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What laws does the Welsh Assembly have the power to pass, and has it passed any of signficance? Are they codified somewhere online? -- Beland 23:49, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
Surely the Welsh flag is more appropriate in this context Lumos3 09:21, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Presumably the UK flag is used because, as it says in the caption, this article is part of the series Politics of the United Kingdom and the flag is associated with the series and not the Welsh Assembly. If it offends your sensibilities why don't you add a Welsh Flag? -- Alun 16:02, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I think that this statement:
This is largely because, unlike other parts of the United Kingdom, Wales has always had the same legal and administrative system as England.
is not only totally incorrect, but displays ignorance about Welsh history. Wales was only annexed in 1536, but even after that was administered somewhat differently to England in many cases (education for example). This is documented well in A History of Wales by John Davies (
ISBN
0140145818). Unfortunately my brother has my copy so I can't check the details. I'm going to modify this.
Alun
17:46, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
Can we get a picture of the debating chamber?
I have changed some articles that declare the First Minister as " Assembly First Minister" when really he is now "Welsh First Minister". When the Welsh Assembly Government was set-up in 2000, The First Minister declared that him and the Cabinet are separate of the Assembly, but are elected and answerable to the Assembly. This article has noted right by saying "First Minister and his Cabinet comprises of Welsh Assembly Government". Most articles on this Wikipedia are based on the period between 1999 and 2000. I am interested in other people comments about this.
Draig goch20 19:36, August 13, 2005 (UTC)
The Assembly [...] will have a new, high-end assembly chamber
Can anyone explain what this means exactly? And which end of the chamber will be high? -- Picapica 09:24, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Please refrain from using
weasel words, if you have a point, use references to back it up. Weasel words don't really give a neutral point of view; they just spread hearsay, or couch personal opinion in vague, indirect syntax. It is better to put a name and a face on an opinion than to assign an opinion to an anonymous source.
Many cite the fact that it is majoritively the English taxpayer propping up the Welsh Assembly and paying the salaries of those whom work there.... Another argument cites the Act of Union 1707. This Act states that there shall be one parliament for the United Kingdom. The current Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly are contended have the powers of separate parliaments, and are therefore said to be breaking the Act of Union....establishing of the Welsh Assembly is also be viewed(sic) as federalisation, such as in the European Union, which many in the mainly centralised United Kingdom are opposed to.
Alun
17:50, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
This section has remained largely unverified for some time now. I am wondering what purpose it serves to maintain information here that breaches the verifiability policy. The original editor(s) have not seen fit to provide supporting material, and much of it seems to be waffle anyway. Alun 16:26, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
I have placed the History section at the start of the article and have split the Richard Commission content into a new section. I think the sections are now a bit more chronological in order. I have also been looking to try to verify some of the info here. I'll continue to tinker with the article and look for more references. Hope this looks OK. Alun 18:00, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
I have heard that at the official opening ceremony the name of the assembly will be translated into Senedd, rather then Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru. Technically the former translates to an independent national Senate on par with with a parliament or congress, and the latter is the technically correct translation for assembly. The Dragon's Eye reports that Queen Elizabeth may refer to it as the Senedd in her speech. Any comments on this? Drachenfyre 19:59, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes, this is correct. The institution is called the Assembly or y Cynulliad depending on language. "y senedd" refers only to the building. They were the Assembly in the old building and continue to be in the new, but only their NEW home in Cardiff Bay is called the senedd. Esquimo 00:38, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
Who the hell made this comment? The Assembly has no power over UK Governments depts in Wales. The Assembly only has power over it's own depts. Someone has purposely put the wrong facts in here. The UK Government controls it's own depts in Wales and the Assembly controls it's own under what powers it's got. Seriously, this part of the article surely is wrong.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.11.221.164 ( talk • contribs)
Amlder20 14:40, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Amlder20 12:15, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
I have changed NAW to NAfW. Google's first reference to the Assembly under NAW is result 9, whereas for NAfW, not only is one of the top results from a local authority ( Carmarthenshire County Council), but its first alternative suggested search is "national assembly for wales". More importantly, having worked in both local and central government, as well as with NAfW bodies themselves, the dominant abbreviation in official use is without any doubt NAfW. Didn't come across NAW even once in official documents during that time. 18:06, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
DO we really need this map? It is an odd map, the referendum was held accross Wales, the verdict was not decided by winning unitary authorities, but by winning a majority accross the whole country. This map appears to indicated that certain authorities voted yes and others no and that this is somehow relevant to the outcome of the election. It is supremely misleading. It would be better to show the Yes/No split within the authorities by shading, like this map of the 2004 US presidential election, that shows that most states are purple, ie there are Democrat (red) and Republican (blue) voters in all states. Someone fancy a crack at this? If I had the foggiest how to do it I would do it myself. Alun 17:25, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
It is important to note that the campaign to secure a 'yes' vote in the 1997 referendum was won by cross-party support (except the Conservatives) AND by the mobilisation of what is best described as Welsh civic society. Without the support of the Trade Unions, the Church and others it is unlikely that Wales would have voted yes. I am therefore including this observation in the article. Am happy to discuss that edit on this page. Normalmouth 20:40, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Even if there is a press citation, wouldn't the information at Basque Parliament (40 women/35 men) negate the assertion about a majority of female members? Crunk 02:39, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
The electoral system used for the assembly does not produce overall proportionality. See Welsh Assembly election, 2003, where Labour got 40% of votes, but 48% of the seats, Plaid got 21% of the vote and 20% of the seats, Tories 19.9% of the vote and 18.3% of the seats, Lib-Dems 14% of votes and 10% of the seats. Labour still takes a lot more seats than it should, a little form Plaid, a little from the Tories and a lot from the Lib-Dems. In a proportional system Labour would have got 24 seats (they got 29), Plaid 13 (12), Tories 12 (11), Lib-Dem 9 (6), UKIP 1 (0). This comes to 59, discrepancies like this are usually overcome depending on the electoral system used. The most proportional systems are Single Transferable Vote (disputed), Open list and of course the AMS if the number of top up seats were larger, especially if they were on a national level, I think a 50:50 chamber would produce proportionality. Alun 06:10, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
The list system does not correct the overall representation for each region towards proportionality. The proportions for the parties on the list elections can be (and are often) different to the parties proportions for the FPTP part of the election. So the list element does not produce the same proportionality of vote as the FPTP system, this is evidenced by the Labour Party gaining a significantly reduced share of the vote on the regional list part of the ballot compared with their proportion of the vote in the FPTP element of the election in 2003. Indeed the list element is parallel as it is in effect a separate election as any voter can vote for any party's list irrespective of their vote in the FPTP part of the election. So effectively they are separate elections. In theory a party could achieve a much larger share of the list vote than of the FPTP vote and gain seats from the list system even without putting candidates up for the FPTP election. Any proportionality achieved is based exclusively on the proportion of votes a party achieves in the list election. I do not understand what you mean when you write you keep removing wording that makes it clear that it isn't. The regional list elections are independent of the FPTP elections, but the proportion of representatives elected from a list is not independent of the number of directly elected AMs. I think we need to come to a form of words upon which we can both agree. The current form of words is:
How about this:
I will not amend the text in the article until we come to I have amended the text and hope I have produced a form of words we can both live with. Let's not edit war, if you are unhappy with this form of words then let's discuss it here untill we are both happy. It may mean that we need to go into a bit more detail about the electoral system used, but this may be a good thing. Comments are appreciated. I have used a BBC site as a reference for the changes I have made.
