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Aout a year ago some wise guys decided to merge "smetana" into Sour cream. Obviously, they screwed something up, so that the old history landed here:
which I am placing it here, in compliance with GFDL rules. mikka (t) 05:08, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
Is "smetana cream" a proper name for this article? Presumably it should be just "smetana", but that is already a disamb for the composer and other things. Perhaps this article should be moved to
smetana (cream) — or, better, to
smetana (food)?
Jorge Stolfi
01:11, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
I propose to move it as per Ghirla. If no one objects, let's move. -- Irpen 05:12, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
As far as I know, at least in Czech 'smetana' means just cream, 'sour cream' is called 'kysaná smetana' Plch 18:32, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
Though smetana is written "сметана" in both Russian and Ukrainian languages, the pronunciation of it differs slightly. In Ukrainian it is [smɛ`ta:na], while in Russian it is [smjɛ`ta:na].
Also, whilst both in Russian сметана and in Ukrainian сметана, second syllable is stressed, it may not be so in other languages. As far as I know, in Czech language, the first syllable is stressed as a rule. So the Czech name must be pronounced probably [`smɛtana]. Still, my native language is Ukrainian, not Czech :) so I welcome the Czech speakers to say their word here ( Flying Fish 09:49, 16 May 2006 (UTC))
If someone has time, please use this page as source: http://www.dlc.fi/~marianna/gourmet/i_milk.htm
Should not the composer be the main entry? I think the anglophone user entering this word is more likely to be looking for a composer, who is pretty famous, than for the sour-cream.I suggest:
Objections? -- Irpen 05:28, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
What are the cows doing in Eastern Europe, that they are failing to do in the rest of the world?
Well, milk. The cows doesn't give sour cream.
It’s the people who do the milk products. And the article is not only for the loved memory of our grandmothers.,
There are still living people in Europe. And Russians who are probably passionate about this stuff.
Warrington (
talk)
17:15, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Someone lef this anonymously on the article page:
The substance of this objection has been raised before, and still needs to be dealt with. Kevlar67 03:13, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
The Serbian/Bosnian terms need to be looked into too. For Serbian, 'mileram' is given, but this is a different product, there is a product called 'pavlaka' in Serbian, with acidic and non-acid ('sweet') forms, so it's not clear why 'mileram' was listed. Pavlaka is the same thing in 'Bosnian' and Serbian, too, so again, not clear. 109.245.44.64 ( talk) 05:19, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I have a question about smetana in its various forms and incarnations. I'd like to know whether or not a bacterial starter (culture) is added to the cream in any of the regions where it is made and eaten. Is it cultured, like American sour cream - or just a naturally soured cream product, like creme fraiche? It seems like this information would be relevant to the entry. Thanks. KateH 13:10, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
This article is a joke. As several people pointed out smetana = cream. Any Czech dictionary will support this fact. I especially like the way "Croatian vrhnje" just links to the page for cream. Haha. Unless someone can provide a reference to show that any of the slavic terms mean something other than just cream, I propose that this page be removed. That also neatly solves any conflict with the composer.
The Oxford English Dictionary defines smetana as "sour cream" (with a Russian etymology) so perhaps the article should be merged back into sour cream. However, it's only sour cream when used in English. The same word in Czech = cream. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.232.105.62 ( talk) 04:05, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
I can assure you, this article is NOT a joke, in English this is the name of this product. It is a Russian loanword in English, like Samovar or Sputnik program. Than the word is the same for this dairy product in the Finnish, Russian, Belarusian and Ukrainian languages, but not the Czech, and this make Czech people confused and upset.
“smetana = cream. In Czech. Any Czech dictionary will support this fact”.
Yes, but this is the English Wikipedia. The Oxford English Dictionary is probably not familiar with the Czech cooking habits. And this is a different type of sour cream. This is the meaning of the article, to point out the differences. It is like the difference between Strained yoghurt (or Greek yoghurt) and Yoghurt, if you would have use them both, you would understand the difference. However, the Czech sour cream seems to be an exeption, more like Crème fraîche. And "Croatian vrhnje" should be written kiselo vrhnje. Warrington ( talk) 12:43, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Lol, is really our śmietana/smetana (or however called) something different than Western/American cream? I'd never have come across such a thought. -- Elvus ( talk) 14:58, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
Russian term for cream is SLIVKI and smetana is in Russia considered as something different. In Czech or Slovak each similar product is smetana/ smotana I can enumarate several examples of product that are in Slovakia considered as specific product and in english just like subcategory of some product.
One more complicated example. Italian Ricotta has independent article, but is defined practically as sort of cheese. In Slovak exist similar product named Tvaroh (also in my dictionary Tvaroh is Ricotta in Italiano), but many people do not accept these products as this same. In my opinion it so similar that it can be accepted as same product. There are a lot of sort of Tvaroh and Ricotta, and many times difference between two Ricotta products is much significant as between Ricotta and Tvaroh. In Hungary exist TURO and it is in Slovakia accepted as equivalent of Tvaroh, however, they are maybe more significant difference in taste between TURO and Tvaroh as between Tvaroh and Ricotta. Anyhow, if loanword Smetana exists in English then article should not be merged, but content should be prepared in this content. So in definition stated that it is Russion (and not slavic) loanword. Translation to czech and other languages have to be deleted (because smetana = cream = slivki), etc. -- 212.5.210.202 ( talk) 12:49, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
Should we really have to include a list of names for "Cream" in other languages? I mean the article for "Dog" isn't going to list 101 names for Dogs in other languages. . . . . Biocrite ( talk) 01:00, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
![]() | The contents of the Smântână page were merged into Smetana (dairy product). For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Aout a year ago some wise guys decided to merge "smetana" into Sour cream. Obviously, they screwed something up, so that the old history landed here:
which I am placing it here, in compliance with GFDL rules. mikka (t) 05:08, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
Is "smetana cream" a proper name for this article? Presumably it should be just "smetana", but that is already a disamb for the composer and other things. Perhaps this article should be moved to
smetana (cream) — or, better, to
smetana (food)?
