salted back in 2010, but the player has since made his professional debut in Germany and the article was created with the disambiguator. Jared Preston ( talk) 18:43, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
I think there are a number of derby articles linked at this template which may not be notable. I've glanced at a few and they don't appear to demonstrate the derby has sufficient coverage, as opposed to just listing matches that have been played. Particular examples include M4 derby, Humber derby (check out the use of colour) and South Lancashire derby. The parent article at the top of template appears to contain many other such 'derbies'. Any other views? Eldumpo ( talk) 07:58, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I would suggest that it contains derbies from the top 2 divisions in each country (possible 3for England) and that new pages be created for all the derbies in each country eg- English football derbies and Scottish football derbies etc. Stevie fae Scotland ( talk) 12:13, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I'm also dubious of "circumstantial" derbies: ties between two clubs that have no obvious reason to be considered a derby other than the fact that they happened to be successful at the same time and have one or two high-profile matches. Specifically I'm thinking Chelsea-Leeds and Arsenal-Manchester United. — WFC— 15:28, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Hey guys the article Liverpool F.C. in European football has been at FAC for a while now and has only had reviews from two users. I would be extremely grateful if anyone could have a look at the article and give a few comments, cheers NapHit ( talk) 19:37, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello, I have just a quick question regarding how to change the way a template works. Here's the issue:
{{fbw|ASA}}
should link to the
American Samoa women's national football team, however when I put it in an article, it comes out like this
American Samoa, instead showing the men's national team. Can anyone tell me how to fix this problem? Thanks in advance, --
Spartan008 (
talk)
00:49, 15 February 2012 (UTC){{fbw|USA}}
works fine
United States.
U+003F
?
11:09, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
United States {{{age|}}} {{{mw|men's}}} national soccer team
" value for the {{{link alias-football}}} parametre. Maybe this would be the correct addition for the American Samoa template too. I'm not sure though... --
Theurgist (
talk)
12:41, 15 February 2012 (UTC)I don't know which names are correct, but for American Samoa and Samoa football team articles, the naming convention should really be standardized to either all use "national association" or just "national" in the titles so these templates can work for any instance without creating redirects. So that everyone knows, American Samoa uses "national association" for men's but not women's and Somoa uses "national association" for both. However, both use just "national" for the "under-nn" links in their navboxes (the pages aren't actually created yet). The simplest thing to do is move the American Samoa's women's article to use "national association" and update the redlinks in the navboxes, since that's just one page move. Then both countries' templates can use the |link alias-football=
parameter set up like some of the other countries' country data templates. Just need a consensus on the appropriate naming. —
Bility (
talk)
00:19, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
can someone check this article? someone is continuously trying to remove all the references and change it to another individual with a different birth date. I can't tell if any of these corrections are legit. Frietjes ( talk) 15:44, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
The years in the infobox for Fan Chun Yip don't add up. The infobox says that he played for Hong Kong from 1998 to 2008 and for Hong Kong U-23 from 2005 to 2006. That would mean that he played his first senior international 7 years before his national youth team debut. But since he was born in 1976, it would also mean that he made his U-23 debut at age 29. Which obviously is impossible. Most likely explanation is that the years should be reversed, that he played for Hong Kong U-23 from 1998 to 2008 and for Hong Kong in 2005 and 2006. But that is also impossible. Because it would mean that he played his last U-23 match in 2008, at age 32. Does anyone know the real dates? 83.80.170.157 ( talk) 18:47, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
Is this projects naming standard for international matches "Country A v Country B (Year)"? I ask because I came across an article at WP:GAN with that format and initially thought it was a mistake. It looked like it should be an article on some legal case. If this is the convention I would be surprised if it met WP:Title as it is not recognisable or unambiguous. It at least needs "match" added to it to turn it into a proper descriptive title. AIRcorn (talk) 13:01, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Back to the title. I realise other articles are titled this way, but that doesn't mean they aren't wrong as well and that is why I brought it up here. I don't think it meets WP:title, but this is just an outsider opinion and I won't be changing anymore titles or monitoring new ones. If there is a relatively recent previous discussion deciding on this format then fine, otherwise it may be worth doing so here. AIRcorn (talk) 21:33, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Okay put in a requested move at
Talk:Barbados v Grenada (1994)#Requested move to get some more opinions. On a side note, I don't know what your inclusion criteria is, but some (especially
England v Rest of the World (1963) look a bit suspect notability wise.
