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Section sizes in 2023 Nigerien crisis error: 2023 Nigerien crisis is a redirect

Hi everyone, I'd like to point out that Cape Verde is part of the West African bloc and is not framed within the map. Can anybody suggest the mapmaker or the one responsible to widen/color it, to include Cape Verde which is kind of in the middle of the Atlantic?

Thank you and excuse me if I sound demanding with this request, but I am really a failure at creating maps. Thanks! CoryGlee ( talk) 12:24, 19 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Maybe a dot or an inset map will do, given the size of the country. Borgenland ( talk) 12:59, 19 August 2023 (UTC) reply

A ring around the country will also do. Borgenland ( talk) 03:32, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Sources confirm that Liberia will contribute military forces to the ECOWAS intervention force, with no reputable sources stating otherwise, can someone contact the map maker and ask for an update? U2You Too ( talk) 16:47, 19 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Yes it does seem like the map does need an update I will add information about this to the article as well. HuntersHistory ( talk) 02:32, 20 August 2023 (UTC) reply

@ U2You Too I got told by Borgenland we do not deal with what appears but what actually happens but I can’t find an article that supports Liberia isn’t againist intervention. HuntersHistory ( talk) 03:18, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Hi, I think one should keep an eye on this article to see if there is any missing content: 2023 Nigerien coup d'état. I'll try to do it but it's quite long so if anyone could help that would be nice Neo Trixma ( talk) 17:26, 20 August 2023 (UTC) reply

It’s the aftermath that’s having problems. We really should hold off on adding content unless it is really significant like a major breakthrough, anything more serious happening to the actors or an intervention actually taking place. Borgenland ( talk) 03:27, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Are you talking about the coup article or the crisis? Some Hecking Nerd ( talk) 03:59, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Some users have been copy pasting the crisis timeline onto the coup aftermath. Borgenland ( talk) 04:29, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Yes agreed, let's stick to essential facts in aftermath in coup article, and same for the "background" section in nigerien crisis Neo Trixma ( talk) 22:38, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

It says on the map that Liberia is only againist the coup political, but most of the sources I see list only that the Cape Verde would be the only country of Ecowas to not support it militarily besides the other juntas, can someone try and give me a source againist this so I can figure out if Liberia is against military intervention. HuntersHistory ( talk) 00:36, 21 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Is this true? https://www.africanews.com/2023/08/22/wagners-boss-hints-he-is-in-africa-in-first-video-post-since-mutiny-in-russia/?dicbo=v2-Z5wRTqd Brek1234567 ( talk) 16:16, 22 August 2023 (UTC) reply

It was reported in August 21st's ISW https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-august-21-2023 Some Hecking Nerd ( talk) 17:19, 22 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Should we add it to the article? Neo Trixma ( talk) 00:04, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Any mention of Niger? Borgenland ( talk) 01:15, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Indeed. Prigozhin is posturing to extend Wagner's current operations in Burkina Faso and Mali into Niger. Some Hecking Nerd ( talk) 02:17, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

@ Borgenland I haven’t heard anything about Niger just that he is somewhere in Africa. HuntersHistory ( talk) 02:50, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Best to hold it off. Borgenland ( talk) 03:32, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Well, Prigozhin just died in a plane crash, so I doubt this is necessary anymore. Some Hecking Nerd ( talk) 18:00, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Yes, Wagner boss Yevgeny Prigozhin presumed dead after Russia plane crash and Russia also said so. HuntersHistory ( talk) 18:29, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Yes it is, some sources did the link between his his death and the video, I can try to find it back if needed Neo Trixma ( talk) 15:13, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

How could he be in Africa and then be dead in Russia a day later? 68.111.7.219 ( talk) 18:20, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Have you ever been on a plane? Borgenland ( talk) 19:00, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Why would he fly back to Russia, where he's likely persona non grata, and likely to die in sabotage, to just fly again and die? 68.111.7.219 ( talk) 19:05, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

We trust sources, not our own reflexion on the matter Neo Trixma ( talk) 19:08, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

If you read the papers he’s been back and forth for a long time. Borgenland ( talk) 19:08, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

