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Would it be possible - preferably by someone from a financial institute itself - to write about the background of why wire transfers costs so much. It is awkward that it is more or less free in Europe while it is so expensive (starting with 15 dollars) in the US. Are there physical barriers that hamper a cheap electronic implementation? Or there (old-fashioned) laws that make it difficult? Or is this just price fixing between the major banks, see wire-transfer-fees-2013?
Andy ( talk) 21:06, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
It doesn't make much sense that a citation would be needed for the underlined paragraph in the SECURITY section. In this particular case, it's difficult to prove a negative. How do you prove that an intermediate bank can't do a money grab on a wire transfer? Of course it happens; and it happens so often it's simply accepted by consumers as a general practice, but it's never been publicly challenged, and there's no official document making a positive statement that it's possible. Jgombos ( talk) 19:49, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
The article fails to discuss China and Africa. Africa in particular makes use of wire transfer services that are very different to the western model. How money is transferred in Japan, China, Korea etc should be mentioned in the article.
Agree. The entire article is written from a US standpoint. Even the term "wire transfer" is specific to the US: it is not used in the UK. The UK term is "bank transfer". French: "virement bancaire". German: "Banküberweisung". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.207.137.7 ( talk) 19:58, 27 August 2014 (UTC)
Can someone expand on why Western Union's history has been controversial?
Western Union is the top choice of scam artists online because it is anonymous and offers no protection for the sender (unlike credit cards, which can cancel a transaction and chargeback the amount). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.85.161.41 ( talk) 16:20, 12 March, 2007 (UTC)
The two banks that I do business with both offer wire transfer services via their internet banking sites. One bank offers "Online wire transfers," with which I can enter in the recipient's bank and account number and have that money transferred usually the same day. The other bank offers "Western Union Money Transfer" service, which lets me input the person's name and location but not their bank account information. I'm confused by this second bank's online form, as I'm not entirely sure how the money gets to the recipient's account if you don't enter the recipient's account information. I suspect that this bank's wire transfer service is more akin to WU's "Money in Minutes" service, which requires the recipient to show up in person at a WU service center to receive the cash, but I'm not sure and have not had a chance to ask the bank if this is the case. I wish they would make it more clear on their site...
The reason I bring this up is because I think it would be helpful if someone could better explain the various forms of wire transfer in this article. I searched this article for help in my case (I wanted to know before I instituted the wire transfer) and found it rather lacking. For example, a look at WU's U.S. web site shows the "Money in Minutes" service (which transfers cash between WU service centers) and the "Direct to Bank" service (which transfers cash between bank accounts). These are two distinct services, and it would be good to differentiate them in this article. I would, but I'm not sufficiently familiar with wire transfers (this is my first one). cluth 02:17, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
What are the differences between electronic funds transfer and wire transfer? Shawnc 14:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
I sent some money from one country of Europe to another. There was a mistake with the recipient's name so the money arrived much later. However then I was noticed that the money were still in transit, waiting in a bank from Frankfurt. Question: Are most of the banks in EU sending trough some kind of International Exchange office located in Frankfurt? Details? Dreamcow 06:56, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
>> Chargeback is unlikely, although wires can be recalled
Is there a reference for this claim? Under what conditions can a wire be recalled? Without elaboration, this statement appears to contradict the assertion that bank-to-bank transfers are "safe". New ( talk) 02:06, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
"..monthly bills are usually paid with a direct transfer (by cellular phone or Internet, or at the bank or an ATM)"
I've read somewhere, and know from personal experience, that direct debits and standing orders are much more common as payment methods. Anyone have any sources on this? - Al.locke ( talk) 14:06, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Wouldn't it be of some interest to mention something about the costs a bank in the US charges to wire what amounts to a bank in the Eurozone?
AdrianAbel ( talk) 13:31, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Very real.
Nick —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.42.141.82 ( talk) 07:05, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
Does this article include the European wire transfers or not? Because in the European Union, it is completely free to send wire transfers by law. And for this reason the banks are unable to collect any fees for doing a wire transfer from one EU country to another. -- 95.234.171.142 ( talk) 13:26, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
This regulation, however, does not apply when
Also, european banks are NOT allowed to grab money out of the amount being transferred by regulation. Banks have price lists for bank transfers (in my case, this price list says that domestic wire transfers are free). Whenever you make a wire transfer, each bank will charge their own customer for this. This usually happens at the end of the month or quarter of the year when your bank charges you for your bank account. However, in the case of an international wire transfer, the originator is able to choose who is going to pay for the transfer:
Intermediate Banks (that is, banks that are sitting between the originator's and the beneficiary's bank) based in Europe are NOT allowed to grab money out of the amount that is being sent. They have to agree with at least one of the other two involved banks on a transit fee and that bank has to include the transit fee in their own fees. Banks outside Europe, however are allowed to grab money out of the amount being sent. -- Dynam1te3 ( talk) 22:44, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
I read in some forum that (in the US) "wire transfer" was "more expensive than ACH" and that these were two different systems which are charged at different rates. I found a web site of a bank which had significantly different rates for "ACH funds transfer" and "wire transfer". However, given that there's an interwiki-link from de:Überweisung to Wire transfer , I assumed that wire transfer simply means transferring funds from one account to another, initated by the payer, i.e. wire transfer does not refer to a particular clearing system. Can someone clear this confusion? -- 89.204.137.120 ( talk) 15:50, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
I have read through this article but can not find the answer to a question which has been bugging me for many years.
