This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Netherlands, an attempt to create, expand, and improve articles related to the
Netherlands on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, visit the
project page where you can join the project or contribute to the
discussion.NetherlandsWikipedia:WikiProject NetherlandsTemplate:WikiProject NetherlandsNetherlands articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject History, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the subject of
History on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.HistoryWikipedia:WikiProject HistoryTemplate:WikiProject Historyhistory articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Geography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
geography on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GeographyWikipedia:WikiProject GeographyTemplate:WikiProject Geographygeography articles
This article is within the scope of
WikiProject Frisia, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.FrisiaWikipedia:WikiProject FrisiaTemplate:WikiProject FrisiaFrisia articles
The contents of the Lake Flevo page were
merged into
Zuiderzee on 16 July 2024. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see
its talk page.
The contents of the Almere (lake) page were
merged into
Zuiderzee on 16 July 2024. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see
its talk page.
Floods
Could somebody who knows about the 1287 wall break and flood that killed 50,000 write about that in this entry? This is an interesting fact and since it is a timely anniversary I would like to place this article on te
Main Page at least a few days. --
mav 00:30 Dec 15, 2002 (UTC)
This is the St Lucia flood; one of the more serious floods in The Netherlands. However it's not specifically related to the Zuiderzee. Its force has had impact throughout the Dutch coastline.
Aliter 13:08, 21 Oct 2003 (UTC)
Do we have a page on floods or storms, somewhere?
Aliter 03:54, 26 Nov 2003 (UTC)
Title
Why on earth was this page created with the name "Zuider Zee" when apparently there is/was a page with the correct name "Zuiderzee"? The latter is the official spelling and I cannot imagine any pressing need to invent a different "English" spelling for what is and remains a Dutch word. If anything, the redirection should go the other way. At least the article content (except for the main heading) has the correct spelling. If I knew how to fix this redirection, I would, but I don't - if an editor can make this correction I would be grateful. I really hate to see geographical names in my country spelled incorrectly.
JavaWoman (
talk)
08:18, 30 September 2008 (UTC)reply
Zuider Zee is how it has historically been known in English to British people. Of course you may try and change this. Maybe it's colonialist or something, but often neighbouring countries have names in neighbouring languages. Hook of Holland, anyone? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
82.5.196.33 (
talk)
23:55, 9 December 2015 (UTC)reply
Cat: Former lake vs. Shrunken lake
I tagged this as a former lake, as there is currently nothing called the Zuider Zee; it could, however, be argued that the lake has been artificially shrunken into IJssel lake, in which case, the cat: Shrunken lake would be appropriate. The two categories are theoretically mutually exclusive. Ah well, one cat is better than none.
samwaltz22:23, 3 February 2007 (UTC)reply
I do have objections categorizing it as either a "Former lake" or a "Shrunken lake" since both are simply incorrect. The Zuiderzee (note spelling) never was anything but a bay (off the North Sea). The IJsselmeer is a lake that came into being when the Zuiderzee was dammed, but there was never a period when the Zuiderzee was a lake or the IJsselmeer was a bay: when the dam was finished the former ceased to exist and the latter came into being.
JavaWoman (
talk)
08:24, 30 September 2008 (UTC)reply
Yes, of course English speakers have default ways they'd read those letters in that combination. No, it's not the same as the Dutch and, no, it's not misleading. We can still remove it pending WP:RS being used, which would probably be hard to find since most don't bother with informal pronunciations of minor historical geographical features. Once sources are found, it can still be shunted to the
Wiktionary entry because Wikipedia is WP:NOTADICTIONARY. Then it just depends on whether other editors thing it's useful or not. Personally, I'd be in favor of losing the Dutch pronunciation as useless trivia (English speakers don't make those exact sounds) and keeping the English pronunciation to help people know if it's zai, zway, or zoo-ee. At minimum, the Dutch should be in the infobox and not cluttering up the lead sentence. —
LlywelynII02:10, 20 May 2023 (UTC)reply
"Now the IJsselmeer"
Apart from not using Dutch orthography in English (which is a matter for the
Ijsselmeer's own talk page), this seems to be entirely wrong. The former Zuiderzee has been divided into the southern part of the
Wadden Sea, the
Ijsselmeer, and the
Markermeer. If the name for all three of them together is still Zuiderzee, this article should be written to say that. If the name for all three of them together is now Ijsselmeer, that article needs to be completely rewritten and this article needs to be corrected to show that sometimes 'Ijsselmeer' only refers to the central part of what was once the Zuiderzee. —
LlywelynII02:14, 20 May 2023 (UTC)reply
This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Netherlands, an attempt to create, expand, and improve articles related to the
Netherlands on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, visit the
project page where you can join the project or contribute to the
discussion.NetherlandsWikipedia:WikiProject NetherlandsTemplate:WikiProject NetherlandsNetherlands articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject History, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the subject of
History on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.HistoryWikipedia:WikiProject HistoryTemplate:WikiProject Historyhistory articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Geography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
geography on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GeographyWikipedia:WikiProject GeographyTemplate:WikiProject Geographygeography articles
This article is within the scope of
WikiProject Frisia, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.FrisiaWikipedia:WikiProject FrisiaTemplate:WikiProject FrisiaFrisia articles
The contents of the Lake Flevo page were
merged into
Zuiderzee on 16 July 2024. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see
its talk page.
