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WP:MULTI. Please see original discussion: User_talk:Vjmlhds#Feedback. Levdr1lp ( talk) 08:06, 17 January 2012 (UTC)
2 things: First, I see how you adjusted the sports play by play on the WKNR page into prose. It looks good, and I did the same to the other Cleveland stations that air multiple teams' games. Also, Jeff Phelps is a Cavs employee. He is listed in the Cavs media guide (which is on the Cavs website) along with the other employees. Remember, the team controls their announcers...also being on the Cavs games is what Phelps is best known for, thus that's why it should be noted, rather than just as a generic "Fox Sports Ohio personality". Vjmlhds 16:32, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Alright, so now that we've embarked on making this article more comprehensive, you have any particular section you'd care to work on? We need something on the economy, and a general histroical narrative. Have at it if you want. I'll tell Jon (Ridinger) as well... Ryecatcher773 ( talk) 01:07, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
I think you may wish to consider the templates Viacom and Viacom Media Networks. They have the Viacom logo in them.Fairly OddParents Freak ( Fairlyoddparents1234) 16:16, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Lebron James bolting, and the 26 game losing streak are probably the 2 most famous/infamous events in franchise history. How can you not include them in the team's culture and lore section? Vjmlhds 13:39, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Good Karma brands their entire Cleveland operation as ESPN Cleveland. This is on top of branding each station individually (ESPN 850 WKNR and ESPN 1540 KNR2). Vjmlhds 19:40, 31 March 2012 (UTC)
On WMMS's website, it looks like they've gone back to the traditional "Buzzard" logo and done away with (or at least de-emphasized) the road sign/orange wing logo. Could you tranfer the current logo to the article, I'm absolutely clueless how to go about that kind of thing. Thanks. Vjmlhds 22:13, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
I saw what User 76 was saying about you. You and me have gone round and round and then some, but what that guy did was uncalled for. That was horrible. Vjmlhds 02:13, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
I re-edited a few sections on
WMMS. Even though 99X doesn't represent 100.7 entirely, it should still be referenced in the infobox since it's on HD2 and has a website and translator. Same with the Template:Cleveland Radio|Cleveland radio template (link to templates as I have below). --
Radiokid1010 (
talk) 17:50, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Nice job putting the new article together. Vjmlhds 21:52, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm sorry... I actually forgot HOW to respond on here... hadn't done it for awhile. o.O
As per the infobox, it was likely a typo on my part that I forgot to correct a long time ago and never thought to do so until you brought it up.
Here's the thing: I don't know as to what year WMMS started carry Browns games in a simulcast with WHK. It had to have been at some point in the early-mid 70s because there were issues about outlying Browns affiliates close to the market - such as WBEA-FM Elyria, then a sister to WEOL who dropped the affiliation because of encroachment from WMMS (this was from reading WBEA/WEOL's corporate cousin, the Elyria Chronicle-Telegram, through their PDF archives... it was a few years ago, so I can't remember off the top of my head what URL they are posted at, or if it's still there - it's more to buttress my original point of view). Nor would I know if WMMS' tenure as a simulcast of WHK's games was ever a continuous one.
But for me to say that it was in 1968 probably owed more to WMMS' early heavily simulcasting of WHK during overnights and (possibly) weekends. They **might** have carried a few games as a result, but probably not enough to merit being a co-flagship. No matter how it's sliced, it's still wrong. My apologies.
As per the exact year, I'm presuming that would have to be resolved somewhere in the Browns media guides. The Browns had a complex radio history in their early years, going from one station to another and another.
That being said, I don't dispute what Mike O. has in Radio Daze (I've met him in person before - he's a really awesome guy). There are some other former staffers at WMMS I could contact as well if needed. Again, my apologies... I'm more than a bit rusty with the Wiki talk pages.
-Nate- Nathan Obral ( talk) 20:29, 15 July 2012 (UTC)
Seriously...you're gonna start questioning OMW's credibility just because he picked up my "man cave" term to describe WMMS' rock/talk/sports mix? You wouldn't have done that if somebody else came up with the term, I'd bet you anything. Vjmlhds 02:55, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
You went through every TV and radio station and removed every reference from Ohio Media Watch?!?! Jesus, dude...Don't tell me it was due to WP:THISTHATORTHEOTHER. You were perfectly fine with OMW until the "man cave" thing last week, and now all of a sudden you got a bug up your butt about it. You can throw all the wiki-ese at me you want about it, but it really does come off like you threw a hissy-fit and wanted to teach OMW a lesson. Perception is reality. Vjmlhds 00:45, 2 August 2012 (UTC)
If we're talking journalism, then reporters are generally supposed to identify themselves; in the example you're giving, Ohio Media Watch is the reporter, not the source. Regardless, I'm not really sure that has anything to do with the topic, i.e. the reliability of Ohio Media Watch. When you (Nathan Obral) write something on a blog, you cannot use it as a reliable source on Wikipedia. When you (Nathan Obral) work for a radio station, you cannot edit that station's article and not expect someone to raise the issue of conflict-of-interest (as I did). And when an anonymous blogger is not subject to editorial oversight, that too is unreliable for the purposes of Wikipedia.
