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Find correct name
The airport is not listed as João Paulo II anywhere.
The airport's own website calls itself simply Ponta Delgada, and has no mention of João Paulo.
Template:Regions of Portugal: statistical (NUTS3) subregions and intercommunal entities are confused; they are not the same in all regions, and should be sublisted separately in each region: intermunicipal entities are sometimes larger and split by subregions (e.g. the Metropolitan Area of Lisbon has two subregions), some intercommunal entities are containing only parts of subregions. All subregions should be listed explicitly and not assume they are only intermunicipal entities (which accessorily are not statistic subdivisions but real administrative entities, so they should be listed below, probably using a smaller font: we can safely eliminate the subgrouping by type of intermunicipal entity from this box).
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Spain, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Spain on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SpainWikipedia:WikiProject SpainTemplate:WikiProject SpainSpain articles
This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Netherlands, an attempt to create, expand, and improve articles related to the
Netherlands on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, visit the
project page where you can join the project or contribute to the
discussion.NetherlandsWikipedia:WikiProject NetherlandsTemplate:WikiProject NetherlandsNetherlands articles
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France on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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This article is within the scope of WikiProject United Kingdom, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the
United Kingdom on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.United KingdomWikipedia:WikiProject United KingdomTemplate:WikiProject United KingdomUnited Kingdom articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Russia, a
WikiProject dedicated to coverage of
Russia on Wikipedia. To participate: Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the
project page, or contribute to the
project discussion.RussiaWikipedia:WikiProject RussiaTemplate:WikiProject RussiaRussia articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the
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Davis and the Falklands "Discovery"
There are arguments for not writing "1592 - Davis discovers the Falkland Islands.
Maybe Davis landing can be stated in another way since the islands appear in much earlier maps than 1592. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Copdefalç (
talk •
contribs) 21:06, 6 February 2011 (UTC):Just because a landmass appears in some map(s) doesn't mean it actually represents a real island(s). Please provide a scholarly source that definitively states that the Falklands were discovered prior to Davis's sighting in 1592. From what I remember reading, your argument appears rather weak.
OldBabyBlue (
talk) 03:10, 11 February 2011 (UTC)(Struck out comment by banned user:
Xyl 54 (
talk)
23:42, 28 August 2015 (UTC))reply
Guidelines for additions to article
People need to stop adding superfluous entries to the article. To combat this, the following rules will be adopted:
1) Only include the first (not second or third) European(s) to discover and/or chart a particular region.
2) Do NOT include the first to settle a region if they were not also the first to discover/chart it.
3) No dubious claims only supported by secondary sources (e.g. that bastard Vespucci).
4) The article is written in present tense (not past tense), so any new entries will follow the same tense.
5) No entries that include discoveries made in the ocean or in outer space (there are separate articles for them).
I've run into a dispute with another editor over the inclusion of the following four items:
1702 – The Spanish ship Rosario discovers
Rosario Island, later renamed Nishinoshima in 1904, around 940 km (584 mi) south-southeast of Tokyo.
1978 – A Danish survey team discovers
Oodaaq, a gravel bank north of Kaffeklubben Island, Greenland.
2013 –
Yaya Island is sighted for the first time from a Russian helicopter.
2021 – A Danish-Swiss research expedition coordinated by Morten Rasch, looking for
Oodaaq, accidentally finds
Qeqertaq Avannarleq instead.
The other editor believes that these are too small and insignificant to warrant inclusion, and that gravel banks, reefs, and islands under one square mile in size should be automatically excluded. They do not find the ability to cite news articles about the discoveries to be an indicator of significance, because "the news will report on anything". They are apparently passionate about this, since their entire edit history involves removing entries from this article. They have responded to me adding these entries twice by saying "please stop vandalizing this page", which I think is a bad faith characterization of my actions.
I believe these are appropriate entries for the article because:
1) They are pieces of land discovered by Europeans
2) There is no previously specified minimum size for inclusion in the article
3) Most importantly, all of these pieces of land are notable enough to have Wikipedia articles that in turn contain citations from valid sources. If they are not significant enough for the article, surely their Wikipedia pages should be deleted as well.
Like I said, I'd like to open this up to other editors to start forming a consensus whether any or all of these should be retained in the article.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
05:00, 23 March 2022 (UTC)reply
There are a bunch of tiny specks of land that have wikipedia articles. That doesn't mean we should include every single one. All the entries up until yours included significant stretches of coastline, river, or a number of island discoveries. Your entries are the only tiny, insignificant ones on here. Please stop adding them.
