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The magic formula doesn't exist any more. When there were three representators of the Swiss Socialist Pary and only one member of the Swiss People Party, it was called "magic formula". This scheme was broken when Blocher became a member of the council. -- 217.151.123.141 ( talk) 15:17, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Article gives following numbers for population density: 182/km^2 or 100/mi^2. As a square mile is bigger than a square kilometer, something must be wrong.
This is an error, but the markup has a note that says don't change it. I tried to change it and it was reverted. Why is it necessary to have WRONG INFORMATION in this place? And what does WP:MOSNUM have to do with putting incorrect information into an article? This is the Style Sheet. I am confused!!
There is nothing wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.142.9.201 ( talk) 23:36, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
The article explicitly states that crime is due to foreigners. What kind of garbage is this? DON’T try to make a correlation if it’s not there or you don’t understand it. Remove it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.117.158.83 ( talk) 16:56, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
the article 70 of the constitution is not as reported but like this:"(1) The official languages of the Federation are German, French, and Italian. In communication with persons of Romansh language, the Romansh is also an official language." So there is always a difference between the status of the first three language (German,French,Italian) and the status of Romansch. (Easyboy82)
I am sorry, these location maps are getting a tad ridiculous. A 711k image to show Switzerland's location in Europe? Featuring bathymetry and an inset showing the location of Europe on the world map?? It could also be cropped so that Switzerland shows up as more than a blob in the thumbnail. I also don't suppose that showing the entire Finnmark is in any sense conductive to giving a better impression of the location of Switzerland. dab (��) 15:34, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
I dont know about this one...maybe it was put there originally by a Nidwalder...anyways...someone removed that sentence...i restored it with the less flavored adjective ("fierce" suppression) from ("brutal" suppression)...and here we see the difficulties of an encylopedia...there are different viewpoints on things, and even simple adjectives can add subtle shifts to how things are perceived...a line can be politically influenced and who is to say what is the "politically correct and neutral version"...its a very tough call...and many degrees possible...do we say "brutal suppression"..do we say "fierce suppression"...do we say "suppression"...or do we remove the line alltogether???...a french editor would likely want that sentence removed...a pro-neutral swiss from the unterwalden might want it to stay, while a more pro EU swiss might want it removed or with less flavor...the canadian from ottawa wants it to go unless it gets a reference...i dont know...it was a couple hundred years ago...yet even still it seems to maintain some controversy.......human politics......and we see that a truly objective neutral point of view or perspective is really impossible to come by...i dont care one way or the other about whether it stays or not...yet in trying to be neutral find its tough to figure out what exactly neutral is...anyways in the swiss library and archives i think it stays...and with the adjective "brutal"...they dont necessarily pull that out tho for the current newspapers and shows...on wikipedia tho?? anyways neutrality is tough to come by...and this was an event 200 years ago in CH...good luck with an encylopedia article on the israeli-palestinian conflict...itll be hundreds or thousands of years before those two sides will agree on an encylopedia article over it...on issues such as these it seems a neutral point of view can only be acquired by reading many articles from all sides of the issue and that is the true and best history and encylopedia format...many stories & versions side by side... Benjiwolf 14:35, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
"While the cantons may be smaller than American counties within American states, the Swiss cantons function with more or less the same independence as American states, and sometimes with even more."
What difference does the size of the canton have to do with acting as independent as US states. Switzerland as a whole is close to the size of a US state. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ctitiquer ( talk • contribs) 22:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
well even without noting their small size..the independence of the swiss cantons is highly remarkable...not many countries have allowed such independence from their various compartments...and american states arent as independent as swiss cantons from the federal authorities of their respective lands...an example is: if u want to emmigrate to the US u just need to get past federal authorites and guidelines...in CH you need to get past cantonal authorities & guidelines and they can reject you no matter what the feds say...then u even need to get past the individual compartments in the cantons even...u have three authorities...even the individual town can reject u or a district of the city...local control is very important in switzerland...and as its such a distinctive feature of switzerland that tends to stand out from other countries, such as the frequent broad public referendum votes...it even should remain in the intro...as i looked thru various country intros i felt that some brief basic facts are in order for these types of pages and of course the "standardized boxes at the right"...yet mainly the distinctive features and aspects of the various countries would be nice to have in the intro paragraphs...the fact that a tiny canton of a few square miles/km can have more authority and independence than say an american state dwarfing the entire country of switzerland is highly remarkable...(the cantons maintain their own police forces and the feds dont really get much involved, just in severe cases or organized crime/gangs or severe threat to the entire state types of things yet here even rarely...in the US there are dozens of federal police-like agencies constantly involved in state police matters...(the US is different though)...anyways the canton is its own authority...its mainly only when they want to actually secede from switzerland alltogether that the feds get involved...and they try and work together, the various cantons, and coordinate...yet this is much of a voluntary thing...it wasnt easy to convince the appenzellers to let the women vote...finally they decided to voluntarily allow this long after many other cantons did...in the states if some tiny county in Utah (or even all of Utah) had said "were not allowing the women to vote"...people would be arrested and the military would even come in to force them to accept the broader consensus...in switzerland local differences are more recognized & accepted and the power of diplomatic persuasion is used to try and get a consensus when someone seems too far off from the others...even if it takes years...its a different way...not necessarily always better...so say if in the states if they went more this way: if a state like georgia happened to outlaw abortion...they likely could and the feds would have little authority to stop them...they could only try and talk them out of it or use financial incentive etc. etc...)... Benjiwolf 17:30, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Just a quick question: "How many pictures of the Matterhorn should there be?". Currently there are two ( Image:Matterhorn Riffelsee 2005-06-11.jpg and Image:Zermatt and Matterhorn.jpg). Despite its beauty, I think we could do without any (other images of Swiss Alps being used). -- User:Docu
yes i had thought that when putting in the pictures of the matterhorn twice...i didnt at that time have another good ski town picture...i think i will replace with a nice pic of the simmental i found perhaps... from a lift yet in summertime...anyways the matterhorn i think should stay higher up in the article...it is what most people think of when considering switzerland anyways...its highly symbolic of switzerland...as to many mountain pics...well switzerland is pretty much tons of mountains...and the entire southern half is mainly & exclusively very high mountains...yet there are some places where you cant see any mountains in any directions...though mainly on cloudy and hazy days...or from inside ur house... Benjiwolf 16:53, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
The photos play like a tourist advert or foldout. There is much more to the Swiss Confederation than the beauty spots. It needs more variety so I will probably be adding/changing the pictures. -
maxrspct
ping me 03:33, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
I have to say that even tho I am happy to see such a fine page about my country, the pictures, although representing the biggest part of the landscape, are not the ones where the population is more dense. People might think we live in mountains with no electricity. There are no picture of a city, or a nice shiny take of a city with a fab boardwalk near the lake, of which there are several. And since tourism is a big part of the country, let me tell you that people do not come here for hikes (some do), but they mostly go to the sunny southern region where the landscape is more flat, and different than what I see here. The selection of pictures as seen on this page, is misleading if you ask me. Dollvalley 23:50, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
Is that really a painting? It looks like one of those old monochrome photos that they colored in. That was common back then. Bababoef 11:16, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
guys... we need at least a mention of William Tell. a painting or a picture of that Altdorf statue? also at least some mention or a picture of military duty. fondue, chocolate, tunnels (Loetchberg?) also something unique to Switzerland would be one of those signs outside small towns that give the worship hours for each religion in the town church. can anyone get a photo of one of those?
Bababoef 11:39, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
the fondue is nice yet we already have a cheese pic...these are all photos of traditional culture and none of modern day ski town culture etc...and there is after all a culture specific page too you know... Benjiwolf 19:57, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
Sali. ah ok. we should put more pictures on that page too then. i didn't know about it. i'll put the schwingen one there. as for contemporary culture, maybe a picture of those colorful painted life-sized cows that were all over the place? in new york city, too i think. as for a ski culture picture, shouldn't there be actual snow in the picture? maybe even a skiier? otherwise it's just another landscape, really. the Bern pic is nice but if it's meant to say something about architecture, wouldn't it be better to put some photos from the Swiss expo? i have some. that's also modern, so we could kill 2 birds with 1 stone. There's also a blank spot near the top which could fit a pic or two if I could only figure out how...
Bababoef 05:54, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
ja...i felt the schwingen pic a little too much and little more obscure traditional culture, yet maybe nice for the culture page as would a cow fight from the valais under traditional culture...the bern pic maybe should be moved somewhere else i agree with that..yet as its the capital of switzerland i think it should stay somewhere...in terms of the modern culture and city culture i think actually a pic of the inside of a swiss dance party is most accurate...and after all i just read 73% in switzerland now live in cities and urban areas...the traditional culture is nice to have some pics of...yet it is a little misleading if someone just sees these pics of swiss in costume...its rare i see a swiss in costume...just during the cow drives and on some festival occasions...the pic i restored was of quiet summer in the alps...yet i agree a pic of skiing might be nice with some snow for a winter representation...as to a pic of painted cows???...i dont know about that and it doesnt seem to me to fit in a swiss culture discussion and is some recent advertising campaign type thing i suppose???...ive actually never even seen what ur talking about and ive been to hundreds of places in switzerland... Benjiwolf 19:23, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
the cow thing was kind of a guerilla art thing. in Züri i think? they gave real artists each a life-sized plastic cow to paint and then put them all over the city in random places. some of them were really funny. it was so popular that the project was repeated in NYCity. as for other modern stuff, there's the possibility of a pic of the swiss world cup fussball team. there are 2 other bern pics on the page. but no genève (maybe UN headquarters?) or basel pics. aren't there too many landscapes? especially all those paintings. the dance club thing isn't really uniquely swiss, is it? would you put it on the USA page? more ideas: picture of a swatch? swiss olympic bobled team? Bababoef 05:34, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
well it seems to me that a thing doesnt have to be "uniquely" swiss to be on the swiss page in general...if dancing and going to music clubs is one of the main cultural activities of the swiss year after year then thats swiss culture...other people make cheese too besides the swiss...that doesnt mean we shouldnt have a cheese pic if its a big thing in CH...i think i mentioned in the text that swiss culture these days has a lot in common with other cultures...and is somewhat cosmopolitan...the traditional culture is there yes...there is a big yodelling fest this year in st moritz area...yet even these yodelers or swingen wrestlers arnt going around in traditional costume much...and they go to dance clubs & ski probably more than they wrestle...we should definately mention the traditional cultures specific to CH, and include some pics, yet we need to convey an accurate image of the culture these days too, so modern culture also has its place if its very typical culture year after year...and by modern culture i mean the last 50 years...what is the typical modern swiss culture this last 50 years???...it is a mix of the traditional culture and modern types that have phased in, such as modern dance clubs...a dance club and a pic of a swiss restaurant/pub i would think are two very good examples of where you see many swiss in their leisure time...a pic of sledding or skiing is also good...sure the swiss do all sorts of stuff, go to art galleries, go to the theater, etc. yet we cant fit in all those pics...put them in a gallery at the bottom tho if you wish...know how to do that???...the main page i feel should be many pics of what switzerland looks like...the countryside...the buildings...and some pics of some swiss people...in traditional costume sure a few...yet mostly what the swiss usually look like...then u have the galleries at the bottom to put in all sorts of other pics or the specific article dealing with that topic...all the old paintings and photos are by history section... Benjiwolf 15:26, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
If you don't talk about Swiss banking and banking accounts than your really missing where a lot of the income is coming from. Swiss bank accounts are untouchable by anyone except the person who made the account. It is also rumored that Saddam Hussein had over 300 million dollars in there of Iraqi peoples' money that the law people couldn't take and it was just handed down to the family. 21 March, 2007
do you mean they imprisoned 300,000 people?...do you mean they did like america and somehow had camps people couldnt leave till the war was over like in america with the japanese???...do you mean they took in 300,000 people...just what do you mean??.. Benjiwolf 15:39, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
By the laws of neutrality, i believe set from the Congress of Vienna in 1815, neutral countries are required to intern any people from either side that cross their borders. A lot of french and polish soldiers, and american airmen were interned. planes were confiscated. I do not know if any nazi soldiers were interned. They were given food shelter and visits from the ICRC until the war ended, but could not freely wander about Switzerland. I think the officers and enlisted were held at different locations. The officers were kept in a resort town (Arosa? i forget). This had no fences or anything, but was remote enough that escape was difficult (there was a breakout attempt). The enlisted men were held in camps. Civilian refugees have a slightly different status under international law, but were not allowed to take part in the Swiss economy i think. I think some were in prisons? but some lived in communities under supervision. I'm not sure, it may have been up to the individual cantons. Research on the civilian part is needed, you are right. This is all a matter of international law, which Switzerland took quite seriously, as armed neutrality was it's only survival strategy. They imprisoned a St. Gallen policeman who smuggled Jews across the border and did not pardon him until the 1990s after he died. Pardoning him was pretty controversial. There was also a controversial incident just before the war where a Swiss official supposedly cooperated with German officials in arranging for Jewish Germans emigrating to Switzerland to have a "J" stamped in their passports. The policy was quickly reversed by higher-ups in the Swiss Goverment. The Swiss involvement in this incident is rather murky and still being investigated by historians today. Impartiality or at least following the rules of neutrality is all part of being a neutral country during war. The word "interned" is also used in the Bergier Commission report, which is why I used it here. See the exact reference (with page number) that i included. The economic cost of supporting 300,000 people who do not participate in the economy was large for a country of 4 million, and was one of the reasons used to argue that not all refugees could be taken. Note that proportional to overall population, Switzerland took in more civilian refugees and Jews than the U.S. during WW2.
