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I'm not sure if the section saying: "Amir has never expressed regret for his act of murder. Amir is viewed by many in Israel as a hero for his act particularly amongst the Right wing but is hated by the Left who worshipped Rabin as an idol. Rabin is seen by many as being responsible for the deaths of 1200 Israelis through the Oslo accords that gave the PLO terrorist organisation both guns and territory. Rabin is also remebered for his younger days when as commander of the Palmach (underground fighters) he ordered his men to fire at the Irgun ship the Altalena, that killed 11 Jewish fighters from the Irgun."
is a totally balanced view. It seems to imply that Rabin was despised by all but a small fantical following. Many viewed him as an only hope for peace in the middle east. Further more the dividing up of "the left", and "the right" is really a fair way to state things. Finally the writer makes "the left", sound unreasonable, for hating a murderer. --—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.206.116.123 ( talk • contribs) 01:17, 25 May 2004 (UTC)
The explanation can be found here. Unfortunately the linked article is not so easy to correct, because the title itself is wrong. -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 192.117.3.51 ( talk • contribs) 03:23, 28 September 2004 (UTC)
This page should mention www.barrychamish.com which is the website in english that shows that Yigal Amir shot blanks and Rabin's bodyguards murdered Rabin. In hebrew the website would be www.yigalamir.com -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.0.175.65 ( talk • contribs) 07:04, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
I think it would be better to let the reader to decide whether it's a murder or an helpful killing. In the article JFK the word "murder" is not used as well. -- Haham hanuka 17:09, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
-- Aleph4 17:07, 28 July 2005 (UTC)
Sorry, but I don't see what the dispute is with the terminology.
1. Was Rabin "killed"? Yigal deliberately caused Rabin's death. Ergo, I believe it is accurate to say that Amir "killed" Rabin.
2. Was Rabin "murdered"? I have yet to hear anyone argue that Amir acted in self-defense or that his actions were accidental. Ergo, I believe it is accurate to say that Amir "murdered" Rabin.
3. Was Rabin "assassinated"? Amir wasn't personally acquainted with Rabin so the traditional motivations for ordinary murder don't really apply. Amir specifically targetted Rabin for political reasons and killed him to bring about political change in Israel. While there is no universally-accepted definition of "assassination", this seems to fall well within the generally-accepted definition that can be summed up as "politically motivated killing".
It seems to me that each of those three terms could be used accurately, but that "assassinated" is the most specific of the three.
What is the dispute again? I thought ( and have been consistently proven to) that murdered is not used in wikipedia vocabulary. Why is this then allowed on this page? The correct term for what happened is assassinated. Why is this page even locked?
Last two days roaming the halls of the Knesset and just chatting with office staff and Knesset members. How exciting for an American Jew to be teaching Israeli politicians about their history. Obviously, the killers were not going to alow me to continue this education tour indeffanately. To get into the Knesset one must be spensered. I was spensered by a Knesset member who has knowed the truth but a bit afraid to get on the podium and start talking. But that member wanted me to educate other members as to the Rabin murder. On the third day, as axpucted for an unkown security reason, even with the MKs permission, I was not permitted in the Knesset. -- written by User:217.132.117.120 on July 28, 2005
The current text says In January 2004, the Israel Prisons Authority announced that it would prohibit Amir from marrying in jail, despite a law permitting all prisoners to wed and have children. During April 2004, the Tel Aviv District Court reviewed the decision regarding a request by Yigal Amir to get married in prison. The Israeli prison authorities rejected the Amir-Trembovler requests to marry and to have conjugal visits, although this right is normally given to prisoners held in Israel's jail system.
First: I do not understand the point of the last sentence, it just repeats the first sentence.
Second: What was the outcome of the district court's review? As there is still a controversy, I assume that the district court upheld the prison authorities' decision, i.e., rejected the Amir-Trembovler request? -- Aleph4 17:15, 28 July 2005 (UTC) I am not spending so much time on wiki, you can tell. We just made the first big headline. Barry Chamish was charged for incitement against Shimon Peres and it is making headlines. Barry has always said Shimon Peres was responsible but never was charged. stuff is happenning.. user/Kempler video
To be researched is the issue why Yigal Amir would receive significantly more severe punishment than others accused of taking lives for criminal, political, passion and other reasons. This issue is especially problematic in Israel, where Palestinian terrorists are exchanged in terms of agreements. It should be clarified if the exceptional punishment of Yigal Amir, such as denying him conjugal visits which others convicted for murder are apparently allowed, is politically motivated or if it is indeed legal that the alleged assassin of a Prime Minister be sentenced differently than others accused of murder. This issue is especially significant since many in Israel don't give credence to the official report of the assassination. The Rabin family too expressed doubts at the official version. There are too many unanswered question marks on the version stating that Amir's bullet killed Rabin. A Citizen's Committee to Investigate the Murder of Yitzhak Rabin discovered a long list of discrepancies and called for an apolitical official board of inquiry. Regretfully Israel doesn't have a Constitution, and in Israel frequently it is not clear what is right and what is wrong. Israel struggles against constant threats to its survival and is plagued by corruption scandals at the highest levels. Consequently it is at best surprising that the
Knesset would find the time to legislate a law specifically against Yigal Amir. In some ways this indicates that Israel failed to mature into a state with sober and stable governance. Amir's unusual punishment is also strange considering that the instigator for the assassination,
Avishai Raviv, a secret service agent provocateur, received no punishment and enjoys all rights of a free man. Regretfully these and other serious aberrations lead many in Israel to have no faith for the justice system and to even feel contempt for it. This is a severe problem which Israel needs to correct.