I heard about a report from someone on the internet that France is using Libya (LNA controlled territory) to prepare for an attack on Niger, and That French forces are stationing. and Hafter forces may be involved. Another source said Niger Changes Mind On France & USA, Wants Them To Stay, it also stated that they praised Biden for his resonable position, and they also stated they would not kill the president and not let Wagner into the country it could just be fake new but if someone chould find a source it could help. https://m.youtube.com/shorts/ZXAtb9o77dI] https://m.youtube.com/shorts/ZXAtb9o77dI [1] https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230822-france-denies-reports-that-algeria-refused-access-to-airspace-for-niger-military-operation/ HuntersHistory ( talk) 02:49, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

There also been a claim That the Africa union now backdown Ecowas intention to intervene using military action is this false. HuntersHistory ( talk) 07:24, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Is there a reliable secondary source? Neo Trixma ( talk) 08:39, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

@ Neo Trixma Thats what I been asking and I was wondering if anyone had an idea or if this is fake new because people have been using the argument of the Africa union now backdown Ecowas intention to intervene using military action against me I should also state that videos are still being posted online that Algeria is supporting the coup and when I say something about it they tell me i am missing the point. HuntersHistory ( talk) 17:52, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

With all due respect, what do you mean by AU backdown ECOWAS intervention? It is quite confusing

Also as far as I’m concerned, videos aren’t recognized as a reliable source in itself as per consensus

Borgenland ( talk) 17:58, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Are they standing down or backing it up? Borgenland ( talk) 17:59, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

@ Borgenland I honestly have no idea what they mean by it that is there exact wording and I also ask them what they meant by it, I honestly think it is fake news because no one is talking about it. HuntersHistory ( talk) 18:40, 23 August 2023 (UTC) reply

He is dead now and I have seen articles making the connection with the video Neo Trixma ( talk) 10:16, 24 August 2023 (UTC) reply

I been told that the ambassador of Nigeria being forced to leave Niger is false and miss information but every link I can find says that only the usa and Germany were proven false so how Is it false information if there isn’t a source that say it is wrong, [2] https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2023-08-25/afp-says-statement-on-german-us-ambassadors-being-told-to-leave-niger-is-unauthentic, this source says only Germany and the USA is false. HuntersHistory ( talk) 03:28, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

So is there another source that states other wise. HuntersHistory ( talk) 03:29, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

Sorry I apologize I didn’t know there was a new source to back this up. HuntersHistory ( talk) 03:32, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

I mean I am sorry thought the claim was true but it was false. HuntersHistory ( talk) 03:32, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

• HuntersHistory, please slow down. You appear to be edit 'bombing' multiple articles and talk pages with questions and errors. I'd encourage you to take your time, read the sources carefully, do not copy content from sources and triple check your grammar and sentence structure before posting. Thanks and happy editing. 2601:19E:4180:6D50:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 ( talk) 03:49, 26 August 2023 (UTC) reply

  What is 'bombing'. HuntersHistory ( talk) 19:30, 27 August 2023 (UTC) reply

  It means you recklessly and rapidly dumping all kinds of stuff without even making the proper checks if it has any coherence or even any relevance with the rest of the article. Haven’t you noticed I’ve had to correct every edit you make? Plus the fact that every time you make a topic on the talk page you piling it on immediately afterwards until it becomes so wieldy. Finally I should warn you about recklessly wiping out massive sections of the talk page without explanation. You could get banned from editing this page if it happens again. Borgenland ( talk) 01:24, 28 August 2023 (UTC) reply

  Okay like I said before I am sorry and I will say I am sorry but knowing your responses to my previous response you guy are probably not going to accept it, again I shouldn’t have done that without warning and out of angry. HuntersHistory ( talk) 02:07, 28 August 2023 (UTC) reply

  I have decided will leave the talk section to others and not make will not make a topic on any talk page inleast it important and will, I Will Try and be more coherent and rebalance to the topic and not copy and paste articles, I will still edits to the but I will take what you said to heart once again I am sorry but once again knowing the previous Reponses it probably won't be nice, autocorrect keeps butchering my response. HuntersHistory ( talk) 02:12, 28 August 2023 (UTC) reply