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
05:12, 30 March 2022 (UTC)reply
I am definitely aware of your position, which I discussed in my post. I'm now looking for other editors to share their opinions on it as well. I only added them in twice, in line with the three revert rule, the second time with more motivation in the edit summary. I have made it clear I am not going to add them back in unless a consensus forms supporting their inclusion, so you do not have to ask me to stop adding them.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
22:27, 30 March 2022 (UTC)reply
You added nothing. There wasn't a single entry that included underwater discoveries until you added one. If you wanna create an article on underwater discoveries knock yourself out but don't include that trash here. Why do you keep adding tiny, insignificant discoveries? It's like I'm talking to a brick wall. You wanna answer my question?
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
05:27, 31 March 2022 (UTC)reply
Comment on the issue, not the other editor. You also don’t own the page, so your opinion about what’s significant or not is just that. Let’s not head to ANI, ok?
Parsecboy (
talk)
11:18, 31 March 2022 (UTC)reply
Can we check to see if ChristopherColumbus1492 is another sockpuppet of Jonas Poole, who currently has 40+ banned alt accounts, two of which commented above on this exact talk page on two different occasions years apart? He was/is famous for getting furious and attacking other editors for not agreeing with his specific whims. If it quacks like a duck...
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
01:33, 1 April 2022 (UTC)reply
I already included my rationale for adding the entries in my original post here. This isn't about winning or losing, I just wanted to hear more opinions from other people on whether those entries belonged.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
03:39, 1 April 2022 (UTC)reply
I have received permission from a Wikipedia administrator to restore these items. I am thus doing so. Please don't remove them again unless more people weigh in and a new consensus forms against them.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
03:12, 18 April 2022 (UTC)reply
So you realized it wasn't gonna go your way so you went to the principal? I see. I'll be reverting your edits as a consensus wasn't reached. You did the opposite of what you said you'd do. That makes you a liar. I hate liars.
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
16:30, 18 April 2022 (UTC)reply
@
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz: what
User:Parsecboy actually told you was "Your best bet would probably be to try to get more people involved - you might try posting neutral invitations for comments at relevant wikiprojects
WP:GEOGRAPHY and
WP:HISTORY seem like the best place to start). You could also start an
WP:RFC or request a third opinion." They have been removed again and I back that removal. Seriously, a gravel bank? I'd strongly suggest starting an RfC which you can then post to the Wikiprojects. Keep it simple. Should there be criteria including size? might be a good question. Sources should not be the media in any case. If you can't find academic sources, then it isn't significant enough.
Doug Wellertalk13:14, 19 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Thank you for sharing your opinion on this without attacking me.
I would like to point out that
User:Parsecboy said that to me after all the discussion that has gone on here. So the characterization of "what [he] actually told you...", insofar as it might be interpreted I misrepresented his words, is misleading.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
21:37, 19 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Well, no, it's not a matter of interpretation (assuming you believe in the linear nature of time); they restored the material
here on 18 April and I answered them more than a day later
on 19 April. Chastising them for not listening to what I said is not a valid take on the situation.
Parsecboy (
talk)
11:57, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Permission for what? It's not within my power to give or withhold permission for anything (as
I told Qmwnebrvtcyxuz earlier); nor is permission required.
Parsecboy (
talk)
12:08, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
@
Parsecboy: exactly. Not our job. I was responding to the above statement "I have received permission from a Wikipedia administrator to restore these items. I am thus doing so. Please don't remove them again unless more people weigh in and a new consensus forms against them. Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (talk) 4:12 am, 18 April 2022, last Monday (2 days ago) (UTC+1)" where I assumed you were the Admin involved.
Doug Wellertalk12:16, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
While Qmwnebrvtcyxuz has had an account for a long time (in fact they predate me by a couple of weeks), they haven't edited a whole lot in that time, and it seems they aren't particularly familiar with how things work; hopefully this bit is more clear to them now.
Parsecboy (
talk)
12:33, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
When I said I received permission, I was basing it off Parsecboy saying: "Since discussion has petered out, and he seems to have stopped editing, you might just restore the material and move on. If he returns, I can deal with it." I took this to be 'permission' which I now realize was more suggestion.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
12:44, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Third opinion declined: There are more than two editors involved (specifically, They have been removed again and I back that removal. Seriously, a gravel bank? suggests involvement). As has been suggested, you can instead start a
request for comments and post it to the relevant WikiProjects listed at the top of this page. —
LauritzT (
talk)
16:48, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Geography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
geography on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GeographyWikipedia:WikiProject GeographyTemplate:WikiProject Geographygeography articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject History, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the subject of
History on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.HistoryWikipedia:WikiProject HistoryTemplate:WikiProject Historyhistory articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Portugal, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Portugal on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PortugalWikipedia:WikiProject PortugalTemplate:WikiProject PortugalPortugal articles
Find correct name
The airport is not listed as João Paulo II anywhere.
