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This restates what is said in topics below, but here it is so more will notice.
It is imperative that examples added to the list include citations. The article used to be a mess of original research, full of outright speculation. Statements must also be attributed, particularly where they come from a party not involved in the production/creative process (eg. reviewers/critics). Extra citations and attributions from other such sources will add weight to these claims. At the time of writing, there are examples which say that a work "is considered" to be a spiritual successor to another work. This implies it to be a widely held view, which may not be the case; the view may be limited to that one source. Finally, there is not an actual need to expand the list. It is only meant to give a few notable examples. Five or six examples is really sufficient.-- Drat ( Talk) 01:39, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
In both of these free steam games, it says in their store page descriptions that they are "spiritual successors" of the original Escape Velocity games. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.177.11.11 ( talk) 17:02, 17 July 2018 (UTC)
While I think Doom 3 was influenced by System Shock 2, I don't know if it can really be considered a spiritual sequel. To my knowledge there wasn't much team overlap. And all of the other spiritual sequels either have serious team overlap or the inspiration of the original game was publicly acknowledged by the team. -- Hardgoodbye
Why is Stargate a spiritual sequel to Raiders of the Lost Ark? I could maybe see "The Mummy" being a spiritual sequel to Raiders... but not Stargate...
OnEscapee was listed as a spiritual sequel to Another World, which is fairly ridiculous. It's an homage (or a rip-off for the cynical) but because it was a fan game with no input from the original people it shouldn't be considered a spiritual sequel. If the meaning of 'spirtual sequel' gets relaxed enough, we might as well start including clones and fan fiction.
We need to establish what the connection is between these games are. It's looking pretty plain and useless as is. I added a bunch of information but someone deleted them claiming them full of errors. Stupid since I mostly only mentioned the shared developers between the games, i.e. Chromehounds and Murakamo are both from Armored Core developer, From Software. Nothing wrong with that.
I just put down Rise of Legends as a spirtual sequel to Rise of Nations on the list. I thought it would have already been added there since the Rise of Legends wikipedia page says it is a spirtual successor to Rise of Nations.
The items added here need to be confirmed as being spiritual sequels/successors. Items should only be added if reliable sources can back them up (not because you think "Gee, Game X sure seems inspired by Game Y"). Otherwise it will become an indicriminate list (if it isn't already).-- Drat ( Talk) 06:41, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
I can see how Starcraft is a spirtual sequel to Warcraft, but not Diablo.-- 70.16.14.116 01:40, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
Good points in your cleanup, Golbez. I'm confused though - I would think that Shadow Warrior would fit the criteria for a spiritual sequel - produced by the same company with the same run engine and a similar style of gameplay and humor. I'm not sure what other criteria we use to differentiate. I think that Warcraft/Starcraft are in the same boat. Sraan 21:16, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
I've removed the list as none of it was sourced, and it was a magnet for everyone with an overactive imagination. Instead Category:Unofficial sequels can be used. I've put an unreferenced tag on the article. This is actually a verifiable phenomena, so it'd be good to see some sources. Just don't want anyone over-reacting and tossing it on AFD within five seconds.-- Drat ( Talk) 12:14, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
I thought this AfD resulted in keep? There seems to be a lack of anything here... --Hawkian
This article would really benefit from an example of some kind. 210.49.218.220 06:48, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
Masam, I don't think that EBA would qualify as a spiritual successor or sequel of Ouendan, it's really more of a localized remake along the lines of Man About The House versus Three's Company or all those other shows remade for Americans. Wasteland and Fallout are a much better example of a concept floating from one game to another, especially since they embody all the silliest tropes of an idea that won't quite die in spite of repeated theft, disownment and abuse. 208.54.14.12 18:34, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
Why is half the article spent talking about one specific example? Very underwhelming fancruft. In addition, why is it considered a video-game related article? The text establishes in the first sentence that it can apply to several forms of media. -- Pathogen 10:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
