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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.


The result was delete. A consensus to delete has formed over the absence of sufficient in-depth treatment in reliable sources. BD2412 T 05:30, 15 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Nigar Helmi Abbasbeyli

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Nigar Helmi Abbasbeyli (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
(Find sources:  Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

The person is not notability, does not meet the criteria. Samral ( talk) 11:34, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply

Keep - Article format is an issue, but person is notability per WP:SIGCOV by the sources cited in the article. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 16:49, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete Not only does the subject fail notability, the editor who created the article made exactly 10 edits before posting this article on the main space. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 22:59, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply
    You are right in questioning the edit history of the creator, however the topic does meet notability through significant coverage apparent in the sources used in the article. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 15:11, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • I can only speak about the Turkish sources here. Ref 2 from an RS is quite lenghty, however, it mostly consists of "Her work will be shown in an expedition" and then it's a bunch of quotes from a few people. I don't really see much significant coverage about her. Ref 3 from an RS is super short, and wouldn't qualify as significant coverage. Ref 4 from an RS is only 3 sentences long, wouldn't call that SIGCOV either. Ref 7 is the exact same source as Ref 2, so it can't be counted as seperate. Haberler.com isn't considered to be reliable on the Turkish Wikipedia anyway. Ref 10 is from a random website I've never heard of, I don't think it's a RS. Now, looking at the Turkish sources, I don't see a reason why I should be convinced of Azerbaijani being any different. I'd be surprised if there suddenly was a huge contrast between the sources. Considering the nominator is fluent in Azerbaijani (and a former azwiki sysop), I'm leaning towards delete as well. Mind you that just looking at the titles, Refs 1 and 8 appear to be about the exact same thing as Ref 2. Gonna pull the refbomb card here. ~Styyx Talk? 17:10, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
    She may as well meet Wikipedia:WikiProject Contemporary Art/Notability≈ under criteria: "has been a substantial part of a significant exhibition" as her exhibition called Legacy of Karabakh is displayed at the Atatürk Cultural Center which is a significant venue and the exhibition seems rather significant. @ Styyx I see why you are pulling the Refbomb card, I read up on it. However, I think this is not a case of refbomb because even Daily Sabah, a reliable news source given the topic, refers to her as "Famous Azerbaijani Artists". PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 17:33, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
That's an essay, which tend to have almost no value when it comes to an AfD per WP:SNG. You could make an argument for WP:ENT#4b WP:NARTIST#4b instead, which is at least a guideline. However, I think it's a bit borderline. Having a single exhibition, for just over a week, in a culture center that hosts hundreds of exhibitions a year, IMO doesn't make someone automatically notable, and the guideline itself states that those people are "likely notable", not "definitely". I don't think an argument based on barely meeting an SNG is going to convince others to keep what is pretty much cross-wiki spam. ~Styyx Talk? 18:04, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
What do you mean by essay? The article seems to talk about what happened at the opening of the exhibit. "launched in AKM by Deputy Minister of Tourism Özgül Özkan Yavuz, Consul General of the Republic of Azerbaijan in Istanbul Narmina Mustafayeva" seems quite significant, especially in the political-historical context that the exhibition sits in with the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. What are you referring to with Wikipedia:Notability (people)#4B? The exhibition is talked about in the major Turkish newspapers, not just Daily Sabah, Akşam, Yeni Şafak but also the big daily's Milliyet, Hürriyet have entries about this exhibition. So yeah its not definitely notable as most things as you say, but makes a quite strong case for it being notable enough. PiccklePiclePikel@ Styyx ( talk) 18:42, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
What I mean is that Wikipedia:WikiProject Contemporary Art/Notability you linked above is a Wikipedia essay, which aren't significant at AfD's (as explained by the final paragraph of WP:SNG). I meant to refer to WP:NARTIST#4b, not WP:ENT. The subject barely meets that, but I'm not willing to keep a cross-wiki spam article that only has a claim of notability because they had a 9-day exhibition at AKM which hosts hundreds of those each year. These criteria point that such subjects are likely notable but not definitely, and WP:SNG states that topics meeting such criteria can still be deleted "if adequate sourcing or significant coverage cannot be found", which is the case here. ~Styyx Talk? 19:23, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Oh yes, @ Styyx, then I agree about #4b, which is basically the same criteria that I referred to in the Wikipedia essay. And yes, "such subjects are likely notable but not definitely" . In this case "adequate sourcing or significant coverage" can be found in the form of articles in the major Turkish dailies. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 19:37, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
I'd like to echo what I said in my first comment: most of these are the exact same source, copied word for word, that can't be considered as seperate. A good chunk aren't reliable anyway. ~Styyx Talk? 06:31, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
@ Styyx I understand your point, however, that is not completely accurate. Other than the English language Daily Sabah article and the Azeri YeniGundem article, the remaining articles originate from 3 separate sources. One from İhlas News Agency, another from Anadolu Agency, and lastly from an article written in Platin by Olcay Can Kaplan. I have re-organised the list of articles so that they are grouped by the ones with similar origins so that this will be easier to see. These original sources are generally reliable given the topic.-- PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 13:37, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Comment The bludgeoning by PiccklePiclePikel prompted me to take a look at their editing history. Joined 2022-08-25 and has jumped into AFD with a vengeance, with a knowledge of the process and vehemence of opinion that would be pretty hard to acquire in less than two weeks. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 00:28, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Thanks, that's a very interesting AfD stats page. Did not mean to bludgeon. It's hard to be credible in saying that there is significant coverage without actually going and finding that coverage to present to the discussion, thereby the reason for my further contribution. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 00:59, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Comment Pinging Nythar who has the same concerns about your swift learning curve of the AfD process. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 02:04, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Thank you, WomenArtistUpdates. I encountered PiccklePiclePikel during their third day on Wikipedia, here: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tello UAV. Their first few edits were random, before focusing on AfD. I don't know why, but their knowledge doesn't appear to be at the level of a newcomer. They might have used an IP before switching to an account, I don't know. Other than that, the discussions I've been having with them (example: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Music of Your Life) have been exhausting, I feel it might be wp:bludgeoning. Nythar T. C 04:16, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 02:12, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply

  • Comment So based on the source analysis waaaay up top, she isn't notable. If she's been the part of a major museum display/exhibition, fine, but we still need sources to confirm that or it's a tenuous GNG at best. Oaktree b ( talk) 04:20, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Comment Also the original creator of the article and the one person who !voted in support of the article seem to have ended their participation on English Wikipedia. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 16:25, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply
    Pickle has been asked on his user page about other accounts, socking? I don't know. Oaktree b ( talk) 03:06, 9 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete Nothing in JStor, Gscohlar, Gbooks, or looking in the ULAN artists search. If she was in the Unesco thing, I'd expect her to at least be in ULAN. zero sources found. Whatever thsat art3f thing is, the artists either have to pay to display or they get sponsored; it looks very much like a sales platform, not an art gallery display (going by what's on their French website, [1]. This whole thing smells fishy. These aren't major art exhibitions; she spent a whole 2 days in the Carousel du Louvre and 2 days in Monaco? The Carousel du Louvre is basically a shopping center, Lacoste and Pandora are there [2]. Art Expo in New York is a trade fair [3]... So displaying there is basically trying to sell stuff. She is in no way notable. This is likely a promotional use of wiki... Shameful, trying to represent these "galleries" as exhibitions in museums. Oaktree b ( talk) 03:10, 9 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete owing to a lack of multiple, in-depth, high quality sources with which to write a biography. Does not meet WP:GNG. Styyx has covered the Turkish sources, I’ve looked at the rest, they are all about an exhibition at the Atatürk Cultural Center and do not represent significant coverage of the subject of the article. My own searches find nothing useful. -- Malcolmxl5 ( talk) 01:11, 15 September 2022 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from " https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Nigar_Helmi_Abbasbeyli&oldid=1110787399"
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.


