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Given the decision to permit articles on words at WP:Wikipedia is not a dictionary, this is clearly no longer a deletion criteria, so I have removed it. I mean, if an article is not encyclopedic, then it's clearly no problem to delete, but just being about a word is now not sufficient for deletion.- Wolfkeeper 23:01, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
I looked around and couldn't find current rules on this - though it used to be the case that uncontroversial (e.g. not legal or BLP issues) pages deleted via AFD could be restored to userspace pretty much for the asking. The particular case: I want to restore Motif of harmful sensation to my userspace for further work and/or putting on the web somewhere else - it was deleted for being OR. I could just press the button to do this, but I wanted to check first :-) - David Gerard ( talk) 11:04, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
There are so many hoops to jump through, it would make more sense to have a link on the page that says perhaps "report this article." I'm always running into junk articles, but the one time I submitted an article for deletion it was too big a hassle to ever bother with again. Case in point, this article which I found this morning. Pure junk. http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=List_of_spoilers I see now that it is being considered for deletion. You guys are pretty good, but my recommendation for an easier way to nominate still stands. 75.121.33.79 ( talk) 14:08, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Ok, whose bright idea was it to start deleting a load of pages from the wiki again? (I remember last time that the entries of web comics came under threat. Now it seems there are file managers that "lack notability". Whatever that means... Is the wiki running out of HD space or why this periodic spring cleaning. It seems useless to me.
Ajasja Ljubetič —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.20.228.210 ( talk) 20:39, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
I'm guessing that this has probably come up in the past but I am basically wondering of how to deal with someone who is "deleting" (for all practical purposes) articles by turning them into redirects to inappropriate, though related articles. Like for example, what if someone redirected the article on World War I to the article on Treaty of Versailles based on a claim that the WWI article was a content fork of the latter? This seems like a egregious violation of Wikipedia policy on Deletion, not to mention WP:Consensus and associated guidelines. radek ( talk) 07:08, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
The issue is over the article German-Polish War (1002-1018) which User:Skapperod is redirecting [1] to a controversial article he himself created. Even if that article somehow survives the current RfC (which it doesn't look like) obviously an article on a military conflict is different than an article on the treaty which ended that military conflict (hence my WWI/Versailles example), so this kind of "deletion" is really irritating and disruptive, particularly since he's not even giving me a chance to work on the article. In fact his justification for the redirect that the article was a "unsourced stub" is misleading - it was a newly created article for which I clearly indicated that it was a work in progress [2]. radek ( talk) 10:29, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
I want to propose an article for deletion. There are about five links to it in other articles that were placed mostly by the same author, and several more links on lists. What should I do with these links? First have the article deleted, then the editors of the other articles (possibly I) will deal with the resulting red links? Or first remove/rewrite the links, and then propose for deletion? The former seems impolite to the other articles, the latter is unfair to the article proposed for deletion: after the links are removed, I could say in an argument that look, there are no links to it. So, what is the policy? I'm surprised this is not mentioned in this Deletion policy. -- GaborPete ( talk) 00:09, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
When wearing my WikiGnome hat, I correct misspellings of retrieve and its derivatives, and various misspellings of rhythm - rhythem, rhythim, rhythym, rhytm, rythem, rythim, rythm & rythym.
My bugbear is that the articles rythm and rythm guitar both exist, albeit as redirects to the correct spelling. The problem is that editors enter and link the incorrect spelling, see that it forms a blue link, so leave it, believing it to be correct. They sometimes then repeat the misspelling later in the article. The net result is a Wikipedia article that contains several misspellings and does not look "professional".
Having looked at the talk page archives, I see that the argument has been made that misspelled articles should be kept, as redirects, to help those people with poor spelling, but this argument has never been accepted or refuted. The same argument appears equally valid for the deletion of such an article - we only help people to improve their spelling by giving them good spelling, not by making misspellings look correct, by appearing as a blue link in an article.
I would like to propose that either
Clicking on the green link would either run-through the redirect showing the correct page (with the correct spelling) to link directly to, or it would open the disambiguation page allowing the correct link to be selected, rather than leaving the casual reader at a disambiguation page, often only to find the article the original editor was hoping to link to, does not even exist.
