- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. Sandstein 16:33, 2 February 2016 (UTC)
- Matt Feiler ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
fails WP:NGRIDIRON Joeykai ( talk) 20:52, 10 January 2016 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 05:22, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 05:22, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Pennsylvania-related deletion discussions. Human3015 It will rain 08:16, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Human3015 It will rain 08:16, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - Non-notable former college football player, and pro practice squad member who has not played in a regular season game. Subject does not satisfy specific notability criteria for a college athletes per WP:NCOLLATH, nor for pro football players per WP:NGRIDIRON, and lacks significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable, secondary sources to satisfy the general notability guidelines per WP:GNG. Without prejudice to recreate if and when subject plays in a regular season NFL game. Closing admin should userfy on request for article creator. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:15, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:20, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States-related deletion discussions. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:17, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment. A quick search does turn up some coverage, including (1) this, (2) this, (3) this, and (4) this from the LNP Media Group, (5) this from The Patriot News, and (6) this from the Associated Press naming him to its Little All-America Team. Cbl62 ( talk) 13:28, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- FYI, Lancasteronline.com = LPN = LPN Media Group = Lancaster Patriot-News = The Patriot-News, are all one and the same source, and the subject's hometown newspaper in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. The Associated Press wire coverage of the Little All-America selections is a mere listing, and the Little All-America Team is not a major CFB award or honor and objectively is of far less significance than even minor selectors of Division I FBS All-America teams. In order to satisfy GNG, we need to see significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable, secondary sources. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 14:10, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- I believe you are incorrect. The
The Patriot News appears to be distinct from the
LNP Media Group (not "LPN"). Accordingly, there is significant coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources. That said, there is a tendency to discount (but not disregard) sources from smaller media outlets. I'm not sufficiently familiar with Lancaster County, though I note that The Patriot News claims half a million weekly readers. Because of my lack of familiarity, and also because I tend to hold Division II players to a higher standard, I am on the fence on this one.
Cbl62 (
talk)
17:24, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I stand corrected: we have coverage in not one, but two hometown newspapers. The usual measure of paid circulation is the daily number of hard copies actually sold, which averaged roughly 62,000 for the 6 months ending September 30, 2014 according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation. "Readers" is the happy-talk marketing number, and using the weekly number instead of the daily number clearly sounds more impressive. In any event, it's still a slender thread upon which to base the notability of a wannabe professional athlete. I got more coverage as a junior high school art student on the front page of the "Local/People" section in my hometown newspaper with greater audited circulation -- perhaps that makes me a notable artist per GNG?
- Just to be clear on the corrected tally: we have four articles, arguably significant coverage, all from the same source, LNP/Lancasteronline.com/LNP Media Group, and one "transaction" article in the separate Patriot-News, plus one bare listing of the subject's name in an AP wire article. Still looks like a GNG fail to me, lacking significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable sources.
Dirtlawyer1 (
talk)
19:57, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Thank you for admitting your error. However, since The Patriot-News serves Harrisburg, and Feiler is from Strasbug, which is located about 50 miles away, I don't think it can be regarded as his "hometown" newspaper. In the end, I'm not voting "keep", but it's a closer call IMO than you suggest. Cbl62 ( talk) 23:37, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I stand corrected: we have coverage in not one, but two hometown newspapers. The usual measure of paid circulation is the daily number of hard copies actually sold, which averaged roughly 62,000 for the 6 months ending September 30, 2014 according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation. "Readers" is the happy-talk marketing number, and using the weekly number instead of the daily number clearly sounds more impressive. In any event, it's still a slender thread upon which to base the notability of a wannabe professional athlete. I got more coverage as a junior high school art student on the front page of the "Local/People" section in my hometown newspaper with greater audited circulation -- perhaps that makes me a notable artist per GNG?
