Main | Criteria | Instructions | Nominations | July Backlog Drive | Mentorship | Discussion | Reassessment | Report |
This is the discussion page for good article nominations (GAN) and the good articles process in general. To ask a question or start a discussion about the good article nomination process, click the Add topic link above. Please check and see if your question may already be answered; click the link to the Frequently asked questions below or search the Archives below. If you are here to discuss concerns with a specific review, please consider discussing things with the reviewer first before posting here.
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GA: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 Reassessment: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 Nominations/Instructions: 1 Search archives |
This page has archives. Sections older than 7 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III. |
Grouping these here, if no further comments or consensus is reached I plan to implement these at the end of the month, before the backlog drive starts. CMD ( talk) 01:02, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Good articles/Video games is one of two long lv2 categories with no lv3 split (the other is Lang & Lit), and one that feels it has a very obvious split: between the Video Games (and series) themselves, and everything else (provisionally I propose "Context and content"). Regarding the lower splits, the video games are currently divided into five-year blocks, some of which are getting very large. There's no clean split there, but if there is a desire to maintain the chronological split it could transition into two-year chunks for at least the 21st century, imitating Music. The other large sections is "Video game characters", currently at 200. This seems a simple candidate from pulling out series, with the two obvious candidates being Pokémon (26) and Final Fantasy (at least 34, I think, it's a complicated series). 13:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC) CMD ( talk) 13:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
In Wikipedia:Good articles/Engineering and technology#Transport, we have 208 articles classified under "rail transport" and a whopping 243 articles under "Rail bridges, tunnels, and stations: United States". I think we should discuss breaking these into subcategories. Some ideas I have for breaking down the general rail transport category are "rail lines", "rail accidents and incidents", "rail companies", and "rapid transit/tram systems". Rail bridges, tunnels, and stations: United States could be divided into rapid transit stations and heavy rail stations, while we could add a "bridges, tunnels, and facilities" section to hold pretty much everything else, including freight facilities (I think the only one is Northup Avenue Yard, my nomination). Trainsandotherthings ( talk) 22:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
I was looking over the GAN's in the Biology and medicine category and noticed that 11 of these were started by Wolverine XI, all within the span of five days (June 10th through 15th). I thought to bring this up here because I'm concerned that the quality of these reviews will suffer from the quantity that this user has taken on, which I think is more than evident in the fact that 8 of them haven't even been started yet. Some of these reviews have received no comments for two whole weeks since their inception.
While I commend their ambition, I don't think this practise is conducive to the standard of quality that the Good Article system should uphold. Perhaps something can be done about it? The Morrison Man ( talk) 13:54, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
There are some long-outstanding review pages that don't have any real activity on them at all. Normally, another editor will come in and check up on them, and eventually they get CSD'd when there's no response from the reviewer. Here is one where Thebiguglyalien just came through to do just that. But in the interests of not dragging out this procedure unnecessarily, could we perhaps institute a general guideline for when we should simply nominate these for CSD without further discussion? How about one month? To be clear, I'm talking only about reviews that have not been started at all, beyond the usual "I'll take this review" opening comment. -- asilvering ( talk) 00:47, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
We are 3 days within the 7 days to contest an abrupt GA delist, so I am requesting additional editors and assistance today to resolve this delist while I simultaneously try to persuade the delisting editor to reverse their action. Another editor and I were in the middle of an appropriate GAR of the Florida State University main article. The cooperating editor and I were waiting for a subject matter expert to weigh into non-free materials assessment. All other matters were style and minor. A third editor enters and without establishing collaboration or consenus and abrupting delists the article, which has had GA status for years. Kindly help me resolve this matter. Sirberus ( talk) 17:32, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
Please see User_talk:TheNuggeteer#GA_on_Philippines_at_the_1924_Summer_Olympics, and also Talk:Jorge Choquetarqui, where I followed a suggestion by User:750h+ and undid the status change. Wait--I see this is part of a contest. Your attention is appreciated. Drmies ( talk) 12:11, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi. I did my first review and closed it as passed without realizing that I needed an experienced reviewer to check it. So, could anyone take a look? Thanks. '''[[ User:CanonNi]]''' ( talk • contribs) 12:02, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
We've had multiple discussions about whether nominations from editors with no GAs deserve to be reviewed earlier than other nominations, but I'd like to make a different case: reviewing nominations from these editors as soon as possible is beneficial for GAN.