[1]
Alun
06:11, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
I have moved this information to the Electoral system section. Alun 11:35, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
I note use in the article of a link to " Additional Member System". I believe that although the system for elections to the Welsh Assembly is called an additional member system in relevant legislation, additional member systems generally are not necessarily designed to produce anything like PR. Linking to " Mixed member proportional representation" might be better, perhaps using " Additional member system (Welsh Assembly)" (a potential article site?) as a redirect. Laurel Bush 18:56, 31 October 2006 (UTC).
The more I think about it the more I feel it would be a good idea to have an article specifically about the system used in elections to the Welsh Assembly or, perhaps, one about the different systems used in Wales or throughout the United Kingdom. Laurel Bush 10:12, 1 November 2006 (UTC).
I am wondering when constituency boundary changes will come into effect for Assembly elections. Before or after they come into effect for Westminster elections? Laurel Bush 12:11, 2 November 2006 (UTC).
Once the GOWA 2006 is in force, Wales will have a totally different type of Assembly from the 1999-2007 Assembly. It's important to ensure that worldwide, people know the changes and the difference in the GOWA 1998 and the GOWA 2006. Amlder20 17:17, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
The Orders-In-Council are the only peices of legislation that will be approved by both houses of parliament, the Assembly and the Secretary of state for Wales. "although Assembly laws will be subject to the veto of the UK Secretary of State for Wales, House of Commons or House of Lords" has been changed to "although Assembly Order-in-Council laws will be subject to the veto of the UK Secretary of State for Wales, House of Commons or House of Lords. " so that people will know what laws will be passed by both Parliament and the Assembly and whats passed by the Assembly alone. The Assembly Measures are passed by the Welsh assembly only, and only needs parliaments approval if they are seeking to legislate on a "matter" that the Assembly has no power over, someone needs to read the act properly. Amlder20 21:24, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
The summary table for the 2003 election results in this article don't match those in National Assembly for Wales election, 2003, the latter being (I think) the correct figures. Can anyone double check? Bondegezou 11:28, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
After tinkering a bit, i decided to do a bit of a re-write, starting with the opening paragraph. What does everybody think so far? I'm using as a mode the article about the Scottish Parliament, which is really very well written and structured. I think with a bit of effort we could get this artile up to a similar standard. Mathsguy 18:18, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
So what ARE the devolved areas of legislation?! MikkoAN1 14:56, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
I have removed the links to around 5 Assembly Member blogs/websites. There is insufficient room to list all AM websites and, in any case, each AM has a Wikipedia article with a link to their personal blogs. -- Darren Wyn Rees 10:16, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
Are statements in the chamber of the NAW protected by Parliamentary Privilege like the Houses of Parliament? Richard Gadsden 14:46, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
In light of the existence of Template:Infobox Legislature, is the special box really necessary? The Legislature infobox is standard across all other legislative chambers (including Parliament of the United Kingdom and its houses, as well as the legislatures of various national subdivisions, e.g. Northern Ireland Assembly), has greater flexibility (should the structure of the Parliament change significantly), and otherwise renders the National Assembly for Wales infobox redundant.
So you know what it would look like, here's the Legislature infobox for the Scottish Parliament:
National Assembly for Wales Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru | |
---|---|
3rd Assembly | |
Type | |
Type | |
Leadership | |
Claire Clancy since February 2007 | |
Structure | |
Seats | 60 |
Political groups |
|
Committees |
|
Elections | |
Last election | 3 May 2007 |
Meeting place | |
Senedd, Cardiff | |
Website | |
www.assemblywales.org |
Thanks for considering! Lockesdonkey ( talk) 20:50, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
I have made a change to a political grouping within the new, improved, infobox. I changed Welsh Labour to Labour Party. It is noted on the Welsh Labour page that "Welsh Labour is formally part of the Labour Party - it is not separately registered [1] with the Electoral Commission under the terms of the Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act." Consequently, electors voted for a candidate for the Labour Party and not Welsh Labour or the Welsh Labour Party. Yours, Daicaregos ( talk) 11:41, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
A change has been made to the Party table in the Elections section - from Labour Party (UK) to Welsh Labour. Each of the Labour AMs is a member of the Labour Party. Each stood in their constituency representing the Labour Party. Each was elected as the Labour Party Assembly Member for their constituency. And most will be standing again in their constituency next month for election to the National Assembly as the Labour Party candidate. Consequently, unless and until the Labour candidates stand as Welsh Labour representitives, their political party should be noted as Labour. I have reverted the change. Daicaregos ( talk) 08:50, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
References
The powers explanation needs updating. There is reference to schedule 7 but it still mentions LCOs and Measures which are no longer relevant. Perhaps also the devolved area list could go higher up in the Powers and Status section as there is a discussion of tax powers etc before we even know broadly what the devolved areas are.
