This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
The only prerequiste for being a student at MGS is money and or contacts. I could accept the word 'exclusive' but the criterion again is money. The 8.30am tram down StKilda road would dispel anyones thought of 'elitism' Eric A. Warbuton 01:35, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
Excuse me- if any one has been stalking its Mr Carr-he edited me -not the other way around. And further to the question under discussion-its not semantics- what a corrupted meaning of the word 'elite' you insist upon. You only need a certain amount of money to buy entry to the school-its actually quite moderate by international standards- if mere consumption can be termed 'elite' than words are rapidly eroding in meaning and being taken over by ad-land. Ill stick by its full meaning (from the OED)
The choice part or flower (of society, or of any body or class of persons). So Im reverting. Remember consumption (through the so called price differential is not and cannot be described by the word 'elite' Eric A. Warbuton 02:15, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
This is a typically stupid piece of Warbutian nitpicking. One of things that defines and creates an elite is its access to expensive private schools, which inculcate elite values and create elite solidarity among their graduates. In Victoria, Melbourne Grammar, Scotch College and Geelong Grammar were deliberately founded as elite schools and continue to perform that role. Adam 03:02, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
As I said before a trip down StKilda road on the tram at 815am would disabuse any one of the notion of 'elite'. Clearly ANYONE has access to such schools. They may claim to be 'elite' but their students dont appear to be, and take away their uniform and you cant tell the difference fgrom anyone else. If inculcate elite values and create elite solidarity is your new definition of 'elite' then are members of the 'Omar Bin El-Khattab Mosque' 'elite'? What about the South Upwey girls soccer club? Its news to me? By your defintion anything can be described as 'elite' the word has lost almost any useful meaning and has become dumb cliche-much like the pointlsee use of the word 'modern'. Eric A. Warbuton 03:20, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
I'm afraid I can't compete with arguments of this level of fatuosity. Adam 05:04, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
Looking at the page history, you fellas (and lady) are looking likely to run afoul of 3RR if you keep it up. Actually, Eric's already violated it, but that was a day and a half ago, so not worth worrying about. Perhaps in future – if'n you don't mind me poking my nose in – you should just find another admin to protect the page until things can be sorted out?
(By the way, what's wrong with "exclusive" as a compromise term?) -- fuddlemark ( fuddle me!) 15:19, 2 November 2005 (UTC)
Currently reads:
This seems reasonable to me. -- Tony Sidaway Talk 03:48, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Well its much better than 'elite' so Im content- but it begs the question (as I mentioned above) what does 'exclusive' really mean in this context? -MGS excludes people on the basis of price? Whats the point of mentioning that? Eric A. Warbuton 04:29, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
I hate to be difficult, but "exclusive" and "elite" mean two different things. An exclusive school is one that only admits certain categories of students - Melbourne High is an exclusive school, because it is academically selective. Yeshiva College is an exclusive school, because you have to be Jewish to go there. Grammar and Scotch are elite schools - they were founded for the explicit purpose of training an elite. They are exclusive only in the sense that they charge high fees. The point of an elite school is not what you are when you enter, but what you are when you leave - a member of the elite. Attendence at an elite school confers elite status, which is why the aspirationals pay the high fees. How the Grammar brats behave on the tram has nothing to do with it. Adam 05:16, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Yes what you say is true. Up to a point. Such schools claim to be 'elite' or produce an 'elite' but, in reality, I assert, they dont. Its only a subjective belief of theirs. I use my, albeit limited, observations of the last 30 years. I can also invite you to be at Camberwell Junction at say 830am on a weekday morning -a sobering experience. Such schools are demonstrably 'exclusive' but not objectively 'elite' to use the Carrite model.(Please see the OED defs.) Eric A. Warbuton 05:32, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Currently reads:
If with the overwhelming support of the Melbourne Community can't be referenced it should be removed.
Currently reads:
successful is either a subjective judgement here, or redundant since at this point it could only explicitly refer to success at the election.
Currently reads:
Each of these three sentences make claims about the success of economic policies, either economically or electorally. Given the contentious nature of political claims about economic management, these should be referenced to demonstrate their objectivity, or at least qualified by whose opinion it is, or removed.
