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What's the evidence for this claim? Ste B 03:02, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
the article asserts that the holte end was bigger than the south bank at molyneux. Ive stood on both and the south bank was surely significantly larger - it went back 280 steps (i counted) across most of its width and was much wider than the pitch. the holte end went back 200 steps ( as far as i remember, i also counted it) and though wider than the pitch was not as wide as the south bank, nor did it have a corner section whereas the south bank did. I am prepared to be corrected that i misremember the depth of the holte end, but i'm sure of the depth of the south bank.
unless someone can correct me i wil edit this article to state that the south bank was the biggest end in the land.
I asset that the south bank coult hold nearly 50,000 in the days before the regulators - the rest of the ground really was a titchy little dump.
oh yeah and i'm a west brom fan, so i have no remit for either wolves or villa - but i was quite a bit spoddy about the sizes of the various terraces of england. i stood on most of them and usually counted the steps. a mention of the kippax might also be in order —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.152.140.68 ( talk • contribs) 19:37, 26 August 2006
I have to take issue with the implication that it was a 'liverpool regiment' that suffered heavy losses at the battle of Spion Kop in the Boer War. Closest to this description is likiely to be The South Lancashitrs; however there were many other regiments from all over the UK and the Empire involved, several of whom suffered significant losses - http://www.britishbattles.com/great-boer-war/spion-kop.htm. The fallout from this battle seriously impacted on the public in the UK, it is almost certain that several Football Clubs, large and small and in a 'patriotic spirit' memorialized the encounter my so naming any mound like enclosure (remember many would not be 'stands' as we know them now, but more like 'The Hill' and 'The Mound' at Sydney and Adelade Cricket Grounds, i.e. Grass covered inclines).
can I also take issue with the assertion that the Anfield Kop is the only 'Official'y named stand.
I can only speak for Bramall Lane in Sheffield but it currently has the 'official' name 'Hallam FM Kop Stand' - http://www.sufc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/Prices/0,,10418,00.html
And, to my knowledge, has been officially the Shoreham Kop, since I started going to Bramall Lane in 1969, and unofficially, i.e. amongst supporters both 't'Shoreham' t'Kop' and 'Spion Kop'.
I'm pretty sure other grounds have stands with an 'official' Kop name.
SubtleBlade 23:28, 3 December 2006 (UTC) SubtleBlade
This is also the name of a one street hamlet on the outskirts of Mansfield. Having spent many matches in the Kop at Hillsborough in the days when Wednesday were a force to be reckoned with I always feel a surge of nostalgia when driving through there.
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The Riverside stadiums kop end is known as the new holgate end (the original holgate end being the kop end at ayresome park) suggest this is added rather than naming the name of a block number. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.104.177.68 ( talk) 20:43, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
The North Stand at the Riverside is not oficially named 'the new holgate' it is only refered to this by a few fans and isnt a widely used term. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
94.0.66.85 (
talk) 11:34, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
Highbury isn't standing anymore is it? So the kop at that stadium isn't there. I don't know whether there are other stadia listed which are no longer standing, but if they are in the list shouldn't they either be removed or a note made that this is the case. -- 81.158.106.197 ( talk) 15:20, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
If you understand the history of english football and the importance of the kops then you would appreciate how signficant there are and how historical these are. Maybe a distinction could be made in relation to those still standing and those not, but simply to say only to list those still standing is a slight on the significance of these stadia icons. I live on the other side of the world and I certainly appreciate their historically importance. SteveD 17th December 2009. 7:56 a.m. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.104.0.218 ( talk) 20:57, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Less of the "loyal" and "famous". Keep it neutral. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.164.243 ( talk) 14:44, 29 September 2009 (UTC) Please a little sense and sensibility. You don't need to be a Liverpool supporter to know how famous the Liverpool Kop is. There is nothing non-neutral about this. Maybe you should know your sport a little better. SteveD 17th December 2009. 7:53 am. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.104.0.218 ( talk) 20:53, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
It seems to me that in the list of 'kops' that there are a series of stands/terraces that have never been known as a kop. Rather, I suspect that these are, instead, 'popular ends', i.e. the end which is/was most popular with the home supporters, particularly as the common layout of football grounds used to have home fans behind one goal and away behind the other. A distinction should be drawn between the two, and if there is no verification that a particular stand/end has ever been referred to as a kop then it should be removed. Dancarney ( talk) 15:59, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
The incredible story behind the Kop 81.155.231.191 ( talk) 12:11, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
The often-repeated assertion that Woolwich Arsenal supporters nicknamed a terrace "Spion Kop" remains unsupported by evidence. The claim was first made by Phil Soar in The History of Arsenal Football Club. But his source—a press cutting dated 1904—only mentions Spion Kop fleetingly. The author, in a single sentence, merely notes the similarity between spectators' heads popping over the top of the embankment to warring factions atop the hill of the same name. To Phil Soar, this was as good as saying Arsenal had a terrace named Spion Kop, even though the evidence clearly does not stretch that far.
