- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Modussiccandi ( talk) 08:56, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Churaman Ahir ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
A quick Google search doesn’t bring anything notable about this individual other than Wikipedia mirror pages. The only source itself is not very reliable either. Little evidence of this individual being notable or worthy of an article. RuudVanClerk ( talk) 14:11, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: History and India. RuudVanClerk ( talk) 14:11, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 15:12, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: Nominator obviously didn't do
WP:BEFORE. They clearly didn't conduct a search in the native language, provided by the corresponding article in Hindi Wikipedia, which also has a number of sources.
Curbon7 (
talk)
16:44, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- The “corresponding” article on Hindi Wikipedia is for a
Churaman (commonly known as Churaman Jat) who is a separate individual entirely. Passive aggressive comment notwithstanding, a basic knowledge of Indian history would help in this situation. Nice try though.
RuudVanClerk (
talk)
17:04, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
-
This is the linked Hindi article, which is clearly about the same person. In fact the articles are so similar that one seems to be a translation of the other.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
08:16, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- This is another source which refers to the same person [1] Lord 0f Avernus ( talk) 09:39, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
-
This is the linked Hindi article, which is clearly about the same person. In fact the articles are so similar that one seems to be a translation of the other.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
08:16, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- The “corresponding” article on Hindi Wikipedia is for a
Churaman (commonly known as Churaman Jat) who is a separate individual entirely. Passive aggressive comment notwithstanding, a basic knowledge of Indian history would help in this situation. Nice try though.
RuudVanClerk (
talk)
17:04, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Wikipedia is not a reliable source in any language. So unless someone can explain exactly why the sources found are reliable, just having a Wikipedia article in another language is not at all a sign of notability. John Pack Lambert ( talk) 12:51, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
|
- Delete Per nomination but allow redirect to any suitable target, if found. Mehta (1984), cited in hi.wiki, is not a (HIST)RS.
TrangaBellam (
talk)
18:36, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- @ TrangaBellam: what about this source? [2] Lord 0f Avernus ( talk) 18:40, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗ plicit 14:31, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Madhya Pradesh-related deletion discussions. – LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄) 00:26, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. – LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄) 00:27, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Delete The subject of the article is mentioned in a few sources, though not usually as "Churaman Ahir", but given the shallowness of coverage and the borderline quality of sources, he doesn't meet WP:GNG or merit a stand-alone article. And the current title is not a suitable one for even creating a redirect.
- And now for the longer explanation with example of typical coverage:
-
Mishra (2008) (not necessarily
WP:RS/
WP:HISTRS), says that "Rao Churaman who was of Ahir caste" was granted 22 villages near Kaimori (sp?) in
Jabalpur district in 1722 for his services as a garrison leader to Narendrashah; Churaman established his son Hamirdev there; Churaman's influence extended up to
Deori, Sagar until 1731, when Narendrashah snatched Deori back. That's the extent of coverage to which ~5 lines of the book are devoted in a para that begins with (rough translation)
We also have knowledge of some ordinary dealings during Narendrashah's time
. - The 1968 district-level
gazetteer for Japalpur says under its entry for Kaimuri that the town
was founded in the beginning of the 17th century by one Rao Churaman employed in the military service of Raja Narind Shah (1679-1727), the Gond Raja of Garha-Mandla. For the military service offered, the Raja granted to the Rao a jagir of 22 villages around Kaimuri and the Rao named the place after the neighbouring range of hills.
No mention of Ahir Similar coverage, with no added depth, can be found in later editions.
-
Mishra (2008) (not necessarily
WP:RS/
WP:HISTRS), says that "Rao Churaman who was of Ahir caste" was granted 22 villages near Kaimori (sp?) in
Jabalpur district in 1722 for his services as a garrison leader to Narendrashah; Churaman established his son Hamirdev there; Churaman's influence extended up to
Deori, Sagar until 1731, when Narendrashah snatched Deori back. That's the extent of coverage to which ~5 lines of the book are devoted in a para that begins with (rough translation)
- As far as I could determine, wikipedia does not have coverage of the ruler who granted the land to Rao Churaman, or of Kaimori village/town. If an article on the latter is created, that can contain a one-line mention of, and a redirect from, Rao Churaman. Abecedare ( talk) 02:13, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Possible merge. "22 villages around Kaimuri and the Rao named the place after the neighbouring range of hills." This range of hills is the Kaimur Range and it states clearly the range extends up to Katangi. Spinning Spark 15:56, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Modussiccandi ( talk) 08:56, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Churaman Ahir ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
A quick Google search doesn’t bring anything notable about this individual other than Wikipedia mirror pages. The only source itself is not very reliable either. Little evidence of this individual being notable or worthy of an article. RuudVanClerk ( talk) 14:11, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: History and India. RuudVanClerk ( talk) 14:11, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 15:12, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: Nominator obviously didn't do
WP:BEFORE. They clearly didn't conduct a search in the native language, provided by the corresponding article in Hindi Wikipedia, which also has a number of sources.
