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Archive 1 |
Why has User:Wik removed the external link http://maugham.thefreelibrary.com/ ? The site looks OK to me and would be pretty useful I think. User:AtStart may have linked the same website on plenty of articles, but is there a policy that disallows this kind of linking ? I guess what finally matters is whether the link is relevant to the article or not. Jay 00:03, 2 Feb 2004 (UTC)
As it turns out, when I edited the page, my internet browser's filter software removed the words boondage (with one 'o') and hommoseexual (with one 'm' and one 'e') so if someone would go back through and replace those where there are big blank spots in the code, that would be appreciated. If not, I can from school tomorrow. Zephyrprince 21:37, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Why has this article substituted 'W.' for 'William' throughout? Was this the man's preference? Should the article not then explain this? Otherwise, shouldn't we just put it back to saying 'William'?
I've enlarged the article with new material. I don't think anything from the existing article has been deleted - moved, yes, subsumed, yes, but not deleted. Please feel free to revert, edit, alter, hack, slash and burn. And to correct typos. I regret that this is the last thing I'll be doing on Wiki, as I've decided it's taking up too much of my time, so I won't be around to answer questions on sourcing etc - but it's all verifiable, even if you have to go read an old-fashioned book to find the sources. PiCo 14:38, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
I have added a complete list in chronological order of the first printing date of every article or contribution made by Maugham to journals and periodicals during his lifetime. Maugham often tested his audience and his own interest in a story by serialising it through periodicals such as The Sunday Times and then later released the story as a novel or book. In later years particularly Maugham was adverse to wasting time or work and often rewrote or reworked these articles and they became short stories to be included in his various collections of short stories as detailed elsewhere in this Wikipedia article. My questions to other editors in relation to this addition is (1) can I have your comments as to whether you feel this addition belongs where it is (that is before the Short Stories sub-heading) or should it be placed further up the page given that it is a chronolical list that assists the reader in seeing how Maugham's periodical work developed also into his books? (2)I also intend to look more closely at the list of Novels and Short Story Collections in the near future with a view to adjusting the detail into complete chronological order. Towards that point it seems to me that item 6.1 Novels and Short Story Collections should change simple to Novels as item 6.6 is Short Story Collections. Views on this before I alter it would also be appreciated? VirtualSteve 06:37, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
This must be getting to be one of the more comprehensive profiles of a writer on Wiki. Add references to the text (quite lacking at present) and it could begin the Featured Article process (rather like beginning the canonisation process in the RC Church :). PiCo 09:38, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
I haven't been around on Wiki that long myself. But have a look at Wikipedia:Peer review. It sets out the steps to be followed. I think this article needs a little more referencing in the main text of the article - to show where our knowledge of his bio comes from, and to identify any quotes. PiCo 13:06, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
Okay I have started to edit this page with a view to Featured Article and Wikipedia:Peer review and in particular set up first Harvard reference for a non-embedded link. I have gone through my own personal records - using the reference and copies of books to be almost absolutely certain that the list of Novels, Books & Pamphlets, Plays, and Contributions to Periodicals is chronologically correct. The changes made this evening do not remove any of Maugham's original works but I have removed 3 or 4 references to secondary books - that is books that were republished as a compilation of primary books either during or after Maugham's lifetime (and which are therefore already on the site at the section headings just mentioned). My intention next is to reference and as necessary clean up the list of short stories to see if it encompasses and cross matches with the Contributions to Periodicals. VirtualSteve 12:51, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
"There was a young lady of Guam/Who peddled her charms, charm by charm/Inspired, I suppose/By the classical prose/Of W Somerset Maugham." PiCo 23:15, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
"Violet Hunt, at age 13, offered herself to John Ruskin, later refused a marriage proposal from Oscar Wilde, seduced the homosexual Somerset Maugham, was seduced by H.G. Wells and lived for some years as the putative wife of Ford Madox Ford."
Offering oneself to John Ruskin seems like a pointless proposition.
See this article.
PiCo 09:29, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
The doctor buries his mistakes, the architect advises his clients to plant vines, the artist writes them into a book. PiCo 15:34, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Then article is getting rather long - 37kb. How about taking the Bibliography section (called, perhaps, Bibliography of works by Somerset Maugham and making it a separate article, with a reference frm here? PiCo 05:54, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
Done - the link should be in blue now :-). PiCo 12:26, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
I've edited for style - not much substantive change. I think it could be put up for featured article candidate now. But please, check that reference to Alan Searle's background as a catamite to the rich and famous in London. Morgan says something about Searle having been well-known in gay circles in London (which is why Maugham sought him out after Haxton's death), but the question of his age at the time is very shaky, based on something I read somewhere about Searle writing a letter to a friend during a trip to Egypt with maugham, in which he says he "hasn't been so popular since I was 12 years old" - not exactly rock-hard evidence for rtaducing the man's reputation. PiCo 05:48, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
"I was in Romania a few years ago and heard much of Doctor Aslan, but after seeing what happened to Somerset Maugham at the hands of that Swiss quack I am reluctant to think of rejuvenation! However I am sure that Doctor Aslan is far better than the man [Dr Niehans] whose name I always Freudianly forget." Thusly Graham Greene to a friend, about 1969. It reminded me of this episode in Willie's life: apparently he went once a year to a clinic in Switzerland run by this Dr Niehans, where he had his bum injected with a brew of concentrate of lambs' testicles. It was said to endow the recipient with a smooth and youthful skin. PiCo 11:20, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
The two edits subsequent to this version were (a) someone who believed, no doubt sincerely, that e.e.cummings was E.E. Cummings, and (b) someone who didn't like one of the photos. Both are mistaken. PiCo 12:35, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
I think we are about ready to nominate this article for Featured Article status now and wait for the input of other editors. As you will see I have adjusted the Searle quote - I just couldn't find the Coward link so I thought it better to remove. Give me your thoughts and then we can put it up if you agree.
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10:48, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
Yep all good points. (Actually I meant Peer Review but my fingers typed featured article - damn fingers!) Appreciate your chronological flow adjustment. I will get to quotes and Haxton soon. (I wrote the Haxton article and checked the date then so will make sure it's right). I am very busy at work at the moment but should be able to get to it fairly soon. Have a good trip - will email you as time and necessity dictates.
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10:14, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Maugham's 1938 book "The Summing Up" has a wealth of information about Maugham's life as he saw it himself, and I am in the process of selecting what seems to me the most apt material from that book and inserting some of it into this article. Feel free to further edit my additions.
Andrew Szanton, 4/06
Hi Andrew, Yes I have read that book as well. Great idea to use it in his wiki article especially if what you add is referenced to the book (as we have done for other parts). Can I suggest care in terms of fact versus Maugham as he was quite often either mistaken (his memory failed him a fair bit in the end) or he was trying to cover his tracks (one of his last acts was to ask everyone that he ever wrote letters to to destroy them and he personally destroyed almost every bit of correspondence he had ever received in huge bonfires), and finally he lived in a kind of post-Wilde morbid fear of his alternate sexuality being discovered.
