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As suggested by Gnangarra about a month ago, I have started putting GAs into subcategories, by using templates.
I also divided "Places" in the Geography section between Eastern hemisphere and Western hemisphere. Maurreen 01:06, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi Maurreen,
I don't support this move. It breaks the automatic listing of good articles. This could be fixed, but before we make the change it would be helpful to know the answers to the following questions:
Editing the new templates is also very difficult because one must edit each and every new template.
Cedars 08:43, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. About the subcategories and templates, I don't understand what Cedars means by "It breaks the automatic listing of good articles." In answer to the questions:
FYI - I created a discussion on the FA Talk about making their page look similar to the GA page. I think this page looks great and would like to duplicate it over there for uniformity and such. Your thought might be helpful in that discussion as many seem to dislike the collapsible menus and sub-categories. Since you've been working with both for a while, I thought your insight would be valuable. Thanks Morphh 20:11, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
In response to dicussions on the FA talk page here and on the GA talk page here. As well as the discussion on this page together with other discussion taking place on the FA and GA talk pages and talk pages of associated articles. I propose that this page Standardised formats for FA and GA become the only forum where consensus be developed for standard page and template formats for both WP:FA and WP:GA.
Featured articles and featured lists make available information on when the items were promoted so people can compare with the approved version and see whether it has deteriorated. This is done both with logs and through Template:Featured and Template:FL. I think it would be good to also be able to easily find out when GAs were approved. Maurreen 06:59, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
Thank you. Maurreen 14:09, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
To indicate the reviewed version of a
Good Article, use {{GA|oldid=nnnnnn}}
on the talk page (replacing nnnnn with the id number of the reviewed version) rather than just {{GA}}
.
Maurreen
22:25, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
Just to let you know, the GA template (which adds a star to the corner of articles like the FA system), which was deleted a few months ago before the project was established, has come up for Deletion Review, should you want to support or oppose it's re-creation. --GW_Simulations |User Page | Talk | Contribs | E-mail 11:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
For the record, what this means is that there actually is a consensus against adding a star or another mark to the corner of good articles. —
mark
✎
10:41, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Featured Articles and Good Articles are both Wikipedia processes to recognize quality articles. I created a proposal for greater co-ordination and integration between the two processes, so that both processes will be more successful in their aim of recognizing quality articles. Please read and participate in the discussion on the village pump. Thanks. -- J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:48, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Would it be possible to rewrite this page so that it patched subpages of content into it for each of the subjects? eg. Wikipedia:Good articles/Art, architecture and archaeology/Architecture. This would specifically enable Portal:Architecture (or anyone else) to provide a box on it's page that would be automatically updated whenever Good articles are added to the list here (I think by using {{Wikipedia:Good articles/Art, architecture and archaeology/Architecture}})? Currently we are duplicating the information on this page and have to maintain the portal to make sure it is current and correct - seems like an easier and error free way of doing it.-- Mcginnly | Natter 00:23, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
I don't really think this will help ... it will slow down the categorizing, the bot operation, the count updates meaning that multiple pages will have to be updated. Too much hassle for this to happen, KISS for this project. Lincher 17:14, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
So from what I can gather the situation is this:- 1. For the people who update the GA page it is much easier to have it on one page. 2. For the people who run portals & wikiprojects etc. it's much harder to have the GA page as one page.
In any event, I'm still not getting, why:-
Archaeoastronomy — Archaeology — Egyptian pyramids — Great Pyramid of Giza — Mummy — (5 articles)
User:Mcginnly/Sandbox/Architecture
Alan Moore — Anton Alexander von Werner — Canaletto — Caravaggio — Hiroh Kikai — Jacques-Louis David — Paul Rand — (7 articles)
Would someone explain? -- Mcginnly | Natter 11:47, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
It might be a good idea to create a version of this page which doesn't rely so heavily on JavaScript, since 5% of people have it disabled! EVOCATIVEINTRIGUE TALKTOME | EMAILME | IMPROVEME 14:01, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
Actually, scratch that: I tried again in Opera and they expand if the user hasn't got JS on, so there's no problem. EVOCATIVEINTRIGUE TALKTOME | EMAILME | IMPROVEME 16:46, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
The phrase "animals and organisms" is odd. All animals are organisms. Perhaps it could be renamed just "organisms"? Even better would be " taxa", but that might be a bit technical. (And on a technical note, viruses are taxa, but might not be organisms.) -- Stemonitis 08:25, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
Recently, Lou Graham (Seattle madame) was reviewed and rejected to be a Good Article. I don't necessarily object to the conclusion, but the reviewer's remarks leave me wondering: did the reviewer actually read the article? It's not terribly long. If anything, I would say its main problem is that it is too short, and there should be a lot more archival research.
Please see Talk:Lou Graham (Seattle_madame)#GA_failed for the details, but just to give a taste, the reviewer asks, as if the article doesn't say anything about it, "Did her business flourish? Did she have success?" The article says (among other things) that she "[became] a wealthy landowner, one of the largest landholders in the Pacific Northwest. She owned one of the Seattle's great mansions…and 'contributed liberally' to projects sponsored by the Seattle Chamber of Commerce"; how much clearer can it be that she was a success in business? - Jmabel | Talk 06:16, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
I'm not appealing this; again, I think the article needs more material. But, still, I worry about a review process that can miss something like that (and several other similar items) in an article of only ten paragraphs. - Jmabel | Talk 06:18, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
Featured articles have their little star in the upper right hand corner of the screen ({{ featured article}}). Would it be possible to do the same thing for good articles? I see no reason why not and people would easily be able to tell that the article is a good article without going to the talk page of the article Thoughts?-- NMajdan• talk 13:11, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
Do we need the show/hide template here? I want to be able to skim the categories for articles I might be interested in reading, like at WP:FA, without clicking two dozen "show" links. I don't mind on pages with just a few such templates, but to me it degrades how easy it should be to browse this page. Alternatively, is there a way I can set "by default, always show" in my preferences? TransUtopian 15:14, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
NavigationBarShowDefault = 28;
There's been some discussion on Talk:The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy Primary and Secondary Phases as to whether or not I should have asked for GA status for a list of episodes. My argument is essentially "Why not?" There's not a GA equivalent to "Good List" (i.e. a list that may or may not be on its way to Wikipedia:Featured lists status). If there are no objections, I'd like to relist the article as a GA nominee, and ask that instead of using strictly "Good Article/Featured Article" criteria, that a modification of the Featured List criteria be used instead. There are currently six lists of TELEVISION episodes as Featured Lists, but not ONE Radio Series episode list.... -- JohnDBuell 16:33, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
