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All churches and monasteries built after 1700 should not be in this template and instead in the Template:Contemporary Armenian Churches template. Serouj ( talk) 01:30, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
Narekavank and Jugha cemetery are both totally destroyed without a trace. Do we want to list them here anyways? Just curious, I could go either way. -- RaffiKojian ( talk) 19:27, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
With a growing number of monasteries catalogued, we'll probably need to create additional templates. Three categorizations come to mind:
Of course, the categories would exist depending on the verge of extinction. Serouj ( talk) 20:20, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
I think it might be better if we comment out the red linked articles (articles that don't yet exist) in the source code, because first of all there are too many of them. And second if the list is large we can start to create subcategories; but it won't look nice if we have sub categories with many red links. What do you think? Serouj ( talk) 20:33, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Which to include? http://virtualani.org/beyondani.htm -- RaffiKojian ( talk) 00:44, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
There is a lack of information on the web on the following two important churches in the area east of Lake Van, the cradle of Armenian civilization (e.g. location of "Hayots Dzor" where Hayk defeated Bel). These are in the Başkale district of Turkey:
I decided to offer a compromise version and to group the sites in Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia as those in the South Caucasus, for a number of reasons, mainly having to do with Nagorno-Karabakh:
I've created a new template to help manage the growth of this list. The new template is limited to churches, monasteries, and seminaries that have actively functioned after 1700. Therefore, even churches built before 1700 but in use afterwards can make it to this list:
Serouj ( talk) 18:54, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
Where it "has been discussed before"? How khachkar destruction under the title of Julfa cemetery match Armenian Churches? Even khachkars alone do not fit much, the recent revert is clearly point-pushing. Stay on topic. As if the Kish Church of ambiguous religious affiliation is not enough... Brand t 17:16, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
Some work is needed to identify the prominent historical & contemporary Armenian churches in Istanbul, the center of Western Armenian culture during the 18th to early 20th centuries. There are about 32 Armenian churches in Istanbul. Serouj ( talk) 19:32, 8 July 2009 (UTC)
Besides the 23 other Armenian churches and monasteries in Tbilisi, there was an 18th century Armenian Cathedral in Old Tbilisi along the banks of the Kura River. This was the main Armenian cathedral of Tbilisi in the early twentieth century and the seat of the Diocese. It was destroyed during Soviet times. Does anyone have any more info about this church that they can share? Thanks. Serouj ( talk) 17:58, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
Moreover, what to do with the huge list of churches of Nakhichevan, which I have no info about, but have got names, and the list is huge. Is it appropriate to create a separate box for it may be?
And we have a bigger problem: Artsakh churches, which number of bigger than of Nakhichevan? I put now only a part of Martakert region, while there are 4 more regions in former NKAO and Karvachar and Kashatagh? Is it possible to create a separate box for it too? I don't know how to do it, but I can send data on every church. And I need advice: whether to keep on adding Artsakh churches to this list? It's gonna become bigger than the whole list all together. 517design ( talk) 21:31, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
There are lots of info on Armenian churches I have, including Argam Ayvazyan works, Samvel Karapetyan, Shahen Mkrtchyan and many more refering both Nakhichevan and Artsakh. I agree it's better have some page like List of Armenian churches and place all the churches there, but here the box needs to contain a link to that page to show that the template doesn't show all ones. I'll work over it as soon as I find some time. 517design ( talk) 07:39, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
I think we can create an article like List of Armenian churches in Azerbaijan. And write a list of Armenian churches in Baku, Northern Artsakh, Nakhichevan, and other places. Probably about the Armenian churches of Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Republic) we can create an article List of Armenian churches in Nagorno-Karabakh separate from the List of Armenian churches in Azerbaijan. So, what do you think about this idea?-- Hovik95 ( talk) 17:45, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
Since the list for the Template:Contemporary Armenian Churches is growing, I think it now makes sense to re-visit the chronological divisions among the templates, namely to add a third. Following the Template:Human history, I propose the following three divisions:
The templates will be renamed according: "Medieval Armenian churches and monasteries", "Early modern Armenian churches and monasteries", and "Modern Armenian churches and seminaries" (as there are no longer any active monasteries in the modern period as far as I know). Serouj ( talk) 18:16, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
If the church was not build before 1700, please do not add it to this template. There is a separate template for that (see above). Serouj ( talk) 20:13, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
The current version of the template violates NPOV for the following reasons:
What is the point of adding a ridiculous number of links to non-existent articles? -- Երևանցի talk 00:19, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Hello Yerevanci, I understand that you would like to clean up the template from these links to non-existent articles. I have been working on articles related to a number of Armenian religious structures over the years and it has helped to fill in the missing gaps. I apologize for reverting the edit, I just felt that it is necessary to keep. Liveon001 ( talk) 00:34, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Hi all, I noticed while adding a new link that there's a huge number of interlanguage links in this navbox; to the point where I'm not sure that the majority of links are even for English articles. This seems to be against the spirit and maybe the letter of WP:NAV (specifically WP:EXISTING). This relevant talk page discussion there seems to confirm a general consensus from experienced editors on not adding such links in navboxes. Or just from a general practical perspective, as someone who may want to browse articles on Armenian churches, the usefulness of this navbox is severely undermined if the majority (or a very prominent proportion) of links are in Armenian (or other languages). The average reader on the English Wikipedia doesn't read Armenian (and if they do, they can consult the Armenian Wikipedia separately) and there's no easy way to even see which links are in English and which aren't, so for the majority of readers this navbox doesn't really help them find the articles they may want to read. Even if we mark out the interlanguage links more explicitly, it would still be visually difficult to find the English links in such a large navbox.