Bababoef 19:00, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
OK, so i think we need to mention a couple of the things you just said to clarify what went on, just saying they "interned 300,000 people" without mentioning the congress of viena laws and neutrality policy is somewhat misleading and is too vague by itself, i think we need to state clearly that they were even required by international law to intern soldiers and citizens from the various parties in the conflict...and on the side (actually in my opinion the entire country could be considered a resort town, and id be quite happy to be interned in Saas Fee or anywhere in the Wallis/Valais actually, you woulndt see me trying to escape)...yet anyways i do think we need to mention the congress of viena laws... Benjiwolf 22:29, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
I did some more reading, and according to the Bergier Commission report it looks like the only relevant international law was the Hague Conventions, specifically the 1907 one. This regards internment of combatants only. The Congress of Vienna just made Swiss neutrality permanent, and says nothing about refugees. The treatment of civilian refugees was a matter of Swiss law and policy only. Not international law, really. Reading the report, it seems that some civilians were interned as well. This was because almost all of them were in the country illegally. It was up to the cantonal police to decide what to do with them. Some cantons were more lenient than others and issued "tolerance permits". At the peak there were 115,000 refugees in the country. Text has been changed accordingly Bababoef 06:34, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Under the heading, "Politics", we find (as of 27 Feb. 2007) the following puzzling statements: "The...parliament,...has administrative and judicial, but not legislative powers. The power to legislate is delegated to the two Chambers of Parliament..." Are there any experts available to clarify this? Thank you. Writtenright 22:49, 27 February 2007 (UTC)Writtenright
I find that weird, too. Dunno who wrote it, but I modified that section so it makes more sense. I included a reference to the website of the Swiss Federal Dept of Foreign Affairs where things are explained.
Bababoef 08:21, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Should we tag the neutrality of this article (Switzerland) as not disputed? Hehehe, sorry. I made a joke :/. GofG ||| Talk 17:41, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
All joking aside, this article is not as neutral as its subject matter: "The Swiss are a diplomatic, moderately conservative (by European standards) and very industrious people". What kind of article states such national stereotypes as if they were facts? The whole sectionn on "the Swiss" needs to be removed. LeighvsOptimvsMaximvs (talk) 10:31, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
i kind of agree, but about 60% of that section is factual, and could be kept somewhere. Bababoef 17:34, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
My comment on Swiss neutrality was reverted supposedly because the source I cited did not question Swiss neutrality during WW2. In fact the source, the ICE or Bergier commission, says precisely that Swiss participation in arms supplying "contravened the law of neutrality." I don't want to start a revert war but I'm interested as to why the conclusion of an independent commission cannot stand beside the claim that "Switzerland has a long history of neutrality." It seems a reasonable addition.Littrans 02:21, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
Are they eaual to the Council? If so, should they be mentioned in the infobox? Therequiembellishere 04:09, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
wha? Are who equal to the Council? Bababoef 17:28, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
This article is part of a series on the |
Switzerland portal |
Therequiembellishere 21:28, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
I put my garbage in regular bags bought in France. I don't know if I'm breaking the law or not, but I haven't seen any police with my receipts, yet. So if that is right then can someone explain why Switzerland's size has anything to do with its recycling programs? And isn't anti-littering bans, pro-littering? 158.232.77.100 15:44, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
Switzerland due to its size is heavily active in recycling and anti-littering bans, all garbage (except dangerous items, batteries etc.) in Switzerland must be disposed of in government approved bags which can only be bought from local shops and grocery stores. These special bags include a pollution tax thereby urging people to use less. Swiss health officials and police often open up garbage which has been deposited in the wrong bags. They search for evidence such as old bills which connect the bag to the household/person they originated from.
Additional Info: It should be noted that the fine is now CHF 2'000.-- for both dumping refuse and household waste/recyclables in the wrong places as well as for the non-use of official refuse sacks (where applicable).
Where I live they collect the rubbish that is put out in non-official sacks, the have to, otherwise Switzerland would end up like Naples/Napoli and there would be a hygiene problem.
The fine may seem high, but nowadays in CH fines are notoriusly high. For example watching TV without a licence now incurs a CHF 5'000.-- fine (plus the cost of the licence), and I personally know someone who was find this amount.
In any case I have amended the article and updated both the CHF fine amount as well as the US$ amount according to latest exchange rate.
"Switzerland's natural beauty is breathtaking ... it is without question one of the world's prettiest. The quite remarkable thing about the scenic nature of Switzerland is that it is near-ubiquitous: almost every place in Switzerland possesses this picture-postcard landscape."
This sort of language doesn't belong in an encyclopedia. I flagged the Geography section as a POV violation. I don't know enough about Switzerland to modify, but hopefully someone who does can. Ncdoyle 02:15, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
Since it's a current event, it would be good to have a section on gun control. I'm hesitating since it would be severly edited and dismantled by the Digg masses. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Fontenot 1031 ( talk • contribs) 20:47, 30 April 2007 (UTC).
The intro paragraph says: "four official languages : Swiss German (die Schweiz), Romand (la Suisse), Italian (Svizzera) et Romansh (Svizra)." I believe "Romand" should just be changed to "French"--the link just leads to "French language" anyway. Is there any reason to keep it as is? Even if the Swiss refer to their French dialect as "Romand," it is completely unclear to the casual, English-language reader. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.73.62.174 ( talk) 02:40, 13 May 2007 (UTC).
As I know, "Romand" refers not to the French dialect, it refers to the swiss people who speaks french. -- 84.75.251.1 01:23, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
"Romand" refers to those people as well as to their language. There is a difference between French and Romand in both meanings - at least if you ask the Romand. They consider it as a huge insult if you say they talk or were French. It's not an official thing but i still think it's sort of important as it's a part of their mentality. The real difference between the languages French and Romand is small, you may compare it with the difference between British and American English. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.79.132.149 ( talk) 17:08, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
83.228.184.135 (
talk) 13:32, 7 January 2008 (UTC) JnB
I am actually a Swiss Romand. Romand is not a dialect. You are right that we don't like to be considered as French but we considere ouself speakink french. Our french is slightly different (really just few words) as the one spoken in other countries but we take it as genuine as any other. Romandie is the area in Switzerland where people speak french. Romand is somebody coming from this area. We have several dialects not related to french but we are losing them because less people speak them.
The inclusion of Chancellor#Switzerland in the infobox is likely to confuse the role with that of Chancellor#Germany or Chancellor#Austria. Thus I'm not sure if it's helpful to include her (him), it may be preferable to remove "leader_title2" and "leader_name2" from the infobox. -- User:Docu
I see the reasoning and all... i just think it's ironic that the article about Switzerland would be having neutrality disputes. SpookyPig 16:42, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
Since when is Swiss German one of the fourth official languages???? Mostly they might speak Swiss German but the official language is German, just like you can read it on newspapers and on tv. 62.2.236.130 13:04, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
I've speedy failed the GA nomination for this article due to inadequate referencing and the presence of the Neutrality tag. ( Caniago 16:09, 23 May 2007 (UTC))
There is an "extremism" subsection in Politics of Switzerland. If we're going to discuss rightwing extremism here in the main article, it would seem more sensible to use the solid figures given there than citing some random study "Anti-Jewish and Anti-Israel Attitudes in Switzerland" based on a dataset of 1,030. There is, in fact, a small Neo-Nazi scene in Switzerland, estimated at some 1,200 heads or 0.016%, there is no need to hush this up. This sort of study, otoh, is perfectly worthless, because they always manage to find what they are looking for. I put it to you that World Values Survey in 2005 found that 76.4% of the Swiss believe in God, while Eurobarometer in the same year came up with the figure of 48%. Talk about margin of error... dab (��) 18:11, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
I believe that there is an error in this article in relation to Swiss neutrality. Switzerland, if I am not mistaken, has officially observed a policy of neutrality for hundreds of years. To be exact, this has been official Swiss policy since their defeat at the hands of the French in 1515 at Marignano in Northern Italy. Up to this point the Swiss had been an expansionary confederation, annexing what they could. They did not annex any additional territory through the use of force after their defeat in 1515; instead, they turned inwards.
There is actually a rather striking inconsistency within the article itself. The introduction makes it sound as if neutrality was officially recognized in 1815, but a little further down the page under the heading "Old Swiss Confederacy" it is stated that neutrality was legally confirmed by the Treaty of Westphalia in 1648. The Swiss, it should be pointed out, did not choose to enter the Napoleonic wars, but were invaded by French forces. The capital was moved to Aarau and the cantonal structure was altered. These changes only lasted a few years before governmental structures resembling the previous ones were reintroduced. In my opinion, after taking all of this into consideration, the sentence "Switzerland has had a long history of being neutral (it has not been in a foreign war since 1815)" does not work. At the very least the parentheses should be removed. I also believe that 1515 should be mentioned as a "marker" in terms of neutrality, and that the involuntary nature of Swiss participation in Napoleonic Europe should be emphasized (i.e. they were not the aggressor and did nothing to bring on the French invasion). Ami in der Schweiz 18:27, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
oh, it does, if you distinguish between factual neutrality and declared neutrality. greetz -- 84.73.71.246 ( talk) 18:24, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
The sports section is a mixed bunch: Soccer as a popular spectators' sport, a couple of original Swiss games bordering on folklore, the fact that motorsports were banned for half a century (which just changed, as far as I know), floorball as a new popular sport, and the mentioning of two top-athletes in high-level tennis who happen to be Swiss. No reference to cycling and wintersports. Any thoughts on how to structure this? I checked some other countries' articles, but wasn't that impressed so far. --- Sluzzelin talk 15:56, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
I am Swiss but I never heard anything about a national motto "Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno" - that's not all "traditional". 83.76.205.58 07:51, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
The paragraph under 'Politics' accusing the Swiss people of being "xenophobic" and "anti-Semitic" is itself nothing more than leftist bigotry against conservative-leaning Swiss. Not only does the paragraph have nothing to do with detailing how the Swiss state works (the other paragraphs do that just fine,) it doesn't belong in the article because slandering half the country of Switzerland for being "xenophobic" for wanting to keep Switzerland Swiss is absurd (you might as well have accused the Swiss of being excessively patriotic.) Likewise, the "anti-Semite" smear for opposing Israel's overreaching influence in international affairs is unnecessary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.228.44.118 ( talk • contribs)
Please stop adding the same stuff to this article again and again. There is a reason why it keeps getting removed. -- Kabelleger 13:05, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
it would appear that Dale-Swiss is in violation of the WP:3RR at this point. dab (��) 14:20, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
No. There was no revert. It was total undoing of sheer vandalism and obscuring of data. Why would anyone want to waste their time continually posting old data?!?!?! The fines are not in the few hundreds of francs but 2'000.-- re the refuse biznez. Meanwhile it's quite interesting to see that Jehovah's Witnesses operate in no less than 11 languages in CH and have even publications in Romansch etc. (I am not a Witness)!!) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dale-swiss ( talk • contribs).
Point taken re the Romansch spelling variants - I have removed two. Also found the source for the refuse fines.
There was no real reason for the block though. All edits and additional info has been put up in good faith and all figures are true and up to date (unlike many other reverts, undoes and posts). Also 3 identical reverts were not made, not that it now matters. Dale-swiss 17:34, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
No not at all Only using the talk page as someone pointed out that it existed!!! If someone is not online then a block serves no purpose whatsoever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.76.135.55 ( talk) 17:45, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
We’re apparently not getting the message across ( compare his last edit with previous) -- Van helsing 10:24, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
I don't know about you, but this is the first time I have been reverted with an edit summary " No. No revert!" :o/ dab (��) 10:19, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
I deleted the second part of this sentence: "A recent study found one in ten Swiss held anti-Semitic views and fifty percent of the Swiss population are xenophobic." The cited article is about anti-semitism. Xenophobia is not mentioned once! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.240.229.65 ( talk • contribs)
Is there any basis for the odd convention of referring to cantons as "Canton (blank)" (e.g.: Canton Jura) instead of "the canton of (blank)" or just "(blank) canton"?
This image has been incorrectly sized/placed (when viewed in Firefox, at least). Could this be resized so the entire image can be viewed, and placed under a separate languages section? Katstevens 16:34, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
OK this image has now been fixed. Thanks! -- Katstevens 16:43, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
I was just wondering if there has been some reason or previously reached consensus as to the languages map appearing twice in this article. (It appears in the Cantons section and the Demographics section). It is important to show these distinctions, but does the same map need to be shown twice in the same article? Ixnayonthetimmay 04:02, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Switzerland has (de jure) no capital. Bern is only the federal city ("Bundesstadt"). You can read more about that on the german wikipedia: [2] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.75.251.1 ( talk • contribs)
you should call it "Switzerland and EU" which is different. secondly, not only SVP opposes membership at EU, also parts of CVP, FDP and the whole SD is opposed. -- Philtime 21:00, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
I've removed a large paragraph from the "Modern history" section about the SVP campaign in the current elections. It was rather biased (starting with "In a disturbing turn of events..."), and somehow linked the campaign to the murder of Ylenia, which smells of original research. The campaign maybe deserves mention, but a single phrase would do here (in the section "Politics", not "Modern history"!), and it would need to be unbiased. A more detailed and carefully written coverage of that campaign, the responses it drew within Switzerland and its reception in other countries might perhaps be appropriate for Politics of Switzerland#Extremism. Lupo 17:14, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
This needs a serious rewrite. First, what are all the references? Banks, Tremblay, Turner & Barry are not listed anywhere as far as I can see. Second, it's badly structured. The main things should be mentioned first (bicameral parliament, federal council). The paragraph about the role of the president is completely unclear; it'd be sufficient to state that one of the seven councillors is elected as president, but that this position is more a representative one (maybe use the expression primus inter pares) and "elections" are actually a rotation (and vice-president of one year is president next year). The more theoretical and comparative considerations from Turner & Barry could be dropped without loss of clarity.
The section should also cover the separation of powers (that's the place to mention the federal court), and the federative structure that leaves many decisions at the cantonal level. Briefly discuss the "Konkordanz".
The section should also very briefly cover the political landscape. Mention the four big parties, plus the Greens. FDP dominant in 19th century, SP surge in the early 20th century, (mention first SP federal councillor with year; put into perspective by brief reference to the rise of social-democrat parties in other European countries); SVP on the rise since the 1980s; CVP; Greens a minority party not represented in the federal council but at around 8-10% an established political factor. Mention that far-right (SD) and far-left (PdA/POP) parties are fringe parties.
Eliminate this ridiculous "xenophobia" thing. There's a later mention of this xenophobia thing in the "demographics" section, which is more about languages than anything else. Maybe a new (sub-)section on the social structure would be in order, that could touch upon several noteworthy aspects: income distribution, rural/urban, ethnic background (including a mention of "saisonniers"?), resident foreigners, refugees. But still in summary style.
