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Hello, I am following up on a suggestion from "Limit-theorem" to discuss the rationale for my edits here, and to seek wider evidence-based feedback and rational consensus as there seems to be some evident disparity of opinion thus far regarding what is acceptable in this regard by several independent editors. There appear to be three parts of the article that need supporting references ("citation needed"), as flagged up at the top of the page, so I supplied one that was requested with an additional recent and apparently novel example that is also backed up by supporting references (I can't help with the other two examples that I can see). What would others suggest to make the article less incongruent? Would it be better to relegate the "Fiction" or real-life "non-academic" examples to a separate article? Protestant Revival ( talk) 22:52, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
There does not seem to be any discussion on the historical usage of the word 'Professor' now. This is a shame, as I wanted to know. The meaning has changed over the years; if anyone is an authority on this, I would welcome their contribution! ixo ( talk) 17:16, 1 April 2013 (UTC)
The text says: "In countries on the northern European mainland, such as Germany, Belgium, The Netherlands and the Scandinavian countries, usage of professor as a legal title is limited much the same way as in most Commonwealth countries, that is, it is reserved for someone who holds a chair."
This is not correct: Germany call many different teaching positions at research or non-research universities "professor". It is not reserved to a "chair" like in the UK system. The same is true for belgium, here all university postions are "professor".
Only the "netherlands" have a system where only a full professor is termed "professor".
I propose that this gets corrected. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.174.192.144 ( talk) 13:39, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
vous — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.228.184.127 ( talk) 21:40, 6 April 2012 (UTC)
I do agree; the same is true in Sweden. Professor is no longer only used for so called (and old-fashioned) "chaired professors" ("ämnesföreträdare"). Since 1990 it is used for all teaching staff that are employed as professors ()and you need not be "chaired" to be what in the US would be a full professor). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.240.172.187 ( talk) 12:22, 12 April 2012 (UTC)
In Scandinavia, Professor is only used for "full Professors," and they are considered to hold a professorial chair. However, generally all faculty members with the appropriate qualifications may be promoted to Professor. Those known as "Associate Professors", "Assistant Professors" and so forth in the US are not entitled to use the title. Bjerrebæk ( talk) 15:53, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
Found one in Edinburgh International Festival: "Sidney Newman, Reid Professor of Music at Edinburgh University". What is the difference from ordinary "professor"? -- Igel B TyMaHe ( talk) 19:29, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
89.134.199.32 ( talk) 18:05, 11 April 2021 (UTC).
[Glad to see that the images have been updated! My former comment is no longer relevant!] The current photo looks like something from the 19th century. Perhaps get something without cork-stoppered bottles of vitriol, an ancient green slate, and one formula from high school chemistry?
Come on, guys! It is time that this edit war ceases and a discussion takes place on this talk page.?
I'll kick it off. Is there any reason why we can not have two images, three images, or even no images? If two, we could have one of a male professor and one of a female professor? However, I guess having images of two US professors is not a good idea? -- Bduke (Discussion) 00:26, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
As a professor, I think that it is important not to rely on a stereotypical picture of a professor i.e. a middle-aged white male, with white hair. There are male and female professors, and from every race and skin colour. I suggest the two options should be no pictures, or at least a mix of professors. I believe the three pictures previously did just that. Geraint_F_Lewis —Preceding undated comment added 02:03, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
Wikipedia articles should be about phenomena and possibly concepts, but not about words. In particular they should not be about foreign words. This is the English wikipedia and therefore this article should be limited to describing the phenomenon that is denoted by the English word "professor". But in many places it strays into trying to clarifying the meaning of non-English words. It should not. -- Ettrig ( talk) 13:19, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
@ Ettrig: IMO it is absolutely okay to include all aspects, including conceptual aspects as well as word-aspects. As well as all those non-English uses came from same etymology. As well etymology (word origin and their changes, a "phenomenon", too! ) and semantics (study of "meaning"), is very much conceptual thing. When our ancestors used the same word for some other usage, they did so only due to some conceptual similarity.
Now, I have the basic right to know and find all such alternative usage at 1 place. And especially when it is an Encyclopedia. It is even okay if you use a disambiguation page for that (at least) ; but please do not lose the connectivity to all other usage.
As well, being a conceptual learner, when I read anything, I always look for whose it is part of. I don't really understand if I trim-away all the surround and focus only the 1 usage and what 'inside' it (and not what 'outside' it); why it still remain conceptual. It would be a tunnel vision then.
