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The routes/schedules from Marcus and Northport I just added are the kind of thing I meant re Talk:Columbia River and related discussions about the role of the Columbia in BC, and also of tying that part of BC to adjoining US territories/states; it's the underlying theme of most Kootenay history until well into the 20th Century, and not in a small way because of the steamboats, in addition to the railways which filled in other links. Speaking of which did a railway ever get biult from Beaton/Galena Bay et al. via Trout Lake City and Lardeau to Kootenay Lake, or was that just a speculation; List of ports of call on the Arrow Lakes could be entertaining to build, lots of vanished nice-places like Ainsworth and Downie Creek (usually called Downie by my time, I think), but the easiest solution would be map showing coloured lines for different service eras/periods, i.e. the Big Bend, the Nelson rush, then the railway survey and construction parties/services, then during the Slocan Rush and since; Volvsek's article comments taht service ran into another 100 years from 1866, and indeed in a way there's still power-vessel traffic on the lakes, isn't there? Even N-S I think, and not just timber barges/booms. I guess a map that would show the Northport/Marcus US termini as well as the Big Bend would also have Kootenay Lake; but maybe in not enough detail for a map of that lake's steamer ports.....nor big enough to show the Slocan service. Anyway I'll see if I can find a map, unless karl or someone might have something suitable in the way of a plain graphic; I have a tendency to favour colour topographic terrain images like that on Bendor Range or Clear Range or the NASA/JPL maps like on Monashee Mountains. If you like the one used on Monashee Mountains it certainly has the scope to serve as the Big Bend Gold Rush map, maybe this Arrow Lakes one; I'll have another look at the source image, maybe it's croppable. One last thing - it strikes me that the Arrow Lakes service, as also I believe on the run via the Creston Valley to Nelson and - ?? - up the Pend Oreille - that these Arrow Lakes steamboats are also necessarily in Category:History of Washington or Category:Steamboats of Washington or whatever; in Kootenay Lake's case the service was from Idaho, right? Anyway I realize taht's not standard categorization, but definitely the Marcus and Northport articles and such should contain these details, or interconnect here......this, again, is what I meant about the hsitory of the Columbia Basin being intertwined; Americans may not be aware of it, but it's their history/activity that's been an integral part of events/businesses/daily realities/connections to the outside world for the Kootenays; it may only be 15% of the basin, but if you're in that area the US-side or the basin is more important, even now, than Vancouver or Calgary, in daily life (even before broaedcasting adn teh automobile, which are the two main forms of exchange in teh area today ;-) advertising+cars=border shopping malls ;-) ...). Skookum1 ( talk) 04:44, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
There were, weren't there? I mean, from the Goldstream River up through Mica Creek, not sure if it's just gold rush era or later on also. Weren't there some in teh Columbia Valley area? Maybe a better title would be Steamboats of the Big Bend and Columbia Valley? The Steamboats of the Columbia River article has "upper" as meaning somewhere down by/above Celilo Falls, but "upper" clearly would include not just the Marcus-La Porte and Northport-Farwell runs involving the Arrow Lakes, but also above the Dalles des Morts. Also waht about the Pend Oreille River/Clark Fork services; are they in the Columbia River steamboats article or do they need their own; Pend Oreille River services would seem to have naturally connected to the Arrow Lakes, no? Skookum1 ( talk) 15:37, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
I made a new navbox for this steamboat route. I replaced the existing BC steamboats and Columbia river navboxes with this one, as the links to these other navboxes are in the new one. There are too many external links on this page and not enough text. I will try to complete the text when I can, and cut down on the xlinks. Also, I would like to make the steamboat table collapsible, but I don't know how to format this. Mtsmallwood ( talk) 13:58, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
In the Columbia Basin section of the Royal BC Museum's Living Landscapes project I found this article on shipwrecks of the Kootenays; includes Slocan and Trout Lakes, interestingly; might be some useful tidbits for the various subarticles on steamers, no? Skookum1 ( talk) 16:15, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Not sure where to put this, other than external links; it's a gallery of images of the Minto on the CBT site: http://www.virtualmuseum.ca/Exhibitions/Hydro/en/communities/minto.php here it is] and I guess it'll be useeful for the eventual Minto article.... Skookum1 ( talk) 14:59, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
This article is at best 1/2 done. I am gradually writing the articles on the steamboats that ran on the Arrow Lakes. I have finished the most important one, which was on Minto and I have started on Columbia (sternwheeler), Nakusp and Revelstoke. I hope soon to be able to use that material to complete the overall Arrow Lakes article. Mtsmallwood ( talk) 12:37, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
the A. Arrow never worked the Arrow Lks so it has been deleted.