Emesz
12:00, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Words from David Cohen- Rutstein. I actually know the Amir family. Geula Amir, Yigal's mom really well. As well as Barry Chamish really well. I am the one who built www.BarryChamish.com and www.YigalAmir.com. In fact, all email from both sites go to me. Email from Barry's site gets forwarded to Barry as well.
The first month of Yigal Amir's arrest, Yigal denied doing the murder. After some friendly persuasion he was all into blaming the Rabbis and admitting everything. I am not sure what was discussed, money and threats. But that is what happened. Yigal will never show remorse because he did not do the murder. The evidence is really overwhelming. The Kempler video of the murder is now online and even in that video you can see weird things happenning. Look at the back passenger door of the limo close from the inside. There was a fourth person in that limo. Israeli TV showed the 10 minute video of the murder, "the Kempler video", for one week in 1996, and has not shown the video since. In fact Yigal played an exaggerated non-defense in which he seemed to want to get convicted. This exagerated desire to be convicted seems weird and will cause Yigal eventually to be freed because anybody who studies the case realizes that Yigal shot blanks.
As well, Yigal Amir is not viewed as a hero by anyone. Most right wingers realize that Yigal did not murder Rabin. Barry Chamish has been giving lectures in Israel for years. Almost every right winger in Israel has heard of Barry. The left wingers are different. There is a complete censor on this subject in the entire Israel media. Since there is a big inclination for left winger to be "happy" that a religous Jew did a murder, the left wingers are less likely to have read one of the conspiracy books or heard Barry's lecture. As well left wingers get their information from TV and newspapers. Rabin conspiracy does not appear on these news vehicles. Right wingers watch less TV, read less newspapers and are less likely to believe what they see in those media anyways. It may seem that right wingers are "idiots" for not following the news. Right wingers in Israel is another word for religous Jews or those closer to the Jewish religous observance. The religous Jew studies Torah and study of Torah takes alot of time. End of comments by David Cohen- Rutstein -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.132.186.183 ( talk • contribs) 10:29, 16 July 2005 (UTC)
A pile of propaganda-conspiracy-theory half-fact
That's what I can say about the text above by David Cohen - except for the final paragraph.
The facts: On November 4th, 1995 Yitzhak Rabin was assassinated by Yigal Amir. Fact. Yigal Amir fired three hollow-point bullets, two hit PM Rabin and one hit a bodyguard. Fact. Yigal Amir is a right-wing extremist. Fact.
Yigal Amir is currently in prison for the awful crime he made against Yitzhak Rabin, against The State of Israel and against Democracy. By assassinating Rabin he hoped to stop the peace process between Israel and the Palestinians. I can sadly say he probably succeeded. Rabin was replaced by the right-wing Benjamin Netanyahu, and the rest is history, full of blood and tears.
This preposterous conspiracy theory is well-known in Israel, and had its share of media coverage, in contradiction to what Mr. Cohen says. Israeli news media is free and uncensored, it is STILL a democracy. Most of the Israeli public, left-wingers and right-wingers, religious people and others, heard it and understood it's simply a bunch of lies. It is even much less accepted than the "shooter on the grassy knoll" theory on the JFK murder. I can only explain its existence as the extreme-right-wing's version of psychological repression and projection.
Procedure 20:04, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
totally disputed nonsense Failure to give equal time to loony conspiracy theories is not a violation of NPOV. -- jpgordon ∇∆∇∆ 19:34, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
The political chitchat inserted here by David Cohen/Rutstein (he is running for parliament and needs signatures etcetera), not in any way related to the article, has been deleted by gidonb. Those who wish to read or verify the validity of this action (please do!), are encouraged to read it in the edit history, at the date and time in my signature---> gidonb 21:46, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
No more running for Knesset, now walking around Israel, especially Jerusalem with a sandwich sign that reads "the killers are free" "kempler video" "10 minutes" "there is a fourth passenger in the limosine" "www.yitzhakrabin.co.il" I am recruiting more volunteers.. It should be international news eventually Kempler video 00:28, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
Could we please stop adding this nonsense to the article?
Guy Montag 00:03, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
hey Guy, go to the Kennedy assasination or Lee Harvey Oswald and start deleting the video of the murder. Afterwards tell them that is nonsense. Actually this video is more important, this is the last 7 1/2 minutes of a free Yigal Amir and shows the crime that Yigal committed. plus, the video is banned from Israeli TV. brings up suspicion. right? Kempler video 6:03, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
last night met with person with more documents, photos and evidence than I have ever seen. It seems that the whole Yigal Amir pulling out gun and shooting is a "photo montage." We will all know the truth very soon. If you examine
Kempler video you can see a bit. but there is actually more evidence.