116.203.188.158 (
talk)
05:00, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
Corrected the mention in the Lede that Most American college teachers have the title of Professor (or Asst., Assoc. Prof.). It has not been a majority since the 1960s and currently is around 25%.
I want to gain consensus before editing the Tenure section -- having over 2/3 of the prose be about criticisms of tenure does not seem NPOV.
Thanks, -- Michael Scott Cuthbert (talk) 20:14, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
First, Assistant Professor has already been merged and now redirects here; now is the time for Associate Professor. Fgnievinski ( talk) 19:34, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
Second, although faculty (academic staff) is a useful distinction from faculty (unit), the former is already discussed in the present article (search for "faculty"), so it should just redirect. Fgnievinski ( talk) 14:28, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
This is an utterly nonsensical merge proposal. Wikipedia has vast amounts of articles on various academic ranks in various systems, from Docent, to [[Reader (academic rank), to Privatdozent. Merging all of them into one single article would be hopeless, and not in accordance with policy because of its excessive length (and scope). Merging a general article on academic employees into Professor, which is in most of the world only the most senior rank for an academic, would be totally inappropriate. We need a separate article on academic ranks or faculty positions, that could provide an overview of ranks in various systems, and we need a separate article on the (full) Professor title as it is understood in most of the world (including the English-speaking world), as the highest rank at universities. The article Professor in itself is currently, quite frankly, a mess, and needs to be reduced, not merged with the maybe 100 other articles on other academic ranks at different levels and functions. Bjerrebæk ( talk) 07:03, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
There are several sub-proposals, so let me split it up:
Which of these A,B,C do you agree/disagree? Thanks. Fgnievinski ( talk) 17:54, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
A possible solution is to make this article into an article on the full professor rank and rename it Professor (highest academic rank) ("Professor, informally also known as full professor, is the highest academic rank at universities and other institutions of higher education in most of the world ..."), and have either a disambiguation page or a shorter article here addressing the history and different uses of the word "professor" (for example, it can mean simply "teacher" (at primary or secondary level) or "music teacher" in some countries/settings, but obviously this is not the same rank or position as the (full) Professor rank at universities). Bjerrebæk ( talk) 14:46, 1 November 2014 (UTC)
Guys/gals, I see that you're enjoying the discussion. Shall we come to a conclusion. As no one objected from the the split of full professor, I'm hijacking that existing redirect and starting a new article; please improve it as you see fit. I've also started Draft:Professor and Draft:Academics -- please help. This last one I struggled a bit about the name (academic ranks, academic positions, academic occupations, academic personnel, academic titles -- bad choice?), as I thought administrative/managerial positions in academia are better left outside the scope. Then, finally, I'm most eager to carry out the geographical splitting next; what would be a good prefix -- "Academic ranks in..."? Thanks for your thoughts. Fgnievinski ( talk) 02:12, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
I'd say let's not worry too much about the geo-specific pages -- I'd just "dump" each subsec into a separate "Academic ranks in..." page. Fgnievinski ( talk) 22:05, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
If we now start at new and separate article on the full professor rank, and one one overview article on academic ranks, in addition to country-specific articles on academic ranks, we will have to remove the entire "Around the world" and "Salary" sections (and possibly other sections) from this (old) Professor article in my opinion, and make it into a shorter and more general article, or possibly just a disambiguation page, on the various uses of the word or title Professor, e.g.