The part about Liverpool fans nicknaming their own terrace is conjecture (though entirely sensible) based on a 1906 report by Birmingham journalist Ernest Edwards in which he wrote "This huge wall of earth has been termed 'Spion Kop', and no doubt this apt name will always be used in future in referring to this spot." It is reasonable to assume the name was adopted by fans in the way indicated by Edwards. But some accounts (including Mark Lawrenson's) conflate these two separate pieces of evidence and apply Ernest Edwards' report to Woolwich Arsenal, without justification. Wikispan ( talk) 12:55, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
While it may have originally been called the Spion Kop, am pretty sure at least from its 1994 rebuild its just been called/referred to as the Kop; shouldnt the article note this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.17.0.3 ( talk) 10:36, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
I came here because reading the possibility of Liverpool appointing Jürgen Klopp as manager, I started to wonder why The Kop is so called (I'm not a Liverpool fan)
I got what I came for but I have to note that this entire article is bonkers! With its emphasis on the origin of the term, and its effort to demonstrate how many stands exist that are officially or unoficially called "kop" in some way - it totally fails to impart to the reader the that the most common use of the term refers to Liverpool's home supporters and/or their most famous stand. The fact that "The Kop" is used, and has been used for decades, by all forms of media to implicitly refer to Liverpool really needs a mention. 194.166.122.239 ( talk) 21:30, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
The Blackpool image is a copyright violation. I added the Liverpool one since it receives plenty of text in the article. Cptnono ( talk) 16:53, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
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I have several times tried to make an edit to refer to the fact that Tottenham Hotspur's new stadium will have a kop-style stand (the South Stand) with 17,000 capacity (the largest in the UK when finished). Each time it has been reverted by Ilikeeatingwaffles for reasons which I don't find convincing.
Here are some sources and I leave it to others to decide:
... and plenty more along the same lines if you do a Google search.
Several of these refer to it as being the largest in the UK, including the Office THFC website "the largest single tier in the UK, the home southern stand seating 17,000."
MrStoofer ( talk) 11:04, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
So this is an article about stands named "Kop" and not an article about a style of stand? And so you cannot include a stand that is of the requisite style and is referred to as a "Kop" in reputable sources if it is not officially named that by the club? MrStoofer ( talk) 12:03, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
We've got a bit off topic. The issue was why was THFC's proposed stand excluded from mention, I believe that I have refuted your reason (it is not "officially" called a kop) because the article is not limited to stands
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The table of Kops mentions the Spinnekop stand at the Dutch club De Graafschap. It was added in 2007 by an unregistered user (their sole contribution to en.wp). A cited reference does verify the existence of the Spinnekop stand at the club, but not any connection with the Spion Kop or any other Kop stand. Spinnekop is Dutch for "spider's head" and Afrikaans for "spider"; I don't think it has anything to do with "spy's lookout hill", which is the original Dutch and Afrikaans sense of spion kop. I propose to remove the Spinnekop from the table unless anyone knows why it should be kept there. Frans Fowler ( talk) 15:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)
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What's the evidence for this claim? Ste B 03:02, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
the article asserts that the holte end was bigger than the south bank at molyneux. Ive stood on both and the south bank was surely significantly larger - it went back 280 steps (i counted) across most of its width and was much wider than the pitch. the holte end went back 200 steps ( as far as i remember, i also counted it) and though wider than the pitch was not as wide as the south bank, nor did it have a corner section whereas the south bank did. I am prepared to be corrected that i misremember the depth of the holte end, but i'm sure of the depth of the south bank.
unless someone can correct me i wil edit this article to state that the south bank was the biggest end in the land.