I also think that this article can be a bit misleading as it says in the second paragraph at the top tht that after the 2011 referendum Parliament no longer needs to be consulted. It is correct that Parliament doesn't need to be consuled in the 20 devolved areas but, even pre-May 2011, Parliament never needed to be consulted where powers were devolved. It only needed needed to be consulted for new powers instered by LCOs. There's a similar error at the end of the Powers and Status paragraph. Seeing as there is so much confusion about NAfW powers it would be great if we could get a really comprehensive page for people to refer to. I am willing to make the small chnges I have suggested unless anyone has any objections? Tralban ( talk) 13:26, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm curious about this. As far as I understand, the Welsh language is put on equal footing with English in many respects; and is used at some ceremonial instances. However, I do not understand whether English is the only practically used working language, with a little Welsh as a kind of adornment, or the rôles of the languages are on a more equal footing. Concretely:
I suspect that other readers than I also would be interested in such data. If there is some reliable source providing answers, I think that these should be added to the article, e.g., under a heading named something like The Assembly working mode. (This section also could cover some other information, like how many days a year the Assembly meets in plenum, and what kinds of permanent or temporary committees are formed by the members.) JoergenB ( talk) 19:47, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Changes to the Ieuan Wyn Jones' position in the Assembly are a bit previous. According to the BBC, he “... is to stand down from his Ynys Mon seat.” He has not done so yet. According to Betsan Powys “He'll start his new job in July but won't stand down as an Assembly member until his successor is elected.” The recent change has been reverted. Daicaregos ( talk) 15:23, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
Is there any scolarly discourse on the nature of the Assembly. Very much conceived as a "(West) German" and not a "Westminster" Model legislature.
Don't think it is so distinctive to be "sui generis" really but still it lacks an important feature of the West German model- the constructive vote of no confidence, (as the Alun Michael to Rhodri Morgan transistion showed). Otherwise though has lots of West German elements, the electoral system, emphasis on committees, consensual style. But there must be some scholarly analysis by now? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.99.121.229 ( talk) 23:00, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
The Wales Act 2014 is now law - this article will need some considerable updating as a result. Argovian ( talk) 18:19, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Dafydd El is noted in the Infobox as a member of the Government. Although the reference cited says 'that he will be supporting the Welsh Government', it also says 'He sits as an independent AM'. That doesn't sound to me that he is a member of the Government. Nor does it sound as if he will be providing much opposition, so he doesn't belong there either. I propose he be put in a section by himself, 'Other: Independent' perhaps. Thoughts? Daicaregos ( talk) 16:01, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
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Hi,
The diagram & caption at the top of the page contradict the breakdown below it, it shows two UKIP seats instead of one and an Independent. Not sure how to fix but just wanted to point this out
Muffington ( talk) 08:58, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
The formal legislation on same has now been published - appears that Senedd would be official in both Welsh and English, but that referral to the body as the Welsh Parliament will also permitted - https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/17426417.plans-to-lower-voting-age-in-welsh-elections-to-16-and-change-assemblys-name-officially-unveiled/ Culloty82 ( talk) 14:18, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No clear consensus for Senedd or Senedd Cymru; not moved to Welsh Parliament; interim move to Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament; review in at least three months This is a complicated situation due to several factors. There is overwhelming consensus that the article should not be at " National Assembly for Wales" as an outdated title. There is less consensus on the exact destination. There are a number of statements about what the common name is expected to be but not what it actually is.
The term "Senedd" has clearly become a common name in English for the building and has been a metonym for the institution even prior to the formal name change but this does not directly mean it has automatically become the common name for the institution post the name change. Out of the various contributions there's strong support for including "Senedd" in the article title but not a clear consensus to use either "Senedd" or "Senedd Cymru" on its own; there is also a sizeable element for including "Welsh Parliament" either alone or in the full bilingual name.
Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament covers all bases and has strong support as a secondary and/or interim option pending time to see which name emerges as the actual WP:COMMONNAME. For now it is the nearest to a consensus outcome. Timrollpickering ( talk) 12:27, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
Senedd Cymru →
Senedd –
Third stage in the bold–revert–discuss cycle; I reverted
Llew Mawr's redirection of the
Senedd (
|
talk |
history |
protect |
delete |
links |
watch |
logs |
views) disambiguation for further discussion. The question is basically: is the parliament the primary topic – and thus should be at
Senedd with a hatnote for
Senedd building per
WP:ONEOTHER – or is there
no primary topic, and should the page at Senedd be a disambiguation page? My own thoughts are that the parliament is indeed the primary topic — but I'm not fully convinced yet — and, for the reasons I made at
Talk:Senedd building#Requested move 5 December 2019, "Senedd" is already the common name in English sources, so in the context of a move discussion, I would support a move to Senedd.
Sceptre (
talk)
11:49, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
References
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
Seneddfor the rest of the article. Other sources refer to it as Senedd including Wales Online and ITV News. If the common name changes in the future the article can be moved again. Ralbegen ( talk) 10:47, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
"The Senedd is not just a building for Members, it is your building. It is the main public building of the Welsh Parliament, the main centre for democracy and devolution in Wales." from https://senedd.wales/en/visiting/senedd/Pages/senedd.aspx
References
I find the phrase "commonly referred to as the Senedd" odd, considering that "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament", has only been in existence since 6 May 2020. Before that date, it was only the building that was known as the Senedd. The "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" was previously commonly known simply as "the Assembly". In my view, this is the Welsh Parliament trying to get the public to call it "the Senedd", when there is no "commonly known name" at all. I accept "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" as the article name, no problems with that, but to go onto say that it is "commonly referred to as the Senedd", is just nonsense. SethWhales talk 23:57, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
I disagree with the statement "its primary law-making powers were enhanced in the Wales Act 2017 following a Yes vote in the referendum on 3 March 2011" on the article. It implies that 2011 referendum was implemented by the Wales Act 2017 - which isn't the case.