I've done a lot of first-time-nominator reviewing, and my observations would include:
The two most important observations, though, are:
I think first-time nominators are the pool from which we should be hoping to draw the innumerable reviewers we need to keep GAN going. If you review first-time nominators, you will see more than your share of editors who (currently) lack the skills to put a GA-quality article together, but you'll also be helping to attract new reviewers, more effectively than any other method I can think of. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 22:17, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi! I want to bring to notice that the review done for Taj Mahal seems to be done by a reviewer in a haste with the review not done as per all the GA criteria.
Background: The article was a GA for many years (2006-2021) and it was de-listed. The article has gone through multiple reviews (eight GA/FA/peer reviews/reassessments to be precise), with three previous assessments retaining it as a GA. The concerns raised in the previous review where it was de-listed (gallery, citation tags, expansion of certain sections), have been fairly addressed. The article is fairly expansive, was a GA and has gone through improvements to address the issues.
In the current review, the reviewer seems to have taken up a few random citations and has found contentious reasons (e.g. "It is not available in Google Books", "it is rather vague", "Author's meaning is different") for discrediting them, quickly failing the GA on the same. Ironically, some of these sources discredited are reliable, verifiable, and have been there for years through all these reviews.
As an editor, I would have been happy to provide clarifications if this was discussed and would work on improving the article if constructive comments have been provided. As comments provided previously have been addressed adequately, the current review adds little value as to what needs to be done. Would request clarity on the below points:
Book citations have been rejected simply because it is not accessible on Google Books or it requires paid access. As per WP:CITEHOW and WP:RS, onus is on providing the required details and not that the book should be available for free or in Google books, I presume. This is of concern as majority sources quoted here are journal sources with paid access and books. There has been no concern raised on this over the years through multiple assessments as well. I request for clarity on verifiability of books not accessible through Google Books and paid journals with respect to the GA.
While there are quick criteria for the failure of GA, in my opinion, the review has not done justice to the article and certainly is not a case for quick failure. Would request further comments or second opinion on this as to how to proceed. Thanks!
Tagging co-nominators as well: The Herald and DreamRimmer.
Magentic Manifestations ( talk) 05:31, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi, as reviewer I've provided answers to the points raised by Magentic Manifestations at Talk:Taj Mahal/GA1#Response to Magentic Manifestations. I stand by my decision to quick-fail the article because the sample of six spot-checks clearly indicate the failure of citations to directly support material, as required by WP:V. I therefore consider the article to be, per WP:GAFAIL, a long way from meeting the requirements of criteria#2, which includes WP:V. The spot-checks have also revealed breaches of WP:NOR and WP:NPOV. Happy to discuss further. PearlyGigs ( talk) 13:40, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
@ CMD, Thanks for giving clarity on the points. I do agree that there are clarifications needed + improvements that can be made and I am happy to do it. My whole point was that this could have been resolved through a simple discussion if the reviewer was willing to do it in the first place and it certainly did not satisfy the criteria for a quick fail (hence my request for a comprehensive review!).
@ AirshipJungleman29, I will sort these out and re-nominate it for a proper review.
The user PearlyGigs is engaging in unnecessary and irrelevant discussions/mudslinging on the GA page, bringing out my past reviews/edits. This does not reek of someone who wants to engage on a constructive conversation.
@ PearlyGigs A discussion is what you ought to have done before. Request you to stop engaging in discussion not related to the subject at hand and not to go on a WP:Witch hunt, which is against the basic rule of civility. Keep the discussion to the relevant subject at hand. Magentic Manifestations ( talk) 16:06, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
WP:DISENGAGE is one of the site's wiser policies. If anyone who reads this discussion should wish to ask me anything, or offer any useful advice, please go to my talk page. Thanks. PearlyGigs ( talk) 09:24, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
Shouldn't it be a Featured list? I think it's still good shape-wise; I don't keep up with this show, so I don't know if it's up-to-date. Spinixster (trout me!) 10:14, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
I went and did a part of a GA assessment of Aoi Koga earlier today, can someone used to the GA process check if it is good? ABG ( Talk/Report any mistakes here) 05:47, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
We're now half way through the year 2024, but there are still over a dozen nominations from 2023 that never got reviewed. If you're not sure what to work on, consider reviewing one of these:
Thebiguglyalien ( talk) 01:29, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
The original review for 2022 City of Edinburgh Council election was messed up by a now blocked editor. The nomination was passed earlier today but, when updating this page, the bot hasn't recorded it as my 12th GA. Is there a way to correct that? Stevie fae Scotland ( talk) 19:35, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Main | Criteria | Instructions | Nominations | July Backlog Drive | Mentorship | Discussion | Reassessment | Report |
This is the discussion page for good article nominations (GAN) and the good articles process in general. To ask a question or start a discussion about the good article nomination process, click the Add topic link above. Please check and see if your question may already be answered; click the link to the Frequently asked questions below or search the Archives below. If you are here to discuss concerns with a specific review, please consider discussing things with the reviewer first before posting here.
