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I thinks this section is poorly written, unclear, and factually incorrect in some spots. Just for starters, it should be called "accelerated stalls," the much-more-widely used term, at least in the U.S. (Is G-stall a military or British term? Anyone care to chime in?). I will rewrite it. Anyone mind? Also, it might be a bit difficult to include just the right amount of detail. Would it be appropriate to go into a full-blown discussion of the V-G diagram in this article? I am leaning towards "yes." Vessbot 07:17, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)
The introduction of this article would make sense to someone who already has a good understanding of the subject field, but I think it's perhaps too technical for a general introduction. Terms like "chord line", "angle of attack", "lift-coefficient", "angle-of-attack curve", "linear and nonlinear regimes", and "flow separation" are not in general use, but the article expects readers to understand them. While technical descriptions are certainly appropriate, there will be a lot of people coming to this article wanting to know what "stall" means and going away without an answer. Could someone knowledgeable about this topic possibly write a brief paragraph giving a basic overview to the uninitiated? -- Vardion 8 July 2005 22:41 (UTC)
I'm going to turn this into a disambiguation page, then create a new 'Stall (flight)' page to cover this subject. There are too many legit other stall definitions, and the (flight) modifier will be consistent with other flight pages, such as Spin (flight). I'll move the discussion over to the new page so it stays with flying stalls, any objections? - Chairboy 20:36, 19 July 2005 (UTC)
Just because some aircraft enthusiasts (me included) have created the most links to stall doesn't mean that Catherine is right. 90% (very approx) of the time "stall" is used it's engine stopping the general pop'n has in mind; 10% it's enclosures; 1% it's aerodynamic. When someone comes to the Wikipedia article then disambiguation is required. I think Chairboy's treatment is correct. I will wait a while and re-do his changes. And then I will hunt out double redirects in aviation articles and replace stall with stall. OK? You can help if you like. Paul Beardsell 09:26, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
The recently added image includes a caption "tilt with respect to horizontal plane". Thus MUST be changed to "tilt with respect to airflow", otherwise it is simply incorrect. In addition, the images themselves are a bit misleading to my mind. An unstalled wing shouldn't be shown with a trail of turbulence left behind, since this isn't there. The flow is smooth. Graham 05:37, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
If you are willing to make the images, that would be great. I started to have a go but I got very frustrated with the free dumbass drawing package I was trying to use (Eazydraw) which makes drawing basic bezier curves unnecessarily complex. Anyway, I think your proposal sounds good - an unstalled wing at some angle (it doesn't need to be 13°, anything reasonable - say 6°, which is a typical AoA in straight and level flight) with laminar flow lines and no turbulence, separation point or any of that malarkey. Then a wing partially stalled (15° say) where the flow is laminar over the first half or so, then breaks away, and one fully stalled where the flow is not attached at all, and spills over the leading edge. Those photographs you linked are very informative and could well be used as a basis - the depiction of turbulence is difficult and just using hatching is a bit lame - some sort of eddying would be great. I think we should avoid using any captions that mention 'separation point' - it should be obvious from the drawings that the airflow has detached and that ties in with the description in the text. Graham 04:24, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
I think there needs to be a subject on Washout but my comments in Washout about the terrors of wing tip stall should be located under the general heading of Stall. When I changed Washout I was trying to correct the previous version which suggested the sole reason for washout was to optimise wing efficiency ie reduce induced drag, whereas avoidance of tip stall, which is more important, wasn't addressed. So I changed the text leaving the structure unchanged. Now, what about the Stall section? It seems to me that a few changes are needed. Take the first sentence "In aerodynamics, a stall is a condition in which an excessive angle of attack causes loss of lift due to disruption of airflow". Read this through the eyes of someone who really wants to know what 'stall' is ie doesn't know already. Do we really mean that excessive AofA causes LOSS of lift? LOSS of lift? Is it leaking away? Or do we mean that the lift is less than would have been achieved were the wing not stalled? If the latter, why don't we say that? Also the discussion above re the diagram seems to suggest that there are only two airflow regimes, laminar and separated. Laminar is very, very difficult to achieve and not possible with an aerofoil section like that shown in the diagram. What will arise at angles less than the critical angle is turbulent (but not separated) flow. -- FHBridges 19:03, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
I have a bird book at home, which details how aq bird can stall in flight.
Is this notable?
Because I notice this article only discusses powered flight.
