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Wernicke encephalopathy article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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I read in The Man Who Mistook His Wife For A Hat by Oliver Sacks that exterme bulimia can lead to Wernicke's encephalopathy. This agrees with the fact that prolonged vomiting is mentioned among the causes in the first paragraph of this article.
Should it be added?
-- 124.62.255.251 18:35, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
I slightly edited the opening paragraph to better reflect that alcoholism, much less severe alcoholism, isn't a necessary prerequisite to developing this syndrome. Since the body does not stock thiamine (as it does with say, Vitamin A in the liver), and because alcohol interferes with its uptake, even excessive drinking over a few days can cause or significantly contribute to a deficiency that can lead to this syndrome. 68.196.122.197 12:30, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
This article's grammar is very poor and needs to be edited. 173.66.25.102 ( talk) 00:35, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
This article is extremely poorly written, almost as if translated from another language. The layout is unsatisfactory. 17:23, 2nd June, 2013. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.78.160.135 ( talk) 16:24, 2 June 2013 (UTC)
I've edited some small reference errors in the introduction. Maybe an expert can review this? Especially the last sentence.
Strompf ( talk) 22:16, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
impairment of short-term memory is a symptome of Korsakoff syndrome not Wernicke's encephalopathy, now indeed WE may be followed in long term by the Korsakoff syndrome and thus leading to short term deficit. But it's a whole new syndrome. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Medbenmedben ( talk • contribs) 01:27, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
Some of the references are very local guidance documents that are not very suitable for encyclopedia content. National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence. Clinical guideline 100: Alcohol-use disorders: physical complications. London, 2010. seems better. JFW | T@lk 16:51, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
I have marked this page for cleanup. This is for the following reasons:
This article could be improved if:
This is a fascinating topic and the content on this page is wonderful. However it could use some improvement. I will continue to work on improving this article and look forward to constructive dialogue with others involved. LT90001 ( talk) 07:43, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I re-posted the multiple issues warning box. I did that for a reason. The page is a mess. I don't know if the editors who have been working on this understand the English language. FYI-I have been in hospitals where I have seen with my own eyes, doctors and nurses who have "Googled" for medical information. I know that is not Wikipedia's responsibility, but it happens. -But for that reason, and also the atrocious mess of grammar, I am suspicious about the prescribing information. The warning at the top of the article should stay if only to warn people that the info. is suspect. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 18:20, 8 July 2013 (UTC)
Well it has not even been a full day and an active editor of this article who is a self-named "researcher' of the topic has deleted the warning box, (again) after other editors came by and did some great work cleaning-up some of the citations. I re-added the warning because there are still citations/references that need to be checked, and the overall grammar/understandability of the article is still lacking. I am finding all kinds-of grammar/translation problems with the article, but I do not have the science background or access to medical journals to confirm the references and citations, so I am strongly recommending that the warning box remain at the top of the article until the entire thing has been verified by editors with better scientific/medical resources, and experience. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 06:08, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
OK so after some research, I have determined that the editor who has been adding a great deal of info. to this article is not a native speaker of the English language. That being said, I think that they have added to the topic. I am proposing that said editor, User:Luis cerni, in future edits to the article, please post edits here on the talk page, as opposed to the article directly, so that a translation can be applied before it is added to the article. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 06:13, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
It is unacceptable to have removed some of the common causes of Wernicke's encephalopathy: Excessive vomiting, Prolonged parenteral nutrition, anorexia, malabsorption of nutrients, thyrotoxicosis and renal dialysis. This is well documented in the references. I would appreciate more prudence and research on what they are modifying. The article has been reviewed and accepted by other American physicians. I can only accept my limitations in handling the language and the rules of Wikipedia. Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia. Luis ........ Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 18:57, July 9, 2013
The English is not my native language but I have written a serious article. Initially, with few references, but then I demanded that it should add references, and I attended that order. The article establishes the last criteria about a very common disease, and diagnosed only 10%, and which is surrounded by old notions and prejudices. So little is known that in the early years of bariatric surgeries, there was 94% of Wernicke encephalopathies. My work has provoked the interest of G Sechi, a reference in this encephalopathy, and has prompted the British Medical Journals ask me to correct an investigation. Mr. XX not judge if "do not have the science background or access to medical journals". Physicians, please investigate because the old criteria WE are causing many deaths and sufferings in 90% of patients who fail to be diagnosed, or are only treated with thiamine. If you have questions do not hesitate to contact me but not destroyed. Cheers, Luis cerni ........ Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 19:08, July 9, 2013