The 2011 Welsh devolution referendum page states: "regulations for the referendum, and the powers to be approved or rejected by it, were provided for in the Government of Wales Act 2006."
As a result, there was no Act needed by the UK Parliament after the referendum to enact what the people voted for. As mentioned above, this was provided by the Government of Wales Act 2006.
The Wales Act 2017 page states "the legislation is based on the proposals of the St David's Day Agreement which were not included in the Wales Act 2014." There is no mention of it being a result of the referendum that was held six years before it.
Lighthouse3050 ( talk) 20:21, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
My proposal: "Its primary law-making powers were enhanced following a Yes vote in the referendum on 3 March 2011, meaning that the UK Parliament or the Secretary of State for Wales were no longer consulted when passing acts of the National Assembly for Wales related to the 20 devolved areas.[10]. These powers were further extended by the Wales Act 2014 and Wales Act 2017." Lighthouse3050 ( talk) 09:32, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
Abolish the Welsh Assembly now has two members, following the affiliation of Mark Reckless, so adjust the infobox accordingly. [1] Culloty82 ( talk) 12:22, 16 October 2020 (UTC)
I corrected the table which references the 1st, 2nd, etc Assembly/Senedd. The text said Assembly/Parliament, but the English is either Assembly (pre-name change) or Senedd - parliament is confusing and not common use. And yet my change was reversed with a WP:MOS added. This is backed up in the Media: https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/2021-senedd-elections-could-be-postponed-if-theres-another-surge-in-coronavirus-cases-says-first-minister-mark-drakeford/ar-BB1b8lvo or https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/local-news/how-2021-senedd-elections-made-19298678; by the Independent Remuneration Board: https://senedd.wales/en/newhome/pages/newsitem.aspx?itemid=2100; the Scottish parliament: https://external.parliament.scot/parliamentarybusiness/report.aspx?r=12944&i=116989&c=2295030; the Senedd itself: https://senedd.wales/en/bus-home/bus-legislation/Pages/bus-legislation.aspx.
I'd like to undo the undo and change it back to Assembly/Senedd. Does anyone object? Cymro ( talk) 09:40, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
As of the 31st December 2020, the Abolish the Welsh Assembly Party is not registered with the Electoral Commission. As a result of this, the party's two Members of the Senedd - Gareth Bennett and Mark Reckless currently sit as independents. I tried to edit this but every time it wouldn't work so would someone else mind having a go? Thank you very much!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freddiewhite1234 ( talk • contribs) 12:38, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
References
Senedd Cymru-Welsh Parliament - Senedd At the time of the official name change six months ago, I supported a bilingual title as an interim move until a media consensus on the WP:COMMONNAME emerged. Now, however, the Senedd seems to have been widely adopted by the Welsh media, including BBC Wales [1], ITV Wales [2] and Wales Online [3]. A disambiguation page would be required to distinguish the parliamentary body from the physical building, but "Senedd" now appears the common term used for both. Culloty82 ( talk) 12:50, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
References
most common in the English languageso I do not feel that our entire decision should be based upon local media (though that should count too). ~ El D. ( talk to me) 10:48, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Consensus to move to Senedd as the most commonly used name in English language sources and the primary topic of "Senedd" in English. ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 00:59, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament → Senedd Cymru – Per COMMONNAME. A year ago, the title of "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" was agreed to as a compromise until it was made certain what the most commonly used name is. As mentioned by Culloty82 in the above section, and bolstered by the election cycle, we do have that commonly used name: "the Senedd". From a cursory view of reliable sources, they will often use the English term "Welsh Parliament", but typically only once near the top, and use "Senedd" in the rest of the running text. Indeed, even UKIP used the term while campaigning. Just like we don't have the article at "Plaid Cymru – The Party of Wales", neither should this article really be at "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" any more Sceptre ( talk) 16:30, 9 May 2021 (UTC)
I lost the argument on the move - fine. Now we should all work to make the move to Senedd clean and consistent.
Why does Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament still exist as the old Senedd disambiguation page? This is just wrong. Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament should be a redirect to Senedd.
If this is a Wikipedia issue rather than a human error, why can’t we do moves like this as a clean atomic operation with everything happening at the same time? Kennethmac2000 ( talk) 09:39, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement about the wording of the introductory sentences of this article, the formal/official name of the Senedd and whether "Welsh Parliament" is English and "Senedd Cymru" is Welsh. I was going to suggest the opening sentence reads "The Senedd (pronounced [ˈsɛnɛð]; lit. 'senate'), officially known bilingually as Senedd Cymru/Welsh Parliament comprising Welsh Parliament in English and Senedd Cymru (Welsh pronunciation: [ˈsɛnɛð ˈkəm.ri]) in Welsh, is the devolved, unicameral legislature of Wales."
The situation isn't helped by the ambiguity of some official announcements, the new Senedd and Elections (Wales) Act 2020 and news coverage at the time of the name change, for example the Senedd's news release on 11 May 2020 says the official name is "Senedd Cymru and Welsh Parliament" while the Act says the Assembly is renamed "Senedd Cymru or Welsh Parliament". The BBC News article on 6 May 2020 says the new name is "Senedd Cymru/Welsh Parliament", with the Welsh and English names having equal status. ITV preferred "Welsh Parliament or Senedd Cymru", while several other news outlets use the name initially preferred by Wikipedia, "Senedd Cymru-Welsh Parliament". Whether we use an "and" or a "or", a dash or a forward slash, it's clear that the official name includes a Welsh name and English language name, of equal status (as a compromise to Assembly members who did not want a Welsh-only name). [4]. Some of these issues were discussed at length during Wikipedia's initial page rename discussion.
Either way, I'd strongly dispute Kennethmac2000's idea that because "Senedd Cymru" is one part of the official name(s), it ceases to be Welsh :) Sionk ( talk) 19:12, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
'The Welsh Parliament or Senedd Cymru, commonly known as the Senedd'.
About the Senedd The Welsh Parliament is the democratically elected body that represents the interests of Wales and its people. Commonly known as the Senedd, it makes laws for Wales, agrees Welsh taxes and holds the Welsh Government to account.