In several of the different categories on the GA page, names of people are listed in different manners. Under Music, people are: First name Last name and alphabatised by first name. Under Media, people are listed as: Last name, First name and alphabatised by last name. I suggest that these be made uniform by choosing one style. There is a third option of course: First name Last name, alphabatised by last name. I suggest the Third. What do you think? -- The Talking Sock talk contribs 20:07, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
Who came up with the idea of splitting this into "Eastern" and "Western" hemispheres? More importantly, why is Norfolk, in the UK and east of the Grenwich Meridian, considered "Western", while Bristol, in the UK and west of the Grenwich Meridian, considered "Eastern"? I suggest instead having "Europe", "North America" and "Rest of World" sections. Joe D (t) 15:29, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
Maybe "Europe", "Americas", "Asia and Oceania" and "Africa" would be more appropriate. Still I like the idea of moving away from the Eastern/Western hemispheres. Cedars 00:49, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
As per subject; I love this format of the subsections, so artilcles can easily be accessed through a kind of indexing system. From it I created Template:Christ, I suppose that this format will become the standard for new templates everywhere. Full credit to you, whoever you are. A J Hay 01:32, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
I've noticed that there a bunch of video game characters that are in both the Media and the Sport and Games sections. Does this mess up the count? I'm thinking that they should only be in one or the other, and it's not completely consistant at the moment besides. If they should only be in one section, what do you guys think? Media or Sport/Games? Note: it's even more complicated for some- Final Fantasy VII characters are in the game as well as the movie. -- PresN 02:01, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
Please support bug 4288 which is an enhancement that allows general tagging of revisions. This will allow user and group defined tags which can then be used for things like this project and possibly other stuff in the future. Thanks. -- Gbleem 23:22, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
I propose we automatically allow for delisting any article which shows no signs of having gone through the process, i've delisted and/or commented on a good amount of articles already which apparently were never reviewed or commented on even once for Good Article status, and it's slowing me down, because I give comments to articles even though they've never even been through the system. If we could just delist them immedietly without so much as a how-do-you-do, we could sweep the list faster and stop template-stampers far more effectively, because alot of articles i've come across just got stamped and left, exactly what the GA system should not be about. However, delisting shouldn't be mandatory, many old articles were here before the review system, it should be up to the sweeper to decide if an article ultimately meets the standards, but the sweeper shouldn't be obligated to do a thorough review for articles which have snuck their way through the system is what i'm after here. Homestarmy 18:54, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
Kafziel's point has not been addressed. The folks who started "Good Articles" did not have a formal process for review initially. Review was informal, and rarely logged. You cannot arbitrarily remove articles automatically because you don't like the review process; when they were admitted they most likely did pass the review process then in place. You can, however, propose articles for removal because they don't meet the current standards. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 16:51, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
How can the number of GAs actually go down? 81.107.36.208 03:32, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
After a few lengthy discussions the other day on GAC I had thought that about how to make this more worthwhile wiki-wide. What if Good Articles become "A and B class articles" and was officially married to the assessment scale, an idea which has merit but doesn't appear particularly active. Presently it lists:
This is heavy at the top. What especially doesn't make sense is that GA's criteria are so close to FA (I've said enough about that already) but technically it's third rank after FA and A (FA, very very close to FA, and very close to FA?). And, to take that further, we're devoting a lot of work in the FA process to the gold (which makes sense) and the next largest workload to the bronze (which doesn't). So:
Nothing much would have to change here, except nominators would have two choices: nominate as A or B. A reviewer could: Pass an A, "half-pass" an A as B, pass a B as a B, or fail a B as a C. Everything transcluded at {{ A-Class}} could be grandfathered into the list. Marskell 13:05, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
In principle, I agree with Marskell's proposition. The "GA" status seems shoehorned into the WP 1.0 assessment scale, creating a redundant level. Either an article is really good on all accounts (which makes it fit for both A-class and GA), or not. And if an article is really as excellent as an FA should be, it should go straight to FAC - if it is really excellent enough to be an FA, it will pass, and if it fails, it is clearly NOT excellent enough.
GA process is rather quick, but the GA criteria are rather strict, and I believe at that point of the quality scale even a one-person external review is very beneficial to ensure everything is up to snuff. So, I believe that GA should be equivalent to A-Class on the quality scale (not to say that the GA tag is a requirement for the A-Class status or the other way around), to make things clearer. Bravada, talk - 15:59, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
Coming from the assessment side of things, rather than the GA side: utterly unacceptable idea. The reason the GA level seems shoehorned into the scale is because it was shoehorned after people started using a mindless GA tag → A-Class assessment approach. The entire point of the assessment system is that it is run by the WikiProjects themselves, rather than hanging off a central process (especially one with a less-than-stellar track record). A number of projects (notably WP:TROP and WP:MILHIST, but I suspect there are others) already have a more rigorous system of reviewing potential A-Class articles than the GA setup provides; to collapse the two levels would eliminate that distinction, and prevent the projects from actually assessing articles properly on their own. Better to remove the GA "level" from the scale and have it be an entirely unrelated system. Kirill Lokshin 17:06, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
The problem, I think, lies with the fact that A-class is determined by the projects, and to my knowledge is only routinely formally assessed by a total of two projects ( WP:TROP and WP:MILHIST), while the other 104 projects have no real idea what to do with it. Stub, Start, and B-class is easy, GA and FA are easy (you ship it off to the black box, and either you get it or you don't), but A-class? Even a large project like WP:CVG hasn't really discussed it, and just uses GA for anything above B. Nifboy 19:41, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
I stopped following sometime ago, but here's what I think - GA should not be a "lax" and "forgiving" process to allow instant recognition, it should be a process that allows for quick and fuss-less identification and recognition of articles that comply really well with all Wikipedia policies and guidelines, and are generally really good encyclopedic articles. The differences between the GAs and FAs on given subjects might be quite small in substance, but large when the effort is considered. So, GA should be the status all articles should be striving for, as it means they are "complete" and can be left like that, while FA is for articles that really excel, and not all articles HAVE to reach that status.
In other words, we need a process that would be able to handle large amounts of articles that are "there", as ideally all Wikipedia articles should be developed to the stage when they are really good encyclopedic articles, even if they are not outstanding. That said, there are calls and attempts to make the GA standards tighter and more consistently applied, so I guess GA will be shaking off its questionable image in near future.