Stall
Is when the wings of an aircraft are no longer capable of deriving enough support from the air in order for the aircraft to maintain altitude. Although a stall usually occurs at slow speeds with excessive nose up attitudes it can actually happen over a wide range of speeds and attitudes.
There simple and to the point. Everyone agree with my definition? (contributed by User:43R35)
A proposed merger of Stall speed into this article has been sitting around for over a year. It makes sense to me, and shouldn't be too hard to accomplish. Any problems? PubliusFL 19:58, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
is stall strake the same thing as a stall fence? -- Kvuo 02:10, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Have just deleted a short paragraph. Jan 28 2008. Don't think it will upset anyone, but will provide a brief justification here in case: Paragraph seemed to be written by someone thinking of a particular class of aeroplane. Not reasonable to say that non-pilots will be worried (with the implication that pilots will not be worried) for all aircraft. For some aircraft pilots will be worried too. Anyway even pilots will be worried if it's accidental. And the point about height is made elsewhere in the article. Assuming nobody objects for a few weeks (say by the end of Feb 08) then please feel free (anyone) to delete what I've written here as it will cease to be of any interest. Rowmn ( talk) 23:22, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 10:03, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
The "misconception" of engine stalls being related to areodynamic stalls is not actually a misconception at all (for jet engines). An engine stall happens when the engine compressor blades stall out, the same sort of aerodynamic stall as described for the wing. That tends to cause reverse flow (known as surge), resulting (often) in an impressive fireball shooting out the front of the engine.
It's also possible for a compressor stage to have a "partial" stall. In that case one stalled blade makes the next one stall. The that one makes the next one stall. Etc. But the first stalled blade recovers. That recovery makes the next one recover. Etc. So a "stall cell" rotates around the stage.
Thus, claiming that engine stall is an unrelated misnomer is wrong (for jet engines, anyway). It's actually a very closely related phenomenon. (What people call an engine stall in a piston engine is a different matter.)
Furthermore, the entire section was unattributed, and there was no evidence given that this is a "popular" misconception. In my personal experience, almost everyone understands that planes can glide and that losing lift on the wings is not related to a car engine dying if you forget to declutch at a stoplight.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.181 ( talk) 22:44, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Rather than deleting the section mabye we can rewrite it. I agree with the section that the public does not understand the difference between an aerodynamyc stall and an engine stall and that is really what the section is trying to express. 20:41, 20 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by RP459 ( talk • contribs)
I really don't think it is popular. And it's even arguable that it's a misconception. The entire section rests on the fact that "stall" has more than one definition. This is an entire section which could be resolved down to one disambiguation reference.
Perhaps later I'll write a section on gas turbine engine stall. I can reference it; I'm an aero engineer and I have the appropriate textbooks right in front of me. That will solve some of the problem with this section.
But I still don't see any reasonable purpose for it at all. However, I'll hold off on re-deleting it, since I don't want to start a reversion battle. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.145 ( talk) 20:51, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
In the Graph section, it is stated 'very few aircraft have an angle of attack indicator.' But further down the page, in the Stall warning and safety devices it says 'Many aircraft have an angle of attack indicator '. Which one is right? Abercrombiefiz ( talk) 07:02, 12 February 2009 (UTC)
The graph showing Cl vs AOA is incorrect. At the critical angle Cl drops only a small way and then flat plate lift takes over so that Cl actually rises again. The Cl does not drop to zero except at 90 degrees. This is a *really* common error splattered all over the internet and books on lift. This subject was researched at Sandia but I can't find a publishable graph showing the correct result. I could graph one up from their data but maybe one of you eds. know of an open source?? Here is a good discussion on the real behaviour:
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/airfoils/q0150b.shtml
What to do? Cheers MarkC ( talk) 03:39, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks MarkC 06:34, 24 April 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbcannell ( talk • contribs)
Actaully how about a new section talking about post stall flight, the X-31 was an impressive display with flight at 70 degrees AOA. We could probably grab a NASA picture of it? With high thrust and vectoring post stall manouvers provide a tactical advantage. Cheers MarkCMarkC 06:48, 24 April 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbcannell ( talk • contribs)
Aeroplanes can fly well beyound the stall. I fly models; they fly the same way as full-size aeroplanes but you can do things too risky for manned aeroplanes. The flight pattern for this kind of post-stall flight is nicknamed 3-D, and includes frequent transitions between unstalled and prop-hanging fflight. For a demo watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEnC68qb5I0
Full-size aerobatic aeroplanes are also frequently flying beyond the stall in part of their manoevres. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.147.130.92 ( talk) 11:56, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Hi all, how about adding a section on tail stalls? They have been implicated in some recent crahes... Cheers MC MarkC ( talk) 14:53, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Needs a "history" subsection. I remember reading someplace that Orville accidentally "discovered" this on a flight at Fort Myers where a passenger was killed, and Orville badly injured for life. It seems odd now, but they were bent on "flying" and hadn't quite got around to analyzing the practical aspects of "not-quite-flying." Student7 ( talk) 14:50, 1 October 2011 (UTC)
I apologize in advance if this is the wrong place to submit suggestions - but I am absolutely LOST in this Wiki hierarchy! :)
I would like to submit a suggestion that the subject of "Tip Stall" (aka 'Wing Tip Stall') be incorporated into the section/page titled 'Stall (flight)'.