I asset that the south bank coult hold nearly 50,000 in the days before the regulators - the rest of the ground really was a titchy little dump.
oh yeah and i'm a west brom fan, so i have no remit for either wolves or villa - but i was quite a bit spoddy about the sizes of the various terraces of england. i stood on most of them and usually counted the steps. a mention of the kippax might also be in order —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.152.140.68 ( talk • contribs) 19:37, 26 August 2006
I have to take issue with the implication that it was a 'liverpool regiment' that suffered heavy losses at the battle of Spion Kop in the Boer War. Closest to this description is likiely to be The South Lancashitrs; however there were many other regiments from all over the UK and the Empire involved, several of whom suffered significant losses - http://www.britishbattles.com/great-boer-war/spion-kop.htm. The fallout from this battle seriously impacted on the public in the UK, it is almost certain that several Football Clubs, large and small and in a 'patriotic spirit' memorialized the encounter my so naming any mound like enclosure (remember many would not be 'stands' as we know them now, but more like 'The Hill' and 'The Mound' at Sydney and Adelade Cricket Grounds, i.e. Grass covered inclines).
can I also take issue with the assertion that the Anfield Kop is the only 'Official'y named stand.
I can only speak for Bramall Lane in Sheffield but it currently has the 'official' name 'Hallam FM Kop Stand' - http://www.sufc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/Prices/0,,10418,00.html
And, to my knowledge, has been officially the Shoreham Kop, since I started going to Bramall Lane in 1969, and unofficially, i.e. amongst supporters both 't'Shoreham' t'Kop' and 'Spion Kop'.
I'm pretty sure other grounds have stands with an 'official' Kop name.
SubtleBlade 23:28, 3 December 2006 (UTC) SubtleBlade
This is also the name of a one street hamlet on the outskirts of Mansfield. Having spent many matches in the Kop at Hillsborough in the days when Wednesday were a force to be reckoned with I always feel a surge of nostalgia when driving through there.
The image Image:Bloomfield Road from above.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check
This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --20:22, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
The Riverside stadiums kop end is known as the new holgate end (the original holgate end being the kop end at ayresome park) suggest this is added rather than naming the name of a block number. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.104.177.68 ( talk) 20:43, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
The North Stand at the Riverside is not oficially named 'the new holgate' it is only refered to this by a few fans and isnt a widely used term. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
94.0.66.85 (
talk) 11:34, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
Highbury isn't standing anymore is it? So the kop at that stadium isn't there. I don't know whether there are other stadia listed which are no longer standing, but if they are in the list shouldn't they either be removed or a note made that this is the case. -- 81.158.106.197 ( talk) 15:20, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
If you understand the history of english football and the importance of the kops then you would appreciate how signficant there are and how historical these are. Maybe a distinction could be made in relation to those still standing and those not, but simply to say only to list those still standing is a slight on the significance of these stadia icons. I live on the other side of the world and I certainly appreciate their historically importance. SteveD 17th December 2009. 7:56 a.m. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.104.0.218 ( talk) 20:57, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Less of the "loyal" and "famous". Keep it neutral. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.164.243 ( talk) 14:44, 29 September 2009 (UTC) Please a little sense and sensibility. You don't need to be a Liverpool supporter to know how famous the Liverpool Kop is. There is nothing non-neutral about this. Maybe you should know your sport a little better. SteveD 17th December 2009. 7:53 am. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.104.0.218 ( talk) 20:53, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
It seems to me that in the list of 'kops' that there are a series of stands/terraces that have never been known as a kop. Rather, I suspect that these are, instead, 'popular ends', i.e. the end which is/was most popular with the home supporters, particularly as the common layout of football grounds used to have home fans behind one goal and away behind the other. A distinction should be drawn between the two, and if there is no verification that a particular stand/end has ever been referred to as a kop then it should be removed. Dancarney ( talk) 15:59, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
The incredible story behind the Kop 81.155.231.191 ( talk) 12:11, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
The often-repeated assertion that Woolwich Arsenal supporters nicknamed a terrace "Spion Kop" remains unsupported by evidence. The claim was first made by Phil Soar in The History of Arsenal Football Club. But his source—a press cutting dated 1904—only mentions Spion Kop fleetingly. The author, in a single sentence, merely notes the similarity between spectators' heads popping over the top of the embankment to warring factions atop the hill of the same name. To Phil Soar, this was as good as saying Arsenal had a terrace named Spion Kop, even though the evidence clearly does not stretch that far.
