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Text and/or other creative content from Soanya Ahmad was copied or moved into Reid Stowe with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
This article was previously deleted after consensus in 2007. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Soanya_Ahmad Perhaps merging it with Reid Stowe may be better than deletion? Aloha27 ( talk) 14:29, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Jac 1688 - This article is very poorly sourced. If one were to delete the content that is not sourced at all, the content that is sourced to the subject herself, and the content that is sourced to a blog -- there wouldn't be an article. Also, how is a sailing trip to Guyana noteworthy? For that matter, how is the article itself noteworthy when the only significant claim is a world record that has not been confirmed by any major organization, such as Guinness? Regatta dog ( talk) 15:37, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Trip to Guyana -- A simple trip to Guyana is very insignificant. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia - It should not be used as a personal travel blog or Twitter feed. Do we create an article for every person who sails from the US to South America? Or do we update any boater's article whenever they leave the dock. This is silly, IMO. I would like to get some input on these topics from Skol Fir. Regatta dog ( talk) 19:04, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
The following is a direct quote from the WSSRC website: (Underlines mine) Note that we have a policy of not ratifying "youngest/oldest etc" claims or attempts and our rules do not include such categories. We concentrate on speed record attempts and claims, and no longer recognise "human condition" categories which can expand to such an extent that almost anyone would be able to claim a record of some sort. The other issue is that whilst we can clearly monitor and ratify "speed/time" records - at which we have become rather expert - the verification of age/ disability/marital status etc is a less exact science. Here is the link to the existing "records of other kinds" page: http://www.sailspeedrecords.com/other-kinds-of-sailing-records.html Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 06:40, 22 December 2011 (UTC)
Let's do this logically, without taking sides for the moment.
I am not actually sure who keeps the "Longest Time at Sea" record, since the WSSRC doesn't want to touch it with a ten-foot pole! What I do know is that at least two reputable sources state that Cottee set that record for a single-handed woman sailor ::
For a male sailor, the "Longest series -- non stop, singlehanded circumnavigations" was done by "Jon Sanders, AUS; 1986-1988; 3 continuous circumnavigations one westabout, two eastabout, 657 days" -- taken from the Other Kinds of Sailing Records at the WSSRC. That record does not specifically dwell on the time it took, but more on the number of circumnavigations, and the fact that they were all in a continuous series -- impressive, indeed!
So, the question remains -- Who invented the record "longest time at sea"? We know it was there before Reid Stowe and Soanya Ahmad came on the scene, because Cottee supposedly holds that record for a single-handed sailor (woman) since 1988. It was never recognized by Guinness BOR, as they only gave Sanders the "longest distance ever sailed continuously by any vessel (71,023 nautical miles)."
As we don't know who actually recognizes such a record, it remains contestable, but so far no one has provided solid evidence to refute it. However, assuming that we accept the GPS tracking as proof that Soanya did not leap off the schooner at any time during the 306 days, I don't see why she cannot say that she is probably the woman with the longest continuous time at sea, since women stepped foot on sea-going vessels. We don't need to call it a record, just an accomplishment. If you don't think that warrants a separate article for her, so be it. -- Skol fir ( talk) 03:08, 23 December 2011 (UTC)
I think you're twisting the facts here. Cottee was a solo sailor with a circumnavigation that took 189 days. The record stands to this day because it was the FIRST solo circumnavigation of the globe by a woman. Conversely Ahmad, in her own words "preferred to stay below", and rarely, (if ever) took an active part in actually sailing the vessel. Since Ahmad IMO is a classic case of WP:BLP1E, merge the article with Stowe's and be done with it. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 06:24, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
The logistics and endurance "feat" isn't a factor here and is the reason WSSRC tightened their rules for record-setting attempts. As for me setting out to "cruise" for an extended period of time, that isn't an option at the moment as I am employed. We'll see what happens in a couple of years after I retire. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't require assistance because I became pregnant though. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 00:05, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
On February 22, 2008 Soanya achieved a world record for the longest time that any woman has remained at sea, with a time of 306 days spent on board the schooner Anne, together with Reid Stowe. [1] She was brought ashore by members of the Royal Perth Yacht Club off Rottnest Island, near Perth, Western Australia. [2] [3] The entire route of the schooner Anne was verified daily by GPS tracking, and the manufacturer of the equipment has made the database available online. [4]
Weak. Really Weak. Since you have no intention or are unable to state unequivocally who held the previous record for longest time spent at sea (non-solo), we must assume that no record existed prior to Ahmad's claim? I have no problem with the 306 days claimed. Never have. But IS it the record time for a woman to be at sea? You don't know. I don't know. Nobody does. Since women have been sailing for the past 250+ years I can safely say that it is truly doubtful. Why? Glad you asked.
