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This could end up being a very fascinating article - you just don't find info like this anywhere else!
I have made some additions, and also removed this line: Sometimes odd numbers are on the left, sometimes they are on the right; there does not appear to be any pattern.
This doesn't make sense, as the side of the street would depend on which way you were facing. Also, it isn't clear whether this relates to Australia specifically (as it is just after the Australia paragraph) or all house numbering in general. -- Chuq 01:11, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Sometimes odd numbers are on the left, sometimes they are on the right; there does not appear to be any pattern.The writer forgot to include "when facing in the direction that the numbers increase". In some cities with grids aligned with NSEW the odd/even rule may be related to compass direction. In areas where the rules are applied consistantly, knowing them can save time getting to an address. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.79.199.104 ( talk) 08:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Could someone please explain, more clearly, the system of numbering based on the distance from a meridian? Dainamo 13:47, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps the confusion is due to the use of the term meridian. Meridian has a particular meaning in land surveying, especially in the Midwest. The east-west version is the ' baseline'. Isaac ( talk) 22:42, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
In Portugal (at least Lisbon) many houses have several numbers. AFAICT, each groundfloor window, i.e. anything that can potentially become a door, has its own number. Does anybody know more? Zocky 18:27, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Explain what the six series stuff is.
Say how one is to write the colored addresses with black and white ASCII.
Mention Salt Lake City street names...
Mention Edmonton AB centered at 101 St. and 101 Av.
Wish it was 250 & 750...
Chinese road # lane # alley # addresses are smart:
http://jidann.org/geo/house_numbering/taiwan_english_addresses.html [dead link]
--jidanni — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
210.200.105.231 (
talk)
09:05, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
In much of North America, buildings are not numbered according to a simple sequence but rather according to distance from a given baseline.
Isn't that as a "simple sequence," albeit with big numbers? In my county Rockland County, New York (NYC metro area), and surrounding areas, house numbering seems to follow the European system, so I have a bit of an issue as to how much "much of North America" is. - HiFiGuy 07:48, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
In Quebec, telephone or hydro poles have a number marked on them that is related to building addresses. This might be worth mentioning in a section called 'Related'
I hereby call upon Wikipedeans to rise from their computers and check out their local utility poles!
Pendragon39
15:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
What is so special about the 1600s block on Pennsylvania Ave, and why does the assertion that it’s ‘probably the most famous block number in the world’ need to be on this article, without actually saying anything about it? — Felix the Cassowary 09:39, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Can I suggest an area for expansion. I cannot quote references for this, but somebody might like to follow it up.
In Europe the system of house numbering was initiated by Napolean in the lands he conquered, along with many other standardisations such as the metric system. Previous to Napolean houses were mostly named. According to the Napoleonic system, numbering starts at the end of a street nearest the centre of a town, with odd numbers (1,3,...) on the left, and even numbers (2,4,...) on the right.
NOTE: This is not the way you state in the article, please examine a few British streets.
This origin explains why in Britain this system was not adopted for a long time. The traditional British system was to number up one side and back down the other. The Napoleonic system has the advantage that as towns grow, additional number can be added, with the old British system this is not possible. Many older towns in Britain still retain the old system in the centre (e.g. London and the example you quote for Downing Street), but use the new system for streets built after the beginning of the 20th century. There are some examples where the older end of a street is numbered with the old system, but the newer end, containing houses built after the First World war is numbered with the new system. (P.S., I grew up in a town with such streets.)
