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The dicussion below was copied from User_talk:DDima; I copy it down here to preserve it for posterity. JdH 02:10, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
I was looking for a kindly soul who is a native speaker of Russian, fluent in English, and with perhaps some knowledge of Ukranian as well. And, most importantly, who is prepared to help me out with a transcription problem. The issue is: What is the correct spelling of Tatyana Alexeyevna Afanasyeva? When I search the internet I stumble over a zillion different spellings:
Tatiana, Tatjana, Tatyana Alexeyevna Alexeevna Alexejewna Afanasyeva Afanassjewa Afnassjewa Afanaseva
and all possible combinations thereof, and probably many more if I were to put some more effort into it. According to Exercises in Experimental Geometry. 1931 and Die Grundlagen der Thermodynamik she spelled her own name "Tatjana Alexejevna Afanassjewa"; so that would be a good reason to stick to that. Except for one little detail: Her primary foreign language was German, so perhaps this would be the correct transcription in German but not in English? So I don't know; I give up. That's why I decided to ask for help from an expert, and I hope you are able to help me out, or at least point me in the right direction. Thanks a lot for any help you may be able to offer, JdH 04:25, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
It makes no sense at all to apply some bizarre concept of the "right" spelling of Tatyana Ehrenfest's maiden name when she herself chose how to spell it using the Roman alphabet during her lifetime:
(From the article:
"^ T. Ehrenfest-Afanassjewa, Die Grundlagen der Thermodynamik (Leiden 1956)"
"^ T. Ehrenfest-Afanassjewa, On the Use of the Notion "Probability" in Physics Am. J. Phys. 26: 388 (1958)" )
As for the "little detail" about her having spelled her name in German, not English: This is a red herring. There are entirely standard ways of writing German word in English, but the only changes used are connected with how to render in English diacritical marks like the umlaut. In the case of Afanassjewa's name, there are no changes, period.
There is no justification for changing her own spelling of her own name. Daqu ( talk) 02:24, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
You added Tatyana Alexeyevna Afanasyeva to the list of mathematics teachers in the mathematics education article. Do you have a reference that shows that Afanasyeva worked as a mathematics teacher ? I have looked at her article and the linked biography, and I can't see her described anyhwere as a teacher. An anonymous editor (possibly yourself while not logged in ?) has added an external link to the list entry that links to a translation of a booklet by Afanasyeva that discusses the theory of teaching mathematics, but I don't think she claims to be a teacher herself. Gandalf61 12:52, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
The lead currently reads:
Afanasyeva was born in Kiev, Ukraine, then part of the Russian Empire.
However, at the same time, Ukraine during World War I reads:
Upon the outbreak of World War I, the name Ukraine was used only geographically, as the term did not exist nationally. The territory that made up the modern country of Ukraine was part of the Russian Empire […]
And indeed, Kiev was the capital of the Kiev Governorate (itself part of the Russian Empire) until shortly after the Soviets came to power.
Thus I wonder what’s the usual way to refer to birth places which have changed sovereignty over the time?
TIA.
— Ivan Shmakov ( d ▞ c) 12:53, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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The dicussion below was copied from User_talk:DDima; I copy it down here to preserve it for posterity. JdH 02:10, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
I was looking for a kindly soul who is a native speaker of Russian, fluent in English, and with perhaps some knowledge of Ukranian as well. And, most importantly, who is prepared to help me out with a transcription problem. The issue is: What is the correct spelling of Tatyana Alexeyevna Afanasyeva? When I search the internet I stumble over a zillion different spellings:
Tatiana, Tatjana, Tatyana Alexeyevna Alexeevna Alexejewna Afanasyeva Afanassjewa Afnassjewa Afanaseva
and all possible combinations thereof, and probably many more if I were to put some more effort into it. According to Exercises in Experimental Geometry. 1931 and Die Grundlagen der Thermodynamik she spelled her own name "Tatjana Alexejevna Afanassjewa"; so that would be a good reason to stick to that. Except for one little detail: Her primary foreign language was German, so perhaps this would be the correct transcription in German but not in English? So I don't know; I give up. That's why I decided to ask for help from an expert, and I hope you are able to help me out, or at least point me in the right direction. Thanks a lot for any help you may be able to offer, JdH 04:25, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
It makes no sense at all to apply some bizarre concept of the "right" spelling of Tatyana Ehrenfest's maiden name when she herself chose how to spell it using the Roman alphabet during her lifetime:
(From the article:
"^ T. Ehrenfest-Afanassjewa, Die Grundlagen der Thermodynamik (Leiden 1956)"
"^ T. Ehrenfest-Afanassjewa, On the Use of the Notion "Probability" in Physics Am. J. Phys. 26: 388 (1958)" )
As for the "little detail" about her having spelled her name in German, not English: This is a red herring. There are entirely standard ways of writing German word in English, but the only changes used are connected with how to render in English diacritical marks like the umlaut. In the case of Afanassjewa's name, there are no changes, period.
There is no justification for changing her own spelling of her own name. Daqu ( talk) 02:24, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
You added Tatyana Alexeyevna Afanasyeva to the list of mathematics teachers in the mathematics education article. Do you have a reference that shows that Afanasyeva worked as a mathematics teacher ? I have looked at her article and the linked biography, and I can't see her described anyhwere as a teacher. An anonymous editor (possibly yourself while not logged in ?) has added an external link to the list entry that links to a translation of a booklet by Afanasyeva that discusses the theory of teaching mathematics, but I don't think she claims to be a teacher herself. Gandalf61 12:52, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
The lead currently reads:
Afanasyeva was born in Kiev, Ukraine, then part of the Russian Empire.
However, at the same time, Ukraine during World War I reads:
Upon the outbreak of World War I, the name Ukraine was used only geographically, as the term did not exist nationally. The territory that made up the modern country of Ukraine was part of the Russian Empire […]
And indeed, Kiev was the capital of the Kiev Governorate (itself part of the Russian Empire) until shortly after the Soviets came to power.
Thus I wonder what’s the usual way to refer to birth places which have changed sovereignty over the time?
TIA.
— Ivan Shmakov ( d ▞ c) 12:53, 21 March 2014 (UTC)