Kempler video 02:54, 7 Sept 2005 (UTC)
Hey Gidon and Jayjg, good news, this story is being picked up by international media in the very near future. Shimon Peres called me a "sycko" "that should be institutionalized" so I filed a $50,000 slander lawsuit against Shimon. As well I put big headlines on all my sites that say "Shimon Peres ordered the murder of Yitzhak Rabin". these sites include yitzhakrabin.co.il, yigalamir.com, shimonperes.net, arielsharon.co.il and barrychamish.com (english) Hey guys you have to appreciate my sense of humor. If what I am claiming is false Shimon will sue me and I will look stupid and loose money. But if what I am saying is true.... oy va voy....G and J.. believe me, I am not happy to be correct.. but the preponderance of evidence is really overwhelming...-- Kempler videoOctober 5
The article states that "one of Raviv's closest supporters was Amir who was groomed him into a group leader," and, while I presume that the author intended to write "was Amir who had groomed him," the article should obviously be updated by someone who has some understanding of the specifics of this relationship.
I do not whether the anonymous who puts the POV message on top of the page, is the same as the one who made justified claims about this page or the one who thinks Amir is a prisoner rather than a criminal.
In any case, I agree with the above anon who had serious reservations about the nature of the "Background" passage. It rearranges facts so to make conspiracy theories more likely and does not provide a balanced background to the murder. No sources are mentioned, while the murder and its backgrounds have been extensively addressed by the Shamgar judicial inquiry commision, the court that convicted Amir of his crimes and the press. Also there are later statements by Amir explaining that he murdered Rabin because he was concerned about Rabin's popularity (by being "laid back", I believe were his words), which would allow him to continue the proces. I believe the article is better served without this chapter in its current version. I copied the chapter below so that anyone can form her or his own judgement. gidonb 13:37, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
At this point in time, the factors that resulted in Amir's role in the assassination of Rabin are mired in some controversy, and not all the facts are clearly known. '
What is known is that Amir perceived the Oslo Accords as national treason, and a threat to the existence of the state of Israel, which led to his decision to assassinate Rabin.
A complicating factor from his days as a university student was his warm friendship with a known agent of the Israeli Shin Bet Avishai Raviv. One of Raviv's closest supporters was Amir who was groomed him into a group leader. This has also given rise to a number of conspiracy theories, see below.
Another factor complicating the drama is that Yigal Amir served as his own lead defense attorney during his trial, and appeared to be "covering" for Raviv according to all accounts. Yigal Amir's brother, Hagai Amir, and his friend Dror Adani, were his accomplices in the assassination plan. Amir had apparently attempted to assassinate Rabin twice throughout 1995, but those plans fell through moments before implementation.
for the following reasons: 1. part of marriage, 2. POV, 3. no sources cited, 4. current event. 5. not updated because Amir seems not to be at hunger strike right now. gidonb 14:04, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
== Hunger strike == Yigal Amir began a hunger strike on June 28, 2005. The hunger strike has been started because of the refusal by the Israeli Prison Service to allow him conjugal visits in prison with his wife, Trembovler, and the tight restrictions placed upon them during their meetings. A representative of the Prison Service told Yediot Aharonot, a leading Israeli newspaper, that the main reason behind the restrictions is the concern that Mrs. Trembovler-Amir might become pregnant. A group of 400 persons, among them leading figures of the Russian-speaking community in Israel, signed a petition demanding an end to what they see as a violation of Amir's "basic human rights".
The personal website promotion and POV pushing (spam) inserted here by David Rutstein/Cohen, not in any way related to the article, has been deleted by gidonb. Those who wish to read or verify the validity of this action (please do!), are encouraged to read it in the edit history, at the date and time in my signature---> gidonb 19:16, 27 January 2006 (UTC) For the overall clarity, the following comment by Guy Montag refers to that spam:
When did this discussion page become your personal blog?
Guy Montag 00:40, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
I don't think Yigal was a computer science student, I've never heard about it and there is no source for this on Israeli press. He was only a law student. -- Haham hanuka 18:54, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
sidenote: last hit of the small correction was accidental. gidonb 17:54, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
The location of these websites in the external links changes all the time. Haham hanuka claims that the websites by Amir's supporters need to be first, because they are official websites. Possibly he thinks about rock singers and the like. Kempler video (David Rutstein, who operates here under at least two logins, and accused me of murder and other weird things) removes these websites as they contain justification for why Amir murdered (killed in their language) the late Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin, while the conspiracy website that he operates claims that another person murdered (in his language) Rabin. Others may agree on removal for other reasons. I believe that Amir is not a rock star and that the supporters sites are not official sites. I do not know official policy which states that "official" sites should come first. But even if they were official and there is such a policy, I do not see the reason why the sites glorifying a murder should come first, after all we have neutral sites (legal documents and press), and supporters sites, but no sites against. It is a question of balance I believe. However as I am sick and tired of the continuous back and forth, I think a consensus can solve it. These pages have almost become a day job and I have so much more to contribute. Thus, I would like to hear different opinions on the place of inclusion of these websites in the external links: on the top, on the bottom, or not at al. Please do include your rational this time next to your vote, but comments to others under "comments". For the good or the bad, if a consensus emerges, I think we can keep it. gidonb 16:16, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
What does it matter whether it's at the top or at the bottom? ⌠ Yellow up⌡ 17:22, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
I moved this warning on the majority of the voters because it is factually incorrect and added a signature for the person who made the allegations gidonb 18:46, 6 February 2006 (UTC))
Warning - most of voters here have less than 20 edits and may be sockpuppets. Haham hanuka 18:39, 6 February 2006
The text appeared under the header "Amir supporters sites at the bottom". gidonb 18:48, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
See the following IZAK 12:27, 7 February 2006 (UTC) :
He has just listed the Israeli author
Amnon Jackont for deletion, see
here. 15:53, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
this is PoV and might be copy vio, pls do not resore. -- Haham hanuka 19:28, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
According to my sources he was born in 1971, we should check it. -- Haham hanuka 09:14, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 21:17, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
An anon user keeps removing the infobox from this page, claiming it is not appropriate. I looked up the usage recommendations (also to be found by clicking here):
==Usage== Misuse of this template may cause Neutral point of view policy problems and Biographies of living persons policy problems. Thus, this template is used in the upper right corner of an article. This template is generally reserved for serial killers, gangsters, mass murderers, old west outlaws, convicted murderers, mafia members, fugitives, FBI 10 most wanted, serial rapist, mobsters, and other notorious criminals.
