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Could someone please redirect this page to the Ayn Rand character by default? The vast majority of Wikipedia searches on this name obviously pertain to that John Galt, not the Scottish novelist. Rearden Metal 21:25, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
Question: Why isn't this the main link for John Galt? An actual person of literary and historical importance should take precidence over a fictional character. Having a link to the Atlas Shrugged reference seems more appropriate than having the Atlas shrugged reference link to this. The fact that the actual John Galt isn't given preference over a fictional one strikes me as ironic. Shouldn't the actual John Galt occupy the main John Galt page? That, or a disambiguation page should be added. Ollie Garkey ( talk) 14:15, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
NOW might be the right time to address the problem of there being two prominent John Galts, since I have just created a separate article on John Galt (Atlas Shrugged). I feel that the idea of redirecting to either, in which I include keeping the current arrangement, is counter-productive and not in-keeping with policy (that is, Wikipedia:Disambiguation#Deciding to disambiguate). Hence, disambiguation is the way forward. I'll go ahead in seven days unless there are objections. Bastin 16:12, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Shouldn't we use a disambiguation page since both of these topics are unrelated? "However if there are two topics for a term but neither is considered the primary topic, then a disambiguation page is used." from Wikipedia:Disambiguation#Disambiguation links Ollie Garkey ( talk) 14:27, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
John Galt (novelist) → John Galt — The John Galt page has been changed to a redirect page by a member of the Objectivism wikipedia project. Since the page is currently being used as a redirect, I plan to move this page to that post, with a disambiguation link, if there are no objections. Ollie Garkey ( talk) 21:20, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Except, in this case 'consolidate' means when someone runs "John Galt" on the Wiki search engine, it automatically takes them to a section of an article representing the fictional character. I'll rephrase my earlier description to "heavy handed edit" rather than "hijack", I still maintain it appears suspect without any prior consultation either here or on the other talk page . As has been pointed out previously on this talk page from WP:PRIMARYTOPIC,"[h]owever if there are two topics for a term but neither is considered the primary topic, then a disambiguation page is used." Since this issue has surfaced more than once in the past, I'd suggest that points toward a situation where consensus is difficult or unlikely to occur, again, indicating to me that a disambiguation page is the best approach. cheers Deconstructhis ( talk) 23:39, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Note: I have reverted the redirect of John Galt. There was a substantial article there until it was redirected to List_of_characters_in_Atlas_Shrugged#John_Galt a few days ago. There is a discussion about the need for a dab page and primary use started at Talk:John Galt before the article was redirected. (I've also moved this section from the top to bottom of this page, so please also see recent comments in sections above.) Station1 ( talk) 04:09, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
IMO there's a rough consensus above in favour if John Galt being a DAB page, when the COI issues are taken into account. Andrewa ( talk) 18:30, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
-- Born2cycle ( talk) 04:25, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Couldn't help but notice that someone just saw fit to pull the hatnote from John Galt (Atlas Shrugged) article. Must be a coincidence. :) Deconstructhis ( talk) 15:09, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Agreed. Personally, I have no preference as to where the discussion occurs as long as everyone knows about it. I'm less sure regarding your comments pertaining to when disambiguation is "needed"; shouldn't ease of reference for the reader take precedent regardless? Judging by the Google numbers being put forward, a ballpark one in ten readers arriving from Google through a "John Galt" link are in fact looking for the Scottish novelist. A simple hatnote on the characters page to disambiguate between the two provides a useful courtesy to the reader, even at one in ten we're still talking about tens of thousands in search of the writer, not the character; as they say, this isn't paper. cheers Deconstructhis ( talk) 17:04, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
It seems WP:Primary is clear here that John Galt should be the article page for the Atlas Shrugged character. Does anyone challenge that? The only question not answered directly by policy is if merge the character John Galt article into an Atlas Shrugged article or keep it as its own article. I suspect the concensus is keep it as its own article. Therefore nothing is left to do but to delete John Galt the DAB page and then move John Galt (Atlas Shrugged) to John Galt. -- Karbinski ( talk) 17:31, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
The discussion seems to be very lopsided in favor of the character having the primary article name. Since there has been no new commentary for a couple of days, I'm going to move the articles back to their previous naming. -- RL0919 ( talk) 15:38, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