I'm wondering what sort of regulation is in place to ensure that the banks themselves do not simply commit fraud. For example: Bill banks with Barclays and requests that £100 is sent to Henry, who banks with Halifax. Barclays sends an electronic instruction to Halifax (a wire transfer) telling them to credit Henry's account with £100. BUT... Barclays fails to deduct the £100 from Bill's account! If you send physical money in the form of paper or coins then there is a physical commodity to be exchanged: it is impossible for one person to receive it without another person giving it. But an electronic "transfer" is just data. When you "send" someone a file by e-mail, you're not really "sending" anything - you're just instructing the e-mail servers to create electronic pulses to replicate the binary data - which is ultimately copied to the recipient's hard drive when they download their e-mail. In order to really "send" a file over the internet in the traditional sense, the sender would have to delete the binary data from his own computer sequentially at the same time the pulses were sent to the modem.
So what system is is place to ensure that a bank does not simply create electronic money out of thin air, by changing the numbers? Do they have to copy a government audit department in to all transactions or something, who checks that everything is legitimate? I thought this article would clarify the situation - but unfortunately it does nothing to address this point. Can someone answer it? Thanks. EuroSong talk 08:56, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
There seems to be an incorrect statement in the section titled "Security": "European privacy law may be breached by some USA operators such as SWIFT," But SWIFT is not a "US operator". I'm not sure what is intended by this sentence. Gwideman ( talk) 18:42, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
I have boldly added a "History" section. The sources I found might not be good enough. Anybody else has better citations and can please add the section? Alefu ( talk) 17:35, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
"SWIFT or IBAN wire transfers are not completely free of vulnerabilities." -- At this point in article, both terms have been previously mentioned once, but neither is specifically dealt with or defined (e.g. the acronyms).
188.103.182.64 ( talk) 06:08, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
"Bank transfer" is more logical than "wire transfer" because the actual transfer is often wireless these days. 85.193.232.158 ( talk) 22:16, 10 December 2015 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Wire transfer article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||
|
Would it be possible - preferably by someone from a financial institute itself - to write about the background of why wire transfers costs so much. It is awkward that it is more or less free in Europe while it is so expensive (starting with 15 dollars) in the US. Are there physical barriers that hamper a cheap electronic implementation? Or there (old-fashioned) laws that make it difficult? Or is this just price fixing between the major banks, see wire-transfer-fees-2013?
Andy ( talk) 21:06, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
It doesn't make much sense that a citation would be needed for the underlined paragraph in the SECURITY section. In this particular case, it's difficult to prove a negative. How do you prove that an intermediate bank can't do a money grab on a wire transfer? Of course it happens; and it happens so often it's simply accepted by consumers as a general practice, but it's never been publicly challenged, and there's no official document making a positive statement that it's possible. Jgombos ( talk) 19:49, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
The article fails to discuss China and Africa. Africa in particular makes use of wire transfer services that are very different to the western model. How money is transferred in Japan, China, Korea etc should be mentioned in the article.
Agree. The entire article is written from a US standpoint. Even the term "wire transfer" is specific to the US: it is not used in the UK. The UK term is "bank transfer". French: "virement bancaire". German: "Banküberweisung". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.207.137.7 ( talk) 19:58, 27 August 2014 (UTC)
Can someone expand on why Western Union's history has been controversial?
Western Union is the top choice of scam artists online because it is anonymous and offers no protection for the sender (unlike credit cards, which can cancel a transaction and chargeback the amount). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.85.161.41 ( talk) 16:20, 12 March, 2007 (UTC)
The two banks that I do business with both offer wire transfer services via their internet banking sites. One bank offers "Online wire transfers," with which I can enter in the recipient's bank and account number and have that money transferred usually the same day. The other bank offers "Western Union Money Transfer" service, which lets me input the person's name and location but not their bank account information. I'm confused by this second bank's online form, as I'm not entirely sure how the money gets to the recipient's account if you don't enter the recipient's account information. I suspect that this bank's wire transfer service is more akin to WU's "Money in Minutes" service, which requires the recipient to show up in person at a WU service center to receive the cash, but I'm not sure and have not had a chance to ask the bank if this is the case. I wish they would make it more clear on their site...