AIRcorn
(talk)
00:20, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
I started a post on this topic a little while back, whereby I queried the addition of representative appearances (e.g. at Billy Steel) to the infobox. There were a number of comments made, but the discussion ended without agreement. There are four main approaches that I can see:
It may be there are other solutions. Can you indicate your preference so we can take things forward. Whatever the outcome the template doc will need to be updated accordingly. Thanks. Eldumpo ( talk) 18:56, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
I will go for number 3 mainly because, like some other users pointed out, these matches are just friendlies and most of the time are just testimonials or charity games. Also if we add the representative caps it would make notable articles, like Gary Neville, Patrick Vieira, Robert Pirès etc have the wrong information as all three of those players were in the Paul Scholes testimonial which was a match between Manchester United and the New York Cosmos. These three players were on the Cosmos for that match. Does that mean we should add New York Cosmos 1 (0) to the infobox? I would hope not.-- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 11:29, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Option 4 is fine, it's clear enough from the text of each article what the term means. There is an awful lot of recentism in the argument that the inter-league internationals aren't important. Jmorrison230582 ( talk) 13:40, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
I have a weak preference for 3. While I do accept that these games were significant, IMO trying to put them in the infobox is more trouble than it's worth. If we are doing this, I think it should be options 1 or 2. I'm strongly opposed to 4: I don't think we should inaccurately label these matches as internationals in the name of simplicity (especially when it would be simpler not to have them in the infobox at all). — WFC— 23:48, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
Most people have provided reasoning for their choice, and there is a slight preference for removing over keeping them without changes, with a couple of people choosing the 'extra labelling' options. Given that these are to a degree a halfway position between keeping/removing, what do people think about choosing one of these as the way forward, in order to try and achieve overall consensus. If you haven't already provided your order of preference, which of the two labelling options do you prefer (Option 1 or 2), and do you agree that trying to progress with one of these is the best way forward, given the outcome. Eldumpo ( talk) 09:11, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
I was just wondering if a player who appeared in the qualifying rounds of the UEFA Cup (now Europa League) qualifies as notable. I had always assumed that it was a fully pro competition but there's nothing to confirm that on the article or here. Does anyone know? Big Dom 20:17, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
This chap - I've been watching the page because he was once on the Canaries' books... Sam Habergham. (Ref Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sam Habergham, which pre-dates his Tamworth days. -- Dweller ( talk) 23:40, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
I've skrewed up some page moves and need the help of admin to fix it. I came across Filip Filipov (defender), which is obviously the wrong disambigutor. Realising that the article at Filip Filipov was also a footballer, I moved it to Filip Filipov (footballer born 1988). It wasn't until after the move, that I realised the two articles are about the same person. I can someone please sort this out. Sorry about the mess. Sir Sputnik ( talk) 20:18, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
If you're participating or considering in participating in Wikimedians to the Games, you may be interested in attending the events below. They may provide an opportunity to get information to write a Wikinews article or to take pictures for points on Commons. If you're not participating, it would still be great to see people attending these events to take pictures for use on Wikipedia and Wikinews. If you do decide to attend, consider hosting a Wikimedia meetup at the end or the evening of the event, or even just letting HOPAU organisers know you are planning to attend. If you leave a message on my talk page, I can help you promote the meetup. :) If you need help with organising attendance because of transport cost issues or accessibility in terms of wanting press access, again please get in touch. :) -- LauraHale ( talk) 07:16, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
Standings tables with clubs have the default value of the text font size ( example), while standings tables with national teams usually specify a 90% value ( example). Why? -- Theurgist ( talk) 22:39, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
But what shall we do upon such an occasion?