In The directory of mines (corrected and published quarterly) : a guide for the use of investors and others interested in the mines of British Columbia (1897) I found a listing of routes and schedules for the Kootenay rail/steam network for 1897; by Alexander Begg. There's probably lots more to be found in Begg's History of British Columbia from its earliest discovery to the present time (1894)] will probably have lots on steamboats and their captains and companies..... Skookum1 ( talk) 03:51, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
The following table was blanked on the Steamboats of the Lower Fraser River and Harrison Lake by User:Emarsee; it had been created by an IP users and was on the wrong talkpage, if anywhere it belongs here for future reference and possibly as its own list article; I'll make it collapsed so it doesn't take up space here. Emarsee blanked the whole page a few times, as well as placed an AfD on the Fraser/Harrison article, which remains underway and should never have been started, but that's beside the point here; this was a valuable list for future use/reference, its destruction as well as the AfD were highly questionable and destructive as well as WP:BITE. Skookum1 ( talk) 06:14, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
The following steamboats and related vessels operated on these lakes:
Name | Type | Year Built | Where Built | Owners | Builder | Gross Tons | Reg. Tons | Length | Beam | Depth [3] | Engines | Disposition |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Forty-Nine | sternwheeler | 1865 | Colville Landing, WA | Leonard White | Leonard White and C.W. Briggs | 219 | 114' | 20' | 5' | 12" by 48" | little used after 1870 | |
Alpha | steam launch | 1882 | Hong Kong [4] | unknown | ||||||||
Dispatch | sternwheeler | 1888 | Revelstoke | Columbia Transportation Co. | 37 | 23 | 54' | 22' [5] | 4.5' | 8"x24" | Last used as snag boat, dismantled 1893, engines to Illecillewaet. | |
sternwheeler | circa 1888 | Golden, BC [6] | Columbia Trans. Co. | Alexander Watson | 15 | 9 | 61' | 10.3' | 3.6' | 5.5" by 8" | sank on Kootenay Lake in 1901 | |
sternwheeler | 1890 | Revelstoke | C&KSN Co. | Alexander Watson | 452 | 285 | 131' | 25.5' | 4.8' | 16'x62" | Dismantled 1902 or 1904 | |
Kootenai | sternwheeler | 1885 | Little Dalles | Henderson & McCartney | Paquet & Smith/E.G.Thomason | 371 | 269 | 139' | 22' | 5' | 14"x60" | Grounded and dismantled 1895 |
Columbia | sternwheeler | 1891 | Little Dalles, WA | Alexander Watson/ Joseph Paquet | C&KSN Co. | 534 | 378 | 153' | 28' | 6.3' | 18"x72" | Burned, 1894, total loss |
Illecillewaet | sternwheel scow | 1892 | Revelstoke | C&KSN Co. | Alexander Watson | 98 | 62 | 78' | 15' | 4' | 8"x24" (from Dispatch) | Sold for barge use, 1902 |
sternwheeler | 1895 | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 1083 | 832 | 171' | 33.5' | 6.3' | 20"x72" | Destroyed by fire at dock at Arrowhead, BC, 23 Dec 1897 | |
Trail | sternwheeler | 1896 | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 663 | 418 | 165' | 31 | 4.9' | 14" by 60" | destroyed by fire at Robson West, BC, June 1900 |
Columbia | steam tug | 1896 [7] | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 50 | 34 | 77' | 14.5' | 6.4' | 9" / 18" by 12" | In service until 1947, sold 1948, later disposition unknown |
Kootenay | sternwheeler | 1897 | Nakusp, BC | Canadian Pacific Railway | Thomas J. Bulger | 1117 | 732 | 184' | 33 | 6.2' | 18" by 72" | Used as houseboat after about 1920, eventually abandoned below Nakusp. |
sternwheeler | 1897 | Nakusp, BC | C.P.R. | Thomas J. Bulger | 884 | 532 | 183' | 29' | 7' | 22" by 96" | sank 1917, raised, but proved to be unsalvageable, and sold for use as landing barge. | |
Minto | sternwheeler | 1898 | Nakusp, BC [8] | C.P.R. | J. M. Bulger | 830 | 522 | 162' | 30' | 5.1' | 16" by 72" | abandoned on beach 1955, fittings and sternwheel stripped, deliberately burned August 1, 1968 after restoration efforts failed. |
Revelstoke | sternwheeler | 1902 | Nakusp, BC | Columbia River Steamship Co. | 309 | 179 | 127' | 22.7' | 4.3' | 12" by 60" | Destroyed by fire at Comaplix, April 1915, possibly arson. | |