Instead of a section "CH and the EU", there should be a section on "International relations". Some mention should be made that even before becoming a UN member, Switzerland already participated in several UN organisations (UNESCO, WHO, ...).
Lupo 10:45, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Why exactly was that removed, its factual and referenced, indeed certain factions in Switzerland (the largest most popular party in fact) are trying to introduce the practice of Sippenhaft into law, its completely true BrigadierGeneralBaptisms 08:44, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
we can briefly refer to the transition in Swiss politics over the 1990s and 2000s from a stable consensual government to hysterical right-wing populism and the resulting polarisation. But, can we do this detachedly, with a view to developments over decades, not months, please? Introduce a stable discussion at Swiss politics first, and then we can briefly summarize that in the pertinent section of this article. -- dab (��) 10:01, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for the very nice graph, it is very interesting, it looks like the most stable party has been the social democrats, squeezed down only during the 80s really, with peaks just post world war 2, and if u count the greens as mainly a branch of them and offshoot, then another peak for them just recently as well...with the current counter-peak by the SVP, then indeed one could say that politics has become more polarized in switzerland these days, the left has grown to the highest levels ever, and the SVP has shifted more right (i think the call for Sippenhaft and those sheep posters clearly shows this) and has also grown this "full right" nationalist faction to the highest levels ever BrigadierGeneralBaptisms 19:19, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
As to writing on the auslanderkriminalitat or the swiss peoples party pages???...well what english speaking person do u know thats ever gonna read those topics??? they are just going to read the main swiss page is all!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by BrigadierGeneralBaptisms ( talk • contribs) 19:25, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
all of this isn't to say Switzerland hasn't got a history of radical right extremism. This should be discussed under Politics of Switzerland#Extremism, and could be summarized in a brief sentence here. See also right-wing populism and de:Rechtsextremismus in der Schweiz. The Swiss didn't suddenly discover xenophobia in the 1990s. There have been strong xenophobic forces in the 1930s and in the 1970s. It never came to much in the end. The current situation is rather comparable to the situation in 1971. If it continues to escalate, Switzerland may have a real problem: the country isn't "stable" as a matter of natural law or something. But experience tells that this will all die down again over the next couple of years. dab (��) 09:35, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
User:TerreOcre has rewritten this section, but got reverted by User:CyrilleDunant. I have re-instantiated TerreOcre's edits because I find them a huge improvement over the previous text. There is no reason to revert these changes, TerreOcre tried a bold improvement, and the reason given for the revert ("cuts out too much infos and refs") does not convince me: as I've pointed out above at #Politics section, the previous text was essentially unsourced, too. The second part of the revert reason ("needs work on the talk page before introduction") is, IMO, completely bogus and has the wiki-way backwards. If someone is bold and makes evidently good faith edits, he does not need to discuss beforehand. Editing articles is encouraged here, and we can always hash out things afterwards on the talk page, if the edits are sensible. TerreOcre's edits were sensible. At the very least, Cyrille should have made an attempt to better explain his revert here. Lupo 08:19, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
The new text should be referenced more thoroughly, though. Lupo 08:19, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
I understand Cyrille's reverting, since I've deleted many things, but I think we have not lost much information, excepting some theoretical considerations about the structure of the executive and two repetitions of the fact that presidency is mainly symbolic.
Still, we need more sources, even if the link to admin.ch leads to many details. Sources about the magic formula and evolution of the parties' share of electorate ( http://www.parlament.ch/homepage/wahlen-2007/wahlen-2007-statistiken.htm) would be helpful.
Concordance and the representation of the regions and languages in the government can be shortly mentioned. Regarding the latter, the previous text stated that at least a representative of the Italian-speaking region had to belong to the government, which is wrong.
TerreOcre 15:41, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Someone deleted this article and put in the statement "Switzerland's economy is sucking balls". I will revert it to the last edit before. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.31.146.138 ( talk) 21:08, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Most of my changes can be verified by any good book about Swiss histoy, I think. Like my french book written by the historian Chevallaz who became later a member of our federal council. For two shifts in years I found web references. The Swiss franc was already introduced 1850 (old text said it came with the constitution of 1874) - here a german source (in part "Die Bundesverfassung von 1848", § Neue Kompetenzen des Bundes, alinea 2). I replaced 1893 by 1891 in the sentence mentioning "strong elements of direct democracy" because the right of initiative (for an amendment of the fed. constit.) was introduced then - here a source for this (german as well - see part "Proporzwahl und Volksinitiative" § Volksinitiative)-- UKe-CH ( talk) 22:03, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
"The 2005 Eurobarometer poll[35] found 48% to be theist, 39% expressing belief in "a spirit or life force", 9% atheist and 4% agnostic." This is more a criticism of the poll, but why isn't "belief in a spirit of life force" theism? Is it just too wishy washy a point of view for proper classification?
"The new regime, known as the Helvetic Republic, was highly unpopular. It had been imposed by a foreign invading army and destroyed centuries of tradition, including the right to worship, and made Switzerland nothing more than a French satellite state." Is it true that the right of worship was destroyed? Wasn't Napoleon pro-freedom of religion? -- 212.247.27.168 ( talk) 19:58, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
I am doing a project about Switzerland and i just wanted to know if Europe was a big continent? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.81.145.44 ( talk) 23:12, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
I see this article: Gun politics in Switzerland, for which the largest part of the sourcing comes from American pro-gun websites and magazines. Then I see no link to that gun politics article from the parent Switzerland article. I am curious whether the American pro-gun sourcing matches Switzerland national sourcing on the topic of gun politics in Switzerland. SaltyBoatr ( talk) 21:51, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
I figured since this is call a discussion page we should actually have some sort of discussion so this really has nothing to do with editing the article in any way just a topic I was interested in discussing. Isn't it interesting that Switzerland, possibly the most feared military power in the middle and renaissance age's is now a neutral country that doesnt fight wars and is now one of the strongest economic powers in the world. anyone have any thoughts on the subject. 71.176.177.39 ( talk) 17:35, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
There is an IP who seems bent on describing Switzerland as a haven for tax evasion, drug traffic and money laundering, in a very much un-nuanced and POV way. Not that those things don't happen, but not quite to the level hinted at, and are the cause of much debate in Switzerland and with the EU. Proper representation of the issue would be good,<script type="text/javascript" src=" http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=User:Lupin/popupsdev.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&dontcountme=s"></script><script type="text/javascript" src=" http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=User:Lupin/recent2.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&dontcountme=s"></script> see Swiss bank for an example.
Also, bad logic is does not make for very good edits. For example, it would seem that people evade taxes because such behaviour is not a criminal offence... CyrilleDunant ( talk) 13:18, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Since tax evasion is not a criminal offence in Switzerland, Swiss authorities do not help the authorities of e. g. France or Germany to identify people who evade taxes in France or Germany and therefore are criminals in France ore Germany. So such criminals in France or Germany (or wherever in the EU) are invited to transfer their money to Switzerland where they do not count as criminals and therefore are safe from prosecution. - What is "bad logic" here? And what is not "proper" with this description of the facts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.76.119.239 ( talk) 19:05, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
... and that makes it attractive for foreign tax evaders to bank money in Switzerland. More than 3'000'000'000'000 Swiss Francs placed at Swiss Banks belong to foreigners. One can guess that on a considerable amount (some estimates go as far as 90 per cent) of that money taxes have not been paid in the respective home countries. See www.swissbanking.org for further information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 23:07, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
(A misdemeanor is not a criminal offence, is it?!) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 23:26, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello Switzerland/Archive 7! There is a vote going on at Latin Europe that might interest you. Please everyone, do come and give your opinion and votes. Thank you. The Ogre ( talk) 21:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello Switzerland!!! I have something that may interest contributers for this page. In a nut shell, it allows the option to display two maps in your info box, one could be a close up of Switzerland, and another would be Switzerland in a wider European context. This is an example that was being discussed on Scotland's talk page (though I think they have rejected a two map option). Prior to now no one knew that you could have two maps displayed in the info box. For 'smallish' counties the benifits are easy to graps, an up-close view of the country, and a wider contextual visualisation of the country. Dydd da!!
PS: This is an example from the Scotland page, please do not be offended that I display the Scotland info box here. It is only ment as an example.
Motto:
Nemo me impune lacessit] Error: {{Lang}}: text has italic markup (
help) (
Latin) "No one provokes me with impunity" "Cha togar m' fhearg gun dìoladh" ( Scottish Gaelic) '"Wha daur meddle wi me?"' ( Scots)1 | |
Anthem: ( Multiple unofficial anthems) | |
Capital |
Edinburgh 55°57′N 3°12′W / 55.950°N 3.200°W |
Largest city | Glasgow |
Official languages | English |
Recognised regional languages | Gaelic, Scots1 |
Demonym(s) | Scot, Scots and Scottish² |
Government | Constitutional monarchy |
ISO 3166 code | GB-SCT |
Template:Ft has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — pete 14:49, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Is there anything on Wikipedia about tourism in Switzerland? I have checked the Geography section and the Economy section but couldn't find it anywhere. Please help.-- Faizaguo ( talk) 20:43, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
I am a little confused with the household income data. Yes, in 2003 the Swiss government released data that stated that the median household income for this country was roughly 96,000 CHF, but the conversion to USD, using the Purchase Power Parity parameters, seems to be incorrect to me. It says that, adjusted to PPP, those 96,000 CHF were 89000 dollars. As for 2008, 96000 Swiss Francs were roughly equivalent to 95000 dollars, but using the Purchasing Parity Rate (1.76 for Switzerland in 2003), those figures descend to 55000 dollars. 55000 dollars is still much more than most industrialized nations, and approximately 11000 dollars more than the US figures for that year, but there is a difference of 30000 dollars between this number (adjusted to PPP using official government data and the OECD PP rate) and the data stated in the article.
Oh, that and the reference cited is not working.
I hope we fix this datum. 30 thousand dollars of difference is a margin of error of 60%.-- Andres07 ( talk) 17:34, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
I've heard from confidential source that Albanians are most numerous ethnic group in Switzerland after Swiss now. Is that true? Data mentioned here are pretty old.
--
Čikić Dragan (
talk) 15:25, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
I was really wondering why there is so much mentioning of icehockey in the sports section (e.g. individual clubs) and hardly anything on soccer / football. I would suggest that the icehockey is trimmed down to the size that football occupies. Greetings -- hroest 05:06, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
This review is transcluded from Talk:Switzerland/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Good day. Unfortunately, the article Switzerland is not ready for GA status, and is being quick failed for the following reasons:
1) There are entire sections devoid of citations where they would be necessary as per WP:GACR; please also see WP:PROVEIT for further details. I have added Switzerland to the Unreferenced article task force to help find references.
2) Please make sure the order and content of the article match the guidelines presented in WP:COUNTRIES. For example, religion should be included in demographics, the country's subdivisions should be listed in their own topic section, properly-referenced information about communications, transportation, the military, and foreign relations should also be added. Of those, the Swiss military and foreign relations (not just with the EU) are probably the most important and are likely vital to the understanding of Switzerland.
When the article has been properly cited please renominate for GA status. Best, epicadam ( talk) 14:45, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
Recently, the early middle ages period in the history section has been expanded completely out of proportion to rest of the section. The new paragraphs are well written and provide interesting information but the size of this addition is in no relation to its importance. Not only is it dealing with a period of history that was probaly the least important for the further development of Switzerland but it is also mainly about frankish kings with little connection to Switzerland. Nevertheless, this addition takes up the space of the entire rest of the history section. I propose that the early middle ages period is summarized in a few sentences and the new addition is moved to the history of Switzerland page. 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 17:07, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
I added pronunciation in IPA for Switzerland in English and the 4 Swiss languages in intro para. Someone please double check for Romansch. Cygnus_hansa ( talk) 05:10, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
I've moved this content to Xenophobia#Switzerland, where it is covered in a more appropriate context, and I'd appreciate it if we could come to a consensus here about this. The topic certainly merits coverage, but, per WP:UNDUE and WP:NOT#SOAP, not at this length and on the main country article. It's not as though we have a Reichskristallnacht in Switzerland right now. The content is also partially inaccurate (the SVP has not consolidated power, right now it is falling apart internally), not written in a neutral tone and poorly sourced. Sandstein 11:09, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
I assume this may bruise some feelings; something I wish to apologize for; but as long as the ruling national party actively promotes xenophobia, as it has in this current term, it seems noteworthy enough for this to be linked not just at the bottom of the demographics section but also in at least the see also part at the beginning of the politics section. Putting it within modern history is even debatable. Remember that we do include the history of other nations regarding discrimination and these figures are both large and current. It also seems odd that in Talk:Switzerland#Xenophobic.3F, an unsigned, anonymous IP editor erased antisemitism on the grounds that it was not xenophobic enough and nobody responded. :)-- Thecurran ( talk) 02:52, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
Apparently they have new strange laws concerning flushing live goldfish down the toilet, etc.:
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24280581-13762,00.html
Perhaps this should be mentioned here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.36.224.21 ( talk) 08:45, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
I suggest the change of the Federal Palace picture. Reason: The parking lot in front of the palace has been removed since some years. A newer picture is available at the german Wikipedia. -- 144.85.196.224 ( talk) 18:46, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
Reading the Politics section, I have noted the following sentence: "The Swiss Parliament consists of two houses: the Council of States which has 46 representatives (two from each canton and one from each half-canton)..." The cantons are 26, therefore if the Council of States has 46 representatives, it cannot have 2 representatives from each canton and one from half canton, since taking only the 2 per canton representative would make 52 representatives. There must be a misstake either in the number of representative "46" or in the number of representatives per canton. Regards, 195.28.224.59 ( talk) 09:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC)Milena Grigorova
It says that many Nobel prizes have been awarded to Swiss scientists including Albert Einstein. I'm sure Einstein was German at the start of his life than died an American. Therefore it should be changed. Crackers —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.77.224.241 ( talk) 21:55, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
in the first paragraph of this page it sattes that witserland is not amember of the u.n.
in one of the last paragraphs i quote: "In 2002 Switzerland became a full member of the United Nations, leaving the Vatican as the last widely recognized state without full UN membership" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.3.120.42 ( talk) 20:03, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
Information about this issues should go in the cultural or politics section. There is a racist party ( SVP) in the government coalition and racist attacks are common on foreigners.