Concerning A-Class and WikiProjects, I believe you are thinking the wrong way - if there is a process that has even higher standards than GA - i.e. all GA formal requirements, including reviewing by a person not involved with editing the article, but also something extra, like checking for some topic-specific characteristics - it would be great to make it equivalent to GA in the way that all articles that pass it are automatically GA! It would be great if we could gradually "outsource" reviewing of articles on some topics to WikiProjects, as this would make it easier to find reviewers ready to process lenghty articles on specialist subjects, and also some useful standards might be developed for similar articles, which would make reaching the GA level easier. Bravada, talk - 02:13, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
After thinking about participating in good Good Articles reviewing, I also ended up not "getting" it. In fact, I don't really "get" the entire article assessment system. It's so bottom-heavy that I don't see what, of interest, it reveals. Articles are weighed on multiple dimensions to achieve one ranking, yet these dimensions often vary drastically within one article (comprehensiveness, referencing, prose quality...). There are excellent articles out there that are still just "B"s because they aren't referenced enough to be "Good". I don't call that identifying good articles. I've said it on some talk page once before: generalizable, user-interface-oriented, multiple-dimension assessment seems a more interesting idea to me. They told me a similar idea had been considered but abandoned earlier in 2006. – Outriggr § 00:32, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I'm concerned with this at the moment there isn't even consensus on what is a good article. Every time there are continual disputes with personal attacks. before GA should consider its position it needs to decide what its doing. Gnangarra 00:52, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
On a different note, I'd like to ask who updates this section? Is it updated automatically, or during some periodic maintenance process, or are we simply supposed to update it manually when listing an article? If the latter is the case, it would be good to provide some clear instructions on that, like "put the article you list at the beginning of the queue and remove the last item" (not that I find this wording too clear, actually). Same question goes for the general article count. Bravada, talk - 01:11, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I believe that they are updated with a script called the GAAuto. Its programmed to do the tasks you mentioned. Tarret 20:46, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently, there are a few members of this project who are going around to articles that are listed as "good" letting them know that they fail criterion 2b. Only problem is, some of these articles actually do have inline references (albeit a small number). Since there is no minimum number listed at criterion 2b, I say it is inappropriate for people to warn that articles will be delisted unless there are precisely zero inline references. If there are one or more inline references, then discussion must be had as to whether more should be provided for the article to be "good" or not. This is a matter of editorial good practice. Some articles lend themselves to inline referencing more easily than others. Science and math articles in particular may not have as many (and may even have what looks superficially to the uninitiated reviewer as "too few") references as other articles. So please, do not delist or insinuate that delisting is immanent unless there are precisely zero inline references. Thank you, -- ScienceApologist 20:57, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
If technical articles can only be assessed by fellow technical editors, then GA might not be a process for them. Perhaps their own A-class review in their respective projects? -- plange 13:59, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
The original intent that cause all this brew-ha was a simple notice encouraging editors to review the GA criteria, with specific concerns of citation, and see how their article stacks up. I was not conducting a full re-review at that time and the notice was intentionally made general because I was leaving the matter into the hands of the article's editors and the subsequent GA reviewer who would later go along. I appreciate the subject nature of the view "well referenced" and I would concede with Homestarmy that I could have worded my notice to incorporate that more. However (and I brought this up on ScienceApologist's RfA), I do feel that the articles I tagged were under-referenced. I went back to the two articles that particular stirred SA's ire, Hubble's law and Special Relativity and tagged 24 items in Hubble's and 43 in Special Relativity that I would like to have seen at least a majority of them tagged. Coupled with things like the OR-ish concerns of "textbook style" first person tone of the Special Relativity article among other things, I believe that through referencing is vital to our scientific articles in establishing Wikipedia's credibility and overall quality levels. You can not assume that you reader will have a textbook in hand and can just assume it's so when you simply state in the article that it is so. Important claims regarding the overthrows and conflicts of theories, the later inspirations of theories, the outcomes of experiences and results of experiments, the impact on science, historical scientific assumptions, vague weasel wordish “Some have said” (who?) and “this was thought to” (by whom?) type phrases SHOULD be cited. I also found areas where it says that an Author has said something, listing several or worse no books of the author in reference below, how are we to know WHERE he said this? Then there were areas where the article seemingly connected two thoughts and then declare they are related. (They may very well be, but how can I verify that?). I don't think it's fair to ask the editors to "dumb down" the article but these articles are absolutely inaccessible to lay readers when there is not solid citations and referencing throughout the article. Agne 15:02, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Well I agree with pretty much everything you write here; it looks, however, like you were trawling GAs and then throwing down the rulebook wrt citations arbitrarily. In the case of Metric expansion of space, for instance, the article is perfectly well sourced in my opinion, insofar as the article presents a very basic overview (including an excellent summary of the ant on a balloon metaphor for comprehending the extra-dimensional aspect of the expansion of matter). In the event that specific debates and controversies are not receiving adequate citation, I entirely agree that this should be remedied. But the impression being given is not that at all. Rather it is more like: this article needs x number of citations in order to be considered a GA. Allow me to quote User:Hoary who answered homestarmy's original objection to the lack of references in a way that I think is perfect: I think this means: "There are only five references, only one of which is linked to a specific assertion." Yes, there's only one note. What's the objection here? If it's that an article such as this should have a longer, more impressive-looking list of references (of unexplained relevance), I utterly disagree. (That smells of the bibliography-stuffing practiced by feeble undergraduates desperately trying to impress.) If by contrast it's that specific assertions should be linked to specific references, then for other articles I'd strongly agree; however, in my very limited understanding of cosmology this article is an attempt to summarize what's pretty much agreed among interested physicists and it's therefore unnecessary to say that A comes from X and B comes from Y. If I'm right here, then I suggest that the article should get either (i) some discursive footnotes, describing roughly what in the article comes from where (in addition of course to any needed footnotes saying which more controversial assertion comes from precisely where), or (ii) descriptions in the list of references, wherein the contribution of the source to the article is briefly explained. -- Hoary 07:06, 18 August 2006 (UTC) Indeed. Eusebeus 16:21, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Can we move discussion of this to the talk page of WP:CITE, since it is this guideline that we're trying to follow? -- plange 21:38, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
I believe those in favor of mandatory inline citations feel they are only following WP:CITE. I encourage everyone to look here for a discussion about clarifying WP:CITE so that we can come to agreement here. CMummert 12:44, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
I would like to encourage GA folks to comment on this discussion about technical articles. Thanks! --best, kevin kzollman][ talk 22:19, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
...and I disagree with such removal. Instead of removing articles, try to fix them. Be bold ... but don't be disruptive is a WP guideline and for that reason, instead of delisting articles, lets try to fix such articles in order to bring them to GA standard. Lincher 03:27, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
There are only 6 nominations in GAC now that are older than 7 days now (not counting those on hold). This is much less then what it used to be, despite some reviewers not reviewing anymore, being put off by pointless debacles in the talk page ;) Bravada, talk - 14:01, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
CMummert already linked to the discussion but the more consenus from all sides we can get the better outcome we will have
Since the heart of the matter seems to be the application of WP:CITE in relation to
WP:V, the discussion has moved there towards trying to find a consensus compromise that we can all live with and help produce a better encyclopedia with. Working together to get something worthwhile accomplished with this guideline will make all these headaches and frustrations not be in vain. I do think there is room for compromise between what the GA team would like to see for readibility and verification and what the Science editors would like for ease of consistency and professionalism. I invite the editors who have been taking part in these discussions across several pages to lay things to rest here and move over to WP:CITE's
talk page so that we can garner consensus there. There is not much that can be accomplished here before things are settled with the guideline.