A quick Wiki Search will advise such page doesn't exist, however it will also show the term is mentioned prolifically in many other places. I can assure you it is a topic of great interest (and concern) in model aviation circles, for one, and from both eyes-on experience and much reading there is obviously a LOT of confusion as to what a tip stall actually is, ie confused with other aeronautical actions eg accelerated stalls & turning stalls. It would be very nice to have a Wiki reference to cite to those lost souls who don't really know what they did wrong or what actually happened. I would readily volunteer to submit such info but lack the technical expertise for Wiki submissions & especially for the proper way to integrate it into the existing Stalls (flight) page.
Respectfully submitted, and thank you for listening. ~Jay F — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.3.66.204 ( talk) 11:37, 24 August 2012
A picture of a stall with a paraglider, maybe something for this article.-- Luxo ( talk) 22:11, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
This article appears to need a section related to high-altitude stalls. See comments about this term at Talk:Air France Flight 447#RfC - What "Summary" should the Accident have?. The term occurs as early as 1988; see page 440 in Human factors in aviation, p. PA440, at Google Books.
Thanks, SBaker43 ( talk) 11:23, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
In the lead to Stall (flight) there is presently a diagram depicting deep stall. It is the same diagram as the one that is used later in the article to support the sub-heading Stall (flight)#Deep stall. Duplication of an image is discouraged in any article unless there is a really good reason. Deep stall is a rare form of the stall phenomenon so a diagram that targets deep stall is not a good one in the lead to this article. If there is to be an image accompanying the lead I think it should be an image appropriate to the general form of aerodynamic stall that occurs at high angle of attack in most aircraft. I am in favor of deleting the deep stall diagram from the lead to this article. Dolphin ( t) 10:19, 15 July 2013 (UTC)
Wondered if we wanted to add this to the page: http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/jfm.2013.440
From the abstract: Computed results show agreement with marginal separation theory at low and with available experimental data at higher. This simplified approach provides a universal criterion to determine the stall angle of stationary thin aerofoils with a parabolic nose.
Research has been published in Journal of Fluids Engineering and Journal of Fluid Mechanics. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.81.139.106 ( talk) 03:36, 15 October 2013 (UTC)
I modified the article to clarify the difference between the aircraft 'nosing down' by itself, and the pilot 'nosing down'. I was careful to avoid implying that once the nose has dropped, the pilot must lower the nose further in order to recover from the stall. [ this] further edit was intended to simplify, but the article now appears to imply just that.
Some texts are not very clear about this but I have just checked Langeweische, Stick and Rudder, p.33. It says that when the nose drops in the stall, the aircraft is already attempting to recover by itself. If the pilot removes his back pressure which created the stall, it will recover. Also, [ FAA Advisory 120-109] p. 14, requires a, "nose down pitch control".
In my stalling training, I had to learn not to lower the nose too much and lose more altitude than necessary in the recovery. I understand that a nose-down control movement is what's required at this point, not necessarily forcing the nose to drop further.