The part about Liverpool fans nicknaming their own terrace is conjecture (though entirely sensible) based on a 1906 report by Birmingham journalist Ernest Edwards in which he wrote "This huge wall of earth has been termed 'Spion Kop', and no doubt this apt name will always be used in future in referring to this spot." It is reasonable to assume the name was adopted by fans in the way indicated by Edwards. But some accounts (including Mark Lawrenson's) conflate these two separate pieces of evidence and apply Ernest Edwards' report to Woolwich Arsenal, without justification. Wikispan ( talk) 12:55, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
While it may have originally been called the Spion Kop, am pretty sure at least from its 1994 rebuild its just been called/referred to as the Kop; shouldnt the article note this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.17.0.3 ( talk) 10:36, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
I came here because reading the possibility of Liverpool appointing Jürgen Klopp as manager, I started to wonder why The Kop is so called (I'm not a Liverpool fan)
I got what I came for but I have to note that this entire article is bonkers! With its emphasis on the origin of the term, and its effort to demonstrate how many stands exist that are officially or unoficially called "kop" in some way - it totally fails to impart to the reader the that the most common use of the term refers to Liverpool's home supporters and/or their most famous stand. The fact that "The Kop" is used, and has been used for decades, by all forms of media to implicitly refer to Liverpool really needs a mention. 194.166.122.239 ( talk) 21:30, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
The Blackpool image is a copyright violation. I added the Liverpool one since it receives plenty of text in the article. Cptnono ( talk) 16:53, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
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An image used in this article, File:Spion Kop at Hillsborough.jpg, has been nominated for speedy deletion for the following reason: All Wikipedia files with unknown copyright status
Don't panic; you should have time to contest the deletion (although please review deletion guidelines before doing so). The best way to contest this form of deletion is by posting on the image talk page.
To take part in any discussion, or to review a more detailed deletion rationale please visit the relevant image page (File:Spion Kop at Hillsborough.jpg) This is Bot placed notification, another user has nominated/tagged the image -- CommonsNotificationBot ( talk) 22:16, 19 February 2012 (UTC) |
I have several times tried to make an edit to refer to the fact that Tottenham Hotspur's new stadium will have a kop-style stand (the South Stand) with 17,000 capacity (the largest in the UK when finished). Each time it has been reverted by Ilikeeatingwaffles for reasons which I don't find convincing.
Here are some sources and I leave it to others to decide:
... and plenty more along the same lines if you do a Google search.
Several of these refer to it as being the largest in the UK, including the Office THFC website "the largest single tier in the UK, the home southern stand seating 17,000."
MrStoofer ( talk) 11:04, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
So this is an article about stands named "Kop" and not an article about a style of stand? And so you cannot include a stand that is of the requisite style and is referred to as a "Kop" in reputable sources if it is not officially named that by the club? MrStoofer ( talk) 12:03, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
We've got a bit off topic. The issue was why was THFC's proposed stand excluded from mention, I believe that I have refuted your reason (it is not "officially" called a kop) because the article is not limited to stands
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The table of Kops mentions the Spinnekop stand at the Dutch club De Graafschap. It was added in 2007 by an unregistered user (their sole contribution to en.wp). A cited reference does verify the existence of the Spinnekop stand at the club, but not any connection with the Spion Kop or any other Kop stand. Spinnekop is Dutch for "spider's head" and Afrikaans for "spider"; I don't think it has anything to do with "spy's lookout hill", which is the original Dutch and Afrikaans sense of spion kop. I propose to remove the Spinnekop from the table unless anyone knows why it should be kept there. Frans Fowler ( talk) 15:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)