Janissary was a History good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | ||||||||||
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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 23 August 2021 and 10 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jmd684.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 01:04, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Changed B-Class referencing to No as some sections are missing citation. Otherwise, article is fine.-- dashiellx ( talk) 11:21, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I removed the following and bring it here for discussion:
This is completely unreferenced, and makes some very strong claims, to boot. This has to be cited or stay gone. --- RepublicanJacobite The'FortyFive' 19:06, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
I did. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.77.156.90 ( talk) 22:24, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
There is a controversy about being celibate as a Janissary:
"They were subject to strict discipline, but they were paid salaries and pensions on retirement, and were free to marry; those conscripted through devşirme formed a distinctive social class[...]"
but then "Janissaries trained under strict discipline with hard labour and in practically monastic conditions in acemi oğlan ("rookie" or "cadet") schools, where they were expected to remain celibate."
What's correct now? -- Halk52 ( talk) 16:14, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Yeniçeri means "new soldier" in Turkish. [1] F.Mehmet ( talk) 13:28, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
However, whilst this is the generally accepted view, there is an alternative etymology that derives Janissary from the Persian جان نثار jan nissar - life or soul scatterer. This is a much more coherent and meaningful phrase than yeni çeri, which is an odd mixture of the Turkish yeni, new, and the rather obscure Middle Persian chērīh, bravery, victory (çeri in modern Turkish simply means "contents" - yeni asker would have be a more straightforward rendering of "new troops" in Turkish).
Incidentally, يکيچرى does not say yenicheri but yakicheri - it would be interesting to see the word written in an authentic Ottoman text. And why would it have passed into spoken usage as "Janissary", if it were written yenicheri? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.7.158.43 ( talk) 14:32, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
Why the tilde over the N in yeñiçeri? What is the difference in the transliteration between ñ and n? I searched and couldn't find anything. I was tempted to change it to the simple N (as it seems to be e-v-e-r-y-w-h-e-r-e else).
Sokollu Mehmed Paşa (family name: Sokolovic) was a christian Serb from Bosnia not a Bosniak. He became a muslim shortly before he was turned into a member of the janissary. The history of the Balkans may be difficult, but nonetheless the article should be based on facts, which are worldwide known.-- 80.133.175.6 ( talk) 14:50, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
Well regarding a fact that "Bosniak's" are either converted Croat's, either converted Serbs..he surly wasn't "Bosniak".and regarding a fact that Bajo Nenadić sound like Serbian name...i will say he was a Serb before become Ottoman. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.115.65.17 ( talk) 14:19, 29 August 2012 (UTC)
ceddin deden was written in 20th century. if you look at the lyrics, you can see the nationalism there. nationalism isn't the best thing for empires, i suppose.
btw, it was written by ismail hakkı bey. -- 78.171.96.86 ( talk) 01:48, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
There seems to be something missing between the first and second sentances here (and the 2nd sentance doesn't seem to be in quite the right style or tone either):
Wardog ( talk) 14:44, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
I consider it an omission not to mention famous Janissaries as Koca Mimar Sinan and Piri Reis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.228.112.194 ( talk) 08:46, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
Mladic made reference to this term in a video in the trial, which can be seen at BBC news. Dahis redirects here, but the term occurs only once in the article, without explanation of what it is/means. Could someone possibly fix this? -- Dweller ( talk) 11:23, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Dana boomer ( talk · contribs) 17:37, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
Hi! I'll be reviewing this article for GA status and should have my full review up shortly. Dana boomer ( talk) 17:37, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
Because the children recruited into the Janissary core where from Christian families, they CONVERTED to Islam during the training stages. They did not REVERTED to Islam, because they had not been Muslim prior to the enrollement into the Janissary training !! In fact, inclusion of Muslim childred into the Janissary core was totally forbidden during the first four centuries of the existence of the Janissary core !! Be more carefull with the use of the English language when you create history articles. The inapropriate use of some words would mislead the reader and give a disparate and twisted image on the subject.
Why are there so many translations in paranthesis in the first paragraph? Should all of those even be there? Robert ( talk) 16:41, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
Don't know much about Janissaries, but this section seems ambiguous and uncited. Referring to the Janissaries as a "valiant fighting force" is rather unscholarly and a bit weird.