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00:00, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
The article says: "Maugham's father and three older brothers were all distinguished lawyers and Maugham asked to be excused from the duty of following in their footsteps." Given his stammer, did he really have to ask to be excused? I don't have any reference books handy, but someone who does might like to check this. PiCo 02:14, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
I think the article's opening assessment of Maugham the world-famous author and the description of the fumbling young Maugham that immediately follows might be better connected, and will try to add a sentence or two here.
Andrew Szanton, 5/06
How come the Significant Works section speaks nothing of The Razor's Edge and Moon and Sixpence? Even if Of Human Bondage was his most acclaimed, these atleast deserve a mention. - Cribananda 04:39, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Go for it
Cribananda. Be bold - Write!
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Steve
01:07, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
For all those interested in W. Somerset Maugham can you put your points below this one as to whether you think that it is ready for a full blown Peer Review? I think that I have covered the last 2 of the unreferenced or unlinked components this evening and it is time to move the whole article up a notch. Anyway your thoughts below if you please? V i r tual Steve 08:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
After further research I am satisfied that MaughaM is the correct spelling. Apologies for setting up another page with the wrong spelling. David( Talk • Contribs) 09:45, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
What is the purpose / value of this note without a reference? TomyDuby 04:11, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
The main article contains so little about his plays... TomyDuby 04:14, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
Just wondering, what is the correct way to pronounce "Maugham"?
why is he in the category of modern pedastry? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.58.74.161 ( talk) 08:13, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
Hello, new as a member, did not want to touch and ruin the page
1940 - Too Many Husbands Jean Arthur Fred MacMurray JABushell ( talk) 00:07, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Sir Wulliam Wiseman was not the head of MI6 or the 'British Secret Service'. See Wikipedia article on Mansfield Smith_Cumming 87.80.20.41 ( talk) 11:05, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
Will one of the IPA gurus on Wikipedia please fix the pronunciation guideline in the first sentence of this article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.30.237.192 ( talk) 00:52, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
I believe that a worthy addition to this already fine article would be a contemporary assessment of Maugham's work. Does he belong amongst the very finest of English writers? If so, why? Or, is he, to paraphrase his own words, forever delegated to the second string?
Is he forever trapped in the role of chronicler of an upper-middle-class lifestyle that has long since passed, or does his work resonate outside that frame of reference, and speak to more eternal human truths? Is his work ripe for revival, or is it simply too dated? Is the most popular of his work highly melodramatic (ie., Rain, Of Human Bondage), and thus of less literary value than one would assume it to be, given Maugham's privileged background? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.173.106.116 ( talk) 22:09, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
I'd find it more interesting when reading an article about a famous person whose mother died when he was a child to know what age he was at her death rather than what age she was. If the date of her death were given, I could work it out. Same for his father's death. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Girlwithgreeneyes ( talk • contribs) 15:45, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
I would be interested to know where most of this detail came from in the main article? I am a great admirer of his writing and have just finished re-reading The Razor's Edge. Liza of Lambeth is also one of my favourite novels. Is there a particularly good biography that can be recommended? If so, please let me know on my talk page.
Also, the article mentions 'In 1928, Maugham bought Villa Mauresque on 12 acres (49,000 m2) at Cap Ferrat on the French Riviera, which was his home for most of the rest of his life, and one of the great literary and social salons of the 1920s and 30s.' I would like to have more detail in it about this period of his life. Ivankinsman ( talk) 11:52, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Among "Influence" it would be fair to list Raymond Chandler, who corresponded with and admired Maugham. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.88.212.142 ( talk) 19:09, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
Could the originator of the bibliography please make the following addition:
The Criminal. By W. Somerset Maugham. Lloyd's Weekly News, July 31 1904, p.14
(The newspaper page is available at www.newspaperarchive.com )
This early story is not in Seventeen Lost Stories or A Traveller in Romance.
Johndoeqwe ( talk) 14:23, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
Attention originator of the bibliography. Would you please add this second additional story:
A Really Nice Story. A Short Tale by William Somerset Maugham. Black & White, November 30 1901, pp.768-769 of Vol.XXII, (pp.14-15 of No.505).
The newspaper pages are available at www.newspaperarchive.com . This a pay site.
This story is also available free at the PapersPast New Zealand website.
The Criminal is also available free at the Trove Australia website, but the author's name is omitted in this reprint; search for the character "Jimmie Loder".
Johndoeqwe ( talk) 23:57, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
QUOTE FROM WIKIPEDIA ENTRY: Jane Lane (pen name of Elaine Kidner Dakers), a contemporary anti-Maugham writer, retraced his footsteps and wrote a record of his journeys called Gin And Bitters
---
My finding: i bought the book mentioned above as i was interested in Maugham's travels. But Gin and Bitters has a completely different topic (see Jane Lane entry in Wikipedia) and nothing to do with Maugham. Maugham mentions drinking gin and bitters repeatedly though in his travel book The Gentleman in the Parlour; that's why Jane Lane's book title might sound like Maugham-related. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.247.49.233 ( talk) 22:38, 15 April 2012 (UTC)
'The Summing Up' (1938) is listed under Fiction. It is actually his memoirs, and ought to be listed under Non-fiction. Valetude ( talk) 10:02, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
'He had an affair with Syrie Wellcome, the wife of Henry Wellcome, the American-born English pharmaceutical magnate. They had a daughter named Mary Elizabeth Wellcome, (1915–1998).'