See the Frequently asked questions (FAQ) |
To help centralise discussions and keep related topics together, several other GA talk pages redirect here. |
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 31, 32 |
GA: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 Reassessment: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 Nominations/Instructions: 1 Search archives |
This page has archives. Sections older than 7 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III. |
Grouping these here, if no further comments or consensus is reached I plan to implement these at the end of the month, before the backlog drive starts. CMD ( talk) 01:02, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Good articles/Video games is one of two long lv2 categories with no lv3 split (the other is Lang & Lit), and one that feels it has a very obvious split: between the Video Games (and series) themselves, and everything else (provisionally I propose "Context and content"). Regarding the lower splits, the video games are currently divided into five-year blocks, some of which are getting very large. There's no clean split there, but if there is a desire to maintain the chronological split it could transition into two-year chunks for at least the 21st century, imitating Music. The other large sections is "Video game characters", currently at 200. This seems a simple candidate from pulling out series, with the two obvious candidates being Pokémon (26) and Final Fantasy (at least 34, I think, it's a complicated series). 13:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC) CMD ( talk) 13:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
In Wikipedia:Good articles/Engineering and technology#Transport, we have 208 articles classified under "rail transport" and a whopping 243 articles under "Rail bridges, tunnels, and stations: United States". I think we should discuss breaking these into subcategories. Some ideas I have for breaking down the general rail transport category are "rail lines", "rail accidents and incidents", "rail companies", and "rapid transit/tram systems". Rail bridges, tunnels, and stations: United States could be divided into rapid transit stations and heavy rail stations, while we could add a "bridges, tunnels, and facilities" section to hold pretty much everything else, including freight facilities (I think the only one is Northup Avenue Yard, my nomination). Trainsandotherthings ( talk) 22:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
I was looking over the GAN's in the Biology and medicine category and noticed that 11 of these were started by Wolverine XI, all within the span of five days (June 10th through 15th). I thought to bring this up here because I'm concerned that the quality of these reviews will suffer from the quantity that this user has taken on, which I think is more than evident in the fact that 8 of them haven't even been started yet. Some of these reviews have received no comments for two whole weeks since their inception.
While I commend their ambition, I don't think this practise is conducive to the standard of quality that the Good Article system should uphold. Perhaps something can be done about it? The Morrison Man ( talk) 13:54, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
There are some long-outstanding review pages that don't have any real activity on them at all. Normally, another editor will come in and check up on them, and eventually they get CSD'd when there's no response from the reviewer. Here is one where Thebiguglyalien just came through to do just that. But in the interests of not dragging out this procedure unnecessarily, could we perhaps institute a general guideline for when we should simply nominate these for CSD without further discussion? How about one month? To be clear, I'm talking only about reviews that have not been started at all, beyond the usual "I'll take this review" opening comment. -- asilvering ( talk) 00:47, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
We are 3 days within the 7 days to contest an abrupt GA delist, so I am requesting additional editors and assistance today to resolve this delist while I simultaneously try to persuade the delisting editor to reverse their action. Another editor and I were in the middle of an appropriate GAR of the Florida State University main article. The cooperating editor and I were waiting for a subject matter expert to weigh into non-free materials assessment. All other matters were style and minor. A third editor enters and without establishing collaboration or consenus and abrupting delists the article, which has had GA status for years. Kindly help me resolve this matter. Sirberus ( talk) 17:32, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
Please see User_talk:TheNuggeteer#GA_on_Philippines_at_the_1924_Summer_Olympics, and also Talk:Jorge Choquetarqui, where I followed a suggestion by User:750h+ and undid the status change. Wait--I see this is part of a contest. Your attention is appreciated. Drmies ( talk) 12:11, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi. I did my first review and closed it as passed without realizing that I needed an experienced reviewer to check it. So, could anyone take a look? Thanks. '''[[ User:CanonNi]]''' ( talk • contribs) 12:02, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
We've had multiple discussions about whether nominations from editors with no GAs deserve to be reviewed earlier than other nominations, but I'd like to make a different case: reviewing nominations from these editors as soon as possible is beneficial for GAN.
