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I have found the Carpenter's paper but I think that it is not discussing about Ouija like this edit [1], but my english is not good, if someone can confirm by looking at http://www.sgipt.org/medppp/psymot/carp1852.htm. -- Akkeron 22:19, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for all your explanations. Akkeron 17:24, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
--- The term 'Ouija' refers to a specific type of of board, see also Planchette. Its not clear that the 'Ouija' was in use in the 1850's or if it was known to Carpenter at the time. This section should be clarified.
On the other hand, turning tables were known, see this 1855 book, which attributes the effect to unconscious muscle movement: The Fashionable Science of Parlour Magic, pg 85 https://books.google.com/books?id=UypbAAAAcAAJ&dq=magic&pg=PA85#v=onepage&q&f=false Dspark76 ( talk) 11:50, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
I'll remove the tears as an example (the article's main and introductory one, nonetheless) of the concept, as of how far is from the concept's popular conception. The "Ideomotor effect" is used to understand unconscious phenomena linked to producing movement. At most, involuntary tearing is a tertiary and/or alternative usage of the concept. Crying because of emotion seems unrelated, as this is not just "unconscious manifestations" (notice: "-motor") (plus never had any citations, it was just added by someone) but it may be reincluded with an appropriate citation. -- 64.237.228.39 ( talk) 17:43, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
I merged Ideometer effect and response into this article, hopefully someone with direct knowledge on the matter should review it. Below is the discussion found on the original article's talk. Hesham4488 ( talk) 01:54, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
These two phenomena seem like the same thing. Could a distinction be made or should they be combined into one major section rather than broken into two almost identical topics? 63.143.219.45 ( talk) 19:11, 23 June 2013 (UTC)
- Done Dspark76 ( talk) 14:02, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
The introduction is improving and evolving to the proper focus of this article -- movement seemingly independent of conscious control. Not a momentary body reflex which is covered elsewhere, not thinking about a lemon and salivating or being aroused -- it's "idea + motor" -- creative flow moving the painter's hand for an extended period of time, for example.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.18.28.106 ( talk) 18:35, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
The ideomotor effect is an illogical theory of how ouija so or other paranormal things work. How can you make your brain move stuff without you realizing that you are moving it and while others as well are seeing the movement. I mean they have different minds and it is very unlikely that others who are playing the game make the same exact moves or movements as the player intended in his mind. There has been cases were people where physically actually attacked by the ouija boards. How is it possible your brain is attacking you by choking or physically hurting you or how your brain create such scenes or 'hallucinations' while you see others being possessed or being attacked by the board.It is impossible or at least extremely unlikely.Does anyone see my point?There are no reliable or logical scientific explanations or scientific theories of paranormal things work.Paranormal things and science have nothing to do with each other. So mixing these subjects or attempting to explain paranormal things in a scientific way makes it pseudoscience. So the ideomodor effect is pseudoscience. Many scientists refuse to believe in these paranormal things simply because they want to have a scientific view of the world because they fear that believing in such things would erode their 'rational' thinking.They just want to think like scientist. Whether you believe in it or not I strongly recommend you not to try the Ouija board or these like things. You never know what could happen.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Coolguy100038 ( talk • contribs) 03:08, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Ideomotor phenomenon article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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I have found the Carpenter's paper but I think that it is not discussing about Ouija like this edit [1], but my english is not good, if someone can confirm by looking at http://www.sgipt.org/medppp/psymot/carp1852.htm. -- Akkeron 22:19, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for all your explanations. Akkeron 17:24, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
--- The term 'Ouija' refers to a specific type of of board, see also Planchette. Its not clear that the 'Ouija' was in use in the 1850's or if it was known to Carpenter at the time. This section should be clarified.
On the other hand, turning tables were known, see this 1855 book, which attributes the effect to unconscious muscle movement: The Fashionable Science of Parlour Magic, pg 85 https://books.google.com/books?id=UypbAAAAcAAJ&dq=magic&pg=PA85#v=onepage&q&f=false Dspark76 ( talk) 11:50, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
I'll remove the tears as an example (the article's main and introductory one, nonetheless) of the concept, as of how far is from the concept's popular conception. The "Ideomotor effect" is used to understand unconscious phenomena linked to producing movement. At most, involuntary tearing is a tertiary and/or alternative usage of the concept. Crying because of emotion seems unrelated, as this is not just "unconscious manifestations" (notice: "-motor") (plus never had any citations, it was just added by someone) but it may be reincluded with an appropriate citation. -- 64.237.228.39 ( talk) 17:43, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
I merged Ideometer effect and response into this article, hopefully someone with direct knowledge on the matter should review it. Below is the discussion found on the original article's talk. Hesham4488 ( talk) 01:54, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
These two phenomena seem like the same thing. Could a distinction be made or should they be combined into one major section rather than broken into two almost identical topics? 63.143.219.45 ( talk) 19:11, 23 June 2013 (UTC)
- Done Dspark76 ( talk) 14:02, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
The introduction is improving and evolving to the proper focus of this article -- movement seemingly independent of conscious control. Not a momentary body reflex which is covered elsewhere, not thinking about a lemon and salivating or being aroused -- it's "idea + motor" -- creative flow moving the painter's hand for an extended period of time, for example.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.18.28.106 ( talk) 18:35, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
The ideomotor effect is an illogical theory of how ouija so or other paranormal things work. How can you make your brain move stuff without you realizing that you are moving it and while others as well are seeing the movement. I mean they have different minds and it is very unlikely that others who are playing the game make the same exact moves or movements as the player intended in his mind. There has been cases were people where physically actually attacked by the ouija boards. How is it possible your brain is attacking you by choking or physically hurting you or how your brain create such scenes or 'hallucinations' while you see others being possessed or being attacked by the board.It is impossible or at least extremely unlikely.Does anyone see my point?There are no reliable or logical scientific explanations or scientific theories of paranormal things work.Paranormal things and science have nothing to do with each other. So mixing these subjects or attempting to explain paranormal things in a scientific way makes it pseudoscience. So the ideomodor effect is pseudoscience. Many scientists refuse to believe in these paranormal things simply because they want to have a scientific view of the world because they fear that believing in such things would erode their 'rational' thinking.They just want to think like scientist. Whether you believe in it or not I strongly recommend you not to try the Ouija board or these like things. You never know what could happen.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Coolguy100038 ( talk • contribs) 03:08, 8 January 2018 (UTC)