Whatsan | steam tug | 1909 | Nakusp, BC | C.P.R. | 106 | 72 | 90' | 19' | 8.1' | 12" / 26" by 18" | Out of service 1919, scrapped 1920 | |
sternwheeler | 1911 | Nakusp, BC [8] | C.P.R. | J. M. Bulger | 1700 | 1010 | 203' | 39 | 7.5' | 16"/ 34" by 96" | Dismantled 1950s | |
Nipigonian | motor launch (steel hull) | 1929 | Penetang, Ont. [9] | 10 | 7 | 40' | 9.5' | 4.8' | gasoline | Only used from February 1 to late April 1948 | ||
Widget | diesel tug | Vancouver, BC | Ivan Horie [10] | 9 | 6 | 36.5' | 9.5' | 4.8 | diesel | |||
Columbia [11] | motor pass. tug | 1928 [12] | Vancouver, BC | C.P.R. | 22 | 15 | 50' | 11.4 | 5.6' | diesel |
These are probably all already on List of historical ships in British Columbia, if not at some later point I'll move some over; the tonnage and other data columns are a useful model for use on other ship-list articles, e.g. the Skeena River and Upper Fraser ones now already extant. Skookum1 ( talk) 06:23, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
References
Turner
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).Mills
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).is among the images just made available on the Commons from the British Library. That's the filename on the Commons, this is the URL for it, no time just now to look as to where to put it, but obviously worth having on this page, maybe on the provincial article (if there is one). Skookum1 ( talk) 14:17, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
The routes/schedules from Marcus and Northport I just added are the kind of thing I meant re Talk:Columbia River and related discussions about the role of the Columbia in BC, and also of tying that part of BC to adjoining US territories/states; it's the underlying theme of most Kootenay history until well into the 20th Century, and not in a small way because of the steamboats, in addition to the railways which filled in other links. Speaking of which did a railway ever get biult from Beaton/Galena Bay et al. via Trout Lake City and Lardeau to Kootenay Lake, or was that just a speculation; List of ports of call on the Arrow Lakes could be entertaining to build, lots of vanished nice-places like Ainsworth and Downie Creek (usually called Downie by my time, I think), but the easiest solution would be map showing coloured lines for different service eras/periods, i.e. the Big Bend, the Nelson rush, then the railway survey and construction parties/services, then during the Slocan Rush and since; Volvsek's article comments taht service ran into another 100 years from 1866, and indeed in a way there's still power-vessel traffic on the lakes, isn't there? Even N-S I think, and not just timber barges/booms. I guess a map that would show the Northport/Marcus US termini as well as the Big Bend would also have Kootenay Lake; but maybe in not enough detail for a map of that lake's steamer ports.....nor big enough to show the Slocan service. Anyway I'll see if I can find a map, unless karl or someone might have something suitable in the way of a plain graphic; I have a tendency to favour colour topographic terrain images like that on Bendor Range or Clear Range or the NASA/JPL maps like on Monashee Mountains. If you like the one used on Monashee Mountains it certainly has the scope to serve as the Big Bend Gold Rush map, maybe this Arrow Lakes one; I'll have another look at the source image, maybe it's croppable. One last thing - it strikes me that the Arrow Lakes service, as also I believe on the run via the Creston Valley to Nelson and - ?? - up the Pend Oreille - that these Arrow Lakes steamboats are also necessarily in Category:History of Washington or Category:Steamboats of Washington or whatever; in Kootenay Lake's case the service was from Idaho, right? Anyway I realize taht's not standard categorization, but definitely the Marcus and Northport articles and such should contain these details, or interconnect here......this, again, is what I meant about the hsitory of the Columbia Basin being intertwined; Americans may not be aware of it, but it's their history/activity that's been an integral part of events/businesses/daily realities/connections to the outside world for the Kootenays; it may only be 15% of the basin, but if you're in that area the US-side or the basin is more important, even now, than Vancouver or Calgary, in daily life (even before broaedcasting adn teh automobile, which are the two main forms of exchange in teh area today ;-) advertising+cars=border shopping malls ;-) ...). Skookum1 ( talk) 04:44, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