(I initially called it a green link, but on consideration, that could create problems for people with red-green colour-blindness)
Arjayay (
talk) 12:31, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
The subsection "Deletion" currently reads:
As many have noted (see WP:AN#AfD's generally closed too soon), some people close AfDs too early, even though there is a strong community consensus for respecting the seven-day minimum. Consequently I propose to add the following to the policy (and also to WP:DRV):
This will encourage compliance with policy while not preventing genuine WP:SNOW cases (in such cases no admin is likely to undo the closure). Sandstein 20:55, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
...check this article Allen, Dorset, as i marked it for deletion, and put the discussion about it, at the right place please. Thanks. 87.240.192.225 ( talk) 17:00, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I recently got into a discussion with an admin who deleted a page I'd created that was nominated for speedy deletion, and wanted some clarification on speedy deletion policy. I'll just post what I thought the point of it was here, and I can be told in what ways it's an incorrect interpretation [3]:
My understanding of the process was as follows: Speedy deletion is meant to weed out obvious spam and other problematic material. That is why it explicitly states notability is not required to pass a speedy delete. On wikipedia, articles require the work of multiple people - thus, to create an article, it may not be the best article, because it's not always the case that a single person can do so - I certainly don't have the time to. Wikipedia is a collaborative effort. This article was only up for a few days - it did not have time to get updated by people with more time and knowledge than me. A great example of an article that went through this process is Darren Barrett. I want to contribute to wikipedia, but I have limited resources, and I contribute in what ways I can. In order for wikipedia to be a true collaborative resource, there needs the be a buffer for articles to pass speedy, but perhaps not pass AfD (or to pass after people become aware of the AfD and improve it). In this case, particularly, I am not capable of finding the sources in Japanese - that's why I created the article. I know that people are weary of creating article - for exactly this reason that they get deleted - and I have created articles in the past and been overjoyed that people have found stuff to contribute to them.
Thanks for any input. Tduk ( talk) 21:54, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
(outdent) After reading the article I think it was a valid A7 speedy deletion. Merely playing with a notable artist at some point in the past isn't a claim of significance, and the sources the article cites are all either clearly unreliable things like myspace, twitter and forums or they barely mentioned the subject at all. Hut 8.5 20:50, 27 October 2010 (UTC)
A recent AN thread has brought home to me the need to get some community consensus on deletion summaries. Please note: I'm not trying to make this about anybody's practices in particular. I'm hoping to get some conversation going about general best practice.
Per arbitration, administrators when using their tools are expected to communicate well, including "giving appropriate (as guided by Wikipedia's policies and guidelines) warnings prior to, and notification messages following, their actions; using accurate and descriptive edit and administrative action summaries; and responding promptly and fully to all good-faith concerns raised about their administrative actions." I believe that in the spirit of this, we need to be clear when deleting content to indicate by what practice or policy the content has been deleted. If an article is deleted at AfD, linking to the AfD is appropriate. If an article is deleted by PROD, noting that PROD was the procedure is appropriate (particularly as PROD deletions may be overturned on request). We have our handy pull-down deletion menu which can be used; for speedy deletions, these offer links to specific criteria. In the alternative, I think that we should require that language in edit summary should plainly communicate if not the number of the criterion, then at least its nature. This can avoid confusion for creators following the directions at Wikipedia:Why was my page deleted? and for bystanders who may observe the deletion log.
In that AN discussion, it has come to my attention that some deletions may necessarily require obscurity. I'm not sure if there are any that require obscurity to the point that identifying them as "attack pages" or whichever criterion may be in action. But, if so, there should be at least enough clarity in description that subsequent viewers aren't left to scratch their heads in confusion about what might have been wrong.
Accordingly, I propose that the lead of this policy be altered to in some manner emphasize the need for clear community. For example, where it current says "All such actions are logged", another sentence could be added to read:
Of course, if you like the idea but don't like the language, I'm completely open to other suggestions. :) I will be traveling from tomorrow, but I hope we'll be able to come up with a good, workable practice to avoid confusion. (Not that I'm suggesting we'll finish today; I'm just hoping that there will be enough conversation to still come up with something after my return. :D) -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 19:18, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
A log summary should not discuss material that is oversightable, but I see no harm in writing "contact privately to discuss" or "contact arbcom to discuss" or whatever would be applicable in whatever circumstance. It should be more clear than "the usual", unless the point of the deletion is
WP:DENY. /
ƒETCH
COMMS
/ 20:42, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
I agree that there should never be an empty deletion summary. But what to put in that summary seems to be what's under discussion. I think MRG's proposed text is probably decently on the right track, but I'd like us to discuss alternatives. (I'm not immediately proposing an alternative, because doing so tends to squelch others' ideas, in that typically, just the initial idea in a thread gets the most discussion : ) - jc37 20:09, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
All such actions are logged. Administrators should provide the process or policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In certain special cases (such as material requiring oversight or Arbitration Committee actions), the log summary should still specify the relevant policy, but not discuss the deleted material.