Agne
16:57, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently articles about sports stadiums - Arsenal Stadium and Gaylord Family Oklahoma Memorial Stadium are categorised under "Culture and society" > "Recreation" when I think they would be better placed, either in "Art, architecture and archaeology" > "Architecture" or under a separate subcategory of "Sport and games". What do others think? Qwghlm 12:30, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
I noticed in the "Historical figures" subsection, some used the first name for ordering which conforms with the Wikipedia style, while others used the last name which would conform to most listing situations such as the phonebook. Has there been a consensus decision on which should be correct? RelHistBuff 08:26, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Yeah we should get more consistent with that. My personal vote would be to order them based on Last name (Jones, Miller, Smith, etc) but to list them as first-last (Will Jones, Adam Miller, Jackie Smith, etc). Though I would go with whatever consensus decides. Agne 08:27, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
I noticed about half of the "Physics and astronomy" section is under the subheading "Atmospheric physics and meteorology". Should we split that half into it's own separate heading called something like " Meteorology" or the broader term " Atmospheric sciences"? I would hardly say Tropical Storm Harvey (2005) qualifies much as being either Physics or Astronomy. - Hyad 06:01, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
I've been thinking about a Meteorology section for a while. We have enough GA of storms and hurricanes that I think would warrant it. Agne 07:26, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
Since three of them have been given GA status so far, I was wondering: Could we add a Television Episodes category to the Media section? -- transaspie 01:56, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
Where do dramatist, such as W. S. Gilbert go? Adam Cuerden talk 15:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
After looking at the articles on the list I have found many articles that fail WP:WIAGA criteria 2b. I know that the criteria was recently changed but many sections such as th e Transportation section still has alot of articles that fails this criteria. This makes me wonder if anyone ever goes through the list and is it possible to make list sweeping a part of WP:GA/R? Tarret 18:54, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
It has the tag to indicate that, anyway. So does User:PalermoD. Badbilltucker 21:38, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
Awhile ago, the page was moved from "Good Articles/disputes" to "Good Articles/review", and I think there's a bit of a problem cropping up because of it. I didn't think much of it before, but there's been a couple people coming to the page wanting their article to be looked at immedietly rather than put it on the candidates page, and i'm starting to think the name Good Articles/Review name is misleading people into thinking that is a page where you can get an article reviewed first, rather than a page to review decisions on articles. Could it be moved back to "Good Articles/Disputes"? Homestarmy 19:06, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
Hi,
First post here. Does this project have GA reviewer coaching, similar to Wikipedia:Esperanza/Admin coaching? I sorta poked around a bit, but didn't see anything similar. Thanks -- Ling.Nut 15:40, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
Well, the GA page itself isn't updated by anyone special, anybody can add anything to the page, its just you're supposed to only add articles which have gone through the system. But occasionally we'll find some articles that somebody just spontaneously listed or things like that, and they often just sort of went under the radar so to speak. User:Cedars GAAuto bot will look for alot of articles that haven't been listed on the page properly, but it can't check for bad faith reviews or reviews where somebody wasn't aware that you have to list articles on the candidate page for somebody else to review first. Homestarmy 19:30, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
What is {{ GA talkbox}} used for? 74.116.113.241 02:00, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
This is a stupid question. However, if someone placed an article in nomination as a feature article candidate, without having ever had it ranked as a good article earlier, would you think it would still be a good idea to nominate them as Good articles, or would that be merely a formality? I am finding several articles which are former FA candidates while never being considered for GA, and welcome your responses. Badbilltucker 23:27, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
Please join the discussion, as it pertains to GA and the Assessment project and several issues raised or broached here. Thanks! Girolamo Savonarola 00:16, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
I've just managed to get my bot User:WillowBot to generate a cross reference table between
You can see the results at User:Salix alba/GA table. For the most part everything seem OK. However there are a number of articles which don't have the the template on their talk pages, possible because the the template has been substituted. Other articles have some minor case differences Indian independence movement is listed on Wikipedia:Good articles, but its a redirect to Indian Independence movement.
This is just the first go at generating the table so I can modify the results if needed. -- Salix alba ( talk) 18:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Phineas Gage was not a biologist/medical scientist yet is listed as such. Perhaps listing him under health/medicine would not be such a ad idea (it seems you guys are trying to keep bios and nonbios apart but he is known more for his medical state than anything else)
Isn't the % of FA more like 0.75%, as per here, than 0.1% as mentioned on the WP:GA page? Or am I reading the graph badly? RHB 21:22, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
Did this ever pass GA, because it has a Ga rating on the talk page
I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but would it be possible to get meteorology as its own section in the list. Currently, unless you know where you are going you might have difficulty getting there (I looked in history, geology, and materials sciences before I remembered where it was). There are 72 articles, which is almost enough to be its own category. In addition, there are 13 meteorology articles on the candidates page. Hurricanehink ( talk) 14:51, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
Well unless someone disagrees feel free to change it. Tarret 23:38, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I have a few ideas to keep separate the concept of reviews in the promotion process vs. reviews in the delisting process.
Comments? Or maybe there are better ideas? -- RelHistBuff 09:36, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I've just created a template Template:Link GA, it's works similar as the Template:Link FA. However it needs the MediaWiki:Monobook.css and MediaWiki:Common.js to be updated to reflect this change. Is that a good idea to introduce this template? -- Shinjiman ⇔ ♨ 05:58, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Hi - I'm a little confused as to how criteria 4, "It follows the neutral point of view policy. In this respect: (a) viewpoints are represented fairly and without bias; (b) all significant points of view are fairly presented, but not asserted, particularly where there are or have been conflicting views on the topic." fits in to an article on a fictional subject. Thanks for any assistance. - Malkinann 11:03, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
"Meteorology and atmospheric sciences" has gotten pretty dense, thanks to all the contributors working on hurricane/tropical cyclone articles. The "Tropical cyclones" subheading seems to me to be too big. Maybe we can split up articles about the science of storms and articles about actual storms?
Also, "Recreation" seems like it would split nicely into "Games" and "Sports". Is there a good icon available for a "Games" section? Twinxor t 23:25, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
Is there somewhere within this project which lists the newest additions of good articles by name as they are added by month? There is a similar list for FA here. -- Nehrams2020 04:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
As suggested by Gnangarra about a month ago, I have started putting GAs into subcategories, by using templates.
