- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was Drafify. Star Mississippi 01:54, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- List of country subdivision flags in Africa ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Wholly unsourced, WP:NOTGALLERY * Pppery * it has begun... 00:04, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Lists and Africa. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 00:18, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Transwiki to Commons. Reywas92 Talk 02:50, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Draftify this and the related articles, too. So, I don't think there's any way to discuss this in isolation. This was sectioned off from
List of country subdivision flags due to ongoing concerns about that article's size and load times, as were the
Europe,
North America, and
South America subtopics. The
Oceania subpage was evidently Draftified. With all that said, I'm really conflicted here. The
most recent AFD for the parent article closed as Keep and offered some suggestions as to how to make it more functional... not that any of those were ever implemented. On one hand, the flags of first- and second-order political subdivisions makes for a pretty well-formed list topic and ought to pass
WP:LISTCRIT. Although evidently not actually policy, it's certainly in line with
Wikipedia:Gazetteer. On the other hand, there's been absolutely no effort to ensure that these flags are accurate or that only official flags are included (indeed, by the main topic's plain text, that's not the case, and there's nothing to indicate which are which). I think the goal here is laudable; I think the execution is incompatible with policy. To make this work, an ambitious editor (not it!) would need to start with a list of the qualifying political subdivisons (in order to know what the list should include), then go one by one through them to source the flag, including what we've got if that's accurate or correcting it if not (and, in cases where political subdivisions do not have flags by official policy, including and sourcing that). Oh, and the debate about how this should be presented (gallery-style or list-icon-style or some third option) would need to be put to rest, too. That's a huge workload that's ill-suited to being handled in place. One of the component pieces has already been Draftified; that's compelling enough reason to move the rest.
Lubal (
talk)
03:13, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- A couple of reasons with regards to my actions:
- I use image galleries instead of templates, as they are easier to edit and require less data to store, thus load times for articles is less.
- I am aware of the request to cite sources for the flags. I have tried finding credible sources, so far only being successful in citing Argentina. I request help for the rest.
- Some images came from me moving galleries from the main list to the continent lists. Others came from looking at the flags listed in lists for each country. That is why they are not cited.
- I hope these points clarify how we got to where we are. For the nth time ( talk) 17:27, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- A couple of reasons with regards to my actions:
- Draftify per above. Orientls ( talk) 05:16, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- The potential OR concerns worry me, surely those Liberian flags do not look like that...
Traumnovelle (
talk)
07:08, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- In fact, the Liberian flags aren't the problem. They look weird to most of us due to systemic bias; they're derived from design traditions in native quilting rather than Eurocentric heraldry. There was an entire scholarly article about them in Raven: A Journal of Vexillology, which is viewable at this archive link. Lubal ( talk) 13:20, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was Drafify. Star Mississippi 01:54, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- List of country subdivision flags in Africa ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Wholly unsourced, WP:NOTGALLERY * Pppery * it has begun... 00:04, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Lists and Africa. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 00:18, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Transwiki to Commons. Reywas92 Talk 02:50, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Draftify this and the related articles, too. So, I don't think there's any way to discuss this in isolation. This was sectioned off from
List of country subdivision flags due to ongoing concerns about that article's size and load times, as were the
Europe,
North America, and
South America subtopics. The
Oceania subpage was evidently Draftified. With all that said, I'm really conflicted here. The
most recent AFD for the parent article closed as Keep and offered some suggestions as to how to make it more functional... not that any of those were ever implemented. On one hand, the flags of first- and second-order political subdivisions makes for a pretty well-formed list topic and ought to pass
WP:LISTCRIT. Although evidently not actually policy, it's certainly in line with
Wikipedia:Gazetteer. On the other hand, there's been absolutely no effort to ensure that these flags are accurate or that only official flags are included (indeed, by the main topic's plain text, that's not the case, and there's nothing to indicate which are which). I think the goal here is laudable; I think the execution is incompatible with policy. To make this work, an ambitious editor (not it!) would need to start with a list of the qualifying political subdivisons (in order to know what the list should include), then go one by one through them to source the flag, including what we've got if that's accurate or correcting it if not (and, in cases where political subdivisions do not have flags by official policy, including and sourcing that). Oh, and the debate about how this should be presented (gallery-style or list-icon-style or some third option) would need to be put to rest, too. That's a huge workload that's ill-suited to being handled in place. One of the component pieces has already been Draftified; that's compelling enough reason to move the rest.
Lubal (
talk)
03:13, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- A couple of reasons with regards to my actions:
- I use image galleries instead of templates, as they are easier to edit and require less data to store, thus load times for articles is less.
- I am aware of the request to cite sources for the flags. I have tried finding credible sources, so far only being successful in citing Argentina. I request help for the rest.
- Some images came from me moving galleries from the main list to the continent lists. Others came from looking at the flags listed in lists for each country. That is why they are not cited.
- I hope these points clarify how we got to where we are. For the nth time ( talk) 17:27, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- A couple of reasons with regards to my actions:
- Draftify per above. Orientls ( talk) 05:16, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- The potential OR concerns worry me, surely those Liberian flags do not look like that...
Traumnovelle (
talk)
07:08, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- In fact, the Liberian flags aren't the problem. They look weird to most of us due to systemic bias; they're derived from design traditions in native quilting rather than Eurocentric heraldry. There was an entire scholarly article about them in Raven: A Journal of Vexillology, which is viewable at this archive link. Lubal ( talk) 13:20, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.