Based on Fetchcomms, what about something on these lines:
All such actions are logged. In almost all circumstances, administrators should provide the process or policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In extraordinary situations which require privacy or otherwise make clear summary undesirable, the administrator may leave a note in deletion summary instead requesting private contact for clarification.
I'd still be happy if there were some sort of code, but at least this would make sure that ordinary deletion summaries are clear. :) -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 21:10, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes, I agree that it's important that information be conveyed, but I would have thought "provide the process or policy-based reason" would make clear that what's needed is more than a link. Hmmm. "administrators should" is advisory, but I believe it is stronger than "It is recommended", and it has the advantage of not being in the passive voice. It's not really even as strong as the imperative already written at WP:CSD policy: "Make sure to specify the reason for deletion in the deletion summary". What about:
All such actions are logged. In almost all circumstances, administrators should note the process (such an a specific deletion discussion or CSD criteria) or other policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In extraordinary situations which require privacy or otherwise make clear summary undesirable, the administrator may leave a note in deletion summary instead that the deleting admin or a certain body (such as the arbitration committee or the Wikimedia Foundation) be contacted before restoring (un-deleting) the page or revision in question.
That keeps the language somewhat stronger, in my reading, but still falls short of the imperative voice in CDS policy. It also keeps it clear that the "call me" line should not be invoked lightly. -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:19, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
I think it's probably important to split the suggested content of the ES from the fact that they should supply an ES. And I also think noting that it should be relevant to the action is important as well.
I dunno about the second part. I agree that it shouldn't be used carelessly or arbitrarily. But since we typically suggest that the deleting admin be contacted before undeleting anyway, I don't think that it should be treated as such a big deal. (And using words like "extraordinary" seems to convey that to me.)
Anyway, for the first part, how about:
For the second:
Though I'm still not happy with even that. I think the parenthetical phrasing needs work. - jc37 22:55, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 35 | ← | Archive 38 | Archive 39 | Archive 40 | Archive 41 | Archive 42 | → | Archive 45 |
Given the decision to permit articles on words at WP:Wikipedia is not a dictionary, this is clearly no longer a deletion criteria, so I have removed it. I mean, if an article is not encyclopedic, then it's clearly no problem to delete, but just being about a word is now not sufficient for deletion.- Wolfkeeper 23:01, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
I looked around and couldn't find current rules on this - though it used to be the case that uncontroversial (e.g. not legal or BLP issues) pages deleted via AFD could be restored to userspace pretty much for the asking. The particular case: I want to restore Motif of harmful sensation to my userspace for further work and/or putting on the web somewhere else - it was deleted for being OR. I could just press the button to do this, but I wanted to check first :-) - David Gerard ( talk) 11:04, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
There are so many hoops to jump through, it would make more sense to have a link on the page that says perhaps "report this article." I'm always running into junk articles, but the one time I submitted an article for deletion it was too big a hassle to ever bother with again. Case in point, this article which I found this morning. Pure junk. http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=List_of_spoilers I see now that it is being considered for deletion. You guys are pretty good, but my recommendation for an easier way to nominate still stands. 75.121.33.79 ( talk) 14:08, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Ok, whose bright idea was it to start deleting a load of pages from the wiki again? (I remember last time that the entries of web comics came under threat. Now it seems there are file managers that "lack notability". Whatever that means... Is the wiki running out of HD space or why this periodic spring cleaning. It seems useless to me.
