The article was promoted by Gog the Mild via FACBot ( talk) 21 December 2021 [1].
This article is part of two lose series that have been on my back burner for a while (railway company war memorials and Charles Sargeant Jagger's war memorials). It follows on from my previous nominations of Jagger's works, the Royal Artillery Memorial and Portsmouth War Memorial. I've been working on it on and off for a couple of years but only recently got round to giving it a full overhaul when I had a bit of time on my hands and wanted a project I could complete without having to buy any more books (I already have a bookcase full of material on war memorials!). It's not a very long article becuase the subject seems to have been overlooked in favour of larger, outdoor works, but I hope the bibliography shows that that is not for want of research, and I think it contains everything that can be expected. As always, I'm eager to hear any constructive criticism. Thank you, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 21:20, 11 November 2021 (UTC)
Image review
Such was the size of the crowd that the GWR built viewing stands across two platforms and the tracks in between them.This feels too detailed for the lead and is also contradicted by
the railway company built a stand on platforms and 2 and 3, and moved wagons into the tracks between the platformsin the history section. Were the stands built across the tracks or not?
The GWR was also responsible for running a train to remove the Austrian ambassador.More detail please - where was he being removed from and to? Why were they being removed? Why was a special train needed, and why the GWR? Some of this would probably be better provided by a link to where this information is elsewhere, if it's anywhere, an offline reference that may or may not include this information is not helpful in this case.
the GWR ran ambulance trains and ... and ...too many "and"s.
the modern successor to the GWRsuggest linking this to Great Western Railway (train operating company)
but it explicitly include in the grade I listingchange to "but it is explicitly included..." Thryduulf ( talk) 15:42, 12 November 2021 (UTC)
Looks to be in good shape. A few nitpicks below:
Comissioning– typo
The GWR considered several schemes...– this sentence would probably flow a bit better if you split it into two.
During the Covid-19 pandemic– our article has COVID in all caps (and I would too), although that's certainly not a hill I'm going to die on.
Gloucesterhsire– typo
a train to remove the Austrian ambassador– "remove" to me connotes some sort of involuntary expulsion, which (to Thryduulf's point above) really makes the reader curious. I see the source uses "return"; perhaps something like "a train to transport the Austrian ambassador back to ____" would be best.
its ships– perhaps link Great Western Railway ships?
More soon. Best regards, Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 22:58, 19 November 2021 (UTC)
The GWR chose Jagger to design...– I'm a bit confused by this sentence. What was Blomfield recommending Jagger for? How (if at all) was "the government" connected to the memorial?
To give such a large crowd...– this sentence is long and complex; it might be more readable if you split it up. The same is true for the following sentence (
The ceremony began....
That's about all I have for you. Sincere apologies for the delay: time just got away from me! Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 07:10, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
A railway I remember my boyfriend mentioned, made an Oooo sound when seeing this FAC. Here we go.
Resolved comments from Gerald WL 01:12, 1 December 2021 (UTC) |
---|
=====Lead and infobox=====
Background
Commisionning
Design
History
References
|
Other than that, nice article. Comprehensive and detailed, using RS-es. If my comments are resolved, I'll support this.
Gerald
WL
02:45, 25 November 2021 (UTC)
I had a quick look for newspaper articles about the dedication in 1922, and found a short piece in the Observer on newspapers.com. About the only thing it contains that you don't already have is that GWR's General Manager, F.J.C. Pole, laid a wreath on behalf of GWR's staff. If you think it's worth including and if you don't have access I can clip the article for you. Otherwise there are just the minor points listed above. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 18:57, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
Support. Looks good, as usual. Harry, if you don't have newspapers.com access and are interested in getting similar clippings for other memorial (or other) articles you work on, I'd be happy to clip what I can find for you. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 22:59, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Will do soon. Hog Farm Talk 18:28, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
So sorry I'm just now getting to this - had some crazy stuff come up over the weekend.
Looking good, pending the items above. Hog Farm Talk 05:08, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
Harry, two quick comments. Although not mentioned in Pevsner, I have found it in a little book I've just obtained, The Immortals: London's finest statues. It doesn't actually have much that you've not already covered but I wonder if it might be included for completeness. Where I think it may be useful is the end of your Design section, in the discussion of Jagger's wartime experiences. Here, Blundell and Hudson have: "This memorial was created by someone who 'knew whereof he spoke'. Jagger was wounded at Gallipoli in 1915, and again on the Western Front in 1918, when he was awarded the MC." See what you think. You can find the full details for the book, here, and the page=16. My other quick observation is that, although the WWII rededication is mentioned in the Design section, it's not covered in the History section. I think there should be a mention of it in the latter. Perhaps a slight rejig/trim of the wording in the former section could avoid repetition. KJP1 ( talk) 09:56, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
The article was promoted by Gog the Mild via FACBot ( talk) 21 December 2021 [1].