As Yigal Amir is a convicted murderer the infobox is specifically and explicitly applicable to this page, according to usage recommendation at the infobox page. Anon, I request not to remove the infobox and the vandalism warning again without prior discussion. gidonb ( talk) 21:14, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
Rtd2101 ( talk · contribs) added several sentences which I removed because they seem to be POV (or nonsense) to me, such as a characterisation of Dror Adani as "rabidly racist", or the claim that the "Attorney General had ordered the Interior Ministry to register Amir and Larissa sexual deviants". -- Austrian ( talk) 09:34, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
It seems that his wife's biography is totally non-notable except for her marriage to Amir. Thoughts on merging?-- TM 18:13, 28 September 2011 (UTC)
The text claimed that Amir was friends "with Avishai Raviv, to whom he revealed his plan to kill Rabin. While Raviv posed as a right-wing radical, he was working for the Shabak, the Israeli secret service." It cites this article from Ha'aretz. But the Ha'aretz article doesn't mention Raviv, or Shabak. Perhaps because I'm reading this in the U.S., I'm seeing a different version of the article. Or, maybe the article has been edited since its publication and access. But the cite, as I see it, doesn't support the claim, so I removed the cite. - Tim1965 ( talk) 12:54, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
Is there a reason why the first sentence is phrased so tepidly? Is there a legal, political, or philosophical argument against simply saying he "assassinated Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin"? MatthewBurton ( talk) 00:38, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
Stating, via category, that an individual is in category - "Jewish religious terrorism" - requires iron clad sourcing. At the moment - the article doesn't even mention terrorism, nor does it make clear that there was a religious motivation (the main motivation, in any event, would seem to be nationalist). Icewhiz ( talk) 14:12, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
He said he "was acting on the "orders of God"" (this article even says it). He is orthodox. He studied at the religious Bar-Ilan university. Still, there is no reference to terrorism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.233.35.210 ( talk) 13:00, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
He is not a law student anymore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.233.35.210 ( talk) 12:50, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
This is a more recent statement from Amir, regarding having no remorse for the murder. https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/255564 Ip says: Work Better yes. ( talk) 15:05, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
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The article states that Bar Ilan is a religious university, however, although Bar Ilan caters to the religious community, there is no mandatory participation in any religious class or program, as such, it has a diverse student body and should not be considered a religious university.
Source: https://biuinternational.com/religious-life-on-campus/#:~:text=Although%20Bar-Ilan%20University%20is,%2C%20spiritual%20traditions%2C%20and%20cultures. מיכאל אליהו ק ( talk) 23:39, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
I am not familiar with Israeli law, so cannot untangle this myself. The article states that "In Israel, a sentence of life imprisonment is usually reduced to a period of 20–30 years by the president". Later we have this sentence: "They noted that several Palestinians serving multiple life terms for crimes such as murder have been permitted to marry in prison."
So which is it? Is there a distinction, that *Israeli* citizens are customarily immune to life sentences, but *Palestinians* kidnapped by Israel are not? 69.113.166.178 ( talk) 23:10, 24 May 2021 (UTC)
The article says current prime minister but it should be former prime minister
Edit: this has now been fixed
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It's specially for him, not especially for him. See article 2A02:F6E:4B03:0:195:9111:8737:A6DE ( talk) 19:57, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
Netanyahu is now the current pm but it says former pm The ultimate editorxyzyazz ( talk) 07:57, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
How can it be that they had a conjugal visit on October 24th, 2006 and his child was born on October 28th, 2007 ? As far as I know, human pregnancy is 9 months ... with all the margins, more than 10 months between visit and birth seem unrealistic to me. 78.48.170.207 ( talk) 19:17, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
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The caption beneath Amir's photo misspells Yitzhak as "Yizhak", and as a result the Wikilink is not correct either (it redirects to the correct page, however). 37.169.1.34 ( talk) 20:07, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | Warning: active arbitration remedies The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to the Arab–Israeli conflict, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article:
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I'm not sure if the section saying: "Amir has never expressed regret for his act of murder. Amir is viewed by many in Israel as a hero for his act particularly amongst the Right wing but is hated by the Left who worshipped Rabin as an idol. Rabin is seen by many as being responsible for the deaths of 1200 Israelis through the Oslo accords that gave the PLO terrorist organisation both guns and territory. Rabin is also remebered for his younger days when as commander of the Palmach (underground fighters) he ordered his men to fire at the Irgun ship the Altalena, that killed 11 Jewish fighters from the Irgun."
