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In this section, the following is listed: "Complete tolerance to sleep disruption effects of caffeine develops after consuming 400 mg of caffeine 3 times a day for 7 days. Complete tolerance to subjective effects of caffeine was observed to develop after consuming 300 mg 3 times per day for 18 days, and possibly even earlier."
I am not sure who wrote this, but the original research that this is based on does not mention anything about "3 times a day," and as such, the entire "3 times a day" part is very confusing. Is this talking about a person who takes 400mg of caffeine each time they take it, and they take it three times per day, for a total of 1200mg in a day? No, the actual article only mentions 400mg and 300 mg, respectively, used in one day. And in fact, the research indicates that the groups this research was done on received the entire dosage in one go. It was not spread out. If it was, please show me. Otherwise, the "3 times a day" should be removed. If not removed, it should be reworded for clarity.
The research link: http://www.acnp.org/G4/GN401000165/CH161.html
-- 75.163.59.120 ( talk) 19:34, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
Conflicting data!
"In Britain, the first coffee houses were opened in London in 1652, at St Michael's Alley, Cornhill."
"The first coffee house in Europe was opened Paris in the 1800's by an French-Armenian named Pascal. " -- Jonathan Drain 03:13, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
I've heard of cases where caffeine actually induces either mild or severe drowsiness in people who consume it. Reports about the mechanism of action vary regarding what causes it, but the most common I've heard is an enzyme deficiency. Does anybody know of any sources that study or have information on this? Kelbesque 17:58, 4 December 2006 (UTC) i read in a book by herald lamb that coffee was being used around 1530's Harisbhai 21:28, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
This could be possible (anecdotal evidence) in someone with ADHD. 72.211.227.240 21:46, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
I believe that caffè should read café if it is meant to be French.
hey ho. i have a question or two regarding caffeine and metabolism. the body can obviously only absorb so much caffeine at one time, like say, nicotine. if a coffee drinker drinks coffee more slowly, are they getting more caffeine from it or giving a longer plateau of caffeinated time?
i also see down there that smoking increases the metabolism, shortening the half life of caffeine. at one point i was told that cigarettes increase the amount of caffeine the body is able to metabolism - is the case just that smoking makes the body process it faster and thus get a bigger (but faster) rush? JoeSmack Talk 17:54, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
I believe the use of half life to be incorrect here. First, half life is a specific scientific term to discus the period necessary for half of a mass of substance to suffer radioactive decay. Caffiene does not have a half life in this sense, as it is not radioactive, so I believe the use of half-life to be incorrect. Further, In terms of it being metabolized by the body, this is a chemical reaction and relies very heavily on the concentrations and volumes of the various chemicals involved in the reaction. The time necessary to metabolize one half a mass of caffiene is going to be highly dependant on how much caffiene is actually present, and any time listed should be qualified with a range of mass it applies to.-- Joshbw 04:56, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine is not a diuretic, well no more than water is. See this peer reviewed published study....
Caffeine, Fluid-Electrolyte Balance, Temperature Regulation, and Exercise-Heat Tolerance
Posted 07/19/2007
Lawrence E. Armstrong; Douglas J. Casa; Carl M. Maresh; Matthew S. Ganio
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/559762 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.154.23.183 ( talk) 04:43, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
-- Stone 09:41, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
Biosynthesis might be a good point for the biochemistry and a addition to the metabolism.
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link)I'm pretty sure this page has been vandalised with the photograph that supposedly shows a spiders web when affected by caffine - seems awfully similar to http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=spider+drugs&search=Search which is a well known spoof. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 124.168.197.83 ( talk)
I have removed a link from under "Overuse" - "excitement" was taking the user to a page on quantum mechanical excitement, which is obviously not appropriate in this context. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.111.8.103 ( talk) 09:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
I will remove the following link: http://www.caffeinated.jp/ because it's broken. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.24.88.222 ( talk) 19:58, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
I believe the line graphics (in addition to not showing the carbon junctions, which I believe is customary, dunno) are missing one of the hydrogen molecules, the one closest to the two nitrogen ones. Caffeine is supposed to have 10. If you look at the ball graphic, there is an additional H hanging off the center left side between two C attached to two N, that doesn't have a match on the other graphic. It would be coming off the C between the two N on the left side (Sorry about the terms, I'm not a chemist....) Sln3412 00:10, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know the difference between the CH3 symbol and the H3C? As in, why is it wrong to change them all to CH3? 198.145.85.152 22:39, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
Gonna off-load everything up through #Topical_caffeine unless anyone complains...all long-ended discussions that were resolved, etc. DMacks 01:24, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
To add to the "Caffeine content of select common food and drugs" table: Product Name: Jolt Gum Serving Size 2 pieces (4g) Caffeine / Serving: ~ 100-135mg*
Also: "The recommended dose of this product contains about as much caffeine as a cup of coffee. This pack contains about as much caffeine as six cups of coffee. Not a substitute for sleep. This product is as safe as coffee or energy drinks." JungleProwler 22:39, 6 March 2007 (UTC)JungleProwler
It says on this page that over 60 known plants contain caffeine. Can there be a list showing what plants contain it and posibly in what amounts and locations (such as leaves, bark, branches, etc....) It might be good for the article. Upon reading that line I became interested in knowing what it was in exactly, so it would probably be a good idea to put it. It would increase the depth of the article; or it could be moved to another page, if this page is thought to be too big for such content. SadanYagci 18:52, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
The page says, "Some yerba mate enthusiasts assert that mateine is a stereoisomer of caffeine, which would make it a different substance altogether.[8] However, caffeine is an achiral molecule, and therefore has no stereoisomers."
Chirality is a type of stereoisomerism, but they are not equivalent. Caffeine and mateine may be the same molecule, but I’m pretty certain the reasoning that caffeine’s achirality proves that it has no stereoisomers is faulty. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.91.144.89 ( talk) 03:31, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
What is meant by "subjective effects"? (in second paragraph of "Tolerance and withdrawal" section)
What does "completely tolerant to most of the effects of caffeine" mean (end of same paragraph)? Does it mean that these people are basically in the same state that they would be if they consumed no caffeine (after any relevant withdrawal period that is)? Does it mean that the effects in the "Effects when taken in moderation" no longer apply (well the ones relating to whatever doseage they are actually taking anyway)?
And some of the examples given in the "in moderation" do not seem all that moderate: reference 36 leads to info about a study involving consumming the equivalent to 10 cups of coffee in two and a half hours; and the heading that reference 37 leads to includes the words "high caffeine dose".
FrankSier 23:45, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
Wow. Does somebody think caffeine is a drug, which should be regulated like nicotine and alcohol, or even banned like cannibis, cocaine, methamphetamine, etc.? I realize that there are some (e.g. Mormons) who have always felt this way about caffeine, and I think it is ironic that the puritanical United States government has tolerated it as long as it has. Shanoman 14:36, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
There's strong evidence that caffeine tolerance is NOT mediated by an increase in adenosine receptors. [1], [2] and [3]so I'd like to remove these sentences from the article but couldn't find a decent wording... Syber 04:46, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
I'm not a chemist, so forgive my ignorance. The info box included "methyltheobromine" as an "other name". I don't see bromine in the formula and have removed "methyltheobromine" from the info box. Please let me know if I'm wrong. Cheers, :) MikeReichold 13:32, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
Could caffeine be used as an entheogen? That is, consumed in a spiritual context like shrooms or cannabis? Not asking if it's a hallucinogen, obviously. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.176.14.100 ( talk • contribs)
One editor suggested that the name be changed to "Coca cola"; however, the source [4] clearly indicates "Coca cola Classic" as the name, and the other source [5] lists "Coca cola" with 45mg per 12oz rather than 34mg, as currently in the article. I therefore suggest that the idea of changing the name be abandoned, even and especially if the data is based on a different, historic formulation of the drink! Samsara ( talk • contribs) 16:33, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
As far as the sources state, the data in both sources comes from Coca cola, not from independent laboratories. One of the sources (second listed above) does not even clearly state this, but simply has a footnote saying "Sources: National Coffee Association, National Soft Drink Association, Tea Council of the USA, and information provided by food, beverage, and pharmaceutical companies and J.J. Barone, H.R. Roberts (1996) “Caffeine Consumption.” Food Chemistry and Toxicology, vol. 34, pp. 119-129.". Samsara ( talk • contribs) 16:36, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
I have been heard that certain drugs can interfere with caffeine metabolism thereby increasing its half-life in circulation. One example cited was oral contraceptives. If this is well-documented in the medical literature it might be valuable to add to this article.
[unsigned]
Serotonin Syndrome
Last week I overdosed on somewhere around 1.5g of caffeine (accidental - I took 100mg every half hour over the course of the day, still tired, finally too much) - resulting in 15 hours of terror (took over 24 hours to return to normal). I have a new-found respect for the drug caffeine.
Yesterday, 8 days after the caffeine overdose, I took a single 300mg St. John's Wart (standardized), and proceeded to endure another day of terror, this time from serotonin syndrome (presumably). I had not taken St. John's Wart or any other medication since the caffeine overdose. Certainly makes for an interesting week.
This SSRI experience makes more sense of the fact that, following the caffeine overdose, after eating I would often experience a flushing sensation. The meals typically involved peanut butter, miso soup, or fish. These foods are contraindicated for users of MOAI's. (MAOI diet: http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/maoi.html)
This summarizes what I have found: "large doses of caffeine taken with antidepressants that have a serotonergic effect put patients at risk of developing the serotonin syndrome." source: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/fulltext/109087387/PDFSTART
Someone more knowledgeable than I might add to the article, explaining how large doses of caffeine can have an MAOI effect, which in combination with SSRI's can result in serotonin syndrome (possibly many days after the caffeine overdose). Also, is the MAOI diet something that should be applied to persons after experiencing a caffeine overdose?