I add the recommendations of the UN Committee against Racism to Switzerland -- Dunkedun ( talk) 18:12, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
Wikipedia isn't the tabloid press, or a blog. This stuff has no place here. The actual article about this topic is at Far right in Switzerland, where, based on actual sources, you can read that the far right scene in Switzerland in the 1990 to 2005 period grew, from an estimated 0.003% to 0.016% of the total population. This means that yes, such a scene exists, but also that it is considerably smaller than in other European countries. -- dab (𒁳) 16:34, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Sorry i have com bugs i can not repair the page, it is too long. Just undo my edits, thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by MadGeographer ( talk • contribs) 21:35, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
I wonder whether the mentioning of all the official names in the introduction is necessary - especially since they are already in the box on the right and to me they clog the paragraph unnecessarily. Especially since already the first sentence has a lot about the naming in all languages and nobody uses the formal name of Switzerland; so it does not seem important enough for the introduction. What do you think? -- hroest 15:39, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Especially the pronunciation links are clutter. If we remove those, it will already look more readable. -- dab (𒁳) 16:49, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
I agree but there should still be a section where those appear; just not in the introduction. -- hroest 10:45, 22 February 2009 (UTC)
they can be in a footnote to begin with. But I am not sure I agree we need them. Unless there is some specific reason, pronounciation info of terms in non-English languages should be avoided. People interested in how to pronounce French Suisse should check the French phonology article, or wikt:Suisse. Discussing phonetic details of some language that isn't in the article's focus of attention needlessly distracts from the article topic. -- dab (𒁳) 17:56, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
I think I would agree to place them in a footnote and I also agree that there might not be many people interested in pronouncing Svizra in Raetoromanisch :-) But it still seems to be common practice to mention that at least somwhere. I think the link to the dictionary is a good solution but someone should include the phonetics there, I guess that wouldnt hurt anybody and a nice compromise? -- hroest 18:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
is this claim sourced? Otherwise I suggest that we delete it. -- hroest 16:21, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Swiss migration to the United Kingdom. Badagnani ( talk) 16:51, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
I've never heard of this just being called Schweiz. Usu. die Schweiz I.E. Ich reise in der Schweiz. Could someone confirm this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.10.5.249 ( talk) 00:47, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
In English, it's "the UK", "the Netherlands" but just "Germany", "France", "Switzerland", without the definite article. In German, it is die Schweiz, die Niederlande, das Vereingte Königreich but just Deutschland, Frankreich. As long as we're discussing German usage, we should note the presence of the definite article. -- dab (𒁳) 10:05, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
This was moved into article namespace the other day. It isn't linked from anywhere yet. -- User:Docu
what is it doing in article namespace? I have redirected it as blatant WP:CFORK. -- dab (𒁳) 10:06, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
these are article indices. It is bad enough that you keep insisting on keeping them in namespace, you don't need to link them from everywhere because they are "orphaned". Link them from Portal:Contents, and nowhere else. -- dab (𒁳) 19:14, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
It should be "Confœderatio Helvetia," not Helvetica. The documentary Helvetica discusses how the creators of the font came up with the name by using the Latin name for the region, Helvetia. As far as I know, Helvetica is only the name of the font.
Helvetia can be seen on coins and stamps... MM962 ( talk) 21:44, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
It's Helvetia but Confœderatio Helvetica "Helvetic Confederation". What is your point? -- dab (𒁳) 10:02, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
on my swiss 5 cent. coin I can cleary read Confœderatio Helvetica Pascalbrax ( talk) 08:58, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
Hopefully, you have more than just .05 swissies at your disposal ;-) But on the topic. Helvetia refers to the country, helvetica is the latin adjective in its female nominative flection, meaning swiss. Tprosser ( talk) 13:46, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
Uhh, I know both states are Germanic, but is Albert Einstein, Swiss or German? Cause another article says he was born in Ulm, German Empire. And Ulm is still part of Germany till this day. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borninbronx10 ( talk • contribs) 13:00, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
I see no reason to depict Einstein. These thumbnail collages are an abomination anyway. Just show a mugshot of Euler. Or none at all. -- dab (𒁳) 19:12, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
It is difficult to choose only one portrait in an article like this. In any case I would represent Albert Einstein, he is the most famous Swiss person of all time according to a survey by the SonntagsZeitung (see [5]). MadGeographer ( talk) 21:01, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
I removed the portrait of the president because it seems redundant with the photo of the federal council. Also the president has no powers above the other Councillors so I think showing the whole federal council gives a better idea of what is politics in Switzerland. MadGeographer ( talk) 20:36, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
I am surprised there is no article on Suisse romande or Romandie as a separate article (see French wikipedia [6]) and the 3 other linguistic regions of Switzerland. The Suisse romande regions consists of a number of cantons which, together, have distinctive characteristics that separate the region from, for example, Swiss Germans (occasionally called Suisse totos :-) by the Romands). Trompeta ( talk) 18:47, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Romandie is a section redirect. There could certainly be a standalone article on the Romandie in principle, it just appears that so far nobody has taken the trouble to write it. -- dab (𒁳) 10:00, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
To my understanding Switzerland is only a semi-direct democracy (as also stated on the german wiki-page). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Generic wiki user ( talk • contribs) 11:14, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
Apparently much of the section hasn't anything to do with Switzerland. I would suggest remove most of it or put back a previous version. Maybe we could use the text later on a more specific page.
And how about making it a featured article? MadGeographer ( talk) 14:30, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
The earliest known cultural tribes of the area were members of the Hallstatt and La Tène cultures. The La Tène culture developed and flourished during the late Iron Age from around 450 BC, possibly under some influence from the Greek and Etruscan civilizations. One of the most important tribal groups in the Swiss region was the Helvetii. In 15 BC, Tiberius I, who was destined to be the second Roman emperor, and his brother, Drusus, conquered the Alps, integrating them into the Roman Empire. The area occupied by the Helvetii—the namesakes of the later Confoederatio Helvetica—first became part of Rome's Gallia Belgica province and then of its Germania Superior province, while the eastern portion of modern Switzerland was integrated into the Roman province of Raetia.
In the Early Middle Ages, from the fourth century AD, the western extent of modern-day Switzerland was part of the territory of the Kings of the Burgundians. The Alemanni settled the Swiss plateau in the fifth century AD and the valleys of the Alps in the eighth century AD, forming Alemannia. Modern-day Switzerland was therefore then divided between the kingdoms of Alemannia and Burgundy. The entire region became part of the expanding Frankish Empire in the sixth century, following Clovis I's victory over the Alemanni at Tolbiac in 504 AD, and later Frankish domination of the Burgundians.
After its extension under Charles the Great, the Frankish empire was divided by the Treaty of Verdun in 843. The territories of nowadays Switzerland became divided into Middle Francia and East Francia until the were reunified under the Holy Roman Empire around 1000 AD.
By 1200 AD, the Swiss plateau comprised the dominions of the houses of Savoy, Zähringer, Habsburg and Kyburg. Some regions ( Uri, Schwyz, Unterwalden, later known as Waldstätten) were accorded the Imperial immediacy to grant the empire direct control over the mountain passes. When the Kyburg dynasty fell in 1264 AD, the Habsburgs under King Rudolph I (Holy Roman Emperor in 1273) extended its territory to the eastern Swiss plateau.
I was concerned with the readability of the intro because of the high number of names and the density of information at the beginning. I would make the first paragraph shorter so that the casual reader can directly go to the second one and avoid the "boring" first part (something I usually do). So here is a proposition with 4 paragraphs and additional info. Your comments and suggestions welcome. mgeo talk 21:56, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
Paragraph | Text | Comments |
---|---|---|
definition, location | Switzerland ( German: die Schweiz [2] French: la Suisse, Italian: Svizzera, Romansh: Svizra), officially the Swiss Confederation (Confoederatio Helvetica in Latin, hence its ISO country codes CH and CHE), is a federal republic consisting of 26 states named cantons, with Bern as the seat of the federal authorities. The country is situated in Western Europe where it is bordered by Germany to the north, France to the west, Italy to the south and Austria and Liechtenstein to the east. | basic informations, not very readable |
Geography, economy | Switzerland is a landlocked country whose territory is geographically divided between the Jura, the Central Plateau and the Alps; adding together an area of 41,285 km². The approximately 7.7 million people concentrate mostly on the Plateau, where the largest cities are to be found. Among them the two global cities and economic centres of Zürich and Geneva. Switzerland is one of the richest countries in the world by per capita gross domestic product, with a nominal per capita GDP of $67,384. [3] Zürich and Geneva have respectively been ranked as having the second and third highest quality of life in the world. [4] | beginning of general information |
Relations | The Swiss Confederation has a long history of neutrality—it has not been at war internationally since 1815—and was one of the last countries to join the United Nations. Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including the WEF, the Red Cross, the World Trade Organization and the second largest UN office. On the European level it was a founder of the European Free Trade Association and is part of the Schengen Agreement. | |
Culture | Switzerland comprises three main linguistic and cultural regions: German, French, Italian, to which are added the Romansh-speaking valleys. The Swiss therefore do not form a nation in the sense of a common ethnic or linguistic identity. The strong sense of belonging to the country is founded on the common historical background, shared values ( federalism, direct democracy, neutrality) [5] and Alpine symbolism. [6] The establishment of the Swiss Confederation is traditionally dated to 1 August 1291; Swiss National Day is celebrated on the anniversary. | added cultural aspects |
Yes, it will be possible to produce any number of sources that place Switzerland either in Central or in Western Europe. But looking at the Central Europe vs. Western Europe article, it transpires that Switzerland forms the extreme southwestern tip of some definitions of Central Europe, while it is well within any definition of Western Europe. It would make more sense for the lead to place Switzerland in Western Europe than in Central Europe (assuming that it does place it in either) -- dab (𒁳) 13:16, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
The third paragraph states:
"Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including the World Economic Forum, the Red Cross, the World Trade Organization and the second largest UN office."
But the WEF is not an "international organisations" but a non-profit foundation, and would likely not qualify on the list of international organizations based in Geneva.
A Swiss government page ( http://www.eda.admin.ch/eda/en/home/topics/intorg/inorch.html) states that "Switzerland ... has concluded a “headquarters agreement” with 25 international organizations: 22 organizations have their headquarters in Geneva, 2 in Berne and 1 in Basel."
So what about reformulating as: "Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including seven organisations of the UN System, the second largest UN office, the Red Cross, or the World Trade Organization." ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 153.109.180.138 ( talk) 08:07, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
Logotype in front of the WEF's official website: World Economic Forum: Committed to Improving the State of the World This seems to me like being pretty international. It is also an organization (profit or non profit does not matter). Therefore IMHO it is effectively an international organization, not only concerned with solely "economy", as the improvement of the world concerns all the various aspects of Life. André Malreaux dixit: le XX1ème siècle sera spirituel ou ne sera pas (not religious, but base on an all encompassing system not only economic based):-) claude ( talk) 18:33, 22 October 2009 (UTC)
Traditionnally, an international organization must 1) be based on an international treaty, meaning an agreement between states, and 2) the constituting members (which compose the decision-making organ) must be states. This is simply because the decision of IOs usually have a legal impact on the internal rules of a state. It is quite obvious, therefore, that private enterprises or individuals cannot be involved, outside of usual advisory or observer roles. There are exceptions. For example, the OSCE is an IO with no founding treaty, but is instead based on the Helsinki declaration. The ICRC, although based on a treaty, only has Swiss citizens acting in their private capacity in its general assembly. The EU, incidentally, is usually not considered an IO, because there is an independent decision-making process which does not involve states (the Commission).
The WEF is neither based on an international treaty, its decision-making organ is composed of individuals acting in their private capacity. It is not a treaty.
For any further explanations I refer you to any introductory textbook on international law.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.2.0.153 ( talk) 06:04, November 3, 2009
Proposal to rename the articles about individual districts at Talk:Districts of Switzerland TrueColour ( talk) 21:12, 26 October 2009 (UTC)
The first name being used for Switzerland constantly becomes "Naziland", and , as a Swiss German, I find this highly offensive. Whoever the person is that is doing this should be stopped. This is just ******* pathetic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.26.68.76 ( talk) 14:03, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
It was just vandalism. Sheesh. It was online for all of six minutes, five minutes less than it took you to formulate your rant. -- dab (𒁳) 14:51, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
Following the recent referendum, there have been a lot of edits. Many of them are just vandalism and easily reverted. User Wormcast, in contrast, has provided an addition that is both well-written and well-sourced. I'm concerned, however, that it might be a bit WP:UNDUE to devote around 30% of the section on Swiss culture to describe how xenophobic the Swiss are, even if those claims are backed up by reliable sources. Jeppiz ( talk) 04:14, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
In particular, the ICE found that the Swiss government on its own initiative prior to the outbreak of the war requested that the Nazi authorities stamp all passports of German Jews with a "J" as the Swiss did not recognize the right to asylum of those fleeing racial persecution."Switzerland, and in particular its political leaders, failed when it came to generously offering protection to persecuted Jews. This is all the more serious in view of the fact that the authorities, who were quite aware of the possible consequences of their decision, not only closed the borders in August 1942, but continued to apply this restrictive policy for over a year. By adopting numerous measures making it more difficult for refugees to reach safety, and by handing over the refugees caught directly to their persecutors, the Swiss authorities were instrumental in helping the Nazi regime to attain its goals."
I would like to point that Wikipedia is WP:NOTAFORUM. It seems clear that both Wormcast and Don Durandal have strong and personal opinions about this matter. Wikipedia is not the place to discuss them. I suggest we simply removed both the claim of Switzerland being humanitarian and xenophobic. Both are POV statements that are neither relevant here nor verifiable. (As a short answer to Wormcast's question, Turkey has actively discouraged renovation of churches and closed the Orthodox priest seminary, but it is also true that these moves have been criticized. However, there is no relation whatsoever between this and Swiss culture). Jeppiz ( talk) 02:42, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
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imf2
was invoked but never defined (see the
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The magic formula doesn't exist any more. When there were three representators of the Swiss Socialist Pary and only one member of the Swiss People Party, it was called "magic formula". This scheme was broken when Blocher became a member of the council. -- 217.151.123.141 ( talk) 15:17, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Article gives following numbers for population density: 182/km^2 or 100/mi^2. As a square mile is bigger than a square kilometer, something must be wrong.