is a totally balanced view. It seems to imply that Rabin was despised by all but a small fantical following. Many viewed him as an only hope for peace in the middle east. Further more the dividing up of "the left", and "the right" is really a fair way to state things. Finally the writer makes "the left", sound unreasonable, for hating a murderer. --—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.206.116.123 ( talk • contribs) 01:17, 25 May 2004 (UTC)
The explanation can be found here. Unfortunately the linked article is not so easy to correct, because the title itself is wrong. -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 192.117.3.51 ( talk • contribs) 03:23, 28 September 2004 (UTC)
This page should mention www.barrychamish.com which is the website in english that shows that Yigal Amir shot blanks and Rabin's bodyguards murdered Rabin. In hebrew the website would be www.yigalamir.com -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.0.175.65 ( talk • contribs) 07:04, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
I think it would be better to let the reader to decide whether it's a murder or an helpful killing. In the article JFK the word "murder" is not used as well. -- Haham hanuka 17:09, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
-- Aleph4 17:07, 28 July 2005 (UTC)
Sorry, but I don't see what the dispute is with the terminology.
1. Was Rabin "killed"? Yigal deliberately caused Rabin's death. Ergo, I believe it is accurate to say that Amir "killed" Rabin.
2. Was Rabin "murdered"? I have yet to hear anyone argue that Amir acted in self-defense or that his actions were accidental. Ergo, I believe it is accurate to say that Amir "murdered" Rabin.
3. Was Rabin "assassinated"? Amir wasn't personally acquainted with Rabin so the traditional motivations for ordinary murder don't really apply. Amir specifically targetted Rabin for political reasons and killed him to bring about political change in Israel. While there is no universally-accepted definition of "assassination", this seems to fall well within the generally-accepted definition that can be summed up as "politically motivated killing".
It seems to me that each of those three terms could be used accurately, but that "assassinated" is the most specific of the three.
What is the dispute again? I thought ( and have been consistently proven to) that murdered is not used in wikipedia vocabulary. Why is this then allowed on this page? The correct term for what happened is assassinated. Why is this page even locked?
Last two days roaming the halls of the Knesset and just chatting with office staff and Knesset members. How exciting for an American Jew to be teaching Israeli politicians about their history. Obviously, the killers were not going to alow me to continue this education tour indeffanately. To get into the Knesset one must be spensered. I was spensered by a Knesset member who has knowed the truth but a bit afraid to get on the podium and start talking. But that member wanted me to educate other members as to the Rabin murder. On the third day, as axpucted for an unkown security reason, even with the MKs permission, I was not permitted in the Knesset. -- written by User:217.132.117.120 on July 28, 2005
The current text says In January 2004, the Israel Prisons Authority announced that it would prohibit Amir from marrying in jail, despite a law permitting all prisoners to wed and have children. During April 2004, the Tel Aviv District Court reviewed the decision regarding a request by Yigal Amir to get married in prison. The Israeli prison authorities rejected the Amir-Trembovler requests to marry and to have conjugal visits, although this right is normally given to prisoners held in Israel's jail system.
First: I do not understand the point of the last sentence, it just repeats the first sentence.
Second: What was the outcome of the district court's review? As there is still a controversy, I assume that the district court upheld the prison authorities' decision, i.e., rejected the Amir-Trembovler request? -- Aleph4 17:15, 28 July 2005 (UTC) I am not spending so much time on wiki, you can tell. We just made the first big headline. Barry Chamish was charged for incitement against Shimon Peres and it is making headlines. Barry has always said Shimon Peres was responsible but never was charged. stuff is happenning.. user/Kempler video
To be researched is the issue why Yigal Amir would receive significantly more severe punishment than others accused of taking lives for criminal, political, passion and other reasons. This issue is especially problematic in Israel, where Palestinian terrorists are exchanged in terms of agreements. It should be clarified if the exceptional punishment of Yigal Amir, such as denying him conjugal visits which others convicted for murder are apparently allowed, is politically motivated or if it is indeed legal that the alleged assassin of a Prime Minister be sentenced differently than others accused of murder. This issue is especially significant since many in Israel don't give credence to the official report of the assassination. The Rabin family too expressed doubts at the official version. There are too many unanswered question marks on the version stating that Amir's bullet killed Rabin. A Citizen's Committee to Investigate the Murder of Yitzhak Rabin discovered a long list of discrepancies and called for an apolitical official board of inquiry. Regretfully Israel doesn't have a Constitution, and in Israel frequently it is not clear what is right and what is wrong. Israel struggles against constant threats to its survival and is plagued by corruption scandals at the highest levels. Consequently it is at best surprising that the
Knesset would find the time to legislate a law specifically against Yigal Amir. In some ways this indicates that Israel failed to mature into a state with sober and stable governance. Amir's unusual punishment is also strange considering that the instigator for the assassination,
Avishai Raviv, a secret service agent provocateur, received no punishment and enjoys all rights of a free man. Regretfully these and other serious aberrations lead many in Israel to have no faith for the justice system and to even feel contempt for it. This is a severe problem which Israel needs to correct.
