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Don't worry but I think somebody got confused while usign LHD and RHD back and forth beetwen different countries, so for example, Spain is LHD or RHD? the part about Gibraltar made me get confused about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.226.204.140 ( talk) 03:16, 6 June 2009 (UTC)
Do we have any reliable evidence about the historic foundations of LHD/RHD are? I think the article could benefit from adding any info to this effect. On numerous occasions, I have heard that left hand driving has its roots in knights passing each other with the lances in their right hand. However, i have never been able to find any evidence of this. -- Matttwd ( talk) 23:01, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
-Please do excuse me for sounding a bit daft, but I'm not sure I understand the question. Isn't that what the entire article is about? In addition, I think the problems ascertaining the specific history are quite well-presented. Haku8645 ( talk) 23:41, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Under Safety factors it says "Research in 1969 by J. J. Leeming showed countries driving on the left have a lower collision rate than countries driving on the right. This research is questioned in Peter Kincaid's book on the rule of the road,[citation needed] but some countries that have switched to driving on the right, such as Sweden, have seen their long-term accident rates increase by more than any increase in traffic volume[citation needed]." The red part is totally made up, and the opposite is the truth. The number of accidents was cut in half from the first day of right hand driving, and has not increased substantually since then. Swedish right hand driver 83.255.35.43 ( talk) 20:03, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
If anyone else has found this already and beaten me to it, I'm sorry to be redundant. After a long night of trolling the internet for hours I finally came across the holy grail of Dagen H-related video. Here's the link.
It's from TV Sveriges. That link will take you to the live television coverage from 4.45am to 5.15am. There's yet another clip from 5.15-5.30 and further clips down the right-hand menu to different reports throughout Sweden at different intervals throughout the day. It chronicles the entire switch in immense detail, though be warned that the dialogue is entirely in Swedish (as is the website) so its main function is simply for those of us who draw immense excitement from watching these events transpire. The site also hosts (further down) the news bulletins for the various anniversaries right up to 1997. Again, if this has been posted before, I'm sorry, but for those of you who haven't seen this before, happy viewing. Haku8645 ( talk) 16:32, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
New link [1] Quiensabe ( talk) 17:48, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Quote: "Some also attempted to reverse the traditional meaning of traffic signals by having the red light mean "go" and the green light "stop"." I find this rather funny, yet I do not entirely interpret this as a form of extreme socialism. Although red may symbolize the Social Revolution, red is also the traditional colour of good fortune in China. For instance, today in China, where reports on the stock and financial markets are given, RED refers to growth and GREEN refers to decline. -- 李博杰 | — Talk contribs 11:23, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
Who says that north China drove on the right before 1946? Kincaid was cautious avout North China because his source (Hooper) could not be confirmed. We can confirm that South China drove on the left because of reports from Hong Kong after 1946 when they discussed changing. (The bus companies wanted to know what kind of buses to buy). Also I have seen file photos of Shanghai published in 1937 at the time fo the Japanese attacks showing cars parked on the left. (Qurterly Review, London) We know that North China was under Japanese occupation, at least Beijing and Manchuria. The Japanes drive on the left. To say that North China drove on the right befor 1946, is saying that not only did they have a different rule to south China, but that the Japanese military recognised local law! It may be that in Manchuria the Soviet forces changed the rule in 1945, but that is speculation. Can anyone find a contemporary source for what happened in Beijing on 1 January 1946, as that is the date given by Hopper? Noel Ellis —Preceding unsigned comment added by Noel Ellis ( talk • contribs) 04:34, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
A discussion has been started at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countries/Lists of countries which could affect the inclusion criteria and title of this and other lists of countries. Editors are invited to participate. Pfainuk talk 12:08, 17 December 2008 (UTC)
All these citation neededs that have been recently added... why?
I removed them from the worst paragraph (which was actually illegible) but don't have time to do it properly.
Seriously, count the references in a paragraph of a featured article and see that it is usually much less than 24. Then stop it. 137.205.74.230 ( talk) 22:52, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
I made the change here [2]. Firstly the Telegraph ref is dead. More importantly, from a quick look through sources each one appears to give a different reason. I presume the Telegraph ref really said it was because he was told by a soothsayer to move to the right. Another ref I saw said it's because he was afraid he was going to die by being hit while driving on the left after being told so by a soothsayer. Another says he dreamed something which he intepreted to mean he should move traffic to the right. All in all, it appears no one really knows why he made the order (not that surprising) and people are just applying the 'he's crazy' argument and coming up with random crazy reason. The best assessment is probably that no one knows why he ordered the change which I've changed it to supporter by a ref. Nil Einne ( talk) 16:42, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Why is it so totally imposssible to find out the date for the change in Burma? I mean, it was in as recently as 1970 and something must have been written about it in the international press.I have heard that Ne Win was obsessed with (among many other things) the number 9. Perhaps it was on the 9th of September at 9 o'clock or something like that. But I have no idea. There is nothing about it on the web. I have also tried to find it out in books and so on. -- Andhanq ( talk) 22:46, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
After an early statement on the page dismisses the theory that left-to-right changeovers as a result of Napoleon's conquests is most likely pure myth and legend, the "History" section includes the following gem:
"Other countries, for example France, adopted driving on the right as a result of Napoleonic occupation/control."
How would this schism be corrected? Is the Napoleonic assertion truly myth? If there's fact behind it, the earlier "Changing to Right-Hand Traffic" section needs to be corrected; if not, the History section should, or there needs to be clarification of the statements. Kirottu82 ( talk) 02:04, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
I am a historian and have always believed this supposed 'myth' to be fact: the armies of Napoleon marched on the right and so, as they conquered, enforced this rule on other nations. I suspect that the account of the USA driving on the right is a myth and more likely derives from the close association with France and anti-British sentiment of the period. ( Philo ( talk) 19:41, 22 February 2009 (UTC))
I think there is kinda a bias in this article that those who drive on the left are a bit mad. The article itself is good but I should like to remove this. A third of the world's motorists drive on the left.
I already removed (four countries in Europe) "continue to drive on the left". To say "continue to" is, in my view, not NPOV. It makes us sound like we are perverse not to drive on the right.
S. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SimonTrew ( talk • contribs) 15:16, 26 February 2009 (UTC)
Another point is that driving on the right is coloured green, while driving on the left is coloured red. Firstly, these colourings are rather unessecary. Secondly, if you must have them they could be culturlaly neutral colours like blue and yellow. 78.146.195.92 ( talk) 00:34, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Afaik Suriname is now connected to French Guyana for several years due to a new bridge over the Suriname (river) 88.159.74.100 ( talk) 15:11, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
There is a picture with this label next to the text, but I couldn't find anything about it in the text, nor did I find anything interesting in the picture. Could somebody clarify why is it there? It seems like some text relevant to that pic got deleted. King Klear ( talk) 16:08, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
The image shows a RHT/LHD car with the light quite clearly dipping down to the left (which makes more sense to me, so the light spreads across the entire road instead of off one side) but the text says "Headlamps for RH-traffic (LHD) countries have low beams that "dip to the right"," (off the road - so it does not dazzle oncoming drivers (who obviously have their heads at floor level) and so it reflects off road signs to make them more visible - but the distribution in the image seems to cover this). Is it the image that is wrong, or did someone get confused with the meaning of LHT,RHT,RHD and LHD, or am I missing something ? I addded the (LHD) and (RHD) clarifications but did not change the aforementioned yet in case I've got this wrong and someone fits their headlamps wrong cos of what Wikipedia says and they dazzle someone and someone DIES. Blatant breach of
WP:BOLD I know but I don't want this showing up in another whining minor news story condemning Wikipedia
☭
мдснєтє
тдлк
ЅТЦФФ 15:23, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 02:04, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I have nearly finished a huge edit done over a couple of days where I have tried to remove the redundancy and improve the consistency of saying RHT/LHD etc, since naturally they can be confusing. It may trample other edits of the last few days as I was working on it since 16 March. I have done my best not to let this happen but I see no way round it.
My aims are to:
It is at User:SimonTrew/Right-_and_left-hand_traffic. I should appreciate your views, or please edit it there (but please don't destroy it!). It's still not quite of the quality I think I can get it to but I think it is better than the current article without all of the redundancy etc.
One outstanding issue is I can't get the lists to sit in their proper places in the article. Any help there would be great.
Another is that I am not sure if there should be a separate section generally for pedestrians (and move some stuff out of individual countries' sections) and similarly for exceptions to the rules for LHT and RHT. I have marked many exceptions with a comment <!--exception-->
in case you think they should be split out somehow. The difficulty basically is whether to organise the article geographically or by use, vehicle type, etc.
SimonTrew ( talk) 01:23, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 19:50, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Countries have adopted one of two standards for traffic flow: ie. it either keeps to the left or ro the right. Countries are thus said to have
These terms are used throughout this article to prevent repetition and avoid misunderstanding— particularly because generally LHD = RHT and RHD = LHT. (If you drive on the left you sit on the right, and vice versa)
SimonTrew, please try to adhere to convention regarding talk page discussion format. We do not intersperse comments with existing text, we place our comments wholly below the existing text, otherwise the discussion quickly becomes impossible to follow, particularly for those not originally involved. I have consolidated your interspersed remarks without changing their content and placed them below the text to which you were replying. You may want to edit them slightly to make clear the referents of your comments.
No matter whether the subject matter is simple or complex, as editors we must strive for an article to be written in correct, clear, concise, precise, and accurate English. I'm sorry for the offence you seem to take at my pointing out errors, but they are errors; this is not a question of making the English "simple". Your English fluency may be good or it may be poor, but the writing in your proposed edit is demonstrably problematic. You asked for its evaluation; it is neither helpful nor appropriate for you now to be churlish when a frank and defensible evaluation is provided. I'm glad to read that you're happy to make improvements and I look forward to seeing whatever new proposal you may care to make. Please also give some thoughtful consideration to the attitude with which you seem to be approaching this project; it is not appropriate for you to consider users of Wikipedia "your readership".
I'm not sure I fully understand your objection to the article's structure — perhaps you'll clarify the problem you say you're having. Which specific parts of the article do you find disjoint, confusing, contradictory, or difficult to follow, and how so? Once any such issues are elucidated, you'll have a great deal of help in fixing the problems, rather than having to go it alone. This is a subject influenced by history, geography, industry, and politics, so it is not likely to fit neatly into an imposed constraint of discussion from only one of those factors without substantial loss of informative value.
I definitely agree with you that only information peculiar to particular nations ought to be in those nations' subheadings, while more generally applicable information ought to be consolidated under whatever which subheading best matches the content. That's certainly a good path for us to pursue the betterment of this article. — Scheinwerfermann T· C23:46, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
"Research in 1969 by J. J. Leeming showed countries driving on the LEFT have a LOWER collision rate than countries driving on the right. This research is questioned in Peter Kincaid's book on the rule of the road,[citation needed] BUT some countries that have switched to driving on the RIGHT, such as Sweden, have seen their long-term accident rates INCREASE by more than any increase in traffic volume."
well they would wouldn't they ? whats the need for that "but" in there ?? ☭ мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 15:35, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 19:48, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
There is a line about marine and aviation regulations, but the terms "Left Traffic" and "Right Traffic" are specific terms that refer to the path that loitering and landing aircraft fly when landing at an airport. Mstefaniak ( talk) 17:25, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
Why is the United States in the "drove on left, now drives on right" category? I'm fairly certain that driving on the left was never the law - certainly not at the national level. The U.S. should be dark red on that map. Funnyhat ( talk) 02:22, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
"None shares a physical border with a country that drives on the right and all were once part of the British Empire."
I think this should say something like:
All were once part of the British Empire and only the UK (Norther Ireland) and the Republic of Ireland share a physical border.
(This very point is made later in the subsection on Ireland)
-- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 08:33, 17 May 2009 (UTC)
Thanks - sorry to waste your time -- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 08:44, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
Shouldn't right-hand be in blue and left-hand in red? Hofska ( talk) 03:12, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
I think you will probably have a difficult time attaining consensus to make the change you propose; we likely will not change map colours just because one editor thinks it'd be prettier. — Scheinwerfermann T· C03:34, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
I thought Hofska was going to reply that red-for-left made sense because (mostly) these are remnants of the old British empire and on old school wall maps etc, the BE, Commonwealth & Dominions were shown in red... Not enough to justify the work involved, but this actually makes sense to me (an old-timer) :-) -- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 09:54, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
There is a section which appears to say that the Republic of Ireland and the United Kingdom do not share a physical border although Northern Ireland is part of the UK. Surely this means that the UK and Rep. of Ireland share a border. Philstaff ( talk) 22:23, 4 June 2009 (UTC) 4th June 2009
We have several photos in this article which are not remarkable at all. They are photos of normal roads in India, Hong Kong, Pakistan and the United Kingdom. I don't think they add any value to the article and should therefore be removed. Photos should be of something unusual such as signs, borders and exceptions to the rule, not just showing normal roads in a particular country. NFH ( talk) 11:08, 13 June 2009 (UTC)
The "Give Way To The Right" is a rule that applies in specific circumstances, and is not a rule assumed in all cases where nothing else applies (although it is a common misconception). More to the point, it does not apply to merges of any sort. Merges where no lines delineate the roadway require that the "zip" principle be applied (the car with its nose behind must give way and fall in behind the car with its nose ahead). Merges where lines separate the lanes (and one lane thins to nothing) the motorist that has to cross broken lines must give way. "Give Way to the Right" only applies on intersections where no other signs or devices control the intersection, and the intersection is not considered 'terminating' (although not necessarily a T-intersection). 152.91.9.153 ( talk) 06:31, 17 June 2009 (UTC) 15/06/2009
Since Suriname was Dutch, and the Dutch never drove on the left-hand side of the road, why does Suriname do so?
Kochamanita ( talk) 06:23, 10 July 2009 (UTC)kochamanita
Hakluyt bean, in this edit you changed
Today, only four European countries drive on the left: Cyprus, Ireland, Malta and the United Kingdom.
to
Today, only four European countries drive on the left, although historically many others used to: Cyprus, Ireland, Malta and the United Kingdom.
I have reverted the change. It spoiled the clarity of the assertion (are Cyprus, Ireland, Malta, and the U.K. countries that drive on the left? Or countries that used to drive on the left?). What's more, it was quite redundant given the extensive coverage of switches in traffic-handedness country by country in the article as a whole. I saw no countervailing benefit your added text offered. What benefit do you feel this text, in this place, affords the article? — Scheinwerfermann T· C23:17, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
I don't know how they drive trams in Zagreb; but "on the old right-hand drive Zagreb trams, the driver sits on the left" is self-contradictory. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 18:44, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
No one who might know how Zagreb trams are driven has corrected this; so I have deleted it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 16:14, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Now a person has restored the offending statement who doesn't seem to understand the terminology used in the article: "Vehicles are manufactured in left-hand drive (LHD) and right-hand drive (RHD) configurations, referring to the placement of the driving seat and controls within the vehicle." In order for the statement to be correct, the long-armed Zagreb driver, who is said to sit on the left, would operate controls on the right side of the "right-hand drive" tram. I doubt that this is the case. Such an extraordinary claim should be supported, perhaps by a picture of the contortionist driver. Will the person who thinks that the statement should stand as it is please explain why? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 12:47, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
In Rome, Italy, I've seen Left-hand traffic for automobiles, motorcycles and bicyles on Ponte Umberto I. Don't know if that's notable... -- Scriberius ( talk) 10:27, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
'Today, UK motor vehicles are normally RHD, the main exceptions being service vehicles such as road sweepers and gritters where view of the kerb is more important than of the centre line. Unlike the US (see below) postal delivery vehicles and waste collection vehicles are not usually different from normal traffic, that is to say, they are RHD.'
I am a bit confused with the second sentence. It seems to contradict the first. If the US postal vehicles are not different from standard vehicles, wouldn't they be LHD? Sweetie candykim ( talk) 13:05, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
How come it's listed both as a jurisdiction with left and right hand driving?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.125.127.81 ( talk) 20:23, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
So that there's not some huge mad rush and wasted labour next week, I hereby volunteer to update the article (including maps and lists) to reflect Samoa's change at exactly 6am Samoa time, which for me in Dubai is 9pm on the 7th. I'll prepare both maps now and will set an alarm to remind me at exactly 9pm. Does anyone have any objections to this? Haku8645 ( talk) 17:42, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
Sounds good. Kevinmon ( talk) 16:54, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
CMBJ, I have reverted your unilateral, undiscussed move of this article. The present title is the result of a great deal of discussion and consensus-building, which is how article titles are decided for complex subjects such as this one. It is possible consensus might develop to support the title you appear to prefer, but I have some difficulty imagining it, for the term "bidirectional traffic" does not seem to be in actual use (see e.g. Google search); another thing we don't do here is prescriptively create the world—we describe it as it is. If you feel the present title is in error, please check the number and dial again (I mean please read through the talk page and its archives to understand how the present title came to be, then if you still feel the same, propose a new title here on the talk page). Thanks for editing coöperatively! — Scheinwerfermann T· C02:31, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
I am confused by the terminology in this article - specifically "left hand road" or "left hand driving," "left hand car" or "right driving car" and so on. Although they seem straightforward at first, they are confusing in context - I guess because a car with a driver on the left is actually driving on the right - we don't usually think about this, and it makes this article hard to read. Is there a way to clarify the terminology and make sure it's used consistently?
(or maybe I'm just dense) Dmz5 *Edits* *Talk* 04:45, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Is it true that left-hand traffic is supported by political Right, and right-hand traffic is supported by political Left?-- MathFacts ( talk) 10:23, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
What has motivated the 'modern' changes is generally avoidance of border conflicts. The article explains how few land borders remain where dirving side changes. Sussexonian ( talk) 15:24, 13 September 2009 (UTC)
One can tell this article has been mostly written by persons living in left driving countries. While it attempts to retain a level of uniformity with information about both sides of driving, most sections offer a very biased tone against right side driving, using negative wording to describe otherwise neutral maneuvers while the left side version uses mostly positive wording, this is probably not done intentionally, but is perhaps written by several authors who are left side biased and so have written the article in a way that promotes it despite the fact the statistics of the article itself show the right hand driving is the predominant form of driving in the world both in road mileage, number of nations, and population. Now, I'm not saying this is some conspiracy, I'm just pointing out the inline wording in the article that makes right hand driving sound inferior to left hand driving, one example I can give off the bat is the two sections titled "jurisdictions for right/left hand driving"; where as the left side paragraph discusses the reasons for why some countries drive left and points out how pacific islands use this method for uniformity with nearby influential nations, yet, the right side section discusses the problems and inconveniences with border crossings... while these "problems" can be just as equally blamed on left driving countries for not staying uniform with the majority of their neighbors, it is somehow made an issue on the "right hand jurisdiction" section as if it were entirely the fault of the right hand countries. This is the way the entire article comes off as, even going as far as hinting that things such as roundabouts and traffic patterns are inferior to to left side driving... regular users of this site should really look into getting together and rewording the bias out of this article. -- 76.255.84.85 ( talk) 16:06, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Regarding the question about the Philippines, it appears that Spain did not fully adopt drive on the right until after 1924 when Madrid changed. So some Spanish colonies drove on the left, such as Argentina, Uruguay and Paraguay until 1945-46. It may also have been that drive on the left was wide-spread in Asia, ie China, Japan, Indonesia etc. 122.57.37.199 ( talk) 08:47, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
There is much talk about "exceptions", places in in different countries where traffic is said to run on the opposite side. But, that is not really the case. It is merely two one-way streets very close to each other, just separeted by a concrete divider and not by a city block. It may look like the opposite system, but normal overtaking rules apply on each of the separeted lanes. -- Andhanq ( talk) 07:04, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
FYI. There is a discussion going on the Infobox Country template to remove the Drives on field currently listed. -- Phoenix ( talk) 10:45, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
Where do one-way streets fit in this statistic? Are they so rare in the world as a whole that they've been lost in the rounding error? -- Smjg ( talk) 16:14, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
Apparently, amidst all the hubbub regarding Samoa's switch back in September, all of us completely missed the story that gripped African headlines only weeks earlier - after a survey, most Rwandans came out in favour of switching to the left as well! I've added in a new section incorporating information from various African news articles (all in English) regarding the survey, the ministry that undertook it, the results and the reasons for the switch. As far as I know, it's still being deliberated and no official word has been given yet, but one article mentioned that it could take months, so I'm keeping my eyes peeled for the next bit of info that crops up.