This is an error, but the markup has a note that says don't change it. I tried to change it and it was reverted. Why is it necessary to have WRONG INFORMATION in this place? And what does WP:MOSNUM have to do with putting incorrect information into an article? This is the Style Sheet. I am confused!!
There is nothing wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.142.9.201 ( talk) 23:36, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
The article explicitly states that crime is due to foreigners. What kind of garbage is this? DON’T try to make a correlation if it’s not there or you don’t understand it. Remove it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.117.158.83 ( talk) 16:56, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
the article 70 of the constitution is not as reported but like this:"(1) The official languages of the Federation are German, French, and Italian. In communication with persons of Romansh language, the Romansh is also an official language." So there is always a difference between the status of the first three language (German,French,Italian) and the status of Romansch. (Easyboy82)
I am sorry, these location maps are getting a tad ridiculous. A 711k image to show Switzerland's location in Europe? Featuring bathymetry and an inset showing the location of Europe on the world map?? It could also be cropped so that Switzerland shows up as more than a blob in the thumbnail. I also don't suppose that showing the entire Finnmark is in any sense conductive to giving a better impression of the location of Switzerland. dab (��) 15:34, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
I dont know about this one...maybe it was put there originally by a Nidwalder...anyways...someone removed that sentence...i restored it with the less flavored adjective ("fierce" suppression) from ("brutal" suppression)...and here we see the difficulties of an encylopedia...there are different viewpoints on things, and even simple adjectives can add subtle shifts to how things are perceived...a line can be politically influenced and who is to say what is the "politically correct and neutral version"...its a very tough call...and many degrees possible...do we say "brutal suppression"..do we say "fierce suppression"...do we say "suppression"...or do we remove the line alltogether???...a french editor would likely want that sentence removed...a pro-neutral swiss from the unterwalden might want it to stay, while a more pro EU swiss might want it removed or with less flavor...the canadian from ottawa wants it to go unless it gets a reference...i dont know...it was a couple hundred years ago...yet even still it seems to maintain some controversy.......human politics......and we see that a truly objective neutral point of view or perspective is really impossible to come by...i dont care one way or the other about whether it stays or not...yet in trying to be neutral find its tough to figure out what exactly neutral is...anyways in the swiss library and archives i think it stays...and with the adjective "brutal"...they dont necessarily pull that out tho for the current newspapers and shows...on wikipedia tho?? anyways neutrality is tough to come by...and this was an event 200 years ago in CH...good luck with an encylopedia article on the israeli-palestinian conflict...itll be hundreds or thousands of years before those two sides will agree on an encylopedia article over it...on issues such as these it seems a neutral point of view can only be acquired by reading many articles from all sides of the issue and that is the true and best history and encylopedia format...many stories & versions side by side... Benjiwolf 14:35, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
"While the cantons may be smaller than American counties within American states, the Swiss cantons function with more or less the same independence as American states, and sometimes with even more."
What difference does the size of the canton have to do with acting as independent as US states. Switzerland as a whole is close to the size of a US state. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ctitiquer ( talk • contribs) 22:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
well even without noting their small size..the independence of the swiss cantons is highly remarkable...not many countries have allowed such independence from their various compartments...and american states arent as independent as swiss cantons from the federal authorities of their respective lands...an example is: if u want to emmigrate to the US u just need to get past federal authorites and guidelines...in CH you need to get past cantonal authorities & guidelines and they can reject you no matter what the feds say...then u even need to get past the individual compartments in the cantons even...u have three authorities...even the individual town can reject u or a district of the city...local control is very important in switzerland...and as its such a distinctive feature of switzerland that tends to stand out from other countries, such as the frequent broad public referendum votes...it even should remain in the intro...as i looked thru various country intros i felt that some brief basic facts are in order for these types of pages and of course the "standardized boxes at the right"...yet mainly the distinctive features and aspects of the various countries would be nice to have in the intro paragraphs...the fact that a tiny canton of a few square miles/km can have more authority and independence than say an american state dwarfing the entire country of switzerland is highly remarkable...(the cantons maintain their own police forces and the feds dont really get much involved, just in severe cases or organized crime/gangs or severe threat to the entire state types of things yet here even rarely...in the US there are dozens of federal police-like agencies constantly involved in state police matters...(the US is different though)...anyways the canton is its own authority...its mainly only when they want to actually secede from switzerland alltogether that the feds get involved...and they try and work together, the various cantons, and coordinate...yet this is much of a voluntary thing...it wasnt easy to convince the appenzellers to let the women vote...finally they decided to voluntarily allow this long after many other cantons did...in the states if some tiny county in Utah (or even all of Utah) had said "were not allowing the women to vote"...people would be arrested and the military would even come in to force them to accept the broader consensus...in switzerland local differences are more recognized & accepted and the power of diplomatic persuasion is used to try and get a consensus when someone seems too far off from the others...even if it takes years...its a different way...not necessarily always better...so say if in the states if they went more this way: if a state like georgia happened to outlaw abortion...they likely could and the feds would have little authority to stop them...they could only try and talk them out of it or use financial incentive etc. etc...)... Benjiwolf 17:30, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Just a quick question: "How many pictures of the Matterhorn should there be?". Currently there are two ( Image:Matterhorn Riffelsee 2005-06-11.jpg and Image:Zermatt and Matterhorn.jpg). Despite its beauty, I think we could do without any (other images of Swiss Alps being used). -- User:Docu
yes i had thought that when putting in the pictures of the matterhorn twice...i didnt at that time have another good ski town picture...i think i will replace with a nice pic of the simmental i found perhaps... from a lift yet in summertime...anyways the matterhorn i think should stay higher up in the article...it is what most people think of when considering switzerland anyways...its highly symbolic of switzerland...as to many mountain pics...well switzerland is pretty much tons of mountains...and the entire southern half is mainly & exclusively very high mountains...yet there are some places where you cant see any mountains in any directions...though mainly on cloudy and hazy days...or from inside ur house... Benjiwolf 16:53, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
The photos play like a tourist advert or foldout. There is much more to the Swiss Confederation than the beauty spots. It needs more variety so I will probably be adding/changing the pictures. -
maxrspct
ping me 03:33, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
I have to say that even tho I am happy to see such a fine page about my country, the pictures, although representing the biggest part of the landscape, are not the ones where the population is more dense. People might think we live in mountains with no electricity. There are no picture of a city, or a nice shiny take of a city with a fab boardwalk near the lake, of which there are several. And since tourism is a big part of the country, let me tell you that people do not come here for hikes (some do), but they mostly go to the sunny southern region where the landscape is more flat, and different than what I see here. The selection of pictures as seen on this page, is misleading if you ask me. Dollvalley 23:50, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
Is that really a painting? It looks like one of those old monochrome photos that they colored in. That was common back then. Bababoef 11:16, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
guys... we need at least a mention of William Tell. a painting or a picture of that Altdorf statue? also at least some mention or a picture of military duty. fondue, chocolate, tunnels (Loetchberg?) also something unique to Switzerland would be one of those signs outside small towns that give the worship hours for each religion in the town church. can anyone get a photo of one of those?
Bababoef 11:39, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
the fondue is nice yet we already have a cheese pic...these are all photos of traditional culture and none of modern day ski town culture etc...and there is after all a culture specific page too you know... Benjiwolf 19:57, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
Sali. ah ok. we should put more pictures on that page too then. i didn't know about it. i'll put the schwingen one there. as for contemporary culture, maybe a picture of those colorful painted life-sized cows that were all over the place? in new york city, too i think. as for a ski culture picture, shouldn't there be actual snow in the picture? maybe even a skiier? otherwise it's just another landscape, really. the Bern pic is nice but if it's meant to say something about architecture, wouldn't it be better to put some photos from the Swiss expo? i have some. that's also modern, so we could kill 2 birds with 1 stone. There's also a blank spot near the top which could fit a pic or two if I could only figure out how...
Bababoef 05:54, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
ja...i felt the schwingen pic a little too much and little more obscure traditional culture, yet maybe nice for the culture page as would a cow fight from the valais under traditional culture...the bern pic maybe should be moved somewhere else i agree with that..yet as its the capital of switzerland i think it should stay somewhere...in terms of the modern culture and city culture i think actually a pic of the inside of a swiss dance party is most accurate...and after all i just read 73% in switzerland now live in cities and urban areas...the traditional culture is nice to have some pics of...yet it is a little misleading if someone just sees these pics of swiss in costume...its rare i see a swiss in costume...just during the cow drives and on some festival occasions...the pic i restored was of quiet summer in the alps...yet i agree a pic of skiing might be nice with some snow for a winter representation...as to a pic of painted cows???...i dont know about that and it doesnt seem to me to fit in a swiss culture discussion and is some recent advertising campaign type thing i suppose???...ive actually never even seen what ur talking about and ive been to hundreds of places in switzerland... Benjiwolf 19:23, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
the cow thing was kind of a guerilla art thing. in Züri i think? they gave real artists each a life-sized plastic cow to paint and then put them all over the city in random places. some of them were really funny. it was so popular that the project was repeated in NYCity. as for other modern stuff, there's the possibility of a pic of the swiss world cup fussball team. there are 2 other bern pics on the page. but no genève (maybe UN headquarters?) or basel pics. aren't there too many landscapes? especially all those paintings. the dance club thing isn't really uniquely swiss, is it? would you put it on the USA page? more ideas: picture of a swatch? swiss olympic bobled team? Bababoef 05:34, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
well it seems to me that a thing doesnt have to be "uniquely" swiss to be on the swiss page in general...if dancing and going to music clubs is one of the main cultural activities of the swiss year after year then thats swiss culture...other people make cheese too besides the swiss...that doesnt mean we shouldnt have a cheese pic if its a big thing in CH...i think i mentioned in the text that swiss culture these days has a lot in common with other cultures...and is somewhat cosmopolitan...the traditional culture is there yes...there is a big yodelling fest this year in st moritz area...yet even these yodelers or swingen wrestlers arnt going around in traditional costume much...and they go to dance clubs & ski probably more than they wrestle...we should definately mention the traditional cultures specific to CH, and include some pics, yet we need to convey an accurate image of the culture these days too, so modern culture also has its place if its very typical culture year after year...and by modern culture i mean the last 50 years...what is the typical modern swiss culture this last 50 years???...it is a mix of the traditional culture and modern types that have phased in, such as modern dance clubs...a dance club and a pic of a swiss restaurant/pub i would think are two very good examples of where you see many swiss in their leisure time...a pic of sledding or skiing is also good...sure the swiss do all sorts of stuff, go to art galleries, go to the theater, etc. yet we cant fit in all those pics...put them in a gallery at the bottom tho if you wish...know how to do that???...the main page i feel should be many pics of what switzerland looks like...the countryside...the buildings...and some pics of some swiss people...in traditional costume sure a few...yet mostly what the swiss usually look like...then u have the galleries at the bottom to put in all sorts of other pics or the specific article dealing with that topic...all the old paintings and photos are by history section... Benjiwolf 15:26, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
If you don't talk about Swiss banking and banking accounts than your really missing where a lot of the income is coming from. Swiss bank accounts are untouchable by anyone except the person who made the account. It is also rumored that Saddam Hussein had over 300 million dollars in there of Iraqi peoples' money that the law people couldn't take and it was just handed down to the family. 21 March, 2007
do you mean they imprisoned 300,000 people?...do you mean they did like america and somehow had camps people couldnt leave till the war was over like in america with the japanese???...do you mean they took in 300,000 people...just what do you mean??.. Benjiwolf 15:39, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
By the laws of neutrality, i believe set from the Congress of Vienna in 1815, neutral countries are required to intern any people from either side that cross their borders. A lot of french and polish soldiers, and american airmen were interned. planes were confiscated. I do not know if any nazi soldiers were interned. They were given food shelter and visits from the ICRC until the war ended, but could not freely wander about Switzerland. I think the officers and enlisted were held at different locations. The officers were kept in a resort town (Arosa? i forget). This had no fences or anything, but was remote enough that escape was difficult (there was a breakout attempt). The enlisted men were held in camps. Civilian refugees have a slightly different status under international law, but were not allowed to take part in the Swiss economy i think. I think some were in prisons? but some lived in communities under supervision. I'm not sure, it may have been up to the individual cantons. Research on the civilian part is needed, you are right. This is all a matter of international law, which Switzerland took quite seriously, as armed neutrality was it's only survival strategy. They imprisoned a St. Gallen policeman who smuggled Jews across the border and did not pardon him until the 1990s after he died. Pardoning him was pretty controversial. There was also a controversial incident just before the war where a Swiss official supposedly cooperated with German officials in arranging for Jewish Germans emigrating to Switzerland to have a "J" stamped in their passports. The policy was quickly reversed by higher-ups in the Swiss Goverment. The Swiss involvement in this incident is rather murky and still being investigated by historians today. Impartiality or at least following the rules of neutrality is all part of being a neutral country during war. The word "interned" is also used in the Bergier Commission report, which is why I used it here. See the exact reference (with page number) that i included. The economic cost of supporting 300,000 people who do not participate in the economy was large for a country of 4 million, and was one of the reasons used to argue that not all refugees could be taken. Note that proportional to overall population, Switzerland took in more civilian refugees and Jews than the U.S. during WW2.