|
|
There needn't be all six of them, one is fairly enough. -- Theurgist ( talk) 03:31, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
With the 90% value these tables look like this:
|
|
That makes a difference, although not much of one. Yet, it made me think that decreasing the font size hadn't been an inherently bad idea despite the inconsistencies it produced. -- Theurgist ( talk) 13:12, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
Prokingsley ( talk · contribs) is showing disturbingly similar editing behaviour (editing predominately Olympiakos F.C.-related articles) and also disturbingly similar aversion to policies and guidelines (he has recreated the recently nominated-for-deletion article Nikos Papadopoulos twice so far). Could someone set an eye on him, because I'm 80% sure this user is a sock? – Kosm 1 fent 20:56, 18 February 2012 (UTC)
Just a quick reminder that this list has been nominated for little over a month and could do with a consensus being reached. As it currently stands, the nomination has two supports as well as comments from two different reviewers which have been addressed. I would appreciate if anyone can give some input, preferably making a final decision. Thanks -- Lemonade51 ( talk) 15:56, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
The page Celtic 9-0 Aberdeen was moved so that it was an en-dash between the two scores rather than an ordinary dash. Is this correct, to me it doesn't look right because the dash it too big but I've never really paid to much attention to WP:ENDASH. Could someone who understands it please tell me if the page is titled correctly. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 16:26, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
How do we distinguish between club article history sections copy-pasted from club websites, and situations where a club has copy-pasted its own website history section from Wikipedia? I'm wondering because the Bracknell Town history section is very similar to the one on the official website and I'm not entirely sure which way round it is. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:03, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
I've removed the copyrighted material and replaced it was a proper history section now, plus stadium and colours sections. Squad was in need of a big update too. Del♉sion23 (talk) 00:29, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
A note for these in future: if you can definitively identify an off-wiki piece as being a copyvio from here, please be sure to flag our article with {{ backwardscopyvio}} so that future editors know that it's us being plagiarised and not the other way around. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:35, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Ex-footballer Bobby Bean is reported in my local paper to have died recently. He played professionally for Bexleyheath & Welling F.C. 1952-57, and had one trial match with West Ham Utd in the 1952-53 season. He had the option to sign professionally for Chelsea in 1953 but decided to continue his apprenticeship as a printers' engineer. From 1957 he played for Tunbridge Wells F. C.
As a Kent-related subject, I have a passing interest here. Does this player meet the notability requirements to sustain an article? Mjroots ( talk) 08:53, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Just to note that the Kent League, while not exactly a stepping stone to the Premier League, is still very much not a "Sunday league" (which refers in England to amateur football which isn't even on the non-League pyramid). And it's important not to be too strict regarding "fully professional leagues" when discussing players from before the sixties, or indeed later in many countries. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:33, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Greetings everyone, there's just an issue that I would like to bring to light here. Any footballers who have played solely in the First League of Montenegro can't get articles due to speedy deletion. Apparently, the justification for such speedy deletions is that "the league in which these players play isn't a fully-professional league." Now, this is on the basis of one news article from several years ago (back when sports were just being reformed after the nation's independence in 2006) that an "amateur league had been formed in 2006." Players who have only played a single minute in the first-tier Bosnian or Macedonian leagues can get their articles, so how is it that players who are having remarkable careers in the first-tier league of Montenegro can't get an article too? If professionalism is the sole barrier here, it is still not an excuse for keeping editors from making articles on players in the 1.CFL because players who have only played in USL Premier Development League get articles even though the league's article clearly states that it itself is not a fully-professional league. I think this should be brought up to attention. Thanks in advance guys. Balkanskiredneck ( talk) 03:06, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Hello everyone, I came across this article after User:The C of E talked about it on the Jock Stein page. I don't think its an appropriate article because firstly, it isn't even about the song (that word being used loosely, the lyrics are just shouting Big Jock Knew) and the word song isn't even in the title. It just seems to be a way for The C of E to try and get his views onto Wikipedia after he wasn't allowed to put them in the Jock Stein article. Also it seems to be lacking inherent notability on its own and the majority of sources don't seem to be mainly about that song. Even still its not really appropriate for a Wikipedia article. What course of action, if any, should be taken. I personally think it should be AfD'd but I could be completely wrong. Thanks. Adam4267 ( talk) 13:22, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