HuntersHistory, sorry it's taken me so long to respond, but I've been recovering from illness. Borgenland summarized what I meant very well, but I'd add two more aspects. One, you have been making many substantive changes to fairly high profile articles, something that ought to require an excellent command of English grammar and copy editing in general--that way other editors will not be compelled to spend so much time cleaning up afterwards. The second observation is that you were adding content you found in the newspapers every day, which isn't very selective. We're an encyclopedia, which means having perspective and discerning what's of lasting importance. If the Nigerien crisis lasts months or years, almost nobody will take the time to scroll through a daily accounting of events, and it's unlikely that most daily events will be worth recording here. Please read one of the things we're not, WP:NOTNEWS. Thanks, 2601:19E:4180:6D50:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 ( talk) 03:22, 2 September 2023 (UTC) reply

I just created an article for the French ambassador to Niger Sylvain Itté. He was ordered to leave the country and so far it appears he has not left. Thriley ( talk) 15:30, 29 August 2023 (UTC) reply

As far as it has been publicly announced only Cape Verde opposes military intervention in Niger. The map should be updated. The liberian president George Weah and his government have stated that several times:

1st of August https://www.liberianobserver.com/liberia-pres-weah-endorses-all-measures-necessary-restore-nigers-overthrown-govt

https://liberiapublicradio.com/2023/08/01/liberia-endorses-ecowas-intervention-in-niger-coup/

11th of August https://www.liberianobserver.com/liberia-pres-weah-backs-ecowass-military-intervention-niger

18th of August https://www.liberianobserver.com/liberia-liberia-likely-contribute-soldiers-nigers-intervention 2001:8A0:6A16:8301:74E6:75CE:8481:B3AC ( talk) 14:02, 31 August 2023 (UTC) reply

We need an updated map ASAP. This misleading map has been on the article for several weeks now, might as well remove it until we get an accurate and updated map U2You Too ( talk) 13:18, 1 September 2023 (UTC) reply

I don't think it is that bad, just add a light-green circle around Cape Verde for better visibility and switch Liberia to dark-green. 2001:8A0:6A16:8301:74E6:75CE:8481:B3AC ( talk) 10:06, 2 September 2023 (UTC) reply

I updated it! Lukt64 ( talk) 02:08, 18 September 2023 (UTC) reply

The article seems to contradict itself regarding the above question. In the section "Security situation" we have the phrase "the entry of [Russia's] private mercenary firm Wagner Group in the region," with a citation, but the citation does not mention the Wagner Group by name (though it does discuss Russian (para-)military involvement). I added a failed verification tag to that claim for this reason. Later in the article, under "Misinformation," the article says that there is "no evidence of Wagner Group mercenaries being deployed in Niger." Citations to debunkings of specific bits of misinformation follow, but I didn't see any explicit statement that the WG definitely is not involved in the situation during my (admittedly cursory) review of those sources. So which is true? I don't personally know which it is, but we should surely figure out what is true and stick to that. Wehpudicabok ( talk) 23:49, 2 September 2023 (UTC) reply

It seems like France is much more involved in its former colonies than just being categorized as Support. The United States has been intentionally reserved on the crisis as taking a side would jeopardize military assets (i.e. the drone sites used in counter-terrorism); however, France has been far more belligerent in both its posturing and actions. Even if France is pulling troops out, the junta and pro-coup partisans seem to be treating the French embassy and French military bases as their enemy. French military personnel is directly involved in the crisis.

To be fair, however, as far as I can tell, France has not declared any intention to intervene in the crisis militarily as has ECOWAS. I think France could be categorized as either a Belligerent or Supporter, but I do think footnotes or citation would be best to clarify that they are more involved than the UK and US. GigaDerp ( talk) 14:45, 7 September 2023 (UTC) reply

G'day, great work in this, but can you please collapse the Timeline section so every day isn't a separate subsection of the TOC? Thanks, Peacemaker67 ( click to talk to me) 11:26, 8 September 2023 (UTC) reply

Placed a TOC limit. Hopefully this fixes things. XTheBedrockX ( talk) 21:35, 6 October 2023 (UTC) reply

The map needs an update fast. It needs a more accurate map of the situation of support world wide. Lukt64 ( talk) 14:58, 9 September 2023 (UTC) reply

Updated the map because nobody was brave enough to do so, I guess. Lukt64 ( talk) 05:53, 11 September 2023 (UTC) reply

