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It said on the page that the drum pattern was essentially a disco drum pattern, but that statement isn't quite reliable. The truth is that the drum pattern (known as a 4 on the floor pattern) existed in garage rock which dated back to the 1960's, but became popular and during disco (which took place in the 1970's) and modern electronic dance music (which's still used to this day). Technically, it's a beat used in classic rock as well as disco and EDM, though the 4 on the floor beat did have influences from jazz music. https://www.masterclass.com/articles/four-on-the-floor-rhythm-explained#a-brief-history-of-fouronthefloor
Dear @ Acousmana: recently you replaced the term electronic dance music throughout the article with EDM. I see the use of the acronym EDM in the techno article as problematic:
Especially in the European techno and electronic dance music culture, the acronym EDM has negative connotations: although techno itself formally counts as electronic dance music, the acronym EDM is understood to refer to a commercialized variant of electronic dance music developed especially since the early 2010s for the mass audience in the U.S., as represented by live acts such as David Guetta, Calvin Harris, Bob Sinclar, deadmau5, Skrillex or Avicii.
For example, British magazine Mixmag writes: “First of all, let's define 'EDM'. The Mixmag definition doesn't cover all 'electronic dance music'. It means the drop-heavy, stadium-filling, fist-pumping, chart-topping, massively commercial main stage sound that conquered America. It means dayglo vests, EDC, Ultra, Vegas pool parties and flying cakes. It's possibly somewhere between electro and progressive house ...”
But also in the U.S. this distinction is known, for example media network NPR writes: “So when did EDM — the U.S. record-biz term for electronic dance music's early-2010s commercial surge through Avicii, Deadmau5, Skrillex and a number of new festivals — "die," anyway?'”
Also, in 2017, the world's largest technoparade Street Parade completely banned EDM artists from their stages and floats (see here or here), proving that the techno scene strongly distances itself from EDM.
A popular video on this topic is also this one: Techno vs. EDM
So this distinction between techno and EDM (as an acronym) might confuse many readers. To take a random example from the article: “Talla's club spot had historical merit in being the first club in Germany to play almost exclusively EDM.” Writing it this way, some readers would take it as if Talla's club was the first to host electro house acts of the 2010s commercial EDM wave like David Guetta, Skrillex or Steve Aoki.
For these reasons, I would suggest going back to using "electronic dance music" instead of the abbreviation EDM in the techno article. Rio65trio ( talk) 22:30, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
This article is BS (sorry). What people call EBM was not used in the 1980s except by a number of dutch and german electronic acts. Other people refer to their music as industrial dance, techno dance, or techno pop, etc.. Kraftwerk coined both terms Techno Pop and EBM (debatable because of YMO “Technopolis”, but Kraftwerk were specifically talking about music genres, and planned an album called Techno Pop (though most of it ended sounding more electro pop except a couple pieces)). I believe, I mean.. I testify that the more club oriented music of the industrial movement is where the sound of techno emerged (later romanticized into techno pop by bands like Depeche Mode (only by their third album, as before that they were synthpop)). Throbbing Gristle had scratched the term “Techno Primitiv” on their Discipline single released in 1980, a term reused as an album title by Chris & Cosey before Detroit Techno was even heard of. This article is 2/3 about Detroit because of naive uninformed people who don’t know enough to hear that in the Detroit Techno sound, somewhere what you actually hear is simply the "EBM of Detroit", which is to say, we should remind ourselves how very few acts actually tagged themselves as “EBM” while much more knew and used the word “techno” (in varied ways, often with other terms) circa or before Juan Atkins. That Detroit Techno is sonically informed by House is correct, but it is also influenced by poppier acts that were themselves influenced by earlier harder-sounding acts like Cabaret Voltaire. Bands that weren't doing "synthpop" at all. Denying a link between industrial dance and techno is lamentable. Listen to Mohnomishe 6 by Zoviet:France: it is experimental techno in 1983. You would call that EBM? No it’s rather the Techno Primitiv sound that Throbbing Gristle hinted at. I wish the people who write about Detroit Techno would give up and accept that there was a lot of the Detroit sound in what many now refer to as “EBM” (a stupid term, sorry Front 242). The sound link is more obvious than with Moroder-ish EDM or synthpop, but that is thanks to bands like Depeche Mode who developed an updated sound that went beyond synthpop, influenced by what this article think is "EBM" (industrial dance) and which was called techno pop in places. I don’t think the band Severed Heads were calling their 1983 single Dead Eyes Opened either synthpop or EBM. It sounds early techno to my ears. They would say that Cabaret Voltaire was what they wanted to sound like originally. That band (Cabaret Voltaire) started in 1978 using harder electronic in a danceable but not quite structured way. They are the originator of the stupid EBM sound (the genre is cool, the term is stupid) that people are talking about (maybe along Suicide's synthpunk). I don’t think we would have techno without them. Kraftwerk were idealists. Cabaret Voltaire emerged in the "industrial movement" and sonically expressed a cold environment of manufactures, as Detroit Techno claim to have done first. Please correct history. TheLionOfKyba ( talk) 12:56, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
The first techno track was already made in 1970 by Kraftwerk. A video can be seen on YT from a concert called "carrusel of the youth". Why do people give America credit for electronic music when they barely can get 50 people to a rave party whereas in Europe it was not unusual to see over 4 million dancing people at the love parade event DanishGuru ( talk) 01:05, 21 January 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Techno article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 91 days |
This
level-5 vital article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
It said on the page that the drum pattern was essentially a disco drum pattern, but that statement isn't quite reliable. The truth is that the drum pattern (known as a 4 on the floor pattern) existed in garage rock which dated back to the 1960's, but became popular and during disco (which took place in the 1970's) and modern electronic dance music (which's still used to this day). Technically, it's a beat used in classic rock as well as disco and EDM, though the 4 on the floor beat did have influences from jazz music. https://www.masterclass.com/articles/four-on-the-floor-rhythm-explained#a-brief-history-of-fouronthefloor
Dear @ Acousmana: recently you replaced the term electronic dance music throughout the article with EDM. I see the use of the acronym EDM in the techno article as problematic:
Especially in the European techno and electronic dance music culture, the acronym EDM has negative connotations: although techno itself formally counts as electronic dance music, the acronym EDM is understood to refer to a commercialized variant of electronic dance music developed especially since the early 2010s for the mass audience in the U.S., as represented by live acts such as David Guetta, Calvin Harris, Bob Sinclar, deadmau5, Skrillex or Avicii.