I suggest a different wording is needed. Burninthruthesky ( talk) 16:02, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
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The result of the move request was: moved as unopposed. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist ( talk) 10:37, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
Stall (fluid mechanics) → Stall (fluid dynamics) – Fluid mechanics comprises both fluid statics and fluid dynamics, but stalls have got nothing to do with the former, and indeed the article currently (and correctly) opens with "In fluid dynamics, a stall...". The current title therefore is unnecessarily generic and not consistent with the lead. Deeday-UK ( talk) 20:52, 2 November 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. KCVelaga ( talk) 03:20, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
Should MCAS be mentioned or discussed in this article? Gah4 ( talk) 18:07, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
@ John Vandenberg, Ahunt, Ariadacapo, Pieter1963, and Agateller:
I propose that the article Post stall be merged with this article (and Post stall be converted to a redirect.)
Post stall has been in existence for a dozen years but it contains little information. The information it contains is technically incorrect because it states that post stall behaviour is a function of airspeed whereas, in fact, post stall behaviour is a function of angle of attack. If anything can be salvaged from Post stall it can be inserted into this article. Dolphin ( t) 13:11, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
I'm no expert, just someone who wants to learn. There is no explanation of how a canard-winged aircraft can get into a deep stall, which is defined by the article as turbulent airflow from a stalled wing at such a high angle of attack that it interferes with the tail control surface effectiveness and possibly rear-mounted turbine engines. The article notes that two Velocity (canard-configured) aircraft crashed due to deep stalls, but there is nothing in the area that would be affected by the turbulent air from a stalled wing in such aircraft, no control surfaces, stabilizers, or engine inlets. The [ Aviation Safety Network] article on the Piper Advanced Technologies crash says it was likely a flat spin, not a deep stall. Yes, I would like to know how this works, but more importantly, I think the article needs to explain how this works. Thanks! Dcs002 ( talk) 01:15, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
Note: The next subsection on tip stalls describes the tendency of swept wings to stall at the tips first, giving a nose-up attitude at stall onset, leading to a super-stall, which is given in the previous subsection as a synonym for a deep stall, though this doesn't fit the definition given in that subsection at all. As the canard-configured aircraft were swept-wing, were they actually unrecoverable tip stalls? Does the definition of deep stalls need to be expanded to include these nose-up tip stalls? If so, shouldn't tip stalls be included under deep stalls? Or does a tip stall become a deep stall only after its nose-up attitude is unrecoverable (which again would require redefining a deep stall)? Dcs002 ( talk) 02:05, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
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I thinks this section is poorly written, unclear, and factually incorrect in some spots. Just for starters, it should be called "accelerated stalls," the much-more-widely used term, at least in the U.S. (Is G-stall a military or British term? Anyone care to chime in?). I will rewrite it. Anyone mind? Also, it might be a bit difficult to include just the right amount of detail. Would it be appropriate to go into a full-blown discussion of the V-G diagram in this article? I am leaning towards "yes." Vessbot 07:17, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)
The introduction of this article would make sense to someone who already has a good understanding of the subject field, but I think it's perhaps too technical for a general introduction. Terms like "chord line", "angle of attack", "lift-coefficient", "angle-of-attack curve", "linear and nonlinear regimes", and "flow separation" are not in general use, but the article expects readers to understand them. While technical descriptions are certainly appropriate, there will be a lot of people coming to this article wanting to know what "stall" means and going away without an answer. Could someone knowledgeable about this topic possibly write a brief paragraph giving a basic overview to the uninitiated? -- Vardion 8 July 2005 22:41 (UTC)
I'm going to turn this into a disambiguation page, then create a new 'Stall (flight)' page to cover this subject. There are too many legit other stall definitions, and the (flight) modifier will be consistent with other flight pages, such as Spin (flight). I'll move the discussion over to the new page so it stays with flying stalls, any objections? - Chairboy 20:36, 19 July 2005 (UTC)
Just because some aircraft enthusiasts (me included) have created the most links to stall doesn't mean that Catherine is right. 90% (very approx) of the time "stall" is used it's engine stopping the general pop'n has in mind; 10% it's enclosures; 1% it's aerodynamic. When someone comes to the Wikipedia article then disambiguation is required. I think Chairboy's treatment is correct. I will wait a while and re-do his changes. And then I will hunt out double redirects in aviation articles and replace stall with stall. OK? You can help if you like. Paul Beardsell 09:26, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