Ajasja Ljubetič —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.20.228.210 ( talk) 20:39, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
I'm guessing that this has probably come up in the past but I am basically wondering of how to deal with someone who is "deleting" (for all practical purposes) articles by turning them into redirects to inappropriate, though related articles. Like for example, what if someone redirected the article on World War I to the article on Treaty of Versailles based on a claim that the WWI article was a content fork of the latter? This seems like a egregious violation of Wikipedia policy on Deletion, not to mention WP:Consensus and associated guidelines. radek ( talk) 07:08, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
The issue is over the article German-Polish War (1002-1018) which User:Skapperod is redirecting [1] to a controversial article he himself created. Even if that article somehow survives the current RfC (which it doesn't look like) obviously an article on a military conflict is different than an article on the treaty which ended that military conflict (hence my WWI/Versailles example), so this kind of "deletion" is really irritating and disruptive, particularly since he's not even giving me a chance to work on the article. In fact his justification for the redirect that the article was a "unsourced stub" is misleading - it was a newly created article for which I clearly indicated that it was a work in progress [2]. radek ( talk) 10:29, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
I want to propose an article for deletion. There are about five links to it in other articles that were placed mostly by the same author, and several more links on lists. What should I do with these links? First have the article deleted, then the editors of the other articles (possibly I) will deal with the resulting red links? Or first remove/rewrite the links, and then propose for deletion? The former seems impolite to the other articles, the latter is unfair to the article proposed for deletion: after the links are removed, I could say in an argument that look, there are no links to it. So, what is the policy? I'm surprised this is not mentioned in this Deletion policy. -- GaborPete ( talk) 00:09, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
When wearing my WikiGnome hat, I correct misspellings of retrieve and its derivatives, and various misspellings of rhythm - rhythem, rhythim, rhythym, rhytm, rythem, rythim, rythm & rythym.
My bugbear is that the articles rythm and rythm guitar both exist, albeit as redirects to the correct spelling. The problem is that editors enter and link the incorrect spelling, see that it forms a blue link, so leave it, believing it to be correct. They sometimes then repeat the misspelling later in the article. The net result is a Wikipedia article that contains several misspellings and does not look "professional".
Having looked at the talk page archives, I see that the argument has been made that misspelled articles should be kept, as redirects, to help those people with poor spelling, but this argument has never been accepted or refuted. The same argument appears equally valid for the deletion of such an article - we only help people to improve their spelling by giving them good spelling, not by making misspellings look correct, by appearing as a blue link in an article.
I would like to propose that either
Clicking on the green link would either run-through the redirect showing the correct page (with the correct spelling) to link directly to, or it would open the disambiguation page allowing the correct link to be selected, rather than leaving the casual reader at a disambiguation page, often only to find the article the original editor was hoping to link to, does not even exist.
(I initially called it a green link, but on consideration, that could create problems for people with red-green colour-blindness)
Arjayay (
talk) 12:31, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
The subsection "Deletion" currently reads:
As many have noted (see WP:AN#AfD's generally closed too soon), some people close AfDs too early, even though there is a strong community consensus for respecting the seven-day minimum. Consequently I propose to add the following to the policy (and also to WP:DRV):
This will encourage compliance with policy while not preventing genuine WP:SNOW cases (in such cases no admin is likely to undo the closure). Sandstein 20:55, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
...check this article Allen, Dorset, as i marked it for deletion, and put the discussion about it, at the right place please. Thanks. 87.240.192.225 ( talk) 17:00, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I recently got into a discussion with an admin who deleted a page I'd created that was nominated for speedy deletion, and wanted some clarification on speedy deletion policy. I'll just post what I thought the point of it was here, and I can be told in what ways it's an incorrect interpretation [3]:
My understanding of the process was as follows: Speedy deletion is meant to weed out obvious spam and other problematic material. That is why it explicitly states notability is not required to pass a speedy delete. On wikipedia, articles require the work of multiple people - thus, to create an article, it may not be the best article, because it's not always the case that a single person can do so - I certainly don't have the time to. Wikipedia is a collaborative effort. This article was only up for a few days - it did not have time to get updated by people with more time and knowledge than me. A great example of an article that went through this process is Darren Barrett. I want to contribute to wikipedia, but I have limited resources, and I contribute in what ways I can. In order for wikipedia to be a true collaborative resource, there needs the be a buffer for articles to pass speedy, but perhaps not pass AfD (or to pass after people become aware of the AfD and improve it). In this case, particularly, I am not capable of finding the sources in Japanese - that's why I created the article. I know that people are weary of creating article - for exactly this reason that they get deleted - and I have created articles in the past and been overjoyed that people have found stuff to contribute to them.
Thanks for any input. Tduk ( talk) 21:54, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
(outdent) After reading the article I think it was a valid A7 speedy deletion. Merely playing with a notable artist at some point in the past isn't a claim of significance, and the sources the article cites are all either clearly unreliable things like myspace, twitter and forums or they barely mentioned the subject at all. Hut 8.5 20:50, 27 October 2010 (UTC)
A recent AN thread has brought home to me the need to get some community consensus on deletion summaries. Please note: I'm not trying to make this about anybody's practices in particular. I'm hoping to get some conversation going about general best practice.