Levdr1lp (
talk) 04:12, 26 October 2012 (UTC)
Look, I'm not an expert on all Wikipedia guidelines and policy. I think the media blogs you named qualify as reliable sources because the contributors aren't anonymous and they each support ads. And I'm sure there are variations of editorial oversight depending on the case. But if it's clearly missing, as in the case of the Ohio Media Watch blog, there needs to be some other kind of attribution. There must be some kind of accountability. Otherwise the "source" is just rumor. Anonymous blogs do readers a disservice.
Levdr1lp (
talk) 05:26, 26 October 2012 (UTC)
Are my changes okay with you? I was working on a draft several months ago and was afraid to submit it. But you beat me to it and I see the article has been accepted.— Vchimpanzee · talk · contributions · 21:24, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
Hey, Levdr1, I noticed on recent changes that you marked a page in your userspace for deletion as G7. That's totally fine and will work without problems, but there's another tag, U1, that's specifically for deletion of userspace pages; it might help you get a faster response time. Thanks! Writ Keeper ⚇ ♔ 13:28, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
...But are you a member of the JCL/SCL? I come in peace, but I'm just curious to see if the article can be improved from its current state. Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 07:38, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
Oh right IE doesn't recognize shortened hex codes still I think. That would be it. (stalking cause Kevin asked me, as a visually impaired user, to verify his issue and I couldn't replicate it)
sonia (
talk) 09:06, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
The starting date of radio station WEBN in Cincinnati was today, August 30, in 1967, and not August 31, as published in the source used by Wikipedia. I know this to be accurate because I recently contacted Frank Wood Jr. (son of the original owner and manager of the station from 1969 into the 1990s) in order to confirm this and other facts about the station's history when talking on the air today about the station's 45th birthday. If you wish to contact Mr. Wood to confirm the date, please let me know and I will send you his e-mail address. Wikithings ( talk) 00:45, 31 August 2012 (UTC)Wikithings
In my opinion, when somebody like Talkers magazine (which is almost like a bible for the radio industry) ranks one of your local shows among the top 100 nationally in either general talk (Mike Trivisonno - WTAM) or sports talk (Really Big Show - WKNR, and Kiley & Booms - WKRK), it's worthy of a sentence in the article. I'm not saying we should smack people over the head with it, but a brief mention of it with the source to back it up is reasonable I think. Vjmlhds 21:07, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
I'll leave it up to you to make the call, but: It's been about a year now (if not more) since WMMS has resumed use of the Buzzard logo as their primary logo (in the upper left corner of their home page in the standard issue format of all Clear Channel stations). The only change they've made in putting a Browns helmet on him now that it's football season. There are few if any references to the road sign logo, and even on the WMMS facebook page they've reverted back to the Buzzard logo (and again just recently putting a Browns helmet on him) and just like their website, there are no signs of the road sign logo. We had this discussion a while back, but as time has gone on, it looks like they're phasing out the road sign to put more emphasis on the Buzzard. Vjmlhds 23:24, 7 September 2012 (UTC)
I uploaded File:Wwwm_fm_logo.jpg for use in the article classic rock but I'm uncertain if I've covered all the fair use rationale. I see you added other radio station logos so if you see anything missing would you mind adding to it? Thank you for any assistance you can offer. I wanted to use it in the WMJI article too but there doesn't appear to be enough room unless the M105 section is expanded. Piriczki ( talk) 17:44, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for inserting the URL template into some of the city articles. I knew there was a template for that but could not remember what it was called! -- JonRidinger ( talk) 01:13, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
I've added numerous sources to back up not only the incoming Cumulus programming, but also verifying the rest of WERE's schedule. And I made it a concious point not to adress you directly in the edit summary ("Here's the source verifying...", and not "Here's your source..." like I would have done previously). However you did single me out directly by saying that you wouldn't have had a problem with the changes, but because it was me you felt it necessary to revert my work. You didn't like it when I adressed you directly in edit summaries, (and I'm making an effort not to anymore), so I ask you reciprocate the same courtesy to me. Vjmlhds 13:50, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
You are welcome to comment on this this sockpuppet investigation based on your observations at a recent AfD. I, Jethrobot drop me a line (note: not a bot!) 18:35, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