Seeing as how he is likely to be the next Premier of Victoria, this article is going to be in need of a good, politically neutral portrait of Mr Brumby. This should be put on the to do list of this article. Doktor Waterhouse 05:15, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
It's surprising how few references there are for the John Brumby article. Considering he's been in the public spotlight for many years. Really, all content added to this article should be clearly referenced. Thanks, Lester 22:22, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
Some of the biggest achievements of John Brumby and his predecessor Steve Bracks would have to be a huge waste of public funds. Some of the "success" stories would have to be the woeful state of Victoria's traffic network. Public Transport network has suffered delays and unbelievably high expenses just to implement the new ticketing system, so called Myki. [1] Some of the other achievements of John Brumby and former Premier Bracks would have to be the fact that around 10% of total number of Victorian drivers have lost their licences due to huge pressure from the Victorian government to issue speeding fines for even the minor speed limit transgressions. This means that Victoria Police and hundreds of hidden revenue raising cameras issue speeding tickets for speeding below the +10% ADR defined speedometer accuracy limits. This greedy money grab by the Brumby state government ensures that the Victorian State Government expects the speeding ticket revenue to amount to a massive AUD$1500 million over the next 2 years. [2] [3] ] John Brumby and his Ministers have also implemented a so called tough new so called "anti-hoon" laws. [4] This is a politically driven decision to appease hundreds of worried citizens that have noticed that Brumby and the Victorian state governemnt has not done a thing to improve the roads around the state.
'Why should a biography only reflect the rosy side of John Brumby's actions. If you read a biography of Hitler I'm pretty sure you would not just see him portraid as a funny, beer drinking german that loved walking his dogs through the bavarian countryside. This biography is a joke since some actions that John Brumby has authorised impact millions of people, and they need to be stated. Some more recent ones would have to be dredging, 2AM lockouts, awful state of the state's traffic network caused by the Brumby and Bracks inaction for almost 10 years. Should I continue, talking about water desal that will cost all Victorians billions of dollars, and that will be built by a foreign company, and run by foreign company. These things need to be clearly stated in the bio or otherwise this is just a crap of politically convenient truths, and the rest is all swept under the carpet.' —Preceding unsigned comment added by Blackspurboys ( talk • contribs)
References
All of the dates in this article should be formatted either according to user preferences or in the Australian style (day, then month), not the American style. - Richard Cavell ( talk) 11:32, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
I believe we're the victim of shoddy, unprofessional, amateurish, ignorant journalism. Baillieu went to Government House last night, but was NOT officially sworn in as Premier, despite what the SMH might say. He was invited to form a government, that's all. This morning's (30 November) The Age makes no mention of any swearing-in last night. The main article starts out "Victoria's next Premier, Ted Baillieu, ... The Coalition cabinet ... will be sworn in within days". Neither is there anything on the Governor of Victoria's website about any swearing in of Baillieu on 29 November. Brumby remains Premier until his commission is withdrawn by the Governor. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 20:37, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 06:21, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 07:41, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 08:12, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
The only prerequiste for being a student at MGS is money and or contacts. I could accept the word 'exclusive' but the criterion again is money. The 8.30am tram down StKilda road would dispel anyones thought of 'elitism' Eric A. Warbuton 01:35, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
Excuse me- if any one has been stalking its Mr Carr-he edited me -not the other way around. And further to the question under discussion-its not semantics- what a corrupted meaning of the word 'elite' you insist upon. You only need a certain amount of money to buy entry to the school-its actually quite moderate by international standards- if mere consumption can be termed 'elite' than words are rapidly eroding in meaning and being taken over by ad-land. Ill stick by its full meaning (from the OED)
The choice part or flower (of society, or of any body or class of persons). So Im reverting. Remember consumption (through the so called price differential is not and cannot be described by the word 'elite' Eric A. Warbuton 02:15, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
This is a typically stupid piece of Warbutian nitpicking. One of things that defines and creates an elite is its access to expensive private schools, which inculcate elite values and create elite solidarity among their graduates. In Victoria, Melbourne Grammar, Scotch College and Geelong Grammar were deliberately founded as elite schools and continue to perform that role. Adam 03:02, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
As I said before a trip down StKilda road on the tram at 815am would disabuse any one of the notion of 'elite'. Clearly ANYONE has access to such schools. They may claim to be 'elite' but their students dont appear to be, and take away their uniform and you cant tell the difference fgrom anyone else. If inculcate elite values and create elite solidarity is your new definition of 'elite' then are members of the 'Omar Bin El-Khattab Mosque' 'elite'? What about the South Upwey girls soccer club? Its news to me? By your defintion anything can be described as 'elite' the word has lost almost any useful meaning and has become dumb cliche-much like the pointlsee use of the word 'modern'. Eric A. Warbuton 03:20, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
I'm afraid I can't compete with arguments of this level of fatuosity. Adam 05:04, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
Looking at the page history, you fellas (and lady) are looking likely to run afoul of 3RR if you keep it up. Actually, Eric's already violated it, but that was a day and a half ago, so not worth worrying about. Perhaps in future – if'n you don't mind me poking my nose in – you should just find another admin to protect the page until things can be sorted out?