- I believe you are incorrect. The
The Patriot News appears to be distinct from the
LNP Media Group (not "LPN"). Accordingly, there is significant coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources. That said, there is a tendency to discount (but not disregard) sources from smaller media outlets. I'm not sufficiently familiar with Lancaster County, though I note that The Patriot News claims half a million weekly readers. Because of my lack of familiarity, and also because I tend to hold Division II players to a higher standard, I am on the fence on this one.
Cbl62 (
talk)
17:24, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Delete if that's all we have, I don't see it being enough to pass WP:GNG. More turns up, I'll listen...-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 18:45, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep The page has good sources and the player in on an NFL roster. If the only reason this person does not require a page is because he hasn't "played a down in the NFL" then why are there so many other player pages of players that have never played a down in the NFL still active and not being reviewed? In my opinion, if a player in on an NFL roster (that includes practice squad) then a player page is noteworthy. They're are only 10 players allowed on a teams practice squad and if a team wins the Super Bowl, practice squad members are given a ring for contributing to the team.
UW1941 (
talk)
16:37, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment your opinion is valued and you should feel free to disagree. There has been extensive discussion on this issue before, and the overall consensus is that the practice squad does not automatically qualify for notability. If the player had extensive coverage for college play or any other issue, then they could pass the general notability guideline which is based on extent of coverage in third party reliable sources. I don't think that has been achieved here, but I could be wrong and missing something (or heck I could just be wrong). Consensus can change. Keep up your disagreement.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 16:52, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per Cbl62 ( talk · contribs)'s sources. The first and third sources from LNP Media Group provide substantial coverage of the subject. The fifth source from The Patriot News, which provides significant coverage, notes: "Feiler was a four-year starter for Bloomsburg, and he never missed a game in four years. In his senior campaign last fall, he was an Associated Press Little All-American pick, and he was tabbed an All-American by Don Hansen Football Gazette." There is enough coverage for him to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline. Cunard ( talk) 07:45, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 19:21, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 19:21, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per Cbl62 ( talk · contribs)'s sources. There's many reliable sources. -- MurderByDeletionism "bang!" 01:36, 2 February 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. Sandstein 16:33, 2 February 2016 (UTC)
- Matt Feiler ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
fails WP:NGRIDIRON Joeykai ( talk) 20:52, 10 January 2016 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 05:22, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 05:22, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Pennsylvania-related deletion discussions. Human3015 It will rain 08:16, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Human3015 It will rain 08:16, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - Non-notable former college football player, and pro practice squad member who has not played in a regular season game. Subject does not satisfy specific notability criteria for a college athletes per WP:NCOLLATH, nor for pro football players per WP:NGRIDIRON, and lacks significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable, secondary sources to satisfy the general notability guidelines per WP:GNG. Without prejudice to recreate if and when subject plays in a regular season NFL game. Closing admin should userfy on request for article creator. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:15, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:20, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States-related deletion discussions. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 10:17, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment. A quick search does turn up some coverage, including (1) this, (2) this, (3) this, and (4) this from the LNP Media Group, (5) this from The Patriot News, and (6) this from the Associated Press naming him to its Little All-America Team. Cbl62 ( talk) 13:28, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- FYI, Lancasteronline.com = LPN = LPN Media Group = Lancaster Patriot-News = The Patriot-News, are all one and the same source, and the subject's hometown newspaper in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. The Associated Press wire coverage of the Little All-America selections is a mere listing, and the Little All-America Team is not a major CFB award or honor and objectively is of far less significance than even minor selectors of Division I FBS All-America teams. In order to satisfy GNG, we need to see significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable, secondary sources. Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 14:10, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- I believe you are incorrect. The
The Patriot News appears to be distinct from the
LNP Media Group (not "LPN"). Accordingly, there is significant coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources. That said, there is a tendency to discount (but not disregard) sources from smaller media outlets. I'm not sufficiently familiar with Lancaster County, though I note that The Patriot News claims half a million weekly readers. Because of my lack of familiarity, and also because I tend to hold Division II players to a higher standard, I am on the fence on this one.