There are lots of unpleasant football songs. Occasionally they get mentioned briefly or alluded to in mainstream media. Very few of them are notable. To me the article reads like a compendium of minor media mentions tied together with synthesis. At most, a redirect (not merge) to Old Firm is warranted. Oldelpaso ( talk) 18:00, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
Ideally what we want here is a separate article for the Torbett incident. It makes no sense to have details on the incident (which certainly is notable) spread out on three separate articles about Celtic Boys Club, Stein and the song. Once such an article is created, both the song and Torbett's name should be redirected to it. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:29, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Following all the news about the signs being removed at St James' Park, Leaky caldron ( talk · contribs) changed the infobox on Newcastle United F.C. to list the stadium as Sports Direct Arena. I reverted and noted consensus on using non-sponsored names. They then simply removed the name of the stadium from the infobox. I reverted again, was threatened with being reported, and was reverted (on the faulty premise of BRD). I have asked them to bring the issue here to discuss, but the response was to label WP:FOOTY as a "obscure little workshop page"/"little old group of editors". Can someone else intervene, as currently the infobox is missing a stadium name! Thanks, Number 5 7 11:14, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
The club website calls it "formerly SJP", the media reports it as no longer SJP, the official league website currently calls it something else but WP has to be held hostage to SJP by a few zealots who care more for history than reliably sourced fact. You couldn't make it up. Leaky Caldron 13:16, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
The stadium is officially the Sports Direct Arena, the rights were bought by Sports Direct and all signage with the former name of St James' removed. Stop referring to it by its old name as it has been rebranded. You might want to place the address of the Sports Direct Arena as St James' Park but the stadium name has changed. Peoples personal views should not be allowed to continue giving out misinformation, this is Wikipedia not a fans site. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.214.130.113 ( talk) 15:54, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
Just to confirm here: is everyone happy that this truly lame dispute has been settled? That the page will remain at the poorly-apostrophised St James' Park until such point as there's reason to believe the common name has changed, but that the infobox is headed with the "official" name? Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 16:20, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
I've said nothing about how the stadium is to be referred in random articles. I specifically asked if the situation with the stadium article itself, and the infobox therein, was acceptable and you objected. For what it's worth, though, use of the common name is almost always more appropriate than use of the "official" name in random articles because the additional recognisability helps with content clarity. In the Newcastle article a simple compromise would be to list both in the infobox. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 08:11, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
TBH, I think it's quite clear there is an impasse here. Do we need a poll on whether the consensus on stadium names (article and infobox) is still valid? Number 5 7 16:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Ideally I'd like to see the original names kept but we have to follow whatever the reliable sources are showing, but not just the position of the club themselves. However, this thread is discussing a slightly strange argument in that the infobox should change and not the article, whereas I think they should be the same. Eldumpo ( talk) 17:45, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I've moved this to Talk:Newcastle United F.C.#Stadium name RFC as I think it's fairly clear this discussion is going nowhere. Number 5 7 19:11, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I created an article about the CAF tournament determining the African qualifiers to the U17 FIFA world cup, but have now redirected as i became aware it already existed: African U-17 Cup of Nations for Women. That name sounds strange, should it be moved to African U-17 Women's Cup of Nations? There also exist two articles for the 2010 tournament 2010 African U-17 Women's Championship, 2010 African U-17 Cup of Nations for Women with the first the better article. So should we move the main article and the the individual tournament, redirecting all the others? - Koppapa ( talk) 16:00, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
Some of the player articles are turning into commentaries that note every goal a player scores because some editors don't know the difference between an encyclopedia and Match of the Day. The project may wish to keep an eye on this. Britmax ( talk) 20:19, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
This has always happened: we can do little to prevent recentism of this sort, and so long as it gains us content and new editors it should probably be tolerated. As time passes, the articles in question will hopefully be rewritten with better prose. The only time to really worry about it is when the content in question is not written in a neutral style and thus is affecting more than just the readability of the article. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) ( talk) 10:55, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I dare say this question has been asked before but does anyone know if there is a policy regarding how a players name should appear in a teams squad template. i.e should Robin van Persie appear as van Persie or as it apppears on his shirt v. Persie. Any help gratefully received. Quentin X ( talk) 20:14, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