TiffaF 08:09, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
After moving to the UK, I found that hose numbering isn't widely used. Instead, buildings are often referred to by street name and, sometimes, house name. Can anyone include the reasons for this in the article? -- 144.173.52.249 01:32, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
"Some rural areas" is a little naive; there are many places with no numbering in certain roads, including many cul-de-sacs and leafy suburbs in towns and cities. Even when roads have numbered houses, many residents also have given a name to their house, e.g. "Dunroamin, 29 Acacia Avenue" and the sign on the door or gate may say "Dunroamin - 29". 82.152.172.217 ( talk) 22:31, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Large groups of streets have increasing numbers in the same direction -- increasing from the Bay, from Market Street, from the Presidio, etc. Masonic and Broderick are in the area of transition between a Market Street Group, and a Presedio group. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.79.199.104 ( talk) 08:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Who assigns house numbers in the various countries of the world? -- Beland 20:28, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
"In Latin America the addressing system is quite similar to the one used in United States and rest of the world." This comment makes no sense, given that the United States uses a very different system from Europe (which is part of the rest of the world). 81.154.49.23 ( talk) 19:54, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
As I already wrote in the article Done, Uruguay uses a variation of the European French-Spanish system, I think that European system should be not that uncommon on Latin America and I would not be surprised to also find it on Peru, Bolivia, Paraguay and Brazil. --
Neurorebel (
talk)
22:14, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
I've found various references stating that block numbers as described in the article are used outside of the United States, particularly in Canada. Yet the consensus here is that they are unique to the US, and any attempt to broaden the treatment beyond the US is eventually edited out. What gives? Doctor Whom ( talk) 17:14, 14 July 2008 (UTC)
We're missing history here by taking numbering for granted. There is a cute and well-known story about the Rothschild family being named that because their house had a red shield on it to denote where to deliver mail in their Germanic state. (not in article). There were other emblems besides colored shields, of course. There has to have been a lot of schemes over the years. Hard to believe that Roman houses were numbered DLIIC, etc. I would think that numbering prior to the introduction of "Arabic" (Indian) mumerals would be counter-intuitive. But then so was mail delivery! :) Student7 ( talk) 20:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
There's an interesting article on house numbering just out on BBC News Online.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/7779212.stm
I have added a reference to it in the sentence about the number 13, and moved it to the british section of the wiki article. (and removed a 'reference?' tag)
My change:
Some UK local authorities avoid the number 13 for house numbering, because that number is considered unlucky. [1]
It's the first time I've added a reference in a wiki article so please let me know if I've made a mistake.
-- RedTomato ( talk) 21:11, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
References
The paragraph
is both off-topic and slightly incorrect. This is a cadastral system, not part of street addresses. What is numbered is not the houses on the property, but the property itself. Also, it's not restricted to farms, it can be used for any rural, semi-rural or even suburban property (cities and other dense developments tend to use block names and lot numbers instead, although exceptions are common). I suggest that the paragraph be removed. // Essin ( talk) 00:03, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
Does this mean odd-even numbering is not used in (substantial parts of) the northeast? — Tamfang ( talk) 23:58, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
Do bridges have street numbers? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.24.172.57 ( talk) 23:46, 15 September 2013 (UTC)
In Utrecht, The Netherlands I noticed that the numbering starts at the side of the street that is the nearest to the center (which is the Dom Tower). Is that usual in The Netherlands/Europe/the world? Joepnl ( talk) 21:32, 18 November 2013 (UTC)
Can someone explain the second sentence? How does numbering the houses in one place help "determine the distribution of property ownership" elsewhere? — Tamfang ( talk) 22:57, 23 October 2016 (UTC)
The various house numbering systems historically developed in stages. When (and where) were the following ideas first implemented?
Reify-tech ( talk) 16:47, 23 March 2017 (UTC)
The phrase "numbers related to the block rather than the street" does not appear to be supported by the citation given (to https://dxdy.ru/topic3547.html named as "Related discussion, additional text"). Although that talk board is about house numbering, the style mentioned in this wiki article (i.e., "Block 12, House 3") isn't mentioned in the talk board items. I'm trusting Chrome's English translation of the talk board page. Maybe someone who reads Russian and who knows Russian addressing habits could improve this? I don't want to say the citation is "irrelevant" because it _is_ related, but it certainly isn't clearly supportive of the assertion in the wiki article. I haven't renamed the talk board's info in the citation, thinking what it says now might be useful to an editor who can actually fix this. - Inkwzitv ( talk) 16:44, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
The link is dead about "numbering system based on tens of metres" to this ("Street Addressing Working Group and the National Street Addressing Standard". Intergovernmental Committee on Survey and Mapping. 19 March 2008. Retrieved 24 February 2010). The following current materials probably would provide a better/updated replacement reference.
AS/NZS 4819:2011 Rural and urban addressing was prepared by the Street Address Working Group of ICSM for the Joint Standards Australia/Standards New Zealand Committee IT-004, to supersede AS/NZS 4819:2003, Geographic Information – Rural and Urban Addressing. It was published in November 2011. Inkwzitv ( talk) 18:05, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
The link from the word "Conscription" takes us to the article about the usual sense of the word "conscription". This however does not appear to be correct in this use, because it's referring to numbering of houses to prevent additional houses being built between them (or at least that's my understanding of the historical event). I have de-linked the conscription article, as the link to the history of the Jews in Prague goes some way to explaining this. DavidFarmbrough ( talk) 16:13, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
Perhaps mention Carmel-by-the-Sea, California has no formal numbers. Jidanni ( talk) 00:34, 27 August 2023 (UTC)
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=30267.0
Also, Charlevoix County, MI has leading zero addresses, which is not mentioned on this thread. 64.135.140.174 ( talk) 03:44, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
House numbering article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This could end up being a very fascinating article - you just don't find info like this anywhere else!