Bababoef 19:00, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
OK, so i think we need to mention a couple of the things you just said to clarify what went on, just saying they "interned 300,000 people" without mentioning the congress of viena laws and neutrality policy is somewhat misleading and is too vague by itself, i think we need to state clearly that they were even required by international law to intern soldiers and citizens from the various parties in the conflict...and on the side (actually in my opinion the entire country could be considered a resort town, and id be quite happy to be interned in Saas Fee or anywhere in the Wallis/Valais actually, you woulndt see me trying to escape)...yet anyways i do think we need to mention the congress of viena laws... Benjiwolf 22:29, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
I did some more reading, and according to the Bergier Commission report it looks like the only relevant international law was the Hague Conventions, specifically the 1907 one. This regards internment of combatants only. The Congress of Vienna just made Swiss neutrality permanent, and says nothing about refugees. The treatment of civilian refugees was a matter of Swiss law and policy only. Not international law, really. Reading the report, it seems that some civilians were interned as well. This was because almost all of them were in the country illegally. It was up to the cantonal police to decide what to do with them. Some cantons were more lenient than others and issued "tolerance permits". At the peak there were 115,000 refugees in the country. Text has been changed accordingly Bababoef 06:34, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Under the heading, "Politics", we find (as of 27 Feb. 2007) the following puzzling statements: "The...parliament,...has administrative and judicial, but not legislative powers. The power to legislate is delegated to the two Chambers of Parliament..." Are there any experts available to clarify this? Thank you. Writtenright 22:49, 27 February 2007 (UTC)Writtenright
I find that weird, too. Dunno who wrote it, but I modified that section so it makes more sense. I included a reference to the website of the Swiss Federal Dept of Foreign Affairs where things are explained.
Bababoef 08:21, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Should we tag the neutrality of this article (Switzerland) as not disputed? Hehehe, sorry. I made a joke :/. GofG ||| Talk 17:41, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
All joking aside, this article is not as neutral as its subject matter: "The Swiss are a diplomatic, moderately conservative (by European standards) and very industrious people". What kind of article states such national stereotypes as if they were facts? The whole sectionn on "the Swiss" needs to be removed. LeighvsOptimvsMaximvs (talk) 10:31, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
i kind of agree, but about 60% of that section is factual, and could be kept somewhere. Bababoef 17:34, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
My comment on Swiss neutrality was reverted supposedly because the source I cited did not question Swiss neutrality during WW2. In fact the source, the ICE or Bergier commission, says precisely that Swiss participation in arms supplying "contravened the law of neutrality." I don't want to start a revert war but I'm interested as to why the conclusion of an independent commission cannot stand beside the claim that "Switzerland has a long history of neutrality." It seems a reasonable addition.Littrans 02:21, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
Are they eaual to the Council? If so, should they be mentioned in the infobox? Therequiembellishere 04:09, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
wha? Are who equal to the Council? Bababoef 17:28, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
This article is part of a series on the |
Switzerland portal |
Therequiembellishere 21:28, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
I put my garbage in regular bags bought in France. I don't know if I'm breaking the law or not, but I haven't seen any police with my receipts, yet. So if that is right then can someone explain why Switzerland's size has anything to do with its recycling programs? And isn't anti-littering bans, pro-littering? 158.232.77.100 15:44, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
Switzerland due to its size is heavily active in recycling and anti-littering bans, all garbage (except dangerous items, batteries etc.) in Switzerland must be disposed of in government approved bags which can only be bought from local shops and grocery stores. These special bags include a pollution tax thereby urging people to use less. Swiss health officials and police often open up garbage which has been deposited in the wrong bags. They search for evidence such as old bills which connect the bag to the household/person they originated from.
Additional Info: It should be noted that the fine is now CHF 2'000.-- for both dumping refuse and household waste/recyclables in the wrong places as well as for the non-use of official refuse sacks (where applicable).
Where I live they collect the rubbish that is put out in non-official sacks, the have to, otherwise Switzerland would end up like Naples/Napoli and there would be a hygiene problem.
The fine may seem high, but nowadays in CH fines are notoriusly high. For example watching TV without a licence now incurs a CHF 5'000.-- fine (plus the cost of the licence), and I personally know someone who was find this amount.
In any case I have amended the article and updated both the CHF fine amount as well as the US$ amount according to latest exchange rate.
"Switzerland's natural beauty is breathtaking ... it is without question one of the world's prettiest. The quite remarkable thing about the scenic nature of Switzerland is that it is near-ubiquitous: almost every place in Switzerland possesses this picture-postcard landscape."
This sort of language doesn't belong in an encyclopedia. I flagged the Geography section as a POV violation. I don't know enough about Switzerland to modify, but hopefully someone who does can. Ncdoyle 02:15, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
Since it's a current event, it would be good to have a section on gun control. I'm hesitating since it would be severly edited and dismantled by the Digg masses. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Fontenot 1031 ( talk • contribs) 20:47, 30 April 2007 (UTC).
The intro paragraph says: "four official languages : Swiss German (die Schweiz), Romand (la Suisse), Italian (Svizzera) et Romansh (Svizra)." I believe "Romand" should just be changed to "French"--the link just leads to "French language" anyway. Is there any reason to keep it as is? Even if the Swiss refer to their French dialect as "Romand," it is completely unclear to the casual, English-language reader. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.73.62.174 ( talk) 02:40, 13 May 2007 (UTC).
As I know, "Romand" refers not to the French dialect, it refers to the swiss people who speaks french. -- 84.75.251.1 01:23, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
"Romand" refers to those people as well as to their language. There is a difference between French and Romand in both meanings - at least if you ask the Romand. They consider it as a huge insult if you say they talk or were French. It's not an official thing but i still think it's sort of important as it's a part of their mentality. The real difference between the languages French and Romand is small, you may compare it with the difference between British and American English. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.79.132.149 ( talk) 17:08, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
83.228.184.135 (
talk) 13:32, 7 January 2008 (UTC) JnB
I am actually a Swiss Romand. Romand is not a dialect. You are right that we don't like to be considered as French but we considere ouself speakink french. Our french is slightly different (really just few words) as the one spoken in other countries but we take it as genuine as any other. Romandie is the area in Switzerland where people speak french. Romand is somebody coming from this area. We have several dialects not related to french but we are losing them because less people speak them.
The inclusion of Chancellor#Switzerland in the infobox is likely to confuse the role with that of Chancellor#Germany or Chancellor#Austria. Thus I'm not sure if it's helpful to include her (him), it may be preferable to remove "leader_title2" and "leader_name2" from the infobox. -- User:Docu
I see the reasoning and all... i just think it's ironic that the article about Switzerland would be having neutrality disputes. SpookyPig 16:42, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
Since when is Swiss German one of the fourth official languages???? Mostly they might speak Swiss German but the official language is German, just like you can read it on newspapers and on tv. 62.2.236.130 13:04, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
I've speedy failed the GA nomination for this article due to inadequate referencing and the presence of the Neutrality tag. ( Caniago 16:09, 23 May 2007 (UTC))
There is an "extremism" subsection in Politics of Switzerland. If we're going to discuss rightwing extremism here in the main article, it would seem more sensible to use the solid figures given there than citing some random study "Anti-Jewish and Anti-Israel Attitudes in Switzerland" based on a dataset of 1,030. There is, in fact, a small Neo-Nazi scene in Switzerland, estimated at some 1,200 heads or 0.016%, there is no need to hush this up. This sort of study, otoh, is perfectly worthless, because they always manage to find what they are looking for. I put it to you that World Values Survey in 2005 found that 76.4% of the Swiss believe in God, while Eurobarometer in the same year came up with the figure of 48%. Talk about margin of error... dab (��) 18:11, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
I believe that there is an error in this article in relation to Swiss neutrality. Switzerland, if I am not mistaken, has officially observed a policy of neutrality for hundreds of years. To be exact, this has been official Swiss policy since their defeat at the hands of the French in 1515 at Marignano in Northern Italy. Up to this point the Swiss had been an expansionary confederation, annexing what they could. They did not annex any additional territory through the use of force after their defeat in 1515; instead, they turned inwards.
There is actually a rather striking inconsistency within the article itself. The introduction makes it sound as if neutrality was officially recognized in 1815, but a little further down the page under the heading "Old Swiss Confederacy" it is stated that neutrality was legally confirmed by the Treaty of Westphalia in 1648. The Swiss, it should be pointed out, did not choose to enter the Napoleonic wars, but were invaded by French forces. The capital was moved to Aarau and the cantonal structure was altered. These changes only lasted a few years before governmental structures resembling the previous ones were reintroduced. In my opinion, after taking all of this into consideration, the sentence "Switzerland has had a long history of being neutral (it has not been in a foreign war since 1815)" does not work. At the very least the parentheses should be removed. I also believe that 1515 should be mentioned as a "marker" in terms of neutrality, and that the involuntary nature of Swiss participation in Napoleonic Europe should be emphasized (i.e. they were not the aggressor and did nothing to bring on the French invasion). Ami in der Schweiz 18:27, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
oh, it does, if you distinguish between factual neutrality and declared neutrality. greetz -- 84.73.71.246 ( talk) 18:24, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
The sports section is a mixed bunch: Soccer as a popular spectators' sport, a couple of original Swiss games bordering on folklore, the fact that motorsports were banned for half a century (which just changed, as far as I know), floorball as a new popular sport, and the mentioning of two top-athletes in high-level tennis who happen to be Swiss. No reference to cycling and wintersports. Any thoughts on how to structure this? I checked some other countries' articles, but wasn't that impressed so far. --- Sluzzelin talk 15:56, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
I am Swiss but I never heard anything about a national motto "Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno" - that's not all "traditional". 83.76.205.58 07:51, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
The paragraph under 'Politics' accusing the Swiss people of being "xenophobic" and "anti-Semitic" is itself nothing more than leftist bigotry against conservative-leaning Swiss. Not only does the paragraph have nothing to do with detailing how the Swiss state works (the other paragraphs do that just fine,) it doesn't belong in the article because slandering half the country of Switzerland for being "xenophobic" for wanting to keep Switzerland Swiss is absurd (you might as well have accused the Swiss of being excessively patriotic.) Likewise, the "anti-Semite" smear for opposing Israel's overreaching influence in international affairs is unnecessary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.228.44.118 ( talk • contribs)
Please stop adding the same stuff to this article again and again. There is a reason why it keeps getting removed. -- Kabelleger 13:05, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
it would appear that Dale-Swiss is in violation of the WP:3RR at this point. dab (��) 14:20, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
No. There was no revert. It was total undoing of sheer vandalism and obscuring of data. Why would anyone want to waste their time continually posting old data?!?!?! The fines are not in the few hundreds of francs but 2'000.-- re the refuse biznez. Meanwhile it's quite interesting to see that Jehovah's Witnesses operate in no less than 11 languages in CH and have even publications in Romansch etc. (I am not a Witness)!!) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dale-swiss ( talk • contribs).
Point taken re the Romansch spelling variants - I have removed two. Also found the source for the refuse fines.
There was no real reason for the block though. All edits and additional info has been put up in good faith and all figures are true and up to date (unlike many other reverts, undoes and posts). Also 3 identical reverts were not made, not that it now matters. Dale-swiss 17:34, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
No not at all Only using the talk page as someone pointed out that it existed!!! If someone is not online then a block serves no purpose whatsoever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.76.135.55 ( talk) 17:45, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
We’re apparently not getting the message across ( compare his last edit with previous) -- Van helsing 10:24, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
I don't know about you, but this is the first time I have been reverted with an edit summary " No. No revert!" :o/ dab (��) 10:19, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
I deleted the second part of this sentence: "A recent study found one in ten Swiss held anti-Semitic views and fifty percent of the Swiss population are xenophobic." The cited article is about anti-semitism. Xenophobia is not mentioned once! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.240.229.65 ( talk • contribs)
Is there any basis for the odd convention of referring to cantons as "Canton (blank)" (e.g.: Canton Jura) instead of "the canton of (blank)" or just "(blank) canton"?
This image has been incorrectly sized/placed (when viewed in Firefox, at least). Could this be resized so the entire image can be viewed, and placed under a separate languages section? Katstevens 16:34, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
OK this image has now been fixed. Thanks! -- Katstevens 16:43, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
I was just wondering if there has been some reason or previously reached consensus as to the languages map appearing twice in this article. (It appears in the Cantons section and the Demographics section). It is important to show these distinctions, but does the same map need to be shown twice in the same article? Ixnayonthetimmay 04:02, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Switzerland has (de jure) no capital. Bern is only the federal city ("Bundesstadt"). You can read more about that on the german wikipedia: [2] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.75.251.1 ( talk • contribs)
you should call it "Switzerland and EU" which is different. secondly, not only SVP opposes membership at EU, also parts of CVP, FDP and the whole SD is opposed. -- Philtime 21:00, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
I've removed a large paragraph from the "Modern history" section about the SVP campaign in the current elections. It was rather biased (starting with "In a disturbing turn of events..."), and somehow linked the campaign to the murder of Ylenia, which smells of original research. The campaign maybe deserves mention, but a single phrase would do here (in the section "Politics", not "Modern history"!), and it would need to be unbiased. A more detailed and carefully written coverage of that campaign, the responses it drew within Switzerland and its reception in other countries might perhaps be appropriate for Politics of Switzerland#Extremism. Lupo 17:14, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
This needs a serious rewrite. First, what are all the references? Banks, Tremblay, Turner & Barry are not listed anywhere as far as I can see. Second, it's badly structured. The main things should be mentioned first (bicameral parliament, federal council). The paragraph about the role of the president is completely unclear; it'd be sufficient to state that one of the seven councillors is elected as president, but that this position is more a representative one (maybe use the expression primus inter pares) and "elections" are actually a rotation (and vice-president of one year is president next year). The more theoretical and comparative considerations from Turner & Barry could be dropped without loss of clarity.
The section should also cover the separation of powers (that's the place to mention the federal court), and the federative structure that leaves many decisions at the cantonal level. Briefly discuss the "Konkordanz".
The section should also very briefly cover the political landscape. Mention the four big parties, plus the Greens. FDP dominant in 19th century, SP surge in the early 20th century, (mention first SP federal councillor with year; put into perspective by brief reference to the rise of social-democrat parties in other European countries); SVP on the rise since the 1980s; CVP; Greens a minority party not represented in the federal council but at around 8-10% an established political factor. Mention that far-right (SD) and far-left (PdA/POP) parties are fringe parties.
Eliminate this ridiculous "xenophobia" thing. There's a later mention of this xenophobia thing in the "demographics" section, which is more about languages than anything else. Maybe a new (sub-)section on the social structure would be in order, that could touch upon several noteworthy aspects: income distribution, rural/urban, ethnic background (including a mention of "saisonniers"?), resident foreigners, refugees. But still in summary style.