The recently added image includes a caption "tilt with respect to horizontal plane". Thus MUST be changed to "tilt with respect to airflow", otherwise it is simply incorrect. In addition, the images themselves are a bit misleading to my mind. An unstalled wing shouldn't be shown with a trail of turbulence left behind, since this isn't there. The flow is smooth. Graham 05:37, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
If you are willing to make the images, that would be great. I started to have a go but I got very frustrated with the free dumbass drawing package I was trying to use (Eazydraw) which makes drawing basic bezier curves unnecessarily complex. Anyway, I think your proposal sounds good - an unstalled wing at some angle (it doesn't need to be 13°, anything reasonable - say 6°, which is a typical AoA in straight and level flight) with laminar flow lines and no turbulence, separation point or any of that malarkey. Then a wing partially stalled (15° say) where the flow is laminar over the first half or so, then breaks away, and one fully stalled where the flow is not attached at all, and spills over the leading edge. Those photographs you linked are very informative and could well be used as a basis - the depiction of turbulence is difficult and just using hatching is a bit lame - some sort of eddying would be great. I think we should avoid using any captions that mention 'separation point' - it should be obvious from the drawings that the airflow has detached and that ties in with the description in the text. Graham 04:24, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
I think there needs to be a subject on Washout but my comments in Washout about the terrors of wing tip stall should be located under the general heading of Stall. When I changed Washout I was trying to correct the previous version which suggested the sole reason for washout was to optimise wing efficiency ie reduce induced drag, whereas avoidance of tip stall, which is more important, wasn't addressed. So I changed the text leaving the structure unchanged. Now, what about the Stall section? It seems to me that a few changes are needed. Take the first sentence "In aerodynamics, a stall is a condition in which an excessive angle of attack causes loss of lift due to disruption of airflow". Read this through the eyes of someone who really wants to know what 'stall' is ie doesn't know already. Do we really mean that excessive AofA causes LOSS of lift? LOSS of lift? Is it leaking away? Or do we mean that the lift is less than would have been achieved were the wing not stalled? If the latter, why don't we say that? Also the discussion above re the diagram seems to suggest that there are only two airflow regimes, laminar and separated. Laminar is very, very difficult to achieve and not possible with an aerofoil section like that shown in the diagram. What will arise at angles less than the critical angle is turbulent (but not separated) flow. -- FHBridges 19:03, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
I have a bird book at home, which details how aq bird can stall in flight.
Is this notable?
Because I notice this article only discusses powered flight.
Stall
Is when the wings of an aircraft are no longer capable of deriving enough support from the air in order for the aircraft to maintain altitude. Although a stall usually occurs at slow speeds with excessive nose up attitudes it can actually happen over a wide range of speeds and attitudes.
There simple and to the point. Everyone agree with my definition? (contributed by User:43R35)
A proposed merger of Stall speed into this article has been sitting around for over a year. It makes sense to me, and shouldn't be too hard to accomplish. Any problems? PubliusFL 19:58, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
is stall strake the same thing as a stall fence? -- Kvuo 02:10, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Have just deleted a short paragraph. Jan 28 2008. Don't think it will upset anyone, but will provide a brief justification here in case: Paragraph seemed to be written by someone thinking of a particular class of aeroplane. Not reasonable to say that non-pilots will be worried (with the implication that pilots will not be worried) for all aircraft. For some aircraft pilots will be worried too. Anyway even pilots will be worried if it's accidental. And the point about height is made elsewhere in the article. Assuming nobody objects for a few weeks (say by the end of Feb 08) then please feel free (anyone) to delete what I've written here as it will cease to be of any interest. Rowmn ( talk) 23:22, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 10:03, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
The "misconception" of engine stalls being related to areodynamic stalls is not actually a misconception at all (for jet engines). An engine stall happens when the engine compressor blades stall out, the same sort of aerodynamic stall as described for the wing. That tends to cause reverse flow (known as surge), resulting (often) in an impressive fireball shooting out the front of the engine.
It's also possible for a compressor stage to have a "partial" stall. In that case one stalled blade makes the next one stall. The that one makes the next one stall. Etc. But the first stalled blade recovers. That recovery makes the next one recover. Etc. So a "stall cell" rotates around the stage.
Thus, claiming that engine stall is an unrelated misnomer is wrong (for jet engines, anyway). It's actually a very closely related phenomenon. (What people call an engine stall in a piston engine is a different matter.)