Nobody changed the map because the map didn't need changing. The previous map accurately displayed which countries have committed to military contributions and which have not. France has not committed to military contribution to an ECOWAS intervention; any suggestion that it would do so is purely speculation. Luisa Koala ( talk) 12:36, 11 September 2023 (UTC) reply

May I add, a truly poor choice of colors on the map which makes it nearly impossible for the colorblind to discern coup allies from opponents. As a colorblind person myself, all I can actually see in the map are coup allies... For the love of God, would you mind changing it? 194.165.48.1 ( talk) 08:58, 26 September 2023 (UTC) reply

Red-green colourblindness, this should have been obvious. I'll see about placing a request on the image's page. Nevermind, the image creator is Lukt64, they should see the concern raised here. Mr rnddude ( talk) 15:44, 27 September 2023 (UTC) reply

I will fix it when I get home, but im at school rn. Lukt64 ( talk) 17:30, 27 September 2023 (UTC) reply

Should the United States be included in support for the old goverment? They have opened diplomatic relations with the coup leaders and are going to begin military operations out of there bace. If this is true they should be removed because they would not support the either side. LuxembourgLover ( talk) 12:23, 3 October 2023 (UTC) reply

There is no yet official US recognition of Tchiani as head of state. Borgenland ( talk) 12:50, 3 October 2023 (UTC) reply

Now the crises is over and the US has opened relations. They where not forced out of the country like France. LuxembourgLover ( talk) 19:08, 12 January 2024 (UTC) reply

What's the source that implies that Chad supports the coup? Their position is more neutral, similar to the Algerian one. 79.44.65.11 ( talk) 07:19, 15 October 2023 (UTC) reply

• I agree, I don't see anything in sources about Chad supporting them like Guinea. Also why are they even represented on the map? I thought it was specifically made to show just ECOWAS members (which is why it is also confusing that insurgencies unrelated to this crisis are shown). Yeoutie ( talk) 15:26, 17 October 2023 (UTC) reply

This contradicts the fact the French forces in Niger withdrew to Chad. Borgenland ( talk) 16:36, 17 October 2023 (UTC) reply

Is it officially over now that the French have left? Borgenland ( talk) 01:31, 24 December 2023 (UTC) reply

I don't think so..... This crisis was rooted from "ECOWAS" which threatend to intervene Niger. French withdrwal was not a main issue about article when it was first made. So, I think it is unfinished until "ECOWAS" declare something about this crisis. Wendylove ( talk) 10:01, 27 December 2023 (UTC) reply

ECOWAS just lifted sanctions. Tdmurlock ( talk) 05:32, 25 February 2024 (UTC) reply

Yes, I think it should be over now. Yxuibs ( talk) 16:06, 9 April 2024 (UTC) reply

Since this appears to be deescalating, should this be the right time to convert the timeline to prose? Borgenland ( talk) 15:35, 25 February 2024 (UTC) reply

I think this is a good idea, and would be happy to help with prose conversion up to the end of last year if other editors agree. Unbandito ( talk) 00:10, 17 March 2024 (UTC) reply

I think we can all agree the crisis is over. they just fell to Wagner and Russian influence now but there won’t be any interventions Ion.want.uu ( talk) 23:33, 12 April 2024 (UTC) reply

It has been proposed in this section that Nigerien crisis (2023–present) be renamed and moved to Nigerien crisis (2023–2024). A bot will list this discussion on requested moves' current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{ subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{ requested move/dated}} directly. Links: current log • target log • direct move

Nigerien crisis (2023–present) → Nigerien crisis (2023–2024) – Some discussion topics on this talk page seem to agree that the crisis is over, hence this request to move the page title. ECOWAS withdrew sanctions and France withdrew troops, there seem to be no "original crisis" still present. Yxuibs ( talk) 03:00, 14 April 2024 (UTC) reply

• An alternative name could be: Nigerien crisis

Yxuibs ( talk) 03:00, 14 April 2024 (UTC) reply

Support and convert to prose Lukt64 ( talk) 01:51, 19 April 2024 (UTC) reply

• Support since many sanctions, especially those of ECOWAS, that were active in 2023 because of this situation have been lifted now. Chiserc ( talk) 21:49, 28 April 2024 (UTC) reply