Thanks
Exists ( talk) 03:33, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
There's a discontinuity in the text here, probably due to an editing error, but I'm not an expert on the neurochemistry being discussed and so I am not sure I'm the right person to fix it:
The second paragraph excerpted above introduces material about the renal pharmacology of caffeine, but then the third sentence — "This effect, called competitive inhibition..." — makes no sense at all in this context. It looks like there might have been an interpolation of the first two sentences at the wrong place, i.e. in the middle of the neurochemistry discussion. However, just moving these two sentences will still leave a discontinuity, as the next sentence introduces (de novo) the term "competitive inhibition" even though the term "competetive inhibitor" was used in the previous paragraph. Also, the second paragraph proclaims the "result" of this competive inhibition to be an increase in catecholamines released by via the HPA axis, and how this is supposed to happen is not at all made clear. The first paragraph has what seems to me a more cogent treatment of the effects of adeonsine receptor antagonism, stating that it results in an increase in dopamine activity, and furthermore that this accounts for most of the stimulant effects. Then it says that caffeine can also increase levels of catecholamines "possibly by a different mechanism".
Summary: the sentences about the diuretic effects need to be moved out of the middle of the neurochemistry discussion, and there needs to be some definitive resolution of the two paragraphs that attempt to address the effects of adenosine receptor antagonism.
Mark Lundquist 20:32, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
Does caffeine really sublime at a much lower temperature than it melts - surely this is unusual? Or is the melting only under pressure - in which case it should be mentioned. If the values are correct then perhaps they need comment. Petermr 22:35, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
I think I had a brainstorm - neglect the comment :-) Petermr 11:36, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine does have a melting point. I have tried heating up pharmaceutical grade caffeine (anhydrous) in a melting point apparatus, and I saw it melt at exactly the melting point the Merck Index had. I have also tried making it sublimate, and it did this as well. The thing is that it starts sublimating at about 178c as far as I can remember, but it starts boiling later on. You can stop heating it at 178c and it will just sublimate, but if you keep heating it, it will eventually melt and start boiling.
Hi, The bit about caffeine intoxication mentions using crushed caffeine tablets for snorting. IIRC many caffeine tablets contain sodium hydroxide so that it burns your nose if you do it. Pure caffeine powder is cheap and easy to obtain (eg: from ebay). bought a kilo for £35 (around $70) and it's good. Can be added to drinks, or snorted. I hear it can also be smoked, but I have never succeeded. 217.134.101.219 20:06, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Yes, caffeine at very high doses = strychnine. Tim Vickers 03:54, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
It could be added that the amount of caffeine in green tea can be reduced by putting hot water (80°C) over the tee and then throwing the water away. The water will contain most of the caffeine and this will not significantely alter the taste of the tea. Then the tee can be steeped in a hot water like normal. (german: de:Grüner_Tee#Entkoffeinierung ) -- helohe (talk) 23:45, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
Excuse the primitive editing, but I noticed a seeming error in the statement of the word's origin. It states that the French word for coffee is caffè, which is, in fact the Italian word for coffee. The French is café, and your source for this fact has that term. Returnoftheavenged 12:45, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
The article may be entirely correct, but it seems contradictory on the surface: in the mechanism of action section, caffeine is said to act by inhibiting adenosine receptors, thus acting as an indirect vasodilator (in addition to the sympathetic vasodilation effects). However, in the withdrawal section, the disinhibition of adenosine is said to cause vasodilation. It's unclear how both inhibition and disinhibition of adenosine cause vasodilation. (Perhaps these are localized effects? If so, that could be clarified.) Twthompson 16:54, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
A general question. What does this statement mean: "The world's primary source of caffeine is the coffee bean." If we know that worldwide tea is the second most consumed beverage after water, does the statement refer to the amount of caffeine that comes from coffee? I wonder if the first source listed should be tea or at least the have the wording changed to "One of the world's primary sources of caffeine is coffee." Thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.134.45.231 ( talk • contribs) 02:26, 12 August 2007
The lead paragraph references alternate names for caffeine by origin and also that the given names are not considered valid chemical designations. Neither "fact" (the accuracy of the names or the validity of the designations) are cited and both should be. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 22:41, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine
Name of Substance
1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- 3,7-Dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione Caffeine Caffeine [BAN:JAN]
Synonyms
1,3,7-Trimethyl-2,6-dioxopurine 1,3,7-Trimethylxanthine 1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- 3,7-Dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione 5-26-13-00558 (Beilstein Handbook Reference) AI3-20154 Alert-pep Anhydrous caffeine BRN 0017705 CCRIS 1314 Cafamil Cafecon Cafeina Caffedrine Caffein Caffeina [Italian] Caffeine Caffeine (natural) Caffeine, anhydrous Caffeine, synthetic Caffine Cafipel Coffein [German] Coffeine Coffeinum Dexitac EINECS 200-362-1 Eldiatric C FEMA No. 2224 Guaranine HSDB 36 Hycomine Kofein [Czech] Koffein Koffein [German] Mateina Methyltheobromide Methyltheobromine Methylxanthine theophylline NCI-C02733 NO-Doz NSC 5036 Nix Nap Nodaca Organex Quick-Pep Refresh'N Stim Thein Theine Theobromine, 1-methyl- Theophylline, 7-methyl Tirend Vivarin Xanthine, 1,3,7-trimethyl
Systematic Name
1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- Caffeine
Superlist Name
Caffeine
U.S. National Library of Medicine, 8600 Rockville Pike, Bethesda, MD 20894, National Institutes of Health, Department of Health & Human Services Copyright and Privacy Policy, Freedom of Information Act, Accessibility Customer Service: tehip@teh.nlm.nih.gov. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jclerman ( talk • contribs) 08:14, August 21, 2007 (UTC).
The article seems to be lacking information about caffeinated bathing products ( 1, 2, 3 ) and criticism they have received ( 4, 5, 6 ). -- Easyas12c 11:26, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
As far as i'm aware, the premise of caffeinated bathing procuts is that the caffiene produces a localised stimulant/irritant reaction on the skin surface, not that the caffeine is absorbed into the central nervous system and results in a systemic reaction or 'buzz', as these references seem to claim (the 'thinkgeek' products, which anyway seem to me to be novelty/spoof products) and then test. Xanatrilby ( talk) 13:33, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
I've added calls for citations in the overuse section. Unlike the tolerance/withdrawal section, the claims here are a little sketchy.
The term "caffeineism" isn't defined in either of the sources that are cited thereafter. It definitely needs a source.
It's unclear why "caffeine dependency" is in quotes - are they intended to be scare quotes? The http://www.minddisorders.com/Br-Del/Caffeine-related-disorders.html source that's cited actually details that there's debate and uncertainty over whether the term "substance dependency" can be applied to caffeine at all. Without a source asserting clearly that it can, this section could use some cleanup. Tofof 00:31, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
Is there anything to be said regarding plants that make caffeine ability to use it as a reversible store of Nitrogen. How do non-caffeine producing plants react to caffeine, and metabolise caffeine. Can caffeine be absorbed by roots? 71.114.163.55 —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 19:33, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
The table in appendix A is interesting - however it fails to take account of either the caffeine-like substances contained in chocolate, which obviously boost the "caffeine effect" of chocolate very considerably (as any "chocoholic" will recognise) - and the fact that the strength of brew of tea has a very great influence on the amount of caffeine in it (any non-American who has ever made a cup of tea for an American will know all about that!!). I have added a note to this effect - although it is in a way subjective and POV??? Soundofmusicals 06:34, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
just how much caffein does one get from tea and what amounts can lead to dependency? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chenjeri ( talk • contribs) 02:37, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
The following should be added to the Caffeine Equivalents chart: "One 6 fluid ounce cup of regular Espresso coffee (355 millilitres)" Or "Two 3 fluid ounce cups of regular Espresso coffee (355 millilitres)" As is stated in the Espresso article. And "Two 8 fluid ounce cups of regular coffee (470 millilitres)" instead of "containers" since 8 fl oz = 1 cup. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lturcoklyl ( talk • contribs) 07:53, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
caffeine is certainly an addictive drug that has toxicity above illegal ones such as THC, and even way more than heroin if isolated in pure form. what factor made it unusually easy to access and virtually no law is made against it? If it keeps people awake and increases productivity (I confess that this happens to me and myself has more or less dependency on it), amphetamine does it too. I am against drug prohibition in general and thankful to the fact that there is this legal drug, but just wonder what's the reason that caffeine is both legally and socially tolerated way much more than other psychoactive drugs, legal or illegal? Wooyi Talk to me? 16:36, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
I think that custom and practice make it legal. It is way more popular than alcohol and nicotine, all of which are more popular than illegal drugs. (If caffein lost its popularity, it could become illegal.) It is surprising though that soft drink manufacturers are allowed to add an addictive drug to a product sold to children. -- 74.15.53.217 07:03, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
This assertion needs to be qualified. Most popular according to which criterion? The article has the following sentence: "Today, global consumption of caffeine has been estimated at 120,000 tons per annum,[25] making it the world's most popular psychoactive substance". Since the assertion in question is part of a sentence that mentions annual consumption by mass, the reader could assume that the criterion is indeed "mass consumed per year". But even a cursory look at articles on beer and wine will show that this is not possible. Based on these two articles, I estimate that annual consumption of ethanol is about 5 million tons from beer and 2 million tons from wine (and probably a few more million tons from other beverages). The total is roughly 100 times larger than for caffeine. Of course, one "dose" of caffeine is much smaller than one dose of alcohol, caffeine being measured in milligrams while alcohol is measured in grams, so perhaps caffeine is "more popular by number of 'doses'". In any case this should be clarified and better sources found if possible. -- Itub 15:39, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know where the caffein in soft drinks comes from? I know that some of it is extracted when decaf is made, but people drink a lot more caffeinated soft drinks than decaffeinated coffee and tea. I cannot find anything about this. -- 74.15.53.217 07:08, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine intoxication is very clearly noted in DSM IV and someone who contributed to the main article had obviously read DSM IV but there have been many other myths and such mixed into the passage and the entire main article making it difficult for a passing reader to differentiate between what is true and what isn't. Practically all of the section in the main article about caffeine intoxication is taken from DSM IV although it is important to note that intoxication starts from 100mg caffeine per day, not the specified 400mg; also irritability, depression, lapses in judgment, disorientation, loss of social inhibition, delusions, hallucinations, psychosis, rhabdomyolysis and death are all made up symptoms. Also for some of the more worrying real symptoms the user must take caffeine on a long-term basis. However one can become resistant to all caffeine intoxication side effects as the body becomes resistant/compensates in certain areas for the caffeine so side effects from caffeine intoxication are more severe in irregular users so some may debate that taking high levels of caffeine on a regular basis is better for you than taking any amount occasionally.