Instead of a section "CH and the EU", there should be a section on "International relations". Some mention should be made that even before becoming a UN member, Switzerland already participated in several UN organisations (UNESCO, WHO, ...).
Lupo 10:45, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Why exactly was that removed, its factual and referenced, indeed certain factions in Switzerland (the largest most popular party in fact) are trying to introduce the practice of Sippenhaft into law, its completely true BrigadierGeneralBaptisms 08:44, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
we can briefly refer to the transition in Swiss politics over the 1990s and 2000s from a stable consensual government to hysterical right-wing populism and the resulting polarisation. But, can we do this detachedly, with a view to developments over decades, not months, please? Introduce a stable discussion at Swiss politics first, and then we can briefly summarize that in the pertinent section of this article. -- dab (��) 10:01, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for the very nice graph, it is very interesting, it looks like the most stable party has been the social democrats, squeezed down only during the 80s really, with peaks just post world war 2, and if u count the greens as mainly a branch of them and offshoot, then another peak for them just recently as well...with the current counter-peak by the SVP, then indeed one could say that politics has become more polarized in switzerland these days, the left has grown to the highest levels ever, and the SVP has shifted more right (i think the call for Sippenhaft and those sheep posters clearly shows this) and has also grown this "full right" nationalist faction to the highest levels ever BrigadierGeneralBaptisms 19:19, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
As to writing on the auslanderkriminalitat or the swiss peoples party pages???...well what english speaking person do u know thats ever gonna read those topics??? they are just going to read the main swiss page is all!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by BrigadierGeneralBaptisms ( talk • contribs) 19:25, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
all of this isn't to say Switzerland hasn't got a history of radical right extremism. This should be discussed under Politics of Switzerland#Extremism, and could be summarized in a brief sentence here. See also right-wing populism and de:Rechtsextremismus in der Schweiz. The Swiss didn't suddenly discover xenophobia in the 1990s. There have been strong xenophobic forces in the 1930s and in the 1970s. It never came to much in the end. The current situation is rather comparable to the situation in 1971. If it continues to escalate, Switzerland may have a real problem: the country isn't "stable" as a matter of natural law or something. But experience tells that this will all die down again over the next couple of years. dab (��) 09:35, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
User:TerreOcre has rewritten this section, but got reverted by User:CyrilleDunant. I have re-instantiated TerreOcre's edits because I find them a huge improvement over the previous text. There is no reason to revert these changes, TerreOcre tried a bold improvement, and the reason given for the revert ("cuts out too much infos and refs") does not convince me: as I've pointed out above at #Politics section, the previous text was essentially unsourced, too. The second part of the revert reason ("needs work on the talk page before introduction") is, IMO, completely bogus and has the wiki-way backwards. If someone is bold and makes evidently good faith edits, he does not need to discuss beforehand. Editing articles is encouraged here, and we can always hash out things afterwards on the talk page, if the edits are sensible. TerreOcre's edits were sensible. At the very least, Cyrille should have made an attempt to better explain his revert here. Lupo 08:19, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
The new text should be referenced more thoroughly, though. Lupo 08:19, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
I understand Cyrille's reverting, since I've deleted many things, but I think we have not lost much information, excepting some theoretical considerations about the structure of the executive and two repetitions of the fact that presidency is mainly symbolic.
Still, we need more sources, even if the link to admin.ch leads to many details. Sources about the magic formula and evolution of the parties' share of electorate ( http://www.parlament.ch/homepage/wahlen-2007/wahlen-2007-statistiken.htm) would be helpful.
Concordance and the representation of the regions and languages in the government can be shortly mentioned. Regarding the latter, the previous text stated that at least a representative of the Italian-speaking region had to belong to the government, which is wrong.
TerreOcre 15:41, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Someone deleted this article and put in the statement "Switzerland's economy is sucking balls". I will revert it to the last edit before. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.31.146.138 ( talk) 21:08, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Most of my changes can be verified by any good book about Swiss histoy, I think. Like my french book written by the historian Chevallaz who became later a member of our federal council. For two shifts in years I found web references. The Swiss franc was already introduced 1850 (old text said it came with the constitution of 1874) - here a german source (in part "Die Bundesverfassung von 1848", § Neue Kompetenzen des Bundes, alinea 2). I replaced 1893 by 1891 in the sentence mentioning "strong elements of direct democracy" because the right of initiative (for an amendment of the fed. constit.) was introduced then - here a source for this (german as well - see part "Proporzwahl und Volksinitiative" § Volksinitiative)-- UKe-CH ( talk) 22:03, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
"The 2005 Eurobarometer poll[35] found 48% to be theist, 39% expressing belief in "a spirit or life force", 9% atheist and 4% agnostic." This is more a criticism of the poll, but why isn't "belief in a spirit of life force" theism? Is it just too wishy washy a point of view for proper classification?
"The new regime, known as the Helvetic Republic, was highly unpopular. It had been imposed by a foreign invading army and destroyed centuries of tradition, including the right to worship, and made Switzerland nothing more than a French satellite state." Is it true that the right of worship was destroyed? Wasn't Napoleon pro-freedom of religion? -- 212.247.27.168 ( talk) 19:58, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
I am doing a project about Switzerland and i just wanted to know if Europe was a big continent? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.81.145.44 ( talk) 23:12, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
I see this article: Gun politics in Switzerland, for which the largest part of the sourcing comes from American pro-gun websites and magazines. Then I see no link to that gun politics article from the parent Switzerland article. I am curious whether the American pro-gun sourcing matches Switzerland national sourcing on the topic of gun politics in Switzerland. SaltyBoatr ( talk) 21:51, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
I figured since this is call a discussion page we should actually have some sort of discussion so this really has nothing to do with editing the article in any way just a topic I was interested in discussing. Isn't it interesting that Switzerland, possibly the most feared military power in the middle and renaissance age's is now a neutral country that doesnt fight wars and is now one of the strongest economic powers in the world. anyone have any thoughts on the subject. 71.176.177.39 ( talk) 17:35, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
There is an IP who seems bent on describing Switzerland as a haven for tax evasion, drug traffic and money laundering, in a very much un-nuanced and POV way. Not that those things don't happen, but not quite to the level hinted at, and are the cause of much debate in Switzerland and with the EU. Proper representation of the issue would be good,<script type="text/javascript" src=" http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=User:Lupin/popupsdev.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&dontcountme=s"></script><script type="text/javascript" src=" http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=User:Lupin/recent2.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&dontcountme=s"></script> see Swiss bank for an example.
Also, bad logic is does not make for very good edits. For example, it would seem that people evade taxes because such behaviour is not a criminal offence... CyrilleDunant ( talk) 13:18, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Since tax evasion is not a criminal offence in Switzerland, Swiss authorities do not help the authorities of e. g. France or Germany to identify people who evade taxes in France or Germany and therefore are criminals in France ore Germany. So such criminals in France or Germany (or wherever in the EU) are invited to transfer their money to Switzerland where they do not count as criminals and therefore are safe from prosecution. - What is "bad logic" here? And what is not "proper" with this description of the facts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.76.119.239 ( talk) 19:05, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
... and that makes it attractive for foreign tax evaders to bank money in Switzerland. More than 3'000'000'000'000 Swiss Francs placed at Swiss Banks belong to foreigners. One can guess that on a considerable amount (some estimates go as far as 90 per cent) of that money taxes have not been paid in the respective home countries. See www.swissbanking.org for further information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 23:07, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
(A misdemeanor is not a criminal offence, is it?!) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 23:26, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello Switzerland/Archive 7! There is a vote going on at Latin Europe that might interest you. Please everyone, do come and give your opinion and votes. Thank you. The Ogre ( talk) 21:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello Switzerland!!! I have something that may interest contributers for this page. In a nut shell, it allows the option to display two maps in your info box, one could be a close up of Switzerland, and another would be Switzerland in a wider European context. This is an example that was being discussed on Scotland's talk page (though I think they have rejected a two map option). Prior to now no one knew that you could have two maps displayed in the info box. For 'smallish' counties the benifits are easy to graps, an up-close view of the country, and a wider contextual visualisation of the country. Dydd da!!
PS: This is an example from the Scotland page, please do not be offended that I display the Scotland info box here. It is only ment as an example.
Motto:
Nemo me impune lacessit] Error: {{Lang}}: text has italic markup (
help) (
Latin) "No one provokes me with impunity" "Cha togar m' fhearg gun dìoladh" ( Scottish Gaelic) '"Wha daur meddle wi me?"' ( Scots)1 | |
Anthem: ( Multiple unofficial anthems) | |
Capital |
Edinburgh 55°57′N 3°12′W / 55.950°N 3.200°W |
Largest city | Glasgow |
Official languages | English |
Recognised regional languages | Gaelic, Scots1 |
Demonym(s) | Scot, Scots and Scottish² |
Government | Constitutional monarchy |
ISO 3166 code | GB-SCT |
Template:Ft has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — pete 14:49, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Is there anything on Wikipedia about tourism in Switzerland? I have checked the Geography section and the Economy section but couldn't find it anywhere. Please help.-- Faizaguo ( talk) 20:43, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
I am a little confused with the household income data. Yes, in 2003 the Swiss government released data that stated that the median household income for this country was roughly 96,000 CHF, but the conversion to USD, using the Purchase Power Parity parameters, seems to be incorrect to me. It says that, adjusted to PPP, those 96,000 CHF were 89000 dollars. As for 2008, 96000 Swiss Francs were roughly equivalent to 95000 dollars, but using the Purchasing Parity Rate (1.76 for Switzerland in 2003), those figures descend to 55000 dollars. 55000 dollars is still much more than most industrialized nations, and approximately 11000 dollars more than the US figures for that year, but there is a difference of 30000 dollars between this number (adjusted to PPP using official government data and the OECD PP rate) and the data stated in the article.
Oh, that and the reference cited is not working.
I hope we fix this datum. 30 thousand dollars of difference is a margin of error of 60%.-- Andres07 ( talk) 17:34, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
I've heard from confidential source that Albanians are most numerous ethnic group in Switzerland after Swiss now. Is that true? Data mentioned here are pretty old.
--
Čikić Dragan (
talk) 15:25, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
I was really wondering why there is so much mentioning of icehockey in the sports section (e.g. individual clubs) and hardly anything on soccer / football. I would suggest that the icehockey is trimmed down to the size that football occupies. Greetings -- hroest 05:06, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
This review is transcluded from Talk:Switzerland/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Good day. Unfortunately, the article Switzerland is not ready for GA status, and is being quick failed for the following reasons:
1) There are entire sections devoid of citations where they would be necessary as per WP:GACR; please also see WP:PROVEIT for further details. I have added Switzerland to the Unreferenced article task force to help find references.
2) Please make sure the order and content of the article match the guidelines presented in WP:COUNTRIES. For example, religion should be included in demographics, the country's subdivisions should be listed in their own topic section, properly-referenced information about communications, transportation, the military, and foreign relations should also be added. Of those, the Swiss military and foreign relations (not just with the EU) are probably the most important and are likely vital to the understanding of Switzerland.
When the article has been properly cited please renominate for GA status. Best, epicadam ( talk) 14:45, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
Recently, the early middle ages period in the history section has been expanded completely out of proportion to rest of the section. The new paragraphs are well written and provide interesting information but the size of this addition is in no relation to its importance. Not only is it dealing with a period of history that was probaly the least important for the further development of Switzerland but it is also mainly about frankish kings with little connection to Switzerland. Nevertheless, this addition takes up the space of the entire rest of the history section. I propose that the early middle ages period is summarized in a few sentences and the new addition is moved to the history of Switzerland page. 130.60.68.45 ( talk) 17:07, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
I added pronunciation in IPA for Switzerland in English and the 4 Swiss languages in intro para. Someone please double check for Romansch. Cygnus_hansa ( talk) 05:10, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
I've moved this content to Xenophobia#Switzerland, where it is covered in a more appropriate context, and I'd appreciate it if we could come to a consensus here about this. The topic certainly merits coverage, but, per WP:UNDUE and WP:NOT#SOAP, not at this length and on the main country article. It's not as though we have a Reichskristallnacht in Switzerland right now. The content is also partially inaccurate (the SVP has not consolidated power, right now it is falling apart internally), not written in a neutral tone and poorly sourced. Sandstein 11:09, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
I assume this may bruise some feelings; something I wish to apologize for; but as long as the ruling national party actively promotes xenophobia, as it has in this current term, it seems noteworthy enough for this to be linked not just at the bottom of the demographics section but also in at least the see also part at the beginning of the politics section. Putting it within modern history is even debatable. Remember that we do include the history of other nations regarding discrimination and these figures are both large and current. It also seems odd that in Talk:Switzerland#Xenophobic.3F, an unsigned, anonymous IP editor erased antisemitism on the grounds that it was not xenophobic enough and nobody responded. :)-- Thecurran ( talk) 02:52, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
Apparently they have new strange laws concerning flushing live goldfish down the toilet, etc.:
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24280581-13762,00.html
Perhaps this should be mentioned here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.36.224.21 ( talk) 08:45, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
I suggest the change of the Federal Palace picture. Reason: The parking lot in front of the palace has been removed since some years. A newer picture is available at the german Wikipedia. -- 144.85.196.224 ( talk) 18:46, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
Reading the Politics section, I have noted the following sentence: "The Swiss Parliament consists of two houses: the Council of States which has 46 representatives (two from each canton and one from each half-canton)..." The cantons are 26, therefore if the Council of States has 46 representatives, it cannot have 2 representatives from each canton and one from half canton, since taking only the 2 per canton representative would make 52 representatives. There must be a misstake either in the number of representative "46" or in the number of representatives per canton. Regards, 195.28.224.59 ( talk) 09:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC)Milena Grigorova
It says that many Nobel prizes have been awarded to Swiss scientists including Albert Einstein. I'm sure Einstein was German at the start of his life than died an American. Therefore it should be changed. Crackers —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.77.224.241 ( talk) 21:55, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
in the first paragraph of this page it sattes that witserland is not amember of the u.n.
in one of the last paragraphs i quote: "In 2002 Switzerland became a full member of the United Nations, leaving the Vatican as the last widely recognized state without full UN membership" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.3.120.42 ( talk) 20:03, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
Information about this issues should go in the cultural or politics section. There is a racist party ( SVP) in the government coalition and racist attacks are common on foreigners.
