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On 27 May 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from M'semen to Msemmen. The result of the discussion was moved. |
Hi all, to say Msemmen is something typical Amazigh is wrong. It is north african or maybe not even that Supermohi ( talk) 18:12, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
M'smen is originally Moroccan and it's recipe is registered in a Moroccan cookbook returns to the 13 century by ابن الرزين التجيبي , it's not Amazighe. Jamaru25 ( talk) 15:42, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Jamaru25: Apart from the fact that the source that you cited here is unreliable, it doesn't seem to support what you attribute to it. Can you please provide a direct quote from it that supports what you added to the article? M.Bitton ( talk) 00:07, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
Please, respect yourself while you're talking. This is a cookbook from the 13 century and you say nonsense?! And you're not an Administrator or an Editor to have this discussion with me, Wikipedia believes in sources and I add my sources and you have no right to revert it, I swear to report you to the Administration of Wikipedia because of your misusing of reversing @ M.Bitton:. Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:34, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
Believe me I will report you @ M.Bitton: Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:39, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
My source is reliable, because you're not able to read Arabic that doesn't make my source not reliable and don't judge things because your only language is English, educate yourself how to react to others people culture @ M.Bitton:. Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:57, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
to @ Drmies:, I have did my best to bring sources to prove myself about it, I have even add this book [1] with it's correct page number which show this bread in it, and all he did is keeping reverting without even make a further look into it, this book it's returns to the 13 century registering this kind of Moroccan culinary. Jamaru25 ( talk) 02:48, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Drmies: Please try to download it from here
http://www.mediafire.com/file/a4t74eo6q8i107o/%25D9%2581%25D8%25B6%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25A9_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25AE%25D9%2588%25D8%25A7%25D9%2586_%25D9%2581%25D9%258A_%25D8%25B7%25DB%258C%25D9%2591%25D8%25A8%25D8%25A7%25D8%25AA_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25B7%25D8%25B9%25D8%25A7%25D9%2585_%25D9%2588_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25A3%25D9%2584%25D9%2588%25D8%25A7%25D9%2586_-_%25D8%25A5%25D8%25A8%25D9%2586_.pdf/file Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:02, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
@ M.Bitton: wait for moment Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:10, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Drmies: Here is what I could translat, the use of (we use) it's refers to Moroccans.
To make M'semen, we use semolina or flour durum wheat, melted ghee and salt and start mixing them with warm water, and kneading the dough strongly, then cut the dough into pieces, in a surface the spread the dough to make it thinner and fold it with the use of ghee, the same method is repeated with the other pieces of the dough, then you start cooking M'semen in a pan with slow heat, and then removed from the pan and place it and covered with a napkin, and watered with hot honey and sprinkled with cinnamon and sugar.
Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:56, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
Here is what I could translat, the use of (we use) it's refers to Moroccans.That's a lie!
recently have been known to Algeria and Tunisia(that you introduced in the article). No surprises there since the consumption of the M'semen in Algeria is attested in various sources dating as far back as 1835. [5] [6] [7]
Therefore, I will restore the article to its neutral version and urge you to familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's core content policies. M.Bitton ( talk) 23:38, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
References
{{
cite book}}
: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1=
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help)
@ M.Bitton: how funny of you to claim that I'm lying even I gives you a direct quote?! Ibn Arrazine Attajibi even if he is Andalusian, he wrote his book in Morocco about the Moroccan culinary during the Al-Marinid Dynasty, which including every dish we still use till today and have no existence in Algeria nor Tunisia, you're not the one will teach me about a book that I have read many times, you weren't able to read because it's written in Arabic and you asked me to bring a quote which you disapprove it?!, you really do lack of respect to the others.
If you think it's North African bread then put a reference that prove it, rather than that your statement is considered as a False Information, so don't compare my sourced information with your unsourced information, maybe my sources seems not reliable to you, but your changes are totally not reliable at all because of the lack of the source. Jamaru25 ( talk) 17:49, 13 November 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. No quorum. Can be reverted per WP:RMUM. ( closed by non-admin page mover) CLYDE TALK TO ME/ STUFF DONE (please mention me on reply) 23:39, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
M'semen → Msemmen – Since there's not really a standardized romanization, can we move the article to a different romanization that's less 'problematic' in English? I suggest 'msemmen' without the apostrophe (which is ambiguous as it can denote a glottal stop or an 'ayn in romanizations of Arabic) and with a doubled m to better approximate the shadda on the second mim. Open to other versions if there's a compelling reason. إيان ( talk) 21:31, 27 May 2023 (UTC) German, French, and Italian WPs use 'msemmen'. Spanish uses 'rghaif'. إيان ( talk) 21:44, 27 May 2023 (UTC)
This article is rated Stub-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
On 27 May 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from M'semen to Msemmen. The result of the discussion was moved. |
Hi all, to say Msemmen is something typical Amazigh is wrong. It is north african or maybe not even that Supermohi ( talk) 18:12, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
M'smen is originally Moroccan and it's recipe is registered in a Moroccan cookbook returns to the 13 century by ابن الرزين التجيبي , it's not Amazighe. Jamaru25 ( talk) 15:42, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Jamaru25: Apart from the fact that the source that you cited here is unreliable, it doesn't seem to support what you attribute to it. Can you please provide a direct quote from it that supports what you added to the article? M.Bitton ( talk) 00:07, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
Please, respect yourself while you're talking. This is a cookbook from the 13 century and you say nonsense?! And you're not an Administrator or an Editor to have this discussion with me, Wikipedia believes in sources and I add my sources and you have no right to revert it, I swear to report you to the Administration of Wikipedia because of your misusing of reversing @ M.Bitton:. Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:34, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
Believe me I will report you @ M.Bitton: Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:39, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
My source is reliable, because you're not able to read Arabic that doesn't make my source not reliable and don't judge things because your only language is English, educate yourself how to react to others people culture @ M.Bitton:. Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:57, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
to @ Drmies:, I have did my best to bring sources to prove myself about it, I have even add this book [1] with it's correct page number which show this bread in it, and all he did is keeping reverting without even make a further look into it, this book it's returns to the 13 century registering this kind of Moroccan culinary. Jamaru25 ( talk) 02:48, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Drmies: Please try to download it from here
http://www.mediafire.com/file/a4t74eo6q8i107o/%25D9%2581%25D8%25B6%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25A9_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25AE%25D9%2588%25D8%25A7%25D9%2586_%25D9%2581%25D9%258A_%25D8%25B7%25DB%258C%25D9%2591%25D8%25A8%25D8%25A7%25D8%25AA_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25B7%25D8%25B9%25D8%25A7%25D9%2585_%25D9%2588_%25D8%25A7%25D9%2584%25D8%25A3%25D9%2584%25D9%2588%25D8%25A7%25D9%2586_-_%25D8%25A5%25D8%25A8%25D9%2586_.pdf/file Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:02, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
@ M.Bitton: wait for moment Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:10, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
@ Drmies: Here is what I could translat, the use of (we use) it's refers to Moroccans.
To make M'semen, we use semolina or flour durum wheat, melted ghee and salt and start mixing them with warm water, and kneading the dough strongly, then cut the dough into pieces, in a surface the spread the dough to make it thinner and fold it with the use of ghee, the same method is repeated with the other pieces of the dough, then you start cooking M'semen in a pan with slow heat, and then removed from the pan and place it and covered with a napkin, and watered with hot honey and sprinkled with cinnamon and sugar.
Jamaru25 ( talk) 00:56, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
Here is what I could translat, the use of (we use) it's refers to Moroccans.That's a lie!
recently have been known to Algeria and Tunisia(that you introduced in the article). No surprises there since the consumption of the M'semen in Algeria is attested in various sources dating as far back as 1835. [5] [6] [7]
Therefore, I will restore the article to its neutral version and urge you to familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's core content policies. M.Bitton ( talk) 23:38, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
References
{{
cite book}}
: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1=
(
help)
@ M.Bitton: how funny of you to claim that I'm lying even I gives you a direct quote?! Ibn Arrazine Attajibi even if he is Andalusian, he wrote his book in Morocco about the Moroccan culinary during the Al-Marinid Dynasty, which including every dish we still use till today and have no existence in Algeria nor Tunisia, you're not the one will teach me about a book that I have read many times, you weren't able to read because it's written in Arabic and you asked me to bring a quote which you disapprove it?!, you really do lack of respect to the others.
If you think it's North African bread then put a reference that prove it, rather than that your statement is considered as a False Information, so don't compare my sourced information with your unsourced information, maybe my sources seems not reliable to you, but your changes are totally not reliable at all because of the lack of the source. Jamaru25 ( talk) 17:49, 13 November 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. No quorum. Can be reverted per WP:RMUM. ( closed by non-admin page mover) CLYDE TALK TO ME/ STUFF DONE (please mention me on reply) 23:39, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
M'semen → Msemmen – Since there's not really a standardized romanization, can we move the article to a different romanization that's less 'problematic' in English? I suggest 'msemmen' without the apostrophe (which is ambiguous as it can denote a glottal stop or an 'ayn in romanizations of Arabic) and with a doubled m to better approximate the shadda on the second mim. Open to other versions if there's a compelling reason. إيان ( talk) 21:31, 27 May 2023 (UTC) German, French, and Italian WPs use 'msemmen'. Spanish uses 'rghaif'. إيان ( talk) 21:44, 27 May 2023 (UTC)