The reason I bring this up is because I think it would be helpful if someone could better explain the various forms of wire transfer in this article. I searched this article for help in my case (I wanted to know before I instituted the wire transfer) and found it rather lacking. For example, a look at WU's U.S. web site shows the "Money in Minutes" service (which transfers cash between WU service centers) and the "Direct to Bank" service (which transfers cash between bank accounts). These are two distinct services, and it would be good to differentiate them in this article. I would, but I'm not sufficiently familiar with wire transfers (this is my first one). cluth 02:17, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
What are the differences between electronic funds transfer and wire transfer? Shawnc 14:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
I sent some money from one country of Europe to another. There was a mistake with the recipient's name so the money arrived much later. However then I was noticed that the money were still in transit, waiting in a bank from Frankfurt. Question: Are most of the banks in EU sending trough some kind of International Exchange office located in Frankfurt? Details? Dreamcow 06:56, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
>> Chargeback is unlikely, although wires can be recalled
Is there a reference for this claim? Under what conditions can a wire be recalled? Without elaboration, this statement appears to contradict the assertion that bank-to-bank transfers are "safe". New ( talk) 02:06, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
"..monthly bills are usually paid with a direct transfer (by cellular phone or Internet, or at the bank or an ATM)"
I've read somewhere, and know from personal experience, that direct debits and standing orders are much more common as payment methods. Anyone have any sources on this? - Al.locke ( talk) 14:06, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Wouldn't it be of some interest to mention something about the costs a bank in the US charges to wire what amounts to a bank in the Eurozone?
AdrianAbel ( talk) 13:31, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Very real.
Nick —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.42.141.82 ( talk) 07:05, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
Does this article include the European wire transfers or not? Because in the European Union, it is completely free to send wire transfers by law. And for this reason the banks are unable to collect any fees for doing a wire transfer from one EU country to another. -- 95.234.171.142 ( talk) 13:26, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
This regulation, however, does not apply when
Also, european banks are NOT allowed to grab money out of the amount being transferred by regulation. Banks have price lists for bank transfers (in my case, this price list says that domestic wire transfers are free). Whenever you make a wire transfer, each bank will charge their own customer for this. This usually happens at the end of the month or quarter of the year when your bank charges you for your bank account. However, in the case of an international wire transfer, the originator is able to choose who is going to pay for the transfer:
Intermediate Banks (that is, banks that are sitting between the originator's and the beneficiary's bank) based in Europe are NOT allowed to grab money out of the amount that is being sent. They have to agree with at least one of the other two involved banks on a transit fee and that bank has to include the transit fee in their own fees. Banks outside Europe, however are allowed to grab money out of the amount being sent. -- Dynam1te3 ( talk) 22:44, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
I read in some forum that (in the US) "wire transfer" was "more expensive than ACH" and that these were two different systems which are charged at different rates. I found a web site of a bank which had significantly different rates for "ACH funds transfer" and "wire transfer". However, given that there's an interwiki-link from de:Überweisung to Wire transfer , I assumed that wire transfer simply means transferring funds from one account to another, initated by the payer, i.e. wire transfer does not refer to a particular clearing system. Can someone clear this confusion? -- 89.204.137.120 ( talk) 15:50, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
I have read through this article but can not find the answer to a question which has been bugging me for many years.
I'm wondering what sort of regulation is in place to ensure that the banks themselves do not simply commit fraud. For example: Bill banks with Barclays and requests that £100 is sent to Henry, who banks with Halifax. Barclays sends an electronic instruction to Halifax (a wire transfer) telling them to credit Henry's account with £100. BUT... Barclays fails to deduct the £100 from Bill's account! If you send physical money in the form of paper or coins then there is a physical commodity to be exchanged: it is impossible for one person to receive it without another person giving it. But an electronic "transfer" is just data. When you "send" someone a file by e-mail, you're not really "sending" anything - you're just instructing the e-mail servers to create electronic pulses to replicate the binary data - which is ultimately copied to the recipient's hard drive when they download their e-mail. In order to really "send" a file over the internet in the traditional sense, the sender would have to delete the binary data from his own computer sequentially at the same time the pulses were sent to the modem.
So what system is is place to ensure that a bank does not simply create electronic money out of thin air, by changing the numbers? Do they have to copy a government audit department in to all transactions or something, who checks that everything is legitimate? I thought this article would clarify the situation - but unfortunately it does nothing to address this point. Can someone answer it? Thanks. EuroSong talk 08:56, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
There seems to be an incorrect statement in the section titled "Security": "European privacy law may be breached by some USA operators such as SWIFT," But SWIFT is not a "US operator". I'm not sure what is intended by this sentence. Gwideman ( talk) 18:42, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
I have boldly added a "History" section. The sources I found might not be good enough. Anybody else has better citations and can please add the section? Alefu ( talk) 17:35, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
"SWIFT or IBAN wire transfers are not completely free of vulnerabilities." -- At this point in article, both terms have been previously mentioned once, but neither is specifically dealt with or defined (e.g. the acronyms).
188.103.182.64 ( talk) 06:08, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
"Bank transfer" is more logical than "wire transfer" because the actual transfer is often wireless these days. 85.193.232.158 ( talk) 22:16, 10 December 2015 (UTC)