Not clear whether 'they' is meant to include Maugham or Henry Wellcome. Valetude ( talk) 10:05, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
When I read this article, it sounds like his plans to adopt Searle as his son and heir happened. But on his daughter's Wikipedia page, it says, "the author was legally barred from his adoption plans." So, did the adoption happen or not? It is clear that Searle did receive funds from Maugham's estate after he died. But as his son or friend? 63.143.226.144 ( talk) 22:12, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
The author is stated as having been born in the UK Embassy. Should this be altered to be the British Embassy, given that it's the 1890s, rather than the 20th century context of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland? 188.29.186.4 ( talk) 14:11, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Nowhere can I find any information about his novel "Where the Foxes Greet Each Other Tonight", set in Southeast Asia, and which I read in Swedish translation ("Bortom ära och redlighet") sometime in the 1960's. Ake Torngren ( talk) 14:18, 31 December 2009 (UTC)
This is not the only missing book. I have added another one that I have read long time ago, and is even referenced on the internet, but this was removed. The book is "The Ten Best Novels of the World" ( http://home.comcast.net/~dwtaylor1/maughamstenbestnovels.html) Unfortunately I don't find other references but the book exists... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sensei2004 ( talk • contribs) 09:31, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
Can anybody source this more accurately, for example from Maugham's own writings? Does The New York Public Library Literature Companion say something about that? Waldstein1981 ( talk) 09:01, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
The superlative of "wealthy" is "wealthiest" (The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language"). The word "most" modifies the only first adjective. (We wouldn't write "most beautiful and good" if we meant the most beautiful and the best. It's the same thing, mutatis mutandis.) Kdammers ( talk) 04:18, 18 October 2014 (UTC)
An IP user made an edit removing Category:Bisexual men and Category:Bisexual writers and adding Category:Gay writers. This was reverted by Dominus. I have no opinion on the "men" part, but the article states that Maugham was homosexual. This suggests that placement in bi rather than gay categories is inappropriate. Rivertorch FIRE WATER 19:45, 8 August 2017 (UTC)
It looks like the article about The Circle (the play) has been deleted. If anyone with admin rights happens to see this note, it would be great to see it restored. Laughing sandbags ( talk) 12:39, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
If you search for "The Circle", the results include a red link to "The Circle (play), a 1921 play by W. Somerset Maugham." I think that there was a detailed article there before but I may be confusing it with the article on "The Letter". Laughing sandbags ( talk) 11:47, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
I created a new article on this topic, any input from the Maugham scholars on this page would be much appreciated. Laughing sandbags ( talk) 16:03, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
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The article is unclear about his languages, which is important as regards his experiences as a spy in Russia. From some other sources it appears his first language was actually French, which was used by some of the upper class in Russia. I found sources that said he didn't know Russian, others that said he did, and one that said he learned it after he was sent there. Shanen ( talk) 11:57, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
In the section on “ Sexuality” we have a footnote that quotes Fritz Klein:
This is evidently Sue Jones ( Ethelwyn Sylvia Jones) who was the inspiration for Rosie in Cakes and Ale. Maugham proposed marriage to her in 1913, but she married Angus McDonnell later that year. I can cite this to the 1984 Morgan biography, and will add it when I get a chance.
— Mark Dominus ( talk) 13:46, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
"The posthumous allegation that Maugham was a homosexual is essentially unsubstantiated. The evidence to the contary is much more convincing.His peregrinating life style necesssitated a male secretary. In his works he clearly does not favor homosexuality."
As these four sentences violated NPOV, I removed them. Quite apart from the bizarre idea that Maugham would have openly "favor[ed]" homosexuality in his works if he were gay (an idea which indicates a faulty understanding of history on the part of whoever added it), calling the claim that Maugham was homosexual an "allegation" indicates an implicit bias. The worst sentence is "The evidence to the contary [sic] is much more convincing", which is editorial, and so violates NPOV. -- Chips Critic 15:19, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
Claiming that Willie's homosexuality is unsubstantiated is more than POV, it's just plain silly - Maugham made no secret of his relationship(s). PiCo 04:05, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
Sorry, all -- I'm a bit of a novice here, so I apologize if I'm incorrect -- but doesn't the following passage seem to violate NPOV? "...Maugham's last years were sadly marred by several quasi-scandals which can probably be set down to an itch for attention mixed with cloudy thinking from approaching dementia. The younger Maugham was far too wise and discreet to have made such basic errors in judgement..." Reecesel 05:47, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
Maugham was bisexual NOT homosexual/gay. See these articles that are a lot more factual and well researched than Wikipedia's articles: http://encycl.opentopia.com/term/W._Somerset_Maugham
Maugham was bisexual. His affair with the married Gwendoline Maud Syrie Barnardo, daughter of orphanage founder Thomas John Barnardo and wife of American-born English pharmaceutical magnate Henry Wellcome, produced a daughter named Elizabeth 'Liza' Mary Maugham (1915-1998); Syrie's husband Henry Wellcome then sued for divorce, naming Maugham as co-respondent. In May of 1916, following the decree nisi, Syrie and Maugham were married. Syrie became a noted interior decorator who popularized the all-white room in the 1920s. In 1922 Maugham dedicated his short story collection On a Chinese Screen to her. They divorced in 1927-1928 after a tempestuous marriage complicated by Maugham's frequent travels abroad and strained by his relationship with Haxton.
I am researching WWII and have read millions of newspapers of the day. I was just reading the June 23, 1940 edition and on pg 27 there is a tiny blurb saying that friends of the esteemed author are reporting having not heard from him since the day the Germans invaded Paris, which is where he was at the time, apparently. This link is to the article, which you can only retrieve if you are a NYT subscriber. I'll be happy to share my copy if need be, but you must ping me and remind me I have it filed in Zotero. I don't have time to write about it now. MagnoliaSouth ( talk) 23:06, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
There don't appear to be any links to articles in other languages. Anyone know where they might be hiding? DuncanHill ( talk) 15:20, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
This article was moved a year ago from "W. Somerset Maugham" to "Somerset Maugham" by a user who claimed that Maugham "never used the 'W.' in his name professionally during his lifetime"–– yet the original editions of many of his novels listed "W. Somerset Maugham" on their covers/book jackets/etc; and almost EVERY reputable article that can be found online that's been written about this guy includes the "W." when referring to him in full. Furthermore, the user who made the decision to move this page from its established title, "W. Somerset Maugham", to one which omitted the "W.", by all accounts, seems to have done so without ANY proper consensus on this article's Talk Page agreeing to such a page move in the first place! Hence, I have restored this article's original and long-standing title of "W. Somerset Maugham" by reversing said page move... but I'm open to further discussion. CitizenKang414 ( talk) 01:19, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
The authors may be interested to know that there is a rival page, less extensive than this, under the heading "Somerset Maughan". Note the incorrect spelling of the surname. The page mis-spelled the surname throughout, which I corrected, however the title remains. The main author is asking for proof of the correct spelling of the surname. Maybe the two groups of authors could get together. 22 May 2007 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.152.94.198 ( talk • contribs) 01:10, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
This is purely curiosity and I wish I could find some confirmation. I live in Rockville, Maryland in a home that was built in the early 1930's. On the rear of the property is a small "playhouse", the interior is about 10' x 12' and is appointed with paneling and sconces, just like the living room of the main house. It is rumored that Somerset Maugham knew the owner of the home and when he visited, in the early 1940's, Razors Edge time frame, he would go to the "playhouse" to write. I would love to confirm this. Thanks Larry P. 24 July 2015 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Larry Rosecroft ( talk • contribs) 17:50, 24 July 2015 (UTC)
This British English article uses the word medic: "Maugham, who had qualified as a medic, dropped medicine..." Was he accredited by the college of physicians?
Could someone with deeper knowledge of Maugham and early 20th century British medical terminology resolve this? A minor edit would clarify the situation. Humphrey Tribble ( talk) 20:47, 24 April 2022 (UTC)
We show him dying on 16 December 1965, as do most sources.