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
What laws does the Welsh Assembly have the power to pass, and has it passed any of signficance? Are they codified somewhere online? -- Beland 23:49, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
Surely the Welsh flag is more appropriate in this context Lumos3 09:21, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Presumably the UK flag is used because, as it says in the caption, this article is part of the series Politics of the United Kingdom and the flag is associated with the series and not the Welsh Assembly. If it offends your sensibilities why don't you add a Welsh Flag? -- Alun 16:02, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I think that this statement:
This is largely because, unlike other parts of the United Kingdom, Wales has always had the same legal and administrative system as England.
is not only totally incorrect, but displays ignorance about Welsh history. Wales was only annexed in 1536, but even after that was administered somewhat differently to England in many cases (education for example). This is documented well in A History of Wales by John Davies (
ISBN
0140145818). Unfortunately my brother has my copy so I can't check the details. I'm going to modify this.
Alun
17:46, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
Can we get a picture of the debating chamber?
I have changed some articles that declare the First Minister as " Assembly First Minister" when really he is now "Welsh First Minister". When the Welsh Assembly Government was set-up in 2000, The First Minister declared that him and the Cabinet are separate of the Assembly, but are elected and answerable to the Assembly. This article has noted right by saying "First Minister and his Cabinet comprises of Welsh Assembly Government". Most articles on this Wikipedia are based on the period between 1999 and 2000. I am interested in other people comments about this.
Draig goch20 19:36, August 13, 2005 (UTC)
The Assembly [...] will have a new, high-end assembly chamber
Can anyone explain what this means exactly? And which end of the chamber will be high? -- Picapica 09:24, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Please refrain from using
weasel words, if you have a point, use references to back it up. Weasel words don't really give a neutral point of view; they just spread hearsay, or couch personal opinion in vague, indirect syntax. It is better to put a name and a face on an opinion than to assign an opinion to an anonymous source.
Many cite the fact that it is majoritively the English taxpayer propping up the Welsh Assembly and paying the salaries of those whom work there.... Another argument cites the Act of Union 1707. This Act states that there shall be one parliament for the United Kingdom. The current Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly are contended have the powers of separate parliaments, and are therefore said to be breaking the Act of Union....establishing of the Welsh Assembly is also be viewed(sic) as federalisation, such as in the European Union, which many in the mainly centralised United Kingdom are opposed to.
Alun
17:50, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
This section has remained largely unverified for some time now. I am wondering what purpose it serves to maintain information here that breaches the verifiability policy. The original editor(s) have not seen fit to provide supporting material, and much of it seems to be waffle anyway. Alun 16:26, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
I have placed the History section at the start of the article and have split the Richard Commission content into a new section. I think the sections are now a bit more chronological in order. I have also been looking to try to verify some of the info here. I'll continue to tinker with the article and look for more references. Hope this looks OK. Alun 18:00, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
I have heard that at the official opening ceremony the name of the assembly will be translated into Senedd, rather then Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru. Technically the former translates to an independent national Senate on par with with a parliament or congress, and the latter is the technically correct translation for assembly. The Dragon's Eye reports that Queen Elizabeth may refer to it as the Senedd in her speech. Any comments on this? Drachenfyre 19:59, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes, this is correct. The institution is called the Assembly or y Cynulliad depending on language. "y senedd" refers only to the building. They were the Assembly in the old building and continue to be in the new, but only their NEW home in Cardiff Bay is called the senedd. Esquimo 00:38, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
Who the hell made this comment? The Assembly has no power over UK Governments depts in Wales. The Assembly only has power over it's own depts. Someone has purposely put the wrong facts in here. The UK Government controls it's own depts in Wales and the Assembly controls it's own under what powers it's got. Seriously, this part of the article surely is wrong.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.11.221.164 ( talk • contribs)
Amlder20 14:40, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Amlder20 12:15, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
I have changed NAW to NAfW. Google's first reference to the Assembly under NAW is result 9, whereas for NAfW, not only is one of the top results from a local authority ( Carmarthenshire County Council), but its first alternative suggested search is "national assembly for wales". More importantly, having worked in both local and central government, as well as with NAfW bodies themselves, the dominant abbreviation in official use is without any doubt NAfW. Didn't come across NAW even once in official documents during that time. 18:06, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
DO we really need this map? It is an odd map, the referendum was held accross Wales, the verdict was not decided by winning unitary authorities, but by winning a majority accross the whole country. This map appears to indicated that certain authorities voted yes and others no and that this is somehow relevant to the outcome of the election. It is supremely misleading. It would be better to show the Yes/No split within the authorities by shading, like this map of the 2004 US presidential election, that shows that most states are purple, ie there are Democrat (red) and Republican (blue) voters in all states. Someone fancy a crack at this? If I had the foggiest how to do it I would do it myself. Alun 17:25, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
It is important to note that the campaign to secure a 'yes' vote in the 1997 referendum was won by cross-party support (except the Conservatives) AND by the mobilisation of what is best described as Welsh civic society. Without the support of the Trade Unions, the Church and others it is unlikely that Wales would have voted yes. I am therefore including this observation in the article. Am happy to discuss that edit on this page. Normalmouth 20:40, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Even if there is a press citation, wouldn't the information at Basque Parliament (40 women/35 men) negate the assertion about a majority of female members? Crunk 02:39, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
The electoral system used for the assembly does not produce overall proportionality. See Welsh Assembly election, 2003, where Labour got 40% of votes, but 48% of the seats, Plaid got 21% of the vote and 20% of the seats, Tories 19.9% of the vote and 18.3% of the seats, Lib-Dems 14% of votes and 10% of the seats. Labour still takes a lot more seats than it should, a little form Plaid, a little from the Tories and a lot from the Lib-Dems. In a proportional system Labour would have got 24 seats (they got 29), Plaid 13 (12), Tories 12 (11), Lib-Dem 9 (6), UKIP 1 (0). This comes to 59, discrepancies like this are usually overcome depending on the electoral system used. The most proportional systems are Single Transferable Vote (disputed), Open list and of course the AMS if the number of top up seats were larger, especially if they were on a national level, I think a 50:50 chamber would produce proportionality. Alun 06:10, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
The list system does not correct the overall representation for each region towards proportionality. The proportions for the parties on the list elections can be (and are often) different to the parties proportions for the FPTP part of the election. So the list element does not produce the same proportionality of vote as the FPTP system, this is evidenced by the Labour Party gaining a significantly reduced share of the vote on the regional list part of the ballot compared with their proportion of the vote in the FPTP element of the election in 2003. Indeed the list element is parallel as it is in effect a separate election as any voter can vote for any party's list irrespective of their vote in the FPTP part of the election. So effectively they are separate elections. In theory a party could achieve a much larger share of the list vote than of the FPTP vote and gain seats from the list system even without putting candidates up for the FPTP election. Any proportionality achieved is based exclusively on the proportion of votes a party achieves in the list election. I do not understand what you mean when you write you keep removing wording that makes it clear that it isn't. The regional list elections are independent of the FPTP elections, but the proportion of representatives elected from a list is not independent of the number of directly elected AMs. I think we need to come to a form of words upon which we can both agree. The current form of words is:
How about this:
I will not amend the text in the article until we come to I have amended the text and hope I have produced a form of words we can both live with. Let's not edit war, if you are unhappy with this form of words then let's discuss it here untill we are both happy. It may mean that we need to go into a bit more detail about the electoral system used, but this may be a good thing. Comments are appreciated. I have used a BBC site as a reference for the changes I have made.
[1]
Alun
06:11, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
I have moved this information to the Electoral system section. Alun 11:35, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
I note use in the article of a link to " Additional Member System". I believe that although the system for elections to the Welsh Assembly is called an additional member system in relevant legislation, additional member systems generally are not necessarily designed to produce anything like PR. Linking to " Mixed member proportional representation" might be better, perhaps using " Additional member system (Welsh Assembly)" (a potential article site?) as a redirect. Laurel Bush 18:56, 31 October 2006 (UTC).
The more I think about it the more I feel it would be a good idea to have an article specifically about the system used in elections to the Welsh Assembly or, perhaps, one about the different systems used in Wales or throughout the United Kingdom. Laurel Bush 10:12, 1 November 2006 (UTC).
I am wondering when constituency boundary changes will come into effect for Assembly elections. Before or after they come into effect for Westminster elections? Laurel Bush 12:11, 2 November 2006 (UTC).
Once the GOWA 2006 is in force, Wales will have a totally different type of Assembly from the 1999-2007 Assembly. It's important to ensure that worldwide, people know the changes and the difference in the GOWA 1998 and the GOWA 2006. Amlder20 17:17, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
The Orders-In-Council are the only peices of legislation that will be approved by both houses of parliament, the Assembly and the Secretary of state for Wales. "although Assembly laws will be subject to the veto of the UK Secretary of State for Wales, House of Commons or House of Lords" has been changed to "although Assembly Order-in-Council laws will be subject to the veto of the UK Secretary of State for Wales, House of Commons or House of Lords. " so that people will know what laws will be passed by both Parliament and the Assembly and whats passed by the Assembly alone. The Assembly Measures are passed by the Welsh assembly only, and only needs parliaments approval if they are seeking to legislate on a "matter" that the Assembly has no power over, someone needs to read the act properly. Amlder20 21:24, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
The summary table for the 2003 election results in this article don't match those in National Assembly for Wales election, 2003, the latter being (I think) the correct figures. Can anyone double check? Bondegezou 11:28, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
After tinkering a bit, i decided to do a bit of a re-write, starting with the opening paragraph. What does everybody think so far? I'm using as a mode the article about the Scottish Parliament, which is really very well written and structured. I think with a bit of effort we could get this artile up to a similar standard. Mathsguy 18:18, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
So what ARE the devolved areas of legislation?! MikkoAN1 14:56, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
I have removed the links to around 5 Assembly Member blogs/websites. There is insufficient room to list all AM websites and, in any case, each AM has a Wikipedia article with a link to their personal blogs. -- Darren Wyn Rees 10:16, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
Are statements in the chamber of the NAW protected by Parliamentary Privilege like the Houses of Parliament? Richard Gadsden 14:46, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
In light of the existence of Template:Infobox Legislature, is the special box really necessary? The Legislature infobox is standard across all other legislative chambers (including Parliament of the United Kingdom and its houses, as well as the legislatures of various national subdivisions, e.g. Northern Ireland Assembly), has greater flexibility (should the structure of the Parliament change significantly), and otherwise renders the National Assembly for Wales infobox redundant.
So you know what it would look like, here's the Legislature infobox for the Scottish Parliament:
National Assembly for Wales Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru | |
---|---|
3rd Assembly | |
Type | |
Type | |
Leadership | |
Claire Clancy since February 2007 | |
Structure | |
Seats | 60 |
Political groups |
|
Committees |
|
Elections | |
Last election | 3 May 2007 |
Meeting place | |
Senedd, Cardiff | |
Website | |
www.assemblywales.org |
Thanks for considering! Lockesdonkey ( talk) 20:50, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
I have made a change to a political grouping within the new, improved, infobox. I changed Welsh Labour to Labour Party. It is noted on the Welsh Labour page that "Welsh Labour is formally part of the Labour Party - it is not separately registered [1] with the Electoral Commission under the terms of the Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act." Consequently, electors voted for a candidate for the Labour Party and not Welsh Labour or the Welsh Labour Party. Yours, Daicaregos ( talk) 11:41, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
A change has been made to the Party table in the Elections section - from Labour Party (UK) to Welsh Labour. Each of the Labour AMs is a member of the Labour Party. Each stood in their constituency representing the Labour Party. Each was elected as the Labour Party Assembly Member for their constituency. And most will be standing again in their constituency next month for election to the National Assembly as the Labour Party candidate. Consequently, unless and until the Labour candidates stand as Welsh Labour representitives, their political party should be noted as Labour. I have reverted the change. Daicaregos ( talk) 08:50, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
References
The powers explanation needs updating. There is reference to schedule 7 but it still mentions LCOs and Measures which are no longer relevant. Perhaps also the devolved area list could go higher up in the Powers and Status section as there is a discussion of tax powers etc before we even know broadly what the devolved areas are.
I also think that this article can be a bit misleading as it says in the second paragraph at the top tht that after the 2011 referendum Parliament no longer needs to be consulted. It is correct that Parliament doesn't need to be consuled in the 20 devolved areas but, even pre-May 2011, Parliament never needed to be consulted where powers were devolved. It only needed needed to be consulted for new powers instered by LCOs. There's a similar error at the end of the Powers and Status paragraph. Seeing as there is so much confusion about NAfW powers it would be great if we could get a really comprehensive page for people to refer to. I am willing to make the small chnges I have suggested unless anyone has any objections? Tralban ( talk) 13:26, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm curious about this. As far as I understand, the Welsh language is put on equal footing with English in many respects; and is used at some ceremonial instances. However, I do not understand whether English is the only practically used working language, with a little Welsh as a kind of adornment, or the rôles of the languages are on a more equal footing. Concretely:
I suspect that other readers than I also would be interested in such data. If there is some reliable source providing answers, I think that these should be added to the article, e.g., under a heading named something like The Assembly working mode. (This section also could cover some other information, like how many days a year the Assembly meets in plenum, and what kinds of permanent or temporary committees are formed by the members.) JoergenB ( talk) 19:47, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Changes to the Ieuan Wyn Jones' position in the Assembly are a bit previous. According to the BBC, he “... is to stand down from his Ynys Mon seat.” He has not done so yet. According to Betsan Powys “He'll start his new job in July but won't stand down as an Assembly member until his successor is elected.” The recent change has been reverted. Daicaregos ( talk) 15:23, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
Is there any scolarly discourse on the nature of the Assembly. Very much conceived as a "(West) German" and not a "Westminster" Model legislature.
Don't think it is so distinctive to be "sui generis" really but still it lacks an important feature of the West German model- the constructive vote of no confidence, (as the Alun Michael to Rhodri Morgan transistion showed). Otherwise though has lots of West German elements, the electoral system, emphasis on committees, consensual style. But there must be some scholarly analysis by now? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.99.121.229 ( talk) 23:00, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
The Wales Act 2014 is now law - this article will need some considerable updating as a result. Argovian ( talk) 18:19, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Dafydd El is noted in the Infobox as a member of the Government. Although the reference cited says 'that he will be supporting the Welsh Government', it also says 'He sits as an independent AM'. That doesn't sound to me that he is a member of the Government. Nor does it sound as if he will be providing much opposition, so he doesn't belong there either. I propose he be put in a section by himself, 'Other: Independent' perhaps. Thoughts? Daicaregos ( talk) 16:01, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
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Hi,
The diagram & caption at the top of the page contradict the breakdown below it, it shows two UKIP seats instead of one and an Independent. Not sure how to fix but just wanted to point this out
Muffington ( talk) 08:58, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
The formal legislation on same has now been published - appears that Senedd would be official in both Welsh and English, but that referral to the body as the Welsh Parliament will also permitted - https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/17426417.plans-to-lower-voting-age-in-welsh-elections-to-16-and-change-assemblys-name-officially-unveiled/ Culloty82 ( talk) 14:18, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No clear consensus for Senedd or Senedd Cymru; not moved to Welsh Parliament; interim move to Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament; review in at least three months This is a complicated situation due to several factors. There is overwhelming consensus that the article should not be at " National Assembly for Wales" as an outdated title. There is less consensus on the exact destination. There are a number of statements about what the common name is expected to be but not what it actually is.
The term "Senedd" has clearly become a common name in English for the building and has been a metonym for the institution even prior to the formal name change but this does not directly mean it has automatically become the common name for the institution post the name change. Out of the various contributions there's strong support for including "Senedd" in the article title but not a clear consensus to use either "Senedd" or "Senedd Cymru" on its own; there is also a sizeable element for including "Welsh Parliament" either alone or in the full bilingual name.
Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament covers all bases and has strong support as a secondary and/or interim option pending time to see which name emerges as the actual WP:COMMONNAME. For now it is the nearest to a consensus outcome. Timrollpickering ( talk) 12:27, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
Senedd Cymru →
Senedd –
Third stage in the bold–revert–discuss cycle; I reverted
Llew Mawr's redirection of the
Senedd (
|
talk |
history |
protect |
delete |
links |
watch |
logs |
views) disambiguation for further discussion. The question is basically: is the parliament the primary topic – and thus should be at
Senedd with a hatnote for
Senedd building per
WP:ONEOTHER – or is there
no primary topic, and should the page at Senedd be a disambiguation page? My own thoughts are that the parliament is indeed the primary topic — but I'm not fully convinced yet — and, for the reasons I made at
Talk:Senedd building#Requested move 5 December 2019, "Senedd" is already the common name in English sources, so in the context of a move discussion, I would support a move to Senedd.
Sceptre (
talk)
11:49, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
References
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
Seneddfor the rest of the article. Other sources refer to it as Senedd including Wales Online and ITV News. If the common name changes in the future the article can be moved again. Ralbegen ( talk) 10:47, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
"The Senedd is not just a building for Members, it is your building. It is the main public building of the Welsh Parliament, the main centre for democracy and devolution in Wales." from https://senedd.wales/en/visiting/senedd/Pages/senedd.aspx
References
I find the phrase "commonly referred to as the Senedd" odd, considering that "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament", has only been in existence since 6 May 2020. Before that date, it was only the building that was known as the Senedd. The "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" was previously commonly known simply as "the Assembly". In my view, this is the Welsh Parliament trying to get the public to call it "the Senedd", when there is no "commonly known name" at all. I accept "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" as the article name, no problems with that, but to go onto say that it is "commonly referred to as the Senedd", is just nonsense. SethWhales talk 23:57, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
I disagree with the statement "its primary law-making powers were enhanced in the Wales Act 2017 following a Yes vote in the referendum on 3 March 2011" on the article. It implies that 2011 referendum was implemented by the Wales Act 2017 - which isn't the case.
The 2011 Welsh devolution referendum page states: "regulations for the referendum, and the powers to be approved or rejected by it, were provided for in the Government of Wales Act 2006."