Does anyone object to me including this information yet? If you think I've jumped the gun, then by all means correct me, but it does seem a very tantalising developing story with not a whole lot of opposition. By way of comparison, the story about Donnie Cassidy in Ireland proposing to switch to the right being pretty much immediately rejected doesn't deserve a mention, but this is actually straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak (the Minister of Infrastructure gave this interview to several newspapers). If it is worth keeping, could someone tidy up my referencing? I've referenced the same thing three times and it's created three separate entries, and I don't know how to consolidate them. Until the next time, all roads lead to Rome... Haku8645 ( talk) 23:11, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
could some put the reason that most countries drive on the right, if that information is available? 76.22.97.102 ( talk) 14:37, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
The article says that in countries with left-hand traffic, "on roads without a footpath pedestrians may be advised to walk on the right," and in countries with right-hand traffic, "on roads without a footpath pedestrians may be advised to walk on the left."
Does anyone know how common this rule is? While this advice is certainly given in some countries, I doubt that it is universal. A friend of mine was reprimanded in India (which drives on the left) when he walked on the right-hand side of the road.-- Oz1cz ( talk) 07:08, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
I have been there but it drives on the left just like Thailand.-- 125.25.20.80 ( talk) 18:52, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
There are four European Union member countries where driving on the left is the practice. There appears to be legislation which means that, in all member countries, after 31.3.13 driving on the right will be compulsory. I quote this reference, although it may be only a related page and not the one which confirms that the legislation is in place: http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/transport/road_transport/l24055b_en.htm
86.182.20.204 ( talk) 19:54, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Clicking on the image with blue and red results in going to File:Countries_driving_on_the_left_or_right.svg.
Red and blue there are swapped. Both the legend and the description say "drives on left" is red and "drives on right" is blue. It should be the other way around. It is probably best to eliminate any variations of the word "drive" altogether to avoid confusion with LHD and RHD. So use something like "traffic keeps to the left" for blue and "traffic keeps to the right" for red. 173.168.177.217 ( talk) 23:14, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
Near the end of last paragraph of Changing to right-hand traffic section, it states that "...Hence, island nations such as Britain and Japan (using ships to move troops around and having less need to move them overland) continued to use the natural system....". How come that left-hand traffic is the "natural system"—given that's what is meant here—and who decides? Or have I missed something in the article? Vidimian ( talk) 17:31, 13 May 2010 (UTC)
I can't find any info but I do know for sure that Dump trucks, construction vehicles such as excavators in Heavy equipment (construction) are all left hand drives. As in the driver is on the left hand side of the vehicle. Can someone who is a long time editor of this page find out more. I know in Australia and other right hand vehicle nations, these heavy equipment or construction vehicles are always left hand drive vehicles because the market is so big and over two thirds of the world drive on the right, it makes economic sense these vehicles are always have the steering column on the left Takamaxa ( talk) 15:14, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
Forgot to add, crane trucks or construction cranes are also left hand steering columns even in countries in left hand driving countries such as Austrlaia. Takamaxa ( talk) 15:15, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
This unsourced paragraph seems far-fetched at best. Is it a joke? HowardMorland ( talk) 04:04, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
In writing this encyclopædia, we are to describe the world as it is, not as any particular individual thinks it ought to be. Kincaid's alleged claim that nearside and offside are equestrian terms "commonly misunderstood" to apply to automobiles appears to be nothing more than his prescriptivist opinion. The whole of the Commonwealth English-speaking world disagrees with him; the terms are formally used as defined in the four dictionary links I've provided ( here, here, here, and here). See also here and here (the two links provided by the IP editor -- not as solid as dictionary defs for article refs) and this driving school page in the UK as well as this one, and this Australian academic research paper. Numerous additional examples are readily found; this is how the world is, ergo, this is how we need to describe it. We must all be careful to avoid the common trap of relying on one source exclusively; few published works are wholly without bias, and if you will spend some time reviewing the ongoing discussion of this article's development you will see Kincaid's book is somewhat controversial. The alleged equestrian origin of the terms "nearside" and "offside" is irrelevant to this article; whatever meanings those terms might have in the equestrian world are of no consequence to the world of vehicles and roadways which is the subject of this article. — Scheinwerfermann T· C18:56, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
For those of you who like looking at this stuff, here are some good videos of Okinawa in Japan switching from the right to the left on 30 July 1978 (known as 730, ナナサンマル).
Road work preparations, signs and markings, good coverage of driving.
More preparation stuff with an excellent split screen of the same junction the day before and after.
Some switch scenes, plus some mishaps and people going the wrong way! (skip to 4:43). The guy is a local famous boxer doing an advert. The last line he says when he does his hands up is like the official tag line of the whole 730 campaign: "Hito wa migi - kuruma wa hidari," which is: "People [drivers] are on the right - cars are on the left".
Haku8645 ( talk) 04:24, 21 October 2010 (UTC)
There seems to be a fairly persistent rumour on the web that Paris adopted a keep-right rule in 1794. A typical account is here. The appealing story is that aristocrats used to drive their carriages fast on the left hand side with peasants having to keep right. So at the revolution it all changed (though the teamsters' contribution is also given). Napoleon's contribution was then to spread this to the countries he conquered. Does anyone know of a good reference for this law?
At present the article has no good explanation of European practice. Chris55 ( talk) 12:33, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
GK tramrunner ( talk) 18:46, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Since Malta is now a EU member it is now common to find left hand drive vehicles also (tourists overland[citation needed] or else second hand imports from other EU countries with LHD vehicles).