Furthermore, the entire section was unattributed, and there was no evidence given that this is a "popular" misconception. In my personal experience, almost everyone understands that planes can glide and that losing lift on the wings is not related to a car engine dying if you forget to declutch at a stoplight.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.181 ( talk) 22:44, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Rather than deleting the section mabye we can rewrite it. I agree with the section that the public does not understand the difference between an aerodynamyc stall and an engine stall and that is really what the section is trying to express. 20:41, 20 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by RP459 ( talk • contribs)
I really don't think it is popular. And it's even arguable that it's a misconception. The entire section rests on the fact that "stall" has more than one definition. This is an entire section which could be resolved down to one disambiguation reference.
Perhaps later I'll write a section on gas turbine engine stall. I can reference it; I'm an aero engineer and I have the appropriate textbooks right in front of me. That will solve some of the problem with this section.
But I still don't see any reasonable purpose for it at all. However, I'll hold off on re-deleting it, since I don't want to start a reversion battle. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.145 ( talk) 20:51, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
In the Graph section, it is stated 'very few aircraft have an angle of attack indicator.' But further down the page, in the Stall warning and safety devices it says 'Many aircraft have an angle of attack indicator '. Which one is right? Abercrombiefiz ( talk) 07:02, 12 February 2009 (UTC)
The graph showing Cl vs AOA is incorrect. At the critical angle Cl drops only a small way and then flat plate lift takes over so that Cl actually rises again. The Cl does not drop to zero except at 90 degrees. This is a *really* common error splattered all over the internet and books on lift. This subject was researched at Sandia but I can't find a publishable graph showing the correct result. I could graph one up from their data but maybe one of you eds. know of an open source?? Here is a good discussion on the real behaviour:
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/airfoils/q0150b.shtml
What to do? Cheers MarkC ( talk) 03:39, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks MarkC 06:34, 24 April 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbcannell ( talk • contribs)
Actaully how about a new section talking about post stall flight, the X-31 was an impressive display with flight at 70 degrees AOA. We could probably grab a NASA picture of it? With high thrust and vectoring post stall manouvers provide a tactical advantage. Cheers MarkCMarkC 06:48, 24 April 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbcannell ( talk • contribs)
Aeroplanes can fly well beyound the stall. I fly models; they fly the same way as full-size aeroplanes but you can do things too risky for manned aeroplanes. The flight pattern for this kind of post-stall flight is nicknamed 3-D, and includes frequent transitions between unstalled and prop-hanging fflight. For a demo watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEnC68qb5I0
Full-size aerobatic aeroplanes are also frequently flying beyond the stall in part of their manoevres. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.147.130.92 ( talk) 11:56, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Hi all, how about adding a section on tail stalls? They have been implicated in some recent crahes... Cheers MC MarkC ( talk) 14:53, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Needs a "history" subsection. I remember reading someplace that Orville accidentally "discovered" this on a flight at Fort Myers where a passenger was killed, and Orville badly injured for life. It seems odd now, but they were bent on "flying" and hadn't quite got around to analyzing the practical aspects of "not-quite-flying." Student7 ( talk) 14:50, 1 October 2011 (UTC)
I apologize in advance if this is the wrong place to submit suggestions - but I am absolutely LOST in this Wiki hierarchy! :)
I would like to submit a suggestion that the subject of "Tip Stall" (aka 'Wing Tip Stall') be incorporated into the section/page titled 'Stall (flight)'.
A quick Wiki Search will advise such page doesn't exist, however it will also show the term is mentioned prolifically in many other places. I can assure you it is a topic of great interest (and concern) in model aviation circles, for one, and from both eyes-on experience and much reading there is obviously a LOT of confusion as to what a tip stall actually is, ie confused with other aeronautical actions eg accelerated stalls & turning stalls. It would be very nice to have a Wiki reference to cite to those lost souls who don't really know what they did wrong or what actually happened. I would readily volunteer to submit such info but lack the technical expertise for Wiki submissions & especially for the proper way to integrate it into the existing Stalls (flight) page.
Respectfully submitted, and thank you for listening. ~Jay F — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.3.66.204 ( talk) 11:37, 24 August 2012
A picture of a stall with a paraglider, maybe something for this article.-- Luxo ( talk) 22:11, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
This article appears to need a section related to high-altitude stalls. See comments about this term at Talk:Air France Flight 447#RfC - What "Summary" should the Accident have?. The term occurs as early as 1988; see page 440 in Human factors in aviation, p. PA440, at Google Books.