Per arbitration, administrators when using their tools are expected to communicate well, including "giving appropriate (as guided by Wikipedia's policies and guidelines) warnings prior to, and notification messages following, their actions; using accurate and descriptive edit and administrative action summaries; and responding promptly and fully to all good-faith concerns raised about their administrative actions." I believe that in the spirit of this, we need to be clear when deleting content to indicate by what practice or policy the content has been deleted. If an article is deleted at AfD, linking to the AfD is appropriate. If an article is deleted by PROD, noting that PROD was the procedure is appropriate (particularly as PROD deletions may be overturned on request). We have our handy pull-down deletion menu which can be used; for speedy deletions, these offer links to specific criteria. In the alternative, I think that we should require that language in edit summary should plainly communicate if not the number of the criterion, then at least its nature. This can avoid confusion for creators following the directions at Wikipedia:Why was my page deleted? and for bystanders who may observe the deletion log.
In that AN discussion, it has come to my attention that some deletions may necessarily require obscurity. I'm not sure if there are any that require obscurity to the point that identifying them as "attack pages" or whichever criterion may be in action. But, if so, there should be at least enough clarity in description that subsequent viewers aren't left to scratch their heads in confusion about what might have been wrong.
Accordingly, I propose that the lead of this policy be altered to in some manner emphasize the need for clear community. For example, where it current says "All such actions are logged", another sentence could be added to read:
Of course, if you like the idea but don't like the language, I'm completely open to other suggestions. :) I will be traveling from tomorrow, but I hope we'll be able to come up with a good, workable practice to avoid confusion. (Not that I'm suggesting we'll finish today; I'm just hoping that there will be enough conversation to still come up with something after my return. :D) -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 19:18, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
A log summary should not discuss material that is oversightable, but I see no harm in writing "contact privately to discuss" or "contact arbcom to discuss" or whatever would be applicable in whatever circumstance. It should be more clear than "the usual", unless the point of the deletion is
WP:DENY. /
ƒETCH
COMMS
/ 20:42, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
I agree that there should never be an empty deletion summary. But what to put in that summary seems to be what's under discussion. I think MRG's proposed text is probably decently on the right track, but I'd like us to discuss alternatives. (I'm not immediately proposing an alternative, because doing so tends to squelch others' ideas, in that typically, just the initial idea in a thread gets the most discussion : ) - jc37 20:09, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
All such actions are logged. Administrators should provide the process or policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In certain special cases (such as material requiring oversight or Arbitration Committee actions), the log summary should still specify the relevant policy, but not discuss the deleted material.
Based on Fetchcomms, what about something on these lines:
All such actions are logged. In almost all circumstances, administrators should provide the process or policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In extraordinary situations which require privacy or otherwise make clear summary undesirable, the administrator may leave a note in deletion summary instead requesting private contact for clarification.
I'd still be happy if there were some sort of code, but at least this would make sure that ordinary deletion summaries are clear. :) -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 21:10, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes, I agree that it's important that information be conveyed, but I would have thought "provide the process or policy-based reason" would make clear that what's needed is more than a link. Hmmm. "administrators should" is advisory, but I believe it is stronger than "It is recommended", and it has the advantage of not being in the passive voice. It's not really even as strong as the imperative already written at WP:CSD policy: "Make sure to specify the reason for deletion in the deletion summary". What about:
All such actions are logged. In almost all circumstances, administrators should note the process (such an a specific deletion discussion or CSD criteria) or other policy-based reason for the page's deletion in the log summary. In extraordinary situations which require privacy or otherwise make clear summary undesirable, the administrator may leave a note in deletion summary instead that the deleting admin or a certain body (such as the arbitration committee or the Wikimedia Foundation) be contacted before restoring (un-deleting) the page or revision in question.
That keeps the language somewhat stronger, in my reading, but still falls short of the imperative voice in CDS policy. It also keeps it clear that the "call me" line should not be invoked lightly. -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:19, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
I think it's probably important to split the suggested content of the ES from the fact that they should supply an ES. And I also think noting that it should be relevant to the action is important as well.
I dunno about the second part. I agree that it shouldn't be used carelessly or arbitrarily. But since we typically suggest that the deleting admin be contacted before undeleting anyway, I don't think that it should be treated as such a big deal. (And using words like "extraordinary" seems to convey that to me.)
Anyway, for the first part, how about:
For the second:
Though I'm still not happy with even that. I think the parenthetical phrasing needs work. - jc37 22:55, 24 November 2010 (UTC)