The result was delete. A consensus to delete has formed over the absence of sufficient in-depth treatment in reliable sources. BD2412 T 05:30, 15 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Nigar Helmi Abbasbeyli

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

Nigar Helmi Abbasbeyli (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
(Find sources:  Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

The person is not notability, does not meet the criteria. Samral ( talk) 11:34, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply

Keep - Article format is an issue, but person is notability per WP:SIGCOV by the sources cited in the article. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 16:49, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete Not only does the subject fail notability, the editor who created the article made exactly 10 edits before posting this article on the main space. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 22:59, 31 August 2022 (UTC) reply
    You are right in questioning the edit history of the creator, however the topic does meet notability through significant coverage apparent in the sources used in the article. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 15:11, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • I can only speak about the Turkish sources here. Ref 2 from an RS is quite lenghty, however, it mostly consists of "Her work will be shown in an expedition" and then it's a bunch of quotes from a few people. I don't really see much significant coverage about her. Ref 3 from an RS is super short, and wouldn't qualify as significant coverage. Ref 4 from an RS is only 3 sentences long, wouldn't call that SIGCOV either. Ref 7 is the exact same source as Ref 2, so it can't be counted as seperate. Haberler.com isn't considered to be reliable on the Turkish Wikipedia anyway. Ref 10 is from a random website I've never heard of, I don't think it's a RS. Now, looking at the Turkish sources, I don't see a reason why I should be convinced of Azerbaijani being any different. I'd be surprised if there suddenly was a huge contrast between the sources. Considering the nominator is fluent in Azerbaijani (and a former azwiki sysop), I'm leaning towards delete as well. Mind you that just looking at the titles, Refs 1 and 8 appear to be about the exact same thing as Ref 2. Gonna pull the refbomb card here. ~Styyx Talk? 17:10, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
    She may as well meet Wikipedia:WikiProject Contemporary Art/Notability≈ under criteria: "has been a substantial part of a significant exhibition" as her exhibition called Legacy of Karabakh is displayed at the Atatürk Cultural Center which is a significant venue and the exhibition seems rather significant. @ Styyx I see why you are pulling the Refbomb card, I read up on it. However, I think this is not a case of refbomb because even Daily Sabah, a reliable news source given the topic, refers to her as "Famous Azerbaijani Artists". PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 17:33, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
That's an essay, which tend to have almost no value when it comes to an AfD per WP:SNG. You could make an argument for WP:ENT#4b WP:NARTIST#4b instead, which is at least a guideline. However, I think it's a bit borderline. Having a single exhibition, for just over a week, in a culture center that hosts hundreds of exhibitions a year, IMO doesn't make someone automatically notable, and the guideline itself states that those people are "likely notable", not "definitely". I don't think an argument based on barely meeting an SNG is going to convince others to keep what is pretty much cross-wiki spam. ~Styyx Talk? 18:04, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
What do you mean by essay? The article seems to talk about what happened at the opening of the exhibit. "launched in AKM by Deputy Minister of Tourism Özgül Özkan Yavuz, Consul General of the Republic of Azerbaijan in Istanbul Narmina Mustafayeva" seems quite significant, especially in the political-historical context that the exhibition sits in with the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. What are you referring to with Wikipedia:Notability (people)#4B? The exhibition is talked about in the major Turkish newspapers, not just Daily Sabah, Akşam, Yeni Şafak but also the big daily's Milliyet, Hürriyet have entries about this exhibition. So yeah its not definitely notable as most things as you say, but makes a quite strong case for it being notable enough. PiccklePiclePikel@ Styyx ( talk) 18:42, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
What I mean is that Wikipedia:WikiProject Contemporary Art/Notability you linked above is a Wikipedia essay, which aren't significant at AfD's (as explained by the final paragraph of WP:SNG). I meant to refer to WP:NARTIST#4b, not WP:ENT. The subject barely meets that, but I'm not willing to keep a cross-wiki spam article that only has a claim of notability because they had a 9-day exhibition at AKM which hosts hundreds of those each year. These criteria point that such subjects are likely notable but not definitely, and WP:SNG states that topics meeting such criteria can still be deleted "if adequate sourcing or significant coverage cannot be found", which is the case here. ~Styyx Talk? 19:23, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Oh yes, @ Styyx, then I agree about #4b, which is basically the same criteria that I referred to in the Wikipedia essay. And yes, "such subjects are likely notable but not definitely" . In this case "adequate sourcing or significant coverage" can be found in the form of articles in the major Turkish dailies. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 19:37, 1 September 2022 (UTC) reply
I'd like to echo what I said in my first comment: most of these are the exact same source, copied word for word, that can't be considered as seperate. A good chunk aren't reliable anyway. ~Styyx Talk? 06:31, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
@ Styyx I understand your point, however, that is not completely accurate. Other than the English language Daily Sabah article and the Azeri YeniGundem article, the remaining articles originate from 3 separate sources. One from İhlas News Agency, another from Anadolu Agency, and lastly from an article written in Platin by Olcay Can Kaplan. I have re-organised the list of articles so that they are grouped by the ones with similar origins so that this will be easier to see. These original sources are generally reliable given the topic.-- PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 13:37, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Comment The bludgeoning by PiccklePiclePikel prompted me to take a look at their editing history. Joined 2022-08-25 and has jumped into AFD with a vengeance, with a knowledge of the process and vehemence of opinion that would be pretty hard to acquire in less than two weeks. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 00:28, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Thanks, that's a very interesting AfD stats page. Did not mean to bludgeon. It's hard to be credible in saying that there is significant coverage without actually going and finding that coverage to present to the discussion, thereby the reason for my further contribution. PiccklePiclePikel ( talk) 00:59, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Comment Pinging Nythar who has the same concerns about your swift learning curve of the AfD process. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 02:04, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply
Thank you, WomenArtistUpdates. I encountered PiccklePiclePikel during their third day on Wikipedia, here: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tello UAV. Their first few edits were random, before focusing on AfD. I don't know why, but their knowledge doesn't appear to be at the level of a newcomer. They might have used an IP before switching to an account, I don't know. Other than that, the discussions I've been having with them (example: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Music of Your Life) have been exhausting, I feel it might be wp:bludgeoning. Nythar T. C 04:16, 2 September 2022 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 02:12, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply

  • Comment So based on the source analysis waaaay up top, she isn't notable. If she's been the part of a major museum display/exhibition, fine, but we still need sources to confirm that or it's a tenuous GNG at best. Oaktree b ( talk) 04:20, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Comment Also the original creator of the article and the one person who !voted in support of the article seem to have ended their participation on English Wikipedia. WomenArtistUpdates ( talk) 16:25, 8 September 2022 (UTC) reply
    Pickle has been asked on his user page about other accounts, socking? I don't know. Oaktree b ( talk) 03:06, 9 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete Nothing in JStor, Gscohlar, Gbooks, or looking in the ULAN artists search. If she was in the Unesco thing, I'd expect her to at least be in ULAN. zero sources found. Whatever thsat art3f thing is, the artists either have to pay to display or they get sponsored; it looks very much like a sales platform, not an art gallery display (going by what's on their French website, [1]. This whole thing smells fishy. These aren't major art exhibitions; she spent a whole 2 days in the Carousel du Louvre and 2 days in Monaco? The Carousel du Louvre is basically a shopping center, Lacoste and Pandora are there [2]. Art Expo in New York is a trade fair [3]... So displaying there is basically trying to sell stuff. She is in no way notable. This is likely a promotional use of wiki... Shameful, trying to represent these "galleries" as exhibitions in museums. Oaktree b ( talk) 03:10, 9 September 2022 (UTC) reply
  • Delete owing to a lack of multiple, in-depth, high quality sources with which to write a biography. Does not meet WP:GNG. Styyx has covered the Turkish sources, I’ve looked at the rest, they are all about an exhibition at the Atatürk Cultural Center and do not represent significant coverage of the subject of the article. My own searches find nothing useful. -- Malcolmxl5 ( talk) 01:11, 15 September 2022 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from " https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Nigar_Helmi_Abbasbeyli&oldid=1110787399"

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