Women have been Captains of pirate ships, disguised themselves as male crewmembers, accompanied their mariner husbands aboard ship. Women are crewmembers aboard nuclear submarines, spending up to a year (or more) patrolling the world's oceans without ever making port. So, if Ahmad wishes to claim a record, so be it. BUT, you cannot sit there and attempt to tell us that suddenly... BAM! 306 days is the magic number.
As far as WP:BLP1E goes, you conveniently neglected the main issue. I quote: " People notable for only one event Main pages: WP:BLP1E and WP:BIO1E People known only in connection with one event should generally not have an article written about them. If the event is notable, then an article usually should be written about the event instead."
Therefore, merge the article with "1000 days" and be done with it. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 18:02, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
(I hate to have to fire a Harpoon missle at a US military reference website, but it is outdated by a year and requires updating.)
So as not to be accused as being underhanded and sneaky, the above was written by me. Forgot to log on. Sorry Regatta dog ( talk) 15:42, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
EARLY LIFE - The section was from the subject's website, which is acceptable in some respects, but when Skol fir included a link to a Channer interview and the interview didn't corroborate the claims, that doesn't pass muster, IMO. Where in the interview is it confirmed that the subject received a BA in Photography? I went to the college website and can't even find a BA in photography.
Not that it matters.
Claiming a BA and referencing a third party source that doesn't even mention it is not adequate sourcing. Where did this BA come from? Any reliable source to confirm that? If her own website is adequate, she might as well claim a PhD in Marine Science.
Also, I ask anyone who's reading this to watch the interview with Channer and chime in if this interview is at all impartial. Regatta dog ( talk) 02:48, 7 January 2012 (UTC)— Regatta dog ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Aloha27, it appears that Banaticus has provided that extra voice, to make it 3 against 1. This merge discussion has been going on long enough (over one month) and as the original creator of this article, I will gladly help you make the proper merge into Reid Stowe according to WP:MERGETEXT. I propose that we do a Full-content paste merger to allow the History and Talk Page to be preserved for this article. If you want, I can do the "merge" into a new section at Reid Stowe. After that, any editors can suggest changes to be made to that section to improve it.
Let me know what you think. -- Skol fir ( talk) 17:57, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Actually, that's what I was going to suggest as well with the senior Wikipedians and adms performing most of the heavy lifting. I'm not even sure at the moment just where the merged article should fit. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 22:43, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
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This redirect does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||
|
Text and/or other creative content from Soanya Ahmad was copied or moved into Reid Stowe with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
This article was previously deleted after consensus in 2007. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Soanya_Ahmad Perhaps merging it with Reid Stowe may be better than deletion? Aloha27 ( talk) 14:29, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Jac 1688 - This article is very poorly sourced. If one were to delete the content that is not sourced at all, the content that is sourced to the subject herself, and the content that is sourced to a blog -- there wouldn't be an article. Also, how is a sailing trip to Guyana noteworthy? For that matter, how is the article itself noteworthy when the only significant claim is a world record that has not been confirmed by any major organization, such as Guinness? Regatta dog ( talk) 15:37, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Trip to Guyana -- A simple trip to Guyana is very insignificant. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia - It should not be used as a personal travel blog or Twitter feed. Do we create an article for every person who sails from the US to South America? Or do we update any boater's article whenever they leave the dock. This is silly, IMO. I would like to get some input on these topics from Skol Fir. Regatta dog ( talk) 19:04, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
The following is a direct quote from the WSSRC website: (Underlines mine) Note that we have a policy of not ratifying "youngest/oldest etc" claims or attempts and our rules do not include such categories. We concentrate on speed record attempts and claims, and no longer recognise "human condition" categories which can expand to such an extent that almost anyone would be able to claim a record of some sort. The other issue is that whilst we can clearly monitor and ratify "speed/time" records - at which we have become rather expert - the verification of age/ disability/marital status etc is a less exact science. Here is the link to the existing "records of other kinds" page: http://www.sailspeedrecords.com/other-kinds-of-sailing-records.html Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 06:40, 22 December 2011 (UTC)
Let's do this logically, without taking sides for the moment.
I am not actually sure who keeps the "Longest Time at Sea" record, since the WSSRC doesn't want to touch it with a ten-foot pole! What I do know is that at least two reputable sources state that Cottee set that record for a single-handed woman sailor ::
For a male sailor, the "Longest series -- non stop, singlehanded circumnavigations" was done by "Jon Sanders, AUS; 1986-1988; 3 continuous circumnavigations one westabout, two eastabout, 657 days" -- taken from the Other Kinds of Sailing Records at the WSSRC. That record does not specifically dwell on the time it took, but more on the number of circumnavigations, and the fact that they were all in a continuous series -- impressive, indeed!