I can see both sides on the List / No List issue. On one hand, you're going to have people that think Game X is a spiritual sequel to Game Y. On the other hand, it's a great way to have examples of the concept. I'll add a few ones that the devs have literally said it, and hope that nobody else mucks with it. Scumbag 02:38, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Would Perfect Dark (the original) be considered a spiritual successor to Goldeneye (again, 64)? They were both made by Rare back in its glory days as interesting spy FPS's with a large multiplayer component. If they count, I think they should be added to the examples since they're very famous and influential. 24.183.105.170 18:52, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I found this page through the main article of Sequels and their different forms and was surprised to find it put so much emphasis on video games. Perhaps the term "spiritual sequel" began in the video game community, although I doubt that. The lead-in paragraph says that a spiritual sequel is "successor to a video game, movie, novel, comic, stage play, or television mini-series" and it would seem that is true. But only examples of video games are given and likewise the article is listed as a Video Game stub. What about those other media? I can not think of any examples at present but I know that I will be able to think of some, especially in television and comic books. Should this article be revised take some ofthe emphasis off games shared with other medias? Danleary25 00:37, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
This article is a MESS. I was looking for a connection between The Umbrellas of Cherbourg and The Young Girls of Rochefort (the latter being a spiritual sequel to the former), and here I am perusing through a brainless list of video games. n00bs! Kaminari ( talk) 01:03, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
Seriously. Can we get some non-games in here? 206.211.155.42 ( talk) 02:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)
The Halo and Marathon series' have several connections, making them extremely similar so I believe they should be included. Also some of Halo 3's maps are just spiritual successor's to Halo 2's maps, not direct remakes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.173.12.112 ( talk • contribs)
Street Fighter 2 hardly resembles the first, but still has the name of the first. Wouldn't that make it a spiritual successor? 69.220.2.188 03:04, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed that at least a couple of the statements about the works, while sourced, do not actually attribute the claims to the person making them. Instead, they merely say "is considered", etc. In addition, multiple sources are really needed, as we can't just say "Reviewer X has described game Y as a spiritual sequel to game Z" and leave it at that.-- Drat ( Talk) 02:35, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
"Creative teams rarely retain the copyright of their creations, often making attempts to create sequels for a product impossible." This confused me a lot, so there may be a better way of expressing it. I was about to suggest that the sentence is actually a typo for "Creature teams usually retain" on the grounds that if they gave up the copyright, they couldn't make it impossible for people to create sequels. But now I realise it's meant to mean that the copyright goes to the studio or producer, so the creative team can't create the sequel. However, even this concept needs further elucidation - surely if the product had been successful, the producer would usually be keen to allow a sequel to be produced? -20:50, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
Could Quake 2 be considered a spiritual successor to Quake 1? Flashn00b 20:11, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Whoa, this article was way different from what I expected. It's all about video games and I thought that 'spiritual successor' was a totally general term - I first saw in in Autocar magazine and they were talking about a car being the S.S. to another. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dustin Pearson ( talk • contribs) 01:49, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
I have moved a couple of the examples of spiritual successors to the previous paragraph describing why spiritual sequels are created. 86.130.156.162 ( talk) 14:18, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
I think Crysis should be added to this article as a spiritual succesor to FarCry because if you search on Google Crysis spiritual FarCry there are lots of webs that says this. Although it exists an official sequel FarCry 2, but Crysis and FarCry were done by Crytek while FarCry 2 not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.103.0.184 ( talk) 19:02, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
No one's mentioned Chrono Cross and Chrono Trigger. Would the former be considered a spiritual successor? If so, can someone add it? ForestAngel ( talk) 09:58, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
No. Chrono Cross is a sequel. 207.55.91.89 ( talk) 00:36, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
This isn't on here, so I think someone can put it on. http://www.gamepro.com/article/features/211826/spiritual-successors-the-13-best-unofficial-video-game-sequels Sincerely Subzerosmokerain ( talk) 01:01, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure red dead redemption is a sequel to red dead revolver, not a spiritual successor -_- Assassin| 1511 07:58, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
Can we add Snatch as a spiritual successor of Love, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.117.102.85 ( talk) 01:00, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
I am wondering about what the legality if spiritual successors is. Can some successors be considered derivative works, and therefore liable to court cases and lawsuits? -- EditCreateContribute ( talk) 15:34, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
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If a company made a game, would the previous game they made be called a predecessor, even if they was not in the same series?
It's a spirtual successor to the game Adventure Forward 2 so you might want to add that to the list :3c 207.74.82.68 ( talk) 18:24, 9 February 2024 (UTC)
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This restates what is said in topics below, but here it is so more will notice.