However, Ted Morgan's 1980 biography, which I've just finished reading, says this (p. 617, my bolding):
Has this ever been refuted? -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 00:06, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
After an excellently helpful peer review − my thanks again to those who contributed − I have nominated the article for WP:FAC. Suggestions and comments on the FAC page will be gratefully received. Tim riley talk 20:31, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
I've added to the article and rejigged it with the aim of taking it to WP:FAC. To that end I have put it up for peer review, where suggestions for further improvements will be gratefully received. Tim riley talk 10:41, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
The following attributes should be added. In WP:Biography, the military history attributes of the following should be added: |military-work-group=yes|military-priority= - I'm leaving the priority blank as someone with more knowledge of the article can independently assess its importance. The a&e-priority= - Priority I thought wasn't included on a second look, it was indeed there. No need to add that, only the MILHIST in the WP:Biography. Adamdaley ( talk) 04:50, 23 September 2022 (UTC)
W. Somerset Maugham was bisexual, and So were his male partners. This is a well known biographical fact and needs to be mentioned in the Wikipedia article. 100.34.234.175 ( talk) 03:38, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
Hi Tim riley. Can you help me understand what isn't beneficial about the copyedits you reverted here? Middle-aged is hyphenated. Authoress is an outdated term, and not gender-neutral. Conforming to norms and exacting tolls on both read more natural to me, though I concede both could go either way. gobonobo + c 10:53, 23 March 2023 (UTC)
The wording "fend off the encroachments of age" may well be appropriate for a novel, but the purpose of an encyclopedia is to straightforwardly convey information. "Prevent aging" conveys exactly the same information with 1/5 of the verbiage. What justifies overly flowery language, and in an FA? Similarly, abusing passive voice in the lead makes it less readable; I'm certainly open to different wording than my shot at it, but I find "marred by senility" even more clunky to read than "mistakes were made". The Blade of the Northern Lights ( 話して下さい) 19:15, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
passive voice is not the spawn of Satan– Sure, but that doesn't mean every use of it is a good choice.
Why do you imagine all the reviewers of this Featured Article have approved the text– I imagine it's because they aren't the gods you imagine them to be, and didn't recognize writing that can be improved when they saw it.
do you know better than everybody else?– He very well might know better. And a bunch of us working together are even more likely to know better.
prevent agingis a blunder but
attempted to fend off the encroachments of ageis all factual and literal. Which is nonsense, see below. E Eng 08:08, 18 November 2023 (UTC) Note: Sentence fragment and comma splice employed for shock value, thanks.
fend off the encroachments of ageand
marred by senilityare phrases that I would expect to see from a book, and not an encyclopedia entry. I agree with The Blade of the Northern Lights above that this is flowery language and I find their copyedited version to be better. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 04:50, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
prevent aging(or ageing) is wrong (because "Nobody can prevent ageing"), while
fend off the encroachments of ageis concrete and factual (as if age literally makes "encroachments" which one might attempt to "fend off"), then we can safely make a provisional determination of blind article ownership. Not that I would have made precisely the same edits as BOTNL did:
marred by senilityin its second use, in the article proper, because it's part of a larger list of things that marred M's final years; but in isolation, in the lead, it indeed sounds a bit flowery. I'd have to think about what to substitute, however.
The wording as it stands is entirely acceptable withing the limits of encyclopaedic writing ... there isn't anything wrong with it– Perhaps, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved, so that's an irrelevant point.
Maugham did not try to “prevent aging”– You guys keep saying that, insisting on a literal interpretation of "aging", but since OED gives (for "aging")
Growing old, showing signs of advancing age ... becoming elderly or aged. Also: giving the appearance of (old) age, then if he tried to "fend off the encroachments of age", there's no avoiding that he tried to "prevent aging". Not if you're honest about it, anyway.
is there any reason to accuse someone of ownership just because you disagree on a minor point of content– It wasn't just a disagreement on a minor point of content. It was reflexive reverts with edit summaries appealing to "agreed FA text" -- as if that's somehow an overriding consideration -- followed by the ill-considered and repeated insistence that "prevent aging" is somehow a blunder.
preferable to dead boring– I'm all for lively writing, but c'mon ... "fend off the encroachments"? In Wikipedia's voice? Really? It's a matter of taste and judgment of course, and opinions may differ, but it's hard to engage seriously on that question when this specious "you can't literally prevent aging" argument gets trotted out over and over, when "fending off encroachments" is every bit as figurative.
And no-one is claiming they are gods– Well, no one comes right out and says that, naturally.
I am being honest about the "prevent aging": it's far superior to the dead and misleading suggested replacement– Great! That's four of us (you, me, BOTNL, 0xDeadbeef) who agree "prevent aging" is far superior, so I'll install that change in the article now. E Eng 17:14, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
Can we focus on the content, rather than the editor?
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Capping this before it goes off the rails even further - SchroCat ( talk) 16:16, 18 November 2023 (UTC)*:If you reread the edits carefully you will see that I haven't. Tim riley talk 22:16, 19 November 2023 (UTC) |
do you know better than everybody elseand
by all means see if you can assemble a consensuscame off as quite combative to me. Thanks for reminding me that I'm a new admin, but I fail to see how that connects to this discussion. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 18:09, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
I am being honest about the "prevent aging": it's far superior to the dead and misleading suggested replacement? E Eng 02:05, 19 November 2023 (UTC)
How many more times has one got to explain what ageing means? It cannot be avoided. What we are talking about is the detrimental effects of ageing, which is what the agreed text says. Tim riley talk 17:09, 22 November 2023 (UTC)
Quite so. I suggest the attackers ask each of the PR and FAC reviewers for their opinions, if they can be bothered with so trivial a matter. Tim riley talk 19:40, 23 November 2023 (UTC)
an increasing wordcount on the talk page that demonstrates nothing but an inability to understand [..] needs to be explained multiple times before it is understood just why it shouldn't be usedreads like suggesting that I don't really understand the English language. So alright, maybe you folks understand English better than me and you know, all of this is a waste of time. I thought that as contributors to an encyclopaedia, we're all here to provide information to the reader, not to stand upon phrases showcasing brilliant and precise diction and criticize anyone that dared to change it as "wasting time" and "attackers".
Not really IDONTLIKEIT, more so that it's representing the information in a more indirect way for readers, especially for someone like me. To get to the effects of ageing, you'd have to reason out that ageing encroaching people means the negative connotations that come with ageing, and to fend off those would mean to try to combat or prevent those. Again, please explain your reasoning. Making an assertion that "It's not an improvement" really doesn't help this discussion. Call me blind, but I'm not seeing anything that objects my suggested wording in your reasoning above. Feel free to urge me to "drop the stick" however many times you want, but I'm genuinely just trying to have a civil and constructive discussion here. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 15:44, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
Thanks both for commenting above. I certainly wished that I actually was in bad faith, as evidenced by want[ing] the encyclopedia to be reduced to boring prose
and attempting to dull down FA quality prose
, to save me from being disheartened of being characterized as something that wasn't among my intentions at all. What can I say other than I'm sorry for stepping in this walled garden in the first place? Unwatched, thanks all for spending time to assert others as commenting on users and not content while doing it themselves. 0x
Deadbeef→∞ (
talk to me)
17:46, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
Why has User:Wik removed the external link http://maugham.thefreelibrary.com/ ? The site looks OK to me and would be pretty useful I think. User:AtStart may have linked the same website on plenty of articles, but is there a policy that disallows this kind of linking ? I guess what finally matters is whether the link is relevant to the article or not. Jay 00:03, 2 Feb 2004 (UTC)
As it turns out, when I edited the page, my internet browser's filter software removed the words boondage (with one 'o') and hommoseexual (with one 'm' and one 'e') so if someone would go back through and replace those where there are big blank spots in the code, that would be appreciated. If not, I can from school tomorrow. Zephyrprince 21:37, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Why has this article substituted 'W.' for 'William' throughout? Was this the man's preference? Should the article not then explain this? Otherwise, shouldn't we just put it back to saying 'William'?