There were, weren't there? I mean, from the Goldstream River up through Mica Creek, not sure if it's just gold rush era or later on also. Weren't there some in teh Columbia Valley area? Maybe a better title would be Steamboats of the Big Bend and Columbia Valley? The Steamboats of the Columbia River article has "upper" as meaning somewhere down by/above Celilo Falls, but "upper" clearly would include not just the Marcus-La Porte and Northport-Farwell runs involving the Arrow Lakes, but also above the Dalles des Morts. Also waht about the Pend Oreille River/Clark Fork services; are they in the Columbia River steamboats article or do they need their own; Pend Oreille River services would seem to have naturally connected to the Arrow Lakes, no? Skookum1 ( talk) 15:37, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
I made a new navbox for this steamboat route. I replaced the existing BC steamboats and Columbia river navboxes with this one, as the links to these other navboxes are in the new one. There are too many external links on this page and not enough text. I will try to complete the text when I can, and cut down on the xlinks. Also, I would like to make the steamboat table collapsible, but I don't know how to format this. Mtsmallwood ( talk) 13:58, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
In the Columbia Basin section of the Royal BC Museum's Living Landscapes project I found this article on shipwrecks of the Kootenays; includes Slocan and Trout Lakes, interestingly; might be some useful tidbits for the various subarticles on steamers, no? Skookum1 ( talk) 16:15, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Not sure where to put this, other than external links; it's a gallery of images of the Minto on the CBT site: http://www.virtualmuseum.ca/Exhibitions/Hydro/en/communities/minto.php here it is] and I guess it'll be useeful for the eventual Minto article.... Skookum1 ( talk) 14:59, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
This article is at best 1/2 done. I am gradually writing the articles on the steamboats that ran on the Arrow Lakes. I have finished the most important one, which was on Minto and I have started on Columbia (sternwheeler), Nakusp and Revelstoke. I hope soon to be able to use that material to complete the overall Arrow Lakes article. Mtsmallwood ( talk) 12:37, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
the A. Arrow never worked the Arrow Lks so it has been deleted.
In The directory of mines (corrected and published quarterly) : a guide for the use of investors and others interested in the mines of British Columbia (1897) I found a listing of routes and schedules for the Kootenay rail/steam network for 1897; by Alexander Begg. There's probably lots more to be found in Begg's History of British Columbia from its earliest discovery to the present time (1894)] will probably have lots on steamboats and their captains and companies..... Skookum1 ( talk) 03:51, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
The following table was blanked on the Steamboats of the Lower Fraser River and Harrison Lake by User:Emarsee; it had been created by an IP users and was on the wrong talkpage, if anywhere it belongs here for future reference and possibly as its own list article; I'll make it collapsed so it doesn't take up space here. Emarsee blanked the whole page a few times, as well as placed an AfD on the Fraser/Harrison article, which remains underway and should never have been started, but that's beside the point here; this was a valuable list for future use/reference, its destruction as well as the AfD were highly questionable and destructive as well as WP:BITE. Skookum1 ( talk) 06:14, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
The following steamboats and related vessels operated on these lakes:
Name | Type | Year Built | Where Built | Owners | Builder | Gross Tons | Reg. Tons | Length | Beam | Depth [3] | Engines | Disposition |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Forty-Nine | sternwheeler | 1865 | Colville Landing, WA | Leonard White | Leonard White and C.W. Briggs | 219 | 114' | 20' | 5' | 12" by 48" | little used after 1870 | |
Alpha | steam launch | 1882 | Hong Kong [4] | unknown | ||||||||
Dispatch | sternwheeler | 1888 | Revelstoke | Columbia Transportation Co. | 37 | 23 | 54' | 22' [5] | 4.5' | 8"x24" | Last used as snag boat, dismantled 1893, engines to Illecillewaet. | |
sternwheeler | circa 1888 | Golden, BC [6] | Columbia Trans. Co. | Alexander Watson | 15 | 9 | 61' | 10.3' | 3.6' | 5.5" by 8" | sank on Kootenay Lake in 1901 | |
sternwheeler | 1890 | Revelstoke | C&KSN Co. | Alexander Watson | 452 | 285 | 131' | 25.5' | 4.8' | 16'x62" | Dismantled 1902 or 1904 | |
Kootenai | sternwheeler | 1885 | Little Dalles | Henderson & McCartney | Paquet & Smith/E.G.Thomason | 371 | 269 | 139' | 22' | 5' | 14"x60" | Grounded and dismantled 1895 |
Columbia | sternwheeler | 1891 | Little Dalles, WA | Alexander Watson/ Joseph Paquet | C&KSN Co. | 534 | 378 | 153' | 28' | 6.3' | 18"x72" | Burned, 1894, total loss |
Illecillewaet | sternwheel scow | 1892 | Revelstoke | C&KSN Co. | Alexander Watson | 98 | 62 | 78' | 15' | 4' | 8"x24" (from Dispatch) | Sold for barge use, 1902 |
sternwheeler | 1895 | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 1083 | 832 | 171' | 33.5' | 6.3' | 20"x72" | Destroyed by fire at dock at Arrowhead, BC, 23 Dec 1897 | |
Trail | sternwheeler | 1896 | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 663 | 418 | 165' | 31 | 4.9' | 14" by 60" | destroyed by fire at Robson West, BC, June 1900 |
Columbia | steam tug | 1896 [7] | Nakusp, BC | C&KSN | Thomas J. Bulger | 50 | 34 | 77' | 14.5' | 6.4' | 9" / 18" by 12" | In service until 1947, sold 1948, later disposition unknown |
Kootenay | sternwheeler | 1897 | Nakusp, BC | Canadian Pacific Railway | Thomas J. Bulger | 1117 | 732 | 184' | 33 | 6.2' | 18" by 72" | Used as houseboat after about 1920, eventually abandoned below Nakusp. |
sternwheeler | 1897 | Nakusp, BC | C.P.R. | Thomas J. Bulger | 884 | 532 | 183' | 29' | 7' | 22" by 96" | sank 1917, raised, but proved to be unsalvageable, and sold for use as landing barge. | |
Minto | sternwheeler | 1898 | Nakusp, BC [8] | C.P.R. | J. M. Bulger | 830 | 522 | 162' | 30' | 5.1' | 16" by 72" | abandoned on beach 1955, fittings and sternwheel stripped, deliberately burned August 1, 1968 after restoration efforts failed. |
Revelstoke | sternwheeler | 1902 | Nakusp, BC | Columbia River Steamship Co. | 309 | 179 | 127' | 22.7' | 4.3' | 12" by 60" | Destroyed by fire at Comaplix, April 1915, possibly arson. | |
Whatsan | steam tug | 1909 | Nakusp, BC | C.P.R. | 106 | 72 | 90' | 19' | 8.1' | 12" / 26" by 18" | Out of service 1919, scrapped 1920 | |
sternwheeler | 1911 | Nakusp, BC [8] | C.P.R. | J. M. Bulger | 1700 | 1010 | 203' | 39 | 7.5' | 16"/ 34" by 96" | Dismantled 1950s | |
Nipigonian | motor launch (steel hull) | 1929 | Penetang, Ont. [9] | 10 | 7 | 40' | 9.5' | 4.8' | gasoline | Only used from February 1 to late April 1948 | ||
Widget | diesel tug | Vancouver, BC | Ivan Horie [10] | 9 | 6 | 36.5' | 9.5' | 4.8 | diesel | |||
Columbia [11] | motor pass. tug | 1928 [12] | Vancouver, BC | C.P.R. | 22 | 15 | 50' | 11.4 | 5.6' | diesel |
These are probably all already on List of historical ships in British Columbia, if not at some later point I'll move some over; the tonnage and other data columns are a useful model for use on other ship-list articles, e.g. the Skeena River and Upper Fraser ones now already extant. Skookum1 ( talk) 06:23, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
References
Turner
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).Mills
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).is among the images just made available on the Commons from the British Library. That's the filename on the Commons, this is the URL for it, no time just now to look as to where to put it, but obviously worth having on this page, maybe on the provincial article (if there is one). Skookum1 ( talk) 14:17, 3 July 2013 (UTC)