It is imperative that examples added to the list include citations. The article used to be a mess of original research, full of outright speculation. Statements must also be attributed, particularly where they come from a party not involved in the production/creative process (eg. reviewers/critics). Extra citations and attributions from other such sources will add weight to these claims. At the time of writing, there are examples which say that a work "is considered" to be a spiritual successor to another work. This implies it to be a widely held view, which may not be the case; the view may be limited to that one source. Finally, there is not an actual need to expand the list. It is only meant to give a few notable examples. Five or six examples is really sufficient.-- Drat ( Talk) 01:39, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
In both of these free steam games, it says in their store page descriptions that they are "spiritual successors" of the original Escape Velocity games. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.177.11.11 ( talk) 17:02, 17 July 2018 (UTC)
While I think Doom 3 was influenced by System Shock 2, I don't know if it can really be considered a spiritual sequel. To my knowledge there wasn't much team overlap. And all of the other spiritual sequels either have serious team overlap or the inspiration of the original game was publicly acknowledged by the team. -- Hardgoodbye
Why is Stargate a spiritual sequel to Raiders of the Lost Ark? I could maybe see "The Mummy" being a spiritual sequel to Raiders... but not Stargate...
OnEscapee was listed as a spiritual sequel to Another World, which is fairly ridiculous. It's an homage (or a rip-off for the cynical) but because it was a fan game with no input from the original people it shouldn't be considered a spiritual sequel. If the meaning of 'spirtual sequel' gets relaxed enough, we might as well start including clones and fan fiction.
We need to establish what the connection is between these games are. It's looking pretty plain and useless as is. I added a bunch of information but someone deleted them claiming them full of errors. Stupid since I mostly only mentioned the shared developers between the games, i.e. Chromehounds and Murakamo are both from Armored Core developer, From Software. Nothing wrong with that.
I just put down Rise of Legends as a spirtual sequel to Rise of Nations on the list. I thought it would have already been added there since the Rise of Legends wikipedia page says it is a spirtual successor to Rise of Nations.
The items added here need to be confirmed as being spiritual sequels/successors. Items should only be added if reliable sources can back them up (not because you think "Gee, Game X sure seems inspired by Game Y"). Otherwise it will become an indicriminate list (if it isn't already).-- Drat ( Talk) 06:41, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
I can see how Starcraft is a spirtual sequel to Warcraft, but not Diablo.-- 70.16.14.116 01:40, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
Good points in your cleanup, Golbez. I'm confused though - I would think that Shadow Warrior would fit the criteria for a spiritual sequel - produced by the same company with the same run engine and a similar style of gameplay and humor. I'm not sure what other criteria we use to differentiate. I think that Warcraft/Starcraft are in the same boat. Sraan 21:16, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
I've removed the list as none of it was sourced, and it was a magnet for everyone with an overactive imagination. Instead Category:Unofficial sequels can be used. I've put an unreferenced tag on the article. This is actually a verifiable phenomena, so it'd be good to see some sources. Just don't want anyone over-reacting and tossing it on AFD within five seconds.-- Drat ( Talk) 12:14, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
I thought this AfD resulted in keep? There seems to be a lack of anything here... --Hawkian
This article would really benefit from an example of some kind. 210.49.218.220 06:48, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
Masam, I don't think that EBA would qualify as a spiritual successor or sequel of Ouendan, it's really more of a localized remake along the lines of Man About The House versus Three's Company or all those other shows remade for Americans. Wasteland and Fallout are a much better example of a concept floating from one game to another, especially since they embody all the silliest tropes of an idea that won't quite die in spite of repeated theft, disownment and abuse. 208.54.14.12 18:34, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
Why is half the article spent talking about one specific example? Very underwhelming fancruft. In addition, why is it considered a video-game related article? The text establishes in the first sentence that it can apply to several forms of media. -- Pathogen 10:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