Emesz
12:00, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Words from David Cohen- Rutstein. I actually know the Amir family. Geula Amir, Yigal's mom really well. As well as Barry Chamish really well. I am the one who built www.BarryChamish.com and www.YigalAmir.com. In fact, all email from both sites go to me. Email from Barry's site gets forwarded to Barry as well.
The first month of Yigal Amir's arrest, Yigal denied doing the murder. After some friendly persuasion he was all into blaming the Rabbis and admitting everything. I am not sure what was discussed, money and threats. But that is what happened. Yigal will never show remorse because he did not do the murder. The evidence is really overwhelming. The Kempler video of the murder is now online and even in that video you can see weird things happenning. Look at the back passenger door of the limo close from the inside. There was a fourth person in that limo. Israeli TV showed the 10 minute video of the murder, "the Kempler video", for one week in 1996, and has not shown the video since. In fact Yigal played an exaggerated non-defense in which he seemed to want to get convicted. This exagerated desire to be convicted seems weird and will cause Yigal eventually to be freed because anybody who studies the case realizes that Yigal shot blanks.
As well, Yigal Amir is not viewed as a hero by anyone. Most right wingers realize that Yigal did not murder Rabin. Barry Chamish has been giving lectures in Israel for years. Almost every right winger in Israel has heard of Barry. The left wingers are different. There is a complete censor on this subject in the entire Israel media. Since there is a big inclination for left winger to be "happy" that a religous Jew did a murder, the left wingers are less likely to have read one of the conspiracy books or heard Barry's lecture. As well left wingers get their information from TV and newspapers. Rabin conspiracy does not appear on these news vehicles. Right wingers watch less TV, read less newspapers and are less likely to believe what they see in those media anyways. It may seem that right wingers are "idiots" for not following the news. Right wingers in Israel is another word for religous Jews or those closer to the Jewish religous observance. The religous Jew studies Torah and study of Torah takes alot of time. End of comments by David Cohen- Rutstein -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.132.186.183 ( talk • contribs) 10:29, 16 July 2005 (UTC)
A pile of propaganda-conspiracy-theory half-fact
That's what I can say about the text above by David Cohen - except for the final paragraph.
The facts: On November 4th, 1995 Yitzhak Rabin was assassinated by Yigal Amir. Fact. Yigal Amir fired three hollow-point bullets, two hit PM Rabin and one hit a bodyguard. Fact. Yigal Amir is a right-wing extremist. Fact.
Yigal Amir is currently in prison for the awful crime he made against Yitzhak Rabin, against The State of Israel and against Democracy. By assassinating Rabin he hoped to stop the peace process between Israel and the Palestinians. I can sadly say he probably succeeded. Rabin was replaced by the right-wing Benjamin Netanyahu, and the rest is history, full of blood and tears.
This preposterous conspiracy theory is well-known in Israel, and had its share of media coverage, in contradiction to what Mr. Cohen says. Israeli news media is free and uncensored, it is STILL a democracy. Most of the Israeli public, left-wingers and right-wingers, religious people and others, heard it and understood it's simply a bunch of lies. It is even much less accepted than the "shooter on the grassy knoll" theory on the JFK murder. I can only explain its existence as the extreme-right-wing's version of psychological repression and projection.
Procedure 20:04, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
totally disputed nonsense Failure to give equal time to loony conspiracy theories is not a violation of NPOV. -- jpgordon ∇∆∇∆ 19:34, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
The political chitchat inserted here by David Cohen/Rutstein (he is running for parliament and needs signatures etcetera), not in any way related to the article, has been deleted by gidonb. Those who wish to read or verify the validity of this action (please do!), are encouraged to read it in the edit history, at the date and time in my signature---> gidonb 21:46, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
No more running for Knesset, now walking around Israel, especially Jerusalem with a sandwich sign that reads "the killers are free" "kempler video" "10 minutes" "there is a fourth passenger in the limosine" "www.yitzhakrabin.co.il" I am recruiting more volunteers.. It should be international news eventually Kempler video 00:28, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
Could we please stop adding this nonsense to the article?
Guy Montag 00:03, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
hey Guy, go to the Kennedy assasination or Lee Harvey Oswald and start deleting the video of the murder. Afterwards tell them that is nonsense. Actually this video is more important, this is the last 7 1/2 minutes of a free Yigal Amir and shows the crime that Yigal committed. plus, the video is banned from Israeli TV. brings up suspicion. right? Kempler video 6:03, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
last night met with person with more documents, photos and evidence than I have ever seen. It seems that the whole Yigal Amir pulling out gun and shooting is a "photo montage." We will all know the truth very soon. If you examine
Kempler video you can see a bit. but there is actually more evidence.