Caffeine withdrawals are a serious concern to regular users though, the side effects from withdrawal are quite unpleasant and theoretically if the body has allowed for the effects of caffeine then there is a risk that opposite symptoms may occur, e.g. Tiredness, slow thoughts, less frequent urination, lower physical performance, etc.
Does caffiene really have a laxative effect or is this just a myth? If it does I think it'd be worth a mention in this article.-- 218.153.87.138 10:54, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
Yes, like all CNS stimulents it does. Ranunculoid ( talk) 19:08, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
I'd always believed that it was the coffee creamer that worked as a laxitive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:37, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
The baldness treatment article says that caffeine can be used as treatment? 132.205.44.5 ( talk) 01:15, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
"In healthy adults, caffeine's half-life is approximately 3–4 hours."
Reference(s)?? I've found articles elsewhere online saying the half-life is around 6 hours (e.g. http://science.howstuffworks.com/question5311.htm). 81.104.186.166 17:38, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
One of the hydrogen atoms (far left) is not shown in the structural formula. I think it is a bit unfortunate to show a hybrid between explicit formula and skeletal formula in this way. -- Etxrge ( talk) 11:54, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
From what I've seen, it's pretty standard for semi-skeletal formulas to be used; the only parts that are rarely shown as a complete skeletal are the methyl groups, which are typically represented by the CH3 that's used in the formula. The only place I've seen methyl groups represented completely skeletally is in simple hydrocarbons, such as " toluene" or methylbenzene. Then again, the most advanced chemistry qualification that I have is an AP chemistry class and some spare time spent looking and building models of organic molecules, so "what I've seen" should be taken at face value (as I see you're an engineer). XarBiogeek ( talk) 00:01, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
The article is protected from editing by guests, so I couldn't add this myself, bet there's something interesting about caffeine and it's effect on testosterone.
Caffeine elevates SHBG. This results in reduced free testosterone levels.
Source: American Journal of Epidemiology (144:642-44, 1996)
Regards, -- 83.24.45.122 ( talk) 03:41, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
Here is something from CNN about caffeine soap. It's just a transcript, but it is CNN. 212.179.71.70 ( talk) 10:37, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
This seems to be becoming more and more popular (although I haven't exactly been keeping tabs on it, it could've very well been just as popular twenty years ago), and I think it should be mentioned in the article. The people I know who do this generally take two, three, four or in one case seventeen caffeine pills at a time, and oftentimes do not wait the recommended amount of time before taking more. It's usually used in combination with other drugs (marijuana, alcohol), mainly to keep one from "crashing." 70.49.132.93 ( talk) 16:36, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I added (with a reference):
Caffeine relaxes the internal anal sphincter muscles, causing a laxative effect and thus should be avoided by those with incontinence.
I'm aware of people using it deliberately as a laxative (e.g. by drinking tea - although they may not be aware that it's the caffeine giving the effect). I didn't see a notable reference on this. Someone please add if you find one. -- Chriswaterguy talk 03:55, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
"An acute overdose of caffeine, usually in excess of 250 milligrams"
I dont understand how an acute overdose of caffeine can be 250mg as stated in this article. Further up the same page, the article states that strong caffeine pills contain 200mg of Caffeine. Thus someone taking two strong caffeine pills will have had a caffeine overdose? Or, Jolt Cola has apparently 150mg of Caffeine. Thus making two cans of Jolt an overdose. When I was at college I would regularly have three of more cans of Jolt in a row without any ill effects. I think this must be a type error and it should say 250 millgrams per body weight in kg, for example. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.38.135.218 ( talk) 20:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
The "Occurrence" section currently says, in part
That's not a great way of saying how much is in tea. Are we trying to say that Tea ranges from 20 mg to 50 mg? If so, then we should probably say exactly that.
Perhaps a table would be in order, with a range for each substance?
Source | mg of Caffeine | Serving Size |
---|---|---|
arabica-variety espresso coffee | 40 mg | single shot (30 milliliters) |
drip coffee | 100 mg | a cup (120 milliliters) |
decafinated coffee | ?? mg | a cup (120 milliliters) |
ordinary western tea | 20 to 50mg | a cup |
oolong tea | ??? | a cup |
(cola based?) softdrink | 10 to 50 mg | ??? |
energy drinks | 80 mg | ??? |
chocolate | ?? mg | 50 g? |
Regards, Ben Aveling 05:42, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
This is most certainly not a reliable source; it has no established reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. I have removed one claim (caffeine not solely responsible for gastric ulcers, since decaffeinated coffee also irritates the stomach lining) and properly sourced another (ld50 in rats.) Please do not re-add Erowid for any purpose. < eleland/ talk edits> 23:02, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
The image of the caffeine molecule on the page is different from the one on this shirt. Which one is the correct one? -- AS Artimour ( talk) 21:01, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
The direction of writing the methyl group (H3C and CH3) makes no difference to the identity of the molecule depicted. You just write H3C if carbon is bonded to something to its right.
The two depictions (t-shirt and article) represent the same molecule.
Ben ( talk) 19:17, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
Searching for "formula" in this talk page finds other questions asked and answered related to confusion arising from laymen encountering the hybrid (not skeletal) formula. Perhaps the treatment in Propane is a good model, where 4 alternate depictions are given. But, in one day, I personally have gone from confusion to understanding (even before seeing it verified in those other Q/A) that the CH3 could/should be omitted from a skeletal formula. (Also, propane has better "explanations" when you hover your mouse over the diagrams (alt text?)).-- SportWagon ( talk) 17:02, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
That's news to me. I've been drinking coffe since I was 7 & I'm the the tallest woman in my extended family. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:33, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Correlation does not mean causation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.18.180.214 ( talk) 06:12, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
To much jargin to read through. Which parts mention why caffine makes some people tired? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:35, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Apparently it doesn't make you dehydrated as commonly thought. [13]. Worth adding? - Ravedave ( talk) 02:24, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Seems coffee and caffeine raise insulin levels and stress hormones. Why isn't this discussed in detail? Seems like a perfect recipe for obesity, abdominal obesity and all the diseases of modern civilization.
The other thing is... caffeine is extremely addictive with a very brutal withdrawal period with lingering fatigue and depression that can last upwards of two months. No doubt most if not all of the posters here and editors are users. How can we trust essentially addicts to dissemminate accurate information about this addictive drug?
I find this really hilarious:
"This is not the only case where caffeine increases the effectiveness of a drug. Caffeine makes pain relievers 40% more effective in relieving headaches and helps the body absorb headache medications more quickly, bringing faster relief.[62] For this reason, many over-the-counter headache drugs include caffeine"
This is not the case at all in the particular case of taking an analgesic with caffeine when withdrawing from caffeine. The caffeine is relieving the headache because you are getting a fix and blunting the withdrawal period, the main effect of which is powerful headaches.
68.161.194.64 ( talk) 20:00, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Since caffeine is linked from the thermogenics section and mentioned there, maybe is should be covered. If that is the case a distinction will have to be made as to its effects on metabolism (general metabolism of caloric intake) vs. metabolism of the caffeine itself into the body. The fact that caffeine is a well-known mild thermogenic yet it is not covered in a section entitled "metabolism" seems very confusing especially if one is looking for that information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.143.157.3 ( talk) 18:19, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
I searched briefly, but wasn't able to find any references to support the assertion that caffeine alters the levels of sex hormones in men and women (it's very late though, and I'm too tired to be rigorous). This is a very high-profile article, so I thought it best to remove the entire section for now lest we see it quoted all over the Net in the next few weeks.
—Preceding
unsigned comment added by
ClockworkSoul (
talk •
contribs) –
Clockwork
Soul 07:07, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
After reading the article from top to bottom I noticed that in the religion section, while the information is fairly accurate, the sentence "These people also refrain from consuming alcoholic beverages such as wine or beer and smoking cigarettes" does not seem to be on topic, article appropriate, or have any beneficial value to this article. It reads as more of an aside than anything else. I'm suggesting that it be removed, unless someone can suggest a valid reason for it being there. Aristophrenia ( talk) 05:54, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't wikipedia aiming at using S.I. units rather than fake-imperial units? Nergaal ( talk) 10:19, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
This article talk page was automatically added with {{ WikiProject Food and drink}} banner as it falls under Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . Maximum and careful attention was done to avoid any wrongly tagging any categories , but mistakes may happen... If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot ( talk) 06:45, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
The lead section currently says: "unlike most other psychoactive substances, it is legal and unregulated in nearly all jurisdictions."
