This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Epic of Gilgamesh article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 180 days |
This article was the subject of an educational assignment in Spring 2015. Further details are available on the course page. |
This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
This article was on the Article Collaboration and Improvement Drive for the week of June 25, 2006. |
This
level-4 vital article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
Hi guys. I just want someone to verify all of my recent cleanups starting here, out of being cautious. Specifically, there are apparently some redundant instances of what might be the same reference.
In an inline citation: <ref name="Epic, AG trans">{{cite book | title= The Epic of Gilgamesh: the Babylonian Epic Poem and Other Texts in Akkadian and Sumerian |first=Andrew R. |last= George |date=2003 |origyear=1999, 2000 |edition= Third |location= London |publisher= Penguin Books |series= Penguin Classics |oclc=901129328 |isbn=0-14-044919-1 |url= https://books.google.com/books?id=eCZRK_61adMC&printsec=frontcover |accessdate= October 8, 2017}}</ref> worldcat
In the bibliography section: {{cite book |last=George | first=Andrew R. | editor-first1=Andrew R. | editor-last1=George | others=translated by Andrew R. George |date=2000 |title=The Epic of Gilgamesh; The Babylonian Epic Poem and Other Texts in Akkadian and Sumerian. |publisher=Penguin |location=England |isbn=0-14-044721-0}} worldcat
Are those two the same book? They have different ISBNs but the same title and author. I think it obviously is a reprint, but please verify as per the given Worldcat links. I think I also consolidated a third instance.
Please check that "Mesopotamia: The Good Life" is the name of a chapter, because I don't know what it is.
Is the book called "The Bible in the British Museum" actually this one listed here and here? I don't see one from 1988, as the original citation in this article states.
In The great wild bull is lying down, is the character's name supposed to be spelled "Bilgames"? I googled it, and I see different versions that say "Bilgamesh" with an "h" so I wondered if that's just an issue of consistancy. I don't know, because I'm not a scholar but a general editor.
We have variously formatted mentions of Standard Akkadian version, "standard version", "The standard Akkadian version". That's not actually a title, right? It's just a typical prose-based reference to a title. So it shouldn't be italicized?
Should this article utilize an infobox like template:infobox poem? — Smuckola (talk) 01:33, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
"However, because of his great building projects, his account of Siduri's advice, and what the immortal man Utnapishtim told him about the Great Flood." What is this supposed to mean? Jrobinjapan ( talk) 01:38, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
The section on translations at the bottom of the article still lists N. K. Sandars' translation, which was last revised in the 1970s. The issue with this is that Gilgamesh translations become outdated for two reasons: (1) the knowledge of Babylonian language in general improves as new clay tablets and fragments are discovered and deciphered, and (2) new fragments of the Gilgamesh epic are discovered (like the "monkey tablet" a few years ago) and older translations don't contain this new content. For this reason, I suggest we remove Sandars' translation and replace it with newer ones, i.e. the translations by Andrew George (Penguin, 1999) and Benjamin R. Foster (Norton, 2nd edition, 2019). I would also list translations of the Old Babylonian version and the Standard Babylonian version separately. ChristopheS ( talk) 21:49, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
"The Epic of Gilgamesh is an epic poem from ancient Mesopotamia, regarded as the earliest surviving notable literature and the second oldest religious text, after the Pyramid Texts." There is no reference where it says this is earliest surviving noble literature, and second oldest. How are these empirical numbers found? These should be changed as not stating anything as "earliest", "second oldest" etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Datta ( talk • contribs) 11:48, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
The Epic of Gilgamesh (is an epic poem from ancient Mesopotamia, regarded as the earliest surviving notable literature and the second oldest religious text, after the Pyramid Texts
There is no reference for these kind of statements that state "earliest", "second oldest religious text". These should be completely removed. -- Datta ( talk) 11:55, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
In the more recent editions of Andrew George's translation, the Sumerian stories use the name Gilgamesh just like the Standard Babylonian version. Does that mean Andrew George's claim in the older editions that the Sumerian stories used "Bilgames" was incorrect? -- NetSpiker ( talk) 14:21, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
31.47.11.97 ( talk) 18:55, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Epic of Gilgamesh article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 180 days |
This article was the subject of an educational assignment in Spring 2015. Further details are available on the course page. |
This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
This article was on the Article Collaboration and Improvement Drive for the week of June 25, 2006. |
This
level-4 vital article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
Hi guys. I just want someone to verify all of my recent cleanups starting here, out of being cautious. Specifically, there are apparently some redundant instances of what might be the same reference.