Kempler video 02:54, 7 Sept 2005 (UTC)
Hey Gidon and Jayjg, good news, this story is being picked up by international media in the very near future. Shimon Peres called me a "sycko" "that should be institutionalized" so I filed a $50,000 slander lawsuit against Shimon. As well I put big headlines on all my sites that say "Shimon Peres ordered the murder of Yitzhak Rabin". these sites include yitzhakrabin.co.il, yigalamir.com, shimonperes.net, arielsharon.co.il and barrychamish.com (english) Hey guys you have to appreciate my sense of humor. If what I am claiming is false Shimon will sue me and I will look stupid and loose money. But if what I am saying is true.... oy va voy....G and J.. believe me, I am not happy to be correct.. but the preponderance of evidence is really overwhelming...-- Kempler videoOctober 5
The article states that "one of Raviv's closest supporters was Amir who was groomed him into a group leader," and, while I presume that the author intended to write "was Amir who had groomed him," the article should obviously be updated by someone who has some understanding of the specifics of this relationship.
I do not whether the anonymous who puts the POV message on top of the page, is the same as the one who made justified claims about this page or the one who thinks Amir is a prisoner rather than a criminal.
In any case, I agree with the above anon who had serious reservations about the nature of the "Background" passage. It rearranges facts so to make conspiracy theories more likely and does not provide a balanced background to the murder. No sources are mentioned, while the murder and its backgrounds have been extensively addressed by the Shamgar judicial inquiry commision, the court that convicted Amir of his crimes and the press. Also there are later statements by Amir explaining that he murdered Rabin because he was concerned about Rabin's popularity (by being "laid back", I believe were his words), which would allow him to continue the proces. I believe the article is better served without this chapter in its current version. I copied the chapter below so that anyone can form her or his own judgement. gidonb 13:37, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
At this point in time, the factors that resulted in Amir's role in the assassination of Rabin are mired in some controversy, and not all the facts are clearly known. '
What is known is that Amir perceived the Oslo Accords as national treason, and a threat to the existence of the state of Israel, which led to his decision to assassinate Rabin.
A complicating factor from his days as a university student was his warm friendship with a known agent of the Israeli Shin Bet Avishai Raviv. One of Raviv's closest supporters was Amir who was groomed him into a group leader. This has also given rise to a number of conspiracy theories, see below.
Another factor complicating the drama is that Yigal Amir served as his own lead defense attorney during his trial, and appeared to be "covering" for Raviv according to all accounts. Yigal Amir's brother, Hagai Amir, and his friend Dror Adani, were his accomplices in the assassination plan. Amir had apparently attempted to assassinate Rabin twice throughout 1995, but those plans fell through moments before implementation.
for the following reasons: 1. part of marriage, 2. POV, 3. no sources cited, 4. current event. 5. not updated because Amir seems not to be at hunger strike right now. gidonb 14:04, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
== Hunger strike == Yigal Amir began a hunger strike on June 28, 2005. The hunger strike has been started because of the refusal by the Israeli Prison Service to allow him conjugal visits in prison with his wife, Trembovler, and the tight restrictions placed upon them during their meetings. A representative of the Prison Service told Yediot Aharonot, a leading Israeli newspaper, that the main reason behind the restrictions is the concern that Mrs. Trembovler-Amir might become pregnant. A group of 400 persons, among them leading figures of the Russian-speaking community in Israel, signed a petition demanding an end to what they see as a violation of Amir's "basic human rights".
The personal website promotion and POV pushing (spam) inserted here by David Rutstein/Cohen, not in any way related to the article, has been deleted by gidonb. Those who wish to read or verify the validity of this action (please do!), are encouraged to read it in the edit history, at the date and time in my signature---> gidonb 19:16, 27 January 2006 (UTC) For the overall clarity, the following comment by Guy Montag refers to that spam:
When did this discussion page become your personal blog?
Guy Montag 00:40, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
I don't think Yigal was a computer science student, I've never heard about it and there is no source for this on Israeli press. He was only a law student. -- Haham hanuka 18:54, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
sidenote: last hit of the small correction was accidental. gidonb 17:54, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
The location of these websites in the external links changes all the time. Haham hanuka claims that the websites by Amir's supporters need to be first, because they are official websites. Possibly he thinks about rock singers and the like. Kempler video (David Rutstein, who operates here under at least two logins, and accused me of murder and other weird things) removes these websites as they contain justification for why Amir murdered (killed in their language) the late Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin, while the conspiracy website that he operates claims that another person murdered (in his language) Rabin. Others may agree on removal for other reasons. I believe that Amir is not a rock star and that the supporters sites are not official sites. I do not know official policy which states that "official" sites should come first. But even if they were official and there is such a policy, I do not see the reason why the sites glorifying a murder should come first, after all we have neutral sites (legal documents and press), and supporters sites, but no sites against. It is a question of balance I believe. However as I am sick and tired of the continuous back and forth, I think a consensus can solve it. These pages have almost become a day job and I have so much more to contribute. Thus, I would like to hear different opinions on the place of inclusion of these websites in the external links: on the top, on the bottom, or not at al. Please do include your rational this time next to your vote, but comments to others under "comments". For the good or the bad, if a consensus emerges, I think we can keep it. gidonb 16:16, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
What does it matter whether it's at the top or at the bottom? ⌠ Yellow up⌡ 17:22, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
I moved this warning on the majority of the voters because it is factually incorrect and added a signature for the person who made the allegations gidonb 18:46, 6 February 2006 (UTC))
Warning - most of voters here have less than 20 edits and may be sockpuppets. Haham hanuka 18:39, 6 February 2006
The text appeared under the header "Amir supporters sites at the bottom". gidonb 18:48, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
See the following IZAK 12:27, 7 February 2006 (UTC) :
He has just listed the Israeli author
Amnon Jackont for deletion, see
here. 15:53, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
this is PoV and might be copy vio, pls do not resore. -- Haham hanuka 19:28, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
According to my sources he was born in 1971, we should check it. -- Haham hanuka 09:14, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 21:17, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
An anon user keeps removing the infobox from this page, claiming it is not appropriate. I looked up the usage recommendations (also to be found by clicking here):
==Usage== Misuse of this template may cause Neutral point of view policy problems and Biographies of living persons policy problems. Thus, this template is used in the upper right corner of an article. This template is generally reserved for serial killers, gangsters, mass murderers, old west outlaws, convicted murderers, mafia members, fugitives, FBI 10 most wanted, serial rapist, mobsters, and other notorious criminals.