The contents of the Almere (lake) page were
merged into
Zuiderzee on 16 July 2024. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see
its talk page.
Floods
Could somebody who knows about the 1287 wall break and flood that killed 50,000 write about that in this entry? This is an interesting fact and since it is a timely anniversary I would like to place this article on te
Main Page at least a few days. --
mav 00:30 Dec 15, 2002 (UTC)
This is the St Lucia flood; one of the more serious floods in The Netherlands. However it's not specifically related to the Zuiderzee. Its force has had impact throughout the Dutch coastline.
Aliter 13:08, 21 Oct 2003 (UTC)
Do we have a page on floods or storms, somewhere?
Aliter 03:54, 26 Nov 2003 (UTC)
Title
Why on earth was this page created with the name "Zuider Zee" when apparently there is/was a page with the correct name "Zuiderzee"? The latter is the official spelling and I cannot imagine any pressing need to invent a different "English" spelling for what is and remains a Dutch word. If anything, the redirection should go the other way. At least the article content (except for the main heading) has the correct spelling. If I knew how to fix this redirection, I would, but I don't - if an editor can make this correction I would be grateful. I really hate to see geographical names in my country spelled incorrectly.
JavaWoman (
talk)
08:18, 30 September 2008 (UTC)reply
Zuider Zee is how it has historically been known in English to British people. Of course you may try and change this. Maybe it's colonialist or something, but often neighbouring countries have names in neighbouring languages. Hook of Holland, anyone? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
82.5.196.33 (
talk)
23:55, 9 December 2015 (UTC)reply
Cat: Former lake vs. Shrunken lake
I tagged this as a former lake, as there is currently nothing called the Zuider Zee; it could, however, be argued that the lake has been artificially shrunken into IJssel lake, in which case, the cat: Shrunken lake would be appropriate. The two categories are theoretically mutually exclusive. Ah well, one cat is better than none.
samwaltz22:23, 3 February 2007 (UTC)reply
I do have objections categorizing it as either a "Former lake" or a "Shrunken lake" since both are simply incorrect. The Zuiderzee (note spelling) never was anything but a bay (off the North Sea). The IJsselmeer is a lake that came into being when the Zuiderzee was dammed, but there was never a period when the Zuiderzee was a lake or the IJsselmeer was a bay: when the dam was finished the former ceased to exist and the latter came into being.
JavaWoman (
talk)
08:24, 30 September 2008 (UTC)reply
Yes, of course English speakers have default ways they'd read those letters in that combination. No, it's not the same as the Dutch and, no, it's not misleading. We can still remove it pending WP:RS being used, which would probably be hard to find since most don't bother with informal pronunciations of minor historical geographical features. Once sources are found, it can still be shunted to the
Wiktionary entry because Wikipedia is WP:NOTADICTIONARY. Then it just depends on whether other editors thing it's useful or not. Personally, I'd be in favor of losing the Dutch pronunciation as useless trivia (English speakers don't make those exact sounds) and keeping the English pronunciation to help people know if it's zai, zway, or zoo-ee. At minimum, the Dutch should be in the infobox and not cluttering up the lead sentence. —
LlywelynII02:10, 20 May 2023 (UTC)reply
"Now the IJsselmeer"
Apart from not using Dutch orthography in English (which is a matter for the
Ijsselmeer's own talk page), this seems to be entirely wrong. The former Zuiderzee has been divided into the southern part of the
Wadden Sea, the
Ijsselmeer, and the
Markermeer. If the name for all three of them together is still Zuiderzee, this article should be written to say that. If the name for all three of them together is now Ijsselmeer, that article needs to be completely rewritten and this article needs to be corrected to show that sometimes 'Ijsselmeer' only refers to the central part of what was once the Zuiderzee. —
LlywelynII02:14, 20 May 2023 (UTC)reply