This article is part of two lose series that have been on my back burner for a while (railway company war memorials and Charles Sargeant Jagger's war memorials). It follows on from my previous nominations of Jagger's works, the Royal Artillery Memorial and Portsmouth War Memorial. I've been working on it on and off for a couple of years but only recently got round to giving it a full overhaul when I had a bit of time on my hands and wanted a project I could complete without having to buy any more books (I already have a bookcase full of material on war memorials!). It's not a very long article becuase the subject seems to have been overlooked in favour of larger, outdoor works, but I hope the bibliography shows that that is not for want of research, and I think it contains everything that can be expected. As always, I'm eager to hear any constructive criticism. Thank you, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 21:20, 11 November 2021 (UTC)
Image review
Such was the size of the crowd that the GWR built viewing stands across two platforms and the tracks in between them.This feels too detailed for the lead and is also contradicted by
the railway company built a stand on platforms and 2 and 3, and moved wagons into the tracks between the platformsin the history section. Were the stands built across the tracks or not?
The GWR was also responsible for running a train to remove the Austrian ambassador.More detail please - where was he being removed from and to? Why were they being removed? Why was a special train needed, and why the GWR? Some of this would probably be better provided by a link to where this information is elsewhere, if it's anywhere, an offline reference that may or may not include this information is not helpful in this case.
the GWR ran ambulance trains and ... and ...too many "and"s.
the modern successor to the GWRsuggest linking this to Great Western Railway (train operating company)
but it explicitly include in the grade I listingchange to "but it is explicitly included..." Thryduulf ( talk) 15:42, 12 November 2021 (UTC)
Looks to be in good shape. A few nitpicks below:
Comissioning– typo
The GWR considered several schemes...– this sentence would probably flow a bit better if you split it into two.
During the Covid-19 pandemic– our article has COVID in all caps (and I would too), although that's certainly not a hill I'm going to die on.
Gloucesterhsire– typo
a train to remove the Austrian ambassador– "remove" to me connotes some sort of involuntary expulsion, which (to Thryduulf's point above) really makes the reader curious. I see the source uses "return"; perhaps something like "a train to transport the Austrian ambassador back to ____" would be best.
its ships– perhaps link Great Western Railway ships?
More soon. Best regards, Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 22:58, 19 November 2021 (UTC)
The GWR chose Jagger to design...– I'm a bit confused by this sentence. What was Blomfield recommending Jagger for? How (if at all) was "the government" connected to the memorial?
To give such a large crowd...– this sentence is long and complex; it might be more readable if you split it up. The same is true for the following sentence (
The ceremony began....
That's about all I have for you. Sincere apologies for the delay: time just got away from me! Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 07:10, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
A railway I remember my boyfriend mentioned, made an Oooo sound when seeing this FAC. Here we go.
Resolved comments from Gerald WL 01:12, 1 December 2021 (UTC) |
---|
=====Lead and infobox=====
Background
Commisionning
Design
History
References
|
Other than that, nice article. Comprehensive and detailed, using RS-es. If my comments are resolved, I'll support this.
Gerald
WL
02:45, 25 November 2021 (UTC)
I had a quick look for newspaper articles about the dedication in 1922, and found a short piece in the Observer on newspapers.com. About the only thing it contains that you don't already have is that GWR's General Manager, F.J.C. Pole, laid a wreath on behalf of GWR's staff. If you think it's worth including and if you don't have access I can clip the article for you. Otherwise there are just the minor points listed above. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 18:57, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
Support. Looks good, as usual. Harry, if you don't have newspapers.com access and are interested in getting similar clippings for other memorial (or other) articles you work on, I'd be happy to clip what I can find for you. Mike Christie ( talk - contribs - library) 22:59, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Will do soon. Hog Farm Talk 18:28, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
So sorry I'm just now getting to this - had some crazy stuff come up over the weekend.
Looking good, pending the items above. Hog Farm Talk 05:08, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
Harry, two quick comments. Although not mentioned in Pevsner, I have found it in a little book I've just obtained, The Immortals: London's finest statues. It doesn't actually have much that you've not already covered but I wonder if it might be included for completeness. Where I think it may be useful is the end of your Design section, in the discussion of Jagger's wartime experiences. Here, Blundell and Hudson have: "This memorial was created by someone who 'knew whereof he spoke'. Jagger was wounded at Gallipoli in 1915, and again on the Western Front in 1918, when he was awarded the MC." See what you think. You can find the full details for the book, here, and the page=16. My other quick observation is that, although the WWII rededication is mentioned in the Design section, it's not covered in the History section. I think there should be a mention of it in the latter. Perhaps a slight rejig/trim of the wording in the former section could avoid repetition. KJP1 ( talk) 09:56, 12 December 2021 (UTC)