Are we aware of any jurisdiction in which it is illegal or regulated? --
201.17.36.246 (
talk) 20:13, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
Few comments:
Jclerman ( talk) 23:52, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
I don't understand this sentence in the context: At this point, the neuron has very little energy left for the successful firing of an action potential. the article's talking about a single molecule of ATP. Can it be clarified? delldot talk 18:21, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
"THis is not the only..." This paragraph seems to be misplaced; it has nothing to do with "Tolerance and withdrawal". But I couldn't find the appropriate place for it. Will someone please put it in the right place? I added a header to lessen confusion, but the transition phrase now doesn't make sense. 198.99.123.63 ( talk) 18:56, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
I think the section "Mechanism of action" needs clarification. Is it intended to say that the only known effect of caffeine in normal dosages is as an adenosine receptor blocker, and that the other effects (increases in dopamine, acetylcholine, etc.) are due indirectly to this? If so, perhaps this should be explicitly stated. 82.1.151.34 ( talk) 16:27, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
I would like to put forward my support for this article and give praise for those who created and edited it. Although it contains many scentific parts, they are easy to understand and well written. Maybe it could be used as some sort of example template for new users to go by? Well done. Wikisaver62 ( talk) 09:32, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
Following from my rambling on this page at Is the image of the Caffeine Molecule correct? , my recent edit demonstrated how to improve the text of the diagrams when you hover your mouse over them. Watchers of this page, please review and improve (e.g. I'm not sure "hybrid skeletal" sounds right to a chemist). You probably watchlisted it anyway, but also perhaps see Propane for my inspiration and crib-sheet. It's sort of strange that the hover text is not taken, at lesat by default, from the image page.-- SportWagon ( talk) 22:04, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
A small edit war has developed concerning caffeine levels in energy drinks. According to this source, caffeine levels vary from about 9.64 mg/oz (about 80 mg/serving) for Red Bull, to as much as 500 mg in a can of Fixx. Thus, I'm reverting back to the 80+ version. If you feel that the information is wrong, please give a source that is better. looie496 ( talk) 04:53, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
The figures given for some of the coffee-based drinks look totally wrong to me, many of them lack sources, and are mathematically suspect: 1. There is in practice no such thing as a Robusto espresso - at most you would get maybe 10-20% Robusto / Arabica mix in some Italian blends - virtually all of them are 100% Arabica (literally half the caffeine) beans. 2. There is no such thing as 150mL espresso shot. A single is 30mL; a double 60mL. 3. I don't know what a "fl. oz" equates to in metric, but I assume Starbucks would use either a single (30 mL) or more probably double (60 mL) espresso shot to create it. Even if they were using the higher caffeine content of the Robusto from (1), that suggests a ceiling of ( 200 mg / 150 mL ) * 60 mL = 80 mg; not the 200 mg claimed. 4. More realistic figures are given in the "coffee" entry of wikipedia. There are figures given at http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeine/AN01211 that look a little better, (although the instant coffee is a bit misleading, since it doesn't specify how much coffee powder is added and instant coffee is usually thought to contain more caffeine for the same amount of taste, since the beans are extracted for longer, and taste gets extracted before caffeine). Perhaps the references to Starbucks could be completely done away with. It would be more meaningful for non-Americans to refer to non-proprietary drinks, eg. http://books.google.com/books?id=YdpL2YCGLVYC&pg=PA230&dq=%22caffeine+content%22#PPA327,M1
I changed the Robusto entry, because it was wrong in so many ways. I also changed the "regular coffee" entry to "instant coffee", since "regular" is pretty meaningless to me. I extrapolated these figures from the above book. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.244.160.212 ( talk) 23:51, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
An IP editor has changed the article to state that caffeine is not a diuretic, giving as evidence http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/jhnd/abstract.00009862-200312000-00004.htm -- Caffeine ingestion and fluid balance: a review. Journal of Human Nutrition & Dietetics December 2003, 16:6. The change was made in a way that broke the grammar, though, and was followed by two other IP edits that made things even worse, so I have for the moment reverted all four edits in the hope that the question could be discussed here before any changes are made to the article. Opinions? looie496 ( talk) 17:39, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
The references in the appendix do not work correctly. The
tag clears out the internal array of data when it is used, so the last two links do not point up correctly (I should know, seeing is I was extending the cite extension last week). By my first-glance assessment, there are three ways to fix this:
The chart includes the item "Coffee, Starbucks" but it is not clear whether this means Starbucks espresso or Starbucks drip coffee. On the one hand, when most people hear "Starbucks" they think espresso, but on the other, "coffee" usually indicates drip or brew coffee. Which is it? Brentonboy ( talk) 23:07, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
I have just moved this passage from lead to body: Despite its widespread use and the conventional view that it is a safe substance, a 2008 study suggested that pregnant women who consume 200 milligrams or more of caffeine per day have about twice the miscarriage risk as women who consume none. However, another 2008 study found no correlation between miscarriage and caffeine consumption. I moved it because the sources are too weak to justify putting this in the lead -- one primary source and a newspaper article. The primary source uses a design that can only show correlation, not causation, so there is no basis for flagging this as "important" by putting it in the lead. Looie496 ( talk) 18:53, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
How many different types of caffine are there? Is the same type of caffine used in tea and coffee? Is there more caffine in tea or coffee per cup? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.69.186.42 ( talk) 14:03, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
Someone needs to recalculate this section based on the table of content values. Eg Green Tea is way off. Rjk ( talk) 15:38, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
I suggest to delete the history parts that are not related to the chemcical compound coffein, that mean everything except the two last paragraphs which describe the first synthesis, etc. A disclaimer and link to the history of coffee page is enough. This would trim the article which is too long, IMHO. Northfox ( talk) 12:04, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
The article's first sentence says is anthropocentrically biased. It says "Caffeine is a bitter, white crystalline xanthine alkaloid that acts as a psychoactive stimulant drug and a mild diuretic[3] in humans and animals."
(I mean, it suggests that humans are not animals)
I'm surprised to see this in a featured article, but then again, anthropocentrism is ambient in our culture.
I would have changed this myself if the article wasn't featured. 195.49.248.147 ( talk) 20:52, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
How about changing it to "... in humans and other animals." ? - 195.49.248.147 ( talk) 22:35, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Nice one boys; I'm on my sixth cup (of caffeinated coffee) of the day, and I'm still alive and kicking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.72.110.11 ( talk) 15:56, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
There are three paragraphs in the "Mechanism of action" section that refer entirely to adenosine mechanisms of secrection and action, where caffeine is not mentioned once. I know that it is important to explain "adenosine slow the neurons down, so caffeine speeds them up", but I think going into this much details about adenosine shouldn't be in an article about caffeine. Independovirus ( talk) 07:32, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
References 68-79 cover the section about "caffeinism" and the detrimental effects on your health of large-scale caffeine consumption. Many of these articles are from the 1980s. Is this position still widely held? I'm asking this because I've never read that the effects can be so drastic. Are we sure that this isn't a 1980s belief that is no longer widely held? Epa101 ( talk) 20:40, 4 February 2009 (UTC)
I ate 100 coffee cherries, but spit out the hard seeds.
I went to sleep anyway, two hours later.
I conclude the caffeine is all contained in the hard seeds, and not the sweet cherry meat.
Please add evidence to the contrary to the article.
In fact, any statement in the article either way would be appreciated. Jidanni ( talk) 22:59, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
Coffee processing talks about which parts of the cherry are used to make "coffee" and which are discarded, so you can see if what you did/didn't-eat matches the part that is widely used as a caffeine source. DMacks ( talk) 23:38, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
All I read is the decaffeination process is applied after the flesh is removed. So we still don't know how much caffeine is in the flesh.
However, I have some more genuine original research for you:
So there must not be any caffeine in the sweet fruit part, or else the plant would have a conflict of interest and probably unable to compete (in evolution)! Jidanni ( talk) 23:38, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
OK, the third item you quote seems to mention that the animals sometimes reach their caffeine limit eating the pulps they are fed... Jidanni ( talk) 06:48, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
I have edited the metabolite percentages to match the source (it doesn't equal 100% now because there are at least 17 metabolites in total) but the picture is still wrong. can someone with the appropriate skills please correct this. Triscut ( talk) 02:50, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
The whole section stating drinks with an equivalent of 200mg is uncited, and contradicts very strongly with the caffeine content shown higher up on the page. In fact green tea differs by almost double the caffeine content when compared to the above table. I am going to delete it, and if an admin disagrees they can feel free to reverse it. 24.65.95.239 ( talk) 20:45, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Adding another high Caffeine content drink Viso which has 300mg per serving. Adding a stub link to wiki.
Someone should add a section about the use of caffeine in molecular biology as an inhibitor of DNA repair: caffeine namely both inhibits the DNA damage signaling kinases ATM and ATR and also acts in as yet uncharacterised ways on other DNA damage signalling or repair pathways. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.77.192.140 ( talk) 12:32, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Occurence, 2nd paragraph: "Some yerba mate enthusiasts assert that mateine is a stereoisomer of caffeine, which would make it a different substance altogether.[14] This is not true because caffeine is an achiral molecule, and therefore has no enantiomers; nor does it have other stereoisomers."
Despite the 'some yerba mate enthusiasts' qualifier, this section still feels contradictory. Even with the citations, both sentences seem speculative. As I do not know which is correct, I don't feel justified in removing either sentence, but one of them should go, or at least be moved to another section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.70.34.109 ( talk) 20:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
At this writing, the second sentence of the lede asserts flatly that caffeine is not a diuretic, and gives three sources. Two of them do not in fact assert directly that it is not a diuretic, but only cast doubt on the claim that it is; the third ref is not available without subscription so I don't know what it says.
Further down, the article points out that theobromine is a metabolite of caffeine, and assserts that theobromine "increases urine volume", which to my unpracticed eye says that it is a diuretic.
I have no position on whether caffeine is a diuretic; I just want the article to be both internally consistent and consistent with its sources, and at present neither of those appears to be true. -- Trovatore ( talk) 21:32, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
i can't find a citation for this. i'm looking through some history databases with the term "arabian wine" and coffee. the closest thing i can find is a reference to palm wine, which is also known as arabian wine, in this document at jstor (subscription required). the reference is on page 58 of the original publication, or page 62 of the digital copy. Daiv ( talk) 05:57, 1 June 2009 (UTC)
Why is Duration of effects under Decaffeination? Should it be under pharmacology?