I've enlarged the article with new material. I don't think anything from the existing article has been deleted - moved, yes, subsumed, yes, but not deleted. Please feel free to revert, edit, alter, hack, slash and burn. And to correct typos. I regret that this is the last thing I'll be doing on Wiki, as I've decided it's taking up too much of my time, so I won't be around to answer questions on sourcing etc - but it's all verifiable, even if you have to go read an old-fashioned book to find the sources. PiCo 14:38, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
I have added a complete list in chronological order of the first printing date of every article or contribution made by Maugham to journals and periodicals during his lifetime. Maugham often tested his audience and his own interest in a story by serialising it through periodicals such as The Sunday Times and then later released the story as a novel or book. In later years particularly Maugham was adverse to wasting time or work and often rewrote or reworked these articles and they became short stories to be included in his various collections of short stories as detailed elsewhere in this Wikipedia article. My questions to other editors in relation to this addition is (1) can I have your comments as to whether you feel this addition belongs where it is (that is before the Short Stories sub-heading) or should it be placed further up the page given that it is a chronolical list that assists the reader in seeing how Maugham's periodical work developed also into his books? (2)I also intend to look more closely at the list of Novels and Short Story Collections in the near future with a view to adjusting the detail into complete chronological order. Towards that point it seems to me that item 6.1 Novels and Short Story Collections should change simple to Novels as item 6.6 is Short Story Collections. Views on this before I alter it would also be appreciated? VirtualSteve 06:37, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
This must be getting to be one of the more comprehensive profiles of a writer on Wiki. Add references to the text (quite lacking at present) and it could begin the Featured Article process (rather like beginning the canonisation process in the RC Church :). PiCo 09:38, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
I haven't been around on Wiki that long myself. But have a look at Wikipedia:Peer review. It sets out the steps to be followed. I think this article needs a little more referencing in the main text of the article - to show where our knowledge of his bio comes from, and to identify any quotes. PiCo 13:06, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
Okay I have started to edit this page with a view to Featured Article and Wikipedia:Peer review and in particular set up first Harvard reference for a non-embedded link. I have gone through my own personal records - using the reference and copies of books to be almost absolutely certain that the list of Novels, Books & Pamphlets, Plays, and Contributions to Periodicals is chronologically correct. The changes made this evening do not remove any of Maugham's original works but I have removed 3 or 4 references to secondary books - that is books that were republished as a compilation of primary books either during or after Maugham's lifetime (and which are therefore already on the site at the section headings just mentioned). My intention next is to reference and as necessary clean up the list of short stories to see if it encompasses and cross matches with the Contributions to Periodicals. VirtualSteve 12:51, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
"There was a young lady of Guam/Who peddled her charms, charm by charm/Inspired, I suppose/By the classical prose/Of W Somerset Maugham." PiCo 23:15, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
"Violet Hunt, at age 13, offered herself to John Ruskin, later refused a marriage proposal from Oscar Wilde, seduced the homosexual Somerset Maugham, was seduced by H.G. Wells and lived for some years as the putative wife of Ford Madox Ford."
Offering oneself to John Ruskin seems like a pointless proposition.
See this article.
PiCo 09:29, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
The doctor buries his mistakes, the architect advises his clients to plant vines, the artist writes them into a book. PiCo 15:34, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Then article is getting rather long - 37kb. How about taking the Bibliography section (called, perhaps, Bibliography of works by Somerset Maugham and making it a separate article, with a reference frm here? PiCo 05:54, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
Done - the link should be in blue now :-). PiCo 12:26, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
I've edited for style - not much substantive change. I think it could be put up for featured article candidate now. But please, check that reference to Alan Searle's background as a catamite to the rich and famous in London. Morgan says something about Searle having been well-known in gay circles in London (which is why Maugham sought him out after Haxton's death), but the question of his age at the time is very shaky, based on something I read somewhere about Searle writing a letter to a friend during a trip to Egypt with maugham, in which he says he "hasn't been so popular since I was 12 years old" - not exactly rock-hard evidence for rtaducing the man's reputation. PiCo 05:48, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
"I was in Romania a few years ago and heard much of Doctor Aslan, but after seeing what happened to Somerset Maugham at the hands of that Swiss quack I am reluctant to think of rejuvenation! However I am sure that Doctor Aslan is far better than the man [Dr Niehans] whose name I always Freudianly forget." Thusly Graham Greene to a friend, about 1969. It reminded me of this episode in Willie's life: apparently he went once a year to a clinic in Switzerland run by this Dr Niehans, where he had his bum injected with a brew of concentrate of lambs' testicles. It was said to endow the recipient with a smooth and youthful skin. PiCo 11:20, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
The two edits subsequent to this version were (a) someone who believed, no doubt sincerely, that e.e.cummings was E.E. Cummings, and (b) someone who didn't like one of the photos. Both are mistaken. PiCo 12:35, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
I think we are about ready to nominate this article for Featured Article status now and wait for the input of other editors. As you will see I have adjusted the Searle quote - I just couldn't find the Coward link so I thought it better to remove. Give me your thoughts and then we can put it up if you agree.
V
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Steve
10:48, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
Yep all good points. (Actually I meant Peer Review but my fingers typed featured article - damn fingers!) Appreciate your chronological flow adjustment. I will get to quotes and Haxton soon. (I wrote the Haxton article and checked the date then so will make sure it's right). I am very busy at work at the moment but should be able to get to it fairly soon. Have a good trip - will email you as time and necessity dictates.
V
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Steve
10:14, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Maugham's 1938 book "The Summing Up" has a wealth of information about Maugham's life as he saw it himself, and I am in the process of selecting what seems to me the most apt material from that book and inserting some of it into this article. Feel free to further edit my additions.
Andrew Szanton, 4/06
Hi Andrew, Yes I have read that book as well. Great idea to use it in his wiki article especially if what you add is referenced to the book (as we have done for other parts). Can I suggest care in terms of fact versus Maugham as he was quite often either mistaken (his memory failed him a fair bit in the end) or he was trying to cover his tracks (one of his last acts was to ask everyone that he ever wrote letters to to destroy them and he personally destroyed almost every bit of correspondence he had ever received in huge bonfires), and finally he lived in a kind of post-Wilde morbid fear of his alternate sexuality being discovered.