--Anonymous, 4:23, 21 October 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.204.254.105 ( talk)
In the infobox, the colours are Red and Green, but there is also an Blue Uniform type. -- Sevenman2345 — Preceding undated comment added 12:56, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
In the Equipment section, there is the line "In particular, they used a massive 'trench gun', firing an 80-millimetre (3.1 in) ball,[citation needed]" I have doubts that anyone carried around essentially a miniature cannon that shot a 3.1 inch lead ball. There is no citation for this and if no one can come up with one it should probably be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.153.114.129 ( talk) 15:50, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
Most of them are described in Osprey Janissaries by David Nicole especially the "Trench Gun with 80mm ball". LaLa_AL ( talk) 10:57, 10 March 2017 (UTC)sevenman2345
This article makes extensive use of unreliable sources. Alan Palmer and Lord Kinross are/were not academic historians, their books can't be used as serious sources on an encyclopedia. Likewise large segments of the article are based upon Glenn Hubbard and Tim Kane's book Balance. Neither of these people are historians of the Ottoman Empire. This article must be based on sound, reliable, scholarly sources by historians who actually specialize in this topic. If you write an article based on books by people who aren't experts, then you're going to get a lot of distortion and misinformation. Chamboz ( talk) 18:38, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
In the paragraph "Origins", I read this sentence: "The Janissaries were kapıkulları". Anyway, the plural is not "kapıkulları", but "kapıkullar", unless Ottoman Turkish used another ending.
Sorry if I made any mistake.
Treuiller ( talk) 14:21, 1 September 2018 (UTC) Treuiller
I am only a reader who read such biased info here. Instead, I read from various history books that Janissary recruits were recruited IF a Christian family have six boys, so one-only was picked to be given to country. Also there were incidents, which in some Balkan regions, locals were offended if Janissary recruiters did not visit their village for this prestigious duty (because of high salary, and possibility of raising as a Vizier, such as intelligent boys were picked for Enderun (Vizier school) and normal boys were picked for Janissary school, and dumb boys were picked for to be raised as shipwright or porter).
Thus saying Janissary recruits were kidnapped is wrong. Surely there could be rare instances, however mainly there was a solid system which Janissary recruiters visiting villages and inspecting children amounts of Christian families.
Thanks for other nice proper information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.213.247.131 ( talk) 13:37, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
The first paragraph introduces the Janissaries as "the first modern standing army in Europe", as in, a professional and organized military structure (see link to standing army). This sounds like a subjective assessment since the first such standing army would have been the Ancient Roman army, which was European, organized and constituted of professional soldiers, most of which enrolled voluntarily, I believe.
dismiss evidence that Janissary were armed with firearms of any sort.
07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)~~\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
Janissary are in fact a sect within the Sunni Muslim whose loyalty to the Ottoman Caliphate, Janissary were born Muslim and their rivals were different rulers whom claimed to be the Caliphate.
15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)~~\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
who was the gun manufacturer of the Janissary and what evidence do we have that the Janissary were armed with firearms?
\\\\\\\\\\15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)\\\\\\\\\15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk) 137.59.145.217 ( talk) 15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
Janissary was a History good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | ||||||||||
|
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|
|
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 23 August 2021 and 10 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jmd684.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 01:04, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Changed B-Class referencing to No as some sections are missing citation. Otherwise, article is fine.-- dashiellx ( talk) 11:21, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I removed the following and bring it here for discussion:
This is completely unreferenced, and makes some very strong claims, to boot. This has to be cited or stay gone. --- RepublicanJacobite The'FortyFive' 19:06, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
I did. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.77.156.90 ( talk) 22:24, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
There is a controversy about being celibate as a Janissary:
"They were subject to strict discipline, but they were paid salaries and pensions on retirement, and were free to marry; those conscripted through devşirme formed a distinctive social class[...]"
but then "Janissaries trained under strict discipline with hard labour and in practically monastic conditions in acemi oğlan ("rookie" or "cadet") schools, where they were expected to remain celibate."
What's correct now? -- Halk52 ( talk) 16:14, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Yeniçeri means "new soldier" in Turkish. [1] F.Mehmet ( talk) 13:28, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
However, whilst this is the generally accepted view, there is an alternative etymology that derives Janissary from the Persian جان نثار jan nissar - life or soul scatterer. This is a much more coherent and meaningful phrase than yeni çeri, which is an odd mixture of the Turkish yeni, new, and the rather obscure Middle Persian chērīh, bravery, victory (çeri in modern Turkish simply means "contents" - yeni asker would have be a more straightforward rendering of "new troops" in Turkish).
Incidentally, يکيچرى does not say yenicheri but yakicheri - it would be interesting to see the word written in an authentic Ottoman text. And why would it have passed into spoken usage as "Janissary", if it were written yenicheri? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.7.158.43 ( talk) 14:32, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
Why the tilde over the N in yeñiçeri? What is the difference in the transliteration between ñ and n? I searched and couldn't find anything. I was tempted to change it to the simple N (as it seems to be e-v-e-r-y-w-h-e-r-e else).