I'm in favour of a linking directly to this one and the fictional character second. Most people who wiki it are more interested in finding out "Who is John Galt" and to learn that he is the founder of Guelph, Ontario and the namesake for my city is a very informative answer. [/dumb amswer] —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
188.3.239.158 (
talk)
20:46, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
Hi there, I can see several editors have been around the block on this title -- in order to disambiguate it. I don't really want to create more churn but describing John Galt as a novelist is probably not giving him the credit due to him. Let me tell you how I came to this, and I will try not go on too long. I was re-writting the Tiger Dunlop article; the two men are very connected to each other both in personal and business lives. I went looking for the John Galt article and honestly couldn't find it. I simply had no idea that he would be catalogued under (novelist). John Galt is a Canadian pre-Confederation historical character responsible for many good and interesting deeds, not the least of which is founding the city of Guelph, Ontario. John Galt is also a prolific writer and novelist as shown in the article. I would like to propose that I expand the current article as I am familiar with the subject area and that the title be renamed to something like "John Galt (1779-1839)" which would not detract from his novelist activities, but would allow those interested in Canadian history to find him. Any comments? CJ_WeißSchäfer 23:49, 15 July 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by CJ3370 ( talk • contribs)
Thanks for the direction to the Title section. Based on that I went to the following for some neutral input that meets those specifications. This is what I found: John Galt 1. Canadian Encyclopedia http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/index.cfm?PgNm=TCE&Params=A1ARTA0003142 Novelist, colonial promoter, Canada Company,
2. Dictionary of Canadian Biography Online http://www.biographi.ca/009004-119.01-e.php?&id_nbr=3400&interval=20&&PHPSESSID=7bqk8hnqpgu7hibj189i6fkmc1 author and colonizer
3 Library and Archives Canada http://amicus.collectionscanada.gc.ca/aaweb-bin/aamain/itemdisp?sessionKey=999999999_142&l=0&d=2&v=0&lvl=1&itm=6885299 Shows subject headings of: Galt, John, 1779-1839
Novelists, Scottish--19th century--Biography Galt, John, 1779-1839 Romanciers écossais--19e siècle--Biographies
Based on those three my thoughts would be use both Novelist and Colonizer. That would maintain the intergrity of the current title and put a little more precision into it. CJ_WeißSchäfer 18:08, 17 July 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by CJ3370 ( talk • contribs)
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Could someone please redirect this page to the Ayn Rand character by default? The vast majority of Wikipedia searches on this name obviously pertain to that John Galt, not the Scottish novelist. Rearden Metal 21:25, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
Question: Why isn't this the main link for John Galt? An actual person of literary and historical importance should take precidence over a fictional character. Having a link to the Atlas Shrugged reference seems more appropriate than having the Atlas shrugged reference link to this. The fact that the actual John Galt isn't given preference over a fictional one strikes me as ironic. Shouldn't the actual John Galt occupy the main John Galt page? That, or a disambiguation page should be added. Ollie Garkey ( talk) 14:15, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
NOW might be the right time to address the problem of there being two prominent John Galts, since I have just created a separate article on John Galt (Atlas Shrugged). I feel that the idea of redirecting to either, in which I include keeping the current arrangement, is counter-productive and not in-keeping with policy (that is, Wikipedia:Disambiguation#Deciding to disambiguate). Hence, disambiguation is the way forward. I'll go ahead in seven days unless there are objections. Bastin 16:12, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Shouldn't we use a disambiguation page since both of these topics are unrelated? "However if there are two topics for a term but neither is considered the primary topic, then a disambiguation page is used." from Wikipedia:Disambiguation#Disambiguation links Ollie Garkey ( talk) 14:27, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
John Galt (novelist) → John Galt — The John Galt page has been changed to a redirect page by a member of the Objectivism wikipedia project. Since the page is currently being used as a redirect, I plan to move this page to that post, with a disambiguation link, if there are no objections. Ollie Garkey ( talk) 21:20, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Except, in this case 'consolidate' means when someone runs "John Galt" on the Wiki search engine, it automatically takes them to a section of an article representing the fictional character. I'll rephrase my earlier description to "heavy handed edit" rather than "hijack", I still maintain it appears suspect without any prior consultation either here or on the other talk page . As has been pointed out previously on this talk page from WP:PRIMARYTOPIC,"[h]owever if there are two topics for a term but neither is considered the primary topic, then a disambiguation page is used." Since this issue has surfaced more than once in the past, I'd suggest that points toward a situation where consensus is difficult or unlikely to occur, again, indicating to me that a disambiguation page is the best approach. cheers Deconstructhis ( talk) 23:39, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Note: I have reverted the redirect of John Galt. There was a substantial article there until it was redirected to List_of_characters_in_Atlas_Shrugged#John_Galt a few days ago. There is a discussion about the need for a dab page and primary use started at Talk:John Galt before the article was redirected. (I've also moved this section from the top to bottom of this page, so please also see recent comments in sections above.) Station1 ( talk) 04:09, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
IMO there's a rough consensus above in favour if John Galt being a DAB page, when the COI issues are taken into account. Andrewa ( talk) 18:30, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
-- Born2cycle ( talk) 04:25, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Couldn't help but notice that someone just saw fit to pull the hatnote from John Galt (Atlas Shrugged) article. Must be a coincidence. :) Deconstructhis ( talk) 15:09, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Agreed. Personally, I have no preference as to where the discussion occurs as long as everyone knows about it. I'm less sure regarding your comments pertaining to when disambiguation is "needed"; shouldn't ease of reference for the reader take precedent regardless? Judging by the Google numbers being put forward, a ballpark one in ten readers arriving from Google through a "John Galt" link are in fact looking for the Scottish novelist. A simple hatnote on the characters page to disambiguate between the two provides a useful courtesy to the reader, even at one in ten we're still talking about tens of thousands in search of the writer, not the character; as they say, this isn't paper. cheers Deconstructhis ( talk) 17:04, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
It seems WP:Primary is clear here that John Galt should be the article page for the Atlas Shrugged character. Does anyone challenge that? The only question not answered directly by policy is if merge the character John Galt article into an Atlas Shrugged article or keep it as its own article. I suspect the concensus is keep it as its own article. Therefore nothing is left to do but to delete John Galt the DAB page and then move John Galt (Atlas Shrugged) to John Galt. -- Karbinski ( talk) 17:31, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
The discussion seems to be very lopsided in favor of the character having the primary article name. Since there has been no new commentary for a couple of days, I'm going to move the articles back to their previous naming. -- RL0919 ( talk) 15:38, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
I'm in favour of a linking directly to this one and the fictional character second. Most people who wiki it are more interested in finding out "Who is John Galt" and to learn that he is the founder of Guelph, Ontario and the namesake for my city is a very informative answer. [/dumb amswer] —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
188.3.239.158 (
talk)
20:46, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
Hi there, I can see several editors have been around the block on this title -- in order to disambiguate it. I don't really want to create more churn but describing John Galt as a novelist is probably not giving him the credit due to him. Let me tell you how I came to this, and I will try not go on too long. I was re-writting the Tiger Dunlop article; the two men are very connected to each other both in personal and business lives. I went looking for the John Galt article and honestly couldn't find it. I simply had no idea that he would be catalogued under (novelist). John Galt is a Canadian pre-Confederation historical character responsible for many good and interesting deeds, not the least of which is founding the city of Guelph, Ontario. John Galt is also a prolific writer and novelist as shown in the article. I would like to propose that I expand the current article as I am familiar with the subject area and that the title be renamed to something like "John Galt (1779-1839)" which would not detract from his novelist activities, but would allow those interested in Canadian history to find him. Any comments? CJ_WeißSchäfer 23:49, 15 July 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by CJ3370 ( talk • contribs)
Thanks for the direction to the Title section. Based on that I went to the following for some neutral input that meets those specifications. This is what I found: John Galt 1. Canadian Encyclopedia http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/index.cfm?PgNm=TCE&Params=A1ARTA0003142 Novelist, colonial promoter, Canada Company,
2. Dictionary of Canadian Biography Online http://www.biographi.ca/009004-119.01-e.php?&id_nbr=3400&interval=20&&PHPSESSID=7bqk8hnqpgu7hibj189i6fkmc1 author and colonizer
3 Library and Archives Canada http://amicus.collectionscanada.gc.ca/aaweb-bin/aamain/itemdisp?sessionKey=999999999_142&l=0&d=2&v=0&lvl=1&itm=6885299 Shows subject headings of: Galt, John, 1779-1839
Novelists, Scottish--19th century--Biography Galt, John, 1779-1839 Romanciers écossais--19e siècle--Biographies
Based on those three my thoughts would be use both Novelist and Colonizer. That would maintain the intergrity of the current title and put a little more precision into it. CJ_WeißSchäfer 18:08, 17 July 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by CJ3370 ( talk • contribs)
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