LOOIE.....90% failure in diagnostics because of prejudice. With so many more failures should be investigated and reviewed texts that contradict research practices. What says Looie is a manifestation of the same, totally honest but misleading. You could read the research that was done in Recife, Brazil (in English), which classifies the cases, and is separated malnutrition (a very few). In developed countries, we know from multiple causes such as cancer and bariatric surgeries. Looie, thanks for discuss without destroying. If after inform you with all the references provided (including in Brazil), have questions, please write me. Of course, I will review epidemiology section, also there we have a lot to improved. Luis cerni ( talk) 00:12, 10 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 20:45, July 9, 2013
The modification you guys made about hypothermia is incorrect. The classical definition is when the body temperature drops to 35 ° C.. But we refer to an incipient cooling caused by deregulation in the CNS, and that begins peripherally with cold skin, or the patient's sensation of cold. Initially not recorded in the thermometers placed in the trunk. This also is called hypothermia. Luis cerni ( talk) 00:12, 10 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) of 19:43, July 9, 2013
James, the link was provided, but is written in Spanish. It is a text written by Codina-Puiggros, a fundamental text of neurology. On page 824 says: "excessive sweating, cyanosis and coldness are frequent symptoms in the hands and feet of these patients." Hypothermia is a symptom absolutely accepted and Codina-Puiggros described in its beginning. I wrote it otherwise than I found it clearer ... perhaps ... but consistent with my personal experience....... Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
I'm not sure what you mean? I thought you were trying to differentiate between outside and internal body temperature? Maybe it should say 95° Fahrenheit? Normal body temperature in American terms is around 98.6°. It could say both, but what exactly does it mean anyways? I left in the part about chills and cold skin, so I'm not sure what the exact temperature is supposed to mean? 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 01:43, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
ABOUT some erased common causes......................................... . MEDLINEPLUS............... " Malabsortion. Other conditions that may cause thiamine deficiency include: AIDS Cancers that have spread throughout the body. Extreme nausea and vomiting during pregnancy (hyperemesis gravidarum). Heart failure (when treated with long-term diuretic therapy). Long periods of intravenous (IV) therapy without receiving thiamine supplements. Long-term dialysis. Very high thyroid hormone levels (thyrotoxicosis). . http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000771.htm
List of cases of Wernicke encephalopathy reported in non alcoholic subjects
CLINICAL CONDITION........................ No. % Cancer.....................................113 18.1 Gastrointestinal surgery...................105 16.8 Hyperemesis gravidarum......................76 12.2 Starvation/Fasting..........................64 10.2 Gastrointestinal tract diseases.............48 7.7 AIDS........................................31 5.0 Malnutrition................................26 4.2 Dialysis and renal diseases.................24 3.8 Parenteral nutrition........................24 3.8 Vomiting....................................15 2.4 Psychiatric-diseases........................15 2.4 Stem cell/marrow transplantation............14 2.2 Infections...................................9 1.4 Intoxication.................................9 1.4 Thyroid-diseases.............................8 1.3 Unbalanced diet..............................6 1.0 Iatrogenic...................................5 0.8 Hypoxic encephalopathy.......................2 0.3 Unknown etiology............................19 3. Total....................................625 cases.100.0%
EFNS.(European Federation of Neurol. Societ.) Search performed in Medline, Embase, LILACS from data-base inception through May 31, 2009.........^ EFNS guidelines for diagnosis, therapy and prevention of Wernicke encephalopathy. R. Galvin, G. Bra ˚then, A. Ivashynka, M. Hillbom, R. Tanasescu and M. A. Leone. EFNS Guidelines/CME articles.
. ............... Luis cerni ( talk) 23:52, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
. . 24.0.133. Thanks for your answer and teach. I would like to be completed the list of risk factors as above provided, or to be left as I originally wrote. Someone cut causes that are out of discussion. Luis cerni ( talk) 20:32, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
I have read this page again and found it excellent. Thank you very much to those who helped. I chose Wiki by its global reach, there are doctors who consult from a child pc in remote places, without acces to publications. But any where and every body read the Wiki. We have relieved a lot of suffering. Cheers, Luis. Luis cerni ( talk) 21:45, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
There continues to be addition of primary sources such as one I removed here [5]. The source is here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=15687431 Doc James ( talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 14:43, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 9 January 2023 and 28 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): MRH2002! ( article contribs). Peer reviewers: Srh030, Delbel4567.