User:MYS77 and another one of his creations, i am 99,999999% sure this chap as not played in higher than Tercera División! Could someone help me out please? -- Vasco Amaral ( talk) 21:36, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
Ahmed Khalil (Emirati footballer) does not appear to require disambiguation as far as I can see. Could an admin please move it back over the redirect? -- Jameboy ( talk) 23:51, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
An unregistered user insists that Healy being photographed with a UDA loyalist and thus being reported in the Sun means that he has "sparked outrage". The Sun seems to be the only newspaper to have reported this. Should it be reported in the article or should it be removed? Approaching the 3 revert rule here.-- Echetus Xe 00:05, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi everyone. I need some admin help. The thing is that I wanted to move Igor Kojić (footballer) to simple Igor Kojić, as there is no need for the disambiguation factor, however I receved a message saying:
You cannot move a page to this location, because the new title has been protected from creation
I never saw that message in my years long wiki history, but I guess someone blocked that article creation? Anyway, not sure if it was intended to be because of this article, so the guys found a way to make using the disambiguating factor (footballer), however the guy passes notability as he played in Serbian top league (1 match :) so it can have an article. Although I have been notecing this article from time to time for one specific reason: the autors seem to have a real difficulty to understand that WP is not their mean to promote the player, so they really insist to add him a horrible propagandistic crap about him being brilliant, etc. I removed that, and left the sourced info, with a good-will unsourced tag for one particular unsourced claim. But the article could be moved to a simple title, for a start. FkpCascais ( talk) 06:29, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi, I recently amended the competition titles in the honours sections of a few Barcelona players recently (e.g. Éric Abidal). For instance, I unpiped [[La Liga|Spanish League]] to just [[La Liga]]. These were later reverted by User:Raulseixas with no explanation given. My amendments are correct though, right? It seems unnecessary and a little condescending to our readers to use generic names for competitions rather than list what they're actually called. Not to mention that it's factually inaccurate as there's no such thing as the Spanish League; it's name is La Liga. And by this logic, what should lower tiers be referred to as? "Spanish League 2"? "Spanish 2nd League"? It just seems silly to me to use these generic, fictional titles rather than the actual titles. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 10:43, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
The article was going through AfD when it was eventually speedy deleted under CSD G5. However, GM1995 ( talk · contribs) has re-created it. Does it qualify for CSD G4, or it has to be nominated for deletion all over again? Cheers. – Kosm 1 fent 13:42, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
When was the European Cup EVER known as the "European Champions' Cup", except perhaps in translation from some European language other than English?! This is the kind of fifth-hand cobbled-together Wikipedia information that gives fifth-hand cobbled-together Wikipedia information a deservedly bad name! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.100.217.69 ( talk) 00:12, 22 February 2012 (UTC)
Not sure about where the cut-off point is for notability of Canadian association football teams, so I'm wondering, is Champlain Cavaliers Men's Soccer team notable? Del♉sion23 (talk) 19:24, 22 February 2012 (UTC)
Umbro have released a new home kit with the three leopards(! ;) [23]) all in red. Does the logo in the infobox on the England national football team now need to be updated? If so, I have created the file:
file:England_national_football_team_crest_(2012).svg
TheBigJagielka ( talk) 00:15, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I know this has been done before, but it remains an issue. Say there is a Brazilian/Spanish/Portuguese player - his article is at 'John Smith', but he is known as 'Johnny'. What should his defaultsort be? I am firmly in the 'surname, firstname' camp... Giant Snowman 09:31, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
User:Jun19, other than the fact he talks to no one and moves pages just like that, is having a totally different approach: Portuguese players are sillily referred to in TV broadcasts with TWO names (i'm Portuguese, so no racism there!), ALWAYS, but Adrien Silva is known as "Silva" (keyword "S"), João Moutinho is known as "Moutinho" (keyword "M"), etc, etc. The M.O. for Brazilian footballers has to be the same, so (example) Fábio Bahia has to be sorted under "B", not "F", as he's not known solely as "Fábio" (some are indeed known by their first name, as Raí or Romário).
Attentively - -- Vasco Amaral ( talk) 09:40, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Please see the explanation of mine at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football/Archive_62#Portuguese_footballers.27_names_.2F_Introductions, most preciselly (I copy/pasted the most important part):
Portuguese players are known by either one of the following ways:
I must say that I think that people with common surnames (Costa, Sousa, Silva, Gomes, Lopes, Pinto, etc.) usually because of disambiguation reasons leave their first name in their commoname, while others like Luis Figo don´t need it, as "Figo" is not a common surname, thus easily recognisable simply as Figo. That is why is common to see in line-ups, exemple: 6 - Paulo Sousa, 7 - Figo, 8 - Rui Cosa, 9 - João Pinto, 10 - Pauleta, 11 - Capucho.