I've done a lot of first-time-nominator reviewing, and my observations would include:
The two most important observations, though, are:
I think first-time nominators are the pool from which we should be hoping to draw the innumerable reviewers we need to keep GAN going. If you review first-time nominators, you will see more than your share of editors who (currently) lack the skills to put a GA-quality article together, but you'll also be helping to attract new reviewers, more effectively than any other method I can think of. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 22:17, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi! I want to bring to notice that the review done for Taj Mahal seems to be done by a reviewer in a haste with the review not done as per all the GA criteria.
Background: The article was a GA for many years (2006-2021) and it was de-listed. The article has gone through multiple reviews (eight GA/FA/peer reviews/reassessments to be precise), with three previous assessments retaining it as a GA. The concerns raised in the previous review where it was de-listed (gallery, citation tags, expansion of certain sections), have been fairly addressed. The article is fairly expansive, was a GA and has gone through improvements to address the issues.
In the current review, the reviewer seems to have taken up a few random citations and has found contentious reasons (e.g. "It is not available in Google Books", "it is rather vague", "Author's meaning is different") for discrediting them, quickly failing the GA on the same. Ironically, some of these sources discredited are reliable, verifiable, and have been there for years through all these reviews.
As an editor, I would have been happy to provide clarifications if this was discussed and would work on improving the article if constructive comments have been provided. As comments provided previously have been addressed adequately, the current review adds little value as to what needs to be done. Would request clarity on the below points:
Book citations have been rejected simply because it is not accessible on Google Books or it requires paid access. As per WP:CITEHOW and WP:RS, onus is on providing the required details and not that the book should be available for free or in Google books, I presume. This is of concern as majority sources quoted here are journal sources with paid access and books. There has been no concern raised on this over the years through multiple assessments as well. I request for clarity on verifiability of books not accessible through Google Books and paid journals with respect to the GA.
While there are quick criteria for the failure of GA, in my opinion, the review has not done justice to the article and certainly is not a case for quick failure. Would request further comments or second opinion on this as to how to proceed. Thanks!
Tagging co-nominators as well: The Herald and DreamRimmer.
Magentic Manifestations ( talk) 05:31, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Hi, as reviewer I've provided answers to the points raised by Magentic Manifestations at Talk:Taj Mahal/GA1#Response to Magentic Manifestations. I stand by my decision to quick-fail the article because the sample of six spot-checks clearly indicate the failure of citations to directly support material, as required by WP:V. I therefore consider the article to be, per WP:GAFAIL, a long way from meeting the requirements of criteria#2, which includes WP:V. The spot-checks have also revealed breaches of WP:NOR and WP:NPOV. Happy to discuss further. PearlyGigs ( talk) 13:40, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
@ CMD, Thanks for giving clarity on the points. I do agree that there are clarifications needed + improvements that can be made and I am happy to do it. My whole point was that this could have been resolved through a simple discussion if the reviewer was willing to do it in the first place and it certainly did not satisfy the criteria for a quick fail (hence my request for a comprehensive review!).
@ AirshipJungleman29, I will sort these out and re-nominate it for a proper review.
The user PearlyGigs is engaging in unnecessary and irrelevant discussions/mudslinging on the GA page, bringing out my past reviews/edits. This does not reek of someone who wants to engage on a constructive conversation.
@ PearlyGigs A discussion is what you ought to have done before. Request you to stop engaging in discussion not related to the subject at hand and not to go on a WP:Witch hunt, which is against the basic rule of civility. Keep the discussion to the relevant subject at hand. Magentic Manifestations ( talk) 16:06, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
WP:DISENGAGE is one of the site's wiser policies. If anyone who reads this discussion should wish to ask me anything, or offer any useful advice, please go to my talk page. Thanks. PearlyGigs ( talk) 09:24, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
Shouldn't it be a Featured list? I think it's still good shape-wise; I don't keep up with this show, so I don't know if it's up-to-date. Spinixster (trout me!) 10:14, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
I went and did a part of a GA assessment of Aoi Koga earlier today, can someone used to the GA process check if it is good? ABG ( Talk/Report any mistakes here) 05:47, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
We're now half way through the year 2024, but there are still over a dozen nominations from 2023 that never got reviewed. If you're not sure what to work on, consider reviewing one of these:
Thebiguglyalien ( talk) 01:29, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
The original review for 2022 City of Edinburgh Council election was messed up by a now blocked editor. The nomination was passed earlier today but, when updating this page, the bot hasn't recorded it as my 12th GA. Is there a way to correct that? Stevie fae Scotland ( talk) 19:35, 6 July 2024 (UTC)