In an inline citation: <ref name="Epic, AG trans">{{cite book | title= The Epic of Gilgamesh: the Babylonian Epic Poem and Other Texts in Akkadian and Sumerian |first=Andrew R. |last= George |date=2003 |origyear=1999, 2000 |edition= Third |location= London |publisher= Penguin Books |series= Penguin Classics |oclc=901129328 |isbn=0-14-044919-1 |url= https://books.google.com/books?id=eCZRK_61adMC&printsec=frontcover |accessdate= October 8, 2017}}</ref> worldcat
In the bibliography section: {{cite book |last=George | first=Andrew R. | editor-first1=Andrew R. | editor-last1=George | others=translated by Andrew R. George |date=2000 |title=The Epic of Gilgamesh; The Babylonian Epic Poem and Other Texts in Akkadian and Sumerian. |publisher=Penguin |location=England |isbn=0-14-044721-0}} worldcat
Are those two the same book? They have different ISBNs but the same title and author. I think it obviously is a reprint, but please verify as per the given Worldcat links. I think I also consolidated a third instance.
Please check that "Mesopotamia: The Good Life" is the name of a chapter, because I don't know what it is.
Is the book called "The Bible in the British Museum" actually this one listed here and here? I don't see one from 1988, as the original citation in this article states.
In The great wild bull is lying down, is the character's name supposed to be spelled "Bilgames"? I googled it, and I see different versions that say "Bilgamesh" with an "h" so I wondered if that's just an issue of consistancy. I don't know, because I'm not a scholar but a general editor.
We have variously formatted mentions of Standard Akkadian version, "standard version", "The standard Akkadian version". That's not actually a title, right? It's just a typical prose-based reference to a title. So it shouldn't be italicized?
Should this article utilize an infobox like template:infobox poem? — Smuckola (talk) 01:33, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
"However, because of his great building projects, his account of Siduri's advice, and what the immortal man Utnapishtim told him about the Great Flood." What is this supposed to mean? Jrobinjapan ( talk) 01:38, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
The section on translations at the bottom of the article still lists N. K. Sandars' translation, which was last revised in the 1970s. The issue with this is that Gilgamesh translations become outdated for two reasons: (1) the knowledge of Babylonian language in general improves as new clay tablets and fragments are discovered and deciphered, and (2) new fragments of the Gilgamesh epic are discovered (like the "monkey tablet" a few years ago) and older translations don't contain this new content. For this reason, I suggest we remove Sandars' translation and replace it with newer ones, i.e. the translations by Andrew George (Penguin, 1999) and Benjamin R. Foster (Norton, 2nd edition, 2019). I would also list translations of the Old Babylonian version and the Standard Babylonian version separately. ChristopheS ( talk) 21:49, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
"The Epic of Gilgamesh is an epic poem from ancient Mesopotamia, regarded as the earliest surviving notable literature and the second oldest religious text, after the Pyramid Texts." There is no reference where it says this is earliest surviving noble literature, and second oldest. How are these empirical numbers found? These should be changed as not stating anything as "earliest", "second oldest" etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Datta ( talk • contribs) 11:48, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
The Epic of Gilgamesh (is an epic poem from ancient Mesopotamia, regarded as the earliest surviving notable literature and the second oldest religious text, after the Pyramid Texts
There is no reference for these kind of statements that state "earliest", "second oldest religious text". These should be completely removed. -- Datta ( talk) 11:55, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
In the more recent editions of Andrew George's translation, the Sumerian stories use the name Gilgamesh just like the Standard Babylonian version. Does that mean Andrew George's claim in the older editions that the Sumerian stories used "Bilgames" was incorrect? -- NetSpiker ( talk) 14:21, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
31.47.11.97 ( talk) 18:55, 10 December 2023 (UTC)