What I really concluded is that Portuguese (including most places using Portuguese as mother tongue, like Brazil) players don´t really have a rule for their names, and they often choose one while still young, which will help them to be recognisable, and usually keep it troughout their careers, weather being real name, nickname, or whatever. FkpCascais ( talk) 04:15, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Someone up for some detective work? Someone added a sourced result to the then unknown third place play-off of the 1983 tournament by finding a web-archive of an english language Singaporan based newspaper archove from 1983. With that start i searched the previous days for more results. I improved the article from this to that but there are some inconsistencies. Day 2 reports that feature a table don't really add up for match-day one when subtracting the day 2 results. Also the 5th matchday results/pairings are unclear to me. There are some clues given in the cited sources like "singapore tied 3rd place after day 4" and so on. I started a table on the articles talkpage. What really would help would be finding a report about matchday 1 (which should have appeared on 11th april) or the last matchday. (although i believe when the paper talks about semi-finals the effectively mean the 5th matchday). If anyone finds a clue please replay on talkpage of article. :) RSSSF is no help for that year btw. - Koppapa ( talk) 11:55, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Just stalking a talk page and saw that Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Competitions was being quoted as the way a football competition article "must be styled". Now I looked at the style guide and, frankly, it's years out of date. Do we want to update it in line with MOS and ACCESS etc or should we just remove the "guide" altogether? The Rambling Man ( talk) 14:00, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
I'd never suggest using a GA. We have a couple of hundred or so FAs and FLs, and the most recent ones would be decent frameworks for this kind of thing, don't you think? I see no good reason to do otherwise, but I'm happy to hear suggestions. The Rambling Man ( talk) 20:56, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi, MarkMysoe ( talk · contribs) has added cup icons to football players' honours sections like this. I've removed them with regard to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Archive 18#Euro cup icons. The discussion was in 2008. Has consensus changed in the meantime and do we want to have these icons now in the articles? -- Jaellee ( talk) 18:39, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Discuss. The Rambling Man ( talk) 19:51, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Okeydokey, I find it to be an unlikely notable intersection of vaguely notable events (i.e. non-league, fifth round, FA Cup, 1945). I'll prod it and see how it goes. The Rambling Man ( talk) 21:06, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Malmö FF will be TFA today the 24th of February. I'm the main contributor of the article, however, as a European I won't be able to keep an eye on it for the next eight hours so I would appreciate if people kept their eyes open for vandalism and good faith edits. Thanks! -- Reckless182 (talk) 23:33, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Could anyone confirm that Adrian Schedlinski played one game for OFI Crete in the 2008–09 Superleague Greece as per this link? The German Wikipedia also sources his time at PFC Lokomotiv Plovdiv to transfermarkt. I have a feeling this isn't quite right... Jared Preston ( talk) 01:09, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
OK, Transfermarkt has many mistakes, but has millions of stats... "Anyone can edit it" is just not trouth. Anyone can register, but please try to submit a wrong info and come back to me saying they accepted it, ok?
-Transfermarkt asks you for a source, and then the change is submited to an website admin who checks the source before inserting the facts to the page, a process that usually takes a day or two. The changes are NOT done directly as here on WP, please GiantSnowman stop giving that phalse idea. I am not saying that it is reliable, but lets not exagerate the other way around. FkpCascais ( talk) 23:26, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Come on GS, I explained this already, Transfermarkt is not a WP:RS, but it has as much mistakes as all other similar websites like Playerhistory, NFT, Weltfussball, Footballdatabase, etc. I only dare to say that Soccerway is slightly better, but in comparison, it has only about 1/8th of total ammount of info Transfermarkt has. As one German editor once said, it is quite reliable for German football, and as you move further away from Germany it becomes less and less accurate... FkpCascais ( talk) 23:36, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Domestic football cup articles all have a different style in depicting their tournament matches. As we all know, most football federations have a single elimination policy for their domestic cups. It's simple, the losing club is eliminated. Here, I list a few examples from current season. All are okay in their own terms, but overall they look like a hairy mess. Maybe we could work on a comprehensive WP:MOS for domestic football cup articles.