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Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
In this section, the following is listed: "Complete tolerance to sleep disruption effects of caffeine develops after consuming 400 mg of caffeine 3 times a day for 7 days. Complete tolerance to subjective effects of caffeine was observed to develop after consuming 300 mg 3 times per day for 18 days, and possibly even earlier."
I am not sure who wrote this, but the original research that this is based on does not mention anything about "3 times a day," and as such, the entire "3 times a day" part is very confusing. Is this talking about a person who takes 400mg of caffeine each time they take it, and they take it three times per day, for a total of 1200mg in a day? No, the actual article only mentions 400mg and 300 mg, respectively, used in one day. And in fact, the research indicates that the groups this research was done on received the entire dosage in one go. It was not spread out. If it was, please show me. Otherwise, the "3 times a day" should be removed. If not removed, it should be reworded for clarity.
The research link: http://www.acnp.org/G4/GN401000165/CH161.html
-- 75.163.59.120 ( talk) 19:34, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
Conflicting data!
"In Britain, the first coffee houses were opened in London in 1652, at St Michael's Alley, Cornhill."
"The first coffee house in Europe was opened Paris in the 1800's by an French-Armenian named Pascal. " -- Jonathan Drain 03:13, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
I've heard of cases where caffeine actually induces either mild or severe drowsiness in people who consume it. Reports about the mechanism of action vary regarding what causes it, but the most common I've heard is an enzyme deficiency. Does anybody know of any sources that study or have information on this? Kelbesque 17:58, 4 December 2006 (UTC) i read in a book by herald lamb that coffee was being used around 1530's Harisbhai 21:28, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
This could be possible (anecdotal evidence) in someone with ADHD. 72.211.227.240 21:46, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
I believe that caffè should read café if it is meant to be French.
hey ho. i have a question or two regarding caffeine and metabolism. the body can obviously only absorb so much caffeine at one time, like say, nicotine. if a coffee drinker drinks coffee more slowly, are they getting more caffeine from it or giving a longer plateau of caffeinated time?
i also see down there that smoking increases the metabolism, shortening the half life of caffeine. at one point i was told that cigarettes increase the amount of caffeine the body is able to metabolism - is the case just that smoking makes the body process it faster and thus get a bigger (but faster) rush? JoeSmack Talk 17:54, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
I believe the use of half life to be incorrect here. First, half life is a specific scientific term to discus the period necessary for half of a mass of substance to suffer radioactive decay. Caffiene does not have a half life in this sense, as it is not radioactive, so I believe the use of half-life to be incorrect. Further, In terms of it being metabolized by the body, this is a chemical reaction and relies very heavily on the concentrations and volumes of the various chemicals involved in the reaction. The time necessary to metabolize one half a mass of caffiene is going to be highly dependant on how much caffiene is actually present, and any time listed should be qualified with a range of mass it applies to.-- Joshbw 04:56, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine is not a diuretic, well no more than water is. See this peer reviewed published study....
Caffeine, Fluid-Electrolyte Balance, Temperature Regulation, and Exercise-Heat Tolerance
Posted 07/19/2007
Lawrence E. Armstrong; Douglas J. Casa; Carl M. Maresh; Matthew S. Ganio
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/559762 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.154.23.183 ( talk) 04:43, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
-- Stone 09:41, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
Biosynthesis might be a good point for the biochemistry and a addition to the metabolism.
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (
link){{
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: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (
link){{
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: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (
link)-- Stone 09:54, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
{{
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link)I'm pretty sure this page has been vandalised with the photograph that supposedly shows a spiders web when affected by caffine - seems awfully similar to http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=spider+drugs&search=Search which is a well known spoof. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 124.168.197.83 ( talk)
I have removed a link from under "Overuse" - "excitement" was taking the user to a page on quantum mechanical excitement, which is obviously not appropriate in this context. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.111.8.103 ( talk) 09:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
I will remove the following link: http://www.caffeinated.jp/ because it's broken. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.24.88.222 ( talk) 19:58, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
I believe the line graphics (in addition to not showing the carbon junctions, which I believe is customary, dunno) are missing one of the hydrogen molecules, the one closest to the two nitrogen ones. Caffeine is supposed to have 10. If you look at the ball graphic, there is an additional H hanging off the center left side between two C attached to two N, that doesn't have a match on the other graphic. It would be coming off the C between the two N on the left side (Sorry about the terms, I'm not a chemist....) Sln3412 00:10, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know the difference between the CH3 symbol and the H3C? As in, why is it wrong to change them all to CH3? 198.145.85.152 22:39, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
Gonna off-load everything up through #Topical_caffeine unless anyone complains...all long-ended discussions that were resolved, etc. DMacks 01:24, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
To add to the "Caffeine content of select common food and drugs" table: Product Name: Jolt Gum Serving Size 2 pieces (4g) Caffeine / Serving: ~ 100-135mg*
Also: "The recommended dose of this product contains about as much caffeine as a cup of coffee. This pack contains about as much caffeine as six cups of coffee. Not a substitute for sleep. This product is as safe as coffee or energy drinks." JungleProwler 22:39, 6 March 2007 (UTC)JungleProwler
It says on this page that over 60 known plants contain caffeine. Can there be a list showing what plants contain it and posibly in what amounts and locations (such as leaves, bark, branches, etc....) It might be good for the article. Upon reading that line I became interested in knowing what it was in exactly, so it would probably be a good idea to put it. It would increase the depth of the article; or it could be moved to another page, if this page is thought to be too big for such content. SadanYagci 18:52, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
The page says, "Some yerba mate enthusiasts assert that mateine is a stereoisomer of caffeine, which would make it a different substance altogether.[8] However, caffeine is an achiral molecule, and therefore has no stereoisomers."
Chirality is a type of stereoisomerism, but they are not equivalent. Caffeine and mateine may be the same molecule, but I’m pretty certain the reasoning that caffeine’s achirality proves that it has no stereoisomers is faulty. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.91.144.89 ( talk) 03:31, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
What is meant by "subjective effects"? (in second paragraph of "Tolerance and withdrawal" section)
What does "completely tolerant to most of the effects of caffeine" mean (end of same paragraph)? Does it mean that these people are basically in the same state that they would be if they consumed no caffeine (after any relevant withdrawal period that is)? Does it mean that the effects in the "Effects when taken in moderation" no longer apply (well the ones relating to whatever doseage they are actually taking anyway)?
And some of the examples given in the "in moderation" do not seem all that moderate: reference 36 leads to info about a study involving consumming the equivalent to 10 cups of coffee in two and a half hours; and the heading that reference 37 leads to includes the words "high caffeine dose".
FrankSier 23:45, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
Wow. Does somebody think caffeine is a drug, which should be regulated like nicotine and alcohol, or even banned like cannibis, cocaine, methamphetamine, etc.? I realize that there are some (e.g. Mormons) who have always felt this way about caffeine, and I think it is ironic that the puritanical United States government has tolerated it as long as it has. Shanoman 14:36, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
There's strong evidence that caffeine tolerance is NOT mediated by an increase in adenosine receptors. [1], [2] and [3]so I'd like to remove these sentences from the article but couldn't find a decent wording... Syber 04:46, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
I'm not a chemist, so forgive my ignorance. The info box included "methyltheobromine" as an "other name". I don't see bromine in the formula and have removed "methyltheobromine" from the info box. Please let me know if I'm wrong. Cheers, :) MikeReichold 13:32, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
Could caffeine be used as an entheogen? That is, consumed in a spiritual context like shrooms or cannabis? Not asking if it's a hallucinogen, obviously. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.176.14.100 ( talk • contribs)
One editor suggested that the name be changed to "Coca cola"; however, the source [4] clearly indicates "Coca cola Classic" as the name, and the other source [5] lists "Coca cola" with 45mg per 12oz rather than 34mg, as currently in the article. I therefore suggest that the idea of changing the name be abandoned, even and especially if the data is based on a different, historic formulation of the drink! Samsara ( talk • contribs) 16:33, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
As far as the sources state, the data in both sources comes from Coca cola, not from independent laboratories. One of the sources (second listed above) does not even clearly state this, but simply has a footnote saying "Sources: National Coffee Association, National Soft Drink Association, Tea Council of the USA, and information provided by food, beverage, and pharmaceutical companies and J.J. Barone, H.R. Roberts (1996) “Caffeine Consumption.” Food Chemistry and Toxicology, vol. 34, pp. 119-129.". Samsara ( talk • contribs) 16:36, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
I have been heard that certain drugs can interfere with caffeine metabolism thereby increasing its half-life in circulation. One example cited was oral contraceptives. If this is well-documented in the medical literature it might be valuable to add to this article.
[unsigned]
Serotonin Syndrome
Last week I overdosed on somewhere around 1.5g of caffeine (accidental - I took 100mg every half hour over the course of the day, still tired, finally too much) - resulting in 15 hours of terror (took over 24 hours to return to normal). I have a new-found respect for the drug caffeine.
Yesterday, 8 days after the caffeine overdose, I took a single 300mg St. John's Wart (standardized), and proceeded to endure another day of terror, this time from serotonin syndrome (presumably). I had not taken St. John's Wart or any other medication since the caffeine overdose. Certainly makes for an interesting week.
This SSRI experience makes more sense of the fact that, following the caffeine overdose, after eating I would often experience a flushing sensation. The meals typically involved peanut butter, miso soup, or fish. These foods are contraindicated for users of MOAI's. (MAOI diet: http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/maoi.html)
This summarizes what I have found: "large doses of caffeine taken with antidepressants that have a serotonergic effect put patients at risk of developing the serotonin syndrome." source: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/fulltext/109087387/PDFSTART
Someone more knowledgeable than I might add to the article, explaining how large doses of caffeine can have an MAOI effect, which in combination with SSRI's can result in serotonin syndrome (possibly many days after the caffeine overdose). Also, is the MAOI diet something that should be applied to persons after experiencing a caffeine overdose?