Now I happen to live in Malta, but I have no idea where this comes from. Most cars will be second-hand and either imported from the UK or Japan - and both are RHD countries. Now this is something based on own observation, so not really encyclopedic material, but as far as I'm concerned, the above statement is demonstratively not true, and should be removed. SeverityOne ( talk) 20:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
This article's name should be changed to Driving side or driver's side of the road, the current title is very unappealing an ugly Thisbites ( talk) 10:07, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
While the current title is clumsy, "Driver's side" is disruptive and frequently inaccurate. Not all road users have such options. E.g. Pedestrians, bicycles, motorcycles, some commercial vehicles. Ephebi ( talk) 10:25, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
A motorcyclist is always on the driver's side dude. It really doesn't follow any wikipedia standard. It is not an encyclopedic term. Thisbites ( talk) 22:31, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 |
Don't worry but I think somebody got confused while usign LHD and RHD back and forth beetwen different countries, so for example, Spain is LHD or RHD? the part about Gibraltar made me get confused about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.226.204.140 ( talk) 03:16, 6 June 2009 (UTC)
Do we have any reliable evidence about the historic foundations of LHD/RHD are? I think the article could benefit from adding any info to this effect. On numerous occasions, I have heard that left hand driving has its roots in knights passing each other with the lances in their right hand. However, i have never been able to find any evidence of this. -- Matttwd ( talk) 23:01, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
-Please do excuse me for sounding a bit daft, but I'm not sure I understand the question. Isn't that what the entire article is about? In addition, I think the problems ascertaining the specific history are quite well-presented. Haku8645 ( talk) 23:41, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Under Safety factors it says "Research in 1969 by J. J. Leeming showed countries driving on the left have a lower collision rate than countries driving on the right. This research is questioned in Peter Kincaid's book on the rule of the road,[citation needed] but some countries that have switched to driving on the right, such as Sweden, have seen their long-term accident rates increase by more than any increase in traffic volume[citation needed]." The red part is totally made up, and the opposite is the truth. The number of accidents was cut in half from the first day of right hand driving, and has not increased substantually since then. Swedish right hand driver 83.255.35.43 ( talk) 20:03, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
If anyone else has found this already and beaten me to it, I'm sorry to be redundant. After a long night of trolling the internet for hours I finally came across the holy grail of Dagen H-related video. Here's the link.
It's from TV Sveriges. That link will take you to the live television coverage from 4.45am to 5.15am. There's yet another clip from 5.15-5.30 and further clips down the right-hand menu to different reports throughout Sweden at different intervals throughout the day. It chronicles the entire switch in immense detail, though be warned that the dialogue is entirely in Swedish (as is the website) so its main function is simply for those of us who draw immense excitement from watching these events transpire. The site also hosts (further down) the news bulletins for the various anniversaries right up to 1997. Again, if this has been posted before, I'm sorry, but for those of you who haven't seen this before, happy viewing. Haku8645 ( talk) 16:32, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
New link [1] Quiensabe ( talk) 17:48, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Quote: "Some also attempted to reverse the traditional meaning of traffic signals by having the red light mean "go" and the green light "stop"." I find this rather funny, yet I do not entirely interpret this as a form of extreme socialism. Although red may symbolize the Social Revolution, red is also the traditional colour of good fortune in China. For instance, today in China, where reports on the stock and financial markets are given, RED refers to growth and GREEN refers to decline. -- 李博杰 | — Talk contribs 11:23, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
Who says that north China drove on the right before 1946? Kincaid was cautious avout North China because his source (Hooper) could not be confirmed. We can confirm that South China drove on the left because of reports from Hong Kong after 1946 when they discussed changing. (The bus companies wanted to know what kind of buses to buy). Also I have seen file photos of Shanghai published in 1937 at the time fo the Japanese attacks showing cars parked on the left. (Qurterly Review, London) We know that North China was under Japanese occupation, at least Beijing and Manchuria. The Japanes drive on the left. To say that North China drove on the right befor 1946, is saying that not only did they have a different rule to south China, but that the Japanese military recognised local law! It may be that in Manchuria the Soviet forces changed the rule in 1945, but that is speculation. Can anyone find a contemporary source for what happened in Beijing on 1 January 1946, as that is the date given by Hopper? Noel Ellis —Preceding unsigned comment added by Noel Ellis ( talk • contribs) 04:34, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
A discussion has been started at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countries/Lists of countries which could affect the inclusion criteria and title of this and other lists of countries. Editors are invited to participate. Pfainuk talk 12:08, 17 December 2008 (UTC)
All these citation neededs that have been recently added... why?
I removed them from the worst paragraph (which was actually illegible) but don't have time to do it properly.
Seriously, count the references in a paragraph of a featured article and see that it is usually much less than 24. Then stop it. 137.205.74.230 ( talk) 22:52, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
I made the change here [2]. Firstly the Telegraph ref is dead. More importantly, from a quick look through sources each one appears to give a different reason. I presume the Telegraph ref really said it was because he was told by a soothsayer to move to the right. Another ref I saw said it's because he was afraid he was going to die by being hit while driving on the left after being told so by a soothsayer. Another says he dreamed something which he intepreted to mean he should move traffic to the right. All in all, it appears no one really knows why he made the order (not that surprising) and people are just applying the 'he's crazy' argument and coming up with random crazy reason. The best assessment is probably that no one knows why he ordered the change which I've changed it to supporter by a ref. Nil Einne ( talk) 16:42, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Why is it so totally imposssible to find out the date for the change in Burma? I mean, it was in as recently as 1970 and something must have been written about it in the international press.I have heard that Ne Win was obsessed with (among many other things) the number 9. Perhaps it was on the 9th of September at 9 o'clock or something like that. But I have no idea. There is nothing about it on the web. I have also tried to find it out in books and so on. -- Andhanq ( talk) 22:46, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
After an early statement on the page dismisses the theory that left-to-right changeovers as a result of Napoleon's conquests is most likely pure myth and legend, the "History" section includes the following gem:
"Other countries, for example France, adopted driving on the right as a result of Napoleonic occupation/control."
How would this schism be corrected? Is the Napoleonic assertion truly myth? If there's fact behind it, the earlier "Changing to Right-Hand Traffic" section needs to be corrected; if not, the History section should, or there needs to be clarification of the statements. Kirottu82 ( talk) 02:04, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
I am a historian and have always believed this supposed 'myth' to be fact: the armies of Napoleon marched on the right and so, as they conquered, enforced this rule on other nations. I suspect that the account of the USA driving on the right is a myth and more likely derives from the close association with France and anti-British sentiment of the period. ( Philo ( talk) 19:41, 22 February 2009 (UTC))
I think there is kinda a bias in this article that those who drive on the left are a bit mad. The article itself is good but I should like to remove this. A third of the world's motorists drive on the left.
I already removed (four countries in Europe) "continue to drive on the left". To say "continue to" is, in my view, not NPOV. It makes us sound like we are perverse not to drive on the right.
S. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SimonTrew ( talk • contribs) 15:16, 26 February 2009 (UTC)
Another point is that driving on the right is coloured green, while driving on the left is coloured red. Firstly, these colourings are rather unessecary. Secondly, if you must have them they could be culturlaly neutral colours like blue and yellow. 78.146.195.92 ( talk) 00:34, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Afaik Suriname is now connected to French Guyana for several years due to a new bridge over the Suriname (river) 88.159.74.100 ( talk) 15:11, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
There is a picture with this label next to the text, but I couldn't find anything about it in the text, nor did I find anything interesting in the picture. Could somebody clarify why is it there? It seems like some text relevant to that pic got deleted. King Klear ( talk) 16:08, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
The image shows a RHT/LHD car with the light quite clearly dipping down to the left (which makes more sense to me, so the light spreads across the entire road instead of off one side) but the text says "Headlamps for RH-traffic (LHD) countries have low beams that "dip to the right"," (off the road - so it does not dazzle oncoming drivers (who obviously have their heads at floor level) and so it reflects off road signs to make them more visible - but the distribution in the image seems to cover this). Is it the image that is wrong, or did someone get confused with the meaning of LHT,RHT,RHD and LHD, or am I missing something ? I addded the (LHD) and (RHD) clarifications but did not change the aforementioned yet in case I've got this wrong and someone fits their headlamps wrong cos of what Wikipedia says and they dazzle someone and someone DIES. Blatant breach of
WP:BOLD I know but I don't want this showing up in another whining minor news story condemning Wikipedia
☭
мдснєтє
тдлк
ЅТЦФФ 15:23, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 02:04, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I have nearly finished a huge edit done over a couple of days where I have tried to remove the redundancy and improve the consistency of saying RHT/LHD etc, since naturally they can be confusing. It may trample other edits of the last few days as I was working on it since 16 March. I have done my best not to let this happen but I see no way round it.
My aims are to:
It is at User:SimonTrew/Right-_and_left-hand_traffic. I should appreciate your views, or please edit it there (but please don't destroy it!). It's still not quite of the quality I think I can get it to but I think it is better than the current article without all of the redundancy etc.
One outstanding issue is I can't get the lists to sit in their proper places in the article. Any help there would be great.
Another is that I am not sure if there should be a separate section generally for pedestrians (and move some stuff out of individual countries' sections) and similarly for exceptions to the rules for LHT and RHT. I have marked many exceptions with a comment <!--exception-->
in case you think they should be split out somehow. The difficulty basically is whether to organise the article geographically or by use, vehicle type, etc.
SimonTrew ( talk) 01:23, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 19:50, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Countries have adopted one of two standards for traffic flow: ie. it either keeps to the left or ro the right. Countries are thus said to have
These terms are used throughout this article to prevent repetition and avoid misunderstanding— particularly because generally LHD = RHT and RHD = LHT. (If you drive on the left you sit on the right, and vice versa)
SimonTrew, please try to adhere to convention regarding talk page discussion format. We do not intersperse comments with existing text, we place our comments wholly below the existing text, otherwise the discussion quickly becomes impossible to follow, particularly for those not originally involved. I have consolidated your interspersed remarks without changing their content and placed them below the text to which you were replying. You may want to edit them slightly to make clear the referents of your comments.
No matter whether the subject matter is simple or complex, as editors we must strive for an article to be written in correct, clear, concise, precise, and accurate English. I'm sorry for the offence you seem to take at my pointing out errors, but they are errors; this is not a question of making the English "simple". Your English fluency may be good or it may be poor, but the writing in your proposed edit is demonstrably problematic. You asked for its evaluation; it is neither helpful nor appropriate for you now to be churlish when a frank and defensible evaluation is provided. I'm glad to read that you're happy to make improvements and I look forward to seeing whatever new proposal you may care to make. Please also give some thoughtful consideration to the attitude with which you seem to be approaching this project; it is not appropriate for you to consider users of Wikipedia "your readership".
I'm not sure I fully understand your objection to the article's structure — perhaps you'll clarify the problem you say you're having. Which specific parts of the article do you find disjoint, confusing, contradictory, or difficult to follow, and how so? Once any such issues are elucidated, you'll have a great deal of help in fixing the problems, rather than having to go it alone. This is a subject influenced by history, geography, industry, and politics, so it is not likely to fit neatly into an imposed constraint of discussion from only one of those factors without substantial loss of informative value.
I definitely agree with you that only information peculiar to particular nations ought to be in those nations' subheadings, while more generally applicable information ought to be consolidated under whatever which subheading best matches the content. That's certainly a good path for us to pursue the betterment of this article. — Scheinwerfermann T· C23:46, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
"Research in 1969 by J. J. Leeming showed countries driving on the LEFT have a LOWER collision rate than countries driving on the right. This research is questioned in Peter Kincaid's book on the rule of the road,[citation needed] BUT some countries that have switched to driving on the RIGHT, such as Sweden, have seen their long-term accident rates INCREASE by more than any increase in traffic volume."
well they would wouldn't they ? whats the need for that "but" in there ?? ☭ мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 15:35, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
мдснєтє тдлк ЅТЦФФ 19:48, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
There is a line about marine and aviation regulations, but the terms "Left Traffic" and "Right Traffic" are specific terms that refer to the path that loitering and landing aircraft fly when landing at an airport. Mstefaniak ( talk) 17:25, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
Why is the United States in the "drove on left, now drives on right" category? I'm fairly certain that driving on the left was never the law - certainly not at the national level. The U.S. should be dark red on that map. Funnyhat ( talk) 02:22, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
"None shares a physical border with a country that drives on the right and all were once part of the British Empire."
I think this should say something like:
All were once part of the British Empire and only the UK (Norther Ireland) and the Republic of Ireland share a physical border.
(This very point is made later in the subsection on Ireland)
-- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 08:33, 17 May 2009 (UTC)
Thanks - sorry to waste your time -- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 08:44, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
Shouldn't right-hand be in blue and left-hand in red? Hofska ( talk) 03:12, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
I think you will probably have a difficult time attaining consensus to make the change you propose; we likely will not change map colours just because one editor thinks it'd be prettier. — Scheinwerfermann T· C03:34, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
I thought Hofska was going to reply that red-for-left made sense because (mostly) these are remnants of the old British empire and on old school wall maps etc, the BE, Commonwealth & Dominions were shown in red... Not enough to justify the work involved, but this actually makes sense to me (an old-timer) :-) -- Sysyphus Jones ( talk) 09:54, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
There is a section which appears to say that the Republic of Ireland and the United Kingdom do not share a physical border although Northern Ireland is part of the UK. Surely this means that the UK and Rep. of Ireland share a border. Philstaff ( talk) 22:23, 4 June 2009 (UTC) 4th June 2009
We have several photos in this article which are not remarkable at all. They are photos of normal roads in India, Hong Kong, Pakistan and the United Kingdom. I don't think they add any value to the article and should therefore be removed. Photos should be of something unusual such as signs, borders and exceptions to the rule, not just showing normal roads in a particular country. NFH ( talk) 11:08, 13 June 2009 (UTC)
The "Give Way To The Right" is a rule that applies in specific circumstances, and is not a rule assumed in all cases where nothing else applies (although it is a common misconception). More to the point, it does not apply to merges of any sort. Merges where no lines delineate the roadway require that the "zip" principle be applied (the car with its nose behind must give way and fall in behind the car with its nose ahead). Merges where lines separate the lanes (and one lane thins to nothing) the motorist that has to cross broken lines must give way. "Give Way to the Right" only applies on intersections where no other signs or devices control the intersection, and the intersection is not considered 'terminating' (although not necessarily a T-intersection). 152.91.9.153 ( talk) 06:31, 17 June 2009 (UTC) 15/06/2009
Since Suriname was Dutch, and the Dutch never drove on the left-hand side of the road, why does Suriname do so?
Kochamanita ( talk) 06:23, 10 July 2009 (UTC)kochamanita
Hakluyt bean, in this edit you changed
Today, only four European countries drive on the left: Cyprus, Ireland, Malta and the United Kingdom.
to
Today, only four European countries drive on the left, although historically many others used to: Cyprus, Ireland, Malta and the United Kingdom.
I have reverted the change. It spoiled the clarity of the assertion (are Cyprus, Ireland, Malta, and the U.K. countries that drive on the left? Or countries that used to drive on the left?). What's more, it was quite redundant given the extensive coverage of switches in traffic-handedness country by country in the article as a whole. I saw no countervailing benefit your added text offered. What benefit do you feel this text, in this place, affords the article? — Scheinwerfermann T· C23:17, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
I don't know how they drive trams in Zagreb; but "on the old right-hand drive Zagreb trams, the driver sits on the left" is self-contradictory. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 18:44, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
No one who might know how Zagreb trams are driven has corrected this; so I have deleted it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 16:14, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Now a person has restored the offending statement who doesn't seem to understand the terminology used in the article: "Vehicles are manufactured in left-hand drive (LHD) and right-hand drive (RHD) configurations, referring to the placement of the driving seat and controls within the vehicle." In order for the statement to be correct, the long-armed Zagreb driver, who is said to sit on the left, would operate controls on the right side of the "right-hand drive" tram. I doubt that this is the case. Such an extraordinary claim should be supported, perhaps by a picture of the contortionist driver. Will the person who thinks that the statement should stand as it is please explain why? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.86.92.198 ( talk) 12:47, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
In Rome, Italy, I've seen Left-hand traffic for automobiles, motorcycles and bicyles on Ponte Umberto I. Don't know if that's notable... -- Scriberius ( talk) 10:27, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
'Today, UK motor vehicles are normally RHD, the main exceptions being service vehicles such as road sweepers and gritters where view of the kerb is more important than of the centre line. Unlike the US (see below) postal delivery vehicles and waste collection vehicles are not usually different from normal traffic, that is to say, they are RHD.'
I am a bit confused with the second sentence. It seems to contradict the first. If the US postal vehicles are not different from standard vehicles, wouldn't they be LHD? Sweetie candykim ( talk) 13:05, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
How come it's listed both as a jurisdiction with left and right hand driving?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.125.127.81 ( talk) 20:23, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
So that there's not some huge mad rush and wasted labour next week, I hereby volunteer to update the article (including maps and lists) to reflect Samoa's change at exactly 6am Samoa time, which for me in Dubai is 9pm on the 7th. I'll prepare both maps now and will set an alarm to remind me at exactly 9pm. Does anyone have any objections to this? Haku8645 ( talk) 17:42, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
Sounds good. Kevinmon ( talk) 16:54, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
CMBJ, I have reverted your unilateral, undiscussed move of this article. The present title is the result of a great deal of discussion and consensus-building, which is how article titles are decided for complex subjects such as this one. It is possible consensus might develop to support the title you appear to prefer, but I have some difficulty imagining it, for the term "bidirectional traffic" does not seem to be in actual use (see e.g. Google search); another thing we don't do here is prescriptively create the world—we describe it as it is. If you feel the present title is in error, please check the number and dial again (I mean please read through the talk page and its archives to understand how the present title came to be, then if you still feel the same, propose a new title here on the talk page). Thanks for editing coöperatively! — Scheinwerfermann T· C02:31, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
I am confused by the terminology in this article - specifically "left hand road" or "left hand driving," "left hand car" or "right driving car" and so on. Although they seem straightforward at first, they are confusing in context - I guess because a car with a driver on the left is actually driving on the right - we don't usually think about this, and it makes this article hard to read. Is there a way to clarify the terminology and make sure it's used consistently?
(or maybe I'm just dense) Dmz5 *Edits* *Talk* 04:45, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Is it true that left-hand traffic is supported by political Right, and right-hand traffic is supported by political Left?-- MathFacts ( talk) 10:23, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
What has motivated the 'modern' changes is generally avoidance of border conflicts. The article explains how few land borders remain where dirving side changes. Sussexonian ( talk) 15:24, 13 September 2009 (UTC)
One can tell this article has been mostly written by persons living in left driving countries. While it attempts to retain a level of uniformity with information about both sides of driving, most sections offer a very biased tone against right side driving, using negative wording to describe otherwise neutral maneuvers while the left side version uses mostly positive wording, this is probably not done intentionally, but is perhaps written by several authors who are left side biased and so have written the article in a way that promotes it despite the fact the statistics of the article itself show the right hand driving is the predominant form of driving in the world both in road mileage, number of nations, and population. Now, I'm not saying this is some conspiracy, I'm just pointing out the inline wording in the article that makes right hand driving sound inferior to left hand driving, one example I can give off the bat is the two sections titled "jurisdictions for right/left hand driving"; where as the left side paragraph discusses the reasons for why some countries drive left and points out how pacific islands use this method for uniformity with nearby influential nations, yet, the right side section discusses the problems and inconveniences with border crossings... while these "problems" can be just as equally blamed on left driving countries for not staying uniform with the majority of their neighbors, it is somehow made an issue on the "right hand jurisdiction" section as if it were entirely the fault of the right hand countries. This is the way the entire article comes off as, even going as far as hinting that things such as roundabouts and traffic patterns are inferior to to left side driving... regular users of this site should really look into getting together and rewording the bias out of this article. -- 76.255.84.85 ( talk) 16:06, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Regarding the question about the Philippines, it appears that Spain did not fully adopt drive on the right until after 1924 when Madrid changed. So some Spanish colonies drove on the left, such as Argentina, Uruguay and Paraguay until 1945-46. It may also have been that drive on the left was wide-spread in Asia, ie China, Japan, Indonesia etc. 122.57.37.199 ( talk) 08:47, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
There is much talk about "exceptions", places in in different countries where traffic is said to run on the opposite side. But, that is not really the case. It is merely two one-way streets very close to each other, just separeted by a concrete divider and not by a city block. It may look like the opposite system, but normal overtaking rules apply on each of the separeted lanes. -- Andhanq ( talk) 07:04, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
FYI. There is a discussion going on the Infobox Country template to remove the Drives on field currently listed. -- Phoenix ( talk) 10:45, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
Where do one-way streets fit in this statistic? Are they so rare in the world as a whole that they've been lost in the rounding error? -- Smjg ( talk) 16:14, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
Apparently, amidst all the hubbub regarding Samoa's switch back in September, all of us completely missed the story that gripped African headlines only weeks earlier - after a survey, most Rwandans came out in favour of switching to the left as well! I've added in a new section incorporating information from various African news articles (all in English) regarding the survey, the ministry that undertook it, the results and the reasons for the switch. As far as I know, it's still being deliberated and no official word has been given yet, but one article mentioned that it could take months, so I'm keeping my eyes peeled for the next bit of info that crops up.