Therefore, I strongly recommend we remove all interlanguage links, but given the number of links to remove I think it would be good to give a chance for more involved editors to comment. If new English articles are created for the missing topics after removal, they can always be added later. If helpful, we can also copy any deleted links on the talk page (in a dedicated section), or at least include a link here to the last version before the links are removed, so that there's still a handy list of potential new articles to create that editors can consult afterwards.
It may also be preferable to create a list page instead if you want to have a full list that isn't limited to existing English articles only. I haven't read through all of the guidelines for list pages (see MOS:LIST), but I don't think there's a requirement that items in a list all be links to articles, so there's also no restriction against redlinks and interlanguage links either. Whereas a navbox is for navigation between existing articles, a list can just be any list with a clear criteria for inclusion (e.g. Armenian churches built before 1700), and the information to be included is up to editors to decide. (Note: there's currently a Lists of Armenian churches article, but not a general "List of Armenian churches".) Thanks, R Prazeres ( talk) 07:59, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
Armenia Template‑class | |||||||
|
Christianity Template‑class | |||||||
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All churches and monasteries built after 1700 should not be in this template and instead in the Template:Contemporary Armenian Churches template. Serouj ( talk) 01:30, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
Narekavank and Jugha cemetery are both totally destroyed without a trace. Do we want to list them here anyways? Just curious, I could go either way. -- RaffiKojian ( talk) 19:27, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
With a growing number of monasteries catalogued, we'll probably need to create additional templates. Three categorizations come to mind:
Of course, the categories would exist depending on the verge of extinction. Serouj ( talk) 20:20, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
I think it might be better if we comment out the red linked articles (articles that don't yet exist) in the source code, because first of all there are too many of them. And second if the list is large we can start to create subcategories; but it won't look nice if we have sub categories with many red links. What do you think? Serouj ( talk) 20:33, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Which to include? http://virtualani.org/beyondani.htm -- RaffiKojian ( talk) 00:44, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
There is a lack of information on the web on the following two important churches in the area east of Lake Van, the cradle of Armenian civilization (e.g. location of "Hayots Dzor" where Hayk defeated Bel). These are in the Başkale district of Turkey:
I decided to offer a compromise version and to group the sites in Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia as those in the South Caucasus, for a number of reasons, mainly having to do with Nagorno-Karabakh:
I've created a new template to help manage the growth of this list. The new template is limited to churches, monasteries, and seminaries that have actively functioned after 1700. Therefore, even churches built before 1700 but in use afterwards can make it to this list:
Serouj ( talk) 18:54, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
Where it "has been discussed before"? How khachkar destruction under the title of Julfa cemetery match Armenian Churches? Even khachkars alone do not fit much, the recent revert is clearly point-pushing. Stay on topic. As if the Kish Church of ambiguous religious affiliation is not enough... Brand t 17:16, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
Some work is needed to identify the prominent historical & contemporary Armenian churches in Istanbul, the center of Western Armenian culture during the 18th to early 20th centuries. There are about 32 Armenian churches in Istanbul. Serouj ( talk) 19:32, 8 July 2009 (UTC)
Besides the 23 other Armenian churches and monasteries in Tbilisi, there was an 18th century Armenian Cathedral in Old Tbilisi along the banks of the Kura River. This was the main Armenian cathedral of Tbilisi in the early twentieth century and the seat of the Diocese. It was destroyed during Soviet times. Does anyone have any more info about this church that they can share? Thanks. Serouj ( talk) 17:58, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
Moreover, what to do with the huge list of churches of Nakhichevan, which I have no info about, but have got names, and the list is huge. Is it appropriate to create a separate box for it may be?