— Assignment last updated by H2Oworks ( talk) 17:50, 23 March 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Wernicke encephalopathy article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find medical sources: Source guidelines · PubMed · Cochrane · DOAJ · Gale · OpenMD · ScienceDirect · Springer · Trip · Wiley · TWL |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
I read in The Man Who Mistook His Wife For A Hat by Oliver Sacks that exterme bulimia can lead to Wernicke's encephalopathy. This agrees with the fact that prolonged vomiting is mentioned among the causes in the first paragraph of this article.
Should it be added?
-- 124.62.255.251 18:35, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
I slightly edited the opening paragraph to better reflect that alcoholism, much less severe alcoholism, isn't a necessary prerequisite to developing this syndrome. Since the body does not stock thiamine (as it does with say, Vitamin A in the liver), and because alcohol interferes with its uptake, even excessive drinking over a few days can cause or significantly contribute to a deficiency that can lead to this syndrome. 68.196.122.197 12:30, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
This article's grammar is very poor and needs to be edited. 173.66.25.102 ( talk) 00:35, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
This article is extremely poorly written, almost as if translated from another language. The layout is unsatisfactory. 17:23, 2nd June, 2013. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.78.160.135 ( talk) 16:24, 2 June 2013 (UTC)
I've edited some small reference errors in the introduction. Maybe an expert can review this? Especially the last sentence.
Strompf ( talk) 22:16, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
impairment of short-term memory is a symptome of Korsakoff syndrome not Wernicke's encephalopathy, now indeed WE may be followed in long term by the Korsakoff syndrome and thus leading to short term deficit. But it's a whole new syndrome. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Medbenmedben ( talk • contribs) 01:27, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
Some of the references are very local guidance documents that are not very suitable for encyclopedia content. National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence. Clinical guideline 100: Alcohol-use disorders: physical complications. London, 2010. seems better. JFW | T@lk 16:51, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
I have marked this page for cleanup. This is for the following reasons:
This article could be improved if:
This is a fascinating topic and the content on this page is wonderful. However it could use some improvement. I will continue to work on improving this article and look forward to constructive dialogue with others involved. LT90001 ( talk) 07:43, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I re-posted the multiple issues warning box. I did that for a reason. The page is a mess. I don't know if the editors who have been working on this understand the English language. FYI-I have been in hospitals where I have seen with my own eyes, doctors and nurses who have "Googled" for medical information. I know that is not Wikipedia's responsibility, but it happens. -But for that reason, and also the atrocious mess of grammar, I am suspicious about the prescribing information. The warning at the top of the article should stay if only to warn people that the info. is suspect. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 18:20, 8 July 2013 (UTC)
Well it has not even been a full day and an active editor of this article who is a self-named "researcher' of the topic has deleted the warning box, (again) after other editors came by and did some great work cleaning-up some of the citations. I re-added the warning because there are still citations/references that need to be checked, and the overall grammar/understandability of the article is still lacking. I am finding all kinds-of grammar/translation problems with the article, but I do not have the science background or access to medical journals to confirm the references and citations, so I am strongly recommending that the warning box remain at the top of the article until the entire thing has been verified by editors with better scientific/medical resources, and experience. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 06:08, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
OK so after some research, I have determined that the editor who has been adding a great deal of info. to this article is not a native speaker of the English language. That being said, I think that they have added to the topic. I am proposing that said editor, User:Luis cerni, in future edits to the article, please post edits here on the talk page, as opposed to the article directly, so that a translation can be applied before it is added to the article. 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 06:13, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
It is unacceptable to have removed some of the common causes of Wernicke's encephalopathy: Excessive vomiting, Prolonged parenteral nutrition, anorexia, malabsorption of nutrients, thyrotoxicosis and renal dialysis. This is well documented in the references. I would appreciate more prudence and research on what they are modifying. The article has been reviewed and accepted by other American physicians. I can only accept my limitations in handling the language and the rules of Wikipedia. Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia. Luis ........ Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 18:57, July 9, 2013