I can see both sides on the List / No List issue. On one hand, you're going to have people that think Game X is a spiritual sequel to Game Y. On the other hand, it's a great way to have examples of the concept. I'll add a few ones that the devs have literally said it, and hope that nobody else mucks with it. Scumbag 02:38, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Would Perfect Dark (the original) be considered a spiritual successor to Goldeneye (again, 64)? They were both made by Rare back in its glory days as interesting spy FPS's with a large multiplayer component. If they count, I think they should be added to the examples since they're very famous and influential. 24.183.105.170 18:52, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I found this page through the main article of Sequels and their different forms and was surprised to find it put so much emphasis on video games. Perhaps the term "spiritual sequel" began in the video game community, although I doubt that. The lead-in paragraph says that a spiritual sequel is "successor to a video game, movie, novel, comic, stage play, or television mini-series" and it would seem that is true. But only examples of video games are given and likewise the article is listed as a Video Game stub. What about those other media? I can not think of any examples at present but I know that I will be able to think of some, especially in television and comic books. Should this article be revised take some ofthe emphasis off games shared with other medias? Danleary25 00:37, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
This article is a MESS. I was looking for a connection between The Umbrellas of Cherbourg and The Young Girls of Rochefort (the latter being a spiritual sequel to the former), and here I am perusing through a brainless list of video games. n00bs! Kaminari ( talk) 01:03, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
Seriously. Can we get some non-games in here? 206.211.155.42 ( talk) 02:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)
The Halo and Marathon series' have several connections, making them extremely similar so I believe they should be included. Also some of Halo 3's maps are just spiritual successor's to Halo 2's maps, not direct remakes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.173.12.112 ( talk • contribs)
Street Fighter 2 hardly resembles the first, but still has the name of the first. Wouldn't that make it a spiritual successor? 69.220.2.188 03:04, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed that at least a couple of the statements about the works, while sourced, do not actually attribute the claims to the person making them. Instead, they merely say "is considered", etc. In addition, multiple sources are really needed, as we can't just say "Reviewer X has described game Y as a spiritual sequel to game Z" and leave it at that.-- Drat ( Talk) 02:35, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
"Creative teams rarely retain the copyright of their creations, often making attempts to create sequels for a product impossible." This confused me a lot, so there may be a better way of expressing it. I was about to suggest that the sentence is actually a typo for "Creature teams usually retain" on the grounds that if they gave up the copyright, they couldn't make it impossible for people to create sequels. But now I realise it's meant to mean that the copyright goes to the studio or producer, so the creative team can't create the sequel. However, even this concept needs further elucidation - surely if the product had been successful, the producer would usually be keen to allow a sequel to be produced? -20:50, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
Could Quake 2 be considered a spiritual successor to Quake 1? Flashn00b 20:11, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Whoa, this article was way different from what I expected. It's all about video games and I thought that 'spiritual successor' was a totally general term - I first saw in in Autocar magazine and they were talking about a car being the S.S. to another. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dustin Pearson ( talk • contribs) 01:49, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
I have moved a couple of the examples of spiritual successors to the previous paragraph describing why spiritual sequels are created. 86.130.156.162 ( talk) 14:18, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
I think Crysis should be added to this article as a spiritual succesor to FarCry because if you search on Google Crysis spiritual FarCry there are lots of webs that says this. Although it exists an official sequel FarCry 2, but Crysis and FarCry were done by Crytek while FarCry 2 not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.103.0.184 ( talk) 19:02, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
No one's mentioned Chrono Cross and Chrono Trigger. Would the former be considered a spiritual successor? If so, can someone add it? ForestAngel ( talk) 09:58, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
No. Chrono Cross is a sequel. 207.55.91.89 ( talk) 00:36, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
This isn't on here, so I think someone can put it on. http://www.gamepro.com/article/features/211826/spiritual-successors-the-13-best-unofficial-video-game-sequels Sincerely Subzerosmokerain ( talk) 01:01, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure red dead redemption is a sequel to red dead revolver, not a spiritual successor -_- Assassin| 1511 07:58, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
Can we add Snatch as a spiritual successor of Love, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.117.102.85 ( talk) 01:00, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
I am wondering about what the legality if spiritual successors is. Can some successors be considered derivative works, and therefore liable to court cases and lawsuits? -- EditCreateContribute ( talk) 15:34, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
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If a company made a game, would the previous game they made be called a predecessor, even if they was not in the same series?
It's a spirtual successor to the game Adventure Forward 2 so you might want to add that to the list :3c 207.74.82.68 ( talk) 18:24, 9 February 2024 (UTC)