The airport's own website calls itself simply Ponta Delgada, and has no mention of João Paulo.
Template:Regions of Portugal: statistical (NUTS3) subregions and intercommunal entities are confused; they are not the same in all regions, and should be sublisted separately in each region: intermunicipal entities are sometimes larger and split by subregions (e.g. the Metropolitan Area of Lisbon has two subregions), some intercommunal entities are containing only parts of subregions. All subregions should be listed explicitly and not assume they are only intermunicipal entities (which accessorily are not statistic subdivisions but real administrative entities, so they should be listed below, probably using a smaller font: we can safely eliminate the subgrouping by type of intermunicipal entity from this box).
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Spain, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Spain on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SpainWikipedia:WikiProject SpainTemplate:WikiProject SpainSpain articles
This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Netherlands, an attempt to create, expand, and improve articles related to the
Netherlands on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, visit the
project page where you can join the project or contribute to the
discussion.NetherlandsWikipedia:WikiProject NetherlandsTemplate:WikiProject NetherlandsNetherlands articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject France, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
France on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.FranceWikipedia:WikiProject FranceTemplate:WikiProject FranceFrance articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject United Kingdom, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the
United Kingdom on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.United KingdomWikipedia:WikiProject United KingdomTemplate:WikiProject United KingdomUnited Kingdom articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Russia, a
WikiProject dedicated to coverage of
Russia on Wikipedia. To participate: Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the
project page, or contribute to the
project discussion.RussiaWikipedia:WikiProject RussiaTemplate:WikiProject RussiaRussia articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the
United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Norway, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Norway on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.NorwayWikipedia:WikiProject NorwayTemplate:WikiProject NorwayNorway articles
Davis and the Falklands "Discovery"
There are arguments for not writing "1592 - Davis discovers the Falkland Islands.
Maybe Davis landing can be stated in another way since the islands appear in much earlier maps than 1592. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Copdefalç (
talk •
contribs) 21:06, 6 February 2011 (UTC):Just because a landmass appears in some map(s) doesn't mean it actually represents a real island(s). Please provide a scholarly source that definitively states that the Falklands were discovered prior to Davis's sighting in 1592. From what I remember reading, your argument appears rather weak.
OldBabyBlue (
talk) 03:10, 11 February 2011 (UTC)(Struck out comment by banned user:
Xyl 54 (
talk)
23:42, 28 August 2015 (UTC))reply
Guidelines for additions to article
People need to stop adding superfluous entries to the article. To combat this, the following rules will be adopted:
1) Only include the first (not second or third) European(s) to discover and/or chart a particular region.
2) Do NOT include the first to settle a region if they were not also the first to discover/chart it.
3) No dubious claims only supported by secondary sources (e.g. that bastard Vespucci).
4) The article is written in present tense (not past tense), so any new entries will follow the same tense.
5) No entries that include discoveries made in the ocean or in outer space (there are separate articles for them).
I've run into a dispute with another editor over the inclusion of the following four items:
1702 – The Spanish ship Rosario discovers
Rosario Island, later renamed Nishinoshima in 1904, around 940 km (584 mi) south-southeast of Tokyo.
1978 – A Danish survey team discovers
Oodaaq, a gravel bank north of Kaffeklubben Island, Greenland.
2013 –
Yaya Island is sighted for the first time from a Russian helicopter.
2021 – A Danish-Swiss research expedition coordinated by Morten Rasch, looking for
Oodaaq, accidentally finds
Qeqertaq Avannarleq instead.
The other editor believes that these are too small and insignificant to warrant inclusion, and that gravel banks, reefs, and islands under one square mile in size should be automatically excluded. They do not find the ability to cite news articles about the discoveries to be an indicator of significance, because "the news will report on anything". They are apparently passionate about this, since their entire edit history involves removing entries from this article. They have responded to me adding these entries twice by saying "please stop vandalizing this page", which I think is a bad faith characterization of my actions.
I believe these are appropriate entries for the article because:
1) They are pieces of land discovered by Europeans
2) There is no previously specified minimum size for inclusion in the article
3) Most importantly, all of these pieces of land are notable enough to have Wikipedia articles that in turn contain citations from valid sources. If they are not significant enough for the article, surely their Wikipedia pages should be deleted as well.
Like I said, I'd like to open this up to other editors to start forming a consensus whether any or all of these should be retained in the article.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
05:00, 23 March 2022 (UTC)reply
There are a bunch of tiny specks of land that have wikipedia articles. That doesn't mean we should include every single one. All the entries up until yours included significant stretches of coastline, river, or a number of island discoveries. Your entries are the only tiny, insignificant ones on here. Please stop adding them.