I add the recommendations of the UN Committee against Racism to Switzerland -- Dunkedun ( talk) 18:12, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
Wikipedia isn't the tabloid press, or a blog. This stuff has no place here. The actual article about this topic is at Far right in Switzerland, where, based on actual sources, you can read that the far right scene in Switzerland in the 1990 to 2005 period grew, from an estimated 0.003% to 0.016% of the total population. This means that yes, such a scene exists, but also that it is considerably smaller than in other European countries. -- dab (𒁳) 16:34, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Sorry i have com bugs i can not repair the page, it is too long. Just undo my edits, thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by MadGeographer ( talk • contribs) 21:35, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
I wonder whether the mentioning of all the official names in the introduction is necessary - especially since they are already in the box on the right and to me they clog the paragraph unnecessarily. Especially since already the first sentence has a lot about the naming in all languages and nobody uses the formal name of Switzerland; so it does not seem important enough for the introduction. What do you think? -- hroest 15:39, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Especially the pronunciation links are clutter. If we remove those, it will already look more readable. -- dab (𒁳) 16:49, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
I agree but there should still be a section where those appear; just not in the introduction. -- hroest 10:45, 22 February 2009 (UTC)
they can be in a footnote to begin with. But I am not sure I agree we need them. Unless there is some specific reason, pronounciation info of terms in non-English languages should be avoided. People interested in how to pronounce French Suisse should check the French phonology article, or wikt:Suisse. Discussing phonetic details of some language that isn't in the article's focus of attention needlessly distracts from the article topic. -- dab (𒁳) 17:56, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
I think I would agree to place them in a footnote and I also agree that there might not be many people interested in pronouncing Svizra in Raetoromanisch :-) But it still seems to be common practice to mention that at least somwhere. I think the link to the dictionary is a good solution but someone should include the phonetics there, I guess that wouldnt hurt anybody and a nice compromise? -- hroest 18:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
is this claim sourced? Otherwise I suggest that we delete it. -- hroest 16:21, 21 February 2009 (UTC)
Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Swiss migration to the United Kingdom. Badagnani ( talk) 16:51, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
I've never heard of this just being called Schweiz. Usu. die Schweiz I.E. Ich reise in der Schweiz. Could someone confirm this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.10.5.249 ( talk) 00:47, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
In English, it's "the UK", "the Netherlands" but just "Germany", "France", "Switzerland", without the definite article. In German, it is die Schweiz, die Niederlande, das Vereingte Königreich but just Deutschland, Frankreich. As long as we're discussing German usage, we should note the presence of the definite article. -- dab (𒁳) 10:05, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
This was moved into article namespace the other day. It isn't linked from anywhere yet. -- User:Docu
what is it doing in article namespace? I have redirected it as blatant WP:CFORK. -- dab (𒁳) 10:06, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
these are article indices. It is bad enough that you keep insisting on keeping them in namespace, you don't need to link them from everywhere because they are "orphaned". Link them from Portal:Contents, and nowhere else. -- dab (𒁳) 19:14, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
It should be "Confœderatio Helvetia," not Helvetica. The documentary Helvetica discusses how the creators of the font came up with the name by using the Latin name for the region, Helvetia. As far as I know, Helvetica is only the name of the font.
Helvetia can be seen on coins and stamps... MM962 ( talk) 21:44, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
It's Helvetia but Confœderatio Helvetica "Helvetic Confederation". What is your point? -- dab (𒁳) 10:02, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
on my swiss 5 cent. coin I can cleary read Confœderatio Helvetica Pascalbrax ( talk) 08:58, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
Hopefully, you have more than just .05 swissies at your disposal ;-) But on the topic. Helvetia refers to the country, helvetica is the latin adjective in its female nominative flection, meaning swiss. Tprosser ( talk) 13:46, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
Uhh, I know both states are Germanic, but is Albert Einstein, Swiss or German? Cause another article says he was born in Ulm, German Empire. And Ulm is still part of Germany till this day. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borninbronx10 ( talk • contribs) 13:00, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
I see no reason to depict Einstein. These thumbnail collages are an abomination anyway. Just show a mugshot of Euler. Or none at all. -- dab (𒁳) 19:12, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
It is difficult to choose only one portrait in an article like this. In any case I would represent Albert Einstein, he is the most famous Swiss person of all time according to a survey by the SonntagsZeitung (see [5]). MadGeographer ( talk) 21:01, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
I removed the portrait of the president because it seems redundant with the photo of the federal council. Also the president has no powers above the other Councillors so I think showing the whole federal council gives a better idea of what is politics in Switzerland. MadGeographer ( talk) 20:36, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
I am surprised there is no article on Suisse romande or Romandie as a separate article (see French wikipedia [6]) and the 3 other linguistic regions of Switzerland. The Suisse romande regions consists of a number of cantons which, together, have distinctive characteristics that separate the region from, for example, Swiss Germans (occasionally called Suisse totos :-) by the Romands). Trompeta ( talk) 18:47, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Romandie is a section redirect. There could certainly be a standalone article on the Romandie in principle, it just appears that so far nobody has taken the trouble to write it. -- dab (𒁳) 10:00, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
To my understanding Switzerland is only a semi-direct democracy (as also stated on the german wiki-page). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Generic wiki user ( talk • contribs) 11:14, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
Apparently much of the section hasn't anything to do with Switzerland. I would suggest remove most of it or put back a previous version. Maybe we could use the text later on a more specific page.
And how about making it a featured article? MadGeographer ( talk) 14:30, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
The earliest known cultural tribes of the area were members of the Hallstatt and La Tène cultures. The La Tène culture developed and flourished during the late Iron Age from around 450 BC, possibly under some influence from the Greek and Etruscan civilizations. One of the most important tribal groups in the Swiss region was the Helvetii. In 15 BC, Tiberius I, who was destined to be the second Roman emperor, and his brother, Drusus, conquered the Alps, integrating them into the Roman Empire. The area occupied by the Helvetii—the namesakes of the later Confoederatio Helvetica—first became part of Rome's Gallia Belgica province and then of its Germania Superior province, while the eastern portion of modern Switzerland was integrated into the Roman province of Raetia.
In the Early Middle Ages, from the fourth century AD, the western extent of modern-day Switzerland was part of the territory of the Kings of the Burgundians. The Alemanni settled the Swiss plateau in the fifth century AD and the valleys of the Alps in the eighth century AD, forming Alemannia. Modern-day Switzerland was therefore then divided between the kingdoms of Alemannia and Burgundy. The entire region became part of the expanding Frankish Empire in the sixth century, following Clovis I's victory over the Alemanni at Tolbiac in 504 AD, and later Frankish domination of the Burgundians.
After its extension under Charles the Great, the Frankish empire was divided by the Treaty of Verdun in 843. The territories of nowadays Switzerland became divided into Middle Francia and East Francia until the were reunified under the Holy Roman Empire around 1000 AD.
By 1200 AD, the Swiss plateau comprised the dominions of the houses of Savoy, Zähringer, Habsburg and Kyburg. Some regions ( Uri, Schwyz, Unterwalden, later known as Waldstätten) were accorded the Imperial immediacy to grant the empire direct control over the mountain passes. When the Kyburg dynasty fell in 1264 AD, the Habsburgs under King Rudolph I (Holy Roman Emperor in 1273) extended its territory to the eastern Swiss plateau.
I was concerned with the readability of the intro because of the high number of names and the density of information at the beginning. I would make the first paragraph shorter so that the casual reader can directly go to the second one and avoid the "boring" first part (something I usually do). So here is a proposition with 4 paragraphs and additional info. Your comments and suggestions welcome. mgeo talk 21:56, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
Paragraph | Text | Comments |
---|---|---|
definition, location | Switzerland ( German: die Schweiz [2] French: la Suisse, Italian: Svizzera, Romansh: Svizra), officially the Swiss Confederation (Confoederatio Helvetica in Latin, hence its ISO country codes CH and CHE), is a federal republic consisting of 26 states named cantons, with Bern as the seat of the federal authorities. The country is situated in Western Europe where it is bordered by Germany to the north, France to the west, Italy to the south and Austria and Liechtenstein to the east. | basic informations, not very readable |
Geography, economy | Switzerland is a landlocked country whose territory is geographically divided between the Jura, the Central Plateau and the Alps; adding together an area of 41,285 km². The approximately 7.7 million people concentrate mostly on the Plateau, where the largest cities are to be found. Among them the two global cities and economic centres of Zürich and Geneva. Switzerland is one of the richest countries in the world by per capita gross domestic product, with a nominal per capita GDP of $67,384. [3] Zürich and Geneva have respectively been ranked as having the second and third highest quality of life in the world. [4] | beginning of general information |
Relations | The Swiss Confederation has a long history of neutrality—it has not been at war internationally since 1815—and was one of the last countries to join the United Nations. Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including the WEF, the Red Cross, the World Trade Organization and the second largest UN office. On the European level it was a founder of the European Free Trade Association and is part of the Schengen Agreement. | |
Culture | Switzerland comprises three main linguistic and cultural regions: German, French, Italian, to which are added the Romansh-speaking valleys. The Swiss therefore do not form a nation in the sense of a common ethnic or linguistic identity. The strong sense of belonging to the country is founded on the common historical background, shared values ( federalism, direct democracy, neutrality) [5] and Alpine symbolism. [6] The establishment of the Swiss Confederation is traditionally dated to 1 August 1291; Swiss National Day is celebrated on the anniversary. | added cultural aspects |
Yes, it will be possible to produce any number of sources that place Switzerland either in Central or in Western Europe. But looking at the Central Europe vs. Western Europe article, it transpires that Switzerland forms the extreme southwestern tip of some definitions of Central Europe, while it is well within any definition of Western Europe. It would make more sense for the lead to place Switzerland in Western Europe than in Central Europe (assuming that it does place it in either) -- dab (𒁳) 13:16, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
The third paragraph states:
"Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including the World Economic Forum, the Red Cross, the World Trade Organization and the second largest UN office."
But the WEF is not an "international organisations" but a non-profit foundation, and would likely not qualify on the list of international organizations based in Geneva.
A Swiss government page ( http://www.eda.admin.ch/eda/en/home/topics/intorg/inorch.html) states that "Switzerland ... has concluded a “headquarters agreement” with 25 international organizations: 22 organizations have their headquarters in Geneva, 2 in Berne and 1 in Basel."
So what about reformulating as: "Switzerland is home to many international organisations, including seven organisations of the UN System, the second largest UN office, the Red Cross, or the World Trade Organization." ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 153.109.180.138 ( talk) 08:07, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
Logotype in front of the WEF's official website: World Economic Forum: Committed to Improving the State of the World This seems to me like being pretty international. It is also an organization (profit or non profit does not matter). Therefore IMHO it is effectively an international organization, not only concerned with solely "economy", as the improvement of the world concerns all the various aspects of Life. André Malreaux dixit: le XX1ème siècle sera spirituel ou ne sera pas (not religious, but base on an all encompassing system not only economic based):-) claude ( talk) 18:33, 22 October 2009 (UTC)
Traditionnally, an international organization must 1) be based on an international treaty, meaning an agreement between states, and 2) the constituting members (which compose the decision-making organ) must be states. This is simply because the decision of IOs usually have a legal impact on the internal rules of a state. It is quite obvious, therefore, that private enterprises or individuals cannot be involved, outside of usual advisory or observer roles. There are exceptions. For example, the OSCE is an IO with no founding treaty, but is instead based on the Helsinki declaration. The ICRC, although based on a treaty, only has Swiss citizens acting in their private capacity in its general assembly. The EU, incidentally, is usually not considered an IO, because there is an independent decision-making process which does not involve states (the Commission).
The WEF is neither based on an international treaty, its decision-making organ is composed of individuals acting in their private capacity. It is not a treaty.
For any further explanations I refer you to any introductory textbook on international law.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.2.0.153 ( talk) 06:04, November 3, 2009
Proposal to rename the articles about individual districts at Talk:Districts of Switzerland TrueColour ( talk) 21:12, 26 October 2009 (UTC)
The first name being used for Switzerland constantly becomes "Naziland", and , as a Swiss German, I find this highly offensive. Whoever the person is that is doing this should be stopped. This is just ******* pathetic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.26.68.76 ( talk) 14:03, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
It was just vandalism. Sheesh. It was online for all of six minutes, five minutes less than it took you to formulate your rant. -- dab (𒁳) 14:51, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
Following the recent referendum, there have been a lot of edits. Many of them are just vandalism and easily reverted. User Wormcast, in contrast, has provided an addition that is both well-written and well-sourced. I'm concerned, however, that it might be a bit WP:UNDUE to devote around 30% of the section on Swiss culture to describe how xenophobic the Swiss are, even if those claims are backed up by reliable sources. Jeppiz ( talk) 04:14, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
In particular, the ICE found that the Swiss government on its own initiative prior to the outbreak of the war requested that the Nazi authorities stamp all passports of German Jews with a "J" as the Swiss did not recognize the right to asylum of those fleeing racial persecution."Switzerland, and in particular its political leaders, failed when it came to generously offering protection to persecuted Jews. This is all the more serious in view of the fact that the authorities, who were quite aware of the possible consequences of their decision, not only closed the borders in August 1942, but continued to apply this restrictive policy for over a year. By adopting numerous measures making it more difficult for refugees to reach safety, and by handing over the refugees caught directly to their persecutors, the Swiss authorities were instrumental in helping the Nazi regime to attain its goals."
I would like to point that Wikipedia is WP:NOTAFORUM. It seems clear that both Wormcast and Don Durandal have strong and personal opinions about this matter. Wikipedia is not the place to discuss them. I suggest we simply removed both the claim of Switzerland being humanitarian and xenophobic. Both are POV statements that are neither relevant here nor verifiable. (As a short answer to Wormcast's question, Turkey has actively discouraged renovation of churches and closed the Orthodox priest seminary, but it is also true that these moves have been criticized. However, there is no relation whatsoever between this and Swiss culture). Jeppiz ( talk) 02:42, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
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