V
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Steve
00:00, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
The article says: "Maugham's father and three older brothers were all distinguished lawyers and Maugham asked to be excused from the duty of following in their footsteps." Given his stammer, did he really have to ask to be excused? I don't have any reference books handy, but someone who does might like to check this. PiCo 02:14, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
I think the article's opening assessment of Maugham the world-famous author and the description of the fumbling young Maugham that immediately follows might be better connected, and will try to add a sentence or two here.
Andrew Szanton, 5/06
How come the Significant Works section speaks nothing of The Razor's Edge and Moon and Sixpence? Even if Of Human Bondage was his most acclaimed, these atleast deserve a mention. - Cribananda 04:39, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Go for it
Cribananda. Be bold - Write!
V
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Steve
01:07, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
For all those interested in W. Somerset Maugham can you put your points below this one as to whether you think that it is ready for a full blown Peer Review? I think that I have covered the last 2 of the unreferenced or unlinked components this evening and it is time to move the whole article up a notch. Anyway your thoughts below if you please? V i r tual Steve 08:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
After further research I am satisfied that MaughaM is the correct spelling. Apologies for setting up another page with the wrong spelling. David( Talk • Contribs) 09:45, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
What is the purpose / value of this note without a reference? TomyDuby 04:11, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
The main article contains so little about his plays... TomyDuby 04:14, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
Just wondering, what is the correct way to pronounce "Maugham"?
why is he in the category of modern pedastry? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.58.74.161 ( talk) 08:13, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
Hello, new as a member, did not want to touch and ruin the page
1940 - Too Many Husbands Jean Arthur Fred MacMurray JABushell ( talk) 00:07, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Sir Wulliam Wiseman was not the head of MI6 or the 'British Secret Service'. See Wikipedia article on Mansfield Smith_Cumming 87.80.20.41 ( talk) 11:05, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
Will one of the IPA gurus on Wikipedia please fix the pronunciation guideline in the first sentence of this article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.30.237.192 ( talk) 00:52, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
I believe that a worthy addition to this already fine article would be a contemporary assessment of Maugham's work. Does he belong amongst the very finest of English writers? If so, why? Or, is he, to paraphrase his own words, forever delegated to the second string?
Is he forever trapped in the role of chronicler of an upper-middle-class lifestyle that has long since passed, or does his work resonate outside that frame of reference, and speak to more eternal human truths? Is his work ripe for revival, or is it simply too dated? Is the most popular of his work highly melodramatic (ie., Rain, Of Human Bondage), and thus of less literary value than one would assume it to be, given Maugham's privileged background? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.173.106.116 ( talk) 22:09, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
I'd find it more interesting when reading an article about a famous person whose mother died when he was a child to know what age he was at her death rather than what age she was. If the date of her death were given, I could work it out. Same for his father's death. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Girlwithgreeneyes ( talk • contribs) 15:45, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
I would be interested to know where most of this detail came from in the main article? I am a great admirer of his writing and have just finished re-reading The Razor's Edge. Liza of Lambeth is also one of my favourite novels. Is there a particularly good biography that can be recommended? If so, please let me know on my talk page.
Also, the article mentions 'In 1928, Maugham bought Villa Mauresque on 12 acres (49,000 m2) at Cap Ferrat on the French Riviera, which was his home for most of the rest of his life, and one of the great literary and social salons of the 1920s and 30s.' I would like to have more detail in it about this period of his life. Ivankinsman ( talk) 11:52, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Among "Influence" it would be fair to list Raymond Chandler, who corresponded with and admired Maugham. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.88.212.142 ( talk) 19:09, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
Could the originator of the bibliography please make the following addition:
The Criminal. By W. Somerset Maugham. Lloyd's Weekly News, July 31 1904, p.14
(The newspaper page is available at www.newspaperarchive.com )
This early story is not in Seventeen Lost Stories or A Traveller in Romance.
Johndoeqwe ( talk) 14:23, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
Attention originator of the bibliography. Would you please add this second additional story:
A Really Nice Story. A Short Tale by William Somerset Maugham. Black & White, November 30 1901, pp.768-769 of Vol.XXII, (pp.14-15 of No.505).
The newspaper pages are available at www.newspaperarchive.com . This a pay site.
This story is also available free at the PapersPast New Zealand website.
The Criminal is also available free at the Trove Australia website, but the author's name is omitted in this reprint; search for the character "Jimmie Loder".
Johndoeqwe ( talk) 23:57, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
QUOTE FROM WIKIPEDIA ENTRY: Jane Lane (pen name of Elaine Kidner Dakers), a contemporary anti-Maugham writer, retraced his footsteps and wrote a record of his journeys called Gin And Bitters
---
My finding: i bought the book mentioned above as i was interested in Maugham's travels. But Gin and Bitters has a completely different topic (see Jane Lane entry in Wikipedia) and nothing to do with Maugham. Maugham mentions drinking gin and bitters repeatedly though in his travel book The Gentleman in the Parlour; that's why Jane Lane's book title might sound like Maugham-related. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.247.49.233 ( talk) 22:38, 15 April 2012 (UTC)
'The Summing Up' (1938) is listed under Fiction. It is actually his memoirs, and ought to be listed under Non-fiction. Valetude ( talk) 10:02, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
'He had an affair with Syrie Wellcome, the wife of Henry Wellcome, the American-born English pharmaceutical magnate. They had a daughter named Mary Elizabeth Wellcome, (1915–1998).'