Instead of "edit warring", I'll explain my reasoning for including Shanley here, and you can do whatever with it. Basically, in 1994 Malrite Communications (who owned WOIO) signed a local marketing agreement with Cannel Communications who owned WUAB. Essentially they took over all operations at 43. When 19 started their newscasts in Feb. 1995, they absorbed the WUAB news team in to the then new "CBS 19" news team. All personalities were part of 1 news team. At this time Gib Shanley primarily did the 10'O Clock news sportscasts on 43, while Jeff Phelps did the 6 and 11 sports on 19, but one would fill in for the other if one was out, and frequently Shanley would do a sports commentary on 19. Long story short, WOIO absorbed the WUAB news team into their fold in '94, so anybody who was at 43 then automatically became part of 19's fledgling news team...including Shanley. Vjmlhds 14:49, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
I was working on Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Ew0sdc and accidentally blocked you as one of the socks, using an automated script. I cannot apologise enough for my error. If anyone ever raises it as an issue, please just point to this notices and say 'useless admin Elen of the Roads blocked me by mistake' Elen of the Roads ( talk) 22:07, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
You were right about WHKW still being an affiliate of Bowling Green (a quick check of the Falcons radio affiliate list confirmed it) despite it's affiliation with Michigan. What must have happened was that the U of M and BGSU played at the same time, and the Wolverines took priority. Vjmlhds 14:51, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
I'll leave it up to consensus as to whether I should add the note about the Tribe or not. But I must say this, though...I looked up WP:Notability, and that pretains more to whether something is worthy of having a whole entire article written about it. There's a difference between that and what I did. If I wanted to write a whole article about Indians coverage on WMMS, then WP:Notability applies, because that isn't worthy of it's own article nor should it be. But adding a quick little note at the end of an existing article is a different animal. Vjmlhds 14:03, 22 November 2012 (UTC)
File names really aren't a problem in most cases, and when they are, the proper course of action is generally to move the file, rather than uploading it under a new name. In situations like the Radio Disney logo, it's actually counterproductive to ask for the original name to be deleted — deleting a page only increases linkrot, so when two files are identical, the older one should be kept. Nyttend ( talk) 18:55, 27 November 2012 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 |
WP:MULTI. Please see original discussion: User_talk:Vjmlhds#Feedback. Levdr1lp ( talk) 08:06, 17 January 2012 (UTC)
2 things: First, I see how you adjusted the sports play by play on the WKNR page into prose. It looks good, and I did the same to the other Cleveland stations that air multiple teams' games. Also, Jeff Phelps is a Cavs employee. He is listed in the Cavs media guide (which is on the Cavs website) along with the other employees. Remember, the team controls their announcers...also being on the Cavs games is what Phelps is best known for, thus that's why it should be noted, rather than just as a generic "Fox Sports Ohio personality". Vjmlhds 16:32, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
Alright, so now that we've embarked on making this article more comprehensive, you have any particular section you'd care to work on? We need something on the economy, and a general histroical narrative. Have at it if you want. I'll tell Jon (Ridinger) as well... Ryecatcher773 ( talk) 01:07, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
I think you may wish to consider the templates Viacom and Viacom Media Networks. They have the Viacom logo in them.Fairly OddParents Freak ( Fairlyoddparents1234) 16:16, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Lebron James bolting, and the 26 game losing streak are probably the 2 most famous/infamous events in franchise history. How can you not include them in the team's culture and lore section? Vjmlhds 13:39, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Good Karma brands their entire Cleveland operation as ESPN Cleveland. This is on top of branding each station individually (ESPN 850 WKNR and ESPN 1540 KNR2). Vjmlhds 19:40, 31 March 2012 (UTC)
On WMMS's website, it looks like they've gone back to the traditional "Buzzard" logo and done away with (or at least de-emphasized) the road sign/orange wing logo. Could you tranfer the current logo to the article, I'm absolutely clueless how to go about that kind of thing. Thanks. Vjmlhds 22:13, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
I saw what User 76 was saying about you. You and me have gone round and round and then some, but what that guy did was uncalled for. That was horrible. Vjmlhds 02:13, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
I re-edited a few sections on
WMMS. Even though 99X doesn't represent 100.7 entirely, it should still be referenced in the infobox since it's on HD2 and has a website and translator. Same with the Template:Cleveland Radio|Cleveland radio template (link to templates as I have below). --
Radiokid1010 (
talk) 17:50, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Nice job putting the new article together. Vjmlhds 21:52, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm sorry... I actually forgot HOW to respond on here... hadn't done it for awhile. o.O
As per the infobox, it was likely a typo on my part that I forgot to correct a long time ago and never thought to do so until you brought it up.
