Spencer was punched from behind by a masked protester whilst he was being interviewed at the time of Trump's presidential inauguration. Some media organizations have called it a 'sucker punch' but within Australia this type of attack is appropriately termed a 'coward punch'.
I think it should be included in the lead that he is a
white nationalist, not just
white supremacist, which is often used a dysphemism, but the sources we are using identifies him as so. He is also identified as a
white nationalist only.
Connor Machiavelli (
talk)
01:46, 12 March 2016 (UTC)Connor Machiavelli has been blocked for
sock puppetry.
See the ongoing discussion on this very issue here: Talk:National_Policy_Institute#White_supremacist?
Cesar Tort 21:16, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
"Wikipedia's sourcing policy, Verifiability, says that all quotations and any material challenged or likely to be challenged must be attributed to a reliable, published source using an inline citation; material not meeting this standard may be removed. This policy extends that principle, adding that contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced should be removed immediately and without discussion." NPalgan2 Spencer does not accept the label "white supremacist". If the subject finds the distinction important, there is a hurdle to clear. And I'm not listening to a 20 minute Maddow monoologue. ( talk) 03:07, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Again, him espousing white supremacist ideas is what he is notable for. If he wasn't a white supremacist, we wouldn't have an article on him. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:06, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I added three more sources on this. It's not like they're hard to find. It's what he's known for. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:17, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
And on this whole "white nationalist" vs "white supremacist" crap. As Maunus says above "white nationalist" is what white supremacists call themselves. And as one of the sources I added says "white nationalism is the suit and tie version of white supremacism". Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:22, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
No WP:ORIGINAL. If it doesn't say directly that he is a White Supremacist, then it does not go in the article. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:32, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
With the exception of SPLC (which has its own issues with POV-pushing), what other source labels him a White Supremacist that isn't also a tabloid like Wonkette? You self-admitted that the headlines alone are good enough for you, disregarding the content. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:40, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Show me the exact passages from each of these sources that says he is a 'White Supremacist' because upon further inspection of all sources provided so far, not once does Spencer identify as a 'White Supremacist' nor is he identified as one by the newspapers in question; For example, nowhere in the NYT article you mentioned do they explicitly say that Spencer is a White Supremacist.
Try again. Bring some meat to the table. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:57, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
You didn't link to the story, because it wasn't a story at all: You didn't want anyone to know that it was an opinion editorial:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/06/opinion/donald-trumps-alt-right-brain.html
As I said: Bring some meat to the table, not tabloids, not opinion pieces, and THEN we'll talk. Solntsa90 ( talk) 15:46, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
"The New York Times and the Associated Press are not Tabloids...
Right, but the articles linked were opinion pieces.
There are no sources cited which say he is not a white supremacist
There are no sources that say you're not really a robot or axe murderer, either. Should we assume that you are one based on sources lack of sources that deny it?
Lack of evidence does not imply that someone is part of a group or ideology. Furthermore, none of those sources listed above explicitly call Spencer a 'White Supremacist'; at the most, it is inferred but never explicitly said, which isn't enough to call him a White Supremacist, and would greatly violate BLP. Famiarlise yourself with the rules: WP:BLP Solntsa90 ( talk) 16:49, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
"It's a distinction without a differene" Then why do you continue to POV-push for 'Supremacist', if it means the exact same thing as 'Nationalist'?
Solntsa90 (
talk)
17:03, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Just a reminder. Any source that gets posted that refers to him as a "White Supremacist", I will personally review to make sure that the source isn't an opinion piece or tabloid, and if it isn't, that it actually explicitly states that Spencer is a "White Supremacist".
So far, no such sources have passed this scrutiny, from what I can tell.
Solntsa90 ( talk) 15:51, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
New York Times isn't a tabloid. First you were denying that the sources existed. Then you were denying that the sources say what they actually say (despite the fact that the sources were quoted to you three or four times). Now you are pretending that the sources are "tabloids" or editorials. They're not. Seriously, cut this shit out. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 16:09, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I clicked on a link at random, which turned out to be this one:
http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37433759
...And nowhere does it even mention the word 'supremacist', let alone the phrase 'White Supremacist'. You're not being a very honest editor here, really trying hard to POV-push. You're just posting links, hoping no one will actually read or scrutinise them. Solntsa90 ( talk) 16:51, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Clicking on another link at random takes me to 'The Rachel Maddow Show'. I don't think you understand what constitutes a impartial source, and suggest you familiarise yourself with
WP:BLP.
Solntsa90 (
talk)
16:59, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I think the sourcing could be cleaned up. Reviewing the discussed sources, the only one that reliably and expressly calls Spencer a white supremacist is the AP story. The others should be removed per WP:V and WP:CITEKILL. The New York Times story comes tantalizingly close but doesn't quite make it there, in my view. (Neither of these are opinion sources, btw.) (I'm not watching this page so please ping me if you want my attention.) -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 18:02, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
That's not what the sources tell, if you just heard what Dr. Fleischman said, only one source reliably calls him a White Supremacist, and one single source (even if from AP) may not be enough to force a label onto someone, especially when that person denies said-label (though that is something I'm unclear of, perhaps someone more knowledgeable can clarify how many sources you need to make a label stick). Solntsa90 ( talk) 18:33, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Keyword: 'Imply'. Solntsa90 ( talk) 18:53, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
To follow up on my previous comment, as I was pinged back: We cannot state what a reliable source only implies, per our policy on original research, which says: "Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources." (Emphasis mine.) The AP source is reliable and calls Spencer a white supremacist. Therefore we can say he's a white supremacist. I am comfortable with the current wording. We just need to remove the references that don't verify the content (and weaken the article by causing some readers to question our neutrality). -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 19:30, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
From yet another NY Times article: "The term was coined in 2008 by Richard Spencer, a white supremacist whose National Policy Institute says it is “dedicated to the heritage, identity and future of people of European descent in the United States, and around the world." (emphasis added). How many sources do we need, exactly? Is it 6? 7? 200? Rockypedia ( talk) 20:31, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
The headline of an article at Interactive One: "Roland Martin Clashes With White Supremacist Over White Angst, Donald Trump". It's an article about Martin's one-on-one with Spencer. Do you think Interactive One is an unreliable source? Rockypedia ( talk) 20:36, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
The Jewish Chronicle, founded in 1841, and the oldest continuously published Jewish newspaper in the world, describes Spencer as such: "The Alt-Right - the term was first coined by white supremacist Richard Spencer". Honestly, I think the original lead skated around the issue by only saying "known for promoting white supremacist views" - there appear to be plenty of reliable sources straight-up describing him as a white supremacist, so the lead should just say that. Rockypedia ( talk) 20:40, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
From a Bloomberg article about Milo Yiannopoulos: "Richard Spencer, a smartly dressed, University of Virginia-educated white supremacist". I've lost count now of the reliable sources describing Spencer as a white supremacist. Rockypedia ( talk) 20:43, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
WP:RS WP:BIASED "Wikipedia articles are required to present a neutral point of view. However, reliable sources are not required to be neutral, unbiased, or objective. Sometimes non-neutral sources are the best possible sources for supporting information about the different viewpoints held on a subject." -- Nbauman ( talk) 04:29, 22 November 2016 (UTC)
I wanted to bring up an issue I am having with this page. Since seeing The Atlantic piece with the excerpted video of the 2016 convention, I wanted to find out more about Spencer. To be very upfront, I do not support his views. I noticed that his Wikipedia page could use a bit of TLC in terms of citations (my specialty), so I spent a bunch of time working on the citations with the intention of doing further reading on Spencer. I wanted to gather information for my own personal understanding, and have found that often fixing up Wikipedia pages, this is a mechanism that allows me to research subjects and people.
After doing this work: I am very conflicted about the end-result of the improved condition of his page as result of my efforts. On one hand, I very seriously don't want to help this man and his organizations. On the other hand, I wanted the data about Spencer to be very clear in terms of linking to a wide variety of sources, both pro and anti his efforts, to illustrate his work -- so others could easily find this data and parse it on their own. So I hope that this has been done with the spirit of Wikipedia #Neutrality in mind. But I remain conflicted, because I don't exactly feel great about learning what I have learned, and again, I don't want to support someone who preaches concepts I object to so fundamentally. I wonder if other editors have any thoughts and/or constructive ideas on this issue. --
BrillLyle (
talk)
06:18, 23 November 2016 (UTC)
I have removed two sources from this article; they add nothing to the article's content and link to purported personally-identifying information such as birthdate and parents for a decidedly non-public figure, namely the article subject's father. I don't see any reason to make it easy to find Richard Spencer's father's alleged parents' names. NorthBySouthBaranof ( talk) 05:35, 29 November 2016 (UTC)
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Please change:
„He spent the summer of 2005 and 2006 at the Institute Vienna Circle.“
to
„He attended the Vienna International Summer University in July 2005 and in July 2006“
https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/VISU_2001_bis_2016.pdf https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/
JanMug ( talk) 16:26, 24 November 2016 (UTC)
The new wording exactly specifies when in the years he attended the Summer School in Vienna. Richard Spencer never spent any time “at the Institute Vienna Circle“. This is important. The institute‘s director Prof. Stadler has clarified this on the Institute‘s website: https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by JanMug ( talk • contribs) 08:23, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
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Remove "known for promoting white supremacist views" from the first sentence, or provide primary source citation to support this claim. The three sources cited are secondary sources who provide no evidence in the body of their works for the validity of such a claim. Secondary source claims that either contradict primary sources, or are unsubstantiated by evidence from primary sources are invalid or fallacious. Citing the prestige or reputation of a secondary source is not a valid argument for the truthfulness of the claim. Either cite primary sources which demonstrate that Richard Spencer has actively promoted white supremacy, or edit the current text to unequivocally reflect that any allegation of white supremacy promotion is unsubstatianted by evidence; such as, "Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is an American white nationalist, alleged by many to promote white supremacist views.[2][3][4] Codylarson ( talk) 22:10, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
Unfortunately the consensus on this page follows fallacious argumentation. Asserting the truth of a claim because of consensus is invalid. Consensus is of limited value only with respect to opinion. The truth of a claim is independent of how many persons assert it. Facts are supported by objective, verifiable evidence. If Richard Spencer has made statements which promote white supremacy, primary source material will exist to support this claim. Until primary source material is presented, these claims remain allegations, and should be clearly identified as such. Let it be a point of common purpose here that content be edited for greater clarity and objectivity, not to establish a comfortable, if erroneous, consensus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Codylarson ( talk • contribs) 14:46, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
In the views section in the fourth paragraph it states that an individual was disinvited from an event and another individual was a guest speaker, but it appears there is no actual mention of what event one spoke at or what event one was disinvited from. Please fix. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.36.15.115 ( talk) 03:37, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
Chief of Staff is Priebus. Article needs fixing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Magicalnumber7 ( talk • contribs) 16:00, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
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Please change every instance of "white supermacist" to "white nationalist" as it does not represent his views and it would be presenting a wrong image to the viewer. AR4P2020 ( talk) 12:06, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
AR4P2020 did not say anything about how Spencer describes his views. Rather, he's saying that Spencer is more aptly described as a white nationalist than as a white supremacist. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Magicalnumber7 ( talk • contribs) 16:02, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
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Take out ", known for promoting white supremacist views" Dogisrain ( talk) 01:05, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
"known for promoting white supremacist views" is untrue and the author/wikipedia may be held libel is s court of law.
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"He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture."
Requesting citation for these quotes. Basgta519 ( talk) 17:50, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
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I would like to add a citation on the quote in the summary:
He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture.[citation needed]
Here is the source: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/richard-spencer-speech-npi/508379/ JoeyS7 ( talk) 07:40, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
The claim that there's a "link" between the Heritage Foundation and the National Policy Institute, based on "reporting" by an opinion broadcaster, Rachel Maddow, is yet another example of why Wikipedia is untrustworthy on any controversial topic. For starters, Maddow isn't a reliable source. Secondly, her broadcast cited gave no evidence whatsoever for a "link" between the two groups. There was no "reporting" in the clip, only an unfounded assertion. Yes, Wikikids, there's a difference. Really.
This is nothing more than a politically motivated attempt to smear the Heritage Foundation, which has no ties to neo-Nazis. The tipoff is the use of a content-free and highly tendentious "report" from a far left-wing talking head to justify a claim backed by no evidence whatsoever.
Now, having been through Wikiwars before, I won't stick around for this one. Wikipedia is fine for non-controversial stuff that we used to find in the World Book encyclopedia, but the politically-motivated roving flash mobs here just cannot resist their temptations, and will naturally support each other. So you will keep the unfounded, ax-grinding claim in the article, to the ongoing detriment of Wikipedia. Have fun, kids. And no, I didn't contribute to their fundraiser. 73.239.55.87 ( talk) 21:50, 18 December 2016 (UTC)
The starter has come under dispute in the wake of a recent David Pakman interview. Can it be resolved? -- Volvlogia ( talk) 22:13, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
I'm inclined to think that including the ski club incident is undue weight. He wasn't expelled from the club, charged, sued, or anything like that. There was some coverage, but one of the main sources we are relying on is by Spencer himself.-- Jack Upland ( talk) 01:39, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
The current first sentence says that Spencer is a white nationalist known for promoting white supremacist views. Isn't this redundant and confusing? White nationalism says that white supremacy is a subset of white nationalism. So if he's known for promoting white supremacist views, why not just say he's a white supremacist? Sorry for being late to the party, but I don't see a prior discussion on this particular topic. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 17:58, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
The white nationalist Richard Spencer https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/20/us/whitefish-montana-jews-daily-stormer.html Dec 20, 2016 Richard Spencer, a white nationalist in Montana, said Mr. Trump was “ https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/14/us/politics/donald-trump-white-identity.html Jul 13, 2016 NPalgan2 ( talk) 23:03, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
I don't think Wikipedia should err on the side of caution, as NPalgan2 suggest. We follow our verifiability policy, which means we call a spade a spade. Multiple reliable sources say Spencer is a white supremacist, and we've found no reliable sources saying he's not a white supremacist. That should settle the matter. In fact it does, since we have consensus. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 23:23, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
Video posted online by the outlet shows the white supremacist speaking to...The article later comments on Spencer's denial of being a supremacist, and dismisses it with a counterpoint from his own words:
Spencer denied being a white supremacist in a December 2016 interview with Ganim. But, in that interview he said, "Only white people can support what we call Western civilization." He also has said there should be a "peaceful ethnic cleansing," meaning individuals not of European descent should voluntarily leave the United States.CNN directly contrasted his self-description with his stated beliefs. Grayfell ( talk) 01:24, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
The simplified wording [16] is an improvement. Nomoskedasticity ( talk) 06:59, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
Can someone with more technical knowledge of talk pages please add links to the talk page archives? -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 20:13, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
EvergreenFir, would you mind changing the archiving to the standard automatic scheme, rather than one click archiving? I just noticed that a discussion that was started on January 21 was then one click archived 16 minutes later. Granted, it was a pretty weak discussion topic, but that shouldn't have happened. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 20:10, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
Richard's alt right magazine/website has put forth the questions on whether we need the black race and whether black genocide should be completed, via archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20120216183528/http://www.alternativeright.com/main/the-magazine/is-black-genocide-right It further delves into what would be the easiest way to dispose of them etc — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.0.114.9 ( talk) 14:40 27 January 2017
A lot of media is covering this. I found out about it via SNL. While the incident itself probably isn't notable, it seems like the reaction is. Also seems to be speculation about identity if masked assailant. Ranze ( talk) 08:06, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
Links:
The ‘alt-right’ arrives in Alexandria http://alextimes.com/2017/01/the-alt-right-arrives-in-alexandria/
Richard Spencer's 'One-Stop Shop' for the Alt-Right - The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/01/a-one-stop-shop-for-the-alt-right/512921/
For one Alexandria neighborhood, the 'alt-right' is all wrong https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/for-one-alexandria-neighborhood-the-alt-right-is-all-wrong/2017/01/17/d4f893b6-dce6-11e6-ad42-f3375f271c9c_story.html
Thanks. 152.180.6.2 ( talk) 20:14, 30 January 2017 (UTC)
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The first line calls Richard Spencer "a noted American white supremacist". Each of the "citations" of this claim link to websites that state that Richard claims not to be a white supremacist, while the website refers to him a white supremacist anyway without presenting sufficient evidence to support their claim. Several people have called him a white supremacist, but that doesn't make it so. Please change the text from "white supremacist" to "political activist" or even to "political activist who has been called a white supremacist, but claims not to be." or something along those lines. The original citations can remain. 74.199.66.41 ( talk) 22:34, 31 January 2017 (UTC)
The title of this article isn't consistent with our naming policies and guidelines, which suggest that we should move this article to Richard Spencer (white supremacist). The vast majority of reliable independent sources refer to Spencer as Richard Spencer, not Richard B. Spencer, and then we have to disambiguate him from the many other notable Richard Spencers. I would be bold and make the move myself but I'd like to achieve consensus first due to the controversial nature of the proposed title. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 18:02, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
I disagree, current article title is in accordance with policy WP:NCDAB "Natural disambiguation. When there is another term (such as Apartment instead of Flat) or more complete name (such as English language instead of English) that is unambiguous, commonly used in English (even without being the most common term), and equally clear, that term is typically the best to use... Natural disambiguation is generally preferable to parenthetical disambiguation" The current title Richard B. Spencer has been or is mostly used by many RSs - The Atlantic, Chronicle of Higher Education, The Guardian, Newsweek, NYT, CNN, etc. NPalgan2 ( talk) 20:56, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
@ BrittanyPBone: I have reverted your unilateral (and obviously premature) page move. Please join the discussion here and wait for a consensus. Fyddlestix ( talk) 18:13, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
[1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] -- BrittanyPBone ( talk) 19:00, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
references
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References
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Does anyone object to a move to Richard Spencer (white nationalist), and if so, please explain. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 21:39, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
I propose we close this discussion. The only two "support" editors are recently-created accounts and looking at [21] and [22], their flurry of recent activity has been mostly concentrated on this talk page. They're both apparently very comfortable with Wiki procedures and terminology despite their recent appearance on the site, and if they're not sock puppets of some other account, I'll eat my keyboard. Rockypedia ( talk) 01:33, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Acording to this source http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2016/08/now-even-white-nationalists-want-gay-friends/ it refer his stance on homosexuality.
It speaks about how he barred matthew heimbach since he was too anti-homosexual.
"Richard Spencer is president of the white-nationalist National Policy Institute and according to SPLC has made overtures to the LGBTQ community. He’s considered one of the founders of the Alt Right, and last year barred homophobes from attending their annual convention, choosing pro-LGBTQ speakers and turning away at least one antigay speaker."
There is even a source inside that links to SPLC about this to be reliable source. BLP violation or not? 83.209.66.168 ( talk) 14:45, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Where is this supposed "clear consensus" that the header should ONLY say "white supremacist" and leave out "white nationalist?" I count 4 "opposes" to calling Spencer a "white nationalist" and 3 supports. How is that a "clear consensus?" Not even Jared Taylor has the header "white supremacist" and he has an equal amount of sources that call him one. JRBx45x ( talk) 13:24, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
Has anyone provided a single link that proves Spencer "promotes" White Surpremacism? Every single source on the article states he promotes White nationalism, pan-Europeanism and Identitarianism. Can't find a single one that says he promotes the ideology of White Supremacism, which is not equivalent to the prior three. Until that's done, I'm removing the word "promoting" from the first sentence and will continue to do so. Bulldog123 21:14, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
We need to just change the lead sentence to "Richard Spencer is an American white nationalist and white supremacist." There's plenty of non-opinion reliable sources for each of those descriptions and this wording would eliminate the word "promoting". Enough of these white-washing attempts to make Spencer more palatable to the masses. If a person doesn't want to be described as a white supremacist, he should stop publicly espousing white supremacist views. Rockypedia ( talk) 05:55, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
Wikipedia defines white supremacy as a " racist ideology centered upon the belief, and the promotion of the belief, that white people are superior in certain characteristics, traits, and attributes to people of other racial backgrounds and that therefore white people should politically, economically and socially rule non-white people." How can a man who self-evidently advocates separatism meet this definition? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:282:b00:a7e0:48b4:76cb:4df4:3a1a ( talk) 20:49, 20 February 2017
Are nine citations necessary in the introductory sentence to substantiate that he is a white supremacist? It seems like overkill to include so many sources in that spot.-- TM 17:28, 18 February 2017 (UTC)
Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is an American white supremacist.[3] He is president of the National Policy Institute, a white nationalist think tank, as well as Washington Summit Publishers. Spencer has stated that he rejects the description of white supremacist, and describes himself as an identitarian. You people are so biased. You think all of your readers are too stupid to be able to read the article and come to their own conclusions, so you insist on applying a label to this guy that he expressly denies. Fuck wikipedia and fuck the people who wrote this page. You can justify your behavior any way you want, but remember the golden rule, assholes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:1c0:8200:4830:b561:b3e7:7c45:5e0 ( talk) 10:41, 25 February 2017
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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Why does it say "white supremacist" even if he isn't one? Isn't that defamation? Thanks. Imageuploader ( talk) 18:51, 7 June 2017 (UTC)
There is no "consensus". There is a plurality of leftist propagandists here who outnumber the honest contributors, and who bluster on until the honest people give up and leave. I'm not a fan of Spencer, but lying about him reflects badly on Wikipedia. 77Mike77 ( talk) 13:05, 8 June 2017 (UTC)
Enough of that. |
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"White Supremacist" is slander. Ruling over other races is not part of this man's belief. READ THE WIKIPEDIA ARTICLE White Nationalism and TELL ME how this does not more closely reflect his actual beliefs? "White supremacist" isn't an actual thing; it is a slur. "White nationalist" is actually a belief. Wikipedia, if it is to remain professional, is NOT to use slurs in articles for public figures that are often in the news! I can find plenty of links referring to Spencer as a "White nationalist". He has said he has no problem with that term, and it is infinitely more accurate. X06 ( talk) 08:12, 25 May 2017 (UTC)
Ummmmm.... Volunteer Marek ( talk) 08:54, 27 May 2017 (UTC)
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Richard Spencer is a white nationalist, not a white supremacist. 75.120.137.83 ( talk) 21:38, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
Spencer just said in his talk at Auburn University that he and his wife are not separated, contrary to what this article says. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.51.13.252 ( talk) 01:44, 19 April 2017 (UTC)
I would have thought Spencer himself is a reliable enough source to determine if his marriage is over or not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.244.200.80 ( talk) 17:05, 6 May 2017 (UTC)
Spencer was punched from behind by a masked protester whilst he was being interviewed at the time of Trump's presidential inauguration. Some media organizations have called it a 'sucker punch' but within Australia this type of attack is appropriately termed a 'coward punch'.
I think it should be included in the lead that he is a
white nationalist, not just
white supremacist, which is often used a dysphemism, but the sources we are using identifies him as so. He is also identified as a
white nationalist only.
Connor Machiavelli (
talk)
01:46, 12 March 2016 (UTC)Connor Machiavelli has been blocked for
sock puppetry.
See the ongoing discussion on this very issue here: Talk:National_Policy_Institute#White_supremacist?
Cesar Tort 21:16, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
"Wikipedia's sourcing policy, Verifiability, says that all quotations and any material challenged or likely to be challenged must be attributed to a reliable, published source using an inline citation; material not meeting this standard may be removed. This policy extends that principle, adding that contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced should be removed immediately and without discussion." NPalgan2 Spencer does not accept the label "white supremacist". If the subject finds the distinction important, there is a hurdle to clear. And I'm not listening to a 20 minute Maddow monoologue. ( talk) 03:07, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Again, him espousing white supremacist ideas is what he is notable for. If he wasn't a white supremacist, we wouldn't have an article on him. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:06, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I added three more sources on this. It's not like they're hard to find. It's what he's known for. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:17, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
And on this whole "white nationalist" vs "white supremacist" crap. As Maunus says above "white nationalist" is what white supremacists call themselves. And as one of the sources I added says "white nationalism is the suit and tie version of white supremacism". Volunteer Marek ( talk) 14:22, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
No WP:ORIGINAL. If it doesn't say directly that he is a White Supremacist, then it does not go in the article. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:32, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
With the exception of SPLC (which has its own issues with POV-pushing), what other source labels him a White Supremacist that isn't also a tabloid like Wonkette? You self-admitted that the headlines alone are good enough for you, disregarding the content. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:40, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Show me the exact passages from each of these sources that says he is a 'White Supremacist' because upon further inspection of all sources provided so far, not once does Spencer identify as a 'White Supremacist' nor is he identified as one by the newspapers in question; For example, nowhere in the NYT article you mentioned do they explicitly say that Spencer is a White Supremacist.
Try again. Bring some meat to the table. Solntsa90 ( talk) 14:57, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
You didn't link to the story, because it wasn't a story at all: You didn't want anyone to know that it was an opinion editorial:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/06/opinion/donald-trumps-alt-right-brain.html
As I said: Bring some meat to the table, not tabloids, not opinion pieces, and THEN we'll talk. Solntsa90 ( talk) 15:46, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
"The New York Times and the Associated Press are not Tabloids...
Right, but the articles linked were opinion pieces.
There are no sources cited which say he is not a white supremacist
There are no sources that say you're not really a robot or axe murderer, either. Should we assume that you are one based on sources lack of sources that deny it?
Lack of evidence does not imply that someone is part of a group or ideology. Furthermore, none of those sources listed above explicitly call Spencer a 'White Supremacist'; at the most, it is inferred but never explicitly said, which isn't enough to call him a White Supremacist, and would greatly violate BLP. Famiarlise yourself with the rules: WP:BLP Solntsa90 ( talk) 16:49, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
"It's a distinction without a differene" Then why do you continue to POV-push for 'Supremacist', if it means the exact same thing as 'Nationalist'?
Solntsa90 (
talk)
17:03, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Just a reminder. Any source that gets posted that refers to him as a "White Supremacist", I will personally review to make sure that the source isn't an opinion piece or tabloid, and if it isn't, that it actually explicitly states that Spencer is a "White Supremacist".
So far, no such sources have passed this scrutiny, from what I can tell.
Solntsa90 ( talk) 15:51, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
New York Times isn't a tabloid. First you were denying that the sources existed. Then you were denying that the sources say what they actually say (despite the fact that the sources were quoted to you three or four times). Now you are pretending that the sources are "tabloids" or editorials. They're not. Seriously, cut this shit out. Volunteer Marek ( talk) 16:09, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I clicked on a link at random, which turned out to be this one:
http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37433759
...And nowhere does it even mention the word 'supremacist', let alone the phrase 'White Supremacist'. You're not being a very honest editor here, really trying hard to POV-push. You're just posting links, hoping no one will actually read or scrutinise them. Solntsa90 ( talk) 16:51, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Clicking on another link at random takes me to 'The Rachel Maddow Show'. I don't think you understand what constitutes a impartial source, and suggest you familiarise yourself with
WP:BLP.
Solntsa90 (
talk)
16:59, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
I think the sourcing could be cleaned up. Reviewing the discussed sources, the only one that reliably and expressly calls Spencer a white supremacist is the AP story. The others should be removed per WP:V and WP:CITEKILL. The New York Times story comes tantalizingly close but doesn't quite make it there, in my view. (Neither of these are opinion sources, btw.) (I'm not watching this page so please ping me if you want my attention.) -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 18:02, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
That's not what the sources tell, if you just heard what Dr. Fleischman said, only one source reliably calls him a White Supremacist, and one single source (even if from AP) may not be enough to force a label onto someone, especially when that person denies said-label (though that is something I'm unclear of, perhaps someone more knowledgeable can clarify how many sources you need to make a label stick). Solntsa90 ( talk) 18:33, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
Keyword: 'Imply'. Solntsa90 ( talk) 18:53, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
To follow up on my previous comment, as I was pinged back: We cannot state what a reliable source only implies, per our policy on original research, which says: "Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources." (Emphasis mine.) The AP source is reliable and calls Spencer a white supremacist. Therefore we can say he's a white supremacist. I am comfortable with the current wording. We just need to remove the references that don't verify the content (and weaken the article by causing some readers to question our neutrality). -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 19:30, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
From yet another NY Times article: "The term was coined in 2008 by Richard Spencer, a white supremacist whose National Policy Institute says it is “dedicated to the heritage, identity and future of people of European descent in the United States, and around the world." (emphasis added). How many sources do we need, exactly? Is it 6? 7? 200? Rockypedia ( talk) 20:31, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
The headline of an article at Interactive One: "Roland Martin Clashes With White Supremacist Over White Angst, Donald Trump". It's an article about Martin's one-on-one with Spencer. Do you think Interactive One is an unreliable source? Rockypedia ( talk) 20:36, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
The Jewish Chronicle, founded in 1841, and the oldest continuously published Jewish newspaper in the world, describes Spencer as such: "The Alt-Right - the term was first coined by white supremacist Richard Spencer". Honestly, I think the original lead skated around the issue by only saying "known for promoting white supremacist views" - there appear to be plenty of reliable sources straight-up describing him as a white supremacist, so the lead should just say that. Rockypedia ( talk) 20:40, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
From a Bloomberg article about Milo Yiannopoulos: "Richard Spencer, a smartly dressed, University of Virginia-educated white supremacist". I've lost count now of the reliable sources describing Spencer as a white supremacist. Rockypedia ( talk) 20:43, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
WP:RS WP:BIASED "Wikipedia articles are required to present a neutral point of view. However, reliable sources are not required to be neutral, unbiased, or objective. Sometimes non-neutral sources are the best possible sources for supporting information about the different viewpoints held on a subject." -- Nbauman ( talk) 04:29, 22 November 2016 (UTC)
I wanted to bring up an issue I am having with this page. Since seeing The Atlantic piece with the excerpted video of the 2016 convention, I wanted to find out more about Spencer. To be very upfront, I do not support his views. I noticed that his Wikipedia page could use a bit of TLC in terms of citations (my specialty), so I spent a bunch of time working on the citations with the intention of doing further reading on Spencer. I wanted to gather information for my own personal understanding, and have found that often fixing up Wikipedia pages, this is a mechanism that allows me to research subjects and people.
After doing this work: I am very conflicted about the end-result of the improved condition of his page as result of my efforts. On one hand, I very seriously don't want to help this man and his organizations. On the other hand, I wanted the data about Spencer to be very clear in terms of linking to a wide variety of sources, both pro and anti his efforts, to illustrate his work -- so others could easily find this data and parse it on their own. So I hope that this has been done with the spirit of Wikipedia #Neutrality in mind. But I remain conflicted, because I don't exactly feel great about learning what I have learned, and again, I don't want to support someone who preaches concepts I object to so fundamentally. I wonder if other editors have any thoughts and/or constructive ideas on this issue. --
BrillLyle (
talk)
06:18, 23 November 2016 (UTC)
I have removed two sources from this article; they add nothing to the article's content and link to purported personally-identifying information such as birthdate and parents for a decidedly non-public figure, namely the article subject's father. I don't see any reason to make it easy to find Richard Spencer's father's alleged parents' names. NorthBySouthBaranof ( talk) 05:35, 29 November 2016 (UTC)
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Please change:
„He spent the summer of 2005 and 2006 at the Institute Vienna Circle.“
to
„He attended the Vienna International Summer University in July 2005 and in July 2006“
https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/VISU_2001_bis_2016.pdf https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/
JanMug ( talk) 16:26, 24 November 2016 (UTC)
The new wording exactly specifies when in the years he attended the Summer School in Vienna. Richard Spencer never spent any time “at the Institute Vienna Circle“. This is important. The institute‘s director Prof. Stadler has clarified this on the Institute‘s website: https://www.univie.ac.at/ivc/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by JanMug ( talk • contribs) 08:23, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
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Remove "known for promoting white supremacist views" from the first sentence, or provide primary source citation to support this claim. The three sources cited are secondary sources who provide no evidence in the body of their works for the validity of such a claim. Secondary source claims that either contradict primary sources, or are unsubstantiated by evidence from primary sources are invalid or fallacious. Citing the prestige or reputation of a secondary source is not a valid argument for the truthfulness of the claim. Either cite primary sources which demonstrate that Richard Spencer has actively promoted white supremacy, or edit the current text to unequivocally reflect that any allegation of white supremacy promotion is unsubstatianted by evidence; such as, "Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is an American white nationalist, alleged by many to promote white supremacist views.[2][3][4] Codylarson ( talk) 22:10, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
Unfortunately the consensus on this page follows fallacious argumentation. Asserting the truth of a claim because of consensus is invalid. Consensus is of limited value only with respect to opinion. The truth of a claim is independent of how many persons assert it. Facts are supported by objective, verifiable evidence. If Richard Spencer has made statements which promote white supremacy, primary source material will exist to support this claim. Until primary source material is presented, these claims remain allegations, and should be clearly identified as such. Let it be a point of common purpose here that content be edited for greater clarity and objectivity, not to establish a comfortable, if erroneous, consensus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Codylarson ( talk • contribs) 14:46, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
In the views section in the fourth paragraph it states that an individual was disinvited from an event and another individual was a guest speaker, but it appears there is no actual mention of what event one spoke at or what event one was disinvited from. Please fix. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.36.15.115 ( talk) 03:37, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
Chief of Staff is Priebus. Article needs fixing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Magicalnumber7 ( talk • contribs) 16:00, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
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Please change every instance of "white supermacist" to "white nationalist" as it does not represent his views and it would be presenting a wrong image to the viewer. AR4P2020 ( talk) 12:06, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
AR4P2020 did not say anything about how Spencer describes his views. Rather, he's saying that Spencer is more aptly described as a white nationalist than as a white supremacist. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Magicalnumber7 ( talk • contribs) 16:02, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
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Take out ", known for promoting white supremacist views" Dogisrain ( talk) 01:05, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
"known for promoting white supremacist views" is untrue and the author/wikipedia may be held libel is s court of law.
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"He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture."
Requesting citation for these quotes. Basgta519 ( talk) 17:50, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
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I would like to add a citation on the quote in the summary:
He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture.[citation needed]
Here is the source: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/richard-spencer-speech-npi/508379/ JoeyS7 ( talk) 07:40, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
The claim that there's a "link" between the Heritage Foundation and the National Policy Institute, based on "reporting" by an opinion broadcaster, Rachel Maddow, is yet another example of why Wikipedia is untrustworthy on any controversial topic. For starters, Maddow isn't a reliable source. Secondly, her broadcast cited gave no evidence whatsoever for a "link" between the two groups. There was no "reporting" in the clip, only an unfounded assertion. Yes, Wikikids, there's a difference. Really.
This is nothing more than a politically motivated attempt to smear the Heritage Foundation, which has no ties to neo-Nazis. The tipoff is the use of a content-free and highly tendentious "report" from a far left-wing talking head to justify a claim backed by no evidence whatsoever.
Now, having been through Wikiwars before, I won't stick around for this one. Wikipedia is fine for non-controversial stuff that we used to find in the World Book encyclopedia, but the politically-motivated roving flash mobs here just cannot resist their temptations, and will naturally support each other. So you will keep the unfounded, ax-grinding claim in the article, to the ongoing detriment of Wikipedia. Have fun, kids. And no, I didn't contribute to their fundraiser. 73.239.55.87 ( talk) 21:50, 18 December 2016 (UTC)
The starter has come under dispute in the wake of a recent David Pakman interview. Can it be resolved? -- Volvlogia ( talk) 22:13, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
I'm inclined to think that including the ski club incident is undue weight. He wasn't expelled from the club, charged, sued, or anything like that. There was some coverage, but one of the main sources we are relying on is by Spencer himself.-- Jack Upland ( talk) 01:39, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
The current first sentence says that Spencer is a white nationalist known for promoting white supremacist views. Isn't this redundant and confusing? White nationalism says that white supremacy is a subset of white nationalism. So if he's known for promoting white supremacist views, why not just say he's a white supremacist? Sorry for being late to the party, but I don't see a prior discussion on this particular topic. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 17:58, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
The white nationalist Richard Spencer https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/20/us/whitefish-montana-jews-daily-stormer.html Dec 20, 2016 Richard Spencer, a white nationalist in Montana, said Mr. Trump was “ https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/14/us/politics/donald-trump-white-identity.html Jul 13, 2016 NPalgan2 ( talk) 23:03, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
I don't think Wikipedia should err on the side of caution, as NPalgan2 suggest. We follow our verifiability policy, which means we call a spade a spade. Multiple reliable sources say Spencer is a white supremacist, and we've found no reliable sources saying he's not a white supremacist. That should settle the matter. In fact it does, since we have consensus. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 23:23, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
Video posted online by the outlet shows the white supremacist speaking to...The article later comments on Spencer's denial of being a supremacist, and dismisses it with a counterpoint from his own words:
Spencer denied being a white supremacist in a December 2016 interview with Ganim. But, in that interview he said, "Only white people can support what we call Western civilization." He also has said there should be a "peaceful ethnic cleansing," meaning individuals not of European descent should voluntarily leave the United States.CNN directly contrasted his self-description with his stated beliefs. Grayfell ( talk) 01:24, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
The simplified wording [16] is an improvement. Nomoskedasticity ( talk) 06:59, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
Can someone with more technical knowledge of talk pages please add links to the talk page archives? -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 20:13, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
EvergreenFir, would you mind changing the archiving to the standard automatic scheme, rather than one click archiving? I just noticed that a discussion that was started on January 21 was then one click archived 16 minutes later. Granted, it was a pretty weak discussion topic, but that shouldn't have happened. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 20:10, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
Richard's alt right magazine/website has put forth the questions on whether we need the black race and whether black genocide should be completed, via archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20120216183528/http://www.alternativeright.com/main/the-magazine/is-black-genocide-right It further delves into what would be the easiest way to dispose of them etc — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.0.114.9 ( talk) 14:40 27 January 2017
A lot of media is covering this. I found out about it via SNL. While the incident itself probably isn't notable, it seems like the reaction is. Also seems to be speculation about identity if masked assailant. Ranze ( talk) 08:06, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
Links:
The ‘alt-right’ arrives in Alexandria http://alextimes.com/2017/01/the-alt-right-arrives-in-alexandria/
Richard Spencer's 'One-Stop Shop' for the Alt-Right - The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/01/a-one-stop-shop-for-the-alt-right/512921/
For one Alexandria neighborhood, the 'alt-right' is all wrong https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/for-one-alexandria-neighborhood-the-alt-right-is-all-wrong/2017/01/17/d4f893b6-dce6-11e6-ad42-f3375f271c9c_story.html
Thanks. 152.180.6.2 ( talk) 20:14, 30 January 2017 (UTC)
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The first line calls Richard Spencer "a noted American white supremacist". Each of the "citations" of this claim link to websites that state that Richard claims not to be a white supremacist, while the website refers to him a white supremacist anyway without presenting sufficient evidence to support their claim. Several people have called him a white supremacist, but that doesn't make it so. Please change the text from "white supremacist" to "political activist" or even to "political activist who has been called a white supremacist, but claims not to be." or something along those lines. The original citations can remain. 74.199.66.41 ( talk) 22:34, 31 January 2017 (UTC)
The title of this article isn't consistent with our naming policies and guidelines, which suggest that we should move this article to Richard Spencer (white supremacist). The vast majority of reliable independent sources refer to Spencer as Richard Spencer, not Richard B. Spencer, and then we have to disambiguate him from the many other notable Richard Spencers. I would be bold and make the move myself but I'd like to achieve consensus first due to the controversial nature of the proposed title. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 18:02, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
I disagree, current article title is in accordance with policy WP:NCDAB "Natural disambiguation. When there is another term (such as Apartment instead of Flat) or more complete name (such as English language instead of English) that is unambiguous, commonly used in English (even without being the most common term), and equally clear, that term is typically the best to use... Natural disambiguation is generally preferable to parenthetical disambiguation" The current title Richard B. Spencer has been or is mostly used by many RSs - The Atlantic, Chronicle of Higher Education, The Guardian, Newsweek, NYT, CNN, etc. NPalgan2 ( talk) 20:56, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
@ BrittanyPBone: I have reverted your unilateral (and obviously premature) page move. Please join the discussion here and wait for a consensus. Fyddlestix ( talk) 18:13, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
[1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] -- BrittanyPBone ( talk) 19:00, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
references
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Does anyone object to a move to Richard Spencer (white nationalist), and if so, please explain. -- Dr. Fleischman ( talk) 21:39, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
I propose we close this discussion. The only two "support" editors are recently-created accounts and looking at [21] and [22], their flurry of recent activity has been mostly concentrated on this talk page. They're both apparently very comfortable with Wiki procedures and terminology despite their recent appearance on the site, and if they're not sock puppets of some other account, I'll eat my keyboard. Rockypedia ( talk) 01:33, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Acording to this source http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2016/08/now-even-white-nationalists-want-gay-friends/ it refer his stance on homosexuality.
It speaks about how he barred matthew heimbach since he was too anti-homosexual.
"Richard Spencer is president of the white-nationalist National Policy Institute and according to SPLC has made overtures to the LGBTQ community. He’s considered one of the founders of the Alt Right, and last year barred homophobes from attending their annual convention, choosing pro-LGBTQ speakers and turning away at least one antigay speaker."
There is even a source inside that links to SPLC about this to be reliable source. BLP violation or not? 83.209.66.168 ( talk) 14:45, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Where is this supposed "clear consensus" that the header should ONLY say "white supremacist" and leave out "white nationalist?" I count 4 "opposes" to calling Spencer a "white nationalist" and 3 supports. How is that a "clear consensus?" Not even Jared Taylor has the header "white supremacist" and he has an equal amount of sources that call him one. JRBx45x ( talk) 13:24, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
Has anyone provided a single link that proves Spencer "promotes" White Surpremacism? Every single source on the article states he promotes White nationalism, pan-Europeanism and Identitarianism. Can't find a single one that says he promotes the ideology of White Supremacism, which is not equivalent to the prior three. Until that's done, I'm removing the word "promoting" from the first sentence and will continue to do so. Bulldog123 21:14, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
We need to just change the lead sentence to "Richard Spencer is an American white nationalist and white supremacist." There's plenty of non-opinion reliable sources for each of those descriptions and this wording would eliminate the word "promoting". Enough of these white-washing attempts to make Spencer more palatable to the masses. If a person doesn't want to be described as a white supremacist, he should stop publicly espousing white supremacist views. Rockypedia ( talk) 05:55, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
Wikipedia defines white supremacy as a " racist ideology centered upon the belief, and the promotion of the belief, that white people are superior in certain characteristics, traits, and attributes to people of other racial backgrounds and that therefore white people should politically, economically and socially rule non-white people." How can a man who self-evidently advocates separatism meet this definition? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:282:b00:a7e0:48b4:76cb:4df4:3a1a ( talk) 20:49, 20 February 2017
Are nine citations necessary in the introductory sentence to substantiate that he is a white supremacist? It seems like overkill to include so many sources in that spot.-- TM 17:28, 18 February 2017 (UTC)
Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is an American white supremacist.[3] He is president of the National Policy Institute, a white nationalist think tank, as well as Washington Summit Publishers. Spencer has stated that he rejects the description of white supremacist, and describes himself as an identitarian. You people are so biased. You think all of your readers are too stupid to be able to read the article and come to their own conclusions, so you insist on applying a label to this guy that he expressly denies. Fuck wikipedia and fuck the people who wrote this page. You can justify your behavior any way you want, but remember the golden rule, assholes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:1c0:8200:4830:b561:b3e7:7c45:5e0 ( talk) 10:41, 25 February 2017
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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Why does it say "white supremacist" even if he isn't one? Isn't that defamation? Thanks. Imageuploader ( talk) 18:51, 7 June 2017 (UTC)
There is no "consensus". There is a plurality of leftist propagandists here who outnumber the honest contributors, and who bluster on until the honest people give up and leave. I'm not a fan of Spencer, but lying about him reflects badly on Wikipedia. 77Mike77 ( talk) 13:05, 8 June 2017 (UTC)
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"White Supremacist" is slander. Ruling over other races is not part of this man's belief. READ THE WIKIPEDIA ARTICLE White Nationalism and TELL ME how this does not more closely reflect his actual beliefs? "White supremacist" isn't an actual thing; it is a slur. "White nationalist" is actually a belief. Wikipedia, if it is to remain professional, is NOT to use slurs in articles for public figures that are often in the news! I can find plenty of links referring to Spencer as a "White nationalist". He has said he has no problem with that term, and it is infinitely more accurate. X06 ( talk) 08:12, 25 May 2017 (UTC)
Ummmmm.... Volunteer Marek ( talk) 08:54, 27 May 2017 (UTC)
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Richard Spencer is a white nationalist, not a white supremacist. 75.120.137.83 ( talk) 21:38, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
Spencer just said in his talk at Auburn University that he and his wife are not separated, contrary to what this article says. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.51.13.252 ( talk) 01:44, 19 April 2017 (UTC)
I would have thought Spencer himself is a reliable enough source to determine if his marriage is over or not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.244.200.80 ( talk) 17:05, 6 May 2017 (UTC)