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I removed the text that stated the Order of St. Gregory is the highest honor in the Catholic Church that a lay man or woman can obtain. First, the Order of St. Pius V, which is still awarded, is senior (higher) than St. Gregory. Secondly, The Order of Christ and the Order of the Golden Spur are senior to both of these orders, and while neither has been awarded in decades, have not been abrogated. Thus the Order of St. Gregory is the fourth highest of the five orders of knighthood of the Holy See. Additionally, there are other honors given to lay people by the Pope, which could conceivably be considered higher--the honor of Gentleman of His Holiness is not officially designated as being senior or junior to St. Gregory, but is certainly highly regarded and rarely awarded.
Sources: http://www.papalhonorees.org/intro.htm, http://www.chivalricorders.org, Burke's World Order of Knighthood and Merit (Sainty and Heydoo-Mankal, eds.), Orders of Knighthood and the Holy See (Bander van Duren)
167.80.244.204 15:05, 3 August 2007 (UTC)chevalier
I don't see how we can hold down this list of notables. If there is an article, do they go here, even though most of us have never heard of him/her? Student7 21:14, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
The degree of a "Knight Grand Cross of the Second Class" was abolished on the 7th. of February 1905. I thought that Wikipedia was "up to date"....
Robert Prummel ( talk) 02:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
(a source on internet is [1]
Umm. Are we sure that "suppression" (what the article says) is identical to "abolished?" See Another site. Student7 ( talk) 03:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
The antiquarian , by the way, mentions two commanders' grades, not two grandcrosses as in the period 1831-1905. What source shall we use? The German and Dutch Wiki claim that the 2nd grandcross was abolished in 1905. But then I have contributed to both. Faithfully yours,
Robert Prummel ( talk) 14:10, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
Odd that the article never contained the name of Conrad Black until he was convicted. Up until then he was not notable enough for inclusion. What changed? Do Boy Scouts of American, PTA, his local credit union, lodge, all take equal hits? My thought is to take the good with the bad. If he wasn't interesting enough to be in here before, he shouldn't be here now. Same with scouts, PTA, etc. If he was in their articles, however, then they have to take the bad with the good. But they don't all get added retroactively. Student7 ( talk) 03:27, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
There's a discussion at Talk:Gilbert Levine about the fact that he's become known as "Sir Gilbert Levine". Some of us are trying to make the point that papal knighthoods do not carry any such pro-nominal title; while others are arguing that Benedict XVI has spoken and his word is law. If anyone can help settle the issue, please come over and join us. -- JackofOz ( talk) 07:19, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
Student7, I notice that you have deleted quite a few attempts to add new names to the list based on the fact that you haven't heard of the person. What criteria are you using to determine who to keep? Why did you decide that, for example, an American conductor or philanthropist is more notable than a Canadian senator? Is it strictly nationality? Is it literally that you personally haven't heard of him? Maybe there should be some set guidelines that more than one person can be in on. I'd be happy to work on that with you. Cheers Dawn Bard ( talk) 02:26, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
It would be nice if the article says what "Pro Deo et Principe" means. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.66.68.102 ( talk) 03:18, 4 September 2009 (UTC)
I have removed the American English tag and reverted the main article. Tagging is overkill when the article subject is not closely associated with a particular version of English. The justification that the original article creator is American is not justification under WP:RETAIN for assigning the language variation of the article. Excepting URLs, prior to the tagging of the article, there were three instances of "honour" and one of "honor", after the original tagging of the article, there were two instances of "honour" and two of "honor". The predominant usage on other Papal orders is "honour" which, combined with the earlier trend on this article, I think is enough to have established prior editorial consensus in favour of "honour" per WP:RETAIN. AusTerrapin ( talk) 11:00, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Article prsently says: "Knights Grand Cross of the Order are entitled to be addressed with the style His/Her Excellency in front of their name." and cites: [3] "Satow, Ernest Mason, Sir - A Guide to Diplomatic Practice". I don't think I buy this, for various reasons: in what purports to be the full text online, [4], there's no mention of the order at all, much less of this privilege; I find no mention of it anywher else; no claim is made for any such privilege for any of the "higher" papal orders; it's not consistent with the practice with knightly orders of other countries; it doesn't seem to make sense with regard to other Vatican practice, as it uses "Excellency" for nuncios and bishops.