Not clear whether 'they' is meant to include Maugham or Henry Wellcome. Valetude ( talk) 10:05, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
When I read this article, it sounds like his plans to adopt Searle as his son and heir happened. But on his daughter's Wikipedia page, it says, "the author was legally barred from his adoption plans." So, did the adoption happen or not? It is clear that Searle did receive funds from Maugham's estate after he died. But as his son or friend? 63.143.226.144 ( talk) 22:12, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
The author is stated as having been born in the UK Embassy. Should this be altered to be the British Embassy, given that it's the 1890s, rather than the 20th century context of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland? 188.29.186.4 ( talk) 14:11, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Nowhere can I find any information about his novel "Where the Foxes Greet Each Other Tonight", set in Southeast Asia, and which I read in Swedish translation ("Bortom ära och redlighet") sometime in the 1960's. Ake Torngren ( talk) 14:18, 31 December 2009 (UTC)
This is not the only missing book. I have added another one that I have read long time ago, and is even referenced on the internet, but this was removed. The book is "The Ten Best Novels of the World" ( http://home.comcast.net/~dwtaylor1/maughamstenbestnovels.html) Unfortunately I don't find other references but the book exists... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sensei2004 ( talk • contribs) 09:31, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
Can anybody source this more accurately, for example from Maugham's own writings? Does The New York Public Library Literature Companion say something about that? Waldstein1981 ( talk) 09:01, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
The superlative of "wealthy" is "wealthiest" (The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language"). The word "most" modifies the only first adjective. (We wouldn't write "most beautiful and good" if we meant the most beautiful and the best. It's the same thing, mutatis mutandis.) Kdammers ( talk) 04:18, 18 October 2014 (UTC)
An IP user made an edit removing Category:Bisexual men and Category:Bisexual writers and adding Category:Gay writers. This was reverted by Dominus. I have no opinion on the "men" part, but the article states that Maugham was homosexual. This suggests that placement in bi rather than gay categories is inappropriate. Rivertorch FIRE WATER 19:45, 8 August 2017 (UTC)
It looks like the article about The Circle (the play) has been deleted. If anyone with admin rights happens to see this note, it would be great to see it restored. Laughing sandbags ( talk) 12:39, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
If you search for "The Circle", the results include a red link to "The Circle (play), a 1921 play by W. Somerset Maugham." I think that there was a detailed article there before but I may be confusing it with the article on "The Letter". Laughing sandbags ( talk) 11:47, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
I created a new article on this topic, any input from the Maugham scholars on this page would be much appreciated. Laughing sandbags ( talk) 16:03, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
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The article is unclear about his languages, which is important as regards his experiences as a spy in Russia. From some other sources it appears his first language was actually French, which was used by some of the upper class in Russia. I found sources that said he didn't know Russian, others that said he did, and one that said he learned it after he was sent there. Shanen ( talk) 11:57, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
In the section on “ Sexuality” we have a footnote that quotes Fritz Klein:
This is evidently Sue Jones ( Ethelwyn Sylvia Jones) who was the inspiration for Rosie in Cakes and Ale. Maugham proposed marriage to her in 1913, but she married Angus McDonnell later that year. I can cite this to the 1984 Morgan biography, and will add it when I get a chance.
— Mark Dominus ( talk) 13:46, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
"The posthumous allegation that Maugham was a homosexual is essentially unsubstantiated. The evidence to the contary is much more convincing.His peregrinating life style necesssitated a male secretary. In his works he clearly does not favor homosexuality."
As these four sentences violated NPOV, I removed them. Quite apart from the bizarre idea that Maugham would have openly "favor[ed]" homosexuality in his works if he were gay (an idea which indicates a faulty understanding of history on the part of whoever added it), calling the claim that Maugham was homosexual an "allegation" indicates an implicit bias. The worst sentence is "The evidence to the contary [sic] is much more convincing", which is editorial, and so violates NPOV. -- Chips Critic 15:19, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
Claiming that Willie's homosexuality is unsubstantiated is more than POV, it's just plain silly - Maugham made no secret of his relationship(s). PiCo 04:05, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
Sorry, all -- I'm a bit of a novice here, so I apologize if I'm incorrect -- but doesn't the following passage seem to violate NPOV? "...Maugham's last years were sadly marred by several quasi-scandals which can probably be set down to an itch for attention mixed with cloudy thinking from approaching dementia. The younger Maugham was far too wise and discreet to have made such basic errors in judgement..." Reecesel 05:47, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
Maugham was bisexual NOT homosexual/gay. See these articles that are a lot more factual and well researched than Wikipedia's articles: http://encycl.opentopia.com/term/W._Somerset_Maugham
Maugham was bisexual. His affair with the married Gwendoline Maud Syrie Barnardo, daughter of orphanage founder Thomas John Barnardo and wife of American-born English pharmaceutical magnate Henry Wellcome, produced a daughter named Elizabeth 'Liza' Mary Maugham (1915-1998); Syrie's husband Henry Wellcome then sued for divorce, naming Maugham as co-respondent. In May of 1916, following the decree nisi, Syrie and Maugham were married. Syrie became a noted interior decorator who popularized the all-white room in the 1920s. In 1922 Maugham dedicated his short story collection On a Chinese Screen to her. They divorced in 1927-1928 after a tempestuous marriage complicated by Maugham's frequent travels abroad and strained by his relationship with Haxton.
I am researching WWII and have read millions of newspapers of the day. I was just reading the June 23, 1940 edition and on pg 27 there is a tiny blurb saying that friends of the esteemed author are reporting having not heard from him since the day the Germans invaded Paris, which is where he was at the time, apparently. This link is to the article, which you can only retrieve if you are a NYT subscriber. I'll be happy to share my copy if need be, but you must ping me and remind me I have it filed in Zotero. I don't have time to write about it now. MagnoliaSouth ( talk) 23:06, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
There don't appear to be any links to articles in other languages. Anyone know where they might be hiding? DuncanHill ( talk) 15:20, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
This article was moved a year ago from "W. Somerset Maugham" to "Somerset Maugham" by a user who claimed that Maugham "never used the 'W.' in his name professionally during his lifetime"–– yet the original editions of many of his novels listed "W. Somerset Maugham" on their covers/book jackets/etc; and almost EVERY reputable article that can be found online that's been written about this guy includes the "W." when referring to him in full. Furthermore, the user who made the decision to move this page from its established title, "W. Somerset Maugham", to one which omitted the "W.", by all accounts, seems to have done so without ANY proper consensus on this article's Talk Page agreeing to such a page move in the first place! Hence, I have restored this article's original and long-standing title of "W. Somerset Maugham" by reversing said page move... but I'm open to further discussion. CitizenKang414 ( talk) 01:19, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
The authors may be interested to know that there is a rival page, less extensive than this, under the heading "Somerset Maughan". Note the incorrect spelling of the surname. The page mis-spelled the surname throughout, which I corrected, however the title remains. The main author is asking for proof of the correct spelling of the surname. Maybe the two groups of authors could get together. 22 May 2007 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.152.94.198 ( talk • contribs) 01:10, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
This is purely curiosity and I wish I could find some confirmation. I live in Rockville, Maryland in a home that was built in the early 1930's. On the rear of the property is a small "playhouse", the interior is about 10' x 12' and is appointed with paneling and sconces, just like the living room of the main house. It is rumored that Somerset Maugham knew the owner of the home and when he visited, in the early 1940's, Razors Edge time frame, he would go to the "playhouse" to write. I would love to confirm this. Thanks Larry P. 24 July 2015 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Larry Rosecroft ( talk • contribs) 17:50, 24 July 2015 (UTC)
This British English article uses the word medic: "Maugham, who had qualified as a medic, dropped medicine..." Was he accredited by the college of physicians?
Could someone with deeper knowledge of Maugham and early 20th century British medical terminology resolve this? A minor edit would clarify the situation. Humphrey Tribble ( talk) 20:47, 24 April 2022 (UTC)
We show him dying on 16 December 1965, as do most sources.