And we have a bigger problem: Artsakh churches, which number of bigger than of Nakhichevan? I put now only a part of Martakert region, while there are 4 more regions in former NKAO and Karvachar and Kashatagh? Is it possible to create a separate box for it too? I don't know how to do it, but I can send data on every church. And I need advice: whether to keep on adding Artsakh churches to this list? It's gonna become bigger than the whole list all together. 517design ( talk) 21:31, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
There are lots of info on Armenian churches I have, including Argam Ayvazyan works, Samvel Karapetyan, Shahen Mkrtchyan and many more refering both Nakhichevan and Artsakh. I agree it's better have some page like List of Armenian churches and place all the churches there, but here the box needs to contain a link to that page to show that the template doesn't show all ones. I'll work over it as soon as I find some time. 517design ( talk) 07:39, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
I think we can create an article like List of Armenian churches in Azerbaijan. And write a list of Armenian churches in Baku, Northern Artsakh, Nakhichevan, and other places. Probably about the Armenian churches of Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Republic) we can create an article List of Armenian churches in Nagorno-Karabakh separate from the List of Armenian churches in Azerbaijan. So, what do you think about this idea?-- Hovik95 ( talk) 17:45, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
Since the list for the Template:Contemporary Armenian Churches is growing, I think it now makes sense to re-visit the chronological divisions among the templates, namely to add a third. Following the Template:Human history, I propose the following three divisions:
The templates will be renamed according: "Medieval Armenian churches and monasteries", "Early modern Armenian churches and monasteries", and "Modern Armenian churches and seminaries" (as there are no longer any active monasteries in the modern period as far as I know). Serouj ( talk) 18:16, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
If the church was not build before 1700, please do not add it to this template. There is a separate template for that (see above). Serouj ( talk) 20:13, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
The current version of the template violates NPOV for the following reasons:
What is the point of adding a ridiculous number of links to non-existent articles? -- Երևանցի talk 00:19, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Hello Yerevanci, I understand that you would like to clean up the template from these links to non-existent articles. I have been working on articles related to a number of Armenian religious structures over the years and it has helped to fill in the missing gaps. I apologize for reverting the edit, I just felt that it is necessary to keep. Liveon001 ( talk) 00:34, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Hi all, I noticed while adding a new link that there's a huge number of interlanguage links in this navbox; to the point where I'm not sure that the majority of links are even for English articles. This seems to be against the spirit and maybe the letter of WP:NAV (specifically WP:EXISTING). This relevant talk page discussion there seems to confirm a general consensus from experienced editors on not adding such links in navboxes. Or just from a general practical perspective, as someone who may want to browse articles on Armenian churches, the usefulness of this navbox is severely undermined if the majority (or a very prominent proportion) of links are in Armenian (or other languages). The average reader on the English Wikipedia doesn't read Armenian (and if they do, they can consult the Armenian Wikipedia separately) and there's no easy way to even see which links are in English and which aren't, so for the majority of readers this navbox doesn't really help them find the articles they may want to read. Even if we mark out the interlanguage links more explicitly, it would still be visually difficult to find the English links in such a large navbox.
Therefore, I strongly recommend we remove all interlanguage links, but given the number of links to remove I think it would be good to give a chance for more involved editors to comment. If new English articles are created for the missing topics after removal, they can always be added later. If helpful, we can also copy any deleted links on the talk page (in a dedicated section), or at least include a link here to the last version before the links are removed, so that there's still a handy list of potential new articles to create that editors can consult afterwards.
It may also be preferable to create a list page instead if you want to have a full list that isn't limited to existing English articles only. I haven't read through all of the guidelines for list pages (see MOS:LIST), but I don't think there's a requirement that items in a list all be links to articles, so there's also no restriction against redlinks and interlanguage links either. Whereas a navbox is for navigation between existing articles, a list can just be any list with a clear criteria for inclusion (e.g. Armenian churches built before 1700), and the information to be included is up to editors to decide. (Note: there's currently a Lists of Armenian churches article, but not a general "List of Armenian churches".) Thanks, R Prazeres ( talk) 07:59, 3 August 2022 (UTC)