Thanks
Exists ( talk) 03:33, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
There's a discontinuity in the text here, probably due to an editing error, but I'm not an expert on the neurochemistry being discussed and so I am not sure I'm the right person to fix it:
The second paragraph excerpted above introduces material about the renal pharmacology of caffeine, but then the third sentence — "This effect, called competitive inhibition..." — makes no sense at all in this context. It looks like there might have been an interpolation of the first two sentences at the wrong place, i.e. in the middle of the neurochemistry discussion. However, just moving these two sentences will still leave a discontinuity, as the next sentence introduces (de novo) the term "competitive inhibition" even though the term "competetive inhibitor" was used in the previous paragraph. Also, the second paragraph proclaims the "result" of this competive inhibition to be an increase in catecholamines released by via the HPA axis, and how this is supposed to happen is not at all made clear. The first paragraph has what seems to me a more cogent treatment of the effects of adeonsine receptor antagonism, stating that it results in an increase in dopamine activity, and furthermore that this accounts for most of the stimulant effects. Then it says that caffeine can also increase levels of catecholamines "possibly by a different mechanism".
Summary: the sentences about the diuretic effects need to be moved out of the middle of the neurochemistry discussion, and there needs to be some definitive resolution of the two paragraphs that attempt to address the effects of adenosine receptor antagonism.
Mark Lundquist 20:32, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
Does caffeine really sublime at a much lower temperature than it melts - surely this is unusual? Or is the melting only under pressure - in which case it should be mentioned. If the values are correct then perhaps they need comment. Petermr 22:35, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
I think I had a brainstorm - neglect the comment :-) Petermr 11:36, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine does have a melting point. I have tried heating up pharmaceutical grade caffeine (anhydrous) in a melting point apparatus, and I saw it melt at exactly the melting point the Merck Index had. I have also tried making it sublimate, and it did this as well. The thing is that it starts sublimating at about 178c as far as I can remember, but it starts boiling later on. You can stop heating it at 178c and it will just sublimate, but if you keep heating it, it will eventually melt and start boiling.
Hi, The bit about caffeine intoxication mentions using crushed caffeine tablets for snorting. IIRC many caffeine tablets contain sodium hydroxide so that it burns your nose if you do it. Pure caffeine powder is cheap and easy to obtain (eg: from ebay). bought a kilo for £35 (around $70) and it's good. Can be added to drinks, or snorted. I hear it can also be smoked, but I have never succeeded. 217.134.101.219 20:06, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Yes, caffeine at very high doses = strychnine. Tim Vickers 03:54, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
It could be added that the amount of caffeine in green tea can be reduced by putting hot water (80°C) over the tee and then throwing the water away. The water will contain most of the caffeine and this will not significantely alter the taste of the tea. Then the tee can be steeped in a hot water like normal. (german: de:Grüner_Tee#Entkoffeinierung ) -- helohe (talk) 23:45, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
Excuse the primitive editing, but I noticed a seeming error in the statement of the word's origin. It states that the French word for coffee is caffè, which is, in fact the Italian word for coffee. The French is café, and your source for this fact has that term. Returnoftheavenged 12:45, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
The article may be entirely correct, but it seems contradictory on the surface: in the mechanism of action section, caffeine is said to act by inhibiting adenosine receptors, thus acting as an indirect vasodilator (in addition to the sympathetic vasodilation effects). However, in the withdrawal section, the disinhibition of adenosine is said to cause vasodilation. It's unclear how both inhibition and disinhibition of adenosine cause vasodilation. (Perhaps these are localized effects? If so, that could be clarified.) Twthompson 16:54, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
A general question. What does this statement mean: "The world's primary source of caffeine is the coffee bean." If we know that worldwide tea is the second most consumed beverage after water, does the statement refer to the amount of caffeine that comes from coffee? I wonder if the first source listed should be tea or at least the have the wording changed to "One of the world's primary sources of caffeine is coffee." Thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.134.45.231 ( talk • contribs) 02:26, 12 August 2007
The lead paragraph references alternate names for caffeine by origin and also that the given names are not considered valid chemical designations. Neither "fact" (the accuracy of the names or the validity of the designations) are cited and both should be. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 22:41, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine
Name of Substance
1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- 3,7-Dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione Caffeine Caffeine [BAN:JAN]
Synonyms
1,3,7-Trimethyl-2,6-dioxopurine 1,3,7-Trimethylxanthine 1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- 3,7-Dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione 5-26-13-00558 (Beilstein Handbook Reference) AI3-20154 Alert-pep Anhydrous caffeine BRN 0017705 CCRIS 1314 Cafamil Cafecon Cafeina Caffedrine Caffein Caffeina [Italian] Caffeine Caffeine (natural) Caffeine, anhydrous Caffeine, synthetic Caffine Cafipel Coffein [German] Coffeine Coffeinum Dexitac EINECS 200-362-1 Eldiatric C FEMA No. 2224 Guaranine HSDB 36 Hycomine Kofein [Czech] Koffein Koffein [German] Mateina Methyltheobromide Methyltheobromine Methylxanthine theophylline NCI-C02733 NO-Doz NSC 5036 Nix Nap Nodaca Organex Quick-Pep Refresh'N Stim Thein Theine Theobromine, 1-methyl- Theophylline, 7-methyl Tirend Vivarin Xanthine, 1,3,7-trimethyl
Systematic Name
1H-Purine-2,6-dione, 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl- Caffeine
Superlist Name
Caffeine
U.S. National Library of Medicine, 8600 Rockville Pike, Bethesda, MD 20894, National Institutes of Health, Department of Health & Human Services Copyright and Privacy Policy, Freedom of Information Act, Accessibility Customer Service: tehip@teh.nlm.nih.gov. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jclerman ( talk • contribs) 08:14, August 21, 2007 (UTC).
The article seems to be lacking information about caffeinated bathing products ( 1, 2, 3 ) and criticism they have received ( 4, 5, 6 ). -- Easyas12c 11:26, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
As far as i'm aware, the premise of caffeinated bathing procuts is that the caffiene produces a localised stimulant/irritant reaction on the skin surface, not that the caffeine is absorbed into the central nervous system and results in a systemic reaction or 'buzz', as these references seem to claim (the 'thinkgeek' products, which anyway seem to me to be novelty/spoof products) and then test. Xanatrilby ( talk) 13:33, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
I've added calls for citations in the overuse section. Unlike the tolerance/withdrawal section, the claims here are a little sketchy.
The term "caffeineism" isn't defined in either of the sources that are cited thereafter. It definitely needs a source.
It's unclear why "caffeine dependency" is in quotes - are they intended to be scare quotes? The http://www.minddisorders.com/Br-Del/Caffeine-related-disorders.html source that's cited actually details that there's debate and uncertainty over whether the term "substance dependency" can be applied to caffeine at all. Without a source asserting clearly that it can, this section could use some cleanup. Tofof 00:31, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
Is there anything to be said regarding plants that make caffeine ability to use it as a reversible store of Nitrogen. How do non-caffeine producing plants react to caffeine, and metabolise caffeine. Can caffeine be absorbed by roots? 71.114.163.55 —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 19:33, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
The table in appendix A is interesting - however it fails to take account of either the caffeine-like substances contained in chocolate, which obviously boost the "caffeine effect" of chocolate very considerably (as any "chocoholic" will recognise) - and the fact that the strength of brew of tea has a very great influence on the amount of caffeine in it (any non-American who has ever made a cup of tea for an American will know all about that!!). I have added a note to this effect - although it is in a way subjective and POV??? Soundofmusicals 06:34, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
just how much caffein does one get from tea and what amounts can lead to dependency? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chenjeri ( talk • contribs) 02:37, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
The following should be added to the Caffeine Equivalents chart: "One 6 fluid ounce cup of regular Espresso coffee (355 millilitres)" Or "Two 3 fluid ounce cups of regular Espresso coffee (355 millilitres)" As is stated in the Espresso article. And "Two 8 fluid ounce cups of regular coffee (470 millilitres)" instead of "containers" since 8 fl oz = 1 cup. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lturcoklyl ( talk • contribs) 07:53, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
caffeine is certainly an addictive drug that has toxicity above illegal ones such as THC, and even way more than heroin if isolated in pure form. what factor made it unusually easy to access and virtually no law is made against it? If it keeps people awake and increases productivity (I confess that this happens to me and myself has more or less dependency on it), amphetamine does it too. I am against drug prohibition in general and thankful to the fact that there is this legal drug, but just wonder what's the reason that caffeine is both legally and socially tolerated way much more than other psychoactive drugs, legal or illegal? Wooyi Talk to me? 16:36, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
I think that custom and practice make it legal. It is way more popular than alcohol and nicotine, all of which are more popular than illegal drugs. (If caffein lost its popularity, it could become illegal.) It is surprising though that soft drink manufacturers are allowed to add an addictive drug to a product sold to children. -- 74.15.53.217 07:03, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
This assertion needs to be qualified. Most popular according to which criterion? The article has the following sentence: "Today, global consumption of caffeine has been estimated at 120,000 tons per annum,[25] making it the world's most popular psychoactive substance". Since the assertion in question is part of a sentence that mentions annual consumption by mass, the reader could assume that the criterion is indeed "mass consumed per year". But even a cursory look at articles on beer and wine will show that this is not possible. Based on these two articles, I estimate that annual consumption of ethanol is about 5 million tons from beer and 2 million tons from wine (and probably a few more million tons from other beverages). The total is roughly 100 times larger than for caffeine. Of course, one "dose" of caffeine is much smaller than one dose of alcohol, caffeine being measured in milligrams while alcohol is measured in grams, so perhaps caffeine is "more popular by number of 'doses'". In any case this should be clarified and better sources found if possible. -- Itub 15:39, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know where the caffein in soft drinks comes from? I know that some of it is extracted when decaf is made, but people drink a lot more caffeinated soft drinks than decaffeinated coffee and tea. I cannot find anything about this. -- 74.15.53.217 07:08, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Caffeine intoxication is very clearly noted in DSM IV and someone who contributed to the main article had obviously read DSM IV but there have been many other myths and such mixed into the passage and the entire main article making it difficult for a passing reader to differentiate between what is true and what isn't. Practically all of the section in the main article about caffeine intoxication is taken from DSM IV although it is important to note that intoxication starts from 100mg caffeine per day, not the specified 400mg; also irritability, depression, lapses in judgment, disorientation, loss of social inhibition, delusions, hallucinations, psychosis, rhabdomyolysis and death are all made up symptoms. Also for some of the more worrying real symptoms the user must take caffeine on a long-term basis. However one can become resistant to all caffeine intoxication side effects as the body becomes resistant/compensates in certain areas for the caffeine so side effects from caffeine intoxication are more severe in irregular users so some may debate that taking high levels of caffeine on a regular basis is better for you than taking any amount occasionally.