Sokollu Mehmed Paşa (family name: Sokolovic) was a christian Serb from Bosnia not a Bosniak. He became a muslim shortly before he was turned into a member of the janissary. The history of the Balkans may be difficult, but nonetheless the article should be based on facts, which are worldwide known.-- 80.133.175.6 ( talk) 14:50, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
Well regarding a fact that "Bosniak's" are either converted Croat's, either converted Serbs..he surly wasn't "Bosniak".and regarding a fact that Bajo Nenadić sound like Serbian name...i will say he was a Serb before become Ottoman. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.115.65.17 ( talk) 14:19, 29 August 2012 (UTC)
ceddin deden was written in 20th century. if you look at the lyrics, you can see the nationalism there. nationalism isn't the best thing for empires, i suppose.
btw, it was written by ismail hakkı bey. -- 78.171.96.86 ( talk) 01:48, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
There seems to be something missing between the first and second sentances here (and the 2nd sentance doesn't seem to be in quite the right style or tone either):
Wardog ( talk) 14:44, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
I consider it an omission not to mention famous Janissaries as Koca Mimar Sinan and Piri Reis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.228.112.194 ( talk) 08:46, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
Mladic made reference to this term in a video in the trial, which can be seen at BBC news. Dahis redirects here, but the term occurs only once in the article, without explanation of what it is/means. Could someone possibly fix this? -- Dweller ( talk) 11:23, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Dana boomer ( talk · contribs) 17:37, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
Hi! I'll be reviewing this article for GA status and should have my full review up shortly. Dana boomer ( talk) 17:37, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
Because the children recruited into the Janissary core where from Christian families, they CONVERTED to Islam during the training stages. They did not REVERTED to Islam, because they had not been Muslim prior to the enrollement into the Janissary training !! In fact, inclusion of Muslim childred into the Janissary core was totally forbidden during the first four centuries of the existence of the Janissary core !! Be more carefull with the use of the English language when you create history articles. The inapropriate use of some words would mislead the reader and give a disparate and twisted image on the subject.
Why are there so many translations in paranthesis in the first paragraph? Should all of those even be there? Robert ( talk) 16:41, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
Don't know much about Janissaries, but this section seems ambiguous and uncited. Referring to the Janissaries as a "valiant fighting force" is rather unscholarly and a bit weird.
--Anonymous, 4:23, 21 October 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.204.254.105 ( talk)
In the infobox, the colours are Red and Green, but there is also an Blue Uniform type. -- Sevenman2345 — Preceding undated comment added 12:56, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
In the Equipment section, there is the line "In particular, they used a massive 'trench gun', firing an 80-millimetre (3.1 in) ball,[citation needed]" I have doubts that anyone carried around essentially a miniature cannon that shot a 3.1 inch lead ball. There is no citation for this and if no one can come up with one it should probably be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.153.114.129 ( talk) 15:50, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
Most of them are described in Osprey Janissaries by David Nicole especially the "Trench Gun with 80mm ball". LaLa_AL ( talk) 10:57, 10 March 2017 (UTC)sevenman2345
This article makes extensive use of unreliable sources. Alan Palmer and Lord Kinross are/were not academic historians, their books can't be used as serious sources on an encyclopedia. Likewise large segments of the article are based upon Glenn Hubbard and Tim Kane's book Balance. Neither of these people are historians of the Ottoman Empire. This article must be based on sound, reliable, scholarly sources by historians who actually specialize in this topic. If you write an article based on books by people who aren't experts, then you're going to get a lot of distortion and misinformation. Chamboz ( talk) 18:38, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
In the paragraph "Origins", I read this sentence: "The Janissaries were kapıkulları". Anyway, the plural is not "kapıkulları", but "kapıkullar", unless Ottoman Turkish used another ending.
Sorry if I made any mistake.
Treuiller ( talk) 14:21, 1 September 2018 (UTC) Treuiller
I am only a reader who read such biased info here. Instead, I read from various history books that Janissary recruits were recruited IF a Christian family have six boys, so one-only was picked to be given to country. Also there were incidents, which in some Balkan regions, locals were offended if Janissary recruiters did not visit their village for this prestigious duty (because of high salary, and possibility of raising as a Vizier, such as intelligent boys were picked for Enderun (Vizier school) and normal boys were picked for Janissary school, and dumb boys were picked for to be raised as shipwright or porter).
Thus saying Janissary recruits were kidnapped is wrong. Surely there could be rare instances, however mainly there was a solid system which Janissary recruiters visiting villages and inspecting children amounts of Christian families.
Thanks for other nice proper information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.213.247.131 ( talk) 13:37, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
The first paragraph introduces the Janissaries as "the first modern standing army in Europe", as in, a professional and organized military structure (see link to standing army). This sounds like a subjective assessment since the first such standing army would have been the Ancient Roman army, which was European, organized and constituted of professional soldiers, most of which enrolled voluntarily, I believe.
dismiss evidence that Janissary were armed with firearms of any sort.
07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)~~\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)07:50, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
Janissary are in fact a sect within the Sunni Muslim whose loyalty to the Ottoman Caliphate, Janissary were born Muslim and their rivals were different rulers whom claimed to be the Caliphate.
15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk)\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)15:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)~~\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
who was the gun manufacturer of the Janissary and what evidence do we have that the Janissary were armed with firearms?
\\\\\\\\\\15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)\\\\\\\\\15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC) 137.59.145.217 ( talk) 137.59.145.217 ( talk) 15:12, 18 April 2024 (UTC)