For example, British magazine Mixmag writes: “First of all, let's define 'EDM'. The Mixmag definition doesn't cover all 'electronic dance music'. It means the drop-heavy, stadium-filling, fist-pumping, chart-topping, massively commercial main stage sound that conquered America. It means dayglo vests, EDC, Ultra, Vegas pool parties and flying cakes. It's possibly somewhere between electro and progressive house ...”
But also in the U.S. this distinction is known, for example media network NPR writes: “So when did EDM — the U.S. record-biz term for electronic dance music's early-2010s commercial surge through Avicii, Deadmau5, Skrillex and a number of new festivals — "die," anyway?'”
Also, in 2017, the world's largest technoparade Street Parade completely banned EDM artists from their stages and floats (see here or here), proving that the techno scene strongly distances itself from EDM.
A popular video on this topic is also this one: Techno vs. EDM
So this distinction between techno and EDM (as an acronym) might confuse many readers. To take a random example from the article: “Talla's club spot had historical merit in being the first club in Germany to play almost exclusively EDM.” Writing it this way, some readers would take it as if Talla's club was the first to host electro house acts of the 2010s commercial EDM wave like David Guetta, Skrillex or Steve Aoki.
For these reasons, I would suggest going back to using "electronic dance music" instead of the abbreviation EDM in the techno article. Rio65trio ( talk) 22:30, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
This article is BS (sorry). What people call EBM was not used in the 1980s except by a number of dutch and german electronic acts. Other people refer to their music as industrial dance, techno dance, or techno pop, etc.. Kraftwerk coined both terms Techno Pop and EBM (debatable because of YMO “Technopolis”, but Kraftwerk were specifically talking about music genres, and planned an album called Techno Pop (though most of it ended sounding more electro pop except a couple pieces)). I believe, I mean.. I testify that the more club oriented music of the industrial movement is where the sound of techno emerged (later romanticized into techno pop by bands like Depeche Mode (only by their third album, as before that they were synthpop)). Throbbing Gristle had scratched the term “Techno Primitiv” on their Discipline single released in 1980, a term reused as an album title by Chris & Cosey before Detroit Techno was even heard of. This article is 2/3 about Detroit because of naive uninformed people who don’t know enough to hear that in the Detroit Techno sound, somewhere what you actually hear is simply the "EBM of Detroit", which is to say, we should remind ourselves how very few acts actually tagged themselves as “EBM” while much more knew and used the word “techno” (in varied ways, often with other terms) circa or before Juan Atkins. That Detroit Techno is sonically informed by House is correct, but it is also influenced by poppier acts that were themselves influenced by earlier harder-sounding acts like Cabaret Voltaire. Bands that weren't doing "synthpop" at all. Denying a link between industrial dance and techno is lamentable. Listen to Mohnomishe 6 by Zoviet:France: it is experimental techno in 1983. You would call that EBM? No it’s rather the Techno Primitiv sound that Throbbing Gristle hinted at. I wish the people who write about Detroit Techno would give up and accept that there was a lot of the Detroit sound in what many now refer to as “EBM” (a stupid term, sorry Front 242). The sound link is more obvious than with Moroder-ish EDM or synthpop, but that is thanks to bands like Depeche Mode who developed an updated sound that went beyond synthpop, influenced by what this article think is "EBM" (industrial dance) and which was called techno pop in places. I don’t think the band Severed Heads were calling their 1983 single Dead Eyes Opened either synthpop or EBM. It sounds early techno to my ears. They would say that Cabaret Voltaire was what they wanted to sound like originally. That band (Cabaret Voltaire) started in 1978 using harder electronic in a danceable but not quite structured way. They are the originator of the stupid EBM sound (the genre is cool, the term is stupid) that people are talking about (maybe along Suicide's synthpunk). I don’t think we would have techno without them. Kraftwerk were idealists. Cabaret Voltaire emerged in the "industrial movement" and sonically expressed a cold environment of manufactures, as Detroit Techno claim to have done first. Please correct history. TheLionOfKyba ( talk) 12:56, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
The first techno track was already made in 1970 by Kraftwerk. A video can be seen on YT from a concert called "carrusel of the youth". Why do people give America credit for electronic music when they barely can get 50 people to a rave party whereas in Europe it was not unusual to see over 4 million dancing people at the love parade event DanishGuru ( talk) 01:05, 21 January 2024 (UTC)