Caffeine withdrawals are a serious concern to regular users though, the side effects from withdrawal are quite unpleasant and theoretically if the body has allowed for the effects of caffeine then there is a risk that opposite symptoms may occur, e.g. Tiredness, slow thoughts, less frequent urination, lower physical performance, etc.
Does caffiene really have a laxative effect or is this just a myth? If it does I think it'd be worth a mention in this article.-- 218.153.87.138 10:54, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
Yes, like all CNS stimulents it does. Ranunculoid ( talk) 19:08, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
I'd always believed that it was the coffee creamer that worked as a laxitive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:37, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
The baldness treatment article says that caffeine can be used as treatment? 132.205.44.5 ( talk) 01:15, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
"In healthy adults, caffeine's half-life is approximately 3–4 hours."
Reference(s)?? I've found articles elsewhere online saying the half-life is around 6 hours (e.g. http://science.howstuffworks.com/question5311.htm). 81.104.186.166 17:38, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
One of the hydrogen atoms (far left) is not shown in the structural formula. I think it is a bit unfortunate to show a hybrid between explicit formula and skeletal formula in this way. -- Etxrge ( talk) 11:54, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
From what I've seen, it's pretty standard for semi-skeletal formulas to be used; the only parts that are rarely shown as a complete skeletal are the methyl groups, which are typically represented by the CH3 that's used in the formula. The only place I've seen methyl groups represented completely skeletally is in simple hydrocarbons, such as " toluene" or methylbenzene. Then again, the most advanced chemistry qualification that I have is an AP chemistry class and some spare time spent looking and building models of organic molecules, so "what I've seen" should be taken at face value (as I see you're an engineer). XarBiogeek ( talk) 00:01, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
The article is protected from editing by guests, so I couldn't add this myself, bet there's something interesting about caffeine and it's effect on testosterone.
Caffeine elevates SHBG. This results in reduced free testosterone levels.
Source: American Journal of Epidemiology (144:642-44, 1996)
Regards, -- 83.24.45.122 ( talk) 03:41, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
Here is something from CNN about caffeine soap. It's just a transcript, but it is CNN. 212.179.71.70 ( talk) 10:37, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
This seems to be becoming more and more popular (although I haven't exactly been keeping tabs on it, it could've very well been just as popular twenty years ago), and I think it should be mentioned in the article. The people I know who do this generally take two, three, four or in one case seventeen caffeine pills at a time, and oftentimes do not wait the recommended amount of time before taking more. It's usually used in combination with other drugs (marijuana, alcohol), mainly to keep one from "crashing." 70.49.132.93 ( talk) 16:36, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I added (with a reference):
Caffeine relaxes the internal anal sphincter muscles, causing a laxative effect and thus should be avoided by those with incontinence.
I'm aware of people using it deliberately as a laxative (e.g. by drinking tea - although they may not be aware that it's the caffeine giving the effect). I didn't see a notable reference on this. Someone please add if you find one. -- Chriswaterguy talk 03:55, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
"An acute overdose of caffeine, usually in excess of 250 milligrams"
I dont understand how an acute overdose of caffeine can be 250mg as stated in this article. Further up the same page, the article states that strong caffeine pills contain 200mg of Caffeine. Thus someone taking two strong caffeine pills will have had a caffeine overdose? Or, Jolt Cola has apparently 150mg of Caffeine. Thus making two cans of Jolt an overdose. When I was at college I would regularly have three of more cans of Jolt in a row without any ill effects. I think this must be a type error and it should say 250 millgrams per body weight in kg, for example. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.38.135.218 ( talk) 20:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
The "Occurrence" section currently says, in part
That's not a great way of saying how much is in tea. Are we trying to say that Tea ranges from 20 mg to 50 mg? If so, then we should probably say exactly that.
Perhaps a table would be in order, with a range for each substance?
Source | mg of Caffeine | Serving Size |
---|---|---|
arabica-variety espresso coffee | 40 mg | single shot (30 milliliters) |
drip coffee | 100 mg | a cup (120 milliliters) |
decafinated coffee | ?? mg | a cup (120 milliliters) |
ordinary western tea | 20 to 50mg | a cup |
oolong tea | ??? | a cup |
(cola based?) softdrink | 10 to 50 mg | ??? |
energy drinks | 80 mg | ??? |
chocolate | ?? mg | 50 g? |
Regards, Ben Aveling 05:42, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
This is most certainly not a reliable source; it has no established reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. I have removed one claim (caffeine not solely responsible for gastric ulcers, since decaffeinated coffee also irritates the stomach lining) and properly sourced another (ld50 in rats.) Please do not re-add Erowid for any purpose. < eleland/ talk edits> 23:02, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
The image of the caffeine molecule on the page is different from the one on this shirt. Which one is the correct one? -- AS Artimour ( talk) 21:01, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
The direction of writing the methyl group (H3C and CH3) makes no difference to the identity of the molecule depicted. You just write H3C if carbon is bonded to something to its right.
The two depictions (t-shirt and article) represent the same molecule.
Ben ( talk) 19:17, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
Searching for "formula" in this talk page finds other questions asked and answered related to confusion arising from laymen encountering the hybrid (not skeletal) formula. Perhaps the treatment in Propane is a good model, where 4 alternate depictions are given. But, in one day, I personally have gone from confusion to understanding (even before seeing it verified in those other Q/A) that the CH3 could/should be omitted from a skeletal formula. (Also, propane has better "explanations" when you hover your mouse over the diagrams (alt text?)).-- SportWagon ( talk) 17:02, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
That's news to me. I've been drinking coffe since I was 7 & I'm the the tallest woman in my extended family. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:33, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Correlation does not mean causation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.18.180.214 ( talk) 06:12, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
To much jargin to read through. Which parts mention why caffine makes some people tired? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.122.193 ( talk) 18:35, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Apparently it doesn't make you dehydrated as commonly thought. [13]. Worth adding? - Ravedave ( talk) 02:24, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Seems coffee and caffeine raise insulin levels and stress hormones. Why isn't this discussed in detail? Seems like a perfect recipe for obesity, abdominal obesity and all the diseases of modern civilization.
The other thing is... caffeine is extremely addictive with a very brutal withdrawal period with lingering fatigue and depression that can last upwards of two months. No doubt most if not all of the posters here and editors are users. How can we trust essentially addicts to dissemminate accurate information about this addictive drug?
I find this really hilarious:
"This is not the only case where caffeine increases the effectiveness of a drug. Caffeine makes pain relievers 40% more effective in relieving headaches and helps the body absorb headache medications more quickly, bringing faster relief.[62] For this reason, many over-the-counter headache drugs include caffeine"
This is not the case at all in the particular case of taking an analgesic with caffeine when withdrawing from caffeine. The caffeine is relieving the headache because you are getting a fix and blunting the withdrawal period, the main effect of which is powerful headaches.
68.161.194.64 ( talk) 20:00, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Since caffeine is linked from the thermogenics section and mentioned there, maybe is should be covered. If that is the case a distinction will have to be made as to its effects on metabolism (general metabolism of caloric intake) vs. metabolism of the caffeine itself into the body. The fact that caffeine is a well-known mild thermogenic yet it is not covered in a section entitled "metabolism" seems very confusing especially if one is looking for that information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.143.157.3 ( talk) 18:19, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
I searched briefly, but wasn't able to find any references to support the assertion that caffeine alters the levels of sex hormones in men and women (it's very late though, and I'm too tired to be rigorous). This is a very high-profile article, so I thought it best to remove the entire section for now lest we see it quoted all over the Net in the next few weeks.
—Preceding
unsigned comment added by
ClockworkSoul (
talk •
contribs) –
Clockwork
Soul 07:07, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
After reading the article from top to bottom I noticed that in the religion section, while the information is fairly accurate, the sentence "These people also refrain from consuming alcoholic beverages such as wine or beer and smoking cigarettes" does not seem to be on topic, article appropriate, or have any beneficial value to this article. It reads as more of an aside than anything else. I'm suggesting that it be removed, unless someone can suggest a valid reason for it being there. Aristophrenia ( talk) 05:54, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't wikipedia aiming at using S.I. units rather than fake-imperial units? Nergaal ( talk) 10:19, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
This article talk page was automatically added with {{ WikiProject Food and drink}} banner as it falls under Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . Maximum and careful attention was done to avoid any wrongly tagging any categories , but mistakes may happen... If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot ( talk) 06:45, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
The lead section currently says: "unlike most other psychoactive substances, it is legal and unregulated in nearly all jurisdictions."