I also divided "Places" in the Geography section between Eastern hemisphere and Western hemisphere. Maurreen 01:06, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi Maurreen,
I don't support this move. It breaks the automatic listing of good articles. This could be fixed, but before we make the change it would be helpful to know the answers to the following questions:
Editing the new templates is also very difficult because one must edit each and every new template.
Cedars 08:43, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. About the subcategories and templates, I don't understand what Cedars means by "It breaks the automatic listing of good articles." In answer to the questions:
FYI - I created a discussion on the FA Talk about making their page look similar to the GA page. I think this page looks great and would like to duplicate it over there for uniformity and such. Your thought might be helpful in that discussion as many seem to dislike the collapsible menus and sub-categories. Since you've been working with both for a while, I thought your insight would be valuable. Thanks Morphh 20:11, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
In response to dicussions on the FA talk page here and on the GA talk page here. As well as the discussion on this page together with other discussion taking place on the FA and GA talk pages and talk pages of associated articles. I propose that this page Standardised formats for FA and GA become the only forum where consensus be developed for standard page and template formats for both WP:FA and WP:GA.
Featured articles and featured lists make available information on when the items were promoted so people can compare with the approved version and see whether it has deteriorated. This is done both with logs and through Template:Featured and Template:FL. I think it would be good to also be able to easily find out when GAs were approved. Maurreen 06:59, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
Thank you. Maurreen 14:09, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
To indicate the reviewed version of a
Good Article, use {{GA|oldid=nnnnnn}}
on the talk page (replacing nnnnn with the id number of the reviewed version) rather than just {{GA}}
.
Maurreen
22:25, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
Just to let you know, the GA template (which adds a star to the corner of articles like the FA system), which was deleted a few months ago before the project was established, has come up for Deletion Review, should you want to support or oppose it's re-creation. --GW_Simulations |User Page | Talk | Contribs | E-mail 11:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
For the record, what this means is that there actually is a consensus against adding a star or another mark to the corner of good articles. —
mark
✎
10:41, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Featured Articles and Good Articles are both Wikipedia processes to recognize quality articles. I created a proposal for greater co-ordination and integration between the two processes, so that both processes will be more successful in their aim of recognizing quality articles. Please read and participate in the discussion on the village pump. Thanks. -- J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:48, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Would it be possible to rewrite this page so that it patched subpages of content into it for each of the subjects? eg. Wikipedia:Good articles/Art, architecture and archaeology/Architecture. This would specifically enable Portal:Architecture (or anyone else) to provide a box on it's page that would be automatically updated whenever Good articles are added to the list here (I think by using {{Wikipedia:Good articles/Art, architecture and archaeology/Architecture}})? Currently we are duplicating the information on this page and have to maintain the portal to make sure it is current and correct - seems like an easier and error free way of doing it.-- Mcginnly | Natter 00:23, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
I don't really think this will help ... it will slow down the categorizing, the bot operation, the count updates meaning that multiple pages will have to be updated. Too much hassle for this to happen, KISS for this project. Lincher 17:14, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
So from what I can gather the situation is this:- 1. For the people who update the GA page it is much easier to have it on one page. 2. For the people who run portals & wikiprojects etc. it's much harder to have the GA page as one page.
In any event, I'm still not getting, why:-
Archaeoastronomy — Archaeology — Egyptian pyramids — Great Pyramid of Giza — Mummy — (5 articles)
User:Mcginnly/Sandbox/Architecture
Alan Moore — Anton Alexander von Werner — Canaletto — Caravaggio — Hiroh Kikai — Jacques-Louis David — Paul Rand — (7 articles)
Would someone explain? -- Mcginnly | Natter 11:47, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
It might be a good idea to create a version of this page which doesn't rely so heavily on JavaScript, since 5% of people have it disabled! EVOCATIVEINTRIGUE TALKTOME | EMAILME | IMPROVEME 14:01, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
Actually, scratch that: I tried again in Opera and they expand if the user hasn't got JS on, so there's no problem. EVOCATIVEINTRIGUE TALKTOME | EMAILME | IMPROVEME 16:46, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
The phrase "animals and organisms" is odd. All animals are organisms. Perhaps it could be renamed just "organisms"? Even better would be " taxa", but that might be a bit technical. (And on a technical note, viruses are taxa, but might not be organisms.) -- Stemonitis 08:25, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
Recently, Lou Graham (Seattle madame) was reviewed and rejected to be a Good Article. I don't necessarily object to the conclusion, but the reviewer's remarks leave me wondering: did the reviewer actually read the article? It's not terribly long. If anything, I would say its main problem is that it is too short, and there should be a lot more archival research.
Please see Talk:Lou Graham (Seattle_madame)#GA_failed for the details, but just to give a taste, the reviewer asks, as if the article doesn't say anything about it, "Did her business flourish? Did she have success?" The article says (among other things) that she "[became] a wealthy landowner, one of the largest landholders in the Pacific Northwest. She owned one of the Seattle's great mansions…and 'contributed liberally' to projects sponsored by the Seattle Chamber of Commerce"; how much clearer can it be that she was a success in business? - Jmabel | Talk 06:16, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
I'm not appealing this; again, I think the article needs more material. But, still, I worry about a review process that can miss something like that (and several other similar items) in an article of only ten paragraphs. - Jmabel | Talk 06:18, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
Featured articles have their little star in the upper right hand corner of the screen ({{ featured article}}). Would it be possible to do the same thing for good articles? I see no reason why not and people would easily be able to tell that the article is a good article without going to the talk page of the article Thoughts?-- NMajdan• talk 13:11, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
Do we need the show/hide template here? I want to be able to skim the categories for articles I might be interested in reading, like at WP:FA, without clicking two dozen "show" links. I don't mind on pages with just a few such templates, but to me it degrades how easy it should be to browse this page. Alternatively, is there a way I can set "by default, always show" in my preferences? TransUtopian 15:14, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
NavigationBarShowDefault = 28;
There's been some discussion on Talk:The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy Primary and Secondary Phases as to whether or not I should have asked for GA status for a list of episodes. My argument is essentially "Why not?" There's not a GA equivalent to "Good List" (i.e. a list that may or may not be on its way to Wikipedia:Featured lists status). If there are no objections, I'd like to relist the article as a GA nominee, and ask that instead of using strictly "Good Article/Featured Article" criteria, that a modification of the Featured List criteria be used instead. There are currently six lists of TELEVISION episodes as Featured Lists, but not ONE Radio Series episode list.... -- JohnDBuell 16:33, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