Bjerrebæk ( talk) 07:49, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
193.251.4.222 ( talk) 16:35, 23 May 2016 (UTC)
Hello all,
I think some work needs to be done in the Salary section. I don't know about the rest, but the statistics for Sweden are definitely incorrect. I'm a PhD Candidate in Sweden, and I earn roughly the amount stated (about €25,000 a year) for that of a professor. This is average for a PhD candidate. Professors tend to earn around the €70,000 mark. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Supermassive 79 ( talk • contribs) 15:55, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
I followed a link from an article about a guy who is a Research Professor of something. To many, this indicates that a "Research Professor" is pretty much the same as a Professor. This is not the case. At least in the US, a Research Track Professor (or Assistant or Associate) is often more like an advanced post-doctoral fellow who is paid by a tenure-track faculty. If I can find a ref for this does anybody have a problem with adding a "Research Track" heading and changing the Tenure to Tenure Track? Desoto10 ( talk) 05:32, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
Never mind. I found the appropriate article explaining the differences. The link should lead to that one, I think. Desoto10 ( talk) 05:38, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
@ OnBeyondZebrax, Bjerrebæk, Vanzylad, and Lexspoon: Please notice this article is supposed to be more general than the one about Professor (highest academic rank) -- please don't duplicate that content here! fgnievinski ( talk) 02:07, 5 September 2016 (UTC)
It seems there is ambiguity in the word "Professor", between the broader Faculty (academic staff) and the narrower Professor (highest academic rank). Maybe we should redirect Professor to either of the two articles above and leave a hatnote indicating the other article? fgnievinski ( talk) 13:53, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
The entire section was deleted because of undue weight, copied here for future use (some content may be relevant for the article):
In [[Islamic Golden Age|Muslim civilisation]], the chair was designated by the [[caliph]] himself. Mostly through recommendation, the caliph made appointments to a professorial chair (''Kursi'' in [[Arabic language|Arabic]]) in a ''[[Madrassah|jami’]]'' ([[university]] or congregational [[madrasah]]). Such was the case of [[Ibn 'Aqil]] (died 1119) who was appointed to a well-known chair in Jami' al-Mansur ([[Baghdad]]), becoming the main teacher of the madrasah. In other cases, a scholar could be appointed to two chairs at the same time, holding a chair in one jami’ and simultaneously holding another in another jami’ or in one of the exclusive institutions.<ref>{{Cite book |last=Nakosteen |first=M. |title=History of Islamic origins of Western Education A.D 800–1350 |publisher=University of Colorado Press |location=Boulder |year=1964 }}</ref> This is the case of particularly distinguished and popular scholars. For example, a certain Ibn al-Banna' (d. 1079) had a chair in Jami' al-Mansur (Baghdad), located in the centre of the riwaq (nave of the [[mosque]]), while simultaneously holding another in Jami' al-Qasr (also Baghdad), around the maqsura (a separate room inside the mosque). Some chairs were also known by the discipline they represented; as, for instance, the chair or study-circle of the traditionalists (''halqat ahl al-hadith''), and that of the grammarians (''halqat al-nahwiyin''). Others were known by the name of the family whose members occupied it in succession; as, for instance, the chair of the [[Barmakid]]s (''halqat al-Barâmika''). Sometimes institutions were specialised in particular study and therefore received a corresponding chair, e.g. the Nizamiya did not have a chair of [[Kalam|Islamic theology]], but only a chair of [[Sharia|Islamic law]].<ref>Al-hassani, Woodcock and Saoud: 1001 Inventions, Muslim Heritage in Our World; FSTC publication, 2007, 2nd Edition, pp.56-57</ref> As to tenure of the chair, once a professor was appointed by the caliph to a chair in one of the main madrasahs (Jamii), he ordinarily held it for the remainder of his lifetime. Cases of lengthy tenure are often reported by biographers, for example [[Ibn al-Kattani|Abu 'All al-Kattani]] (d. 1061), who was in his eighties when he died, had occupied his chair for 50 years. According to George Makdisi and Hugh Goddard, "the fact that we still talk of professors holding the 'chair' of their subject" is thought to allegedly be based on the "traditional [[Islam]]ic pattern of teaching where the professor sits on a chair and the students sit around him", and the term '[[Study circle|academic circles]]' may be derived from the way Islamic students "sat in a circle around their professor, although the ancient Greeks and Romans did this long before, and it is believed Islamic culture took this from these cultures."<ref>{{Cite book|title=A History of Christian-Muslim Relations|first=Hugh|last=Goddard|year=2000|publisher=[[Edinburgh University Press]]|isbn=0-7486-1009-X|page=100|oclc=237514956}}</ref> The term 'professor' itself is believed a translation of the Arabic term ''[[mufti]]'' by Islamic interpretations, which meant "professor of [[Fatwā|legal opinions]], however the word 'professor' was derived long before Islamic culture was formed, in the time of the Ancient Greeks and Romans."<ref name=G-Makdisi>{{Cite journal|last=Makdisi|first=George|title=Scholasticism and Humanism in Classical Islam and the Christian West|journal=Journal of the American Oriental Society|volume=109|issue=2|date=April–June 1989|pages=175–182 [175–77]|doi=10.2307/604423|jstor=604423}}</ref>
— Erik Jr. 17:28, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
I think what we noticed was that EVERY picture on the page was of a white male. The idea was to show that professors are more than just aged white men. By adding McGonagall to the fictional section, we simply acknowledged that other professors (Dumbledore and Snape) who have been on the page for a very long time textually also exist. I'm happy to mix it up--but this should not be a white men only domain. -- tassieg ( talk) 20:36, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
The new picture showed a random, more or less completely unknown African guy who was not even a professor (according to his CV, he has never held the title "Professor" anywhere, and appears to be at instructor-level academically with a day job as a high school teacher). The picture used in the infobox should be of particularly high quality and be representative of what professors are in most of the world. This means, among other things, that the person depicted should be a "full professor", not a high school teacher or instructor, as the American oddity of referring to just about anyone who teaches as "professors" would be laughed out of court in most of the world and is certainly not representative of global usage; on the other hand a "full professor" would be called a professor both in the US and the rest of the world. File:Einstein 1921 by F Schmutzer - restoration.jpg is a much better choice; it shows the world's best known Professor, who is instantly recognizable, and who was an actual Professor at the time the picture was taken; also, the picture is a featured picture, which has been selected for the picture of the day section of the main page next year. -- Bjerrebæk ( talk) 22:16, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
The following statement is false:
In the U.S. and Canada, when an individual states that he is a professor at a university, without any additional qualifying terms (e.g., "adjunct professor, "assistant professor" or "associate professor"), it is typically assumed to mean he is a full professor.
I am an assistant professor at an American university, so I have an idea of what I'm talking about. If someone says they're, say, "a university professor" without qualifying it with "assistant" or "associate", it is not generally assumed they mean full professor; it's simply unclear. The term "professor" in the US is used very widely to refer to any university level instructor; students frequently use the term to refer to or address instructors who don't even have "professor" as part of their job title (e.g., postdocs and lecturers). This is precisely why the term "full professor" exists.
The claim is also not supported by the source provided ( [1]), which in fact uses the unqualified term "professor" to refer to professors in general, without regard to rank. All it claims is that a full professor might be called "simply Professor". And that's not the same thing. So I've removed the statement from this article. Garik ( talk) 14:14, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
Looking for a definition on the web, not having much luck. Ghostofnemo ( talk) 07:16, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Junior professor. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Hildeoc ( talk) 18:48, 8 June 2019 (UTC)
Table of wages is expressed in terms of 2014 Dutch Euros. Is this considered appropriate per Wikipedia guidelines? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.225.38.251 ( talk) 15:56, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
Currently, the Table of wages section presents a table under the caption "NL comparison, 2014, net salaries, in NL purchasing power"; does this refer to the study mentioned two sections above ( Netherlands)? I guess so, because otherwise I've got no idea what NL stands for / means. Can someone who knows for sure confirm it, and ideally edit the article appropriately (probably moving the table to a proper sub-section, and maybe also avoiding the obscure abbreviation "NL")? 95.90.235.121 ( talk) 15:41, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
It is nice to see the picture of Einstein. But he is not that representative of the professor: he was a genius scientist, a researcher, and did not lecture outside of conferences. He had almost no graduate students! I hate to say it but he was too good to be a professor. Feynman would be more representative as, in addition, he was a great educator. Limit-theorem ( talk) 22:21, 9 November 2021 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Chair(professorship) and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 19#Chair(professorship) until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
Steel1943 (
talk)
23:23, 19 October 2022 (UTC)
If Toni Morisson is dead, should her tense as professor be changed to be similar to Einstein's, something like "Toni Morrison as Emeritus..."? 192.226.178.38 ( talk) 04:44, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
There is a picture there of Socrates, as an early professor, but the article then makes out that professor is a Western Europe 14th century term.
The history and alternative usage sections are very bad. I came here to look up the possible occult usages of "professor" as one who professes, even if not right out academically teaches, as I saw a debate today with some very strange behaviour that reminds of of occult manipulative practices, from somebody calling himself professor, unaccredited. Strangely Wikipedia lacks am article on occult rankings,and neither did a page turn up in Google search, and here even the coverage of professor is cut short. This leaves no proof the usage dies not formally or in some cases informally popularly extent into the occult educational system (we are not interested in informal rare usages not attached to popular figures, and then only in as far as they were informally called such). But, this is where Wikipedia should fill in the gaps, so we know of these common formal and popular informal usages, in order to address the subject with people saying such usage, or non usage, when there is not. 49.197.228.206 ( talk) 04:48, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
I'm requesting that an admin
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review my changes and remove the additional
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Frankymulls ( talk) 23:45, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
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Hello, I am following up on a suggestion from "Limit-theorem" to discuss the rationale for my edits here, and to seek wider evidence-based feedback and rational consensus as there seems to be some evident disparity of opinion thus far regarding what is acceptable in this regard by several independent editors. There appear to be three parts of the article that need supporting references ("citation needed"), as flagged up at the top of the page, so I supplied one that was requested with an additional recent and apparently novel example that is also backed up by supporting references (I can't help with the other two examples that I can see). What would others suggest to make the article less incongruent? Would it be better to relegate the "Fiction" or real-life "non-academic" examples to a separate article? Protestant Revival ( talk) 22:52, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
There does not seem to be any discussion on the historical usage of the word 'Professor' now. This is a shame, as I wanted to know. The meaning has changed over the years; if anyone is an authority on this, I would welcome their contribution! ixo ( talk) 17:16, 1 April 2013 (UTC)
The text says: "In countries on the northern European mainland, such as Germany, Belgium, The Netherlands and the Scandinavian countries, usage of professor as a legal title is limited much the same way as in most Commonwealth countries, that is, it is reserved for someone who holds a chair."
This is not correct: Germany call many different teaching positions at research or non-research universities "professor". It is not reserved to a "chair" like in the UK system. The same is true for belgium, here all university postions are "professor".
Only the "netherlands" have a system where only a full professor is termed "professor".
I propose that this gets corrected. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.174.192.144 ( talk) 13:39, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
vous — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.228.184.127 ( talk) 21:40, 6 April 2012 (UTC)
I do agree; the same is true in Sweden. Professor is no longer only used for so called (and old-fashioned) "chaired professors" ("ämnesföreträdare"). Since 1990 it is used for all teaching staff that are employed as professors ()and you need not be "chaired" to be what in the US would be a full professor). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.240.172.187 ( talk) 12:22, 12 April 2012 (UTC)
In Scandinavia, Professor is only used for "full Professors," and they are considered to hold a professorial chair. However, generally all faculty members with the appropriate qualifications may be promoted to Professor. Those known as "Associate Professors", "Assistant Professors" and so forth in the US are not entitled to use the title. Bjerrebæk ( talk) 15:53, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
Found one in Edinburgh International Festival: "Sidney Newman, Reid Professor of Music at Edinburgh University". What is the difference from ordinary "professor"? -- Igel B TyMaHe ( talk) 19:29, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
89.134.199.32 ( talk) 18:05, 11 April 2021 (UTC).
[Glad to see that the images have been updated! My former comment is no longer relevant!] The current photo looks like something from the 19th century. Perhaps get something without cork-stoppered bottles of vitriol, an ancient green slate, and one formula from high school chemistry?
Come on, guys! It is time that this edit war ceases and a discussion takes place on this talk page.?
I'll kick it off. Is there any reason why we can not have two images, three images, or even no images? If two, we could have one of a male professor and one of a female professor? However, I guess having images of two US professors is not a good idea? -- Bduke (Discussion) 00:26, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
As a professor, I think that it is important not to rely on a stereotypical picture of a professor i.e. a middle-aged white male, with white hair. There are male and female professors, and from every race and skin colour. I suggest the two options should be no pictures, or at least a mix of professors. I believe the three pictures previously did just that. Geraint_F_Lewis —Preceding undated comment added 02:03, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
Wikipedia articles should be about phenomena and possibly concepts, but not about words. In particular they should not be about foreign words. This is the English wikipedia and therefore this article should be limited to describing the phenomenon that is denoted by the English word "professor". But in many places it strays into trying to clarifying the meaning of non-English words. It should not. -- Ettrig ( talk) 13:19, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
@ Ettrig: IMO it is absolutely okay to include all aspects, including conceptual aspects as well as word-aspects. As well as all those non-English uses came from same etymology. As well etymology (word origin and their changes, a "phenomenon", too! ) and semantics (study of "meaning"), is very much conceptual thing. When our ancestors used the same word for some other usage, they did so only due to some conceptual similarity.
Now, I have the basic right to know and find all such alternative usage at 1 place. And especially when it is an Encyclopedia. It is even okay if you use a disambiguation page for that (at least) ; but please do not lose the connectivity to all other usage.
As well, being a conceptual learner, when I read anything, I always look for whose it is part of. I don't really understand if I trim-away all the surround and focus only the 1 usage and what 'inside' it (and not what 'outside' it); why it still remain conceptual. It would be a tunnel vision then.
116.203.188.158 (
talk)
05:00, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
Corrected the mention in the Lede that Most American college teachers have the title of Professor (or Asst., Assoc. Prof.). It has not been a majority since the 1960s and currently is around 25%.
I want to gain consensus before editing the Tenure section -- having over 2/3 of the prose be about criticisms of tenure does not seem NPOV.
Thanks, -- Michael Scott Cuthbert (talk) 20:14, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
First, Assistant Professor has already been merged and now redirects here; now is the time for Associate Professor. Fgnievinski ( talk) 19:34, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
Second, although faculty (academic staff) is a useful distinction from faculty (unit), the former is already discussed in the present article (search for "faculty"), so it should just redirect. Fgnievinski ( talk) 14:28, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
This is an utterly nonsensical merge proposal. Wikipedia has vast amounts of articles on various academic ranks in various systems, from Docent, to [[Reader (academic rank), to Privatdozent. Merging all of them into one single article would be hopeless, and not in accordance with policy because of its excessive length (and scope). Merging a general article on academic employees into Professor, which is in most of the world only the most senior rank for an academic, would be totally inappropriate. We need a separate article on academic ranks or faculty positions, that could provide an overview of ranks in various systems, and we need a separate article on the (full) Professor title as it is understood in most of the world (including the English-speaking world), as the highest rank at universities. The article Professor in itself is currently, quite frankly, a mess, and needs to be reduced, not merged with the maybe 100 other articles on other academic ranks at different levels and functions. Bjerrebæk ( talk) 07:03, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
There are several sub-proposals, so let me split it up:
Which of these A,B,C do you agree/disagree? Thanks. Fgnievinski ( talk) 17:54, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
A possible solution is to make this article into an article on the full professor rank and rename it Professor (highest academic rank) ("Professor, informally also known as full professor, is the highest academic rank at universities and other institutions of higher education in most of the world ..."), and have either a disambiguation page or a shorter article here addressing the history and different uses of the word "professor" (for example, it can mean simply "teacher" (at primary or secondary level) or "music teacher" in some countries/settings, but obviously this is not the same rank or position as the (full) Professor rank at universities). Bjerrebæk ( talk) 14:46, 1 November 2014 (UTC)
Guys/gals, I see that you're enjoying the discussion. Shall we come to a conclusion. As no one objected from the the split of full professor, I'm hijacking that existing redirect and starting a new article; please improve it as you see fit. I've also started Draft:Professor and Draft:Academics -- please help. This last one I struggled a bit about the name (academic ranks, academic positions, academic occupations, academic personnel, academic titles -- bad choice?), as I thought administrative/managerial positions in academia are better left outside the scope. Then, finally, I'm most eager to carry out the geographical splitting next; what would be a good prefix -- "Academic ranks in..."? Thanks for your thoughts. Fgnievinski ( talk) 02:12, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
I'd say let's not worry too much about the geo-specific pages -- I'd just "dump" each subsec into a separate "Academic ranks in..." page. Fgnievinski ( talk) 22:05, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
If we now start at new and separate article on the full professor rank, and one one overview article on academic ranks, in addition to country-specific articles on academic ranks, we will have to remove the entire "Around the world" and "Salary" sections (and possibly other sections) from this (old) Professor article in my opinion, and make it into a shorter and more general article, or possibly just a disambiguation page, on the various uses of the word or title Professor, e.g.
Bjerrebæk ( talk) 07:49, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
193.251.4.222 ( talk) 16:35, 23 May 2016 (UTC)
Hello all,
I think some work needs to be done in the Salary section. I don't know about the rest, but the statistics for Sweden are definitely incorrect. I'm a PhD Candidate in Sweden, and I earn roughly the amount stated (about €25,000 a year) for that of a professor. This is average for a PhD candidate. Professors tend to earn around the €70,000 mark. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Supermassive 79 ( talk • contribs) 15:55, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
I followed a link from an article about a guy who is a Research Professor of something. To many, this indicates that a "Research Professor" is pretty much the same as a Professor. This is not the case. At least in the US, a Research Track Professor (or Assistant or Associate) is often more like an advanced post-doctoral fellow who is paid by a tenure-track faculty. If I can find a ref for this does anybody have a problem with adding a "Research Track" heading and changing the Tenure to Tenure Track? Desoto10 ( talk) 05:32, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
Never mind. I found the appropriate article explaining the differences. The link should lead to that one, I think. Desoto10 ( talk) 05:38, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
@ OnBeyondZebrax, Bjerrebæk, Vanzylad, and Lexspoon: Please notice this article is supposed to be more general than the one about Professor (highest academic rank) -- please don't duplicate that content here! fgnievinski ( talk) 02:07, 5 September 2016 (UTC)
It seems there is ambiguity in the word "Professor", between the broader Faculty (academic staff) and the narrower Professor (highest academic rank). Maybe we should redirect Professor to either of the two articles above and leave a hatnote indicating the other article? fgnievinski ( talk) 13:53, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
The entire section was deleted because of undue weight, copied here for future use (some content may be relevant for the article):
In [[Islamic Golden Age|Muslim civilisation]], the chair was designated by the [[caliph]] himself. Mostly through recommendation, the caliph made appointments to a professorial chair (''Kursi'' in [[Arabic language|Arabic]]) in a ''[[Madrassah|jami’]]'' ([[university]] or congregational [[madrasah]]). Such was the case of [[Ibn 'Aqil]] (died 1119) who was appointed to a well-known chair in Jami' al-Mansur ([[Baghdad]]), becoming the main teacher of the madrasah. In other cases, a scholar could be appointed to two chairs at the same time, holding a chair in one jami’ and simultaneously holding another in another jami’ or in one of the exclusive institutions.<ref>{{Cite book |last=Nakosteen |first=M. |title=History of Islamic origins of Western Education A.D 800–1350 |publisher=University of Colorado Press |location=Boulder |year=1964 }}</ref> This is the case of particularly distinguished and popular scholars. For example, a certain Ibn al-Banna' (d. 1079) had a chair in Jami' al-Mansur (Baghdad), located in the centre of the riwaq (nave of the [[mosque]]), while simultaneously holding another in Jami' al-Qasr (also Baghdad), around the maqsura (a separate room inside the mosque). Some chairs were also known by the discipline they represented; as, for instance, the chair or study-circle of the traditionalists (''halqat ahl al-hadith''), and that of the grammarians (''halqat al-nahwiyin''). Others were known by the name of the family whose members occupied it in succession; as, for instance, the chair of the [[Barmakid]]s (''halqat al-Barâmika''). Sometimes institutions were specialised in particular study and therefore received a corresponding chair, e.g. the Nizamiya did not have a chair of [[Kalam|Islamic theology]], but only a chair of [[Sharia|Islamic law]].<ref>Al-hassani, Woodcock and Saoud: 1001 Inventions, Muslim Heritage in Our World; FSTC publication, 2007, 2nd Edition, pp.56-57</ref> As to tenure of the chair, once a professor was appointed by the caliph to a chair in one of the main madrasahs (Jamii), he ordinarily held it for the remainder of his lifetime. Cases of lengthy tenure are often reported by biographers, for example [[Ibn al-Kattani|Abu 'All al-Kattani]] (d. 1061), who was in his eighties when he died, had occupied his chair for 50 years. According to George Makdisi and Hugh Goddard, "the fact that we still talk of professors holding the 'chair' of their subject" is thought to allegedly be based on the "traditional [[Islam]]ic pattern of teaching where the professor sits on a chair and the students sit around him", and the term '[[Study circle|academic circles]]' may be derived from the way Islamic students "sat in a circle around their professor, although the ancient Greeks and Romans did this long before, and it is believed Islamic culture took this from these cultures."<ref>{{Cite book|title=A History of Christian-Muslim Relations|first=Hugh|last=Goddard|year=2000|publisher=[[Edinburgh University Press]]|isbn=0-7486-1009-X|page=100|oclc=237514956}}</ref> The term 'professor' itself is believed a translation of the Arabic term ''[[mufti]]'' by Islamic interpretations, which meant "professor of [[Fatwā|legal opinions]], however the word 'professor' was derived long before Islamic culture was formed, in the time of the Ancient Greeks and Romans."<ref name=G-Makdisi>{{Cite journal|last=Makdisi|first=George|title=Scholasticism and Humanism in Classical Islam and the Christian West|journal=Journal of the American Oriental Society|volume=109|issue=2|date=April–June 1989|pages=175–182 [175–77]|doi=10.2307/604423|jstor=604423}}</ref>
— Erik Jr. 17:28, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
I think what we noticed was that EVERY picture on the page was of a white male. The idea was to show that professors are more than just aged white men. By adding McGonagall to the fictional section, we simply acknowledged that other professors (Dumbledore and Snape) who have been on the page for a very long time textually also exist. I'm happy to mix it up--but this should not be a white men only domain. -- tassieg ( talk) 20:36, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
The new picture showed a random, more or less completely unknown African guy who was not even a professor (according to his CV, he has never held the title "Professor" anywhere, and appears to be at instructor-level academically with a day job as a high school teacher). The picture used in the infobox should be of particularly high quality and be representative of what professors are in most of the world. This means, among other things, that the person depicted should be a "full professor", not a high school teacher or instructor, as the American oddity of referring to just about anyone who teaches as "professors" would be laughed out of court in most of the world and is certainly not representative of global usage; on the other hand a "full professor" would be called a professor both in the US and the rest of the world. File:Einstein 1921 by F Schmutzer - restoration.jpg is a much better choice; it shows the world's best known Professor, who is instantly recognizable, and who was an actual Professor at the time the picture was taken; also, the picture is a featured picture, which has been selected for the picture of the day section of the main page next year. -- Bjerrebæk ( talk) 22:16, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
The following statement is false:
In the U.S. and Canada, when an individual states that he is a professor at a university, without any additional qualifying terms (e.g., "adjunct professor, "assistant professor" or "associate professor"), it is typically assumed to mean he is a full professor.
I am an assistant professor at an American university, so I have an idea of what I'm talking about. If someone says they're, say, "a university professor" without qualifying it with "assistant" or "associate", it is not generally assumed they mean full professor; it's simply unclear. The term "professor" in the US is used very widely to refer to any university level instructor; students frequently use the term to refer to or address instructors who don't even have "professor" as part of their job title (e.g., postdocs and lecturers). This is precisely why the term "full professor" exists.
The claim is also not supported by the source provided ( [1]), which in fact uses the unqualified term "professor" to refer to professors in general, without regard to rank. All it claims is that a full professor might be called "simply Professor". And that's not the same thing. So I've removed the statement from this article. Garik ( talk) 14:14, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
Looking for a definition on the web, not having much luck. Ghostofnemo ( talk) 07:16, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Junior professor. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Hildeoc ( talk) 18:48, 8 June 2019 (UTC)
Table of wages is expressed in terms of 2014 Dutch Euros. Is this considered appropriate per Wikipedia guidelines? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.225.38.251 ( talk) 15:56, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
Currently, the Table of wages section presents a table under the caption "NL comparison, 2014, net salaries, in NL purchasing power"; does this refer to the study mentioned two sections above ( Netherlands)? I guess so, because otherwise I've got no idea what NL stands for / means. Can someone who knows for sure confirm it, and ideally edit the article appropriately (probably moving the table to a proper sub-section, and maybe also avoiding the obscure abbreviation "NL")? 95.90.235.121 ( talk) 15:41, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
It is nice to see the picture of Einstein. But he is not that representative of the professor: he was a genius scientist, a researcher, and did not lecture outside of conferences. He had almost no graduate students! I hate to say it but he was too good to be a professor. Feynman would be more representative as, in addition, he was a great educator. Limit-theorem ( talk) 22:21, 9 November 2021 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Chair(professorship) and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 19#Chair(professorship) until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
Steel1943 (
talk)
23:23, 19 October 2022 (UTC)
If Toni Morisson is dead, should her tense as professor be changed to be similar to Einstein's, something like "Toni Morrison as Emeritus..."? 192.226.178.38 ( talk) 04:44, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
There is a picture there of Socrates, as an early professor, but the article then makes out that professor is a Western Europe 14th century term.
The history and alternative usage sections are very bad. I came here to look up the possible occult usages of "professor" as one who professes, even if not right out academically teaches, as I saw a debate today with some very strange behaviour that reminds of of occult manipulative practices, from somebody calling himself professor, unaccredited. Strangely Wikipedia lacks am article on occult rankings,and neither did a page turn up in Google search, and here even the coverage of professor is cut short. This leaves no proof the usage dies not formally or in some cases informally popularly extent into the occult educational system (we are not interested in informal rare usages not attached to popular figures, and then only in as far as they were informally called such). But, this is where Wikipedia should fill in the gaps, so we know of these common formal and popular informal usages, in order to address the subject with people saying such usage, or non usage, when there is not. 49.197.228.206 ( talk) 04:48, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
I'm requesting that an admin
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review my changes and remove the additional
This article needs additional citations for
verification. |
Frankymulls ( talk) 23:45, 11 August 2023 (UTC)