Thanks, SBaker43 ( talk) 11:23, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
In the lead to Stall (flight) there is presently a diagram depicting deep stall. It is the same diagram as the one that is used later in the article to support the sub-heading Stall (flight)#Deep stall. Duplication of an image is discouraged in any article unless there is a really good reason. Deep stall is a rare form of the stall phenomenon so a diagram that targets deep stall is not a good one in the lead to this article. If there is to be an image accompanying the lead I think it should be an image appropriate to the general form of aerodynamic stall that occurs at high angle of attack in most aircraft. I am in favor of deleting the deep stall diagram from the lead to this article. Dolphin ( t) 10:19, 15 July 2013 (UTC)
Wondered if we wanted to add this to the page: http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/jfm.2013.440
From the abstract: Computed results show agreement with marginal separation theory at low and with available experimental data at higher. This simplified approach provides a universal criterion to determine the stall angle of stationary thin aerofoils with a parabolic nose.
Research has been published in Journal of Fluids Engineering and Journal of Fluid Mechanics. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.81.139.106 ( talk) 03:36, 15 October 2013 (UTC)
I modified the article to clarify the difference between the aircraft 'nosing down' by itself, and the pilot 'nosing down'. I was careful to avoid implying that once the nose has dropped, the pilot must lower the nose further in order to recover from the stall. [ this] further edit was intended to simplify, but the article now appears to imply just that.
Some texts are not very clear about this but I have just checked Langeweische, Stick and Rudder, p.33. It says that when the nose drops in the stall, the aircraft is already attempting to recover by itself. If the pilot removes his back pressure which created the stall, it will recover. Also, [ FAA Advisory 120-109] p. 14, requires a, "nose down pitch control".
In my stalling training, I had to learn not to lower the nose too much and lose more altitude than necessary in the recovery. I understand that a nose-down control movement is what's required at this point, not necessarily forcing the nose to drop further.
I suggest a different wording is needed. Burninthruthesky ( talk) 16:02, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
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The result of the move request was: moved as unopposed. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist ( talk) 10:37, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
Stall (fluid mechanics) → Stall (fluid dynamics) – Fluid mechanics comprises both fluid statics and fluid dynamics, but stalls have got nothing to do with the former, and indeed the article currently (and correctly) opens with "In fluid dynamics, a stall...". The current title therefore is unnecessarily generic and not consistent with the lead. Deeday-UK ( talk) 20:52, 2 November 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. KCVelaga ( talk) 03:20, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
Should MCAS be mentioned or discussed in this article? Gah4 ( talk) 18:07, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
@ John Vandenberg, Ahunt, Ariadacapo, Pieter1963, and Agateller:
I propose that the article Post stall be merged with this article (and Post stall be converted to a redirect.)
Post stall has been in existence for a dozen years but it contains little information. The information it contains is technically incorrect because it states that post stall behaviour is a function of airspeed whereas, in fact, post stall behaviour is a function of angle of attack. If anything can be salvaged from Post stall it can be inserted into this article. Dolphin ( t) 13:11, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
I'm no expert, just someone who wants to learn. There is no explanation of how a canard-winged aircraft can get into a deep stall, which is defined by the article as turbulent airflow from a stalled wing at such a high angle of attack that it interferes with the tail control surface effectiveness and possibly rear-mounted turbine engines. The article notes that two Velocity (canard-configured) aircraft crashed due to deep stalls, but there is nothing in the area that would be affected by the turbulent air from a stalled wing in such aircraft, no control surfaces, stabilizers, or engine inlets. The [ Aviation Safety Network] article on the Piper Advanced Technologies crash says it was likely a flat spin, not a deep stall. Yes, I would like to know how this works, but more importantly, I think the article needs to explain how this works. Thanks! Dcs002 ( talk) 01:15, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
Note: The next subsection on tip stalls describes the tendency of swept wings to stall at the tips first, giving a nose-up attitude at stall onset, leading to a super-stall, which is given in the previous subsection as a synonym for a deep stall, though this doesn't fit the definition given in that subsection at all. As the canard-configured aircraft were swept-wing, were they actually unrecoverable tip stalls? Does the definition of deep stalls need to be expanded to include these nose-up tip stalls? If so, shouldn't tip stalls be included under deep stalls? Or does a tip stall become a deep stall only after its nose-up attitude is unrecoverable (which again would require redefining a deep stall)? Dcs002 ( talk) 02:05, 8 August 2023 (UTC)