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Is this correct?
I think it should say "object-orientation", not "object-oriented". I have made this adjustment before and it was changed back. Am I in the wrong here?
EDIT: Boy I feel stupid. I did not read the full sentence. I'm sorry for wasting your time.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Megakacktus ( talk • contribs) 22:20, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
It's important to make the distinction between language and implementation, but I don't think we need separate articles to do so. For the bulk of its users, and in many of the sources, CPython is Python, unless otherwise specified. AFAIK, the language spec is "do what CPython does (or documents)".
Also, a look at the current material on CPython shows a discussion of the GIL, but little else of encyclopedic value that isn't also discussed in this article. I think a section in this article is a better place to discuss the main implementation than a separate article. QVVERTYVS ( hm?) 19:40, 10 December 2015 (UTC)
I just linked to blogory.org after reading the policy guidelines.
Understandably Wikipedia is very sensitive about links, and so I want to be most respectful of the site. In case there is any concern about my posting, here is the background.
I run blogory.org. As of today, Jan 19, 2016 it has 169 links about Python, and 63 links about zodb.
Blogory.org is a site very similar to DMOZ or Yahoo Directory.
In contrast DMOZ, has 328 links about Python, and 1 link about zodb.
Really DMOZ is so out of date.
So I linked to the appropriate pages of my website from Wikipedia->Python blogory.org/python
and from Wikipedia->zodb blogory.org/zodb
I presume that is okay under the external links policy: "A well-chosen link to a directory of websites or organizations. Long lists of links are not acceptable. A directory link may be a permanent link or a temporary measure put in place while external links are being discussed on the article's talk page."
Please let me know if there is anything I should do to make this link more appealing to the Wikipedia community. Clozinski ( talk) 14:07, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
Currently the paragraph on the "=" statement is very long and does not really go well with the explanations on other statements. For example the 'if' statement is described like this:
if
statement, which conditionally executes a block of code, along with else
and elif
(a contraction of else-if).This is easy to understand for even for beginners. On the other hand the "=" statement is described like this:
I think this is too complicated and doesn't fit with the rest of this list. My suggestion would be:
=
, which assigns a value to a variable.We could move the longer version to Python syntax and semantics.
What do you think? -- Marko Knoebl ( talk) 23:09, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
=
, which assigns a value to a variable.", no more than there is in the statement "The
if
statement, which conditionally executes a block of code, along with else
and elif
(a contraction of else-if)." Both of these are trivially obvious to anyone with the rudimentary level of knowledge we would assume for a reader interested in an article on a specific programming language. Both fail WP:MANUAL (by not even reaching that level!). Is there a single reader who reads past the lead (which introduces Python as an unsurprising block-structured procedural language) and will then learn anything new from such a bland statement? If we are to have descriptions no more detail than that, then we might as well state nothing about the assignment operator or the if statement at all and just save the length.Under Typing, we currently have, "Type constraints are not checked at compile time...", although Python is introduced as an interpreted language. This is a paradox (as the linked articles for "compile time" and "interpreted language" support).
What is the intended meaning here? There seem to be two possibilities:
1. "Type constraints are not checked once, statically, but only when and if they are executed" (could even be independently checked every time they are executed).
2. "On those occasions when Python code is to be compiled instead of interpreted (as with PyPy, Cython, or other), type constraints are not checked at compile time."
Jmacwiki ( talk) 05:36, 4 December 2016 (UTC)
Some other Wikipedia pages about programming languages have a subheader titled "criticism". Python's page doesn't have that. List criticism below to add it to the future subheader. Andrew Gunner ( talk) 18:24, 23 February 2017 (UTC)
https://docs.python.org/3/whatsnew/3.6.html-- Mister Infamous ( talk) 05:53, 7 March 2017 (UTC)
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I just read over the article, and came away mostly baffled. I am reasonably computer literate, and recognize some of the terms in the lead, but came away with only a slightly better understanding of Python than I had before I read it. Someone with more expertise needs to take a shot at making this more readable for the general public. Imagine your mom reading this, your mom who knows how to send and receive emails and can open up a Word document but who has never modified her computer registry or attempted to replace her internal hard drive— she knows there is a difference between a Mac and a PC, but isn't sure what it is. How would you explain Python to her in a way that would allow her to understand it? That is what this article needs to fix. The multiple links in the lead, etc., are good for obtaining this information, but Mom shouldn't have to click on a bunch of links to understand the basics of this article. Anyhow, someone please think about it. Thanks! KDS4444 ( talk) 23:30, 21 August 2017 (UTC)
I disagree as well. I only started a little while ago,and I think I've gotten the hang of it. Here are some reasons I think it's good: 1.It has "batteries included". That means it comes with everything you need to get started. 2.It has good documentation. There is a pretty big online community, and the download comes with a help program. There are also lots of books. 3.Good for beginners. Python is easy to learn,but very powerful. I think you should try. CrazyMinecart88 ( talk) 19:09, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
The lead says, "and a syntax that allows programmers to express concepts in fewer lines of code". Should that be removed? I have two problems. One, fewer than what (it says fewer than C or Java, but that's not saying much because they're small languages)? And two, it's not my experience anyway: compared to some languages (e.g. Perl, Matlab), I'd say Python is more verbose but also more readable. And it's not what I'd call a defining feature of python. Adpete ( talk) 01:36, 14 March 2018 (UTC)
I disagree. It says (said) "express *concepts* in fewer lines of code. Trying to create a hash map of linked lists in C requires an enormous number of LOC (assuming one statement = one line). I would consider the syntax a defining characteristic of the language. The statement was well ref'd, so I'd like it back in. peterl ( talk) 03:27, 21 March 2018 (UTC)
Should the second sentence of the lead in our very highest level introductory article on Python throw new readers immediately into the issue of Py2 vs Py3? See [2] & [3]. Andy Dingley ( talk) 09:53, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
Hello. New wiki editor here so I apologize if this topic has been hashed out before(although I couldn't find it in the talk archives). Would it be a good idea to add a short section about commond, and free, ways that programmers learn Python? I am thinking Python's built in library turtle, Google's free python course, etc. Since many people who land on this wiki will have at least a cursory interest in actually learning the basics of Python, it seems like a good place to encourage free and open source materials. Muhareer ( talk) 15:32, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
This
edit request to
Python (programming language) has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Delete "(see Wikipedia's "Python IDE" article), " since there is not such article (any more?) and the link target is the same as the "see also" a few lines above. 2001:638:A0A:1192:1CFE:845C:B132:107F ( talk) 10:59, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
I came to this page to read about Python, but first I had to sit through how awesome the creator is, how long he worked as a leader and innovator, see a picture of him drinking beer... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.221.162.176 ( talk) 15:05, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
in the section
Statements and control flow
it says under the description of the for keyword that it:
iterates over an iterable object, capturing each element to a local variable for use by the attached block.
the variable that the for loop uses is NOT local to the body of the loop, it is GLOBAL to the file:
for name in ['ted', 'ed', 'ned']: pass
print(name) # this will print 'ned' because name is NOT local
(interestingly the loop variable in a list comprehension or generator expression IS local.)
Quizdog ( talk) 03:32, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
name
cannot be accessed from another function.
Johnuniq (
talk)
04:05, 24 November 2018 (UTC)Who's doing the math here -- some magazine article? Even December 1989 until July 2018 isn't 30 years. Therefore September 1990 through July 2018 is definitely less than 30 years. If Wikipedia is just duplicating glorified journalistic fluff then what good is it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.228.181.182 ( talk • contribs) 12:44, 12 August 2018 (UTC)
In the infobox, there is a list of "Major implementations". The list is currently in alphabetical order, but this puts a relatively minor implementation at the beginning. I think listing them in order of importance would be more appropriate. It might be difficult to determine the order of importance, but the Python (programming language)#Implementations section does a good job of briefly explaining the differences between the versions. As CPython is the reference implementation, it should be the first listed in the infobox, and other implementations which are highly compliant and support Python 3 should follow. Implementations which have a limited subset of the Python language or standard library should be later in the list, or not included in the infobox at all. Just my opinion, I made an edit to this infobox list on 20 December 2018 and I'm not going to edit war over it.- gadfium 22:29, 13 March 2019 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place as to whether Portal:Python (programming language) is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.
The page will be discussed at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Haskell (programming language) (it's part of a bundled nomination) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
Users may edit the page during the discussion, including to improve the page to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the deletion notice from the top of the page. North America 1000 00:44, 26 March 2019 (UTC)
PEP8 redirects here but is not explained in the article. -- Beland ( talk) 15:48, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
There is a section Languages influenced by Python. There should also be a section describing what languages that influenced Python. It seems likely to me that some of the features that are listed as being influenced by Python were actually features of languages that existed prior to Python. Sam Tomato ( talk) 17:03, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 7 | Archive 8 | Archive 9 | Archive 10 | Archive 11 |
Is this correct?
I think it should say "object-orientation", not "object-oriented". I have made this adjustment before and it was changed back. Am I in the wrong here?
EDIT: Boy I feel stupid. I did not read the full sentence. I'm sorry for wasting your time.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Megakacktus ( talk • contribs) 22:20, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
It's important to make the distinction between language and implementation, but I don't think we need separate articles to do so. For the bulk of its users, and in many of the sources, CPython is Python, unless otherwise specified. AFAIK, the language spec is "do what CPython does (or documents)".
Also, a look at the current material on CPython shows a discussion of the GIL, but little else of encyclopedic value that isn't also discussed in this article. I think a section in this article is a better place to discuss the main implementation than a separate article. QVVERTYVS ( hm?) 19:40, 10 December 2015 (UTC)
I just linked to blogory.org after reading the policy guidelines.
Understandably Wikipedia is very sensitive about links, and so I want to be most respectful of the site. In case there is any concern about my posting, here is the background.
I run blogory.org. As of today, Jan 19, 2016 it has 169 links about Python, and 63 links about zodb.
Blogory.org is a site very similar to DMOZ or Yahoo Directory.
In contrast DMOZ, has 328 links about Python, and 1 link about zodb.
Really DMOZ is so out of date.
So I linked to the appropriate pages of my website from Wikipedia->Python blogory.org/python
and from Wikipedia->zodb blogory.org/zodb
I presume that is okay under the external links policy: "A well-chosen link to a directory of websites or organizations. Long lists of links are not acceptable. A directory link may be a permanent link or a temporary measure put in place while external links are being discussed on the article's talk page."
Please let me know if there is anything I should do to make this link more appealing to the Wikipedia community. Clozinski ( talk) 14:07, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
Currently the paragraph on the "=" statement is very long and does not really go well with the explanations on other statements. For example the 'if' statement is described like this:
if
statement, which conditionally executes a block of code, along with else
and elif
(a contraction of else-if).This is easy to understand for even for beginners. On the other hand the "=" statement is described like this:
I think this is too complicated and doesn't fit with the rest of this list. My suggestion would be:
=
, which assigns a value to a variable.We could move the longer version to Python syntax and semantics.
What do you think? -- Marko Knoebl ( talk) 23:09, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
=
, which assigns a value to a variable.", no more than there is in the statement "The
if
statement, which conditionally executes a block of code, along with else
and elif
(a contraction of else-if)." Both of these are trivially obvious to anyone with the rudimentary level of knowledge we would assume for a reader interested in an article on a specific programming language. Both fail WP:MANUAL (by not even reaching that level!). Is there a single reader who reads past the lead (which introduces Python as an unsurprising block-structured procedural language) and will then learn anything new from such a bland statement? If we are to have descriptions no more detail than that, then we might as well state nothing about the assignment operator or the if statement at all and just save the length.Under Typing, we currently have, "Type constraints are not checked at compile time...", although Python is introduced as an interpreted language. This is a paradox (as the linked articles for "compile time" and "interpreted language" support).
What is the intended meaning here? There seem to be two possibilities:
1. "Type constraints are not checked once, statically, but only when and if they are executed" (could even be independently checked every time they are executed).
2. "On those occasions when Python code is to be compiled instead of interpreted (as with PyPy, Cython, or other), type constraints are not checked at compile time."
Jmacwiki ( talk) 05:36, 4 December 2016 (UTC)
Some other Wikipedia pages about programming languages have a subheader titled "criticism". Python's page doesn't have that. List criticism below to add it to the future subheader. Andrew Gunner ( talk) 18:24, 23 February 2017 (UTC)
https://docs.python.org/3/whatsnew/3.6.html-- Mister Infamous ( talk) 05:53, 7 March 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Python (programming language). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 22:12, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
I just read over the article, and came away mostly baffled. I am reasonably computer literate, and recognize some of the terms in the lead, but came away with only a slightly better understanding of Python than I had before I read it. Someone with more expertise needs to take a shot at making this more readable for the general public. Imagine your mom reading this, your mom who knows how to send and receive emails and can open up a Word document but who has never modified her computer registry or attempted to replace her internal hard drive— she knows there is a difference between a Mac and a PC, but isn't sure what it is. How would you explain Python to her in a way that would allow her to understand it? That is what this article needs to fix. The multiple links in the lead, etc., are good for obtaining this information, but Mom shouldn't have to click on a bunch of links to understand the basics of this article. Anyhow, someone please think about it. Thanks! KDS4444 ( talk) 23:30, 21 August 2017 (UTC)
I disagree as well. I only started a little while ago,and I think I've gotten the hang of it. Here are some reasons I think it's good: 1.It has "batteries included". That means it comes with everything you need to get started. 2.It has good documentation. There is a pretty big online community, and the download comes with a help program. There are also lots of books. 3.Good for beginners. Python is easy to learn,but very powerful. I think you should try. CrazyMinecart88 ( talk) 19:09, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
The lead says, "and a syntax that allows programmers to express concepts in fewer lines of code". Should that be removed? I have two problems. One, fewer than what (it says fewer than C or Java, but that's not saying much because they're small languages)? And two, it's not my experience anyway: compared to some languages (e.g. Perl, Matlab), I'd say Python is more verbose but also more readable. And it's not what I'd call a defining feature of python. Adpete ( talk) 01:36, 14 March 2018 (UTC)
I disagree. It says (said) "express *concepts* in fewer lines of code. Trying to create a hash map of linked lists in C requires an enormous number of LOC (assuming one statement = one line). I would consider the syntax a defining characteristic of the language. The statement was well ref'd, so I'd like it back in. peterl ( talk) 03:27, 21 March 2018 (UTC)
Should the second sentence of the lead in our very highest level introductory article on Python throw new readers immediately into the issue of Py2 vs Py3? See [2] & [3]. Andy Dingley ( talk) 09:53, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
Hello. New wiki editor here so I apologize if this topic has been hashed out before(although I couldn't find it in the talk archives). Would it be a good idea to add a short section about commond, and free, ways that programmers learn Python? I am thinking Python's built in library turtle, Google's free python course, etc. Since many people who land on this wiki will have at least a cursory interest in actually learning the basics of Python, it seems like a good place to encourage free and open source materials. Muhareer ( talk) 15:32, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
This
edit request to
Python (programming language) has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Delete "(see Wikipedia's "Python IDE" article), " since there is not such article (any more?) and the link target is the same as the "see also" a few lines above. 2001:638:A0A:1192:1CFE:845C:B132:107F ( talk) 10:59, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
I came to this page to read about Python, but first I had to sit through how awesome the creator is, how long he worked as a leader and innovator, see a picture of him drinking beer... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.221.162.176 ( talk) 15:05, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
in the section
Statements and control flow
it says under the description of the for keyword that it:
iterates over an iterable object, capturing each element to a local variable for use by the attached block.
the variable that the for loop uses is NOT local to the body of the loop, it is GLOBAL to the file:
for name in ['ted', 'ed', 'ned']: pass
print(name) # this will print 'ned' because name is NOT local
(interestingly the loop variable in a list comprehension or generator expression IS local.)
Quizdog ( talk) 03:32, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
name
cannot be accessed from another function.
Johnuniq (
talk)
04:05, 24 November 2018 (UTC)Who's doing the math here -- some magazine article? Even December 1989 until July 2018 isn't 30 years. Therefore September 1990 through July 2018 is definitely less than 30 years. If Wikipedia is just duplicating glorified journalistic fluff then what good is it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.228.181.182 ( talk • contribs) 12:44, 12 August 2018 (UTC)
In the infobox, there is a list of "Major implementations". The list is currently in alphabetical order, but this puts a relatively minor implementation at the beginning. I think listing them in order of importance would be more appropriate. It might be difficult to determine the order of importance, but the Python (programming language)#Implementations section does a good job of briefly explaining the differences between the versions. As CPython is the reference implementation, it should be the first listed in the infobox, and other implementations which are highly compliant and support Python 3 should follow. Implementations which have a limited subset of the Python language or standard library should be later in the list, or not included in the infobox at all. Just my opinion, I made an edit to this infobox list on 20 December 2018 and I'm not going to edit war over it.- gadfium 22:29, 13 March 2019 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place as to whether Portal:Python (programming language) is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.
The page will be discussed at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Haskell (programming language) (it's part of a bundled nomination) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
Users may edit the page during the discussion, including to improve the page to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the deletion notice from the top of the page. North America 1000 00:44, 26 March 2019 (UTC)
PEP8 redirects here but is not explained in the article. -- Beland ( talk) 15:48, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
There is a section Languages influenced by Python. There should also be a section describing what languages that influenced Python. It seems likely to me that some of the features that are listed as being influenced by Python were actually features of languages that existed prior to Python. Sam Tomato ( talk) 17:03, 27 July 2019 (UTC)