I propose to remove this entirely, unless someone argues what a horrible mistake that would be. 84.203.74.123 ( talk) 04:25, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
The wiki article on alleged paedophile Jimmy Savile, states that moves are afoot to strip him of the award posthumously. Does anyone know how this is carried out? And was there any significance (templar?) in his burial position (at a 45 degree angle)? 80.42.235.106 ( talk) 23:22, 10 October 2012 (UTC)twl 80.42.235.106 ( talk) 23:22, 10 October 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not Moved Mike Cline ( talk) 17:31, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
Order of St. Gregory the Great →
Order of Saint Gregory the Great – Redundant abbrevation.
Chicbyaccident (
talk) 09:34, 16 October 2015 (UTC) Relisted.
Jenks24 (
talk)
02:23, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was not moved (as to each). This is a single close of multiple related contemporaneous moves requests by one nominator – in no particular order, of:
Order of St. Gregory the Great → Order of Saint Gregory the Great – To relief abbrevation. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 09:40, 13 December 2015 (UTC) Relisted. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 03:41, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
--Relisting. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 14:34, 21 June 2016 (UTC)
Sorry. I don't know how above discussion came to be about miscrediting my user account. In any case. the investigation turned out to prove the accusers wrong. Therefore I am relisting the request to give it a fair try.
Reasons as per authoritative sources in support of the name Order of Saint Gregory the Great:
Some of the above listed sources, as well as numerous others proposed in the previous discussion, does use the abbreviated form, however clearly referring to its full name by - it's full name. Which should also be the case on Wikipedia, at least in the article's name and leading section. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 14:34, 21 June 2016 (UTC)
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Dame Cicely Saunders was made Dame of the Order of St Gregory the Great (awarded by His Holiness the Pope) according to the Cecily Saunders Institute. I cannot find her name on the list of UK deceased members (she died in 2005). When did she get her award?
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I removed the text that stated the Order of St. Gregory is the highest honor in the Catholic Church that a lay man or woman can obtain. First, the Order of St. Pius V, which is still awarded, is senior (higher) than St. Gregory. Secondly, The Order of Christ and the Order of the Golden Spur are senior to both of these orders, and while neither has been awarded in decades, have not been abrogated. Thus the Order of St. Gregory is the fourth highest of the five orders of knighthood of the Holy See. Additionally, there are other honors given to lay people by the Pope, which could conceivably be considered higher--the honor of Gentleman of His Holiness is not officially designated as being senior or junior to St. Gregory, but is certainly highly regarded and rarely awarded.
Sources: http://www.papalhonorees.org/intro.htm, http://www.chivalricorders.org, Burke's World Order of Knighthood and Merit (Sainty and Heydoo-Mankal, eds.), Orders of Knighthood and the Holy See (Bander van Duren)
167.80.244.204 15:05, 3 August 2007 (UTC)chevalier
I don't see how we can hold down this list of notables. If there is an article, do they go here, even though most of us have never heard of him/her? Student7 21:14, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
The degree of a "Knight Grand Cross of the Second Class" was abolished on the 7th. of February 1905. I thought that Wikipedia was "up to date"....
Robert Prummel ( talk) 02:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
(a source on internet is [1]
Umm. Are we sure that "suppression" (what the article says) is identical to "abolished?" See Another site. Student7 ( talk) 03:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
The antiquarian , by the way, mentions two commanders' grades, not two grandcrosses as in the period 1831-1905. What source shall we use? The German and Dutch Wiki claim that the 2nd grandcross was abolished in 1905. But then I have contributed to both. Faithfully yours,
Robert Prummel ( talk) 14:10, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
Odd that the article never contained the name of Conrad Black until he was convicted. Up until then he was not notable enough for inclusion. What changed? Do Boy Scouts of American, PTA, his local credit union, lodge, all take equal hits? My thought is to take the good with the bad. If he wasn't interesting enough to be in here before, he shouldn't be here now. Same with scouts, PTA, etc. If he was in their articles, however, then they have to take the bad with the good. But they don't all get added retroactively. Student7 ( talk) 03:27, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
There's a discussion at Talk:Gilbert Levine about the fact that he's become known as "Sir Gilbert Levine". Some of us are trying to make the point that papal knighthoods do not carry any such pro-nominal title; while others are arguing that Benedict XVI has spoken and his word is law. If anyone can help settle the issue, please come over and join us. -- JackofOz ( talk) 07:19, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
Student7, I notice that you have deleted quite a few attempts to add new names to the list based on the fact that you haven't heard of the person. What criteria are you using to determine who to keep? Why did you decide that, for example, an American conductor or philanthropist is more notable than a Canadian senator? Is it strictly nationality? Is it literally that you personally haven't heard of him? Maybe there should be some set guidelines that more than one person can be in on. I'd be happy to work on that with you. Cheers Dawn Bard ( talk) 02:26, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
It would be nice if the article says what "Pro Deo et Principe" means. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.66.68.102 ( talk) 03:18, 4 September 2009 (UTC)
I have removed the American English tag and reverted the main article. Tagging is overkill when the article subject is not closely associated with a particular version of English. The justification that the original article creator is American is not justification under WP:RETAIN for assigning the language variation of the article. Excepting URLs, prior to the tagging of the article, there were three instances of "honour" and one of "honor", after the original tagging of the article, there were two instances of "honour" and two of "honor". The predominant usage on other Papal orders is "honour" which, combined with the earlier trend on this article, I think is enough to have established prior editorial consensus in favour of "honour" per WP:RETAIN. AusTerrapin ( talk) 11:00, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Article prsently says: "Knights Grand Cross of the Order are entitled to be addressed with the style His/Her Excellency in front of their name." and cites: [3] "Satow, Ernest Mason, Sir - A Guide to Diplomatic Practice". I don't think I buy this, for various reasons: in what purports to be the full text online, [4], there's no mention of the order at all, much less of this privilege; I find no mention of it anywher else; no claim is made for any such privilege for any of the "higher" papal orders; it's not consistent with the practice with knightly orders of other countries; it doesn't seem to make sense with regard to other Vatican practice, as it uses "Excellency" for nuncios and bishops.
I propose to remove this entirely, unless someone argues what a horrible mistake that would be. 84.203.74.123 ( talk) 04:25, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
The wiki article on alleged paedophile Jimmy Savile, states that moves are afoot to strip him of the award posthumously. Does anyone know how this is carried out? And was there any significance (templar?) in his burial position (at a 45 degree angle)? 80.42.235.106 ( talk) 23:22, 10 October 2012 (UTC)twl 80.42.235.106 ( talk) 23:22, 10 October 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not Moved Mike Cline ( talk) 17:31, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
Order of St. Gregory the Great →
Order of Saint Gregory the Great – Redundant abbrevation.
Chicbyaccident (
talk) 09:34, 16 October 2015 (UTC) Relisted.
Jenks24 (
talk)
02:23, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was not moved (as to each). This is a single close of multiple related contemporaneous moves requests by one nominator – in no particular order, of:
Order of St. Gregory the Great → Order of Saint Gregory the Great – To relief abbrevation. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 09:40, 13 December 2015 (UTC) Relisted. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 03:41, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
--Relisting. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 14:34, 21 June 2016 (UTC)
Sorry. I don't know how above discussion came to be about miscrediting my user account. In any case. the investigation turned out to prove the accusers wrong. Therefore I am relisting the request to give it a fair try.
Reasons as per authoritative sources in support of the name Order of Saint Gregory the Great:
Some of the above listed sources, as well as numerous others proposed in the previous discussion, does use the abbreviated form, however clearly referring to its full name by - it's full name. Which should also be the case on Wikipedia, at least in the article's name and leading section. Chicbyaccident ( talk) 14:34, 21 June 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on Order of St. Gregory the Great. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Kaybeesquared (
talk)
21:55, 9 May 2019 (UTC)
![]() | This user is new to Wikipedia. Please assume good faith, remain civil, and be calm, patient, helpful, and polite while they become accustomed to Wikipedia and its intricacies. |
Dame Cicely Saunders was made Dame of the Order of St Gregory the Great (awarded by His Holiness the Pope) according to the Cecily Saunders Institute. I cannot find her name on the list of UK deceased members (she died in 2005). When did she get her award?