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I have assessed this article as meeting the B class criteria, although I suggest that it might be able to go higher. It seems like it could be at least a GA if someone (a significant contributor perhaps?) were willing to nominate and then go through the review process. One improvement I'd suggest, although it is only cosmetic, is to consolidate some of the footnotes using the WP:NAMEDREFS system. AustralianRupert ( talk) 00:14, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
In section Alliance of Francis and Suleiman the it is claimed that "...However, the Ottomans would continue their campaigns in Central Europe, and besiege the Habsburg capital in the 1529 Siege of Vienna, and again in 1532..." A little correction; there was no siege of Vienna in 1532. (The second siege was 151 years later) Nedim Ardoğa ( talk) 14:12, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
In section Alliance of Francis and Suleiman the it is claimed that "...However, the Ottomans would continue their campaigns in Central Europe, and besiege the Habsburg capital in the 1529 Siege of Vienna, and again in 1532..." A little correction; there was no siege of Vienna in 1532. (The second siege was 151 years later) Nedim Ardoğa ( talk) 14:12, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
"Although the French accompanied most of the campaigns of Barbarossa, they rarely participated to the depredations made by the Turks, and were often horrified by the violence of these encounters, in which Christians were slaughtered or taken as captives."
I do not want to sound like an overly patriotic Turk, but I do not think that this sentence fits to the scientific tone of the rest of the article. It could be deleted or some references should be added if preferred to be kept. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.237.140.112 ( talk) 09:31, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
I already deleted some, but this article still got too many images. Can anybody see which images are really needful? Jeff5102 ( talk) 09:09, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
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I'm thinking of nominating this for GA - but I've been entirely uninvolved in its preparation. Any comments from the regular editors about a possible GA nomination? Seraphim System ( talk) 10:02, 29 May 2017 (UTC)
There must be a mistake in this line. Either it was sent to Henry IV or it didn't happen in 1607, because Louis XIII did not become king until 1610. 2602:306:CFEA:170:A8DD:8229:84C0:2CDE ( talk) 01:27, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
The article contains a truly asinine claim that could only have been made by someone profoundly ignorant of mediaeval history, to wit “The [Franco-Ottoman] alliance was exceptional, as the first non-ideological alliance in effect between a Christian and Muslim state, and caused a scandal in the Christian world.” I propose changing it to: “Although there had previously been hundreds of alliances during the Middle Ages between various Christian states on the one hand and Muslim states on the other in such varied settings as the Iberian peninsula, the Levant during the Crusades, Sicily and elsewhere, this was the first alliance between a Christian great power and a Mohammedan great power ever since the alliance against the eastern Roman Empire between the Carolingian empire and the Abbasid caliphate in the 8th century.”
Grounds: Some examples of alliances and other agreerments between Christian and Mohammedan rulers
The reconquista was not a religious war. Moorish and Christian princes were often allies, or one was the vassal of the other. Until the 12th century, in Portugal, and largely also in Spain, struggles between Christians and Muslims were seen as local quarrels. Only afterward were they reinterpreted as a fundamental confrontation between opposing beliefs. Source: Writing the Reconquest: The Crafting of Historical Memory in Twelfth-Century Portugal Stephen Lay, 2010