The English is not my native language but I have written a serious article. Initially, with few references, but then I demanded that it should add references, and I attended that order. The article establishes the last criteria about a very common disease, and diagnosed only 10%, and which is surrounded by old notions and prejudices. So little is known that in the early years of bariatric surgeries, there was 94% of Wernicke encephalopathies. My work has provoked the interest of G Sechi, a reference in this encephalopathy, and has prompted the British Medical Journals ask me to correct an investigation. Mr. XX not judge if "do not have the science background or access to medical journals". Physicians, please investigate because the old criteria WE are causing many deaths and sufferings in 90% of patients who fail to be diagnosed, or are only treated with thiamine. If you have questions do not hesitate to contact me but not destroyed. Cheers, Luis cerni ........ Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 19:08, July 9, 2013
LOOIE.....90% failure in diagnostics because of prejudice. With so many more failures should be investigated and reviewed texts that contradict research practices. What says Looie is a manifestation of the same, totally honest but misleading. You could read the research that was done in Recife, Brazil (in English), which classifies the cases, and is separated malnutrition (a very few). In developed countries, we know from multiple causes such as cancer and bariatric surgeries. Looie, thanks for discuss without destroying. If after inform you with all the references provided (including in Brazil), have questions, please write me. Of course, I will review epidemiology section, also there we have a lot to improved. Luis cerni ( talk) 00:12, 10 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) 20:45, July 9, 2013
The modification you guys made about hypothermia is incorrect. The classical definition is when the body temperature drops to 35 ° C.. But we refer to an incipient cooling caused by deregulation in the CNS, and that begins peripherally with cold skin, or the patient's sensation of cold. Initially not recorded in the thermometers placed in the trunk. This also is called hypothermia. Luis cerni ( talk) 00:12, 10 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luis cerni ( talk • contribs) of 19:43, July 9, 2013
James, the link was provided, but is written in Spanish. It is a text written by Codina-Puiggros, a fundamental text of neurology. On page 824 says: "excessive sweating, cyanosis and coldness are frequent symptoms in the hands and feet of these patients." Hypothermia is a symptom absolutely accepted and Codina-Puiggros described in its beginning. I wrote it otherwise than I found it clearer ... perhaps ... but consistent with my personal experience....... Luis cerni ( talk) 23:55, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
I'm not sure what you mean? I thought you were trying to differentiate between outside and internal body temperature? Maybe it should say 95° Fahrenheit? Normal body temperature in American terms is around 98.6°. It could say both, but what exactly does it mean anyways? I left in the part about chills and cold skin, so I'm not sure what the exact temperature is supposed to mean? 24.0.133.234 ( talk) 01:43, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
ABOUT some erased common causes......................................... . MEDLINEPLUS............... " Malabsortion. Other conditions that may cause thiamine deficiency include: AIDS Cancers that have spread throughout the body. Extreme nausea and vomiting during pregnancy (hyperemesis gravidarum). Heart failure (when treated with long-term diuretic therapy). Long periods of intravenous (IV) therapy without receiving thiamine supplements. Long-term dialysis. Very high thyroid hormone levels (thyrotoxicosis). . http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000771.htm
List of cases of Wernicke encephalopathy reported in non alcoholic subjects
CLINICAL CONDITION........................ No. % Cancer.....................................113 18.1 Gastrointestinal surgery...................105 16.8 Hyperemesis gravidarum......................76 12.2 Starvation/Fasting..........................64 10.2 Gastrointestinal tract diseases.............48 7.7 AIDS........................................31 5.0 Malnutrition................................26 4.2 Dialysis and renal diseases.................24 3.8 Parenteral nutrition........................24 3.8 Vomiting....................................15 2.4 Psychiatric-diseases........................15 2.4 Stem cell/marrow transplantation............14 2.2 Infections...................................9 1.4 Intoxication.................................9 1.4 Thyroid-diseases.............................8 1.3 Unbalanced diet..............................6 1.0 Iatrogenic...................................5 0.8 Hypoxic encephalopathy.......................2 0.3 Unknown etiology............................19 3. Total....................................625 cases.100.0%
EFNS.(European Federation of Neurol. Societ.) Search performed in Medline, Embase, LILACS from data-base inception through May 31, 2009.........^ EFNS guidelines for diagnosis, therapy and prevention of Wernicke encephalopathy. R. Galvin, G. Bra ˚then, A. Ivashynka, M. Hillbom, R. Tanasescu and M. A. Leone. EFNS Guidelines/CME articles.
. ............... Luis cerni ( talk) 23:52, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
. . 24.0.133. Thanks for your answer and teach. I would like to be completed the list of risk factors as above provided, or to be left as I originally wrote. Someone cut causes that are out of discussion. Luis cerni ( talk) 20:32, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
I have read this page again and found it excellent. Thank you very much to those who helped. I chose Wiki by its global reach, there are doctors who consult from a child pc in remote places, without acces to publications. But any where and every body read the Wiki. We have relieved a lot of suffering. Cheers, Luis. Luis cerni ( talk) 21:45, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
There continues to be addition of primary sources such as one I removed here [5]. The source is here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=15687431 Doc James ( talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 14:43, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 9 January 2023 and 28 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): MRH2002! ( article contribs). Peer reviewers: Srh030, Delbel4567.
— Assignment last updated by H2Oworks ( talk) 17:50, 23 March 2023 (UTC)