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
05:12, 30 March 2022 (UTC)reply
I am definitely aware of your position, which I discussed in my post. I'm now looking for other editors to share their opinions on it as well. I only added them in twice, in line with the three revert rule, the second time with more motivation in the edit summary. I have made it clear I am not going to add them back in unless a consensus forms supporting their inclusion, so you do not have to ask me to stop adding them.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
22:27, 30 March 2022 (UTC)reply
You added nothing. There wasn't a single entry that included underwater discoveries until you added one. If you wanna create an article on underwater discoveries knock yourself out but don't include that trash here. Why do you keep adding tiny, insignificant discoveries? It's like I'm talking to a brick wall. You wanna answer my question?
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
05:27, 31 March 2022 (UTC)reply
Comment on the issue, not the other editor. You also don’t own the page, so your opinion about what’s significant or not is just that. Let’s not head to ANI, ok?
Parsecboy (
talk)
11:18, 31 March 2022 (UTC)reply
Can we check to see if ChristopherColumbus1492 is another sockpuppet of Jonas Poole, who currently has 40+ banned alt accounts, two of which commented above on this exact talk page on two different occasions years apart? He was/is famous for getting furious and attacking other editors for not agreeing with his specific whims. If it quacks like a duck...
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
01:33, 1 April 2022 (UTC)reply
I already included my rationale for adding the entries in my original post here. This isn't about winning or losing, I just wanted to hear more opinions from other people on whether those entries belonged.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
03:39, 1 April 2022 (UTC)reply
I have received permission from a Wikipedia administrator to restore these items. I am thus doing so. Please don't remove them again unless more people weigh in and a new consensus forms against them.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
03:12, 18 April 2022 (UTC)reply
So you realized it wasn't gonna go your way so you went to the principal? I see. I'll be reverting your edits as a consensus wasn't reached. You did the opposite of what you said you'd do. That makes you a liar. I hate liars.
ChristopherColumbus1492 (
talk)
16:30, 18 April 2022 (UTC)reply
@
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz: what
User:Parsecboy actually told you was "Your best bet would probably be to try to get more people involved - you might try posting neutral invitations for comments at relevant wikiprojects
WP:GEOGRAPHY and
WP:HISTORY seem like the best place to start). You could also start an
WP:RFC or request a third opinion." They have been removed again and I back that removal. Seriously, a gravel bank? I'd strongly suggest starting an RfC which you can then post to the Wikiprojects. Keep it simple. Should there be criteria including size? might be a good question. Sources should not be the media in any case. If you can't find academic sources, then it isn't significant enough.
Doug Wellertalk13:14, 19 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Thank you for sharing your opinion on this without attacking me.
I would like to point out that
User:Parsecboy said that to me after all the discussion that has gone on here. So the characterization of "what [he] actually told you...", insofar as it might be interpreted I misrepresented his words, is misleading.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
21:37, 19 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Well, no, it's not a matter of interpretation (assuming you believe in the linear nature of time); they restored the material
here on 18 April and I answered them more than a day later
on 19 April. Chastising them for not listening to what I said is not a valid take on the situation.
Parsecboy (
talk)
11:57, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Permission for what? It's not within my power to give or withhold permission for anything (as
I told Qmwnebrvtcyxuz earlier); nor is permission required.
Parsecboy (
talk)
12:08, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
@
Parsecboy: exactly. Not our job. I was responding to the above statement "I have received permission from a Wikipedia administrator to restore these items. I am thus doing so. Please don't remove them again unless more people weigh in and a new consensus forms against them. Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (talk) 4:12 am, 18 April 2022, last Monday (2 days ago) (UTC+1)" where I assumed you were the Admin involved.
Doug Wellertalk12:16, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
While Qmwnebrvtcyxuz has had an account for a long time (in fact they predate me by a couple of weeks), they haven't edited a whole lot in that time, and it seems they aren't particularly familiar with how things work; hopefully this bit is more clear to them now.
Parsecboy (
talk)
12:33, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
When I said I received permission, I was basing it off Parsecboy saying: "Since discussion has petered out, and he seems to have stopped editing, you might just restore the material and move on. If he returns, I can deal with it." I took this to be 'permission' which I now realize was more suggestion.
Qmwnebrvtcyxuz (
talk)
12:44, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Third opinion declined: There are more than two editors involved (specifically, They have been removed again and I back that removal. Seriously, a gravel bank? suggests involvement). As has been suggested, you can instead start a
request for comments and post it to the relevant WikiProjects listed at the top of this page. —
LauritzT (
talk)
16:48, 20 April 2022 (UTC)reply