Curbon7 (
talk)
16:44, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- The “corresponding” article on Hindi Wikipedia is for a
Churaman (commonly known as Churaman Jat) who is a separate individual entirely. Passive aggressive comment notwithstanding, a basic knowledge of Indian history would help in this situation. Nice try though.
RuudVanClerk (
talk)
17:04, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
-
This is the linked Hindi article, which is clearly about the same person. In fact the articles are so similar that one seems to be a translation of the other.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
08:16, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- This is another source which refers to the same person [1] Lord 0f Avernus ( talk) 09:39, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
-
This is the linked Hindi article, which is clearly about the same person. In fact the articles are so similar that one seems to be a translation of the other.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
08:16, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- The “corresponding” article on Hindi Wikipedia is for a
Churaman (commonly known as Churaman Jat) who is a separate individual entirely. Passive aggressive comment notwithstanding, a basic knowledge of Indian history would help in this situation. Nice try though.
RuudVanClerk (
talk)
17:04, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
- Wikipedia is not a reliable source in any language. So unless someone can explain exactly why the sources found are reliable, just having a Wikipedia article in another language is not at all a sign of notability. John Pack Lambert ( talk) 12:51, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
|
- Delete Per nomination but allow redirect to any suitable target, if found. Mehta (1984), cited in hi.wiki, is not a (HIST)RS.
TrangaBellam (
talk)
18:36, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
- @ TrangaBellam: what about this source? [2] Lord 0f Avernus ( talk) 18:40, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗ plicit 14:31, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Madhya Pradesh-related deletion discussions. – LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄) 00:26, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. – LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄) 00:27, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Delete The subject of the article is mentioned in a few sources, though not usually as "Churaman Ahir", but given the shallowness of coverage and the borderline quality of sources, he doesn't meet WP:GNG or merit a stand-alone article. And the current title is not a suitable one for even creating a redirect.
- And now for the longer explanation with example of typical coverage:
-
Mishra (2008) (not necessarily
WP:RS/
WP:HISTRS), says that "Rao Churaman who was of Ahir caste" was granted 22 villages near Kaimori (sp?) in
Jabalpur district in 1722 for his services as a garrison leader to Narendrashah; Churaman established his son Hamirdev there; Churaman's influence extended up to
Deori, Sagar until 1731, when Narendrashah snatched Deori back. That's the extent of coverage to which ~5 lines of the book are devoted in a para that begins with (rough translation)
We also have knowledge of some ordinary dealings during Narendrashah's time
. - The 1968 district-level
gazetteer for Japalpur says under its entry for Kaimuri that the town
was founded in the beginning of the 17th century by one Rao Churaman employed in the military service of Raja Narind Shah (1679-1727), the Gond Raja of Garha-Mandla. For the military service offered, the Raja granted to the Rao a jagir of 22 villages around Kaimuri and the Rao named the place after the neighbouring range of hills.
No mention of Ahir Similar coverage, with no added depth, can be found in later editions.
-
Mishra (2008) (not necessarily
WP:RS/
WP:HISTRS), says that "Rao Churaman who was of Ahir caste" was granted 22 villages near Kaimori (sp?) in
Jabalpur district in 1722 for his services as a garrison leader to Narendrashah; Churaman established his son Hamirdev there; Churaman's influence extended up to
Deori, Sagar until 1731, when Narendrashah snatched Deori back. That's the extent of coverage to which ~5 lines of the book are devoted in a para that begins with (rough translation)
- As far as I could determine, wikipedia does not have coverage of the ruler who granted the land to Rao Churaman, or of Kaimori village/town. If an article on the latter is created, that can contain a one-line mention of, and a redirect from, Rao Churaman. Abecedare ( talk) 02:13, 11 May 2022 (UTC)
- Possible merge. "22 villages around Kaimuri and the Rao named the place after the neighbouring range of hills." This range of hills is the Kaimur Range and it states clearly the range extends up to Katangi. Spinning Spark 15:56, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.