I have made some additions, and also removed this line: Sometimes odd numbers are on the left, sometimes they are on the right; there does not appear to be any pattern.
This doesn't make sense, as the side of the street would depend on which way you were facing. Also, it isn't clear whether this relates to Australia specifically (as it is just after the Australia paragraph) or all house numbering in general. -- Chuq 01:11, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Sometimes odd numbers are on the left, sometimes they are on the right; there does not appear to be any pattern.The writer forgot to include "when facing in the direction that the numbers increase". In some cities with grids aligned with NSEW the odd/even rule may be related to compass direction. In areas where the rules are applied consistantly, knowing them can save time getting to an address. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.79.199.104 ( talk) 08:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Could someone please explain, more clearly, the system of numbering based on the distance from a meridian? Dainamo 13:47, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps the confusion is due to the use of the term meridian. Meridian has a particular meaning in land surveying, especially in the Midwest. The east-west version is the ' baseline'. Isaac ( talk) 22:42, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
In Portugal (at least Lisbon) many houses have several numbers. AFAICT, each groundfloor window, i.e. anything that can potentially become a door, has its own number. Does anybody know more? Zocky 18:27, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Explain what the six series stuff is.
Say how one is to write the colored addresses with black and white ASCII.
Mention Salt Lake City street names...
Mention Edmonton AB centered at 101 St. and 101 Av.
Wish it was 250 & 750...
Chinese road # lane # alley # addresses are smart:
http://jidann.org/geo/house_numbering/taiwan_english_addresses.html [dead link]
--jidanni — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
210.200.105.231 (
talk)
09:05, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
In much of North America, buildings are not numbered according to a simple sequence but rather according to distance from a given baseline.
Isn't that as a "simple sequence," albeit with big numbers? In my county Rockland County, New York (NYC metro area), and surrounding areas, house numbering seems to follow the European system, so I have a bit of an issue as to how much "much of North America" is. - HiFiGuy 07:48, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
In Quebec, telephone or hydro poles have a number marked on them that is related to building addresses. This might be worth mentioning in a section called 'Related'
I hereby call upon Wikipedeans to rise from their computers and check out their local utility poles!
Pendragon39
15:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
What is so special about the 1600s block on Pennsylvania Ave, and why does the assertion that it’s ‘probably the most famous block number in the world’ need to be on this article, without actually saying anything about it? — Felix the Cassowary 09:39, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Can I suggest an area for expansion. I cannot quote references for this, but somebody might like to follow it up.
In Europe the system of house numbering was initiated by Napolean in the lands he conquered, along with many other standardisations such as the metric system. Previous to Napolean houses were mostly named. According to the Napoleonic system, numbering starts at the end of a street nearest the centre of a town, with odd numbers (1,3,...) on the left, and even numbers (2,4,...) on the right.
NOTE: This is not the way you state in the article, please examine a few British streets.
This origin explains why in Britain this system was not adopted for a long time. The traditional British system was to number up one side and back down the other. The Napoleonic system has the advantage that as towns grow, additional number can be added, with the old British system this is not possible. Many older towns in Britain still retain the old system in the centre (e.g. London and the example you quote for Downing Street), but use the new system for streets built after the beginning of the 20th century. There are some examples where the older end of a street is numbered with the old system, but the newer end, containing houses built after the First World war is numbered with the new system. (P.S., I grew up in a town with such streets.)