So, the question remains -- Who invented the record "longest time at sea"? We know it was there before Reid Stowe and Soanya Ahmad came on the scene, because Cottee supposedly holds that record for a single-handed sailor (woman) since 1988. It was never recognized by Guinness BOR, as they only gave Sanders the "longest distance ever sailed continuously by any vessel (71,023 nautical miles)."
As we don't know who actually recognizes such a record, it remains contestable, but so far no one has provided solid evidence to refute it. However, assuming that we accept the GPS tracking as proof that Soanya did not leap off the schooner at any time during the 306 days, I don't see why she cannot say that she is probably the woman with the longest continuous time at sea, since women stepped foot on sea-going vessels. We don't need to call it a record, just an accomplishment. If you don't think that warrants a separate article for her, so be it. -- Skol fir ( talk) 03:08, 23 December 2011 (UTC)
I think you're twisting the facts here. Cottee was a solo sailor with a circumnavigation that took 189 days. The record stands to this day because it was the FIRST solo circumnavigation of the globe by a woman. Conversely Ahmad, in her own words "preferred to stay below", and rarely, (if ever) took an active part in actually sailing the vessel. Since Ahmad IMO is a classic case of WP:BLP1E, merge the article with Stowe's and be done with it. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 06:24, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
The logistics and endurance "feat" isn't a factor here and is the reason WSSRC tightened their rules for record-setting attempts. As for me setting out to "cruise" for an extended period of time, that isn't an option at the moment as I am employed. We'll see what happens in a couple of years after I retire. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't require assistance because I became pregnant though. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 00:05, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
On February 22, 2008 Soanya achieved a world record for the longest time that any woman has remained at sea, with a time of 306 days spent on board the schooner Anne, together with Reid Stowe. [1] She was brought ashore by members of the Royal Perth Yacht Club off Rottnest Island, near Perth, Western Australia. [2] [3] The entire route of the schooner Anne was verified daily by GPS tracking, and the manufacturer of the equipment has made the database available online. [4]
Weak. Really Weak. Since you have no intention or are unable to state unequivocally who held the previous record for longest time spent at sea (non-solo), we must assume that no record existed prior to Ahmad's claim? I have no problem with the 306 days claimed. Never have. But IS it the record time for a woman to be at sea? You don't know. I don't know. Nobody does. Since women have been sailing for the past 250+ years I can safely say that it is truly doubtful. Why? Glad you asked.
Women have been Captains of pirate ships, disguised themselves as male crewmembers, accompanied their mariner husbands aboard ship. Women are crewmembers aboard nuclear submarines, spending up to a year (or more) patrolling the world's oceans without ever making port. So, if Ahmad wishes to claim a record, so be it. BUT, you cannot sit there and attempt to tell us that suddenly... BAM! 306 days is the magic number.
As far as WP:BLP1E goes, you conveniently neglected the main issue. I quote: " People notable for only one event Main pages: WP:BLP1E and WP:BIO1E People known only in connection with one event should generally not have an article written about them. If the event is notable, then an article usually should be written about the event instead."
Therefore, merge the article with "1000 days" and be done with it. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 18:02, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
(I hate to have to fire a Harpoon missle at a US military reference website, but it is outdated by a year and requires updating.)
So as not to be accused as being underhanded and sneaky, the above was written by me. Forgot to log on. Sorry Regatta dog ( talk) 15:42, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
EARLY LIFE - The section was from the subject's website, which is acceptable in some respects, but when Skol fir included a link to a Channer interview and the interview didn't corroborate the claims, that doesn't pass muster, IMO. Where in the interview is it confirmed that the subject received a BA in Photography? I went to the college website and can't even find a BA in photography.
Not that it matters.
Claiming a BA and referencing a third party source that doesn't even mention it is not adequate sourcing. Where did this BA come from? Any reliable source to confirm that? If her own website is adequate, she might as well claim a PhD in Marine Science.
Also, I ask anyone who's reading this to watch the interview with Channer and chime in if this interview is at all impartial. Regatta dog ( talk) 02:48, 7 January 2012 (UTC)— Regatta dog ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Aloha27, it appears that Banaticus has provided that extra voice, to make it 3 against 1. This merge discussion has been going on long enough (over one month) and as the original creator of this article, I will gladly help you make the proper merge into Reid Stowe according to WP:MERGETEXT. I propose that we do a Full-content paste merger to allow the History and Talk Page to be preserved for this article. If you want, I can do the "merge" into a new section at Reid Stowe. After that, any editors can suggest changes to be made to that section to improve it.
Let me know what you think. -- Skol fir ( talk) 17:57, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Actually, that's what I was going to suggest as well with the senior Wikipedians and adms performing most of the heavy lifting. I'm not even sure at the moment just where the merged article should fit. Regards Aloha27 ( talk) 22:43, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
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