Does anyone object to me including this information yet? If you think I've jumped the gun, then by all means correct me, but it does seem a very tantalising developing story with not a whole lot of opposition. By way of comparison, the story about Donnie Cassidy in Ireland proposing to switch to the right being pretty much immediately rejected doesn't deserve a mention, but this is actually straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak (the Minister of Infrastructure gave this interview to several newspapers). If it is worth keeping, could someone tidy up my referencing? I've referenced the same thing three times and it's created three separate entries, and I don't know how to consolidate them. Until the next time, all roads lead to Rome... Haku8645 ( talk) 23:11, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
could some put the reason that most countries drive on the right, if that information is available? 76.22.97.102 ( talk) 14:37, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
The article says that in countries with left-hand traffic, "on roads without a footpath pedestrians may be advised to walk on the right," and in countries with right-hand traffic, "on roads without a footpath pedestrians may be advised to walk on the left."
Does anyone know how common this rule is? While this advice is certainly given in some countries, I doubt that it is universal. A friend of mine was reprimanded in India (which drives on the left) when he walked on the right-hand side of the road.-- Oz1cz ( talk) 07:08, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
I have been there but it drives on the left just like Thailand.-- 125.25.20.80 ( talk) 18:52, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
There are four European Union member countries where driving on the left is the practice. There appears to be legislation which means that, in all member countries, after 31.3.13 driving on the right will be compulsory. I quote this reference, although it may be only a related page and not the one which confirms that the legislation is in place: http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/transport/road_transport/l24055b_en.htm
86.182.20.204 ( talk) 19:54, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Clicking on the image with blue and red results in going to File:Countries_driving_on_the_left_or_right.svg.
Red and blue there are swapped. Both the legend and the description say "drives on left" is red and "drives on right" is blue. It should be the other way around. It is probably best to eliminate any variations of the word "drive" altogether to avoid confusion with LHD and RHD. So use something like "traffic keeps to the left" for blue and "traffic keeps to the right" for red. 173.168.177.217 ( talk) 23:14, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
Near the end of last paragraph of Changing to right-hand traffic section, it states that "...Hence, island nations such as Britain and Japan (using ships to move troops around and having less need to move them overland) continued to use the natural system....". How come that left-hand traffic is the "natural system"—given that's what is meant here—and who decides? Or have I missed something in the article? Vidimian ( talk) 17:31, 13 May 2010 (UTC)
I can't find any info but I do know for sure that Dump trucks, construction vehicles such as excavators in Heavy equipment (construction) are all left hand drives. As in the driver is on the left hand side of the vehicle. Can someone who is a long time editor of this page find out more. I know in Australia and other right hand vehicle nations, these heavy equipment or construction vehicles are always left hand drive vehicles because the market is so big and over two thirds of the world drive on the right, it makes economic sense these vehicles are always have the steering column on the left Takamaxa ( talk) 15:14, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
Forgot to add, crane trucks or construction cranes are also left hand steering columns even in countries in left hand driving countries such as Austrlaia. Takamaxa ( talk) 15:15, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
This unsourced paragraph seems far-fetched at best. Is it a joke? HowardMorland ( talk) 04:04, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
In writing this encyclopædia, we are to describe the world as it is, not as any particular individual thinks it ought to be. Kincaid's alleged claim that nearside and offside are equestrian terms "commonly misunderstood" to apply to automobiles appears to be nothing more than his prescriptivist opinion. The whole of the Commonwealth English-speaking world disagrees with him; the terms are formally used as defined in the four dictionary links I've provided ( here, here, here, and here). See also here and here (the two links provided by the IP editor -- not as solid as dictionary defs for article refs) and this driving school page in the UK as well as this one, and this Australian academic research paper. Numerous additional examples are readily found; this is how the world is, ergo, this is how we need to describe it. We must all be careful to avoid the common trap of relying on one source exclusively; few published works are wholly without bias, and if you will spend some time reviewing the ongoing discussion of this article's development you will see Kincaid's book is somewhat controversial. The alleged equestrian origin of the terms "nearside" and "offside" is irrelevant to this article; whatever meanings those terms might have in the equestrian world are of no consequence to the world of vehicles and roadways which is the subject of this article. — Scheinwerfermann T· C18:56, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
For those of you who like looking at this stuff, here are some good videos of Okinawa in Japan switching from the right to the left on 30 July 1978 (known as 730, ナナサンマル).
Road work preparations, signs and markings, good coverage of driving.
More preparation stuff with an excellent split screen of the same junction the day before and after.
Some switch scenes, plus some mishaps and people going the wrong way! (skip to 4:43). The guy is a local famous boxer doing an advert. The last line he says when he does his hands up is like the official tag line of the whole 730 campaign: "Hito wa migi - kuruma wa hidari," which is: "People [drivers] are on the right - cars are on the left".
Haku8645 ( talk) 04:24, 21 October 2010 (UTC)
There seems to be a fairly persistent rumour on the web that Paris adopted a keep-right rule in 1794. A typical account is here. The appealing story is that aristocrats used to drive their carriages fast on the left hand side with peasants having to keep right. So at the revolution it all changed (though the teamsters' contribution is also given). Napoleon's contribution was then to spread this to the countries he conquered. Does anyone know of a good reference for this law?
At present the article has no good explanation of European practice. Chris55 ( talk) 12:33, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
GK tramrunner ( talk) 18:46, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Since Malta is now a EU member it is now common to find left hand drive vehicles also (tourists overland[citation needed] or else second hand imports from other EU countries with LHD vehicles).
Now I happen to live in Malta, but I have no idea where this comes from. Most cars will be second-hand and either imported from the UK or Japan - and both are RHD countries. Now this is something based on own observation, so not really encyclopedic material, but as far as I'm concerned, the above statement is demonstratively not true, and should be removed. SeverityOne ( talk) 20:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
This article's name should be changed to Driving side or driver's side of the road, the current title is very unappealing an ugly Thisbites ( talk) 10:07, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
While the current title is clumsy, "Driver's side" is disruptive and frequently inaccurate. Not all road users have such options. E.g. Pedestrians, bicycles, motorcycles, some commercial vehicles. Ephebi ( talk) 10:25, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
A motorcyclist is always on the driver's side dude. It really doesn't follow any wikipedia standard. It is not an encyclopedic term. Thisbites ( talk) 22:31, 5 February 2011 (UTC)