This is the
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Human rights abuses in Jammu and Kashmir template. |
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I would say that more than half the links in this template are not to article son human rights abuses, any reasons for not removing them? Darkness Shines ( talk) 11:12, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: There have been 595 rape cases in Jammu and Kashmir in last 2 years. [1] [2]. So does that mean we will add every rape case??. It's better to keep this tempelate limited to major terror attacks rather than list of rapes, Rape is never ending case, we can't add every second rape case here. My Lord ( talk) 06:15, 3 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: I didn't say every Terror attack, I said Major Terror attacks should be listed here and as far as rapes are concerned those rape incidents should be mentioned here which are either done by securiy forces or Terrorists. Mentioning of regular rape cases makes no sense as I already said there have been 595 regular rape incidents in J&K in last 2 years and as far as Kunan and Shopain are concerned both are done by security forces. So it should be added here. My Lord ( talk) 19:14, 3 June 2018 (UTC)
@ Kautilya3: Notability is not an issue, the issue is whether to include cases which doesn't include Security forces or terrorists. My Lord ( talk) 04:36, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: As @ Adamgerber80: said it is not the part of curent insurgency. My Lord ( talk) 12:17, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
Usage: The following template includes human rights incidents in Jammu and Kashmir between the following parties - Indian security forces, militants and civilians. The template should not include other acts of rape or murder in Jammu and Kashmir, no matter how notable, if not related to militancy or insurgency.
The subject of what to call something a "Human rights violation" is a bit confused right now. Until recently, only the actions of states were called human rights violations. That is because the states are supposed to be human rights providers, and what they do cannot called "crimes". But, when people started complaining, the human rights organisations started including militant groups too, without a clear understanding of what they are doing and why. It makes sense in the areas where the militant groups are in control, acting as if they are mini-states of their own, inviting descriptions such as "non-state actors" (which is not a term of any greater clarity).
The Kathua rape case has, to me at least, the sense of a "human rights violation" because the dominant group of the area (the Hindus) seemed to have been united in backing the perpetrators. But it is not easy to make a case. I think we should list it here only if some human rights organisation lists it as a human rights violation, not otherwise. I don't buy the argument that what we list here should have anything to do with the "insurgency". -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 17:45, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: Adding the description is a good choice as this limits the edits to relevant one's and reated to insurgency. My Lord ( talk) 17:57, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
Should this be included in this template? - Amarnath land transfer controversy - for 2008? DiplomatTesterMan ( talk) 17:38, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
Hello. I would like to chime in and ask why have been terror attacks against armed security forces included in this template when the template is only for reporting human rights abuses against civilians? isn't that the case with every other entry besides the latest two? is the person responsible for adding these two entries implying that the terrorist attacks against armed forces should have the same weight as massacres and rapes of civilians? Mhveinvp ( talk) 07:17, 26 February 2019 (UTC)
It must be noted that attacks against the state are not counted as "human rights abuses". By definition, human rights are rights that are claimed only from the state (e.g., right to education, right to due process, right to family life, etc.). Only states are bound by human rights treaties they signed, and consequently only states can be held in breach of human rights.
We have two options:
Which option would you prefer? — kashmīrī TALK 21:07, 12 October 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Human rights abuses in Jammu and Kashmir template. |
|
This template does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||
|
I would say that more than half the links in this template are not to article son human rights abuses, any reasons for not removing them? Darkness Shines ( talk) 11:12, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: There have been 595 rape cases in Jammu and Kashmir in last 2 years. [1] [2]. So does that mean we will add every rape case??. It's better to keep this tempelate limited to major terror attacks rather than list of rapes, Rape is never ending case, we can't add every second rape case here. My Lord ( talk) 06:15, 3 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: I didn't say every Terror attack, I said Major Terror attacks should be listed here and as far as rapes are concerned those rape incidents should be mentioned here which are either done by securiy forces or Terrorists. Mentioning of regular rape cases makes no sense as I already said there have been 595 regular rape incidents in J&K in last 2 years and as far as Kunan and Shopain are concerned both are done by security forces. So it should be added here. My Lord ( talk) 19:14, 3 June 2018 (UTC)
@ Kautilya3: Notability is not an issue, the issue is whether to include cases which doesn't include Security forces or terrorists. My Lord ( talk) 04:36, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: As @ Adamgerber80: said it is not the part of curent insurgency. My Lord ( talk) 12:17, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
Usage: The following template includes human rights incidents in Jammu and Kashmir between the following parties - Indian security forces, militants and civilians. The template should not include other acts of rape or murder in Jammu and Kashmir, no matter how notable, if not related to militancy or insurgency.
The subject of what to call something a "Human rights violation" is a bit confused right now. Until recently, only the actions of states were called human rights violations. That is because the states are supposed to be human rights providers, and what they do cannot called "crimes". But, when people started complaining, the human rights organisations started including militant groups too, without a clear understanding of what they are doing and why. It makes sense in the areas where the militant groups are in control, acting as if they are mini-states of their own, inviting descriptions such as "non-state actors" (which is not a term of any greater clarity).
The Kathua rape case has, to me at least, the sense of a "human rights violation" because the dominant group of the area (the Hindus) seemed to have been united in backing the perpetrators. But it is not easy to make a case. I think we should list it here only if some human rights organisation lists it as a human rights violation, not otherwise. I don't buy the argument that what we list here should have anything to do with the "insurgency". -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 17:45, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
@ DiplomatTesterMan: Adding the description is a good choice as this limits the edits to relevant one's and reated to insurgency. My Lord ( talk) 17:57, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
Should this be included in this template? - Amarnath land transfer controversy - for 2008? DiplomatTesterMan ( talk) 17:38, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
Hello. I would like to chime in and ask why have been terror attacks against armed security forces included in this template when the template is only for reporting human rights abuses against civilians? isn't that the case with every other entry besides the latest two? is the person responsible for adding these two entries implying that the terrorist attacks against armed forces should have the same weight as massacres and rapes of civilians? Mhveinvp ( talk) 07:17, 26 February 2019 (UTC)
It must be noted that attacks against the state are not counted as "human rights abuses". By definition, human rights are rights that are claimed only from the state (e.g., right to education, right to due process, right to family life, etc.). Only states are bound by human rights treaties they signed, and consequently only states can be held in breach of human rights.
We have two options:
Which option would you prefer? — kashmīrī TALK 21:07, 12 October 2023 (UTC)