Jorge Stolfi
01:11, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
I propose to move it as per Ghirla. If no one objects, let's move. -- Irpen 05:12, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
As far as I know, at least in Czech 'smetana' means just cream, 'sour cream' is called 'kysaná smetana' Plch 18:32, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
Though smetana is written "сметана" in both Russian and Ukrainian languages, the pronunciation of it differs slightly. In Ukrainian it is [smɛ`ta:na], while in Russian it is [smjɛ`ta:na].
Also, whilst both in Russian сметана and in Ukrainian сметана, second syllable is stressed, it may not be so in other languages. As far as I know, in Czech language, the first syllable is stressed as a rule. So the Czech name must be pronounced probably [`smɛtana]. Still, my native language is Ukrainian, not Czech :) so I welcome the Czech speakers to say their word here ( Flying Fish 09:49, 16 May 2006 (UTC))
If someone has time, please use this page as source: http://www.dlc.fi/~marianna/gourmet/i_milk.htm
Should not the composer be the main entry? I think the anglophone user entering this word is more likely to be looking for a composer, who is pretty famous, than for the sour-cream.I suggest:
Objections? -- Irpen 05:28, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
What are the cows doing in Eastern Europe, that they are failing to do in the rest of the world?
Well, milk. The cows doesn't give sour cream.
It’s the people who do the milk products. And the article is not only for the loved memory of our grandmothers.,
There are still living people in Europe. And Russians who are probably passionate about this stuff.
Warrington (
talk)
17:15, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Someone lef this anonymously on the article page:
The substance of this objection has been raised before, and still needs to be dealt with. Kevlar67 03:13, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
The Serbian/Bosnian terms need to be looked into too. For Serbian, 'mileram' is given, but this is a different product, there is a product called 'pavlaka' in Serbian, with acidic and non-acid ('sweet') forms, so it's not clear why 'mileram' was listed. Pavlaka is the same thing in 'Bosnian' and Serbian, too, so again, not clear. 109.245.44.64 ( talk) 05:19, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I have a question about smetana in its various forms and incarnations. I'd like to know whether or not a bacterial starter (culture) is added to the cream in any of the regions where it is made and eaten. Is it cultured, like American sour cream - or just a naturally soured cream product, like creme fraiche? It seems like this information would be relevant to the entry. Thanks. KateH 13:10, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
This article is a joke. As several people pointed out smetana = cream. Any Czech dictionary will support this fact. I especially like the way "Croatian vrhnje" just links to the page for cream. Haha. Unless someone can provide a reference to show that any of the slavic terms mean something other than just cream, I propose that this page be removed. That also neatly solves any conflict with the composer.
The Oxford English Dictionary defines smetana as "sour cream" (with a Russian etymology) so perhaps the article should be merged back into sour cream. However, it's only sour cream when used in English. The same word in Czech = cream. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.232.105.62 ( talk) 04:05, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
I can assure you, this article is NOT a joke, in English this is the name of this product. It is a Russian loanword in English, like Samovar or Sputnik program. Than the word is the same for this dairy product in the Finnish, Russian, Belarusian and Ukrainian languages, but not the Czech, and this make Czech people confused and upset.
“smetana = cream. In Czech. Any Czech dictionary will support this fact”.
Yes, but this is the English Wikipedia. The Oxford English Dictionary is probably not familiar with the Czech cooking habits. And this is a different type of sour cream. This is the meaning of the article, to point out the differences. It is like the difference between Strained yoghurt (or Greek yoghurt) and Yoghurt, if you would have use them both, you would understand the difference. However, the Czech sour cream seems to be an exeption, more like Crème fraîche. And "Croatian vrhnje" should be written kiselo vrhnje. Warrington ( talk) 12:43, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Lol, is really our śmietana/smetana (or however called) something different than Western/American cream? I'd never have come across such a thought. -- Elvus ( talk) 14:58, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
Russian term for cream is SLIVKI and smetana is in Russia considered as something different. In Czech or Slovak each similar product is smetana/ smotana I can enumarate several examples of product that are in Slovakia considered as specific product and in english just like subcategory of some product.
One more complicated example. Italian Ricotta has independent article, but is defined practically as sort of cheese. In Slovak exist similar product named Tvaroh (also in my dictionary Tvaroh is Ricotta in Italiano), but many people do not accept these products as this same. In my opinion it so similar that it can be accepted as same product. There are a lot of sort of Tvaroh and Ricotta, and many times difference between two Ricotta products is much significant as between Ricotta and Tvaroh. In Hungary exist TURO and it is in Slovakia accepted as equivalent of Tvaroh, however, they are maybe more significant difference in taste between TURO and Tvaroh as between Tvaroh and Ricotta. Anyhow, if loanword Smetana exists in English then article should not be merged, but content should be prepared in this content. So in definition stated that it is Russion (and not slavic) loanword. Translation to czech and other languages have to be deleted (because smetana = cream = slivki), etc. -- 212.5.210.202 ( talk) 12:49, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
Should we really have to include a list of names for "Cream" in other languages? I mean the article for "Dog" isn't going to list 101 names for Dogs in other languages. . . . . Biocrite ( talk) 01:00, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
![]() | The contents of the Smântână page were merged into Smetana (dairy product). For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |