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"Charges have been leveled" seems a bit extreme and perhaps non-NPOV. He didn't commit any crime if he did push himself too hard and has suffered brain damage (I don't know either way) as a result. His mountaineering accomplishments cannot be any less great if such "charges" are true. Every climber has the option to push himself to extreme (yes, I'm sure most accomplished climbers have pushed themselves to such limits). Sounds to me like there's some mountaineers out there that might be just a little too jealous of his astounding accomplishments. I believe Anatoli Boukreev summitted Everest at least once w/o supplemental oxygen but was not a solo ascent. RedWolf 06:46, May 4, 2004 (UTC)
-- Goran Kropp soloed Everest without supplementary oxygen.
I've removed to here, for work that may make it suitable to the article, the whole 'graph
It was too vague even before the yeti stuff was added, and "possibly related" is either original research or even less acceptable vagueness than before. What is it that the sources say? -- that may help work up encyclopedic language.
--
Jerzy
(t) 03:36, 2005 Apr 11 (UTC)
Maybe something about his competition with Kukuczka "who would be first to reach all 14 peaks" should be added and the controversies explained? Szopen 13:51, 18 January 2006 (UTC)
Messner and Knopp are not the only one to achieve a solo ascent to Everest without using oxygen. For instance also
Alison Hargreaves (a woman) accomplished that goal (she was the second one after R.Messner), and likely many others somebody else.
gala.martin (
what?)
20:07, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
The article says he lost seven, but I recall that in the Herzog film he says he still has 4 (this is from memory so I might be mistaken) ... presumably he wasn't born with 11. Do we have a citable source for the number of toes lost? Stumps 05:10, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
Anyway, I believe that this article by The Guardian is likely the most reliable. You can find there some words by Messner himself, where he says seven toes. The Guardian has always been quite interested and precise about Messner related stuff, so I think seven toes is likely right. Probably, he lost other toes or fingers later, years after the Nanga Parbat.
Is there any reason to allow "Ben Folds Five" to do promotion on this page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.58.241.44 ( talk) 21:05, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
Mentioning that he was culturally referenced by their album title is hardly promotion, especially since the band disbanded years ago. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.207.42.250 ( talk) 01:24, 24 October 2008 (UTC)
I have to agree that it's annoying that the only reference under "pop culture" is this obscure album... Messner is obviously part of pop culture by his own accomplishments, very much more so than this obscure band. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.195.184 ( talk) 19:19, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Ben Folds Five is not an obscure band. He's toured the world several times headlining with leading artists. You guys are idiots. This is way too subjective. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.207.93.164 ( talk) 09:26, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
That was indeed Messner's climb of Nanga Parbat in 1978. He started at Base Camp and made the whole ascent on his own. Without using bottled oxygen and without installing high camps or fixed ropes.
Hermann Buhl's first ascent of the same mountain in 1953 was organized by an expedition. Buhl's soloing started from an high camp and ended at the same high camp. Buhl's achivement is of course extraordinary but it is not considered a solo climb.
--
Rupert Pupkin (
talk)
12:53, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
As most books by Reinhold are published in German [first editions] it might be worthwhile to add a list of'm to this article. However, that being said, it's quite a list and it'd almost double the size of this article. I've set up a preliminary list HERE and I'd appreciate any input or comments on this. TIA, Qwrk ( talk) 12:48, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
Messner is not german; he is Italian from a german language area, but that doesn't make him a german. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.13.176.167 ( talk) 14:19, 23 July 2010 (UTC)
It would be more correct to say "Alto Adige" instead of "South Tyrol". In fact Tyrol is an old region that doesn't exist anymore;today it is called Alto Adige. It is like saying that sarkozy is a politician from Gaul or beckham a sportman from Britannia : ) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.13.176.106 ( talk) 20:04, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
This article states:
On the morning of 27 June, Reinhold Messner was of the view that the weather would deteriorate rapidly, and set off alone from the last high-altitude camp. Surprisingly his brother climbed after him and caught him up before the summit.
So the version of events here is that Reinhold set off alone FOLLOWED by Günther. However, the page on Günther has a different version of events:
Günther ascended Nanga Parbat alone up the Rupal face during the middle of the night, which was at the time, the highest known vertical climb in the world. Messner was followed several hours later by his brother Reinhold who was a more experienced climber. Reinhold caught up to Günther later in the morning, and Günther soon began to show sign of altitude sickness and exhaustion by trying to maintain his pace.
In this version Günther leaves first, followed by Reinhold. So which is correct? ( Worbleswick ( talk) 01:23, 31 July 2011 (UTC))
The article says differently in different places. Is it Franz Jäger or Frank Jäger? Limbero ( talk) 17:56, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
It always bothered me a little that not more is said in this article about Messner's part in the history of the Seven Summits. Well, I added a section tonight. It's just that I'm not very happy with the wording. I'm going to try to rewrite it tomorrow or the next day. In the mean time, I invite anyone who feels they can improve the section to have at it. Thanks. -- RacerX11 Talk to me Stalk me 03:42, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
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He's ethnically austrian/german and this should be mentioned. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.24.244.212 ( talk) 05:43, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
This plainly false. Every climber, including Messner, saw that the weather would be fair. This has repeatedly been confirmed by Werner Haim, Max von Kienlin, and Hans Saler in publications in print.-- 2A02:8388:8180:B000:A1EF:5097:C1EA:EAEB ( talk) 11:47, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
Is cited from script of Jurassic Park, a fictional film, (the second film in Spielberg’s franchise from the 1990s). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amsu81 ( talk • contribs) 04:05, 16 June 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 14:18, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
Who was the first one to solo Mount Everest?
Both the Franz Oppurg article and this one about Messner claim they are the first to solo ascent Mount Everest. Either this article or the Oppurg's one must be incorrect. Uwsi ( talk) 21:52, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
No one ever puts in a sentence that says, "His father was 6 years older than his mother." On any wikipedia biography that I know of.
It's only when the woman is older. Fascinating.
Further, it's not even for every case of older woman/younger man. In this case, it's just four years! And it's completely deducible by the reader by simply looking at their birth dates.
I do wonder why this article found that detail so important that it belonged in the top of the article. El Cubedo ( talk) 20:23, 17 December 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Reinhold Messner article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
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This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
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A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on October 16, 2011 and October 16, 2016. |
This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
"Charges have been leveled" seems a bit extreme and perhaps non-NPOV. He didn't commit any crime if he did push himself too hard and has suffered brain damage (I don't know either way) as a result. His mountaineering accomplishments cannot be any less great if such "charges" are true. Every climber has the option to push himself to extreme (yes, I'm sure most accomplished climbers have pushed themselves to such limits). Sounds to me like there's some mountaineers out there that might be just a little too jealous of his astounding accomplishments. I believe Anatoli Boukreev summitted Everest at least once w/o supplemental oxygen but was not a solo ascent. RedWolf 06:46, May 4, 2004 (UTC)
-- Goran Kropp soloed Everest without supplementary oxygen.
I've removed to here, for work that may make it suitable to the article, the whole 'graph
It was too vague even before the yeti stuff was added, and "possibly related" is either original research or even less acceptable vagueness than before. What is it that the sources say? -- that may help work up encyclopedic language.
--
Jerzy
(t) 03:36, 2005 Apr 11 (UTC)
Maybe something about his competition with Kukuczka "who would be first to reach all 14 peaks" should be added and the controversies explained? Szopen 13:51, 18 January 2006 (UTC)
Messner and Knopp are not the only one to achieve a solo ascent to Everest without using oxygen. For instance also
Alison Hargreaves (a woman) accomplished that goal (she was the second one after R.Messner), and likely many others somebody else.
gala.martin (
what?)
20:07, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
The article says he lost seven, but I recall that in the Herzog film he says he still has 4 (this is from memory so I might be mistaken) ... presumably he wasn't born with 11. Do we have a citable source for the number of toes lost? Stumps 05:10, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
Anyway, I believe that this article by The Guardian is likely the most reliable. You can find there some words by Messner himself, where he says seven toes. The Guardian has always been quite interested and precise about Messner related stuff, so I think seven toes is likely right. Probably, he lost other toes or fingers later, years after the Nanga Parbat.
Is there any reason to allow "Ben Folds Five" to do promotion on this page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.58.241.44 ( talk) 21:05, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
Mentioning that he was culturally referenced by their album title is hardly promotion, especially since the band disbanded years ago. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.207.42.250 ( talk) 01:24, 24 October 2008 (UTC)
I have to agree that it's annoying that the only reference under "pop culture" is this obscure album... Messner is obviously part of pop culture by his own accomplishments, very much more so than this obscure band. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.195.184 ( talk) 19:19, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Ben Folds Five is not an obscure band. He's toured the world several times headlining with leading artists. You guys are idiots. This is way too subjective. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.207.93.164 ( talk) 09:26, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
That was indeed Messner's climb of Nanga Parbat in 1978. He started at Base Camp and made the whole ascent on his own. Without using bottled oxygen and without installing high camps or fixed ropes.
Hermann Buhl's first ascent of the same mountain in 1953 was organized by an expedition. Buhl's soloing started from an high camp and ended at the same high camp. Buhl's achivement is of course extraordinary but it is not considered a solo climb.
--
Rupert Pupkin (
talk)
12:53, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
As most books by Reinhold are published in German [first editions] it might be worthwhile to add a list of'm to this article. However, that being said, it's quite a list and it'd almost double the size of this article. I've set up a preliminary list HERE and I'd appreciate any input or comments on this. TIA, Qwrk ( talk) 12:48, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
Messner is not german; he is Italian from a german language area, but that doesn't make him a german. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.13.176.167 ( talk) 14:19, 23 July 2010 (UTC)
It would be more correct to say "Alto Adige" instead of "South Tyrol". In fact Tyrol is an old region that doesn't exist anymore;today it is called Alto Adige. It is like saying that sarkozy is a politician from Gaul or beckham a sportman from Britannia : ) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.13.176.106 ( talk) 20:04, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
This article states:
On the morning of 27 June, Reinhold Messner was of the view that the weather would deteriorate rapidly, and set off alone from the last high-altitude camp. Surprisingly his brother climbed after him and caught him up before the summit.
So the version of events here is that Reinhold set off alone FOLLOWED by Günther. However, the page on Günther has a different version of events:
Günther ascended Nanga Parbat alone up the Rupal face during the middle of the night, which was at the time, the highest known vertical climb in the world. Messner was followed several hours later by his brother Reinhold who was a more experienced climber. Reinhold caught up to Günther later in the morning, and Günther soon began to show sign of altitude sickness and exhaustion by trying to maintain his pace.
In this version Günther leaves first, followed by Reinhold. So which is correct? ( Worbleswick ( talk) 01:23, 31 July 2011 (UTC))
The article says differently in different places. Is it Franz Jäger or Frank Jäger? Limbero ( talk) 17:56, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
It always bothered me a little that not more is said in this article about Messner's part in the history of the Seven Summits. Well, I added a section tonight. It's just that I'm not very happy with the wording. I'm going to try to rewrite it tomorrow or the next day. In the mean time, I invite anyone who feels they can improve the section to have at it. Thanks. -- RacerX11 Talk to me Stalk me 03:42, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Reinhold Messner. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 20:30, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
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He's ethnically austrian/german and this should be mentioned. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.24.244.212 ( talk) 05:43, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
This plainly false. Every climber, including Messner, saw that the weather would be fair. This has repeatedly been confirmed by Werner Haim, Max von Kienlin, and Hans Saler in publications in print.-- 2A02:8388:8180:B000:A1EF:5097:C1EA:EAEB ( talk) 11:47, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
Is cited from script of Jurassic Park, a fictional film, (the second film in Spielberg’s franchise from the 1990s). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amsu81 ( talk • contribs) 04:05, 16 June 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 14:18, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
Who was the first one to solo Mount Everest?
Both the Franz Oppurg article and this one about Messner claim they are the first to solo ascent Mount Everest. Either this article or the Oppurg's one must be incorrect. Uwsi ( talk) 21:52, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
No one ever puts in a sentence that says, "His father was 6 years older than his mother." On any wikipedia biography that I know of.
It's only when the woman is older. Fascinating.
Further, it's not even for every case of older woman/younger man. In this case, it's just four years! And it's completely deducible by the reader by simply looking at their birth dates.
I do wonder why this article found that detail so important that it belonged in the top of the article. El Cubedo ( talk) 20:23, 17 December 2023 (UTC)