(By the way, what's wrong with "exclusive" as a compromise term?) -- fuddlemark ( fuddle me!) 15:19, 2 November 2005 (UTC)
Currently reads:
This seems reasonable to me. -- Tony Sidaway Talk 03:48, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Well its much better than 'elite' so Im content- but it begs the question (as I mentioned above) what does 'exclusive' really mean in this context? -MGS excludes people on the basis of price? Whats the point of mentioning that? Eric A. Warbuton 04:29, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
I hate to be difficult, but "exclusive" and "elite" mean two different things. An exclusive school is one that only admits certain categories of students - Melbourne High is an exclusive school, because it is academically selective. Yeshiva College is an exclusive school, because you have to be Jewish to go there. Grammar and Scotch are elite schools - they were founded for the explicit purpose of training an elite. They are exclusive only in the sense that they charge high fees. The point of an elite school is not what you are when you enter, but what you are when you leave - a member of the elite. Attendence at an elite school confers elite status, which is why the aspirationals pay the high fees. How the Grammar brats behave on the tram has nothing to do with it. Adam 05:16, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Yes what you say is true. Up to a point. Such schools claim to be 'elite' or produce an 'elite' but, in reality, I assert, they dont. Its only a subjective belief of theirs. I use my, albeit limited, observations of the last 30 years. I can also invite you to be at Camberwell Junction at say 830am on a weekday morning -a sobering experience. Such schools are demonstrably 'exclusive' but not objectively 'elite' to use the Carrite model.(Please see the OED defs.) Eric A. Warbuton 05:32, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Currently reads:
If with the overwhelming support of the Melbourne Community can't be referenced it should be removed.
Currently reads:
successful is either a subjective judgement here, or redundant since at this point it could only explicitly refer to success at the election.
Currently reads:
Each of these three sentences make claims about the success of economic policies, either economically or electorally. Given the contentious nature of political claims about economic management, these should be referenced to demonstrate their objectivity, or at least qualified by whose opinion it is, or removed.
Seeing as how he is likely to be the next Premier of Victoria, this article is going to be in need of a good, politically neutral portrait of Mr Brumby. This should be put on the to do list of this article. Doktor Waterhouse 05:15, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
It's surprising how few references there are for the John Brumby article. Considering he's been in the public spotlight for many years. Really, all content added to this article should be clearly referenced. Thanks, Lester 22:22, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
Some of the biggest achievements of John Brumby and his predecessor Steve Bracks would have to be a huge waste of public funds. Some of the "success" stories would have to be the woeful state of Victoria's traffic network. Public Transport network has suffered delays and unbelievably high expenses just to implement the new ticketing system, so called Myki. [1] Some of the other achievements of John Brumby and former Premier Bracks would have to be the fact that around 10% of total number of Victorian drivers have lost their licences due to huge pressure from the Victorian government to issue speeding fines for even the minor speed limit transgressions. This means that Victoria Police and hundreds of hidden revenue raising cameras issue speeding tickets for speeding below the +10% ADR defined speedometer accuracy limits. This greedy money grab by the Brumby state government ensures that the Victorian State Government expects the speeding ticket revenue to amount to a massive AUD$1500 million over the next 2 years. [2] [3] ] John Brumby and his Ministers have also implemented a so called tough new so called "anti-hoon" laws. [4] This is a politically driven decision to appease hundreds of worried citizens that have noticed that Brumby and the Victorian state governemnt has not done a thing to improve the roads around the state.
'Why should a biography only reflect the rosy side of John Brumby's actions. If you read a biography of Hitler I'm pretty sure you would not just see him portraid as a funny, beer drinking german that loved walking his dogs through the bavarian countryside. This biography is a joke since some actions that John Brumby has authorised impact millions of people, and they need to be stated. Some more recent ones would have to be dredging, 2AM lockouts, awful state of the state's traffic network caused by the Brumby and Bracks inaction for almost 10 years. Should I continue, talking about water desal that will cost all Victorians billions of dollars, and that will be built by a foreign company, and run by foreign company. These things need to be clearly stated in the bio or otherwise this is just a crap of politically convenient truths, and the rest is all swept under the carpet.' —Preceding unsigned comment added by Blackspurboys ( talk • contribs)
References
All of the dates in this article should be formatted either according to user preferences or in the Australian style (day, then month), not the American style. - Richard Cavell ( talk) 11:32, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
I believe we're the victim of shoddy, unprofessional, amateurish, ignorant journalism. Baillieu went to Government House last night, but was NOT officially sworn in as Premier, despite what the SMH might say. He was invited to form a government, that's all. This morning's (30 November) The Age makes no mention of any swearing-in last night. The main article starts out "Victoria's next Premier, Ted Baillieu, ... The Coalition cabinet ... will be sworn in within days". Neither is there anything on the Governor of Victoria's website about any swearing in of Baillieu on 29 November. Brumby remains Premier until his commission is withdrawn by the Governor. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 20:37, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 06:21, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 07:41, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on John Brumby. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 08:12, 2 January 2018 (UTC)