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Interesting. I never knew about this until now. - Anonymous
Ankaŭ mi.
The two neighbours are now written out as: "( Prussia on one side, and a succession of countries on the other)". Though I agree that the neighbours should be specified at some point in the article, I'm not sure about this curious list in the introduction. Not just that Prussia later became Germany, but it leaves the reader wondering about this succession. Is there a reason not just to mention (its) two neighbours and leave the details for the article? Aliter 20:07, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Nope. This is not about the nomination, just about improving the page:
I guess Neutral Moresnet might be a better title: The Mairie Moresnet was split in a Dutch part, a Prusian part, and a neutral part. Neutral Moresnet was the "country". Eventually, all parts became Belgian territory, though. Aliter 21:26, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I though about that solution, but it'll be somewhat unbalanced. After all, the other parts just shared their history with the countries they were part of.
I improve the image at Commons. Can we get the local one deleted? Aliter 15:34, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
How is Moresnet pronounced in French (or German or Flemish)? Is it /morne/, /moresne/, /morsnet/? -- Cam 05:04, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
It says in this sentence that Prussia existed in 1900, surely this is incorrect seeing as the German Empire replaced Prussia in 1871. Unless I'm missing something here it should say Germany.
"Neither Belgium nor Prussia had ever surrendered its original claim to the territory and around 1900 Prussia in particular was taking a more aggressive stance towards the territory and was accused of sabotage and of obstructing the administrative process in order to force the issue." Hibernian 02:32, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
Neutral Morenset is obviously a spelling error, but the title of this article should be Neutral Moresnet, in my opinion. Moresnet, if the article were to exist at all, would be a stubby article about the town or commune in Belgium called "Moresnet". Neutral Moresnet would be about this historic territory. Just throwing in my two snets :-) -- Cam 15:20, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
Actually I sort of garbled things. It seems there are several entities in modern history known as Moresnet, or including the name Moresnet:
I think this article should be called Neutral Moresnet. It is only about the neutral territory. Nevertheless I am interested in hearing any arguments in favor of keeping called simply Moresnet. -- Cam 05:29, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Since nobody has commented in a few months, I would like to reopen the discussion. I agree that this article's title should be Neutral Moresnet, for all the reasons stated above: it would avoid confusion with the village, mairie, commune, and Gemeinde of Moresnet. Fishal 04:21, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
The Moresnet flag should be black, white and blue, not black, white and purple [1]. It is a combination of the Prussian flag of black and white (horizontal bicolor), the the Dutch flag of red, white and blue (horizontal tricolor), with the black coming from Prussia, the white from both Prussia and the Netherlands, and the blue from the Netherlands Landau7 08:46, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
If you look at [ [2]], it is as if the roads leading to the current 3-borders point are named "road of the 3 borders" in French and German, but "road of the 4 borders" in Dutch! This should be added! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.148.225 ( talk) 16:13, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know what was official language of territory? Luka Jačov 18:11, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Wasn't it Esperanto? Mweites ( talk) 16:42, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
I've found nothing pointing to an "official language" for Neutral Moresnet. This map indicates that Limburgish is spoken where NM used to be. Remain questions such as what language was used for judicial proceedings - for a possible answer, I'll see if I can get a hold of: Mousson, Historische, politische und juristische Monographie über das neutrale Gebiet Moresnet, Aachen 1903. We also know that French law was used for NM. And that German schools were predominant in and around NM. Probably take your pick when it comes to language. -- Iterator12n Talk 04:21, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
A source in Russian claims that the state had a symbolic army of one soldier. Can anyone provide additional data? Omeganian 11:46, 4 April 20078 (Israel)
Conflating the information from several New York Times articles on Moresnet: there was one soldier who doubled up as the local policeman and Secretary of War.
A candidate for a WP April Fool's day entry? Jackiespeel ( talk) 15:02, 17 May 2010 (UTC)
What currency did Neutral Moresnet have? -- Osho-jabbe ( talk) 22:22, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
Right now, for the predecessor states the info box shows the french royal flag and the flag of the german empire. I think it's more correct to show the First French Empire as the predecessor state, with the tricolore. Opposition? -- Iterator12n Talk 01:33, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
One hears it said that Neutral Moresnet was the subject of an attempt to found a state whose official language would be Esperanto. Shouldn't the article contain a section documenting or refuting this notion? Tom 129.93.10.83 ( talk) 04:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
I have deleted the "Controversy" section because there was no controversy, just a couple of joky comments on MetaFilter. Please do not try to insert in-jokes from other sites into Wikipedia. Languagehat ( talk) 18:10, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Let me just say that I went to some trouble to research that issue, because I and some other folks I know were really questioning whether Moresnet existed. The Wikipedia article as it existed didn't help much, partly because the external sites it links to provide evidence that seems a little dubious somehow. So, I was not inserting a joke, I was trying to stop a joke from affecting Wikipedia. If you read the entry, it was an entirely serious attempt to be helpful. I am (still) concerned that similar confusions will arise in the future, but if "the community" doesn't think this is a good contribution, okay. I wasn't aware that the allegation was only raised on one website. Drbobpgh ( talk) 18:41, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
What would the adjective be - Moresnetian? Jackiespeel ( talk) 19:24, 27 October 2015 (UTC)
I corrected what I took to be a typographical error: a parenthetical translation "Bofder" I assumed to be Border. I don't claim to be a linguist or a scholar of modern Euro history. I am 'being bold.' If I am incorrect, please revert. TYVM rags ( talk) 19:01, 21 February 2019 (UTC)
In the section First World War I have raised citation need against the alleged number of Neutral Moresnet citizens killed in WWI. If sources could be found for this statistic (a major figure for a territory of its size of population) then serious consideration could be given to introducing these into the wikipedia article on Casualties of World War I and giving acknowledgement to the territory's existence which was independent into 1915. A check with the more fulsome equivalent articles in Dutch and German wikipedias show that in the former the statement translates as '147 inhabitants....were killed as a result of acts of war' while the latter mentions no casualties. I wonder if there are Belgian sources? The Dutch wikipedia's article on the Church of Assumption in present-day Kelmis mentions without citation a war memorial within the church to soldiers of both Belgian and German armies from Kelmis who died serving in WWI. I have also raised a citation need for the annexation by Prussia - surely there must have been an official announcement from German sources for news consumption and for the 'benefit' of the inhabitants? Cloptonson ( talk) 07:35, 12 June 2021 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Neutral Moresnet article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1 |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Neutral Moresnet is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. For older candidates, please check the archive. | ||||||||||
|
Interesting. I never knew about this until now. - Anonymous
Ankaŭ mi.
The two neighbours are now written out as: "( Prussia on one side, and a succession of countries on the other)". Though I agree that the neighbours should be specified at some point in the article, I'm not sure about this curious list in the introduction. Not just that Prussia later became Germany, but it leaves the reader wondering about this succession. Is there a reason not just to mention (its) two neighbours and leave the details for the article? Aliter 20:07, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Nope. This is not about the nomination, just about improving the page:
I guess Neutral Moresnet might be a better title: The Mairie Moresnet was split in a Dutch part, a Prusian part, and a neutral part. Neutral Moresnet was the "country". Eventually, all parts became Belgian territory, though. Aliter 21:26, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I though about that solution, but it'll be somewhat unbalanced. After all, the other parts just shared their history with the countries they were part of.
I improve the image at Commons. Can we get the local one deleted? Aliter 15:34, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
How is Moresnet pronounced in French (or German or Flemish)? Is it /morne/, /moresne/, /morsnet/? -- Cam 05:04, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
It says in this sentence that Prussia existed in 1900, surely this is incorrect seeing as the German Empire replaced Prussia in 1871. Unless I'm missing something here it should say Germany.
"Neither Belgium nor Prussia had ever surrendered its original claim to the territory and around 1900 Prussia in particular was taking a more aggressive stance towards the territory and was accused of sabotage and of obstructing the administrative process in order to force the issue." Hibernian 02:32, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
Neutral Morenset is obviously a spelling error, but the title of this article should be Neutral Moresnet, in my opinion. Moresnet, if the article were to exist at all, would be a stubby article about the town or commune in Belgium called "Moresnet". Neutral Moresnet would be about this historic territory. Just throwing in my two snets :-) -- Cam 15:20, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
Actually I sort of garbled things. It seems there are several entities in modern history known as Moresnet, or including the name Moresnet:
I think this article should be called Neutral Moresnet. It is only about the neutral territory. Nevertheless I am interested in hearing any arguments in favor of keeping called simply Moresnet. -- Cam 05:29, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Since nobody has commented in a few months, I would like to reopen the discussion. I agree that this article's title should be Neutral Moresnet, for all the reasons stated above: it would avoid confusion with the village, mairie, commune, and Gemeinde of Moresnet. Fishal 04:21, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
The Moresnet flag should be black, white and blue, not black, white and purple [1]. It is a combination of the Prussian flag of black and white (horizontal bicolor), the the Dutch flag of red, white and blue (horizontal tricolor), with the black coming from Prussia, the white from both Prussia and the Netherlands, and the blue from the Netherlands Landau7 08:46, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
If you look at [ [2]], it is as if the roads leading to the current 3-borders point are named "road of the 3 borders" in French and German, but "road of the 4 borders" in Dutch! This should be added! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.148.225 ( talk) 16:13, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know what was official language of territory? Luka Jačov 18:11, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Wasn't it Esperanto? Mweites ( talk) 16:42, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
I've found nothing pointing to an "official language" for Neutral Moresnet. This map indicates that Limburgish is spoken where NM used to be. Remain questions such as what language was used for judicial proceedings - for a possible answer, I'll see if I can get a hold of: Mousson, Historische, politische und juristische Monographie über das neutrale Gebiet Moresnet, Aachen 1903. We also know that French law was used for NM. And that German schools were predominant in and around NM. Probably take your pick when it comes to language. -- Iterator12n Talk 04:21, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
A source in Russian claims that the state had a symbolic army of one soldier. Can anyone provide additional data? Omeganian 11:46, 4 April 20078 (Israel)
Conflating the information from several New York Times articles on Moresnet: there was one soldier who doubled up as the local policeman and Secretary of War.
A candidate for a WP April Fool's day entry? Jackiespeel ( talk) 15:02, 17 May 2010 (UTC)
What currency did Neutral Moresnet have? -- Osho-jabbe ( talk) 22:22, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
Right now, for the predecessor states the info box shows the french royal flag and the flag of the german empire. I think it's more correct to show the First French Empire as the predecessor state, with the tricolore. Opposition? -- Iterator12n Talk 01:33, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
One hears it said that Neutral Moresnet was the subject of an attempt to found a state whose official language would be Esperanto. Shouldn't the article contain a section documenting or refuting this notion? Tom 129.93.10.83 ( talk) 04:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
I have deleted the "Controversy" section because there was no controversy, just a couple of joky comments on MetaFilter. Please do not try to insert in-jokes from other sites into Wikipedia. Languagehat ( talk) 18:10, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Let me just say that I went to some trouble to research that issue, because I and some other folks I know were really questioning whether Moresnet existed. The Wikipedia article as it existed didn't help much, partly because the external sites it links to provide evidence that seems a little dubious somehow. So, I was not inserting a joke, I was trying to stop a joke from affecting Wikipedia. If you read the entry, it was an entirely serious attempt to be helpful. I am (still) concerned that similar confusions will arise in the future, but if "the community" doesn't think this is a good contribution, okay. I wasn't aware that the allegation was only raised on one website. Drbobpgh ( talk) 18:41, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
What would the adjective be - Moresnetian? Jackiespeel ( talk) 19:24, 27 October 2015 (UTC)
I corrected what I took to be a typographical error: a parenthetical translation "Bofder" I assumed to be Border. I don't claim to be a linguist or a scholar of modern Euro history. I am 'being bold.' If I am incorrect, please revert. TYVM rags ( talk) 19:01, 21 February 2019 (UTC)
In the section First World War I have raised citation need against the alleged number of Neutral Moresnet citizens killed in WWI. If sources could be found for this statistic (a major figure for a territory of its size of population) then serious consideration could be given to introducing these into the wikipedia article on Casualties of World War I and giving acknowledgement to the territory's existence which was independent into 1915. A check with the more fulsome equivalent articles in Dutch and German wikipedias show that in the former the statement translates as '147 inhabitants....were killed as a result of acts of war' while the latter mentions no casualties. I wonder if there are Belgian sources? The Dutch wikipedia's article on the Church of Assumption in present-day Kelmis mentions without citation a war memorial within the church to soldiers of both Belgian and German armies from Kelmis who died serving in WWI. I have also raised a citation need for the annexation by Prussia - surely there must have been an official announcement from German sources for news consumption and for the 'benefit' of the inhabitants? Cloptonson ( talk) 07:35, 12 June 2021 (UTC)