In several of the different categories on the GA page, names of people are listed in different manners. Under Music, people are: First name Last name and alphabatised by first name. Under Media, people are listed as: Last name, First name and alphabatised by last name. I suggest that these be made uniform by choosing one style. There is a third option of course: First name Last name, alphabatised by last name. I suggest the Third. What do you think? -- The Talking Sock talk contribs 20:07, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
Who came up with the idea of splitting this into "Eastern" and "Western" hemispheres? More importantly, why is Norfolk, in the UK and east of the Grenwich Meridian, considered "Western", while Bristol, in the UK and west of the Grenwich Meridian, considered "Eastern"? I suggest instead having "Europe", "North America" and "Rest of World" sections. Joe D (t) 15:29, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
Maybe "Europe", "Americas", "Asia and Oceania" and "Africa" would be more appropriate. Still I like the idea of moving away from the Eastern/Western hemispheres. Cedars 00:49, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
As per subject; I love this format of the subsections, so artilcles can easily be accessed through a kind of indexing system. From it I created Template:Christ, I suppose that this format will become the standard for new templates everywhere. Full credit to you, whoever you are. A J Hay 01:32, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
I've noticed that there a bunch of video game characters that are in both the Media and the Sport and Games sections. Does this mess up the count? I'm thinking that they should only be in one or the other, and it's not completely consistant at the moment besides. If they should only be in one section, what do you guys think? Media or Sport/Games? Note: it's even more complicated for some- Final Fantasy VII characters are in the game as well as the movie. -- PresN 02:01, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
Please support bug 4288 which is an enhancement that allows general tagging of revisions. This will allow user and group defined tags which can then be used for things like this project and possibly other stuff in the future. Thanks. -- Gbleem 23:22, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
I propose we automatically allow for delisting any article which shows no signs of having gone through the process, i've delisted and/or commented on a good amount of articles already which apparently were never reviewed or commented on even once for Good Article status, and it's slowing me down, because I give comments to articles even though they've never even been through the system. If we could just delist them immedietly without so much as a how-do-you-do, we could sweep the list faster and stop template-stampers far more effectively, because alot of articles i've come across just got stamped and left, exactly what the GA system should not be about. However, delisting shouldn't be mandatory, many old articles were here before the review system, it should be up to the sweeper to decide if an article ultimately meets the standards, but the sweeper shouldn't be obligated to do a thorough review for articles which have snuck their way through the system is what i'm after here. Homestarmy 18:54, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
Kafziel's point has not been addressed. The folks who started "Good Articles" did not have a formal process for review initially. Review was informal, and rarely logged. You cannot arbitrarily remove articles automatically because you don't like the review process; when they were admitted they most likely did pass the review process then in place. You can, however, propose articles for removal because they don't meet the current standards. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 16:51, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
How can the number of GAs actually go down? 81.107.36.208 03:32, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
After a few lengthy discussions the other day on GAC I had thought that about how to make this more worthwhile wiki-wide. What if Good Articles become "A and B class articles" and was officially married to the assessment scale, an idea which has merit but doesn't appear particularly active. Presently it lists:
This is heavy at the top. What especially doesn't make sense is that GA's criteria are so close to FA (I've said enough about that already) but technically it's third rank after FA and A (FA, very very close to FA, and very close to FA?). And, to take that further, we're devoting a lot of work in the FA process to the gold (which makes sense) and the next largest workload to the bronze (which doesn't). So:
Nothing much would have to change here, except nominators would have two choices: nominate as A or B. A reviewer could: Pass an A, "half-pass" an A as B, pass a B as a B, or fail a B as a C. Everything transcluded at {{ A-Class}} could be grandfathered into the list. Marskell 13:05, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
In principle, I agree with Marskell's proposition. The "GA" status seems shoehorned into the WP 1.0 assessment scale, creating a redundant level. Either an article is really good on all accounts (which makes it fit for both A-class and GA), or not. And if an article is really as excellent as an FA should be, it should go straight to FAC - if it is really excellent enough to be an FA, it will pass, and if it fails, it is clearly NOT excellent enough.
GA process is rather quick, but the GA criteria are rather strict, and I believe at that point of the quality scale even a one-person external review is very beneficial to ensure everything is up to snuff. So, I believe that GA should be equivalent to A-Class on the quality scale (not to say that the GA tag is a requirement for the A-Class status or the other way around), to make things clearer. Bravada, talk - 15:59, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
Coming from the assessment side of things, rather than the GA side: utterly unacceptable idea. The reason the GA level seems shoehorned into the scale is because it was shoehorned after people started using a mindless GA tag → A-Class assessment approach. The entire point of the assessment system is that it is run by the WikiProjects themselves, rather than hanging off a central process (especially one with a less-than-stellar track record). A number of projects (notably WP:TROP and WP:MILHIST, but I suspect there are others) already have a more rigorous system of reviewing potential A-Class articles than the GA setup provides; to collapse the two levels would eliminate that distinction, and prevent the projects from actually assessing articles properly on their own. Better to remove the GA "level" from the scale and have it be an entirely unrelated system. Kirill Lokshin 17:06, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
The problem, I think, lies with the fact that A-class is determined by the projects, and to my knowledge is only routinely formally assessed by a total of two projects ( WP:TROP and WP:MILHIST), while the other 104 projects have no real idea what to do with it. Stub, Start, and B-class is easy, GA and FA are easy (you ship it off to the black box, and either you get it or you don't), but A-class? Even a large project like WP:CVG hasn't really discussed it, and just uses GA for anything above B. Nifboy 19:41, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
I stopped following sometime ago, but here's what I think - GA should not be a "lax" and "forgiving" process to allow instant recognition, it should be a process that allows for quick and fuss-less identification and recognition of articles that comply really well with all Wikipedia policies and guidelines, and are generally really good encyclopedic articles. The differences between the GAs and FAs on given subjects might be quite small in substance, but large when the effort is considered. So, GA should be the status all articles should be striving for, as it means they are "complete" and can be left like that, while FA is for articles that really excel, and not all articles HAVE to reach that status.
In other words, we need a process that would be able to handle large amounts of articles that are "there", as ideally all Wikipedia articles should be developed to the stage when they are really good encyclopedic articles, even if they are not outstanding. That said, there are calls and attempts to make the GA standards tighter and more consistently applied, so I guess GA will be shaking off its questionable image in near future.