TiffaF 08:09, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
After moving to the UK, I found that hose numbering isn't widely used. Instead, buildings are often referred to by street name and, sometimes, house name. Can anyone include the reasons for this in the article? -- 144.173.52.249 01:32, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
"Some rural areas" is a little naive; there are many places with no numbering in certain roads, including many cul-de-sacs and leafy suburbs in towns and cities. Even when roads have numbered houses, many residents also have given a name to their house, e.g. "Dunroamin, 29 Acacia Avenue" and the sign on the door or gate may say "Dunroamin - 29". 82.152.172.217 ( talk) 22:31, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Large groups of streets have increasing numbers in the same direction -- increasing from the Bay, from Market Street, from the Presidio, etc. Masonic and Broderick are in the area of transition between a Market Street Group, and a Presedio group. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.79.199.104 ( talk) 08:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Who assigns house numbers in the various countries of the world? -- Beland 20:28, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
"In Latin America the addressing system is quite similar to the one used in United States and rest of the world." This comment makes no sense, given that the United States uses a very different system from Europe (which is part of the rest of the world). 81.154.49.23 ( talk) 19:54, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
As I already wrote in the article Done, Uruguay uses a variation of the European French-Spanish system, I think that European system should be not that uncommon on Latin America and I would not be surprised to also find it on Peru, Bolivia, Paraguay and Brazil. --
Neurorebel (
talk)
22:14, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
I've found various references stating that block numbers as described in the article are used outside of the United States, particularly in Canada. Yet the consensus here is that they are unique to the US, and any attempt to broaden the treatment beyond the US is eventually edited out. What gives? Doctor Whom ( talk) 17:14, 14 July 2008 (UTC)
We're missing history here by taking numbering for granted. There is a cute and well-known story about the Rothschild family being named that because their house had a red shield on it to denote where to deliver mail in their Germanic state. (not in article). There were other emblems besides colored shields, of course. There has to have been a lot of schemes over the years. Hard to believe that Roman houses were numbered DLIIC, etc. I would think that numbering prior to the introduction of "Arabic" (Indian) mumerals would be counter-intuitive. But then so was mail delivery! :) Student7 ( talk) 20:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
There's an interesting article on house numbering just out on BBC News Online.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/7779212.stm
I have added a reference to it in the sentence about the number 13, and moved it to the british section of the wiki article. (and removed a 'reference?' tag)
My change:
Some UK local authorities avoid the number 13 for house numbering, because that number is considered unlucky. [1]
It's the first time I've added a reference in a wiki article so please let me know if I've made a mistake.
-- RedTomato ( talk) 21:11, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
References
The paragraph
is both off-topic and slightly incorrect. This is a cadastral system, not part of street addresses. What is numbered is not the houses on the property, but the property itself. Also, it's not restricted to farms, it can be used for any rural, semi-rural or even suburban property (cities and other dense developments tend to use block names and lot numbers instead, although exceptions are common). I suggest that the paragraph be removed. // Essin ( talk) 00:03, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
Does this mean odd-even numbering is not used in (substantial parts of) the northeast? — Tamfang ( talk) 23:58, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
Do bridges have street numbers? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.24.172.57 ( talk) 23:46, 15 September 2013 (UTC)
In Utrecht, The Netherlands I noticed that the numbering starts at the side of the street that is the nearest to the center (which is the Dom Tower). Is that usual in The Netherlands/Europe/the world? Joepnl ( talk) 21:32, 18 November 2013 (UTC)
Can someone explain the second sentence? How does numbering the houses in one place help "determine the distribution of property ownership" elsewhere? — Tamfang ( talk) 22:57, 23 October 2016 (UTC)
The various house numbering systems historically developed in stages. When (and where) were the following ideas first implemented?
Reify-tech ( talk) 16:47, 23 March 2017 (UTC)
The phrase "numbers related to the block rather than the street" does not appear to be supported by the citation given (to https://dxdy.ru/topic3547.html named as "Related discussion, additional text"). Although that talk board is about house numbering, the style mentioned in this wiki article (i.e., "Block 12, House 3") isn't mentioned in the talk board items. I'm trusting Chrome's English translation of the talk board page. Maybe someone who reads Russian and who knows Russian addressing habits could improve this? I don't want to say the citation is "irrelevant" because it _is_ related, but it certainly isn't clearly supportive of the assertion in the wiki article. I haven't renamed the talk board's info in the citation, thinking what it says now might be useful to an editor who can actually fix this. - Inkwzitv ( talk) 16:44, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
The link is dead about "numbering system based on tens of metres" to this ("Street Addressing Working Group and the National Street Addressing Standard". Intergovernmental Committee on Survey and Mapping. 19 March 2008. Retrieved 24 February 2010). The following current materials probably would provide a better/updated replacement reference.
AS/NZS 4819:2011 Rural and urban addressing was prepared by the Street Address Working Group of ICSM for the Joint Standards Australia/Standards New Zealand Committee IT-004, to supersede AS/NZS 4819:2003, Geographic Information – Rural and Urban Addressing. It was published in November 2011. Inkwzitv ( talk) 18:05, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
The link from the word "Conscription" takes us to the article about the usual sense of the word "conscription". This however does not appear to be correct in this use, because it's referring to numbering of houses to prevent additional houses being built between them (or at least that's my understanding of the historical event). I have de-linked the conscription article, as the link to the history of the Jews in Prague goes some way to explaining this. DavidFarmbrough ( talk) 16:13, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
Perhaps mention Carmel-by-the-Sea, California has no formal numbers. Jidanni ( talk) 00:34, 27 August 2023 (UTC)
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=30267.0
Also, Charlevoix County, MI has leading zero addresses, which is not mentioned on this thread. 64.135.140.174 ( talk) 03:44, 7 March 2024 (UTC)