So, what are your thoughts? — Ekin( talk· @) 09:38, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
I was on a forum today and someone asked me if I could put a picture of Amrinder Singh on his page. I said okay and give me the picture. He told me that his picture was on facebook in one of his albums, in that album there is a picture of him in his jersey and that because nothing on Facebook is copyright (supposedly, I am not sure about that) that I can just us that picture on wikipedia freely. I said I would think about it and now I am here. So, are we even allowed to use pictures of footballers from there facebook pages without there consent. I am pretty sure its a no but just to make sure.-- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 18:37, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Hi guys, I'm sure some of you will have heard of James Forrest (footballer born 1991) the footballer at Celtic. I think his page should be at what is currently the disambiguation page. He is IMO by far the most notable of all the forrests listed on the page and actually the only one who is called James Forrest. I'm not entirely sure on the protocol, does this need an RM or can it just be moved. Cheers. Adam4267 ( talk) 20:02, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
I thought displaying honours in the infobox was only reserved for competitions that actually distribute medals such as the Summer Olympics. User:MarkMysoe has added an honours section in the infobox of André Ayew, but it lists international and domestic competitions. I reverted because I remember this being brought up before and, subsequently rejected, but the user reverted me citing Alessandro Del Piero's infobox, which has honours in his infobox. The honours have also been displayed in the infobox for over a year. — JS Rant Away 03:09, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
I'm just wondering, does anyone here know with which program or editor I can create a lineup image such as File:PAR-NZL 2010-06-24.svg? I can't seem to find any information of how they were created on images such as that one. JaumeBG ( talk) 06:32, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
The issue in general is rather minor, but nevertheless – I recently noticed that Scandinavian league season articles (e.g., 2012 Norwegian Premier League, 2012 Allsvenskan, 2012 Veikkausliiga) began to include collapsible boxes à la Template:2012 in Norwegian football below the standard infobox, partially although a navbox with the same content had already been placed within the stack at the bottom of the pages. Both navbox styles are valid in WP:MOS terms, nevertheless two nearly identical boxes seem to be one too many.
So... is there a preference regarding the location (top of article vs bottom stack) and the style (collapsible box vs standard navbox) of these boxes within the project? -- Soccer-holic I hear voices in my head... 14:19, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
Can we please put the England national football team on protection. The page is consistently vandalized and many IPs refuse to use the talk page. Until the issue of the crest is over I think we should semi-protect the page. -- Arsenalkid700 ( talk) 07:35, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
Another Spanish player-related query. I changed the season ranges displayed in a number of Barcelona players' career statistics from 1999–00 to 1999–2000 in order to reflect what the wikilinked articles are titled (e.g. 1999–2000 Segunda División B is used, rather than 1999–00 Segunda División B). However, I have been reverted on all counts by User:Raulseixas, with no explanation given as to why. So I just wanted to raise this here and make sure the amendments I made are correct. Cheers, Mattythewhite ( talk) 20:25, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Last summer some user redirected a long existing article into a new page, thus making it loose its edit history. The page is Milan Stojanoski, and the edit history is at Milan Stojanovski which is now a redirect. FkpCascais ( talk) 06:19, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
Since we didn't spent too much attention to User:Zombie433 so that his vandalism in footy biographies grew to unimaginable dimensions I'm forced to report here User:MarkMysoe who is adding to Ghanian footabllers articles fictious youth years, stats and info unsupported by sources, just like User:Zombie433 did. His trademark is to add his own opinions or other info about a player using "ghost" sources that not support the claims. I already reported there his actions in Kevin-Prince Boateng article and User:Basalisk cleaned a lot his POVish. After that he continues to do the same thing like for example in Kevin Mensah. By the way please look how high is the level of his arrogance, he added later another not supported claim, "He usually plays the ball with his right foot but is actually left-footed" based on "Preferred foot: Right/Left" from source, he removed not supported claim in next edit, but look at the summary "so what not supported in the source?" - what a cheek! Go now to his recent edits: Masahudu Alhassan, he added a source which says "...he signed for then Serie B side Rimini. He left after one season to join Genoa", he include this info and by the way added contradictory info that he played 4 years for Rimini as well as fictious years for Prampram Mighty Royals [25]. The same he did in Rashid Sumaila with some POVish and a lot of the same things in Richard Mpong. Please look also into Emmanuel Baffour, this is common example how he adds his own opinion using random sources that not support a claim. As you can see we need to precisely look at his edits, even if he adds references often these are references without cover.-- Oleola ( talk) 16:16, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
The "omniscient one" has struck again............. lol!!!! Banana Fingers ( talk) 16:13, 2 March 2012 (UTC)