Concerning A-Class and WikiProjects, I believe you are thinking the wrong way - if there is a process that has even higher standards than GA - i.e. all GA formal requirements, including reviewing by a person not involved with editing the article, but also something extra, like checking for some topic-specific characteristics - it would be great to make it equivalent to GA in the way that all articles that pass it are automatically GA! It would be great if we could gradually "outsource" reviewing of articles on some topics to WikiProjects, as this would make it easier to find reviewers ready to process lenghty articles on specialist subjects, and also some useful standards might be developed for similar articles, which would make reaching the GA level easier. Bravada, talk - 02:13, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
After thinking about participating in good Good Articles reviewing, I also ended up not "getting" it. In fact, I don't really "get" the entire article assessment system. It's so bottom-heavy that I don't see what, of interest, it reveals. Articles are weighed on multiple dimensions to achieve one ranking, yet these dimensions often vary drastically within one article (comprehensiveness, referencing, prose quality...). There are excellent articles out there that are still just "B"s because they aren't referenced enough to be "Good". I don't call that identifying good articles. I've said it on some talk page once before: generalizable, user-interface-oriented, multiple-dimension assessment seems a more interesting idea to me. They told me a similar idea had been considered but abandoned earlier in 2006. – Outriggr § 00:32, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I'm concerned with this at the moment there isn't even consensus on what is a good article. Every time there are continual disputes with personal attacks. before GA should consider its position it needs to decide what its doing. Gnangarra 00:52, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
On a different note, I'd like to ask who updates this section? Is it updated automatically, or during some periodic maintenance process, or are we simply supposed to update it manually when listing an article? If the latter is the case, it would be good to provide some clear instructions on that, like "put the article you list at the beginning of the queue and remove the last item" (not that I find this wording too clear, actually). Same question goes for the general article count. Bravada, talk - 01:11, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I believe that they are updated with a script called the GAAuto. Its programmed to do the tasks you mentioned. Tarret 20:46, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently, there are a few members of this project who are going around to articles that are listed as "good" letting them know that they fail criterion 2b. Only problem is, some of these articles actually do have inline references (albeit a small number). Since there is no minimum number listed at criterion 2b, I say it is inappropriate for people to warn that articles will be delisted unless there are precisely zero inline references. If there are one or more inline references, then discussion must be had as to whether more should be provided for the article to be "good" or not. This is a matter of editorial good practice. Some articles lend themselves to inline referencing more easily than others. Science and math articles in particular may not have as many (and may even have what looks superficially to the uninitiated reviewer as "too few") references as other articles. So please, do not delist or insinuate that delisting is immanent unless there are precisely zero inline references. Thank you, -- ScienceApologist 20:57, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
If technical articles can only be assessed by fellow technical editors, then GA might not be a process for them. Perhaps their own A-class review in their respective projects? -- plange 13:59, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
The original intent that cause all this brew-ha was a simple notice encouraging editors to review the GA criteria, with specific concerns of citation, and see how their article stacks up. I was not conducting a full re-review at that time and the notice was intentionally made general because I was leaving the matter into the hands of the article's editors and the subsequent GA reviewer who would later go along. I appreciate the subject nature of the view "well referenced" and I would concede with Homestarmy that I could have worded my notice to incorporate that more. However (and I brought this up on ScienceApologist's RfA), I do feel that the articles I tagged were under-referenced. I went back to the two articles that particular stirred SA's ire, Hubble's law and Special Relativity and tagged 24 items in Hubble's and 43 in Special Relativity that I would like to have seen at least a majority of them tagged. Coupled with things like the OR-ish concerns of "textbook style" first person tone of the Special Relativity article among other things, I believe that through referencing is vital to our scientific articles in establishing Wikipedia's credibility and overall quality levels. You can not assume that you reader will have a textbook in hand and can just assume it's so when you simply state in the article that it is so. Important claims regarding the overthrows and conflicts of theories, the later inspirations of theories, the outcomes of experiences and results of experiments, the impact on science, historical scientific assumptions, vague weasel wordish “Some have said” (who?) and “this was thought to” (by whom?) type phrases SHOULD be cited. I also found areas where it says that an Author has said something, listing several or worse no books of the author in reference below, how are we to know WHERE he said this? Then there were areas where the article seemingly connected two thoughts and then declare they are related. (They may very well be, but how can I verify that?). I don't think it's fair to ask the editors to "dumb down" the article but these articles are absolutely inaccessible to lay readers when there is not solid citations and referencing throughout the article. Agne 15:02, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Well I agree with pretty much everything you write here; it looks, however, like you were trawling GAs and then throwing down the rulebook wrt citations arbitrarily. In the case of Metric expansion of space, for instance, the article is perfectly well sourced in my opinion, insofar as the article presents a very basic overview (including an excellent summary of the ant on a balloon metaphor for comprehending the extra-dimensional aspect of the expansion of matter). In the event that specific debates and controversies are not receiving adequate citation, I entirely agree that this should be remedied. But the impression being given is not that at all. Rather it is more like: this article needs x number of citations in order to be considered a GA. Allow me to quote User:Hoary who answered homestarmy's original objection to the lack of references in a way that I think is perfect: I think this means: "There are only five references, only one of which is linked to a specific assertion." Yes, there's only one note. What's the objection here? If it's that an article such as this should have a longer, more impressive-looking list of references (of unexplained relevance), I utterly disagree. (That smells of the bibliography-stuffing practiced by feeble undergraduates desperately trying to impress.) If by contrast it's that specific assertions should be linked to specific references, then for other articles I'd strongly agree; however, in my very limited understanding of cosmology this article is an attempt to summarize what's pretty much agreed among interested physicists and it's therefore unnecessary to say that A comes from X and B comes from Y. If I'm right here, then I suggest that the article should get either (i) some discursive footnotes, describing roughly what in the article comes from where (in addition of course to any needed footnotes saying which more controversial assertion comes from precisely where), or (ii) descriptions in the list of references, wherein the contribution of the source to the article is briefly explained. -- Hoary 07:06, 18 August 2006 (UTC) Indeed. Eusebeus 16:21, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Can we move discussion of this to the talk page of WP:CITE, since it is this guideline that we're trying to follow? -- plange 21:38, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
I believe those in favor of mandatory inline citations feel they are only following WP:CITE. I encourage everyone to look here for a discussion about clarifying WP:CITE so that we can come to agreement here. CMummert 12:44, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
I would like to encourage GA folks to comment on this discussion about technical articles. Thanks! --best, kevin kzollman][ talk 22:19, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
...and I disagree with such removal. Instead of removing articles, try to fix them. Be bold ... but don't be disruptive is a WP guideline and for that reason, instead of delisting articles, lets try to fix such articles in order to bring them to GA standard. Lincher 03:27, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
There are only 6 nominations in GAC now that are older than 7 days now (not counting those on hold). This is much less then what it used to be, despite some reviewers not reviewing anymore, being put off by pointless debacles in the talk page ;) Bravada, talk - 14:01, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
CMummert already linked to the discussion but the more consenus from all sides we can get the better outcome we will have
Since the heart of the matter seems to be the application of WP:CITE in relation to
WP:V, the discussion has moved there towards trying to find a consensus compromise that we can all live with and help produce a better encyclopedia with. Working together to get something worthwhile accomplished with this guideline will make all these headaches and frustrations not be in vain. I do think there is room for compromise between what the GA team would like to see for readibility and verification and what the Science editors would like for ease of consistency and professionalism. I invite the editors who have been taking part in these discussions across several pages to lay things to rest here and move over to WP:CITE's
talk page so that we can garner consensus there. There is not much that can be accomplished here before things are settled with the guideline.