King Alfonso VI of Leon would declare war on Muslim states or make treaties with them depending on pragmatic political considerations. The author of the Vita Geraldi describes a world in which mutually beneficial agreements between local nobles and their Muslim peers were common. Source: Writing the Reconquest: The Crafting of Historical Memory in Twelfth-Century Portugal Stephen Lay, 2010
“At the beginning of the eleventh century Portuguese society was, in common with the neighbouring Spanish kingdoms, characterised by a fluidity in political, social and cultural forms. Identity tended to be constructed on local foundations and as a result there was an unusual degree of tolerance toward religious and cultural differences. By the end of the eleventh century, however, this pragmatic tolerance had been challenged by a growing engagement with the Latin Christian culture of Europe.” Source: Interview with Stephen Lay https://www.medievalists.net/2009/11/interview-with-stephen-lay/ In 1187 the Holy Roman Emperor Frederick Barbarossa resolved to recapture Jerusalem from Saladin, en enterprise that became known as the Third Crusade. For this purpose he dispatched Godfrey of Wiesenbach to the [Mohammedan] Seljuk sultanate of Rûm to negotiate the passage of his army through their lands on the way to Jerusalem. “Because Frederick had signed a treaty of friendship with Saladin in 1175, he felt it necessary to give Saladin notice of the termination of their alliance. On 26 May 1188, he sent Count Henry II of Dietz to present an ultimatum to Saladin. The sultan was ordered to withdraw from the lands he had conquered, to return the True Cross to the Church of the Holy Sepulchre and to make satisfaction for those Christians who had been killed in his conquests, otherwise Frederick would abrogate their treaty.” Source: Third Crusade, Wikipedia /info/en/?search=Third_Crusade In 1139 Mu'in al-Din Unur, the mamluk ("slave soldier") of the Seljuq prince of Mosul, Imad al-Din Zengi, seized Damascus, prompting Zengi—with Safwat al-Mulk's backing—to lay siege against Damascus the same year. In response, Damascus allied with the Crusader Kingdom of Jerusalem to resist Zengi's forces. /info/en/?search=Damascus#Seljuq_and_Ayyubid_periods
On 2 September 1192 King Richard I of England and Saladin finalized the Treaty of Jaffa, which recognised Muslim control over Jerusalem but allowed unarmed Christian pilgrims and merchants to visit the city. In 1226, the Ayyubid sultan of Egypt al-Kamil began exploring peace with the West, dispatching the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to meet Frederick II Barbarossa … By May 1227, al-Kamil was concerned for his sultanate, feeling increasingly boxed in. The arrival of the Crusaders began, and he was again considering his offer of Jerusalem made to Frederick II in 1226, that appearing to him as the only viable option. As described above, the sultan al-Kamil was in a desperate civil conflict in 1226. Having unsuccessfully tried negotiations with the West beginning in 1219, he again tried this approach. The sultan sent the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to Frederick asking him to come to Acre for discussions, offering return of much of the Holy Land to Christian control in exchange for military support against his brother al-Mu'azzam at Damascus. Fakhr ad-Din reportedly was somewhat amazed when he reached Palermo and discovered that Frederick spoke Arabic, had admiration for Muslim society and contempt for Rome.[37] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
Frederick realised that his only hope of success in the Holy Land was to negotiate for the return of Jerusalem as he lacked the manpower to engage in battle. He sent Thomas of Aquino and Balian of Sidon to inform the sultan of his arrival in the Holy Land. Al-Kamil was friendly but non-committal. In reply, Frederick received the ambassadors of the sultan, including Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh, at the Hospitaller camp at Recordane, near Acre. The sultan relocated from Nablus to Hiribya, northeast of Gaza, and Thomas and Balian were sent to resume negotiations.[55] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
On 2 September 1192 King Richard I of England and Saladin finalized the Treaty of Jaffa, which recognised Muslim control over Jerusalem but allowed unarmed Christian pilgrims and merchants to visit the city.