Here's the thing: I don't know as to what year WMMS started carry Browns games in a simulcast with WHK. It had to have been at some point in the early-mid 70s because there were issues about outlying Browns affiliates close to the market - such as WBEA-FM Elyria, then a sister to WEOL who dropped the affiliation because of encroachment from WMMS (this was from reading WBEA/WEOL's corporate cousin, the Elyria Chronicle-Telegram, through their PDF archives... it was a few years ago, so I can't remember off the top of my head what URL they are posted at, or if it's still there - it's more to buttress my original point of view). Nor would I know if WMMS' tenure as a simulcast of WHK's games was ever a continuous one.
But for me to say that it was in 1968 probably owed more to WMMS' early heavily simulcasting of WHK during overnights and (possibly) weekends. They **might** have carried a few games as a result, but probably not enough to merit being a co-flagship. No matter how it's sliced, it's still wrong. My apologies.
As per the exact year, I'm presuming that would have to be resolved somewhere in the Browns media guides. The Browns had a complex radio history in their early years, going from one station to another and another.
That being said, I don't dispute what Mike O. has in Radio Daze (I've met him in person before - he's a really awesome guy). There are some other former staffers at WMMS I could contact as well if needed. Again, my apologies... I'm more than a bit rusty with the Wiki talk pages.
-Nate- Nathan Obral ( talk) 20:29, 15 July 2012 (UTC)
Seriously...you're gonna start questioning OMW's credibility just because he picked up my "man cave" term to describe WMMS' rock/talk/sports mix? You wouldn't have done that if somebody else came up with the term, I'd bet you anything. Vjmlhds 02:55, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
You went through every TV and radio station and removed every reference from Ohio Media Watch?!?! Jesus, dude...Don't tell me it was due to WP:THISTHATORTHEOTHER. You were perfectly fine with OMW until the "man cave" thing last week, and now all of a sudden you got a bug up your butt about it. You can throw all the wiki-ese at me you want about it, but it really does come off like you threw a hissy-fit and wanted to teach OMW a lesson. Perception is reality. Vjmlhds 00:45, 2 August 2012 (UTC)
If we're talking journalism, then reporters are generally supposed to identify themselves; in the example you're giving, Ohio Media Watch is the reporter, not the source. Regardless, I'm not really sure that has anything to do with the topic, i.e. the reliability of Ohio Media Watch. When you (Nathan Obral) write something on a blog, you cannot use it as a reliable source on Wikipedia. When you (Nathan Obral) work for a radio station, you cannot edit that station's article and not expect someone to raise the issue of conflict-of-interest (as I did). And when an anonymous blogger is not subject to editorial oversight, that too is unreliable for the purposes of Wikipedia.
Levdr1lp (
talk) 04:12, 26 October 2012 (UTC)
Look, I'm not an expert on all Wikipedia guidelines and policy. I think the media blogs you named qualify as reliable sources because the contributors aren't anonymous and they each support ads. And I'm sure there are variations of editorial oversight depending on the case. But if it's clearly missing, as in the case of the Ohio Media Watch blog, there needs to be some other kind of attribution. There must be some kind of accountability. Otherwise the "source" is just rumor. Anonymous blogs do readers a disservice.
Levdr1lp (
talk) 05:26, 26 October 2012 (UTC)
Are my changes okay with you? I was working on a draft several months ago and was afraid to submit it. But you beat me to it and I see the article has been accepted.— Vchimpanzee · talk · contributions · 21:24, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
Hey, Levdr1, I noticed on recent changes that you marked a page in your userspace for deletion as G7. That's totally fine and will work without problems, but there's another tag, U1, that's specifically for deletion of userspace pages; it might help you get a faster response time. Thanks! Writ Keeper ⚇ ♔ 13:28, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
...But are you a member of the JCL/SCL? I come in peace, but I'm just curious to see if the article can be improved from its current state. Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 07:38, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
Oh right IE doesn't recognize shortened hex codes still I think. That would be it. (stalking cause Kevin asked me, as a visually impaired user, to verify his issue and I couldn't replicate it)
sonia (
talk) 09:06, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
The starting date of radio station WEBN in Cincinnati was today, August 30, in 1967, and not August 31, as published in the source used by Wikipedia. I know this to be accurate because I recently contacted Frank Wood Jr. (son of the original owner and manager of the station from 1969 into the 1990s) in order to confirm this and other facts about the station's history when talking on the air today about the station's 45th birthday. If you wish to contact Mr. Wood to confirm the date, please let me know and I will send you his e-mail address. Wikithings ( talk) 00:45, 31 August 2012 (UTC)Wikithings
In my opinion, when somebody like Talkers magazine (which is almost like a bible for the radio industry) ranks one of your local shows among the top 100 nationally in either general talk (Mike Trivisonno - WTAM) or sports talk (Really Big Show - WKNR, and Kiley & Booms - WKRK), it's worthy of a sentence in the article. I'm not saying we should smack people over the head with it, but a brief mention of it with the source to back it up is reasonable I think. Vjmlhds 21:07, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
I'll leave it up to you to make the call, but: It's been about a year now (if not more) since WMMS has resumed use of the Buzzard logo as their primary logo (in the upper left corner of their home page in the standard issue format of all Clear Channel stations). The only change they've made in putting a Browns helmet on him now that it's football season. There are few if any references to the road sign logo, and even on the WMMS facebook page they've reverted back to the Buzzard logo (and again just recently putting a Browns helmet on him) and just like their website, there are no signs of the road sign logo. We had this discussion a while back, but as time has gone on, it looks like they're phasing out the road sign to put more emphasis on the Buzzard. Vjmlhds 23:24, 7 September 2012 (UTC)
I uploaded File:Wwwm_fm_logo.jpg for use in the article classic rock but I'm uncertain if I've covered all the fair use rationale. I see you added other radio station logos so if you see anything missing would you mind adding to it? Thank you for any assistance you can offer. I wanted to use it in the WMJI article too but there doesn't appear to be enough room unless the M105 section is expanded. Piriczki ( talk) 17:44, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for inserting the URL template into some of the city articles. I knew there was a template for that but could not remember what it was called! -- JonRidinger ( talk) 01:13, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
I've added numerous sources to back up not only the incoming Cumulus programming, but also verifying the rest of WERE's schedule. And I made it a concious point not to adress you directly in the edit summary ("Here's the source verifying...", and not "Here's your source..." like I would have done previously). However you did single me out directly by saying that you wouldn't have had a problem with the changes, but because it was me you felt it necessary to revert my work. You didn't like it when I adressed you directly in edit summaries, (and I'm making an effort not to anymore), so I ask you reciprocate the same courtesy to me. Vjmlhds 13:50, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
You are welcome to comment on this this sockpuppet investigation based on your observations at a recent AfD. I, Jethrobot drop me a line (note: not a bot!) 18:35, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
Instead of "edit warring", I'll explain my reasoning for including Shanley here, and you can do whatever with it. Basically, in 1994 Malrite Communications (who owned WOIO) signed a local marketing agreement with Cannel Communications who owned WUAB. Essentially they took over all operations at 43. When 19 started their newscasts in Feb. 1995, they absorbed the WUAB news team in to the then new "CBS 19" news team. All personalities were part of 1 news team. At this time Gib Shanley primarily did the 10'O Clock news sportscasts on 43, while Jeff Phelps did the 6 and 11 sports on 19, but one would fill in for the other if one was out, and frequently Shanley would do a sports commentary on 19. Long story short, WOIO absorbed the WUAB news team into their fold in '94, so anybody who was at 43 then automatically became part of 19's fledgling news team...including Shanley. Vjmlhds 14:49, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
I was working on Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Ew0sdc and accidentally blocked you as one of the socks, using an automated script. I cannot apologise enough for my error. If anyone ever raises it as an issue, please just point to this notices and say 'useless admin Elen of the Roads blocked me by mistake' Elen of the Roads ( talk) 22:07, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
You were right about WHKW still being an affiliate of Bowling Green (a quick check of the Falcons radio affiliate list confirmed it) despite it's affiliation with Michigan. What must have happened was that the U of M and BGSU played at the same time, and the Wolverines took priority. Vjmlhds 14:51, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
I'll leave it up to consensus as to whether I should add the note about the Tribe or not. But I must say this, though...I looked up WP:Notability, and that pretains more to whether something is worthy of having a whole entire article written about it. There's a difference between that and what I did. If I wanted to write a whole article about Indians coverage on WMMS, then WP:Notability applies, because that isn't worthy of it's own article nor should it be. But adding a quick little note at the end of an existing article is a different animal. Vjmlhds 14:03, 22 November 2012 (UTC)
File names really aren't a problem in most cases, and when they are, the proper course of action is generally to move the file, rather than uploading it under a new name. In situations like the Radio Disney logo, it's actually counterproductive to ask for the original name to be deleted — deleting a page only increases linkrot, so when two files are identical, the older one should be kept. Nyttend ( talk) 18:55, 27 November 2012 (UTC)