As a result, there was no Act needed by the UK Parliament after the referendum to enact what the people voted for. As mentioned above, this was provided by the Government of Wales Act 2006.
The Wales Act 2017 page states "the legislation is based on the proposals of the St David's Day Agreement which were not included in the Wales Act 2014." There is no mention of it being a result of the referendum that was held six years before it.
Lighthouse3050 ( talk) 20:21, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
My proposal: "Its primary law-making powers were enhanced following a Yes vote in the referendum on 3 March 2011, meaning that the UK Parliament or the Secretary of State for Wales were no longer consulted when passing acts of the National Assembly for Wales related to the 20 devolved areas.[10]. These powers were further extended by the Wales Act 2014 and Wales Act 2017." Lighthouse3050 ( talk) 09:32, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
Abolish the Welsh Assembly now has two members, following the affiliation of Mark Reckless, so adjust the infobox accordingly. [1] Culloty82 ( talk) 12:22, 16 October 2020 (UTC)
I corrected the table which references the 1st, 2nd, etc Assembly/Senedd. The text said Assembly/Parliament, but the English is either Assembly (pre-name change) or Senedd - parliament is confusing and not common use. And yet my change was reversed with a WP:MOS added. This is backed up in the Media: https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/2021-senedd-elections-could-be-postponed-if-theres-another-surge-in-coronavirus-cases-says-first-minister-mark-drakeford/ar-BB1b8lvo or https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/local-news/how-2021-senedd-elections-made-19298678; by the Independent Remuneration Board: https://senedd.wales/en/newhome/pages/newsitem.aspx?itemid=2100; the Scottish parliament: https://external.parliament.scot/parliamentarybusiness/report.aspx?r=12944&i=116989&c=2295030; the Senedd itself: https://senedd.wales/en/bus-home/bus-legislation/Pages/bus-legislation.aspx.
I'd like to undo the undo and change it back to Assembly/Senedd. Does anyone object? Cymro ( talk) 09:40, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
As of the 31st December 2020, the Abolish the Welsh Assembly Party is not registered with the Electoral Commission. As a result of this, the party's two Members of the Senedd - Gareth Bennett and Mark Reckless currently sit as independents. I tried to edit this but every time it wouldn't work so would someone else mind having a go? Thank you very much!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freddiewhite1234 ( talk • contribs) 12:38, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
References
Senedd Cymru-Welsh Parliament - Senedd At the time of the official name change six months ago, I supported a bilingual title as an interim move until a media consensus on the WP:COMMONNAME emerged. Now, however, the Senedd seems to have been widely adopted by the Welsh media, including BBC Wales [1], ITV Wales [2] and Wales Online [3]. A disambiguation page would be required to distinguish the parliamentary body from the physical building, but "Senedd" now appears the common term used for both. Culloty82 ( talk) 12:50, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
References
most common in the English languageso I do not feel that our entire decision should be based upon local media (though that should count too). ~ El D. ( talk to me) 10:48, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Consensus to move to Senedd as the most commonly used name in English language sources and the primary topic of "Senedd" in English. ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 00:59, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament → Senedd Cymru – Per COMMONNAME. A year ago, the title of "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" was agreed to as a compromise until it was made certain what the most commonly used name is. As mentioned by Culloty82 in the above section, and bolstered by the election cycle, we do have that commonly used name: "the Senedd". From a cursory view of reliable sources, they will often use the English term "Welsh Parliament", but typically only once near the top, and use "Senedd" in the rest of the running text. Indeed, even UKIP used the term while campaigning. Just like we don't have the article at "Plaid Cymru – The Party of Wales", neither should this article really be at "Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament" any more Sceptre ( talk) 16:30, 9 May 2021 (UTC)
I lost the argument on the move - fine. Now we should all work to make the move to Senedd clean and consistent.
Why does Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament still exist as the old Senedd disambiguation page? This is just wrong. Senedd Cymru – Welsh Parliament should be a redirect to Senedd.
If this is a Wikipedia issue rather than a human error, why can’t we do moves like this as a clean atomic operation with everything happening at the same time? Kennethmac2000 ( talk) 09:39, 16 May 2021 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement about the wording of the introductory sentences of this article, the formal/official name of the Senedd and whether "Welsh Parliament" is English and "Senedd Cymru" is Welsh. I was going to suggest the opening sentence reads "The Senedd (pronounced [ˈsɛnɛð]; lit. 'senate'), officially known bilingually as Senedd Cymru/Welsh Parliament comprising Welsh Parliament in English and Senedd Cymru (Welsh pronunciation: [ˈsɛnɛð ˈkəm.ri]) in Welsh, is the devolved, unicameral legislature of Wales."
The situation isn't helped by the ambiguity of some official announcements, the new Senedd and Elections (Wales) Act 2020 and news coverage at the time of the name change, for example the Senedd's news release on 11 May 2020 says the official name is "Senedd Cymru and Welsh Parliament" while the Act says the Assembly is renamed "Senedd Cymru or Welsh Parliament". The BBC News article on 6 May 2020 says the new name is "Senedd Cymru/Welsh Parliament", with the Welsh and English names having equal status. ITV preferred "Welsh Parliament or Senedd Cymru", while several other news outlets use the name initially preferred by Wikipedia, "Senedd Cymru-Welsh Parliament". Whether we use an "and" or a "or", a dash or a forward slash, it's clear that the official name includes a Welsh name and English language name, of equal status (as a compromise to Assembly members who did not want a Welsh-only name). [4]. Some of these issues were discussed at length during Wikipedia's initial page rename discussion.
Either way, I'd strongly dispute Kennethmac2000's idea that because "Senedd Cymru" is one part of the official name(s), it ceases to be Welsh :) Sionk ( talk) 19:12, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
'The Welsh Parliament or Senedd Cymru, commonly known as the Senedd'.
About the Senedd The Welsh Parliament is the democratically elected body that represents the interests of Wales and its people. Commonly known as the Senedd, it makes laws for Wales, agrees Welsh taxes and holds the Welsh Government to account.