In 1226, the Ayyubid sultan of Egypt al-Kamil began exploring peace with the West, dispatching the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to meet Frederick II Barbarossa … By May 1227, al-Kamil was concerned for his sultanate, feeling increasingly boxed in. The arrival of the Crusaders began, and he was again considering his offer of Jerusalem made to Frederick II in 1226, that appearing to him as the only viable option. As described above, the sultan al-Kamil was in a desperate civil conflict in 1226. Having unsuccessfully tried negotiations with the West beginning in 1219, he again tried this approach. The sultan sent the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to Frederick asking him to come to Acre for discussions, offering return of much of the Holy Land to Christian control in exchange for military support against his brother al-Mu'azzam at Damascus. Fakhr ad-Din reportedly was somewhat amazed when he reached Palermo and discovered that Frederick spoke Arabic, had admiration for Muslim society and contempt for Rome.[37] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
In January 1229 ... al-Kamil was occupied with a siege in Damascus against his nephew an-Nasir Dā’ūd. He then agreed to cede Jerusalem to the Franks, along with a narrow corridor to the coast. .... The treaty was concluded on 18 February 1229, and also involved a ten-year truce. The English bishops Peter des Roches and William Briwere were witness to the signing. No complete copy of the treaty has survived, either in Latin nor Arabic. In it, al-Kamil surrendered Jerusalem with the exception of some Muslim holy sites. Frederick also received Bethlehem and Nazareth, part of Sidon district, and Jaffa and Toron, dominating the coast. Other lordships may have been returned to Christian control, but sources disagree. It was, however, a treaty of compromise. The Muslims retained control over the Temple Mount area of Jerusalem, the Jami Al-Aqsa, and the Dome of the Rock. The Transjordan castles stayed in Ayyubid hands. Whether Frederick was permitted to restore Jerusalem's fortifications was unclear, although the Crusaders did in fact restore Jerusalem's defensive walls.[59] ... The agreement, known sometimes as the Treaty of Jaffa,[60] also included the agreement signed by the different Ayyubid rulers at Tell Ajul near Gaza, of which, from al-Kamil's perspective, the treaty with Frederick was just an extension,[61] which allows this agreement to be also called the Treaty of Jaffa and Tell Ajul.[62] Frederick seems to have pledged his support to the sultan against all enemies, including Christian ones. The other Crusader states––Principality of Antioch and County of Tripoli––would receive no support in the event of war with the Muslims. /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade Banderswipe ( talk) 13:45, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
A fact from Franco-Ottoman alliance appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 8 April 2009 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
|
I have assessed this article as meeting the B class criteria, although I suggest that it might be able to go higher. It seems like it could be at least a GA if someone (a significant contributor perhaps?) were willing to nominate and then go through the review process. One improvement I'd suggest, although it is only cosmetic, is to consolidate some of the footnotes using the WP:NAMEDREFS system. AustralianRupert ( talk) 00:14, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
In section Alliance of Francis and Suleiman the it is claimed that "...However, the Ottomans would continue their campaigns in Central Europe, and besiege the Habsburg capital in the 1529 Siege of Vienna, and again in 1532..." A little correction; there was no siege of Vienna in 1532. (The second siege was 151 years later) Nedim Ardoğa ( talk) 14:12, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
In section Alliance of Francis and Suleiman the it is claimed that "...However, the Ottomans would continue their campaigns in Central Europe, and besiege the Habsburg capital in the 1529 Siege of Vienna, and again in 1532..." A little correction; there was no siege of Vienna in 1532. (The second siege was 151 years later) Nedim Ardoğa ( talk) 14:12, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
"Although the French accompanied most of the campaigns of Barbarossa, they rarely participated to the depredations made by the Turks, and were often horrified by the violence of these encounters, in which Christians were slaughtered or taken as captives."
I do not want to sound like an overly patriotic Turk, but I do not think that this sentence fits to the scientific tone of the rest of the article. It could be deleted or some references should be added if preferred to be kept. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.237.140.112 ( talk) 09:31, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
I already deleted some, but this article still got too many images. Can anybody see which images are really needful? Jeff5102 ( talk) 09:09, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Franco-Ottoman alliance. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 06:58, 4 January 2017 (UTC)
I'm thinking of nominating this for GA - but I've been entirely uninvolved in its preparation. Any comments from the regular editors about a possible GA nomination? Seraphim System ( talk) 10:02, 29 May 2017 (UTC)
There must be a mistake in this line. Either it was sent to Henry IV or it didn't happen in 1607, because Louis XIII did not become king until 1610. 2602:306:CFEA:170:A8DD:8229:84C0:2CDE ( talk) 01:27, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
The article contains a truly asinine claim that could only have been made by someone profoundly ignorant of mediaeval history, to wit “The [Franco-Ottoman] alliance was exceptional, as the first non-ideological alliance in effect between a Christian and Muslim state, and caused a scandal in the Christian world.” I propose changing it to: “Although there had previously been hundreds of alliances during the Middle Ages between various Christian states on the one hand and Muslim states on the other in such varied settings as the Iberian peninsula, the Levant during the Crusades, Sicily and elsewhere, this was the first alliance between a Christian great power and a Mohammedan great power ever since the alliance against the eastern Roman Empire between the Carolingian empire and the Abbasid caliphate in the 8th century.”
Grounds: Some examples of alliances and other agreerments between Christian and Mohammedan rulers
The reconquista was not a religious war. Moorish and Christian princes were often allies, or one was the vassal of the other. Until the 12th century, in Portugal, and largely also in Spain, struggles between Christians and Muslims were seen as local quarrels. Only afterward were they reinterpreted as a fundamental confrontation between opposing beliefs. Source: Writing the Reconquest: The Crafting of Historical Memory in Twelfth-Century Portugal Stephen Lay, 2010
King Alfonso VI of Leon would declare war on Muslim states or make treaties with them depending on pragmatic political considerations. The author of the Vita Geraldi describes a world in which mutually beneficial agreements between local nobles and their Muslim peers were common. Source: Writing the Reconquest: The Crafting of Historical Memory in Twelfth-Century Portugal Stephen Lay, 2010
“At the beginning of the eleventh century Portuguese society was, in common with the neighbouring Spanish kingdoms, characterised by a fluidity in political, social and cultural forms. Identity tended to be constructed on local foundations and as a result there was an unusual degree of tolerance toward religious and cultural differences. By the end of the eleventh century, however, this pragmatic tolerance had been challenged by a growing engagement with the Latin Christian culture of Europe.” Source: Interview with Stephen Lay https://www.medievalists.net/2009/11/interview-with-stephen-lay/ In 1187 the Holy Roman Emperor Frederick Barbarossa resolved to recapture Jerusalem from Saladin, en enterprise that became known as the Third Crusade. For this purpose he dispatched Godfrey of Wiesenbach to the [Mohammedan] Seljuk sultanate of Rûm to negotiate the passage of his army through their lands on the way to Jerusalem. “Because Frederick had signed a treaty of friendship with Saladin in 1175, he felt it necessary to give Saladin notice of the termination of their alliance. On 26 May 1188, he sent Count Henry II of Dietz to present an ultimatum to Saladin. The sultan was ordered to withdraw from the lands he had conquered, to return the True Cross to the Church of the Holy Sepulchre and to make satisfaction for those Christians who had been killed in his conquests, otherwise Frederick would abrogate their treaty.” Source: Third Crusade, Wikipedia /info/en/?search=Third_Crusade In 1139 Mu'in al-Din Unur, the mamluk ("slave soldier") of the Seljuq prince of Mosul, Imad al-Din Zengi, seized Damascus, prompting Zengi—with Safwat al-Mulk's backing—to lay siege against Damascus the same year. In response, Damascus allied with the Crusader Kingdom of Jerusalem to resist Zengi's forces. /info/en/?search=Damascus#Seljuq_and_Ayyubid_periods
On 2 September 1192 King Richard I of England and Saladin finalized the Treaty of Jaffa, which recognised Muslim control over Jerusalem but allowed unarmed Christian pilgrims and merchants to visit the city. In 1226, the Ayyubid sultan of Egypt al-Kamil began exploring peace with the West, dispatching the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to meet Frederick II Barbarossa … By May 1227, al-Kamil was concerned for his sultanate, feeling increasingly boxed in. The arrival of the Crusaders began, and he was again considering his offer of Jerusalem made to Frederick II in 1226, that appearing to him as the only viable option. As described above, the sultan al-Kamil was in a desperate civil conflict in 1226. Having unsuccessfully tried negotiations with the West beginning in 1219, he again tried this approach. The sultan sent the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to Frederick asking him to come to Acre for discussions, offering return of much of the Holy Land to Christian control in exchange for military support against his brother al-Mu'azzam at Damascus. Fakhr ad-Din reportedly was somewhat amazed when he reached Palermo and discovered that Frederick spoke Arabic, had admiration for Muslim society and contempt for Rome.[37] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
Frederick realised that his only hope of success in the Holy Land was to negotiate for the return of Jerusalem as he lacked the manpower to engage in battle. He sent Thomas of Aquino and Balian of Sidon to inform the sultan of his arrival in the Holy Land. Al-Kamil was friendly but non-committal. In reply, Frederick received the ambassadors of the sultan, including Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh, at the Hospitaller camp at Recordane, near Acre. The sultan relocated from Nablus to Hiribya, northeast of Gaza, and Thomas and Balian were sent to resume negotiations.[55] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
On 2 September 1192 King Richard I of England and Saladin finalized the Treaty of Jaffa, which recognised Muslim control over Jerusalem but allowed unarmed Christian pilgrims and merchants to visit the city.
In 1226, the Ayyubid sultan of Egypt al-Kamil began exploring peace with the West, dispatching the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to meet Frederick II Barbarossa … By May 1227, al-Kamil was concerned for his sultanate, feeling increasingly boxed in. The arrival of the Crusaders began, and he was again considering his offer of Jerusalem made to Frederick II in 1226, that appearing to him as the only viable option. As described above, the sultan al-Kamil was in a desperate civil conflict in 1226. Having unsuccessfully tried negotiations with the West beginning in 1219, he again tried this approach. The sultan sent the emir Fakhr ad-Din ibn as-Shaikh to Frederick asking him to come to Acre for discussions, offering return of much of the Holy Land to Christian control in exchange for military support against his brother al-Mu'azzam at Damascus. Fakhr ad-Din reportedly was somewhat amazed when he reached Palermo and discovered that Frederick spoke Arabic, had admiration for Muslim society and contempt for Rome.[37] /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade
In January 1229 ... al-Kamil was occupied with a siege in Damascus against his nephew an-Nasir Dā’ūd. He then agreed to cede Jerusalem to the Franks, along with a narrow corridor to the coast. .... The treaty was concluded on 18 February 1229, and also involved a ten-year truce. The English bishops Peter des Roches and William Briwere were witness to the signing. No complete copy of the treaty has survived, either in Latin nor Arabic. In it, al-Kamil surrendered Jerusalem with the exception of some Muslim holy sites. Frederick also received Bethlehem and Nazareth, part of Sidon district, and Jaffa and Toron, dominating the coast. Other lordships may have been returned to Christian control, but sources disagree. It was, however, a treaty of compromise. The Muslims retained control over the Temple Mount area of Jerusalem, the Jami Al-Aqsa, and the Dome of the Rock. The Transjordan castles stayed in Ayyubid hands. Whether Frederick was permitted to restore Jerusalem's fortifications was unclear, although the Crusaders did in fact restore Jerusalem's defensive walls.[59] ... The agreement, known sometimes as the Treaty of Jaffa,[60] also included the agreement signed by the different Ayyubid rulers at Tell Ajul near Gaza, of which, from al-Kamil's perspective, the treaty with Frederick was just an extension,[61] which allows this agreement to be also called the Treaty of Jaffa and Tell Ajul.[62] Frederick seems to have pledged his support to the sultan against all enemies, including Christian ones. The other Crusader states––Principality of Antioch and County of Tripoli––would receive no support in the event of war with the Muslims. /info/en/?search=Sixth_Crusade Banderswipe ( talk) 13:45, 31 August 2022 (UTC)