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This "subgenre" was clearly "invented" to describe one or two bands that never maintained any popularity. Please see this as a reason to merge this article in to the article for Industrial Metal, as a subcategory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.105 ( talk) 15:00, 28 September 2011 (UTC)
Did you ever listen to Industrial metal? NDH is completely different. It uses electronic elements, yes, but these elements aren't (Electro-)Industrial. Most NDH bands, such as Rammstein, use Techno-/Dance elements or elements of some other Electronica styles. It's unrelated to the classical Skinny Puppy/Ministry harsh electronic sound.
Moreover, the riffs are different... more like Alternative/Groove metal riffs, less traditional Thrash metal/Noise rock.
"Dance Metal" isn't Industrial metal. And that's a fact. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.134.20.174 ( talk) 19:52, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
NDH might be a subgenre of Industrial Metal, but it certainly is notable by itself. NDH is unique because it plays on the guttural qualities of the German language, combined with a deep male voice, to produce a distinct type of vocal sound within the Metal genre. Trying to dismiss NDH as being simply the "German version" of Industrial Metal is culturally ignorant: if we were to go down that path for the rest of Wikipedia, we might as well get rid of the page for Spaghetti and merge it into the "Italian version" of noodles. Another thing: there are already two discussion topics with this exact theme on this page. Creating a third when you could just have easily voiced your views in either of the pre-existing topics is quite frankly attention-seeking. Now I hope we can finally put this topic to bed. Eddiehimself ( talk) 23:27, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
I pretty much looked at the German wikipedia article as reference. Please add whatever you feel is needed to improve this article. - Iopq 10:29, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
The list is largely based on the group "NDH - Neue Deutsche Haerte" from last.fm--I can't think of a group of people who would know more about the genre. I made this list from characteristics I noticed in the most popular german bands on that list--Rammstein, Oomph, Eisbrecher, Megaherz, and Unheilig. I posted the list there first, and it seemed to be generally accepted. Leptogenesis ( talk) 23:37, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
I always thought of Rammstein as industrial metal.
Why is there even this category in the first place, while reading it, it was ALL the same as [ industrial] to me ?! -- 67.212.22.44 ( talk) 11:51, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
All the listed stylistic origins were part of [ Industrial Metal] ; this is also listed as a derivative of it. I see no reason why it isn't a subgenre or rework of it. -- DynV ( talk) 23:28, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
setting aside the pretentious definitions that xe7al has, industrial metal is essentially electronica & metal combined, which pretty much describes what rammstein is all about. in the end, the language used is irrelevant since the music isn't affected by that and "neue deutsche härte" just isnt a legitimate genre in itself, its just industrial metal (and fyi, this is coming from a german guy. if not even we believe this is a real genre, then who exactly do you think you're kidding?) -- 92.193.9.243 ( talk) 22:21, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
I don't see how this is stylistically connected. - Iopq 12:02, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Although L'Ame Immortelle's earlier music would be closer to EBM, their newer stuff includes guitars and that 'german hardness'. i quote 'Kraushofer and Rainer recruited Ashley Dayour as a guitarist' check out Stumme Schreie and 5 Jahre to see their new appraoch. and remember Oomph originally did not have guitars either before taking their a new approach -- Sic one 18:00, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
How and where exactly does KMFDM fit into this genre? They've been recording since 1984 (earlier than the apparent founding of this genre) and have incorporated dozens of genres throughout their career. Each album is typically quite different (stylistically) from the previous. I'm not arguing that they be removed from the article--I'm just wondering if there is a particular album or single that tags them as NDH-metal. I'd like to incorporated this into the KMFDM article if necessary. -- buck 16:47, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
One of the unregistered editors had a problem with several of the bands that I'd added to the list, so rather than endlessly changing the list I thought we could discuss it here.
All of the bands that I added to that list (excepting a_Life[Divided]) are listed on the German page on NDH, and beyond that, several of the more well known bands removed ( Subway to Sally, Tanzwut, In Extremo) are often listed as NDH on German websites (amazon.de, for one) While I'll agree that Subway to Sally's earlier work is most definitely not NDH, Engelskrieger and Nord Nord Ost definitely do fit into this category, as does In Extremo's more recent releases (tracks like Horizont or Poc vecem from Mein Rasend Herz), and of course Tanzwut's work has generally been classified as NDH. Just about any track from their most recent release, Schattenreiter, could fall easily into the genre.
I'm happy to have a dialogue about this, so if you feel that I'm completely off base here I'd be happy to have you tell me why. Tev 04:26, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
Die apokalyptische reiter isn't NDH. -- 78.12.8.78 ( talk) 00:10, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
What about Ruoska? they sound almost like Rammstein but they sing it in Finnish. − ₪ÇɨгcaғucɨҲ₪ kaiden 02:09, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Tev, Subway to Sally and In Extremo are in no way NDH. They are folk and/or medieval. Just because they sing in German don't automatically make them NDH, just like how bands like Die Prinzen and Ich + Ich are NOT NDH. Hydroracee ( talk) 18:55, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
Eisbrecher and Reifenstahl are NDH Bands as well Andy_Howard ( talk) 10:56, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Yeah just because they sing in German doesn't mean they are NDH. Nena for example. Andy_Howard ( talk)
Die Krupps isn't NDH. They are as mentioned above EBM(Early) and Industrial Metal(later) FredrikJambren ( talk) 14:29, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
Should we only be counting bands that come from German speaking countries, or bands that sing in German, or...? Lately there have been some additions that, while stylistically they qualify as NDH, are either singing in an unrelated language or are from a country that doesn't have German as an official language. Any thoughts? Tev 03:57, 17 June 2007 (UTC) So could Laibach be considered NDH? They're not German but they sing in German amd Rammstein site them as a major influence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.44.226.194 ( talk) 21:57, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
Well, seeing as NDH means "new German hardness", it would make sense that NDH bands speak German, if not come from a German speaking country. Laibach could be considered NDH according to certain characteristics, but since many of the major NDH bands were created in the 90's, should bands from the 90's/2000's be considered NDH, or bands that fall under that category in general? 71.212.184.18 ( talk) 07:11, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
As this is German I wouldn't wonder when a lot of people have problems pronouncing it so phonetics would be very useful.
I always thought that was folk-metal.....at least In Extremo
Why is the name of the article Neue Deutsche härte, with Neue Deutsche Härte as a redirect? The latter is the correct spelling, since nouns are always capitalized in German. As long as the name is in German, shouldn't it be capitalized according to German rules? DES ( talk) 12:33, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
-- Cjepo ( talk) 23:08, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
-- Cjepo ( talk) 02:24, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
I suggest this page be merged with industrial metal. Pages on Wikipedia tend to do better when they centralize a great deal of information, rather than breaking off into myriad specialized sub-pages. Aryder779 ( talk) 19:22, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
I disagree--I like most things in the NDH genre. People keep telling me that I should like industrial metal too, but every time I listen to it (I've tried KMFDM, 16 volt, Ministry...) I never do. The main difference to me is that NDH will actually build lasting chords and chord progressions out of the non-metal instruments, rather than just playing them as random sound effects. Listen to songs like Sonne from Rammstein, Spiegelbild from Unheilig, Gott Sein 04 from Megaherz, Viel zu Tief from Oomph!, and Leider from Eisbrecher. Pay attention to the way the orchestras and other pitched instruments blend with the guitars. In my experience, you simply never get that from Industrial Metal. As a side note, I would also like to point out that none of these bands make exclusively NDH music the way I define it. Rammstein's Mann Gegen Mann strikes me as basically industrial metal, as does Wach Auf! from Oomph! and Kopfschuss from Megaherz; An Deiner Seite from Unheilig is very much a ballad, with not enough of the NDH edge; and Fanatica from Eisbrecher is too far toward dance/techno. Leptogenesis ( talk) 14:49, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
It may make sense to merge NDH with industrial metal because NDH is similar to industrial metal, but since NDH is definitively German, it should really stand on its own. It is a strong enough genre to not be a sub-genre. NDH also has specific elements that aren't always a part of industrial metal. 71.212.184.18 ( talk) 07:18, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
In my opinion NDH and Industrial are quite different. Some songs from any particular NDH band may seem Industrial, but on the whole, the band is NDH. Like Rammstein's Ohne Dich is a ballad but that doesn't mean that the bad on a whole is not NDH. Leptogenesis has given some pretty good examples here, too. You'll listen a song from one of these bands and BANG! You know it's NDH. Honestly, most mainstream Industrial music otherwise sounds like a knife in my ear. It would be a shame to merge the both. -- Hydroracee ( talk) 19:22, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I'd support a merge with industrial metal, also this is not a genre, it's a scene, and need's to be removed from band's like Rammstein and Oomph!'s infoboxes. --unsigned
as per my previous edits, i dont consider ndh to be a legitimate genre but rather a sub-genre of industrial metal for specifically german bands or bands with german sounding names and therefore arbitrary and unnoteworthy for wikipedia. that is to say: merge or delete this altogether -- 92.193.9.243 ( talk) 22:28, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
New proposal -- This page should be merged with European industrial metal. The section on that page is better sourced and better written. There's not a great difference between OOMPH and Die Krupps. Aryder779 ( talk) 23:00, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
I'm saying truth, why? NDH is fusion of Hard Rock and TECHNO, not industrial -- 82.139.5.13 ( talk) 12:51, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved. I know that I voted and so I should not close this discussion but there was unanimous consensus for a return to the standard name. It should never have been moved in the first place. Binksternet ( talk) 23:17, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
The request to rename this article to Neue Deutsche Härte has been carried out. |
New German Hardness → Neue Deutsche Härte – The page was moved to New German Hardness without any sort of discussion or explanation. Pageviews and google search results for Neue Deutsche Härte radically outnumbers New German Hardness. ( Neue Deutsche Härte pageviews, New German Hardness pageviews, Neue Deutsche Härte google results, New German Hardness google results) Myxomatosis57 ( talk) 11:15, 18 October 2015 (UTC)
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The lead section doesn’t have to be that’s vague, It is considerd a fusion genre, not just a subgenre of rock music. ~SML • TP 12:34, 23 July 2018 (UTC)
Here is my suggestion for creating a new Wikipeadia entries for the bands Richthofen and Seelenwalzer. The entry explains why these bands should be considered as part of Neue Deutsche Härte genre. Richthofen was one of the first bands from this scene signed to a major label and the debut record is reissued in 2019 alongside a new successor project called "Seelenwalzer."
Richthofen (Band)
Richthofen was a German Neue Deutsche Härte industrial metal band founded in 1997 by producer and guitarist Andy Classen. The bands name references the prominent German air ace Manfred von Richthofen (1892–1918), also known as the "Red Baron". Founded in 1997 the band recorded two albums and was disbanded in 1999.
The first album published with the Sony Music subsidy GUN-Records in 1997 was named Seelenwalzer a word play on soul and walz. After protests by the Richthofen family the band was legally required to drop the name and ultimately disbanded without publishing the fully recorded second album Mondo Bizarre. While the first album was influenced by Rammstein with a more death metal approach the second album was heavily inspired by the movie Dead Man and made extensive references to country music. GUN-Records objected to this stylistic choices and together with the controversy over the band name dropped the band from the label. The second album remains unpublished.
In 2019 the original Seelenwalzer album is being reissued with the label Massacre Records Here the band-name has been changed to the title of the original album Seelenwalzer. Together with members of the original Richthofen line-up Andy Classen has founded a new band under this name and recorded an album named Totgeglaubt - german for "believed dead". Totgeglaubt is being published with Massacre Records in May 2019.
http://seelenwalzer.com http://metalmaximumradio.com/2019/02/25/seelenwalzer-signs-with-massacre-records/
The result of the move request was: Not moved — Wug· a·po·des 22:21, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
Neue Deutsche Härte →
Neue deutsche Härte – Per
MOS:GENRECAPS, music genres are not capitalised, unless the genre name contains a proper name such as the name of a place, or in this case the demonym "Deutsche" or "German", therefore it will read as "neue Deutsche härte" (or "new German hardness").
Hiddenstranger (
talk) 20:56, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
What's all this in the themes about featuring shock topics like "necrophilia and sexual abuse of children"? I've listened to quite a bit of NDH and although it can get sexual at times, I've never heard anything like this. I feel like the source in question (a German book that I can't track down online) may be referring more to death metal or other genres. If someone could provide an exact quote from the book or some other evidence to clear this up that would be great because this just seems a little bizarre to me. WingsOfBone ( talk) 02:52, 18 March 2020 (UTC)
I'm wondering if there is a good case to be made about the influence of the 'Dissolution of the Soviet Union' on NDH? I couldn't find any references to capitalism/communism/east-west/'berlin wall' in the wiki or the talk page. My reasons for suspecting an influence are: the timing (early-mid 90s reformed Germany), a lot of 'western' imported themes and ideas in NDH, the emergence of an art scene is common in times of transformation. I'm wondering if the lack of reference is a deliberate omission because the association is simply not there/not a strong one, or because it hasn't been explored fully.
If the latter, I would be prepared to research further and contribute to the Wiki, as it's an interesting area of exploration for me. I'm keen to hear what you think, so please leave your thoughts. Freshfdgeehtsj ( talk) 10:44, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
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This "subgenre" was clearly "invented" to describe one or two bands that never maintained any popularity. Please see this as a reason to merge this article in to the article for Industrial Metal, as a subcategory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.105 ( talk) 15:00, 28 September 2011 (UTC)
Did you ever listen to Industrial metal? NDH is completely different. It uses electronic elements, yes, but these elements aren't (Electro-)Industrial. Most NDH bands, such as Rammstein, use Techno-/Dance elements or elements of some other Electronica styles. It's unrelated to the classical Skinny Puppy/Ministry harsh electronic sound.
Moreover, the riffs are different... more like Alternative/Groove metal riffs, less traditional Thrash metal/Noise rock.
"Dance Metal" isn't Industrial metal. And that's a fact. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.134.20.174 ( talk) 19:52, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
NDH might be a subgenre of Industrial Metal, but it certainly is notable by itself. NDH is unique because it plays on the guttural qualities of the German language, combined with a deep male voice, to produce a distinct type of vocal sound within the Metal genre. Trying to dismiss NDH as being simply the "German version" of Industrial Metal is culturally ignorant: if we were to go down that path for the rest of Wikipedia, we might as well get rid of the page for Spaghetti and merge it into the "Italian version" of noodles. Another thing: there are already two discussion topics with this exact theme on this page. Creating a third when you could just have easily voiced your views in either of the pre-existing topics is quite frankly attention-seeking. Now I hope we can finally put this topic to bed. Eddiehimself ( talk) 23:27, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
I pretty much looked at the German wikipedia article as reference. Please add whatever you feel is needed to improve this article. - Iopq 10:29, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
The list is largely based on the group "NDH - Neue Deutsche Haerte" from last.fm--I can't think of a group of people who would know more about the genre. I made this list from characteristics I noticed in the most popular german bands on that list--Rammstein, Oomph, Eisbrecher, Megaherz, and Unheilig. I posted the list there first, and it seemed to be generally accepted. Leptogenesis ( talk) 23:37, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
I always thought of Rammstein as industrial metal.
Why is there even this category in the first place, while reading it, it was ALL the same as [ industrial] to me ?! -- 67.212.22.44 ( talk) 11:51, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
All the listed stylistic origins were part of [ Industrial Metal] ; this is also listed as a derivative of it. I see no reason why it isn't a subgenre or rework of it. -- DynV ( talk) 23:28, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
setting aside the pretentious definitions that xe7al has, industrial metal is essentially electronica & metal combined, which pretty much describes what rammstein is all about. in the end, the language used is irrelevant since the music isn't affected by that and "neue deutsche härte" just isnt a legitimate genre in itself, its just industrial metal (and fyi, this is coming from a german guy. if not even we believe this is a real genre, then who exactly do you think you're kidding?) -- 92.193.9.243 ( talk) 22:21, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
I don't see how this is stylistically connected. - Iopq 12:02, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Although L'Ame Immortelle's earlier music would be closer to EBM, their newer stuff includes guitars and that 'german hardness'. i quote 'Kraushofer and Rainer recruited Ashley Dayour as a guitarist' check out Stumme Schreie and 5 Jahre to see their new appraoch. and remember Oomph originally did not have guitars either before taking their a new approach -- Sic one 18:00, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
How and where exactly does KMFDM fit into this genre? They've been recording since 1984 (earlier than the apparent founding of this genre) and have incorporated dozens of genres throughout their career. Each album is typically quite different (stylistically) from the previous. I'm not arguing that they be removed from the article--I'm just wondering if there is a particular album or single that tags them as NDH-metal. I'd like to incorporated this into the KMFDM article if necessary. -- buck 16:47, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
One of the unregistered editors had a problem with several of the bands that I'd added to the list, so rather than endlessly changing the list I thought we could discuss it here.
All of the bands that I added to that list (excepting a_Life[Divided]) are listed on the German page on NDH, and beyond that, several of the more well known bands removed ( Subway to Sally, Tanzwut, In Extremo) are often listed as NDH on German websites (amazon.de, for one) While I'll agree that Subway to Sally's earlier work is most definitely not NDH, Engelskrieger and Nord Nord Ost definitely do fit into this category, as does In Extremo's more recent releases (tracks like Horizont or Poc vecem from Mein Rasend Herz), and of course Tanzwut's work has generally been classified as NDH. Just about any track from their most recent release, Schattenreiter, could fall easily into the genre.
I'm happy to have a dialogue about this, so if you feel that I'm completely off base here I'd be happy to have you tell me why. Tev 04:26, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
Die apokalyptische reiter isn't NDH. -- 78.12.8.78 ( talk) 00:10, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
What about Ruoska? they sound almost like Rammstein but they sing it in Finnish. − ₪ÇɨгcaғucɨҲ₪ kaiden 02:09, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Tev, Subway to Sally and In Extremo are in no way NDH. They are folk and/or medieval. Just because they sing in German don't automatically make them NDH, just like how bands like Die Prinzen and Ich + Ich are NOT NDH. Hydroracee ( talk) 18:55, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
Eisbrecher and Reifenstahl are NDH Bands as well Andy_Howard ( talk) 10:56, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Yeah just because they sing in German doesn't mean they are NDH. Nena for example. Andy_Howard ( talk)
Die Krupps isn't NDH. They are as mentioned above EBM(Early) and Industrial Metal(later) FredrikJambren ( talk) 14:29, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
Should we only be counting bands that come from German speaking countries, or bands that sing in German, or...? Lately there have been some additions that, while stylistically they qualify as NDH, are either singing in an unrelated language or are from a country that doesn't have German as an official language. Any thoughts? Tev 03:57, 17 June 2007 (UTC) So could Laibach be considered NDH? They're not German but they sing in German amd Rammstein site them as a major influence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.44.226.194 ( talk) 21:57, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
Well, seeing as NDH means "new German hardness", it would make sense that NDH bands speak German, if not come from a German speaking country. Laibach could be considered NDH according to certain characteristics, but since many of the major NDH bands were created in the 90's, should bands from the 90's/2000's be considered NDH, or bands that fall under that category in general? 71.212.184.18 ( talk) 07:11, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
As this is German I wouldn't wonder when a lot of people have problems pronouncing it so phonetics would be very useful.
I always thought that was folk-metal.....at least In Extremo
Why is the name of the article Neue Deutsche härte, with Neue Deutsche Härte as a redirect? The latter is the correct spelling, since nouns are always capitalized in German. As long as the name is in German, shouldn't it be capitalized according to German rules? DES ( talk) 12:33, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
-- Cjepo ( talk) 23:08, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
-- Cjepo ( talk) 02:24, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
I suggest this page be merged with industrial metal. Pages on Wikipedia tend to do better when they centralize a great deal of information, rather than breaking off into myriad specialized sub-pages. Aryder779 ( talk) 19:22, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
I disagree--I like most things in the NDH genre. People keep telling me that I should like industrial metal too, but every time I listen to it (I've tried KMFDM, 16 volt, Ministry...) I never do. The main difference to me is that NDH will actually build lasting chords and chord progressions out of the non-metal instruments, rather than just playing them as random sound effects. Listen to songs like Sonne from Rammstein, Spiegelbild from Unheilig, Gott Sein 04 from Megaherz, Viel zu Tief from Oomph!, and Leider from Eisbrecher. Pay attention to the way the orchestras and other pitched instruments blend with the guitars. In my experience, you simply never get that from Industrial Metal. As a side note, I would also like to point out that none of these bands make exclusively NDH music the way I define it. Rammstein's Mann Gegen Mann strikes me as basically industrial metal, as does Wach Auf! from Oomph! and Kopfschuss from Megaherz; An Deiner Seite from Unheilig is very much a ballad, with not enough of the NDH edge; and Fanatica from Eisbrecher is too far toward dance/techno. Leptogenesis ( talk) 14:49, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
It may make sense to merge NDH with industrial metal because NDH is similar to industrial metal, but since NDH is definitively German, it should really stand on its own. It is a strong enough genre to not be a sub-genre. NDH also has specific elements that aren't always a part of industrial metal. 71.212.184.18 ( talk) 07:18, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
In my opinion NDH and Industrial are quite different. Some songs from any particular NDH band may seem Industrial, but on the whole, the band is NDH. Like Rammstein's Ohne Dich is a ballad but that doesn't mean that the bad on a whole is not NDH. Leptogenesis has given some pretty good examples here, too. You'll listen a song from one of these bands and BANG! You know it's NDH. Honestly, most mainstream Industrial music otherwise sounds like a knife in my ear. It would be a shame to merge the both. -- Hydroracee ( talk) 19:22, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I'd support a merge with industrial metal, also this is not a genre, it's a scene, and need's to be removed from band's like Rammstein and Oomph!'s infoboxes. --unsigned
as per my previous edits, i dont consider ndh to be a legitimate genre but rather a sub-genre of industrial metal for specifically german bands or bands with german sounding names and therefore arbitrary and unnoteworthy for wikipedia. that is to say: merge or delete this altogether -- 92.193.9.243 ( talk) 22:28, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
New proposal -- This page should be merged with European industrial metal. The section on that page is better sourced and better written. There's not a great difference between OOMPH and Die Krupps. Aryder779 ( talk) 23:00, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
I'm saying truth, why? NDH is fusion of Hard Rock and TECHNO, not industrial -- 82.139.5.13 ( talk) 12:51, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved. I know that I voted and so I should not close this discussion but there was unanimous consensus for a return to the standard name. It should never have been moved in the first place. Binksternet ( talk) 23:17, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
The request to rename this article to Neue Deutsche Härte has been carried out. |
New German Hardness → Neue Deutsche Härte – The page was moved to New German Hardness without any sort of discussion or explanation. Pageviews and google search results for Neue Deutsche Härte radically outnumbers New German Hardness. ( Neue Deutsche Härte pageviews, New German Hardness pageviews, Neue Deutsche Härte google results, New German Hardness google results) Myxomatosis57 ( talk) 11:15, 18 October 2015 (UTC)
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The lead section doesn’t have to be that’s vague, It is considerd a fusion genre, not just a subgenre of rock music. ~SML • TP 12:34, 23 July 2018 (UTC)
Here is my suggestion for creating a new Wikipeadia entries for the bands Richthofen and Seelenwalzer. The entry explains why these bands should be considered as part of Neue Deutsche Härte genre. Richthofen was one of the first bands from this scene signed to a major label and the debut record is reissued in 2019 alongside a new successor project called "Seelenwalzer."
Richthofen (Band)
Richthofen was a German Neue Deutsche Härte industrial metal band founded in 1997 by producer and guitarist Andy Classen. The bands name references the prominent German air ace Manfred von Richthofen (1892–1918), also known as the "Red Baron". Founded in 1997 the band recorded two albums and was disbanded in 1999.
The first album published with the Sony Music subsidy GUN-Records in 1997 was named Seelenwalzer a word play on soul and walz. After protests by the Richthofen family the band was legally required to drop the name and ultimately disbanded without publishing the fully recorded second album Mondo Bizarre. While the first album was influenced by Rammstein with a more death metal approach the second album was heavily inspired by the movie Dead Man and made extensive references to country music. GUN-Records objected to this stylistic choices and together with the controversy over the band name dropped the band from the label. The second album remains unpublished.
In 2019 the original Seelenwalzer album is being reissued with the label Massacre Records Here the band-name has been changed to the title of the original album Seelenwalzer. Together with members of the original Richthofen line-up Andy Classen has founded a new band under this name and recorded an album named Totgeglaubt - german for "believed dead". Totgeglaubt is being published with Massacre Records in May 2019.
http://seelenwalzer.com http://metalmaximumradio.com/2019/02/25/seelenwalzer-signs-with-massacre-records/
The result of the move request was: Not moved — Wug· a·po·des 22:21, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
Neue Deutsche Härte →
Neue deutsche Härte – Per
MOS:GENRECAPS, music genres are not capitalised, unless the genre name contains a proper name such as the name of a place, or in this case the demonym "Deutsche" or "German", therefore it will read as "neue Deutsche härte" (or "new German hardness").
Hiddenstranger (
talk) 20:56, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
What's all this in the themes about featuring shock topics like "necrophilia and sexual abuse of children"? I've listened to quite a bit of NDH and although it can get sexual at times, I've never heard anything like this. I feel like the source in question (a German book that I can't track down online) may be referring more to death metal or other genres. If someone could provide an exact quote from the book or some other evidence to clear this up that would be great because this just seems a little bizarre to me. WingsOfBone ( talk) 02:52, 18 March 2020 (UTC)
I'm wondering if there is a good case to be made about the influence of the 'Dissolution of the Soviet Union' on NDH? I couldn't find any references to capitalism/communism/east-west/'berlin wall' in the wiki or the talk page. My reasons for suspecting an influence are: the timing (early-mid 90s reformed Germany), a lot of 'western' imported themes and ideas in NDH, the emergence of an art scene is common in times of transformation. I'm wondering if the lack of reference is a deliberate omission because the association is simply not there/not a strong one, or because it hasn't been explored fully.
If the latter, I would be prepared to research further and contribute to the Wiki, as it's an interesting area of exploration for me. I'm keen to hear what you think, so please leave your thoughts. Freshfdgeehtsj ( talk) 10:44, 28 February 2024 (UTC)