Are we aware of any jurisdiction in which it is illegal or regulated? --
201.17.36.246 (
talk) 20:13, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
Few comments:
Jclerman ( talk) 23:52, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
I don't understand this sentence in the context: At this point, the neuron has very little energy left for the successful firing of an action potential. the article's talking about a single molecule of ATP. Can it be clarified? delldot talk 18:21, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
"THis is not the only..." This paragraph seems to be misplaced; it has nothing to do with "Tolerance and withdrawal". But I couldn't find the appropriate place for it. Will someone please put it in the right place? I added a header to lessen confusion, but the transition phrase now doesn't make sense. 198.99.123.63 ( talk) 18:56, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
I think the section "Mechanism of action" needs clarification. Is it intended to say that the only known effect of caffeine in normal dosages is as an adenosine receptor blocker, and that the other effects (increases in dopamine, acetylcholine, etc.) are due indirectly to this? If so, perhaps this should be explicitly stated. 82.1.151.34 ( talk) 16:27, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
I would like to put forward my support for this article and give praise for those who created and edited it. Although it contains many scentific parts, they are easy to understand and well written. Maybe it could be used as some sort of example template for new users to go by? Well done. Wikisaver62 ( talk) 09:32, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
Following from my rambling on this page at Is the image of the Caffeine Molecule correct? , my recent edit demonstrated how to improve the text of the diagrams when you hover your mouse over them. Watchers of this page, please review and improve (e.g. I'm not sure "hybrid skeletal" sounds right to a chemist). You probably watchlisted it anyway, but also perhaps see Propane for my inspiration and crib-sheet. It's sort of strange that the hover text is not taken, at lesat by default, from the image page.-- SportWagon ( talk) 22:04, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
A small edit war has developed concerning caffeine levels in energy drinks. According to this source, caffeine levels vary from about 9.64 mg/oz (about 80 mg/serving) for Red Bull, to as much as 500 mg in a can of Fixx. Thus, I'm reverting back to the 80+ version. If you feel that the information is wrong, please give a source that is better. looie496 ( talk) 04:53, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
The figures given for some of the coffee-based drinks look totally wrong to me, many of them lack sources, and are mathematically suspect: 1. There is in practice no such thing as a Robusto espresso - at most you would get maybe 10-20% Robusto / Arabica mix in some Italian blends - virtually all of them are 100% Arabica (literally half the caffeine) beans. 2. There is no such thing as 150mL espresso shot. A single is 30mL; a double 60mL. 3. I don't know what a "fl. oz" equates to in metric, but I assume Starbucks would use either a single (30 mL) or more probably double (60 mL) espresso shot to create it. Even if they were using the higher caffeine content of the Robusto from (1), that suggests a ceiling of ( 200 mg / 150 mL ) * 60 mL = 80 mg; not the 200 mg claimed. 4. More realistic figures are given in the "coffee" entry of wikipedia. There are figures given at http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeine/AN01211 that look a little better, (although the instant coffee is a bit misleading, since it doesn't specify how much coffee powder is added and instant coffee is usually thought to contain more caffeine for the same amount of taste, since the beans are extracted for longer, and taste gets extracted before caffeine). Perhaps the references to Starbucks could be completely done away with. It would be more meaningful for non-Americans to refer to non-proprietary drinks, eg. http://books.google.com/books?id=YdpL2YCGLVYC&pg=PA230&dq=%22caffeine+content%22#PPA327,M1
I changed the Robusto entry, because it was wrong in so many ways. I also changed the "regular coffee" entry to "instant coffee", since "regular" is pretty meaningless to me. I extrapolated these figures from the above book. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.244.160.212 ( talk) 23:51, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
An IP editor has changed the article to state that caffeine is not a diuretic, giving as evidence http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/jhnd/abstract.00009862-200312000-00004.htm -- Caffeine ingestion and fluid balance: a review. Journal of Human Nutrition & Dietetics December 2003, 16:6. The change was made in a way that broke the grammar, though, and was followed by two other IP edits that made things even worse, so I have for the moment reverted all four edits in the hope that the question could be discussed here before any changes are made to the article. Opinions? looie496 ( talk) 17:39, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
The references in the appendix do not work correctly. The
tag clears out the internal array of data when it is used, so the last two links do not point up correctly (I should know, seeing is I was extending the cite extension last week). By my first-glance assessment, there are three ways to fix this:
The chart includes the item "Coffee, Starbucks" but it is not clear whether this means Starbucks espresso or Starbucks drip coffee. On the one hand, when most people hear "Starbucks" they think espresso, but on the other, "coffee" usually indicates drip or brew coffee. Which is it? Brentonboy ( talk) 23:07, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
I have just moved this passage from lead to body: Despite its widespread use and the conventional view that it is a safe substance, a 2008 study suggested that pregnant women who consume 200 milligrams or more of caffeine per day have about twice the miscarriage risk as women who consume none. However, another 2008 study found no correlation between miscarriage and caffeine consumption. I moved it because the sources are too weak to justify putting this in the lead -- one primary source and a newspaper article. The primary source uses a design that can only show correlation, not causation, so there is no basis for flagging this as "important" by putting it in the lead. Looie496 ( talk) 18:53, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
How many different types of caffine are there? Is the same type of caffine used in tea and coffee? Is there more caffine in tea or coffee per cup? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.69.186.42 ( talk) 14:03, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
Someone needs to recalculate this section based on the table of content values. Eg Green Tea is way off. Rjk ( talk) 15:38, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
I suggest to delete the history parts that are not related to the chemcical compound coffein, that mean everything except the two last paragraphs which describe the first synthesis, etc. A disclaimer and link to the history of coffee page is enough. This would trim the article which is too long, IMHO. Northfox ( talk) 12:04, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
The article's first sentence says is anthropocentrically biased. It says "Caffeine is a bitter, white crystalline xanthine alkaloid that acts as a psychoactive stimulant drug and a mild diuretic[3] in humans and animals."
(I mean, it suggests that humans are not animals)
I'm surprised to see this in a featured article, but then again, anthropocentrism is ambient in our culture.
I would have changed this myself if the article wasn't featured. 195.49.248.147 ( talk) 20:52, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
How about changing it to "... in humans and other animals." ? - 195.49.248.147 ( talk) 22:35, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Nice one boys; I'm on my sixth cup (of caffeinated coffee) of the day, and I'm still alive and kicking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.72.110.11 ( talk) 15:56, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
There are three paragraphs in the "Mechanism of action" section that refer entirely to adenosine mechanisms of secrection and action, where caffeine is not mentioned once. I know that it is important to explain "adenosine slow the neurons down, so caffeine speeds them up", but I think going into this much details about adenosine shouldn't be in an article about caffeine. Independovirus ( talk) 07:32, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
References 68-79 cover the section about "caffeinism" and the detrimental effects on your health of large-scale caffeine consumption. Many of these articles are from the 1980s. Is this position still widely held? I'm asking this because I've never read that the effects can be so drastic. Are we sure that this isn't a 1980s belief that is no longer widely held? Epa101 ( talk) 20:40, 4 February 2009 (UTC)
I ate 100 coffee cherries, but spit out the hard seeds.
I went to sleep anyway, two hours later.
I conclude the caffeine is all contained in the hard seeds, and not the sweet cherry meat.
Please add evidence to the contrary to the article.
In fact, any statement in the article either way would be appreciated. Jidanni ( talk) 22:59, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
Coffee processing talks about which parts of the cherry are used to make "coffee" and which are discarded, so you can see if what you did/didn't-eat matches the part that is widely used as a caffeine source. DMacks ( talk) 23:38, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
All I read is the decaffeination process is applied after the flesh is removed. So we still don't know how much caffeine is in the flesh.
However, I have some more genuine original research for you:
So there must not be any caffeine in the sweet fruit part, or else the plant would have a conflict of interest and probably unable to compete (in evolution)! Jidanni ( talk) 23:38, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
OK, the third item you quote seems to mention that the animals sometimes reach their caffeine limit eating the pulps they are fed... Jidanni ( talk) 06:48, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
I have edited the metabolite percentages to match the source (it doesn't equal 100% now because there are at least 17 metabolites in total) but the picture is still wrong. can someone with the appropriate skills please correct this. Triscut ( talk) 02:50, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
The whole section stating drinks with an equivalent of 200mg is uncited, and contradicts very strongly with the caffeine content shown higher up on the page. In fact green tea differs by almost double the caffeine content when compared to the above table. I am going to delete it, and if an admin disagrees they can feel free to reverse it. 24.65.95.239 ( talk) 20:45, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Adding another high Caffeine content drink Viso which has 300mg per serving. Adding a stub link to wiki.
Someone should add a section about the use of caffeine in molecular biology as an inhibitor of DNA repair: caffeine namely both inhibits the DNA damage signaling kinases ATM and ATR and also acts in as yet uncharacterised ways on other DNA damage signalling or repair pathways. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.77.192.140 ( talk) 12:32, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Occurence, 2nd paragraph: "Some yerba mate enthusiasts assert that mateine is a stereoisomer of caffeine, which would make it a different substance altogether.[14] This is not true because caffeine is an achiral molecule, and therefore has no enantiomers; nor does it have other stereoisomers."
Despite the 'some yerba mate enthusiasts' qualifier, this section still feels contradictory. Even with the citations, both sentences seem speculative. As I do not know which is correct, I don't feel justified in removing either sentence, but one of them should go, or at least be moved to another section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.70.34.109 ( talk) 20:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
At this writing, the second sentence of the lede asserts flatly that caffeine is not a diuretic, and gives three sources. Two of them do not in fact assert directly that it is not a diuretic, but only cast doubt on the claim that it is; the third ref is not available without subscription so I don't know what it says.
Further down, the article points out that theobromine is a metabolite of caffeine, and assserts that theobromine "increases urine volume", which to my unpracticed eye says that it is a diuretic.
I have no position on whether caffeine is a diuretic; I just want the article to be both internally consistent and consistent with its sources, and at present neither of those appears to be true. -- Trovatore ( talk) 21:32, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
i can't find a citation for this. i'm looking through some history databases with the term "arabian wine" and coffee. the closest thing i can find is a reference to palm wine, which is also known as arabian wine, in this document at jstor (subscription required). the reference is on page 58 of the original publication, or page 62 of the digital copy. Daiv ( talk) 05:57, 1 June 2009 (UTC)
Why is Duration of effects under Decaffeination? Should it be under pharmacology?