Cbl62 (
talk)
17:24, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I stand corrected: we have coverage in not one, but two hometown newspapers. The usual measure of paid circulation is the daily number of hard copies actually sold, which averaged roughly 62,000 for the 6 months ending September 30, 2014 according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation. "Readers" is the happy-talk marketing number, and using the weekly number instead of the daily number clearly sounds more impressive. In any event, it's still a slender thread upon which to base the notability of a wannabe professional athlete. I got more coverage as a junior high school art student on the front page of the "Local/People" section in my hometown newspaper with greater audited circulation -- perhaps that makes me a notable artist per GNG?
- Just to be clear on the corrected tally: we have four articles, arguably significant coverage, all from the same source, LNP/Lancasteronline.com/LNP Media Group, and one "transaction" article in the separate Patriot-News, plus one bare listing of the subject's name in an AP wire article. Still looks like a GNG fail to me, lacking significant coverage in multiple independent, reliable sources.
Dirtlawyer1 (
talk)
19:57, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Thank you for admitting your error. However, since The Patriot-News serves Harrisburg, and Feiler is from Strasbug, which is located about 50 miles away, I don't think it can be regarded as his "hometown" newspaper. In the end, I'm not voting "keep", but it's a closer call IMO than you suggest. Cbl62 ( talk) 23:37, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- I stand corrected: we have coverage in not one, but two hometown newspapers. The usual measure of paid circulation is the daily number of hard copies actually sold, which averaged roughly 62,000 for the 6 months ending September 30, 2014 according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation. "Readers" is the happy-talk marketing number, and using the weekly number instead of the daily number clearly sounds more impressive. In any event, it's still a slender thread upon which to base the notability of a wannabe professional athlete. I got more coverage as a junior high school art student on the front page of the "Local/People" section in my hometown newspaper with greater audited circulation -- perhaps that makes me a notable artist per GNG?
- I believe you are incorrect. The
The Patriot News appears to be distinct from the
LNP Media Group (not "LPN"). Accordingly, there is significant coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources. That said, there is a tendency to discount (but not disregard) sources from smaller media outlets. I'm not sufficiently familiar with Lancaster County, though I note that The Patriot News claims half a million weekly readers. Because of my lack of familiarity, and also because I tend to hold Division II players to a higher standard, I am on the fence on this one.
Cbl62 (
talk)
17:24, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Delete if that's all we have, I don't see it being enough to pass WP:GNG. More turns up, I'll listen...-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 18:45, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep The page has good sources and the player in on an NFL roster. If the only reason this person does not require a page is because he hasn't "played a down in the NFL" then why are there so many other player pages of players that have never played a down in the NFL still active and not being reviewed? In my opinion, if a player in on an NFL roster (that includes practice squad) then a player page is noteworthy. They're are only 10 players allowed on a teams practice squad and if a team wins the Super Bowl, practice squad members are given a ring for contributing to the team.
UW1941 (
talk)
16:37, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment your opinion is valued and you should feel free to disagree. There has been extensive discussion on this issue before, and the overall consensus is that the practice squad does not automatically qualify for notability. If the player had extensive coverage for college play or any other issue, then they could pass the general notability guideline which is based on extent of coverage in third party reliable sources. I don't think that has been achieved here, but I could be wrong and missing something (or heck I could just be wrong). Consensus can change. Keep up your disagreement.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 16:52, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per Cbl62 ( talk · contribs)'s sources. The first and third sources from LNP Media Group provide substantial coverage of the subject. The fifth source from The Patriot News, which provides significant coverage, notes: "Feiler was a four-year starter for Bloomsburg, and he never missed a game in four years. In his senior campaign last fall, he was an Associated Press Little All-American pick, and he was tabbed an All-American by Don Hansen Football Gazette." There is enough coverage for him to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline. Cunard ( talk) 07:45, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 19:21, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 19:21, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per Cbl62 ( talk · contribs)'s sources. There's many reliable sources. -- MurderByDeletionism "bang!" 01:36, 2 February 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.