However, Ted Morgan's 1980 biography, which I've just finished reading, says this (p. 617, my bolding):
Has this ever been refuted? -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 00:06, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
After an excellently helpful peer review − my thanks again to those who contributed − I have nominated the article for WP:FAC. Suggestions and comments on the FAC page will be gratefully received. Tim riley talk 20:31, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
I've added to the article and rejigged it with the aim of taking it to WP:FAC. To that end I have put it up for peer review, where suggestions for further improvements will be gratefully received. Tim riley talk 10:41, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
The following attributes should be added. In WP:Biography, the military history attributes of the following should be added: |military-work-group=yes|military-priority= - I'm leaving the priority blank as someone with more knowledge of the article can independently assess its importance. The a&e-priority= - Priority I thought wasn't included on a second look, it was indeed there. No need to add that, only the MILHIST in the WP:Biography. Adamdaley ( talk) 04:50, 23 September 2022 (UTC)
W. Somerset Maugham was bisexual, and So were his male partners. This is a well known biographical fact and needs to be mentioned in the Wikipedia article. 100.34.234.175 ( talk) 03:38, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
Hi Tim riley. Can you help me understand what isn't beneficial about the copyedits you reverted here? Middle-aged is hyphenated. Authoress is an outdated term, and not gender-neutral. Conforming to norms and exacting tolls on both read more natural to me, though I concede both could go either way. gobonobo + c 10:53, 23 March 2023 (UTC)
The wording "fend off the encroachments of age" may well be appropriate for a novel, but the purpose of an encyclopedia is to straightforwardly convey information. "Prevent aging" conveys exactly the same information with 1/5 of the verbiage. What justifies overly flowery language, and in an FA? Similarly, abusing passive voice in the lead makes it less readable; I'm certainly open to different wording than my shot at it, but I find "marred by senility" even more clunky to read than "mistakes were made". The Blade of the Northern Lights ( 話して下さい) 19:15, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
passive voice is not the spawn of Satan– Sure, but that doesn't mean every use of it is a good choice.
Why do you imagine all the reviewers of this Featured Article have approved the text– I imagine it's because they aren't the gods you imagine them to be, and didn't recognize writing that can be improved when they saw it.
do you know better than everybody else?– He very well might know better. And a bunch of us working together are even more likely to know better.
prevent agingis a blunder but
attempted to fend off the encroachments of ageis all factual and literal. Which is nonsense, see below. E Eng 08:08, 18 November 2023 (UTC) Note: Sentence fragment and comma splice employed for shock value, thanks.
fend off the encroachments of ageand
marred by senilityare phrases that I would expect to see from a book, and not an encyclopedia entry. I agree with The Blade of the Northern Lights above that this is flowery language and I find their copyedited version to be better. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 04:50, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
prevent aging(or ageing) is wrong (because "Nobody can prevent ageing"), while
fend off the encroachments of ageis concrete and factual (as if age literally makes "encroachments" which one might attempt to "fend off"), then we can safely make a provisional determination of blind article ownership. Not that I would have made precisely the same edits as BOTNL did:
marred by senilityin its second use, in the article proper, because it's part of a larger list of things that marred M's final years; but in isolation, in the lead, it indeed sounds a bit flowery. I'd have to think about what to substitute, however.
The wording as it stands is entirely acceptable withing the limits of encyclopaedic writing ... there isn't anything wrong with it– Perhaps, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved, so that's an irrelevant point.
Maugham did not try to “prevent aging”– You guys keep saying that, insisting on a literal interpretation of "aging", but since OED gives (for "aging")
Growing old, showing signs of advancing age ... becoming elderly or aged. Also: giving the appearance of (old) age, then if he tried to "fend off the encroachments of age", there's no avoiding that he tried to "prevent aging". Not if you're honest about it, anyway.
is there any reason to accuse someone of ownership just because you disagree on a minor point of content– It wasn't just a disagreement on a minor point of content. It was reflexive reverts with edit summaries appealing to "agreed FA text" -- as if that's somehow an overriding consideration -- followed by the ill-considered and repeated insistence that "prevent aging" is somehow a blunder.
preferable to dead boring– I'm all for lively writing, but c'mon ... "fend off the encroachments"? In Wikipedia's voice? Really? It's a matter of taste and judgment of course, and opinions may differ, but it's hard to engage seriously on that question when this specious "you can't literally prevent aging" argument gets trotted out over and over, when "fending off encroachments" is every bit as figurative.
And no-one is claiming they are gods– Well, no one comes right out and says that, naturally.
I am being honest about the "prevent aging": it's far superior to the dead and misleading suggested replacement– Great! That's four of us (you, me, BOTNL, 0xDeadbeef) who agree "prevent aging" is far superior, so I'll install that change in the article now. E Eng 17:14, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
Can we focus on the content, rather than the editor?
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Capping this before it goes off the rails even further - SchroCat ( talk) 16:16, 18 November 2023 (UTC)*:If you reread the edits carefully you will see that I haven't. Tim riley talk 22:16, 19 November 2023 (UTC) |
do you know better than everybody elseand
by all means see if you can assemble a consensuscame off as quite combative to me. Thanks for reminding me that I'm a new admin, but I fail to see how that connects to this discussion. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 18:09, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
I am being honest about the "prevent aging": it's far superior to the dead and misleading suggested replacement? E Eng 02:05, 19 November 2023 (UTC)
How many more times has one got to explain what ageing means? It cannot be avoided. What we are talking about is the detrimental effects of ageing, which is what the agreed text says. Tim riley talk 17:09, 22 November 2023 (UTC)
Quite so. I suggest the attackers ask each of the PR and FAC reviewers for their opinions, if they can be bothered with so trivial a matter. Tim riley talk 19:40, 23 November 2023 (UTC)
an increasing wordcount on the talk page that demonstrates nothing but an inability to understand [..] needs to be explained multiple times before it is understood just why it shouldn't be usedreads like suggesting that I don't really understand the English language. So alright, maybe you folks understand English better than me and you know, all of this is a waste of time. I thought that as contributors to an encyclopaedia, we're all here to provide information to the reader, not to stand upon phrases showcasing brilliant and precise diction and criticize anyone that dared to change it as "wasting time" and "attackers".
Not really IDONTLIKEIT, more so that it's representing the information in a more indirect way for readers, especially for someone like me. To get to the effects of ageing, you'd have to reason out that ageing encroaching people means the negative connotations that come with ageing, and to fend off those would mean to try to combat or prevent those. Again, please explain your reasoning. Making an assertion that "It's not an improvement" really doesn't help this discussion. Call me blind, but I'm not seeing anything that objects my suggested wording in your reasoning above. Feel free to urge me to "drop the stick" however many times you want, but I'm genuinely just trying to have a civil and constructive discussion here. 0x Deadbeef→∞ ( talk to me) 15:44, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
Thanks both for commenting above. I certainly wished that I actually was in bad faith, as evidenced by want[ing] the encyclopedia to be reduced to boring prose
and attempting to dull down FA quality prose
, to save me from being disheartened of being characterized as something that wasn't among my intentions at all. What can I say other than I'm sorry for stepping in this walled garden in the first place? Unwatched, thanks all for spending time to assert others as commenting on users and not content while doing it themselves. 0x
Deadbeef→∞ (
talk to me)
17:46, 24 November 2023 (UTC)