As Yigal Amir is a convicted murderer the infobox is specifically and explicitly applicable to this page, according to usage recommendation at the infobox page. Anon, I request not to remove the infobox and the vandalism warning again without prior discussion. gidonb ( talk) 21:14, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
Rtd2101 ( talk · contribs) added several sentences which I removed because they seem to be POV (or nonsense) to me, such as a characterisation of Dror Adani as "rabidly racist", or the claim that the "Attorney General had ordered the Interior Ministry to register Amir and Larissa sexual deviants". -- Austrian ( talk) 09:34, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
It seems that his wife's biography is totally non-notable except for her marriage to Amir. Thoughts on merging?-- TM 18:13, 28 September 2011 (UTC)
The text claimed that Amir was friends "with Avishai Raviv, to whom he revealed his plan to kill Rabin. While Raviv posed as a right-wing radical, he was working for the Shabak, the Israeli secret service." It cites this article from Ha'aretz. But the Ha'aretz article doesn't mention Raviv, or Shabak. Perhaps because I'm reading this in the U.S., I'm seeing a different version of the article. Or, maybe the article has been edited since its publication and access. But the cite, as I see it, doesn't support the claim, so I removed the cite. - Tim1965 ( talk) 12:54, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
Is there a reason why the first sentence is phrased so tepidly? Is there a legal, political, or philosophical argument against simply saying he "assassinated Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin"? MatthewBurton ( talk) 00:38, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
Stating, via category, that an individual is in category - "Jewish religious terrorism" - requires iron clad sourcing. At the moment - the article doesn't even mention terrorism, nor does it make clear that there was a religious motivation (the main motivation, in any event, would seem to be nationalist). Icewhiz ( talk) 14:12, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
He said he "was acting on the "orders of God"" (this article even says it). He is orthodox. He studied at the religious Bar-Ilan university. Still, there is no reference to terrorism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.233.35.210 ( talk) 13:00, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
He is not a law student anymore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.233.35.210 ( talk) 12:50, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
This is a more recent statement from Amir, regarding having no remorse for the murder. https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/255564 Ip says: Work Better yes. ( talk) 15:05, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
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The article states that Bar Ilan is a religious university, however, although Bar Ilan caters to the religious community, there is no mandatory participation in any religious class or program, as such, it has a diverse student body and should not be considered a religious university.
Source: https://biuinternational.com/religious-life-on-campus/#:~:text=Although%20Bar-Ilan%20University%20is,%2C%20spiritual%20traditions%2C%20and%20cultures. מיכאל אליהו ק ( talk) 23:39, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
I am not familiar with Israeli law, so cannot untangle this myself. The article states that "In Israel, a sentence of life imprisonment is usually reduced to a period of 20–30 years by the president". Later we have this sentence: "They noted that several Palestinians serving multiple life terms for crimes such as murder have been permitted to marry in prison."
So which is it? Is there a distinction, that *Israeli* citizens are customarily immune to life sentences, but *Palestinians* kidnapped by Israel are not? 69.113.166.178 ( talk) 23:10, 24 May 2021 (UTC)
The article says current prime minister but it should be former prime minister
Edit: this has now been fixed
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It's specially for him, not especially for him. See article 2A02:F6E:4B03:0:195:9111:8737:A6DE ( talk) 19:57, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
Netanyahu is now the current pm but it says former pm The ultimate editorxyzyazz ( talk) 07:57, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
How can it be that they had a conjugal visit on October 24th, 2006 and his child was born on October 28th, 2007 ? As far as I know, human pregnancy is 9 months ... with all the margins, more than 10 months between visit and birth seem unrealistic to me. 78.48.170.207 ( talk) 19:17, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
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The caption beneath Amir's photo misspells Yitzhak as "Yizhak", and as a result the Wikilink is not correct either (it redirects to the correct page, however). 37.169.1.34 ( talk) 20:07, 30 November 2023 (UTC)