Agne
16:57, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently articles about sports stadiums - Arsenal Stadium and Gaylord Family Oklahoma Memorial Stadium are categorised under "Culture and society" > "Recreation" when I think they would be better placed, either in "Art, architecture and archaeology" > "Architecture" or under a separate subcategory of "Sport and games". What do others think? Qwghlm 12:30, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
I noticed in the "Historical figures" subsection, some used the first name for ordering which conforms with the Wikipedia style, while others used the last name which would conform to most listing situations such as the phonebook. Has there been a consensus decision on which should be correct? RelHistBuff 08:26, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Yeah we should get more consistent with that. My personal vote would be to order them based on Last name (Jones, Miller, Smith, etc) but to list them as first-last (Will Jones, Adam Miller, Jackie Smith, etc). Though I would go with whatever consensus decides. Agne 08:27, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
I noticed about half of the "Physics and astronomy" section is under the subheading "Atmospheric physics and meteorology". Should we split that half into it's own separate heading called something like " Meteorology" or the broader term " Atmospheric sciences"? I would hardly say Tropical Storm Harvey (2005) qualifies much as being either Physics or Astronomy. - Hyad 06:01, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
I've been thinking about a Meteorology section for a while. We have enough GA of storms and hurricanes that I think would warrant it. Agne 07:26, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
Since three of them have been given GA status so far, I was wondering: Could we add a Television Episodes category to the Media section? -- transaspie 01:56, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
Where do dramatist, such as W. S. Gilbert go? Adam Cuerden talk 15:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
After looking at the articles on the list I have found many articles that fail WP:WIAGA criteria 2b. I know that the criteria was recently changed but many sections such as th e Transportation section still has alot of articles that fails this criteria. This makes me wonder if anyone ever goes through the list and is it possible to make list sweeping a part of WP:GA/R? Tarret 18:54, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
It has the tag to indicate that, anyway. So does User:PalermoD. Badbilltucker 21:38, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
Awhile ago, the page was moved from "Good Articles/disputes" to "Good Articles/review", and I think there's a bit of a problem cropping up because of it. I didn't think much of it before, but there's been a couple people coming to the page wanting their article to be looked at immedietly rather than put it on the candidates page, and i'm starting to think the name Good Articles/Review name is misleading people into thinking that is a page where you can get an article reviewed first, rather than a page to review decisions on articles. Could it be moved back to "Good Articles/Disputes"? Homestarmy 19:06, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
Hi,
First post here. Does this project have GA reviewer coaching, similar to Wikipedia:Esperanza/Admin coaching? I sorta poked around a bit, but didn't see anything similar. Thanks -- Ling.Nut 15:40, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
Well, the GA page itself isn't updated by anyone special, anybody can add anything to the page, its just you're supposed to only add articles which have gone through the system. But occasionally we'll find some articles that somebody just spontaneously listed or things like that, and they often just sort of went under the radar so to speak. User:Cedars GAAuto bot will look for alot of articles that haven't been listed on the page properly, but it can't check for bad faith reviews or reviews where somebody wasn't aware that you have to list articles on the candidate page for somebody else to review first. Homestarmy 19:30, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
What is {{ GA talkbox}} used for? 74.116.113.241 02:00, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
This is a stupid question. However, if someone placed an article in nomination as a feature article candidate, without having ever had it ranked as a good article earlier, would you think it would still be a good idea to nominate them as Good articles, or would that be merely a formality? I am finding several articles which are former FA candidates while never being considered for GA, and welcome your responses. Badbilltucker 23:27, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
Please join the discussion, as it pertains to GA and the Assessment project and several issues raised or broached here. Thanks! Girolamo Savonarola 00:16, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
I've just managed to get my bot User:WillowBot to generate a cross reference table between
You can see the results at User:Salix alba/GA table. For the most part everything seem OK. However there are a number of articles which don't have the the template on their talk pages, possible because the the template has been substituted. Other articles have some minor case differences Indian independence movement is listed on Wikipedia:Good articles, but its a redirect to Indian Independence movement.
This is just the first go at generating the table so I can modify the results if needed. -- Salix alba ( talk) 18:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Phineas Gage was not a biologist/medical scientist yet is listed as such. Perhaps listing him under health/medicine would not be such a ad idea (it seems you guys are trying to keep bios and nonbios apart but he is known more for his medical state than anything else)
Isn't the % of FA more like 0.75%, as per here, than 0.1% as mentioned on the WP:GA page? Or am I reading the graph badly? RHB 21:22, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
Did this ever pass GA, because it has a Ga rating on the talk page
I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but would it be possible to get meteorology as its own section in the list. Currently, unless you know where you are going you might have difficulty getting there (I looked in history, geology, and materials sciences before I remembered where it was). There are 72 articles, which is almost enough to be its own category. In addition, there are 13 meteorology articles on the candidates page. Hurricanehink ( talk) 14:51, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
Well unless someone disagrees feel free to change it. Tarret 23:38, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I have a few ideas to keep separate the concept of reviews in the promotion process vs. reviews in the delisting process.
Comments? Or maybe there are better ideas? -- RelHistBuff 09:36, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I've just created a template Template:Link GA, it's works similar as the Template:Link FA. However it needs the MediaWiki:Monobook.css and MediaWiki:Common.js to be updated to reflect this change. Is that a good idea to introduce this template? -- Shinjiman ⇔ ♨ 05:58, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Hi - I'm a little confused as to how criteria 4, "It follows the neutral point of view policy. In this respect: (a) viewpoints are represented fairly and without bias; (b) all significant points of view are fairly presented, but not asserted, particularly where there are or have been conflicting views on the topic." fits in to an article on a fictional subject. Thanks for any assistance. - Malkinann 11:03, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
"Meteorology and atmospheric sciences" has gotten pretty dense, thanks to all the contributors working on hurricane/tropical cyclone articles. The "Tropical cyclones" subheading seems to me to be too big. Maybe we can split up articles about the science of storms and articles about actual storms?
Also, "Recreation" seems like it would split nicely into "Games" and "Sports". Is there a good icon available for a "Games" section? Twinxor t 23:25, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
Is there somewhere within this project which lists the newest additions of good articles by name as they are added by month? There is a similar list for FA here. -- Nehrams2020 04:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC)