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Fact check and references
Newspaper clipping from the "New York Review", feb 10th, 1917
In the article of February 8th, 1917, The New York Times states that Ms Coen became the first woman to conduct a Grand Opera in New York.
There is a newspaper clipping from the New York Review, dated February 10th, 1917, that states that Ms Coen became the first woman in the United States to conduct a Grand Opera.
Three questions:
1) Does anyone know the New York Review? There is a link on Wikipedia that redirects to the New York Review of Books but I cannot find a reference that clarifies the relationship.
2) Is there a URL to this magazine?
3) Is it true that Ms Coen was the first female conductor of a Grand Opera in the United States?
Re 1, I suspect it might be
thisThe New York Review; the dates line up. It would be in the public domain, so it's possible it's digitized somewhere but I wasn't able to find it; unfortunately "New York Review" is a common title. It will also be a while before anyone can go use the microform at the NYPL to confirm/get the relevant citation information.
Umimmak (
talk)
19:21, 20 July 2020 (UTC)reply
"The German newspaper "Neuen Zeitschrift für Musik" found it" should be The German newspaper Neuen Zeitschrift für Musik found it"
"The critics were especially pleased with Coen's play" - to me "The critics were especially pleased with Coen's playing" sounds better
"Soon, Coen would find the role that would define her career: accompanying opera singers on the piano." - this doesn't sound so encyclopadic, I'd suggest something more like "Coen became famous as a pianist accompanying opera singers" - if that fits the source
"In addition to serving as Mme. Rappold's accompanist " can be "In addition to serving as Rappold's accompanist " and later on you can use Rappold for "Marie Rappold"
the way works are titled seems inconsistent, for example "C Sharp Minor Waltz" versus Gluck's Gavotte
"quotes Coen's response to the apparently unavoidable question about her dress" doesn't sound encyclopedic - suggest " quotes Coen's response to a question about her dress"
the lead (which i always do last) is not currently big enough to summarise the whole article so needs expansion. you wouldn't neceesarily need the citation in the lead.
"Coen was born as Caroline Marie Cohen in Paris on September 21, 1878, to Hippolijte Cohen, diamond merchant, and Mathilde Schoijer. Both her parents were nationals of the Netherlands." is currently uncited
"In 1925, she obtained US citizenship under the name Lina Coen, renouncing her French and Dutch citizenship in the process." is currently uncited
"Among the singers who coached with Coen were Marion Telva, Julia Culp, Jeanne Gordon, Carl Jörn, Orville Harrold, Marie Tiffany, Geneviève Vix, Claire Dux and many others" is currently uncited (The information comes from the Musical Courier. This weekly journal is available online through Hathi Trust Digital Library. I added two specific citations to issues from 1922 and 1923
Ruud Buitelaar (
talk)
00:09, 26 September 2023 (UTC))reply
"Coen died in Miami, Florida, in 1952, at age 73." is currently uncited
sources appear generally reliable on a very quick check
Broad
seems ok, but would prob want to look further into that at GA review
Neutral
yup
Stable
yup
Images
relevant and on a quick check appear to be appropriately licensed
Overall
Phew that 20 minutes flew by! Right now I don't think this article would become a GA but in future with a bit more work I don't see why it couldn't. Main things to improve would be prose, the lead and perhaps doing another check in musical biographies to check broadness. Hope this helps and best of luck with the article. Please do ask if something isn't clear. Cheers,
Mujinga (
talk)
15:52, 23 September 2023 (UTC)reply
Thank you very much, @
Mujinga! That is really helpful. Most issues can be solved quicly; I´ll do that. Other issues require more time. Hopefully I´ll get the opportunity to check libraries in Paris, New York and Miami to find sources that are not available online and that would help to broaden the article. I´m looking forward to that. Cheers!
Ruud Buitelaar (
talk)
16:36, 23 September 2023 (UTC)reply
This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Opera, a group writing and editing Wikipedia articles on operas, opera terminology, opera composers and librettists, singers, designers, directors and managers, companies and houses, publications and recordings. The project discussion page is a place to talk about issues and exchange ideas. New members are welcome!OperaWikipedia:WikiProject OperaTemplate:WikiProject OperaOpera articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Classical music, which aims to improve, expand, copy edit, and maintain all articles related to
classical music, that are not covered by other classical music related projects. Please read the
guidelines for writing and maintaining articles. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the
project page for more details.Classical musicWikipedia:WikiProject Classical musicTemplate:WikiProject Classical musicClassical music articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Women in Music, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Women in music on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Women in MusicWikipedia:WikiProject Women in MusicTemplate:WikiProject Women in MusicWomen in music articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to
join the project and
contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the
documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Netherlands, an attempt to create, expand, and improve articles related to the
Netherlands on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, visit the
project page where you can join the project or contribute to the
discussion.NetherlandsWikipedia:WikiProject NetherlandsTemplate:WikiProject NetherlandsNetherlands articles
Fact check and references
Newspaper clipping from the "New York Review", feb 10th, 1917
In the article of February 8th, 1917, The New York Times states that Ms Coen became the first woman to conduct a Grand Opera in New York.
There is a newspaper clipping from the New York Review, dated February 10th, 1917, that states that Ms Coen became the first woman in the United States to conduct a Grand Opera.
Three questions:
1) Does anyone know the New York Review? There is a link on Wikipedia that redirects to the New York Review of Books but I cannot find a reference that clarifies the relationship.
2) Is there a URL to this magazine?
3) Is it true that Ms Coen was the first female conductor of a Grand Opera in the United States?
Re 1, I suspect it might be
thisThe New York Review; the dates line up. It would be in the public domain, so it's possible it's digitized somewhere but I wasn't able to find it; unfortunately "New York Review" is a common title. It will also be a while before anyone can go use the microform at the NYPL to confirm/get the relevant citation information.
Umimmak (
talk)
19:21, 20 July 2020 (UTC)reply
"The German newspaper "Neuen Zeitschrift für Musik" found it" should be The German newspaper Neuen Zeitschrift für Musik found it"
"The critics were especially pleased with Coen's play" - to me "The critics were especially pleased with Coen's playing" sounds better
"Soon, Coen would find the role that would define her career: accompanying opera singers on the piano." - this doesn't sound so encyclopadic, I'd suggest something more like "Coen became famous as a pianist accompanying opera singers" - if that fits the source
"In addition to serving as Mme. Rappold's accompanist " can be "In addition to serving as Rappold's accompanist " and later on you can use Rappold for "Marie Rappold"
the way works are titled seems inconsistent, for example "C Sharp Minor Waltz" versus Gluck's Gavotte
"quotes Coen's response to the apparently unavoidable question about her dress" doesn't sound encyclopedic - suggest " quotes Coen's response to a question about her dress"
the lead (which i always do last) is not currently big enough to summarise the whole article so needs expansion. you wouldn't neceesarily need the citation in the lead.
"Coen was born as Caroline Marie Cohen in Paris on September 21, 1878, to Hippolijte Cohen, diamond merchant, and Mathilde Schoijer. Both her parents were nationals of the Netherlands." is currently uncited
"In 1925, she obtained US citizenship under the name Lina Coen, renouncing her French and Dutch citizenship in the process." is currently uncited
"Among the singers who coached with Coen were Marion Telva, Julia Culp, Jeanne Gordon, Carl Jörn, Orville Harrold, Marie Tiffany, Geneviève Vix, Claire Dux and many others" is currently uncited (The information comes from the Musical Courier. This weekly journal is available online through Hathi Trust Digital Library. I added two specific citations to issues from 1922 and 1923
Ruud Buitelaar (
talk)
00:09, 26 September 2023 (UTC))reply
"Coen died in Miami, Florida, in 1952, at age 73." is currently uncited
sources appear generally reliable on a very quick check
Broad
seems ok, but would prob want to look further into that at GA review
Neutral
yup
Stable
yup
Images
relevant and on a quick check appear to be appropriately licensed
Overall
Phew that 20 minutes flew by! Right now I don't think this article would become a GA but in future with a bit more work I don't see why it couldn't. Main things to improve would be prose, the lead and perhaps doing another check in musical biographies to check broadness. Hope this helps and best of luck with the article. Please do ask if something isn't clear. Cheers,
Mujinga (
talk)
15:52, 23 September 2023 (UTC)reply
Thank you very much, @
Mujinga! That is really helpful. Most issues can be solved quicly; I´ll do that. Other issues require more time. Hopefully I´ll get the opportunity to check libraries in Paris, New York and Miami to find sources that are not available online and that would help to broaden the article. I´m looking forward to that. Cheers!
Ruud Buitelaar (
talk)
16:36, 23 September 2023 (UTC)reply